895 Ron Johnson: Author of Shop Different

31:22Kara Goldin:But then the stores came and what happened? Like when did you know that it was going to be successful? Well, I personally believed and I'm an optimist at heart. I believed the stores would be successful on launch day because i saw the connection we were able to create with employees and customers you'll never forget that first store we opened to the same day may 19th 2001 one in outside of dc one in southern california and we had 7 000 people visit the store that day wow and they just stayed in the store. They were on the computers. They were trying things. They were engaging with employees. They were belling up to the Genius Bar.

32:14And even though no one knew what they could do there, but people love to engage with the stores. And that was the thesis I had with Steve is that the world's going online, but if we're going to make a store, we got to make it completely different, like something no one's ever seen before. And it's got to focus on engagement. nothing. When someone goes to an Apple store, you're going to make them so clean, so uncluttered that you have nothing to do but put your hands on a product or talk to somebody. And that's what they did. And of course, there's this, and I would just, every time I walk in the store, even if our volumes were a little below our plan, I would see customers and employees together in deep, enjoyable conversations.

33:02They're smiling, they're laughing, they're learning. And as I watched that, I knew all it would take was time for someone either to buy a Mac or I knew Apple's roadmap. I knew the iPod. I knew where it was going. And I just figured that there'd be some point when the products were in such demand that the Apple store would become something extraordinary. So I saw it early. but I don't think the world understood that until about 2004. And the first people to see it were the analysts. You know, the analysts suck, because they started, when the iPod went to Windows, they started counting the number of people waiting out of line to buy the thing.

33:46And they're going, what's going on here? There's huge demands, you know. But we all knew in 2004 that the stores were here for good, because, you know, our volumes almost doubled that year. We were profitable. We were setting, you know, we were the most productive retail stores in the world, even back in 2004, doing more volume per square foot than anybody, even like Tiffany or luxury brands. And so we knew the stores would be good, but then you just continue to get better and better as Apple added more products. Because we only had Macs and iPods when they were the most productive stores in the world.

34:22Imagine when the phone came. Yeah. Then the iPad. And then the watch. and people, you know, even though Apple products are available at every store in the world, it seems like, Target, Walmart, Best Buy, Circuit City, on and on, you go, people still love to shop at the office.

34:39Kara Goldin:This episode of the Kara Golden Show is brought to you by LinkedIn Hiring Pro. Hi, Kara here. For small businesses, every hire matters, but so does your time. I felt that pressure firsthand. You know, a bad hire isn't just frustrating. it's expensive in time, money, and team morale. And yet hiring the right person can feel like a full-time job on top of everything else you're already doing. Sifting through applications, trying to spot the real standouts, second-guessing decisions, it can get overwhelming fast. That's why having a way to save time without sacrificing quality isn't just nice to have, it's critical.

35:24Kara Goldin:Luckily, LinkedIn Hiring Pro is built for that reality. It's your hiring partner designed to help you hire with confidence by surfacing only the right candidates without turning hiring into another full-time job. Posting a job isn't always the hard part. It's finding, connecting with, and screening the right candidates. Hiring Pro streamlines the entire process from drafting your job to shortlisting candidates and conducting AI-powered interviews for initial screenings. Their updated conversational interface lets you describe what you need in plain language, no recruiter jargon needed. Nearly 60 % of hires find a candidate to interview within a week.

36:06Kara Goldin:With Hiring Pro, you spend less time searching and more time connecting with the right talent. Join the 2.7 million small businesses using LinkedIn to hire. Get started by posting your job for free at linkedin.com slash Kara Golden. Terms and conditions apply. This message is a paid partnership with AT &T Business. Hey everyone, Kara here. Let's get real about those early days of building a business. Not the highlight reel, the actual day-to-day, the friction, trying to manage everything across time zones, across teams, across locations, and realizing how much depends on staying connected. I remember those days at Hint, a retailer call, an order, a decision, all of it.

