Entrepreneur Confidential: Alli Webb Sold Drybar for $255 MILLION! | KMP Ep.43

24:50But, you know, I think it was probably not the right thing in the first place, you know, if I'm being really honest.

24:57Katie Miller:What advice would you give to other women who are looking to start a business? You know, obviously some will never be as successful as you were. But women who are, you know, entrepreneurs who are saying, I also want to do something outside of the home. And how do you keep it all together? Because that is something that I think about a lot, right? Like whether or not, you know, like a podcast for me is a business. My daughter last night turned to me and she goes, Mommy, when I grow up, I want to interview and I want to be a mom. And I was like, that's so cute. But like, what is interviewing? Like, what even is that?

25:28Katie Miller:No, it's awesome. And so, you know, where I go with this is, like, how do you, obviously my husband and I work very hard to stay connected and have that time with two different demanding jobs. Yeah. But I'd be curious as to, like, what your advice would be to other women trying to do the same. Well, I mean, you know, it's interesting. I probably have a different answer today than I would have five or ten years ago. I mean, but I think, you know, at the end of the day, like, you know, probably along the lines of, like, why I decided to start my mobile business all those years ago. Like, I really believe in, like, finding your purpose.

26:05And what's interesting about my life right now is that, like, after selling Drybar, a lot of people are like, why don't you just, you know, chill out and, you know, go to the beach and vacation, whatever. I'm like, that's just very unfulfilling for me. Like, I'm a builder. I like to build things. And so, you know, I think it's like, you know, paying very close attention to like that inner voice of what makes you, you know, feel really good. You know, I think there's this interesting, like, I feel like I see this a lot and maybe it's just I'm getting fed this because I am interested in it. That, you know, this like overworking ourselves and working ourselves to the ground.

26:46And like there's some sort of trophy for that. Like, I don't, and I think I did subscribe to that at some point. I don't think I do now, you know.

26:54Katie Miller:That's like, be the best. You have to like out-compete somebody else. Yeah, or like you have to like work like a 12 or 14 hour day. Like, I am much more of the camp now. And, you know, and it's hard to say because maybe because I'm on the other side and I've grown a business and I have a little bit of a cushion, you know, but not even like, I still feel like I have like an ax to grind. I still feel like I want to make more money. I still feel like I want to do more things, you know. And I think that that drive is very important, but I also like that it's equally matched with I love building stuff.

27:26I love growing stuff. I love having a positive effect on women and the world. That is just my passion. So whatever that looks like, and from an advice standpoint, it's like keep that in mind where I feel like a lot of people get kind of waylaid on this. Like I just want to get really rich and make a lot of money.

27:44Katie Miller:Do you think there's a demonization of private equity that's warranted? Like, you know, it kind of, I don't want to say it's ruined the dry bar brand because it hasn't. But also I look at like Poppy recently just sold and immediately their product changed. Did it? Yeah. They immediately changed some of like the healthier stuff in it to something unhealthy. Yeah. And so. Is Allison still running it? I don't think so. Yeah. I think she's done what you did, which is like take the full step back. Yeah. Which to me, your stories are very similar. She's just doing it more recently. And she sold for$2 billion.

28:16Katie Miller:She did very well for herself, which I think, though, is today's market share for most things. It's crazy. It's like overinflated market shares for most companies. Yeah, it's insane. Do you think it's right that private equity has that kind of demonization given what it's doing to these brands? You know, I can make the argument on both sides. I've seen it both ways. You know, I don't think that private equity ruined Drybar. You know, I think, and I don't think Drybar is ruined, but I changed Drybar, I guess is a better way to put it. And I can only, of course, speak to my experience with private equity.

28:49And we were very, here's the word again, discerning on who we partnered with. And we almost did a deal before we did the deal with Castaneda, which is now Stride, which I don't know if you know, those guys are out of Boston. But we almost did a deal with another company, another private equity company that was like at the 11th hour we pulled out because there was some red flags and we were like, oh, shit, we got to get out of this. And it was painful to unravel it and whatever. But my experience with private equity and the people we chose to work with was was really positive. And what we looked for in a private equity group was like people who were going to like be in lockstep with us, not try to change everything.

29:32And really, Kastanea and Rourke, who was our other big private equity partner, you know, we worked alongside them and they were incredibly helpful to us. So my experience was good. That being said, not mentioning any names, I have other friends who are big founders who've had terrible experiences with private equity where they've not made a great deal. And there are changes that are being made. And then you see, you know, I didn't know about that with Poppy, but I've seen it with other brands, you know, where private equity comes in. And I mean, I was actually I just watched a reel this morning on Candace Nelson, who's a good friend of mine.

