718 Sameer Mehta: Co-Founder & CEO of Smash Kitchen

0:00Kara Goldin:I am unwilling to give up, but I will start over from scratch as many times as it takes to get where I want to be. You just want to make sure you will get knocked down, but just make sure you don't get knocked out. So your only choice should be, go focus on what you can control. Hi everyone and welcome to the Kara Goldin show. Join me each week for inspiring conversations with some of the world's greatest leaders. We'll talk with founders, entrepreneurs, CEOs, and really some of the most interesting people of our time. Can't wait to get started. Let's go. Hi, everyone, and welcome back to The Kara Golden Show.

0:45Kara Goldin:Today, we're talking reinvention, brand building, and bold flavor, three things this guest knows inside and out. I'm joined by Samir Mehta, who is the co-founder and CEO of, amongst other companies that he's built, Smash Kitchen, which is the Better For You pantry brand, shaking up the condiment aisle today. and I have a feeling we're going to see a lot more from them in the future. But before Smash, Samir helped build Casper, as well as more recently, Jinx, which is a modern dog food company. And he also is doing this company with a couple of co-founders, which I'll allow him to chat about. But he's reimagining what American staples can be, starting with clean label, crave-worthy condiments.

1:40Kara Goldin:And as I was sharing with him, the samples came to my house with my 20-something year old kids running around here, and they were quite excited to try something new and really, really enjoyed them. So I can't wait to dive into what exactly he's doing in building this incredible brand and really what it takes to build a brand that's not just delicious, but also mission-driven too. So, Samir, welcome to The Kara Golden Show. Really excited to have you. Thank you for having me. Absolutely. So, let's start really with Smash Kitchen. What is it? How do you define it? And what was kind of the original vision for actually deciding, I'm going to go do this?

2:26Yeah, no, for sure. Myself and my two partners, we actually thought of this idea a couple years ago, you know, the real kind of context behind the brand was redeveloping the American pantry with cleaner ingredients, better for you ingredients, but also an affordable product that people can enjoy all over America. You know, if you're familiar with kind of the category, specifically in the condiment category, it's filled with a ton of nasty ingredients, everything from high fructose corn syrup to artificial ingredients and dyes. And, you know, we had an idea of figuring out how do we kind of merge cleaning ingredients, but with also kind of keeping that flavor profile that people are used to and also enjoy to kind of keep coming back.

3:12Kara Goldin:I love it. So you're building this company with two other co-founders. Can you talk a little bit how you all three connected? Yep. So it's myself. And my second co-founder is Sean Cain. Previous to this, he was the founder of The Honest Company with Just Galba and Brian Lee, and then started another baby brand called Hello Bello. Similarly to Smash Kitchen, really focused on clean label, clean ingredients in diapers and lotions, and specifically kind of in the baby category. And our third co-founder is actor Glenn Powell. So if you've seen him before, he's most prevalent recently on things like Top Gun, Anyone But You, as well as a few other movies coming out this year.

3:59And so, you know, we came together not too long ago, probably about a year and a half to two years ago, to really kind of come up with this idea to revolutionize the pantry. You know, Glenn grew up in Texas himself, you know, has been a host of many barbecues and many parties. And flavor was really, really important to him. And I think even more now than ever, he's starting to look at the back of these labels and looking at the ingredient decks and really kind of notice that, you know, if you start to eat too much high fructose or a lot of these artificial ingredients, you start to feel worse, you start to end up performing worse.

4:38And so really figuring out the blend of clean ingredients and flavor was really important.

4:45Kara Goldin:So you are a serial entrepreneur and so excited for you to be doing what you're doing right now, but you have built some pretty incredible brands so far or really joined, I guess, in one case, Casper, to really help participate in that startup, but then went on to start a company called Jinx. Really incredible brands, but also different categories. So when you think about this category and the differences, and maybe it's some of the similarities, what's been similar and what's been different in terms of how you think about building Smash Kitchens? You know, I've personally always been drawn to categories that are part of our everyday life.

5:37You know, first when I was at Casper, you know, we were really kind of modernizing the mattress where most people, you know, would go to mattress stores, they'd sleep on mattresses for the past like 15 to 20 years, not really understand what they're sleeping on. And, you know, you sleep most of a big part of your life and it's super important to kind of your health and your wellness. And so figuring out how do we kind of optimize for kind of that part of your life. And then, you know, three of us ended up leaving Casper to start Jinx, a modern kind of dog food brand that we launched back in 2019.

6:13So not sure if you have a pet, but if you have a pet or a dog, you kind of know that, you know, your dog becomes part of your daily life. They become a part of your family. And back then, you know, we were feeding things that we bought at grocery store that's similar to Smash Kitchen. We're filled with kind of nasty ingredients and a lot of fillers and a lot of ingredients that people didn't really recognize or really understand. And so kind of the context was, you know, you wouldn't feed your own kid some of these ingredients. Why would you feed your pet unless you kind of understand the reasoning or what's going on behind it?

