Episode 7 - Jillian Michaels | The Katie Miller Podcast

24:40Katie Miller:i was like right on time and then i'm like okay right i know she has no idea what's in there and what she's talking about so i go i'm like have you looked just like you said to me have you looked at any of these things i'd probably take the alternate view that there is very terrible things in there but sure well there are yeah so she goes well yeah slavery's bad and we should talk about it but i know that none of it is actually nothing in this list is about slavery so i at that point now i'm like addressing that comment and i simply say you cannot this has been going on for thousands of years this has every single race has perpetrated this against every single race every single race has worn the whip and the chains so stop laying this at the feet of only one race richie torres and abby phillip are like i can't believe you're trying to relitigate slavery in america and it's like well where did you get america i just said thousands of years right america's 249 years old and like but then i'm like i'm not but they continue so then i give a fact from the 1860 census, which whether you like it or not is a fact from the 1860 census, that only 2%, less than, 1.5 % of white Americans own slaves.

25:55And of course, everyone's outraged because the South built their economy on slavery and they all benefited. But then again, you can continue that argument that yes, and despite that, all the North, well, the South died to keep, yes, but the North died to end it. And throughout history with segregation, you've got white people alongside black people fighting for what's right. It doesn't mean evil didn't happen. It means there were also good guys that gave their lives to stop it that also had white skin. And the next thing you know, I even clarify again.

26:29Katie Miller:I'm actually not talking about that. I'm talking about these exhibits. Did you know in the minute this was going to be a thing? In the minute I addressed it. I even said that's not what I'm actually trying to do. What I'm trying to show you is that every single exhibit blames white imperialism when it's not relevant. And I gave a specific example involving Cuban emigration where they made no mention of Fidel Castro. I was like, that's, wow. I mean, I've lived in Miami and he's kind of a key figure in the reason Cubans emigrated to America. And by the way, the vast majority of them are now conservative Republicans because of that.

27:03So I gave that example. I was very specific and clear. and then literally she goes on Kara Swisher's podcast and lies and says, we were just having a conversation about the arts and she just brought this up. Out of nowhere. Out of nowhere. You just called half the country racist. We had a Nazi reference to Trump. Your guest referenced slavery. And I had no idea what was actually in the Smithsonian. But what's even scarier is that that's their narrative. So much so is it doesn't matter. That it was like a white culture poster about how we're inherently aggressive and we have to win at all costs.

27:42Or this thing about Cuban immigration or another exhibit comparing George Floyd to Jesus that, I don't know, a lot of people might find blasphemous. The list is extensive and long. Or gender testing in sports where they go on to talk about how athletes have had to expose their genitals to doctors. I'm like, this happened maybe once in a developed country decades ago. It's a cheek swap. Like, it's all propaganda. If you want to have a black, overweight drag queen pose as the Statue of Liberty, that should go in a gallery, not a museum. That's fine.

28:20Katie Miller:That's freedom of expression. Do your thing. But... Well, even in the National Portrait Gallery that's not far from where we're sitting, there's a plaque of President Trump from the first term. And it is a total, like, woke rewrite of history. Right. Despite the fact, by the way... It's just not even honest. That's not even what he had on the list that was sent to me. Because I thought, is it all? I honestly thought, okay, it's going to be that, right? It's going to be a rewriting about Trump and he probably doesn't like it. That's what I thought I was going to get. So I was going to be prepared for it.

28:48Katie Miller:That's my own list that I found from walking into the museum. Was not even on the list that they sent over. So then she did a whole show on CNN about how I was misinformed about slavery. And I tried to relitigate who benefited from slavery in America. by the way which I said twice. That's crazy. No. Once this is thousands of years old. Another time I'm talking about the exhibits. The third time like this has been going on throughout history with people of all different races and just blatantly lied. Just like her guest was blatantly lying about what was in the specific. That's what the legacy media does is they rewrite it in order to serve their narrative.

29:28Katie Miller:None of it. And they all are complicit in going along with it. It's the craziest thing I've seen. And when you see it up close and firsthand, and then the things that happen after it where you're going, I mean, here's proof that that's not what happened. And they just throw away the proof and keep going. So talking about the legacy media narrative. Yeah. You have another good one. Which one? So there's a Netflix documentary that my husband and I recently watched in which you're famously not in. And they very aggressively go after the trainer that you were. Isn't that interesting? And so I read an article that said you were considering suing them, which we don't have to get into.