30:06And, you know, she sold private equity there. They were there. They closed the Sprinkles door. And, you know, and I'm sure you follow Cody Sanchez, who I also adore. And, you know, she talks about it all the time. It's like a lot of times private equity does come in by it. And, you know, you kind of lose the soul of the company. You make changes that, you know, seem more economical. and then you lose the essence of what it is, which, you know, I think to some degree that has happened with Drybar. Like I hate speaking ill of Drybar because it is my legacy. And, you know, I'm also not involved in Drybar anymore.

30:45That doesn't mean I wasn't willing. I won't go too into the weeds with that. But it's like, I do feel like when I hear stories like that, I'm like, God, I could come and fix that thing so fast. You could do it so quickly. I could do it so quickly. You know exactly what to do. Because when you say things like that, I'm like, even the story you told me about the stylist and the TikTok thing, I'm like, oh, I know why that's not working. You know, it's like I was very, very particular and, you know, about who went on the floor and when. And by the way, that was also the biggest rub between me and our board was because we could be doing 150 blood today, but we're only doing 120 because Ali won't approve stylists to go on the floor.

31:21And they were all like, but we could be making more money. I'm like, but we will get a terrible reputation and we have to make sure the stylists are where they need to be. And I was like, not that I didn't care about making money, but I was like, this is my reputation online. This is like, I want women to come in with so much confidence that no matter whose chair they sit in, it's going to be a great blowout. My guess is nobody is like ringing that bell anymore to be like, no, no, no, no, no. We can't just let anybody on the floor. Yeah.

31:45Katie Miller:Do you think that TikTok today has set, and I would say Instagram as well, has set these impossible beauty standards for girls that maybe weren't in existence when Drybar was started? 100%. I mean, girls were posting on Twitter, TwitPix or whatever they were called back then. I mean, Instagram actually started in 2010, too. That's when Drybar started. But Twitter was much more popular as like a sharing tool, which was so funny. But yeah, I do think that's true. I mean, and I personally work very hard to show, I mean, listen, I'm, I couldn't say, you know, I, do I put a filtered, like, great picture on my, of myself on Instagram?

32:25Yes. Who doesn't? Who doesn't? I also do like to show the not so pretty and not so filtered. And I really try to kind of straddle the fence on that. I do think that there is an impossible standard that we are trying to meet. I feel it too. I see these girls and I'm like, huh, how do I look like that? And even like I was just asked for a quote on, I didn't even really know this show, although I think maybe I need to watch it. It's on campus, off campus. What's that show? I don't know. It's like some show that's blowing up and there's two young actresses on it. They must be in their early 20s, Ella Bright, I think, and Mika, whatever.

33:07But the magazine asked me to comment on their hair. And they're wearing very like, they're just like no muss, no fuss, like very, because I was doing my research and looking at their hair and seeing how they wear it. And they're wearing it very like wavy, messy. And I was like, oh, it's like speaking to my soul because, and I was so, these are younger girls who are certainly influencing the younger girls. And they're not having this ideal of perfectionism. They're, you know.

33:34Katie Miller:Not the sorority recruitment girls. They're just not. they're like they're they're beautiful but they're just more themselves and i and my hope and again part of my you know hope with messy is like the pendulum swings back a little bit to like less over filtered less perfect more like listen i want to be the best version of myself of course always we all do and should right but like it doesn't have to be this ideal of perfectionism which you know i feel like i contributed to with with dry bar you know but i'll tell you it's what it's interesting too I mean you know because you go to dry bar all the time like the Mai Tai which is like the messy beachy look it's kind of ironic that that if you were to look at like all the data the Mai Tai is the number one encrusted style at dry bar which was a messy beachy look did you come up with all the styles I did which one so Mai Tai is your favorite well probably you know because yeah I mean that was what I did all the time because I can't tell you how many women would come into dry bar and be like I don't want my hair to look like I just had a blowout you know it's like sometimes you do and sometimes you want the like very perfect I feel like now they have to do with hot tools I've never gotten away now with someone just doing it with a round brush yeah it's it's harder you know as a stylist to do it and I mean like I can do it but sometimes you still touch it up with a hot tool but for me it's like what's more interesting to me is using someone's natural texture versus like yeah you know I just literally came back from LA yesterday and had a shoot with messy and you know I had a couple hairstylists helping me and I was like Like, listen, we're not going to do, like, a blowout and then curl her hair to look messy.