6:50And so I think, you know, I've always been kind of fascinated with cleaning up categories and categories that people don't necessarily know are bad for you and really kind of pushing out education. And so I think similar to kind of pet and now kind of the pantry with Smash Kitchen, you know, condiments is really one of those things that a lot of folks, you know, are starting to be more and more aware every day of what's kind of going into these products. A lot of folks are starting to see high fructose corn syrup in their ketchup. But a lot of people don't know that there's a ton of high fructose corn syrup in barbecue sauces.

7:26There's a ton of nasty ingredients and artificial dyes and things like yellow mustard and even things like relish that are all products that, you know, people eat every time they have a bowl of French fries or every time they have a burger or sandwich. which, you know, you're kind of eating these products without even noticing or really being aware of it. You know, I think there's things like soda that people, you know, enjoy a can of Coke or Pepsi, but you are aware of what you're putting into your body versus, you know, a bottle of ketchup or a splash of mustard or mayo. You know, so I think for us, it was really important to figure out how do we create a flavor profile that not specifically tastes healthy, but tastes like something people want to enjoy all the time, but using clean ingredients to kind of get there.

8:15Kara Goldin:How did you think about the go-to-market strategy? Because you've worked on brands that were primarily direct-to-consumer, and now you're going into stores and retailers, major retailers like Sprouts and Walmart. So you're obviously still doing direct-to-consumer where consumers can get it that way. But how did you think and why did you think that this time you're going to do something that is actually both? Yeah, I think, you know, it's been really important for us to kind of reach mass consumers in kind of the right way. We specifically partnered on this launch with Walmart. You know, Walmart's the largest grocer in America.

8:57And so I think for us to really affect and kind of enact change within kind of the American pantry, it was really important for us to partner with a retailer that could really help spread awareness, but also kind of spread distribution. And at the same time, you know, we are selling a product such as an organic mustard that's under$2. So I think for us, it's also been equally important to not charge$10 a bottle or $8 a bottle, where most consumers can't really opt in for it. And so for us, it's really charging a price point that people can afford. So they don't have to think too hard between a non-organic product and then our organic product.

9:35Kara Goldin:How did you think about the name and, or how did you come up with the name and sort of the brand personality that is around Smash as well? Yeah, I think it was, you know, there's a few things behind the name that we were really excited. I think one, it was really important for us to have Kitchen in the name in order to kind of instill confidence that, you know, we have, we kind of know what we're doing specifically within the kitchen pantry. So it's ingredients that people can really trust. And then I think the word smash came from a couple of things. One is, you know, specifically in condiments and sauces, you're smashing vegetables and ingredients to create kind of this flavor profile.

10:17And then the other part is really just smashing kind of traditional conventions. I think a lot of people still believe that if you're eating clean or eating organic, it doesn't taste good. And so to convince the consumer that you can eat clean without sacrificing taste.

10:34Kara Goldin:Yeah, definitely. How many SKUs did you actually launch with? We launched with 11 SKUs, and now it's been, I think, about 11 weeks ago, the first week of April. Wow, that's really, really quick. And your barbecue sauce, by the way, I mean, we were talking about sort of the staples around ketchup and mustards and mayo. Those are two, but the barbecue sauce was awesome. I mean, it's really good, and I'm picky about my barbecue sauces too. So yeah, the taste was terrific. So what was the hardest part when you're, because you're launching something totally different, right? It's liquids, it's really different.

11:19Kara Goldin:So what was the hardest part of launching and how long did it actually take to to create those first couple of SKUs? Yeah, I think, you know, it took us all in all about two to two and a half years to really get from idea to initial recipes, all the way to kind of final recipes and on the shelf. I think the hardest part was creating a recipe that consumers can enjoy and kind of folks can enjoy, but also keeping up and making sure the ingredient kind of lives up to our standards. You know, I think a lot of traditional recipes and condiments are filled with a lot of this nasty ingredients because, you know, they're focused on not only price point, but including kind of this addictive kind of taste that provides the sweetness that consumers are kind of used to.

12:16You know, if you look at traditional ketchup today, it's super glossy, it's super artificial, and it kind of has this flavor profile that consumers just kind of understand or remember. And so I think for us, it was really kind of how do we create a familiar taste, but also purify the ingredients. And so, you know, I think we did in totality about 12 kind of taste tests with different focus groups, kind of similar to what you're saying earlier. I think kids are really an interesting focus group because they'll definitely be honest with you. And of course, you know, they tend to like things that sometimes have been processed.