30:08No, no, we can get into that.

30:09Katie Miller:But I'm very curious because you've been a trainer for so long, especially on The Biggest Loser. And one of my personal questions is a lot of the contestants have gained their weight back. Do you believe that's because they lost weight too fast and too dramatically? Or is it that they didn't have healthy habits that lasted? Because there is a, I wouldn't say in the Maha world, right? it's very important for what you eat in addition to working out that there's often women in the gym who are heavyset and you see these people on tiktok and instagram that are heavyset but can lift triple quadruple the amount of weight i can lift okay but then they're not eating healthy in order to maintain a healthy lifestyle neither of these things are are the answer so what is it okay so first thing is i would say i didn't even have the fact that i didn't even watch this documentary but the vast pieces of it that I've seen, I've probably seen 30 minutes of it, the specific accusations against me are unilaterally false.

31:08Now, I never said to Ryan Benson, you're going to make me a millionaire. I was wearing a microphone on camera. He was wearing a microphone. And both of the executive producers came out and they're like, she never said that. Do you think anyone printed? Harvey did at TMZ, bless his heart. Like, I never starved the contestants. I never ignored medical advice and I could give you literally hundreds. I spoke to that doctor every day. There'd be a medical report from his staff on set and every day we would all be on it. There are hundreds of emails. As for the doctor really laid the blame at like the trainer's feet.

31:44The doctor, by the way, that's because I was never a fan of his and he knows it because I felt that he acted unilaterally. And I don't think anybody does that as a doctor. You refer out. So he would pull contestants off of their medications, whether it was something like Prozac or something like Metformin. And there would be all kinds of issues with that. And I could provide you with all the emails and I would ask for them to see specialists outside of the show. But with that said, he didn't even do their diet. That's a total lie. There was a registered dietitian named Dr. Cheryl Forberg, who was the dietitian on the show that I actually liked and worked with all the time.

32:27Like that's a complete lie. He wasn't even responsible for their nutrition. She was. And I would dialogue with her regularly. And I think she's great. Like we can talk about the nutrition. I'm happy to talk about the diet. I'm happy to talk about the screaming and the yelling and what that was about because all that's real despite the fact that it's manipulated oh it is real it's not just the producers told everyone to scream that's no so okay so first let me answer with that many people i feel like you're excited nah okay so first let me answer why they gain the weight back okay let's start there because i'm very fascinated when a person is 50 pounds 100 pounds 200 pounds overweight this is not like a dad bod kind of a person right this is not somebody who is one of the 74 % of Americans that's suddenly obese or overweight by like 50 or so pounds because the system is rigged against them.

33:21And 50 is enough to make you super duper sick. So nevertheless, these are people that are 100, 200, 300 pounds overweight.

33:30Statistically, 95 % of individuals, not on Biggest Loot, just across the board, that lose a significant amount of weight, put it back on. 95%. So this is not only not a phenomenon that's unique to Biggest Loser, my contestants on Biggest Loser, 35 % of them kept the weight off. So it's actually unprecedented. Sorry to interject. Do you still stay in touch with any of the contestants? Of course. Do you think any of them? There were 424 contestants on Biggest Loser. I worked with over 150. They had like six on this documentary of which I worked with four of them. Olivia and Hannah. And Hannah just came out and was like, Jillian Michaels changed my life.

34:09This is a, it's in the Daily Mail. She's like, she changed my life. I'm forever grateful. I didn't even, I sent her.

34:15Katie Miller:Yeah, they cherry picked. I was like, and I messaged her and I was like, honey, thanks so much because I know you don't need it. And I was like, it's not about needing it. Feels good. Like, I really appreciate it. Thank you. I talked to a ton, of course, Julie Haddon, Michelle Aguilar, Danny Allen, Tara Costa. Do they still come to you for training advice? No, because they know. They know what to do now. A lot of them work in the field. But the point is, do you think... So one guy I trained 20 years ago on season one, Danny Cahill was trained by both Bob and I. And the one who gave Danny the caffeine pills was actually Sandy Crumb, who worked for Dr.

34:53Heizanga. I have all the documents. I'll give them all to you. You can put them all up throughout your show. It's all bullshit. All a lie. There was one season where the doctor was like, we can't do this anymore. And then also pulled magnesium and was giving them Ambien, by the way, which I didn't agree with. And was giving them Dip, which I didn't agree with. And they were allowed to have unlimited amounts of coffee, which is why we were using the pre-workout in the first place to regulate how much caffeine they were allowed to get. I have all the documentation to provide you. This is all a crazy lie.