36:55Kara Goldin:And you realize quickly, connection isn't a nice to have, it's the lifeblood of your business. As a founder, you don't want to think about your connectivity. You just need it to work every time. That's why AT &T Business matters. AT &T Business is the reliable provider for small business owners. And when you have that kind of reliability behind you, you can focus on what actually moves your business forward. Powered by AT &T Business, built to work. Get AT &T Business at business.att.com. This episode of the Kara Golden Show is brought to you by Chime. We spend a lot of time thinking about how to make our money go further, But sometimes it's not about earning more.

37:43Kara Goldin:It's about not losing money to things that shouldn't be costing you in the first place. That's where Chime comes in. They've built a more rewarding, fee-free way to bank with no overdraft fees, no monthly fees, and no minimum balance fees. It's banking designed around helping you move forward, not charging you along the way. Chime offers the most rewarding, fee-free banking with no overdraft fees, no monthly fees, and no minimum balance fees. What I really like is that you get 5 % cash back on your Chime card in a category of your choice, like gas or groceries, while building credit through regular everyday spending with no credit check.

38:24Kara Goldin:You can also grow your money faster with a savings rate that's nine times the national average. And if you're ever in a pinch, SpotMe lets you overdraft up to$200, fee free. Join the millions who are already banking fee-free with America's number one choice for banking. Head to Chime.com slash Kara Golden. That is Chime.com slash Kara Golden. Sign up now. It only takes a few minutes. Chime is a fintech, not a bank. Banking services and Chime card provided by Chime's bank partners. Qualifying direct deposits required. Terms and limits apply. Go to Chime.com slash disclosures for details. Support for today's episode comes from Seed, the company taking a scientific approach to gut health.

39:12Kara Goldin:I'm selective about the supplements that earn a place in my daily routine. If I'm going to take something every day, I want to understand what's in it, how it works, and whether there is real evidence behind it. That's what stood out to me about Seed's DSO-1. DSO-1 is a two-in-one probiotic and prebiotic formulated with 24 probiotic strains to support digestive and whole body health. It also uses seeds via CAP technology, a capsule-in-capsule delivery system engineered to protect the probiotics through digestion and deliver them where they need to go. And this isn't based on marketing promises.

39:57Kara Goldin:in a clinical trial, DS01 was shown to improve regularity, reduce bloating, and alleviate gas. Plus, it requires no refrigeration, making it easy to maintain your routine at home or while traveling. Make your daily probiotic one of the more informed decisions you make today. Go to seed.com forward slash Cara Golden and use code Cara to get 25 % off. These statements have not been evaluated by the FDA. These products are not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease. Yeah, I remember it was shortly after we launched Hint, and I knew somebody who was also working at Apple at the stores, and the biggest problem that everyone was talking about was the lines out the door.

40:53Kara Goldin:Everyone was talking about the lines. And so it wasn't my idea. It was this individual's idea at Apple and they said, can you give us Apple Hint Water to give to a lot of the people out the doors? And so we did that. And it was huge. I mean, we got so much great customer feedback. Sure. Apple was able to, keep people hydrated while they were standing in the lines. And it just kind of worked. It was a lot of fun doing something like that. But I remember Apple. Apple just does the right thing. Yeah. Like I remember when we opened our store in the Ginza in Tokyo. People said no one in Japan is going to line up for a store opening.

41:36And we go to open our stores. And our Thanksgiving weekend, 2002, Steve and Lorraine came, which was fun to celebrate Thanksgiving. and he used to love to go up to Kyoto. But no one's going to line up. And then our store's going to open and there's typhoon warnings. Yet the walk to the store was 10 train stops. We had lines you'd measure in miles. And they waited. But because the line was so long and the rain was coming, we had umbrellas for everybody. And we had employees walking out there giving umbrellas. You know, on a hot day, they still give Hint water. You know, Apple's very conscious of what the customer needs.

42:21And that's a way of saying thank you to the people that came to wait in line. Because they're your most loyal customers. The ones that want to be there on the opening for an event, a launch, or a store opening. Because they can come back the next day and nobody will be there. But people wanted to be there at launch. which says something about the depth of customers' love for Apple.