12:53So making sure that, you know, our taste test stands up to kids who are starting to kind of eat these products a lot. And so I think that was really kind of the hardest part. But I think, you know, where we landed today after a ton of iterations on the recipes and formulas are ingredients that we can really stand by.

13:11Kara Goldin:it how did the relationship with glenn come about did you know him before or had you been introduced to him how did that all come about yeah so actually uh my part our third co-founder so myself and sean were actually introduced to glenn uh about a year and a half ago um at an event um through a common friend uh and we actually just started um connecting you know he was super passionate about sauces. As I mentioned, growing up in Texas, he would barbecue all the time. He has his own kind of barbecue sauce that he grew up kind of making and his mom's sauce as well. And so we kind of started talking to each other about how there is kind of this gap within the pantry.

13:57And a lot of stuff that's currently on the market, specifically in barbecue is filled with a lot of nasty ingredients that people just don't understand. And so from that one conversation, you know, we started sharing recipes, we started sharing ideas, and then it just kind of spiraled from there.

14:12Kara Goldin:That's awesome. How do you make celebrity partnerships feel authentic and not just like a marketing stunt? Yeah, I think, you know, I think especially in today's age, it's really important to kind of bring that authenticity forward. And I think, you know, Having worked with a handful of celebrity and influencer partners before, I think Glenn personally is super excited about this category, is super excited about the sauces. He wouldn't let anything to market unless it's a sauce that he enjoyed and kind of stood behind. And I think a big part of it is making sure somebody like Glenn is really acting as a true co-founder, which he is, but he's involved in all the taste tests.

15:00He's involved in all the iterations on the actual product side. And of course, you know, he's the best at marketing and creating content, which is, of course, his specialty. But I think it's really important for the celebrity to be, you know, as involved on the product side, just so they can really believe in the product as well.

15:19Kara Goldin:You've been involved in a few other startups, as we've mentioned, and incredible brands. but this one you're really building from scratch with you've got co-founders which I think is is awesome I know there's a lot of founders that listen to this podcast that are trying to figure out should I just go do this by myself should I go do it with co-founders should I get a celebrity involved so this is such a great example of somebody who's done something before and seen other things and has decided to do what you're doing. But also, what else do you need on this team? I mean, what do you start with once you've actually figured out the co-founders?

16:04Kara Goldin:Who are your first hires? How do you think about building this team in order to be successful? Yeah, no, for sure. I think one of our largest teams, we're still a small team, but one of our largest kind of groups within the team is really on the product development side. I think, you know, especially being kind of a food first brand, it's really important to make sure the quality is there, the innovation is there, so you can kind of keep up to trends with what's going on for kind of next year and the year after and really kind of innovating and making sure we have the latest and greatest. So I think really investing in kind of product development is important, specifically for a food kind of first brand.

16:49I think that the next part is really the operations and the marketing side of the business. On the operations side, you can have the best product, but you have to make sure it gets on shelf. And then the other part is you have to make sure it sells once it gets to shelf. So you really have to invest in not only marketing, but really telling the brand story. And I think in today's consumer brands, a lot of the marketing is happening on social media. It's happening in store. And so being able to tell the story, the brand story, the mission, the ingredients, the value propositions within a creative environment is going to be super important.

17:26Kara Goldin:I love that you've said that because I think so often I've done a ton of speaking on college campuses and spoken to a lot of business MBAs as well as engineers. And I'm like, if you don't have an appreciation for the storytelling side of the equation, it's really hard to have a successful company. It's not just about your own kind of experience or what you know, but also having an appreciation for that other side of things. Did you feel like you learned some hard lessons or saw some hard lessons at Casper or prior at Jinx that you felt like, you know, we can't do that here at Smash Kitchen? Because I've seen people make mistakes around the storytelling with those brands that, you know, maybe, or maybe it's not even with brands that you've worked on, but people, you've seen things that you're like, I'm not going to make that mistake.

18:27Yeah, I think, you know, there's a delicate balance of storytelling through kind of creative ways, but also kind of selling the product and the value proposition. You know, I think a lot of brands are either focusing on this value prop or that value prop or this ingredient. And then there's a lot of brands that are talking about, you know, pure kind of mission value and kind of storytelling. And so I think really the best way to kind of go about it is figuring out kind of the right balance of being able to kind of describe your product and why people should pick it up, but also do it in a creative kind of mission storytelling way.

19:04And I think fortunate for us, you know, we have actor Glenn Powell with us. So he's able to really kind of take the message that we have and put it into a beautiful wrapper to really kind of help tell that story, whether it's through an in-store end cap or whether it's through an Instagram post or whether it's through a TV commercial. It's being able to not only capture the consumer's attention, but really kind of convey what we're trying to say.