35:24So all of that is complete bullshit. With that said, why do the people that put it back on put it back on, whether it's the 65 % of the people I worked with or the 95 % of the people in Gen Pop? And here's the answer. Because for these individuals, the food is a defense mechanism. It's a coping structure. It is something that at one point or another in their lives meant their psychological survival. It is as powerful as a drug addiction, if not more so.

36:02Katie Miller:Well, yeah, when I'm having a bad day, I'm still eating pizza no matter what anyone tells me. Worse than that, though. and maybe worse is the wrong word far more intense so I'm sure you've heard this and I don't mean to sound cliche but I'll give you two examples that I've famously given so for anybody who's heard this you know fast forward about two minutes one contestant on the show she was about 500 pounds biggest contestant female contestant ever named Shay who to this day I adore and speak with semi-regularly. This poor girl, her mother was a heroin addict who would turn tricks for drugs while she was locked in a closet.

36:39She was put into foster care. And as you can imagine, a host of horrors happened upon this woman. So for someone like that, when they're turning to food, is it control? Sure. Is it comfort? Sure. Is it potentially like desexualizing? Very possibly. there are a list of reasons people use food. But it's not because they're weak or they're lazy or they're stupid. It's because for them at that moment, it's like, I'm terrified. I need to desexualize. I need a layer of protection. So maybe that's why they put it on. There's another example. I had a young kid who had lost about a hundred pounds. Dad loses about a hundred pounds.

37:20They'd come together. I didn't even train this kid. I worked with him tangentially. He goes home for the holidays, comes back, all the contestants get on the scale. Dad loses nothing, he gains six pounds. And because I liked him, I sat down with him and I was just, walk me through what happened. Leaves the ranch, there's no food at the airport, can't get my exercise, you know, the usual bullshit excuses. And we get to his house, the doors fly open and everyone's there. And there's his mom and she breaks into tears, But they're not tears of joy because she's also morbidly obese. So upon seeing her much thinner son and her much thinner husband, they broke the contract.

38:00This isn't the deal. We all agreed we were going to co-sign this. We were going to be in this together. Now, you guys have lost 100 pounds. You've abandoned me. You've left me behind. She becomes depressed. She's in tears. What if she withdraws from her son? So what does the food provide her son? An emotional connection to his mother. When he loses it, what does he lose? he has a primal abandonment. It's not conscious. It's unconscious, of course. But this is why they put the weight back on. It has nothing to do with, in fact, I can't stand this doctor. He's a complete scumbag. But with that said, he actually went on, because someone sent this to me, I think it was News Nation.

38:37And he's like, yeah, that study about their metabolism is actually a lie. And it's been debunked. And I'm thinking, you're a day late and a dollar short here, dude. Really? Nevertheless,

38:48Katie Miller:nevertheless, that's not it at all. That's not what happened. In the past, you've mentioned like these fake friends from Hollywood and how you've learned over the years of, you know, who you can remain, who's loyal to you and who you can trust. I know I have in my own experiences. Yeah. Does Bob Harper fall into that bucket? Listen, here's the thing with Bob. I don't think I've ever said a bad word about him publicly. I defy you to find one. I really do. You know, we had a very difficult relationship, which is sad. I mean, I could show you messages, pictures where it was like there was a lot of love there, but at the same time, there was a lot of unfortunately inherent competition.

39:34And I posted the last message I ever sent, second to last message I ever sent to Bob. And it said like, when you don't answer me, you don't return my calls, this is what always disappoints me about our relationship. This is where I always feel let down. I'm going to let you read into that what you will. And then I'm going to let you look at all the things that he has said about me publicly before the heart attack and ask yourself, did it seem like he'd want to hear from her? My answer is the phone works both ways. If in fact you really wanted to hear from me, then my apologies. You call me, I'll pick up the phone.

40:12Katie Miller:Did the producers encourage the competition? Because it feels like if you're watching it right, there's equal airtime, two teams, two trainers. Seems very similar style, honestly. I think, oh God, I don't want to speak for him. But when I was watching the parts of the documentary that I referenced, he's like, I just, Jillian just gave them caffeine and they won and they won and I'm just there trying to help these people. and I'm thinking like you what are you Danny Cahill trained with both of us and Danny Cahill was given caffeine pills that you actually chose stacker was his choice I had my own brand that I had created actually and the funny thing is I got sued because the lawsuit was they don't work I'm like so which is it I cheated like crazy because they work so well or they didn't work and I'm a total fraud and the reality is caffeine is an athletic performance enhancer it's totally legal.