42:45Kara Goldin:Yeah, definitely. I know you talked in the book about, and I've heard you say, that Apple stores were built to serve, not necessarily sell. But obviously, you did sell merchandise, a lot of merchandise. I don't agree with that. I don't think we sold anything. Customers choose to buy. Seriously. Yeah. Customers chose to buy at our store. You know, we had a version to selling. You know, we said, you know, the customer will, when they're ready to buy, they'll tell you I'm ready to buy. And so it would take four or five visits. But the idea is there's no ask before it's time. If you were to ask someone too early, would you buy a Mac?

43:32It might work some of the time, but some people will be very off-putting. and these are big expenses for people buying their first computer from apple and so we had an aversion to selling and we had the patience to just end every conversation with look forward to seeing you again come on back and people did you know so customers really bought in the store we i don't think it's fair to say we really sold in the store that's that's fair the entire experience sold because you were buying into the idea, if I buy here, I can come back and get help at the Genius Bar and join one-to-one training programs.

44:12And so the concept of the store, I think, sold product. But the customer bought into the idea of Apple and the Apple store.

44:22Kara Goldin:This episode of the Kara Golden Show is brought to you by LinkedIn Hiring Pro. Hi, Kara here. For small businesses, every hire matters, but so does your time. I felt that pressure firsthand. You know, a bad hire isn't just frustrating, it's expensive in time, money, and team morale. And yet hiring the right person can feel like a full-time job on top of everything else you're already doing. Sifting through applications, trying to spot the real standouts, second-guessing decisions, it can get overwhelming fast. That's why having a way to save time without sacrificing quality isn't just nice to have, it's critical.

45:06Kara Goldin:Luckily, LinkedIn Hiring Pro is built for that reality. It's your hiring partner designed to help you hire with confidence by surfacing only the right candidates without turning hiring into another full-time job. Posting a job isn't always the hard part. It's finding, connecting with, and screening the right candidates. Hiring Pro streamlines the entire process from drafting your job to shortlisting candidates and conducting AI-powered interviews for initial screenings. Their updated conversational interface lets you describe what you need in plain language, no recruiter jargon needed. Nearly 60 % of hires find a candidate to interview within a week.

45:49Kara Goldin:With Hiring Pro, you spend less time searching and more time connecting with the right talent. Join the 2.7 million small businesses using LinkedIn to hire. Get started by posting your job for free at linkedin.com slash Kara Golden. Terms and conditions apply. This message is a paid partnership with AT &T Business. Hey everyone, Kara here. Let's get real about those early days of building a business, Not the highlight reel, the actual day-to-day, the friction, trying to manage everything across time zones, across teams, across locations, and realizing how much depends on staying connected. I remember those days at Hint, a retailer call, an order, a decision, all of it.

46:37Kara Goldin:And you realize quickly, connection isn't a nice-to-have, it's the lifeblood of your business. As a founder, you don't want to think about your connectivity. You just need it to work every time. That's why AT &T Business matters. AT &T Business is the reliable provider for small business owners. And when you have that kind of reliability behind you, you can focus on what actually moves your business forward. Powered by AT &T Business, built to work. Get AT &T Business at business.att.com.

47:40Kara Goldin:helping you move forward, not charging you along the way. Chime offers the most rewarding, fee-free banking with no overdraft fees, no monthly fees, and no minimum balance fees. What I really like is that you get 5 % cash back on your Chime card in a category of your choice, like gas or groceries, while building credit through regular everyday spending with no credit check. You can also grow your money faster with a savings rate That's nine times the national average. And if you're ever in a pinch, SpotMe lets you overdraft up to$200 fee-free. Join the millions who are already banking fee-free with America's number one choice for banking.

48:25Kara Goldin:Head to chime.com slash Kara Golden. That is chime.com slash Kara Golden. Sign up now. It only takes a few minutes. Chime is a fintech, not a bank. Banking services and ChimeCard provided by Chime's bank partners. Qualifying direct deposits required. Terms and limits apply. Go to Chime.com slash disclosures for details. Support for today's episode comes from Seed, the company taking a scientific approach to gut health. I'm selective about the supplements that earn a place in my daily routine. If I'm going to take something every day, I want to understand what's in it, how it works, and whether there is real evidence behind it.

