743 Joe Nicchi: Founder & CEO of CVT Soft Serve

0:00Kara Goldin:I am unwilling to give up, but I will start over from scratch as many times as it takes to get where I want to be. You just want to make sure you will get knocked down, but just make sure you don't get knocked out. So your only choice should be, go focus on what you can control. Hi everyone and welcome to the Kara Goldin show. Join me each week for inspiring conversations with some of the world's greatest leaders. We'll talk with founders, entrepreneurs, CEOs, and really some of the most interesting people of our time. Can't wait to get started. Let's go. Hi, everyone, and welcome back to the Kara Golden Show.

0:44Kara Goldin:Today, we're talking about ice cream, but not just any ice cream. I'm joined by Joe Nikki, who is the founder and CEO of CVT Soft Serve. That's V as in Victor. So CVT Soft Serve, the Los Angeles-based brand that took a classic treat and turned it into a cult sensation. It started as a single food truck in 2014, serving the creamiest chocolate vanilla. Twist Soft Serve you've ever tasted has grown into an iconic brand with trucks and now packaged pints available to even more fans. So Joe became an unlikely entrepreneur launching CVT after a career in acting and a stint in the restaurant world. And he's built not only a beloved brand, but also made waves by saying no to some influencer freebie culture I read.

1:46Kara Goldin:Cannot even wait to hear about Joe's journey and the lessons he's learned and story of grit, creativity, and staying true to your values. I'm super excited to finally meet the man behind the brand and very, very excited to have you here today. So welcome, Joe. So excited to have you here. Thank you so much. I'm so excited to be here. I really appreciate it. This episode of the Kara Golden Show is brought to you by Range Rover Sport. You know that old saying, it's not what you say, it's how you say it. Well, I believe it's also how you show up because in business and in life, you have to lead with presence, power, and adaptability.

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3:20Kara Goldin:So if you're expecting the best, like I know you do, the Range Rover Sport is your perfect ride. Build your Range Rover Sport at rangeroversport.com slash US slash sport to configure your Range Rover Sport today. Again, that's rangerover.com slash US slash sport. Trust me, you'll be glad you did. So CVT is in the pouches. I currently had a few of the chocolate vanilla different pouches and so, so yummy. I mean, you have just absolutely nailed not only the packaging, but also obviously what's most important, what's inside and the taste so, so good. So let's start with the simple. When someone eats a CVT, I guess it's a cone, pouch, I don't know how you refer it to, but actually has your product, what are they really tasting beyond that ice cream?

4:26Kara Goldin:Like what is the promise inside? It is absolutely, in my opinion, the most delicious soft serve ice cream you're ever going to have made with seven all natural ingredients. We keep it super clean. I know that soft serve ice cream in general gets a bad rap in terms of chemicals and all that. So we have a very clean, delicious product. But yeah, this is a family-run business. We started almost 12 years ago now. A lot of blood, sweat, and tears went into it. And yeah, just a really, really great product. So what is the story behind CVT? You went from acting to launching a soft-serve truck and then now where you are today.

5:11Kara Goldin:but share the story. So I'll give you a condensed version. I know this show can't last that long, but I went and moved to Los Angeles a lifetime ago and studied theater at USC. And throughout the years, I grew up in upstate New York where there was soft serve ice cream was prevalent. There's soft serve shacks everywhere. And I noticed there wasn't any good soft serve in LA. So I started asking people, you know, where do you get the stuff? And they said McDonald's or some, I'm like, this, that's disgusting. Like where's, where's the good stuff? So I joke that I opened out of frustration, but it's true.

5:44Um, as a kind of a side hustle between acting gigs, I said, I'm going to open a soft serve ice cream truck. And I did, and it absolutely took over my life. So we went from one soft serve truck to two and we quickly became known as this TV film brand. So we became known for catering TV sets and movie sets in LA, uh, lots of private events, weddings, this and that. And then we started wholesaling our soft serve ice cream, which is you pour into a machine, like a jug of ice cream to colleges and restaurants. And then about three or four years after that, we got a residential install and it was Jeff Bezos.

6:17And when Jeff put our ice cream in his house, it was this moment for me of, well, how can we get soft serve ice cream to everyone that can't afford a ridiculously expensive machine in their kitchen? And I spent about two years of my life doing R &D, trying to figure it out and a lot of patent attorneys involved and got all of it together. And we launched in May of 23. So just over two years now with the pouch, the to-go pouches. And it's been a crazy ride. And we started in LA at Gelson's. We love Gelson's, 27 stores. I was over the moon that, you know, oh my God, we got this regional brand and then it quickly just exploded from there.