41:07It's a great way to control the amount of caffeine you're taking in. And a lot of these things have other stuff in it, like capsaicin, which is cayenne, good for metabolism, ECGC from green tea, beetroot extract for nitric oxide. They're legal, healthy performance enhancers. But as I'm watching Bob say this, and I'm thinking, you don't realize I have the email. Like this is a total lie. But he was trying to say, well, Jillian only won because she gave them caffeine pills. And in that moment, I felt it the most strongly like, oh, you're still pissed because I won. It's crazy.

41:47Katie Miller:It's like a TV show. Like you think. It's a TV show. Sounds like a TV show. Yeah. So the screaming, it was real. Okay. I need to know this because like I need someone to scream at me in the gym. So last chance workout, that's not real. Not at all. And the running joke is that they'd make us come in and scream last chance workout, but you never wanted to beat the shit out of them before the workout because they'd be swollen and they'd hold water. So the weigh-in was the next day. The last thing you want to do is beat the crap out of them because they'll swell and they'll retain fluid. So I would just have them do the walk to China.

42:23I'd have them do slow, steady, easy cardio. Right. and they'd come in and they'd need this kind of last chance chaos that was all fake what was real is the you know your father's gonna die get on the fuck screaming yelling get on the treadmill i swear to god i'll put you through the wall now would you have to ask yourself is why so you're seeing i don't know you're seeing what 30 minutes of me on a show maybe 30 minutes maybe 20 minutes of me, maybe 10 minutes of me on a show that's 90 minutes. I was there all day, every day, every episode. So let's say an episode was seven to 10 days and I'm there 12 to 14 hours a day and you're seeing 10 minutes of that.

43:13Now, this would be a tool that anybody would have in their toolbox or I had in my toolbox, but it was one of a million different tools. So if I have a sledgehammer, I also have a suite of screws, wrenches, this, that, the other. Sledgehammer makes the best TV. Why do you use the sledgehammer? So you've got people that are there for a life or death intervention and I took it very seriously. I didn't see it as a TV show. I was not a producer. I didn't partake in the Biggest Loser brand. I took that job very seriously. They go home in a week, in two weeks, in three and four, just depends on when they get voted off.

43:53I have no say so in that. Hence the reason, if I had to critique the show, the gamification of weight loss is exceptionally unfortunate because the people that are working the hardest are the ones they want to get rid of because it's the biggest threat. I can't, I didn't create this format. Arguably that's what made it a hit show. I benefited from that regardless. So what needs to happen before they go home for there to be any hope of success. Number one, they need a rock bottom moment. It must happen because they have to feel the pain of the way that they've been living. And it has to be more painful than the work and the fear associated with where they need to get to.

44:32So in other words, if I can make being 300 pounds more painful than your mom crying when she sees you skinny, we've got a chance. okay it it has to not be comfortable it has to not be comforting because it's a psychological thing it has to be horribly painful in order to get them to keep moving out of it but if it's like nope this is my happy comfy this is my comfortable numb this is where i feel good this is my safe space well you're fucked yeah it has to be the opposite of that it has to be terrifying it has to be painful it has to be scary to be that overweight so you won't desire to move out of it.

45:08Okay. Second piece, they have to take responsibility, which nobody wants to do nowadays. So when you are that victim in the closet while your mom is turning tricks for heroin, you're a victim. A lot of these people are victims, but the defense mechanism that they chose is no longer serving them. So, you know, that whole saying of, listen, bad things are going to happen to you, but how you choose to respond makes all the difference. So how they chose to respond worked at the time it kept them alive it meant their psychological survival but it's no longer serving them so if you can't get them to take responsibility they're fundamentally disempowered to make a different choice regardless that's why this victim mentality that they sell to everybody nowadays about everything whether it's weight or whether it's race or whatever gender whatever the hell it may be this is all a trick to like strip you of your boots do you think

46:00Katie Miller:at the time if glp ones were available they would have put people on glp ones no because that's not the point, right? Anybody can lose weight on GLP-1s. Is it safe? Is it lasting? Is it the affordable? Different conversation. The question I think is, can you do it or not? You know, can you maintain it or not? Getting them to say, all right, I see how I've perpetuated this cycle of abuse. That's number two. And number three, they need an experience of success. So if you come to me and your whole life experiences, I was the funny fat kid or I was the one last picked in pee or I was born without any physical prowess, this narrative, the way you think affects how you behave, which dictates the outcome of your reality.