49:08Kara Goldin:That's what stood out to me about Seeds DSO-1. DSO-1 is a two-in-one probiotic and prebiotic formulated with 24 probiotic strains to support digestive and whole body health. It also uses Seeds via Cap Technology, a capsule-in-capsule delivery system engineered to protect the probiotics through digestion and deliver them where they need to go. And this isn't based on marketing promises. In a clinical trial, DS01 was shown to improve regularity, reduce bloating, and alleviate gas. Plus, it requires no refrigeration, making it easy to maintain your routine at home or while traveling. Make your daily probiotic, one of the more informed decisions you make today.

50:02Kara Goldin:Go to seed.com forward slash Cara Golden and use code Cara to get 25 % off. These statements have not been evaluated by the FDA. These products are not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease. Can you share a behind-the-scenes Apple Store story that captures how differently Apple thought? Is there one region? You spoke about Japan. Japan was great. But we had opened our store in New York in Soho. It was our first flagship store. And we had taught the employees, no matter what the customer needs, find a way to solve it. And a woman walked in the sewer one day, and I believe she was a PC user, and her PC had died.

50:55and she was an author. Like you've been, like I'm currently doing. She was writing a book and she wanted to buy a Mac to do that. But they were expensive, you know, for her as an author. And our employees said, well, I've got a better idea. Why don't, you know, why don't you just belly up to this Mac over here and I'll bring a stool down from the Genius Bar and you can write your book here in the store. and she came back for every day for 30 days and wrote her book in the store. That's pretty interesting. Yeah. And to me, that captures what the Apple store is about. Whatever your need might be, we're going to fix it.

51:39You know, in the early days of the phones, when like iPhone 4, when it was very prone to break, then we had to advertise it's really glass is going to be great, but people were cracking screens. We fixed them for free for nearly a year because what was broken was your trust in Apple. You know, you spent a lot of money on that phone and you'd accidentally slipped out of your hand. And it's an accident. You know, a product ought to be able to stand an accident, you know, like that. And so until we were able to figure that out, you know, we fixed phones for free. You know, so I think those are the kind of things that stand out to me.

52:21It's the stories of how well we took care of customers.

52:27Kara Goldin:So the Genius Bar, and I think if anyone's listening and they don't know what the Genius Bar is today, you have been hiding in a hole somewhere, but did the Genius Bar, did it start out what it is today? Was that the dream or did it sort of grow, the plan for what it would be over time? It grew over time. Like most things, they start out slower than you anticipate. But the insight we had was the biggest thing we had to overcome was people's fear of technology. And, you know, because only half the people in America and probably less in the world owned a computer, a personal computer when we launched stores.

53:13So our target market was the people who've never gotten over the hump to buy one yet. We had to convince them why a Mac was right for them. But then we had to tell them we'd stand behind it. So a lot of companies would hide customer service. They'd put it in a room next door. They even lease a space next door because they didn't want someone buying to even think that they'd have a problem. But we said, let's, if in doubt, stick it out. And we put the Genius Bar in the back of the stores and we created a bar where we had the smartest people in town who would dispense advice for free. We would fix things in a day.

53:54Our goal was to repair a Mac and have it back the next day. And we did pretty good at that. But the idea was to create a place that you could trust would be there for you when you had a problem. Early on when we launched the service, we didn't have enough customers. Apple had a really low market share. So most people walking in the store, one in a hundred might use a Mac. They had no reason to go to the Genius Bar. Yeah. So the stores were busy. The front of the store was busy. People were almost treating the store like an internet cafe back then because you didn't have a cell phone. And people charged for internet access at cafes.

54:32That was a big little business. And we had free internet. So the store was busy in the front. As time went on, people started to understand what the Genius Bar could do for you. And we had more and more customers. And then pretty soon we couldn't build the bars big enough. The last store we opened before I left in 2012, we had an entire floor in Hong Kong, overlooking Hong Kong Harbor, devoted to the Genius Bar. It had a hundred stools. A hundred places. Think about that. We had the staff to take care of 100 customers simultaneously at the Genius Bar in Hong Kong. You know, so over time, the Genius Bar became part of the culture of the store, the culture of America in many ways.

55:22And you'd see it popping up on sitcoms. You know, I was at the Genius Bar today and, you know, somehow it became a pretty magical place. But it took time.