6:51Kara Goldin:So when you think about, you know, what you've done, it's, I mean, you described it as, as, I mean, it's quality. It's simple with limited ingredients. Why the heck didn't someone do this before you? I don't have a good answer for that. I can tell you that it's cheaper probably from a manufacturing standpoint just to use chemicals than to use the real stuff. So you want to use real dairy and, and, you know, real, all the real stuff costs more money. And I'm sure there's lots of shortcuts involved. Um, there's, but yeah, I don't, I don't have an answer to that. I'm, thankful that it hasn't been done.

7:24So, yeah.

7:25Kara Goldin:So you made headlines with your viral influencers pay double sign. What pushed you to take the stand? So this was back when influencer culture was just taking off. And, you know, people were coming to the truck constantly saying, hey, I will do a post on my Instagram in exchange for a free ice cream party or free cone. And I was like, this is crazy. You know, I've got kids, I've got bills to pay. I can't do this. So as a joke, I made a sign that said influencers pay double. And I put it in our window, thought nothing of it. It went on Reddit and it became the number one post on Reddit. It was an international story.

8:04I was in Time Magazine, the BBC, the Today Show in Australia had us on. I struck a chord with business owners around the world that they were just sick of people asking for free stuff in exchange for exposure. And the irony of that whole story is I got more exposure mocking the system than had I actually just given them a lay-free product. So yeah, it was just a crazy lightning in a bottle moment.

8:27Kara Goldin:Crazy. So how did that moment of going viral really change the business then? I mean, you got a lot more press. Obviously, your business changed as well. You went from trucks to actually creating a product that you're now dealing with grocery stores, D2C, all of these new things. But how did your overall company change? Oh, it was insane. Overnight, the trucks were just inundated with either private event requests, or we had lines down the street when we were serving on the street. And it really bumped up our wholesale business of pouring the jugs that you pour in machines. So like it exploded.

9:10The virality was I see the power of the Internet and I see the power of some influencers. But the ones that were hitting me up with the truck just didn't seem worth it at the time. Again, this was early days of social media when people were just sort of taking off with Instagram and food trucks in L.A. But no, it really it really exploded.

9:28Kara Goldin:What was the point when you said we have to go and do this in pouches? Like, what was that? Do you remember that point where you just said, I got to get serious about writing this business plan? I would imagine people wanted the product and were sort of asking and requesting it. But what was the point where you just said, I've got to put my head into this and make it happen? I wanted to see if it was possible, first of all. And, you know, I did a lot of R &D and beta testing with my family and friends. My wife and I have four kids. We actually took empty breast milk storage bags and we're filling them with soft serve ice cream which is similar in form to the pouches that you now see on shelf and just you know seeing if it could work seeing if the the quality of the product would last on a shelf and stay frozen and then as it thawed does it does it stay creamy and and delicious and when that happened i was like okay you know this is real we have something here and i just started pitching to some you know some business owners that I knew and said, hey, was this something that you would consider selling?

10:30And it was just, you know, I had to go all in because I saw the response of people didn't realize that they could have soft serve in that form. And then once they did, they realized that I, you know, it was it was a viable thing that I had to jump on.

10:43Kara Goldin:How difficult was it to find a manufacturer? There's I know we had all kinds of stories in the early days of Hint where, you know, Everybody who was willing to manufacture our product, they wanted to throw preservatives into it because it's easier for them, right? But it's not what I wanted. I wanted a product that had fruit and did not have any preservatives in it. Was there any similar stories in your case? I'm being kind and saying that was an absolute nightmare trying to find a manufacturer to do this thing because I thought I'd go to baby food manufacturers. You know, there's baby food pouches have been around for years.

11:24So I went to them and said, you know, I'm going to teach them how to make ice cream and we'll do this. Well, their facilities aren't set up for frozen or for ice cream. They don't know how to make ice cream. So I said, you know what? I got to teach an ice cream person how to fill pouches. So that's what I did. And then when I finally found that person, it was like, okay, we're doing this, but I had to sign, I had them sign an exclusive because I'm I'm going to teach you the secret sauce of how we do this, but you can't make pouched ice cream for anyone else. So it took a long time to find the manufacturer and really happy with it.

11:53But it took a while.

11:54Kara Goldin:Yeah, I counted. I probably had 200 no's before I actually found. But as I always tell entrepreneurs, you just need one. You need one manufacturer to sort of allow you to do a test or whatever it is. We had manufacturers that said no. And now once it started to explode, they're like, hey, did you still want to talk about that project? And I'm like, we would have a year and a half ago, but no, we're good now. So yeah, you need to find someone that had the same vision and was like, okay, I see that this is a great opportunity. How difficult has it been to carve out space and stand apart in the world of ice cream?