19:30Kara Goldin:who do you feel is the the core audience that you're really hitting at this at this point and maybe it's you know it's pretty early in the brand and i think that that's one thing that maybe surprises a lot of people that they think they're going to be going after one demographic and then as they start to see who's actually purchasing it they have to really look at all that data to figure out am i really seeing this consumer that i was originally targeting or not? Yeah, I think, you know, the beauty of this category is, you know, almost everybody eats ketchup or mayo or mustard. And so I think when we, you know, we're first kind of going down this path, you know, we were kind of convinced that, you know, everybody's going to really pick this up.

20:15I think, you know, as we start started to get to launch, you know, we have a handful of consumers that are starting to now kind of repeat and kind of purchase and, and buy more products within the brand. And we're also starting to see a lot of kids enjoying our product. And I think that's really kind of the breakout kind of demo that we saw is, you know, you don't really realize how much condiments or sauces that kids are consuming until you kind of get into it. But kids, you know, are eating ketchup every single day, or they're eating mustard with all of their foods, or mayo is going into cooking things like grilled cheese, quises or salads or anything like that.

20:54And so we're starting to see kids are actually becoming one of our biggest kind of taste consumers. And so for us, it's really not only proving that that taste is good, but also to their parents that the ingredients are good as well.

21:06Kara Goldin:So what's one misconception people have about what it takes to build a brand? I think, you know, a misconception is, you know, taste and quality don't really matter. I think a lot of people, especially in kind of CPG, think you can put, you know, a beautiful package, a beautiful design, a beautiful kind of billboard. And you'll kind of, you know, build out a beautiful brand. I think, you know, when you have really great packaging and marketing, you can kind of get consumers to opt into it the first time. But I think in order to build a great brand, you really need to focus on the actual product and make sure, you know, it tastes good, make sure it has ingredients that people are resonating with.

21:50and that way you can really get people to continue to purchase your brand versus kind of a one-off.

21:56Kara Goldin:Yeah, I totally agree. There are a lot of elements and touch points to building out that brand and especially when you're in, I think, when you're not only direct-to-consumer but you're also in stores, there's packaging in stores is probably more important than packaging in a direct-to-consumer. once people have the product. And actually, I had another guest on and we were having this conversation about if you have too much packaging today in a direct-to-consumer box, I mean, that's another thing that people get upset about, right? And so there's all of this feedback that I'm sure you've been enjoying coming in, not just with this brand, but with other brands.

22:46Kara Goldin:I think that it's such a powerful thing when you start really getting your product into the hands of consumers and hearing what they say. Would you agree? Yeah. And I think the best part of once you kind of enter retail or D2C is consumers will really be vocal about what they like and don't like. Whether it's the packaging or the ingredients or the recipe, they'll kind of tell you that they don't like this ingredient or they don't like this formula or they love this recipe and they love this packaging. And so really kind of guiding kind of iterations, whether it's packaging or formulations based off of consumer feedback.

23:23Kara Goldin:Yeah, definitely. Did you always know you were going to go into consumer brands? We get a lot of colleges and universities across the world, actually, that are listening to this podcast. And, you know, I always share with students and people who are listening what people are, you know, what you thought you were going to be doing when you were in college. And did you ever think that you would be running a condiment company and this is what you would be working on? Definitely not a condiment company, I think. Like, right out of college, I was actually working on a kind of like a tech company called Jungle Sense that was actually a Y Combinator company.

24:06And so that was kind of the original intention. And then eventually, you know, that business kind of spiraled or turned into something a little bit more consumer facing around a subscription box for consumers. And so I think, you know, naturally, I progressed kind of more and more into consumer from kind of digital tech to now mostly kind of in store. And I think, you know, it's kind of a full circle moment where, you know, a lot of brands back then were entering retail and then they started to do D2C. and now people are kind of going back to retail. But I think now more than ever, it's really important to be able to tell the story in kind of both platforms, whether it's D2C through a digital lens like social media or whether it's kind of in store.

24:51Kara Goldin:Yeah, well, I think also once you start working on something that you actually would purchase yourself every single day, it gets really exciting and addictive. Yeah, I always say, As much as I love my dog, it's refreshing to be able to enjoy kind of my own products. Yeah. Really taste it and kind of iterate from there. So what's the one thing you want people to remember about Smash Kitchen after hearing this conversation? Oh, there's my dog. See, your dog was talking back to you as soon as you were making comments about it. I didn't enjoy that. All good. but i think um you know the one thing to really kind of understand what the brand is that i think it's been important for us to to tell is uh is that you can really enjoy products and and food that have clean ingredients and an organic label but also tastes good i think that's kind of the biggest misnomer now is that you have to eat healthy um but it doesn't taste necessarily good and so how do you kind of balance both and i think smash kitchen is definitely trying to achieve both I love it.