55:32Kara Goldin:It's interesting because when I think about the Apple stores back then, but also today, you create an environment that definitely brought new people in who had been unsure about how to buy. And so you gain the new consumers, but you didn't make the existing consumers who loved Apple feel like they couldn't come in. right? That it wasn't a newbie. I'm not like them. And instead, they wanted to come in, right? They wanted to say, maybe they wanted to even help the salespeople sell, you know, iPhone or computer. How do you do that? Right? Like, it's just, it was a whole new retail concept, but I got it.

56:23Kara Goldin:I watched what you were doing and I thought it was fascinating and innovative for sure. But how do you do that? How do you serve existing consumers, but then also bring in the new consumers as you did and make everyone feel like this is your place? Well, you know, the way I'd answer that, it's easy to design a store for an existing consumer. They're going to come to you no matter where you put the store. You know, typically people would put stores like that in low-cost places because they'll drive to it when I got to come. It's harder to design a store to bring in someone new, right? So we had to think through everything we did.

57:12But what's the experience a new customer is going to have? And what's the experience that an existing customer is going to have? Right. And we had to make them all feel welcome. And we did that through the people and the programming. So, for example, early on in the back of the store, we had a theater. It was meant to be like Macworld. If you've ever been to a Macworld, there's the big stage where Steve would launch a product. but there were all these little stages where you'd demonstrate like iPhoto or iMovie or whatever's new and incoming. And so we had a schedule of events and there were events for first timers getting started with a Mac.

57:54And then we had events for Final Cut Pro. And so the people who were using their Mac for work would come in at certain times in the day and they'd be with other Final Cut Pro people and they felt like they were with their peers. those classes were taught by very sophisticated trainers while the getting started with Mac was taught by someone who was just a good teacher because the audience knew so little and they had the patience to help people understand what's a mouse do I have to look should I be looking on the floor no the mouse is what you hold when you interact with the computer we had mice back on you know when we launched the store the Mac had a mouse right But we had such a diversity of customers, but that's what made the stores fun.

58:42We had a lot of early on complaints from some of the real sophisticated Apple people. Your employees don't know anything. You know, I know more about the Mac than your employees and they wanted expertise everywhere. But we couldn't do that because then we wouldn't have people who were great at welcoming the people who'd never bought a Mac before. You know, so we had diversity, really diverse personal geographies with all the employees in the store.

59:11Kara Goldin:I think it's so interesting, too, that, you know, you mentioned that the stores don't look that much different versus how when you launch. And I think that that also speaks to that you were doing it right, right? The company was growing. People wanted more, the existing consumer base, but you were still bringing in new consumers. When does a brand know that they need to bring in new consumers, especially if they're growing their existing consumer base? When you notice, when you do something great, really significant, and it doesn't move the needle on your volume or your market share. It'd be like if you launched a new bottle of flavored water And you knew it was the best in the world And your sales didn't go up And that's what happened to Apple when Steve returned So for those who know Apple well Steve founded the company with Woz He left, he was replaced by someone They brought him back in 1997 Really to save the company And he did a lot of things initially to help save the company But the big one is they launched a great product, the iMac.

1:00:28You remember that. It was a cult hit. It was on the cover of Time magazine. It used beautiful plastics and colored plastics, and it changed the whole idea of what a computer was. It got all the attention in the world, but it only sold to the Mac install base. After about a year, Apple was in the same place. Windows had won. Windows had 95 % share of the Mac wasn't grown. And that's when Steve knew that if he was going to win, he had to control the customer's parents. He had to improve the channel. And that was really Apple's weak point as a company. It had great marketing, great hardware, great software.

1:01:17Its go-to market was terrible. Best Buy wouldn't carry the Mac back then. it was too low volume for Best Buy. They only carried these. Circuit City didn't carry the Mac. We were carried mainly in these, you know, mom-and-pop resellers. There were these small little stores that weren't a great shopping experience. And Steve knew that where the world was going, he had to open his own stores. In spite of the internet, as you started talking about, where people said, why would you do this? The world's going online. Stores won't exist. But Steve knew he had to be face-to-face with customers to win.