12:37Kara Goldin:Even when you're doing something better, it's like you've got the consumer-facing marketing that you're doing, but then you've also got to convince the grocery buyers, the gatekeepers, to allow you to get into different stores. and then you've got tons of competition, right? They might not be in the same format, but so how difficult has that been in terms of, I guess, just getting in there and being able to make it? I had no idea when I launched our company, Hint. The closest thing that I knew about was that they were Coke and Pepsi trucks that I had seen every once in a while at the stoplight, but I had no idea what went on behind the scenes.

13:27I was brand new to CPG. I knew absolutely nothing. Luckily, one of my customers had a friend who has a sales rep who has been working in CPG for a long time. And he came in early and said, you know, no promises, but I can sort of help you out and guide you in the process. So I started with him and our first pitch meeting, they took it in the room and we walked out of the room and he said, Joe, that doesn't happen. And, you know, they usually they'll take forever. They'll ghost you. You know, this is this is a crazy moment. And I'm like, OK, great. But what I learned in the process or what I've learned from the category managers is that you kind of nailed it when you said like the form factor is huge.

14:05They're not seeing a ton of innovation in the space. It's the same pint or it's a pint with more protein or a pint with more less sugar. But in terms of novelty ice cream, it's it's very low. I'm not going to name specific products, but I'm trying to dance around it here. There are novelty products that are just filled with chemicals and garbage. So to give them a product that is a clean label and it's an interesting form factor. And for parents especially, giving your kid ice cream that's no mess has been incredible. So the whole no mess aspect of the innovation was huge. Like, oh, I can sell this to anyone that can have an ice cream in their car or on their couch and it's not going to make a giant mess.

14:45So I don't want to jinx it, but the selling has not been as challenging as people in the industry have seen, apparently.

14:53Kara Goldin:That's awesome. So when you think about the toughest punch in the gut moments that you've obviously recovered from, but what would you, what comes to mind when I say that, that, you know, a big lesson you've learned that you would share with people just in launching your company and category? That's a really tough question. I don't want to say gut punch specifically, but we've had a lot of people that as many yeses as we celebrate on social media or talk about, there's been a lot of no's. And just, I'm sorry, I'm not answering your question. I'm trying to think about the biggest gut punch. No, that's fine.

15:32Kara Goldin:That's fine. You know, I'll give you one of the guests that I just interviewed, Reds, uh, what that is a burrito. And he talked about how he always felt like his breakfast burrito is sort of his, um, you know, what he, it's, um, what he leads with and, uh, breakfast foods. And what he found was he always felt like he had to have burritos that were big, that were like giant burritos, but it ended up that the majority of his consumers actually wanted it so that they could have it in their hand while they're driving or, you know, something small, especially for breakfast, just to put something in their stomach.

16:13Kara Goldin:They didn't want this giant thing that was going to fall all over the car or not be able to give it to kids. And so that was kind of the roadblock. And he had sold a bunch of these in. And when he figured out that he could actually make it half the size and maybe even up the price a little bit, like all of these things, he got stuck with, you know, a bunch of these bigger burritos, I guess. And, and, and so, you know, he said, it was like lesson learned on that. I've been very cautious, but also optimistic, especially with some of our bigger grocery partners not to overproduce. We haven't had any out of stock issues.

16:55But I've definitely been told or heard horror stories from other CPG founders that they're producing for next season to stay ahead of stock to then learn that, oh, no, they're actually cutting you back. So I haven't run into that yet, but especially with a product that's perishable more so than, I don't know, we're having a shelf life that we're fighting. It's just being a, it's a constant dance of like, I got to make sure that we do this much. And I've heard that about Club too with Costco and BJ's and all that, you know, they can have you and you could sell like crazy. And then next category review comes up and you're out and you have all this extra product.

17:30So I'm trying to be on tiptoe in those situations and make sure that we don't make any mistakes. But I'm sure that gut punch is coming. But so far, so good.

17:40Kara Goldin:So when you think about your overall timeline and in building CVT, did you have any other like pinch me moments or even feel like expanding on the Jeff Bezos story? I understand, didn't he asked for a machine in his home and things like that, where you've decided we've really built something here. I mean, this is a brand. Yeah. Well, when Jeff put our ice cream machine in his house, that was the big moment of, you know, how do we get our soft serve to everyone? And that sort of sparked the whole pouch thing to begin with. But I've had so many, knock on wood, not so many gut punches, but so many pinch me moments over the last two years.