35:04Like, it's very important to me that this is authentic, that we're using their true texture and showing, you know, how we do it. You know, do I touch up with a curling iron? I didn't today, but sometimes I do, you know. And so it's like there's no, like, nothing off limits, you know. But I just, it's like being the best version of yourself.

35:21Katie Miller:What's your most controversial hair opinion? Huh. That's such a good question. I don't love a slicked back bun or a slicked back pony. I feel like that's been a very big trend and everybody loves it. And listen, I think it looks really cool on the Kardashians and Kylie Jenner. I was actually thinking about Kourtney Kardashian, like how she said she lost all of her hair when she slicked it back. Oh, that's interesting. I didn't even think about that. I just don't, it's not for me. I don't like the way I look. And maybe it's just because I have such a relationship with my hair. I like my hair big.

35:54I like my hair on my face. Like my hair is very much my frame and like my maybe even security blanket. I just, I see these girls do these really beautiful like slick back looks and I'm like, that's just a no for me. If you could permanently retire one hairstyle forever, which one would it be? Gosh, that's such a hard question. I mean, the first thing that came to mind was like really short bangs. But like some girls. Can pull it off. Some girls can pull it off. Where are you on the bob? I love a bob. I love a bob. I wish that I could I could invent or somebody could figure out how to like make your hair grow in like 10 days like a chia pet right yeah like I wish because I want a bob all the time but I would only do it for like 5 days and then give it back right I'm like can I cut my hair into a bob and then in even a month's time have my long hair back because I love a bob what celebrity hair era lives rent free in your mind

36:47Katie Miller:oh probably like which celebrity like what the hair era like when everyone was doing like the same thing Probably like the Cindy Crawford, you know, Christy Brinkley, big bouncy waves. Like I do love that hair. But I feel like, you know, I mentioned, oh, you know, I changed that. Mary-Kate and Ashley Olsen. The amount of time I think about their hair, four years. And I always wanted that hair. And, you know, I know a lot of... I think all girls wanted the Mary-Kate and Ashley Olsen look. I mean, it's funny because I don't know what your age demo is, but some people might be like, who the hell are they?

37:21No, I'm still re-watching those movies now with my daughter. Yeah, but their hair. They're iconic. And I know a lot of, I know, like, I think Mark Townsend does their hair a lot. He's a big, you know, famous, like, LA hair stylist. And he's like, they don't like a blowout. They don't like sitting for a blowout. They have this, like, effortlessly, like, wavy, messy hair. And I swear it was, like, one of my biggest inspirations in starting messy. It was like, I just, and my hair is much, seemingly much curlier than there. But, like, the longer my hair gets, the more I get that look. So, yeah, I think about them a lot.

37:51So why did you? Why'd you start messy? Well, you know, I think, like I was saying before, I think I just got so tired of, like, the over styling, the breakage, the damage, and the, like, perfectionism I was trying to get with my own hair. And really wanted, like you were saying before, like, to learn how to, like, embrace my waves and not fight them so much. And, like, is there a way? and it was really during COVID when everyone kind of stopped blow drying their hair and you weren't leaving the house and whatever, that I wanted to find a way to embrace my texture, my curls, my waves, whatever, and like tame the frizz.

38:29And it wasn't just a, it's interesting now because there's the air dry trend, which works.

38:34Katie Miller:They say that's super bad for your hair. Really? Why? Yeah. I don't know. They said that that's not good to have like wet hair at your roots, that you need to blow dry them at your roots. That is an odd. Okay. You think that's fake? I think that's fake. Okay. I don't know why. Now I get like paranoid. I get out of the shower and I like paranoid, like blow dry my roots. I don't know. Someone said that to me and I believed them. I can't. So now I can't go to bed with a wet head. Now I need to like feel like I need to research that. I can't think of a good reason that that would be a thing. I can't go to bed with a wet head.

38:59That is so interesting. No, I don't think that's true. But going to bed with wet hair is probably not ideal for a bunch of reasons, you know? Why? Because first of all, like your hair will dry funky. Sure. for starters. And you don't, you know, there's so much friction on your hair, I feel like. I'm sure you sleep on a silk pillowcase.