46:47I got to have some sort of success in that gym. And the reason is because the minute they do run the mile, they never thought they could do the pushup. They never thought they could do the pull up. They never thought they could. It simply opens up an infinity of possibility with regard to everything else they didn't think they could do. So if I've tried every other tool in that box and none of it's working,

47:09sledgehammer. And I don't expect people to know. I don't expect them to understand. I don't expect them to have an opinion one way or the other. And if they're upset about it, like I could see why when you really don't even know what's going on. And that I'll speak to you all day long because that's true. And I'll tell you why I did it, whether you like it or not. But the other shit is just a complete lie.

47:30Katie Miller:It's insane. Do you think the show could have done a better job about food education? Or was that done and no one saw it? It was absolutely done. A lot of people would say, I want to know what's going on. I think the show's goal was to put out Biggest Loser books to try to get people to buy into it. I don't know that they felt it was the most entertaining television either. But they were absolutely taught what was going on. And we could sit here and talk about diet all day long. and there were days they would have low calories what i used to do actually was vary their caloric intake um i it's a strategy i've written about it because if you actually just keep their calories so consistently low it's counterintuitive yeah the body adapts to that i would throw in high calorie days low calorie days there would be minimums though so for example there were always allowed.

48:21Unlimited greens. Unlimited. Eat as many as you get. Leafy, cruciferous, broccoli, spinach, mushrooms, onions, all of it. Unlimited. Peas, this, that, the other. Starchy vegetables, not unlimited. Fruit, not unlimited. Unlimited. So we get the micronutrients and the fiber. Then if it came to starchy carbs and protein and fat, there would be a calorie allowance for that and that would fluctuate over the course of the week. Like this doctor, he's not even a dietician. He didn't even do their diets. He had nothing to do with their nutrition. There was a dietician on the show, as I mentioned, that I would consult with regularly.

49:01And by the way, I work with a suite of people with a PhD in nutrition science that have my entire career. And if you don't think that I was consulting all of them all the time, you're deluded.

49:14Katie Miller:so do you still train people now i don't train people now when did you stop training gosh i stopped training the minute i started biggest loser because i only could afford the time to train there um and then when that stopped i have fitness content books or dvds or apps or dvds are gone now but apps or stream online streaming programs sure for fun but it's almost it's hard to explain I love it and I think it's fun but it's not where my heart is at at the moment so what's your personal workout routine? oh gosh given that you travel so much I know, I know people are so disappointed in me every time I check into a hotel they tell me where the gym is and I'm like I gotta be up at 6 and I'm probably not getting to bed until 11 so I don't know if this is gonna happen They're like, what time can I come watch you in the gym?

50:10If you don't see me on your security cameras, that's why. I'm really good at controlling my food. So I eat clean. I eat healthy. I'm really controlled. So what do you eat in a day? Gosh, okay. So today I had yogurt and berries. I had two hard bold eggs for a snack. Same. And then I had hummus and grilled artichoke for lunch.

50:35Katie Miller:And I have no idea what I'm going to have to eat. So you're ordering takeout though? I was here because I'm in D.C. But I know how to do it in a way where it's like we went to Pret a Manja or whatever. I got the two hard-boiled eggs. I got sparkling water. I got yogurt at the hotel with berries. Is it the perfect quality food? Are the berries organic? No. But at the end of the day, it's better than bacon and eggs and oatmeal and all this other crap. Okay. So now we're going to do the only thing I've wanted to do this whole episode. I want you to rate the top fitness trends over the last 20 years.

51:08Okay. I feel like you have some hot takes.

51:10Katie Miller:All right. I'm ready. Give me what you got. Okay. Where does CrossFit fall? This is a tough one for me. And here's why.

51:20You, I want people to move their body and I want them to move in a way they're going to show up for. If they love it, they love the community. They love the challenge. I think that's great. And I don't want to poo poo it, but at the end of the day, you have chosen the most advanced advanced modalities in fitness and you're doing them for time with coaches that have been certified over a weekend course like oh have you ever done a crossfit class yeah and i didn't understand it at all like i'll give you an example one was it was like a 10 one workout where 10 box jumps one push-up nine box jumps two push-ups this that the other but by the time you were done i'd like like jammed my toe on my shoulder.