18:21we quickly caught the attention of Live Nation. They came in and venture backed us. We're the official ice cream of Live Nation amphitheaters. So seeing concerts and watching all these people eat our ice cream at concerts has been incredible. We're at the Indy 500 last year at the Indianapolis Motor Speedway, SoFi Stadium in Los Angeles, Hershey Park, Six Flags. Just seeing this product in so many places has been just so surreal. And we've grown really fast and just trying to keep up with the momentum and make sure I'm surrounded with the right people. But yeah, so many pinch me moments for sure.

18:59Kara Goldin:Yeah, how hard is Frozen? You talked about shelf life, especially dealing with a product that is, you know, real ingredients. I'm sure, you know, those shelf life issues are real. But how hard is it to deal with Frozen overall? Yeah, I think the biggest challenge in Frozen as freight and making sure that obviously the price of frozen freight is not cheap. So making sure that it makes sense, making sure we can pull truckloads out from our manufacturing. Also, from the time it leaves our factory, it's out of my control. So let's just say someone's not stocking it properly and it's sitting out for a half hour in the freezer aisle and then they're putting it in the freezer.

19:41It's like, I'm such a control freak. My OCD gets the best of me, but truly it's out of my hands. So yeah, there's definitely challenges. Maybe a freezer broke, Maybe a truck on the drive to the grocery store, that truck broke. I have no idea as far as making sure that the supply chain is running smoothly and that basically the entire supply chain relies on frozen machinery and making sure everything stays frozen from beginning to end. There's a lot of moving parts once it leaves the factory.

20:08Kara Goldin:Yeah, definitely. Yeah. I mean, I remember, I mean, even 10 years ago, like launching a product that was frozen. I mean, everyone said no way, right? I mean, today, it's possible. It's not easy. It's not easy. But it's definitely, definitely possible. So running a food business can be totally exhausting. Being a founder, you're the founder and CEO, you're learning every day, you've got an incredible brand, but how do you stay motivated, right? Like what keeps you the most motivated? Are you constantly talking to customers and staying in the market? Like, do you like what is it that keeps you really motivated every single day?

20:59Brutal honesty is my family. Honestly, like making sure keeping the lights on. I've got four kids. But no, I love I love meeting new customers. I love converting customers who didn't even realize that soft serve comes in a pouch. Like I just I love meeting people and introducing this this brand. And they have watching them have this aha moment once they try it, because I think novelty ice cream gets a bad rap of, oh, it's just going to taste like a dollar drumstick or a Klondike bar or whatever. But this is actually quality stuff. So I really am motivated by introducing the brand to new people and seeing how excited they get when they try it.

21:37Kara Goldin:Definitely. How did you come up with the name? CVT stands for Chocolate, Vanilla and Twist. I intentionally named the brand an acronym so that people would ask that exact question. I could call it like Joe's Ice Cream, but it forces this conversation. If someone says CBT, they'll say, oh, what's that? Oh, it's this ice cream. You got to try it and blah, blah, blah. So I actually do get some pushback from category managers like, oh, you know, that name doesn't make sense or it's confusing. And I'm like, yeah, but it's working. So I'm good with it. But yeah, that was intentional. I love it. So if you had to give anybody advice in launching their own business in the food industry today.

22:17Kara Goldin:What is one of the biggest learnings that you've had that is, okay, I've learned that. We're not going to go there again. I mean, crazy hard work. I think that this whole world of social media is a highlight reel and people are only seeing the wins. And I want people and entrepreneurs to know there are so many losses behind the scenes that people aren't sharing. And also I've told this, I just spoke at this engagement with a bunch of MBAs. And I was like, I know you guys don't want to hear this, but there is definitely an element of luck involved. Yes, there's a lot of hard work, but I have met a lot of people that have helped me along the way and opened doors.

22:59And I'm not ashamed of that. I'm proud of those people and how they help the business. But I would say for learning, meet as many people as possible. You've no idea who that person might know who could actually open a door for you or you could open a door for them. So I think networking is just so important and getting out there as much as possible.

23:20Kara Goldin:When you think about skew mix, so obviously you have the chocolate, the vanilla and the twist. Have you thought about going beyond those flavors? And it's like it opens up a whole can of worms, Right. I mean, maybe that's not the right visual, but but it's, you know, people like more than vanilla and chocolate, but they also love vanilla and chocolate. Yeah, absolutely. No, we're actually considering some additional SKUs next year. I've learned in CPG, obviously, the more SKUs you have, the more shelf space they can give you. So I see the opportunity for more real estate there. There's something I love about being classic and simple.