39:21Katie Miller:Bamboo. Okay. I think, I don't know. I got to look at it. It's like cotton, organic cotton. Yeah, I think you need silk. Because silk, cotton roughs up the hair cuticle and it's not good for your skin either. Well, I know those with babies, by the way. Like, when you have a newborn who has hair, on these, like, on their crib sheets that are, like, organic cotton because everyone buys the organic cotton crib sheets now, the ones that have, like no plastics no dyes but i keep going that all you find the baby's hair on the crib sheets because of them rubbing it so like i think it was like my son all of his hair had fallen out in the back of his head no it does i'm like the crib sheet i don't know i can't comment to baby hair yeah loss but i was a real thing i didn't know that was a thing but but i'm telling you sleeping on a silk pillowcase which i have i have very strong feelings about like i feel like what are you doing if you're not like it is really yes because cotton will the you will get a lot of even if it's organic you'll get a lot of like friction on your hair and it's not great for your skin like i was just talking to my you know i might have a plastic surgeon does it apply by the way to silk hair ties like does it apply way way better for your hair than like the plastic or the really strong alaska ones a hundred percent anything silk you want silk okay silk on your hair silk on your face you know okay but but to answer your question i mean so with with why i started messy you know I just I feel like you know it just it felt like the right time to like let's let's figure out a way to embrace our true texture and and have our daughters embrace it and not you know and it's not to say like I'm forever evolving when it comes to hair I love change I love trying new things and I the amount of time and talk about living rent free in my head it's like the amount of time I think about hair or see someone's hair and be like huh how did they do that how can I do that what can I mean I and I'm like if you ever see someone's hair and you're like that's awful yeah or I'm like sometimes I just want to go up and be like can I just do something can I just I can help you so much you know I started carrying around like messy samples I give to women because I'm like not that I would ever go up to a woman and be like you need to fix your hair but also like the back of people's hair I'm like you got to remember the back you know it's like I put the twist in when now I'm like wait how's the back of my hair look um you know but yeah I mean I I just I think about hair so much and I just want I wanted to give women at like another alternative to the blowout, you know?

41:37It's like, or, you know, or it's like a blowout or a bun. Like there's got to be something in the middle. And I really think that's where messy comes in.

41:45Katie Miller:In every episode, we play the game of would you rather. Oh, that's fun. Would you rather use drugstore box hair dye the day of a black tie event or never be able to use dry shampoo again? Oh my God, definitely store bought. Box hair dye. Yeah, thanks. Or box hair dye. Yeah, because I have actually done that when I was, I'm very overdue for color now. I hope you can't see it. I've been traveling a ton and I'm getting my color done next week. Anyways, but I would, when my hair was a little bit darker, I would just buy it. So I'm not opposed to that. I'm also a hairstylist, so I'm not scared of that.

42:18Katie Miller:But the box hair dye, I feel like it's similar to what... Yeah, like L 'Oreal makes a really easy to use, like light gray coverage. It's like, you know, I mean, if you have blonde hair, don't put like brown on your hair. Right. But, you know. Would you rather accidentally use Gorilla Glue as hairspray or Nair as shampoo? Oh, God. That's terrible.

42:43I don't, I can't, I'd say neither. I just can't. I can't admit to any of those.

42:51Katie Miller:Would you rather spend six hours trying to get gum out of a client's hair or try to fix the bangs they cut themselves at 1 a.m. after a breakup? up? I'd probably rather fix the bangs. Is there a way to fix bangs? Well, yes, you can like, I like a challenge like that. Like you could, you can bring it down more hair. Like, yeah. I mean, don't, don't cut your own bangs is the moral of the story. But if you do, like, I feel like I can, you can change a part. Like there's more things you can do. Like getting gum out of someone's hair just doesn't sound fun. Would you rather have to wear 2007 era bangs side bangs forever or bring back crunchy mousse curls oh god no crunchy mousse curls which is exactly like what i don't like i'm that's the only thing i know how to do it's so well i'm pretty like anti-diffuser like i'm like even though like and that's that's kind of the thing with messy it's like i'm like embrace your texture your curls but like please don't use and i feel like i talk about controversy i'll probably get in trouble for saying this but like the diffused curls i mean some girls like it so I don't you know it's like do what you like I don't like those diffused scrunchy curls and that like just made me think of that like and maybe it's because like that's all I knew how to do when I was a kid is either scrunch them and that's like what my hairstylist told me to do get a diffuser and then I'd have these curls I don't like curls like that like I like loose wavy curls but my hair if I was using diffuser and I scrunched my hair it would it's very curly I know how to stretch it out now no thanks on diffused curls would you rather cut your own hair without a mirror or let one of your kids give you highlights?