51:59I'm like, what is your trainer logic? Explain to me the logic of this. Like, this is sloppy. It's a lot of individuals. Why am I doing this for time? Like, what is the concept other than, like, you just made this up in your head? Why, though, am I doing this? I've yet to meet a person who didn't tell me that. Even Josh Axe, he had this crazy back procedure done and almost died from it. And I'm like, Josh, what? And he, well, I injured myself in CrossFit. Josh Axe. You know, the heart attack that Bob Harper had? I think it happened in a CrossFit classroom, just to be clear. So I'm almost sure. So it's like, if you're there with a coach who has a degree in exercise science, great.

52:41And if they can modify everything that's coming down from on high and they can watch everybody in perfect form, fantastic. But taking literally the most advanced modalities and fitness and giving them to a layman to do for time, which is unheard of and unprecedented from a guy who got certified over the weekend is just a horrible idea in general. But a great coach, you're getting, I will, you know, there's a guy who wrote Supple Leopard. I cannot freaking for the life of me remember his name and he's fantastic. Maybe we could Google it. He has a degree in exercise science and like, I think he's fantastic.

53:19I would defer to someone

53:20Katie Miller:like him next is going to be orange theory it's totally fine if you like it just cardio berries my only issue with berries is it kind of falls under the it depends on the instructor so berries like you could be doing push-ups for three minutes and that's when i i just i'm like why am i doing push-ups for three minutes but if you get a great instructor like it's a great way to sweat if you love it wonderful and if you have the ability to kind of police yourself throughout the class. That's going to be great. The trainer logic, that stuff matters to me when you're training that aggressively. So I think it depends on the instructor.

54:00But if you're responsible and you can take agency and you can handle it and you know your limits, go and have the best time. Get your burn on.

54:05Katie Miller:Soul cycle. Totally fine. Just spin class. What do you think of that the trainers have all become famous and everyone loves them? I think that's great. I think that's wonderful. Same as Peloton? I think also great. I think if you if you like to show up and hang out with that coach, that's really important That's why you're showing up. I would hope that the trainers that's kind of the point is you want to hang out with them You like them you want to spend time with them. You enjoy their humor their personality it's it's spin class you could get into like if I was to be a real bitch It's like should we really be dancing on the bike?

54:36I mean, but I've taught spin classes. I'm like and then up and down and bounce around and spin like because you just get bored i mean is it like the best bike riding you know no but so what you know people love it and like you have a great

54:52Katie Miller:burn and that's that's awesome have you ever gone to any of these classes and do people then are like jillian michaels is in my spin class i have i have gone and when there's a great instructor i love it and i i for years would work with great teachers in different modalities whether it was olympic lifts but i wanted to understand it or whether you know whether i ended up seeing somebody for kettlebell because i think a great teacher is a great student um i don't love classes simply because again like i'm the person thinking like why did you put me in push-ups for three minutes why am i doing this like 10 1 9 2 5 7 like what is the logic here that drives me crazy because i'm very logic.

55:34Katie Miller:So today's workout I did was 21, 15, 9, 20, 20, 20, 21, 15, 9, 20, 20, 20. Do you love it? I do. Then that's all that matters. You showed up for it. I do. You love it. And that's awesome. Anything that gets people to show up and to be in this place. But there was a lot of those similar to what you're making fun of here. And I get it. But that's okay. I'm like sitting there not remembering, like falling over dumbbells. Don't worry. No one was harmed in the making of this. It's so much better than nothing. I agree. You know, if you're asking me to be a fitness person and critique it, I'll critique it.

56:08You know.

56:09Katie Miller:What do you think about the girlies training for the marathons and marathon culture? Okay. First, a lot of respect. Here you go. Hot take. A lot of respect. The only thing with marathon culture is you've got to remember, like, the guy who ran the first one dropped it. Just so we're clear. Does this fall also for like the 300 milers and you see those other guys running those like 200 milers? That is not fitness. When you see the Cam Jones and the David Goggins. I love that guy on TikTok though. This is not fitness. This is something else entirely. These guys are trying to, I don't know, reinvent what it means to be human.