1:01:57And that was the right instinct. Yeah, definitely. It's hard to imagine like the iPhone. When the iPhone came out, it was so fun to see customer after customer for the first time touch a screen and impact it. Just the touch response. It was like a moment you never forget. That first time you interacted with the iPhone. You know, and, you know, so that if you didn't have stores, how would the iPhone have taken off like it did? You know, we had so many stores when the iPhone launched. We were within seven miles of 80 % of the U.S. population, the U.K. population, the Japanese population. So we could really get people, and they wanted to see that product.

1:02:45They had heard about it, and they wanted to try it, and they lined up to do that. and they bought it and that kick-started the thing when the imap launched you'd go in a store they were in boxes and they were beautiful boxes but they weren't out there to try no one had them loaded with software it was just a pretty looking thing you know but with the apple store you could try everything and and so the stores you know had a real positive impact for apple as we launched all those new products in the first decade at the stores it impacted the ipod the obviously the iphone the ipad all those products were things you had to try to understand today you know you can order online because you kind of know what the experience of working with an all-stream devices

1:03:35Kara Goldin:back then you didn't yeah no it's so so true so today uh we are you you can not get through your day without hearing about AI and or people call it chat GPT or however you want to refer to it as. But in the age of AI and online shopping, you are sitting back in your chair now and looking at it and I'm sure have many, many thoughts. But why might physical retail become even more important today, knowing what you know? Yeah, my instinct is AI is going to, and it already is, it's going going to greatly improve the online shopping experience. So instead of having going through all these tiles and click, click, click, click, click and try to find something you want to buy, we'll be able to have a conversation with an agent that's tailored to that website that will take us through finding the right product.

1:04:29So online will improve. The stores will improve as they implement AI and they already are in a variety of ways. But it's not going to change where we shop. it'll change how we shop and I say that with great confidence because we are now 30 years in the US after online shopping started each of us shops every week we've reached our conclusions what things do I go to the store for what things do I go to Amazon for when do I go online and over the 30 years that customers voted what they want as an omni-channel experience. They want to work with a brand where they can go online and sometimes they'll buy online, sometimes they'll go to the store.

1:05:18They'd love to buy online and pick up in store if they're in a hurry. You know, so the debate over online shopping and physical shopping is largely over. And if you look at it, 30 % of all products are bought online, which means the market share between online and retailers changed a point every year. But for the last two years, it's been pretty static. You know, stores are actually growing a little bit faster than online for most retailers, you know? And so the world's changed. And why is that? Well, because we're kind of getting tired. We're getting over, we're tired of spending too much time on screens, especially young kids.

1:06:06You know, the younger you are, the less time you want to spend on screens. And you're trying to connect more. You see that if you have, I have young kids in New York, they're all in running clubs. You know, everyone's trying to connect. And so I think what AI is going to do, it's going to let us get to the general knowledge we need much faster, like shopping, which I can do online. But then I'll have more time to go connect. And connection is what is really convenience at its core. If you look at the root word of convenience, what's the word? To convene. So somehow we were, over years, we've misunderstood what convenience really is.

1:06:58it's not just efficiency. It's the ease of connecting with people. And that's what's going to happen, I think, as we go forward. And so where I live, you know, in Menlo Park, Atherton, Palo Alto, one of the hardest parking places is Stanford Shopping Center. Well, that's within two miles of where the VCs and private equity firms for 30 years have been trying to put stores out of business. Yet they thrive in the heart of that world. These are the most online people in the world, the most digital savvy, the most incoming people. Yet Stanford Shopping Center is one of the most productive centers in the world.