44:26I'd rather cut my own hair without a mirror. Oh my god. My son, my younger son, he was born with like, he was like a toe head, very blonde. And from the time he was probably like six until he was 12, he would, I used to do it for him. Like we'd get hair color and it'd be pink one week and blue the next and then he just started doing it himself. It was so fun. It was a form of expression that I completely embraced.

44:49Katie Miller:What's a conspiracy theory that you believe in? God, I don't, that's a good question. It's so funny because my, speaking of my son, he's, he's been very into conspiracy theories forever, but I don't know. I don't go down the road at all. What's his favorite? Well, like he just sent me something like two days ago that was like, you know, all this alien stuff that, the UFOs, I mean the UFO stuff that's like been uncovered. He's, he's like, I told you, you know we get a lot of that like I told you that they were real and that did we go to the moon well I mean I know this this is like there's just so much crazy shit out there now I and I'm a big like I believe where there's smoke there's fire so I don't know I don't know where do you get your news?

45:37I don't watch the news. I rarely watch TV. I mean, I watch shows. I'm like a streamer. Like I love, you know, Netflix and that kind of stuff, but I don't, it's funny cause I grew up, you probably did too, like with the TV was just on and like news was always on. In the background.

45:53Katie Miller:Yeah. Yeah. It's just so toxic and negative that I'm just not a news girl. Um, I mean, I probably get my news from like Instagram and like, you know, my boyfriend is always like, he has I have like Apple News on my phone I don't really love the news I'm like a little bit more ignorance is bliss and like you know somebody will tell me something I really need to know if it's really important yeah um what's the first app you open in the morning probably I mean does does messaging messaging yeah yeah I mean I think I always because I don't live in the same city as my kids anymore I I usually like will text check text my check my Oh, my God.

46:35My text messages to make sure my kids are good. And then probably Insight Timer because they have this thing on your phone where you can have a little square and you can, like, set your intention for the day.

46:45Katie Miller:Oh, that's cool. Yeah. What shows are you watching right now? What did I just watch? I just plowed through something. God, I can never remember when someone asked me. Oh, Imperfect Women. Have you seen that? No. It's pretty good. I'm rewatching Manifest right now. There's a show called Manifest? Yes. Oh my gosh, wait. So I'm really into conspiracy theories. That's like my thing. That's why you asked that. Yes, my thing. Yeah, what's yours? Well, I have a lot of them. I believe every conspiracy theory is true. You would have a great time with my son. But my latest one is I'm back on the MH370. Like what happened to the plane, the Malaysian airline plane.

47:25Oh, I remember hearing that.

47:26Katie Miller:I'm back on that one, which is like it disappeared. It's completely off radar. I think I saw that. Why? Like where did it go? did it time jump like where why did they only find certain parts it's the most expensive aviation search in history yet they can't find a lot of the parts to the plane like that just it doesn't vibe check for me yeah and so I was watching a different documentary about a different conspiracy theory about the missing nuclear scientists which led me back to MH370 which led me to re-watching manifest because that's a plane that time jumps five years it's missing for five years and then it lands and so it's a conspiracy in and of like what where did the plane go but the plane was just in the air and like time jumped.

48:09Oh now I want to watch that.

48:10Katie Miller:It's on Netflix. Okay. Very fascinating. Good to know. Huh. What's the last thing you were influenced to buy? What's the last thing I was influenced to buy? Probably cowboy boots. I do live in Nashville now. But what like where like what from where from probably I have a I have a new like music girl crush on Ella Langley It was Taylor Swift for a very long time But now it's all Ella and I'm like I love okay like I'm yeah I mean I just I do on Instagram is like influenced to buy something I know I know but I mean it's like there's always so I actually literally as I was getting dressed today I was like I need new clothes like any new tops like I need I need to infuse some newness It's that time of year.

48:53Yeah. And it's warm. Yeah.

48:56Katie Miller:What do you always keep in your purse?

49:01Dry shampoo and lipstick.