1:07:45And the hardest parking place in the valley. So if retail can survive in the heart of the technology world, imagine how much better we'll do it or else. you know so stores are here for good it's kind of what we do online's here for good ai is going to make it better i don't think it's going to change where we shop it'll just change the

1:08:08Kara Goldin:experience we get shopping i totally agree so we have so so many things that you talked about in the book your experience with target and jc penny as well when you think about the biggest lessons if you had a couple of major lessons from Shop Different that founders and CEOs should take away, what would you say about building out brands? I would say two or three things. Number one, don't be in a hurry. No matter what we do, we always feel we're in a hurry. Things take time to build. But I go back to, you know, I had the privilege of working side by side with Steve Jobs for 12 years. Unfortunately, he left us way too soon But look what he accomplished in his lifetime He invented the PC He invented the digital movie He saved Apple He brought us a modern smartphone, everything But Steve was never in a hurry You know, Steve said When you do one product well You earn the right to do another And I remember with movies You know, people said Why don't you do two Pixar movies a year They're doing so well Every other studio releases multiple movies He goes, I can only do one a year well So the first five to seven years Pixar launched one movie a year But they were all great you know, Apple did very few products in its time.

1:09:49You know, we finally did a non-PC and that was the iPod. But the phone didn't come out until six years after the iPod launched because it took time to make that a great product. You know, and Steve and the team worked on that phone for at least three years. And some of the Apple wanted it to ever come out. You know, and... But Steve was never in a hurry. He wasn't in a hurry in a meeting. He would stay with the group until they got to the right answer. He was always available when I needed to talk to him, if I called or he called me every day, it seemed like for a good number of years. Steve wasn't in a hurry, so don't be in a hurry.

1:10:32Just be in a hurry to do great work. You know, that'd be my first, you know, bit of advice. And similar to that, I really believe that everyone, all the great things, come out of someone's imagination or their inner voice. You're not going to win in business by copying something that's been done before. You improve when you copy. And it's good to pay attention to your competitors and steal their best ideas. That lets you improve. That's what it takes to compete. To win, you have to do something that's never been done before. You know, you did that with your water. You know, when you launched that, you were one of the first to do flavored water.

1:11:29Or unsweetened flavored water. Unsweetened flavored water. But the point is, you did something that hadn't been done before. And that's what it takes. and things that haven't been done before are always the combination of some group of people, barely an individual, who are in conversation trying to solve a really important need and aha, they come up with something unique. You know, I had a few of those moments in my life doing design at Target. You know, good design doesn't have to be expensive. That was very different when we did that, you know. The Apple store is very different. The Genius Bar is a way to serve people These are things that had never been done before.

1:12:11But they're the kind of things that endure. They're the kind of things that break through the clutter. And so I think you have to really have confidence in your imagination. And then when you launch something, you've got to will it to success. Very few things are overnight. If you believe in something to your core, keep working at it until you get it right. You know, those are a couple bits or bits. Yeah.

1:12:36Kara Goldin:How long did it take you from the time that you were incubating this idea of the Apple stores to actual launch? 18 months. 18 months? 18 months, yeah. We spent from, I started in January, we opened in, I guess, 17 months. It was the end of May, so it was probably 18 months, which is time. Yeah, definitely. Ron, thank you so much for joining me today. The book is called Shop Different. Comes out in mid-September. The exact date, Ron, is... September 22nd. Woo-hoo! So Shop Different. Get your copy. I love this conversation. Love the book. It's going to make you want to go to an Apple store even more and kind of live the experience even more.

1:13:28Kara Goldin:So, so, so good. Thank you, Ron, for all your wisdom and for really all of these incredible experiences that you've brought to life for not only me, but also consumers. So it was so great to get to know you a little more. Well, you're way too kind and I appreciate your chance to spend time together. Thank you again. Thanks everyone for listening. Thanks again for listening to The Kara Golden Show. If you would, please give us a review and feel free to share this podcast with others who would benefit. And of course, feel free to subscribe so you don't miss a single episode of our podcast. Just a reminder that I can be found on all platforms at Kara Golden.

1:14:08Kara Goldin:I would love to hear from you too, so feel free to DM me. And if you want to hear more about my journey, I hope you will have a listen or pick up a copy of my Wall Street Journal bestselling book, Undaunted, where I share more about my journey, including founding and building, Hint. We are here every Monday, Wednesday, and Friday. Thanks for listening and goodbye for now. This episode of the Kara Golden Show is brought to you by LinkedIn Hiring Pro. Hi, Kara here. For small businesses, every hire matters, but so does your time. I felt that pressure firsthand. You know, a bad hire isn't just frustrating, it's expensive in time, money, and team morale.

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