49:04Katie Miller:I've never used dry shampoo. Ever? Ever. I don't understand. Ever. I don't understand. Ever. I think it makes my hair either white or greasy or something because I have super black hair. Will you please try the one I gave you, dry shampoo? Yeah, I've never used it. It's called Silky Dry Shampoo. It has vegan silk in it. So it's like, as opposed to like, I still can't understand that sentence, but the detox dry shampoo that we did for Dry Bar, which was amazing, but very strong. I have a lot of dry shampoo. I've never sprayed it into my head. So don't start with the detox because it's very white and it's very, very, very concentrated with powder, which all dry shampoos are.

49:41So when we were deciding to make a dry shampoo for Messy, I was like, it can't be, like, I don't really want to do a dry shampoo because it can't be, it's just drying and not good for your scalp. This one is incredibly good for your scalp. I know your hair is dark, and it will come out light, but I promise you if you just do this and rub it in, it'll rub. I just use a little bit. I really want to be the first now. And it's silky. You'll love it. But you will see it. You just got to use your fingertips to run it in. And, like, lift and spray. That is shocking to me, by the way, that most women, I even saw a girl posted how much she loved our dry shampoo today, but she just sprayed it on her scalp.

50:15I'm like, no, no, no, no. You have to, like, lift and spray. but yeah and then you just rub it in well the new trend is actually like heavy maybe you haven't

50:23Katie Miller:seen this maybe i'm just too much on tiktok but like again these women dump their hair over into a sink just wash right here instead of doing dry shampoo like you're not washing this yeah you're just washing this i buy that because that's really chances are you don't need to wash your hair you need to wash your hairline yeah which is like i used to when i would blow dry my hair a lot i I used to do that. I would just wet the front pieces of my hair and re-blow them, and then it makes the whole thing look fresh. Do you think there's something with the fact that, like, if you don't wash your hair as many days of the week, it gets less greasy?

50:56Well, it depends on if you're putting dry shampoo in it. I think, I do think, no, I think it gets more greasy the longer you go without washing it.

51:03Katie Miller:Okay. Because, like, your natural oils start to come in, but I think that's actually really good for your hair. You know, you don't want to be washing. You said you wash your hair twice a week? Yeah. That's good. My hair doesn't get oily. It doesn't? No. Ever? It just gets gross. Like, eventually, I'm like, that smells. Like, dry? It just gets, like, it just kind of, like, at a certain point during the week, because I do so much TV or something, there's too much hairspray and stuff that I'm like, ugh. Then it's just, like, product heavy. Yeah, I've got to, like, wash it out. Yeah. And I'm doing, like, five washes to get, like, the layers of hairspray out.

51:32Yeah, you use hairspray, huh?

51:33Katie Miller:Well, the people who do my hair at night, yeah, do. If I do ever get a blowout and someone is doing my hair, I'm like, no hairspray. I don't like hairspray. I don't like, like, why? Why use hairspray? Also, why the mousse when you begin? Well, that's to like build texture and body. I get that. Okay. But a hairspray is like a hard no for me. Really? I really don't like hairspray. That's controversial. Yes. I just, I feel like, maybe it's just like because I grew up in the Aquanet era, like hairspray very hard. Yeah. All right. Last question of the pod always is, if you could host a dinner party with three people dead or alive, who's sitting at the table and what are you eating?

52:08Well, definitely Jesus. Okay. Big Jesus guy. Yeah.

52:13Katie Miller:Big Jesus girl. Big Jesus guy. Well, I just want to have a conversation. I really want to, I have so many questions, you know. Maybe Maya Angelou. That's fascinating. Yeah. I feel like I'd love to like, I don't know if I want to say this. God, it's such a good question. I mean, it's a toss up between like Oprah, because I'm like a big, I grew up with Oprah and just love her. can you imagine the conversation with like Jesus and Oprah and I get a third maybe like JFK JFK I just am fascinated I'm a little fascinated by the Kennedys in general speaking of like a series like the love story you know like I was always very into that them that whole the CIA was involved in his murder no you think they were yes I'm telling you every conspiracy theory I come back to.

53:11I never even didn't even know that was a thing.

53:14Katie Miller:Yeah. Wow. That's interesting. I also lived in New York City when they were there. So it was like, you know. Yeah. What are you eating? Probably steak. I'm a big like steak and fries. Maybe a little caviar and sushi. Those are like my favorites. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you for doing this. Yeah. Thanks for coming here. That was so nice. when they told me you were flying in, I was like, she's just flying in for this? Yeah. That's so nice. Thank you so much for watching this episode of the Katie Miller Podcast. We're live every Tuesday night at 6 p.m. everywhere you get your podcasts. We'll see you next week.