56:49David Goggins will tell you like I run from my demons. It keeps me alive. But that is not a workout. That is a whole different. Goggins was a seal, wasn't he? The most elite warrior in the world. I think they drown those guys and bring them back to life. This is not a normal, typical person. So, I mean, do I have incredible respect for the discipline that they have, the work ethic? Unbelievable. Yes. But I would say with a marathon, make it a bucket list thing and switch to perfecting your half. It's just a lot of flexion, extension, flexion, extension, pound. It's a lot. And not everybody is built for that.

57:25Some people can do it indefinitely and they're built for it, but not everybody is. So I would simply say do it once, get it off your bucket list, and then perfect your halftime. Or maybe move to like a triathlon. And there's all different sets of difficulty there, class like sprint, so on and so forth.

57:42Katie Miller:What big fitness and trainer counts do you follow?

57:47Katie Miller:Gosh, I don't anymore. I think, I don't know. And it's not because there aren't incredible people out there. there are?

57:59I think it's just because I feel like I know it. I've seen it. I understand it. There's not a whole lot really for me to learn there. With that said, I do love to follow different doctors, PhDs, MDs. I love to learn about stuff I don't fully have a grasp on yet. So somebody who's going to break down peptides for me and stem cell therapies and gene editing, that fascinates me. I want to learn about it and understand it, whether it's safe or not. It's a different conversation. But that stuff I'm really, that new frontier.

58:41Katie Miller:In your algorithm, though, when you're scrolling, I'm sure you get some fitness accounts. You ever see someone, you're like, this is not correct. This is not the right form. Every now and again I get those. But, you know, gosh, there's a bunch of great trainers out there that are just fantastic. I'm just killing you that I cannot remember the name of the guy who wrote something. It's like, it's just driving me crazy. We'll find it. We'll put it on the screen. For everyone who wants to know, we will find it and we will get it up for you. Kelly, stare it. There you go. Wow. That was torturous. Tip your tongue for 20 minutes.

59:10Katie Miller:There you go. There we go. Like, you know, I would tell people. Shout out to Kelly. At this point, look to people that have their degree. I know we've become very... There's a lot of glute trainers on the internet. I know, but they have inserts. Those are not real. No one's ass was like, no, that's not real. There's an insert you put in your pants. Come on now. You can't fall for that. That's ridiculous. Are there any products or supplements that you swear by? Oh, my God. I take everything, dude. Do you really? You don't believe in eating your vitamins? There's a problem with that. So I do eat my vitamins.

59:43But here's the problem, and it's twofold. Number one, is your diet varied enough? Like how much wild caught salmon did you eat in the last three days? None. Zero. So maybe you should consider omega-3. Did you have sardines? Like what did you eat? Right. No. So I haven't either. Not that I don't like those foods. I do. I don't. But I don't even remember the law. Okay. So even if I'm out, they likely don't have wild caught salmon. I can't stand sardines. So it's like I know I need omega-3s. All right. When you look at micronutrients, antioxidants, polyphenol, all this crap that we're reading about all the time, I say crap in the most loving way, is your diet that varied?

1:00:24Mine is simply not. And on top of that, we know that the soil is depleted. So here's the problem. If we're over-farming the soil and it's depleted, then the fruits and the vegetables are depleted and the animals that get their nutrients from the soil and the fruits and the vegetables, they don't have as much nutrients. and this is these are the two reasons that I supplement um and I just I take all kinds of crap so much so you're taking creatine it's not relatable I do take creatine how much you're taking um I know you're supposed to take a huge amount it makes me nauseous does it make you bloat no but it makes me sick to my stomach really so I can only like I can only do the scuba and I gotta have to hold on for dear like I don't know why but it does make me nauseous which is a real shame because I want all of these cognitive benefits that supposedly it helps provide.

1:01:15I take, do you really want the list? Yes, go for it. I really want it. Okay. All right. Brace yourself. You want the supplements or the peptides?

1:01:24Katie Miller:Let's go for the full list. What's Jillian Michaels taking? Okay. Now I take pharmaceutical grade fish oil. Okay. And there are plenty of PhDs who would tell you that's not the ideal form, but the problem is I simply don't trust the quality of the supplements out there with fish oil because it can go rancid. It could have mercury. It could be all kinds of problems with it. And I don't really want to risk it. Whereas I know the pharmaceutical grade form doesn't have that stuff. And as long as you have it with fat, it's more bioavailable, more easily absorbed. I'm butchering that, but nevertheless.

1:01:57I take 5 ,000 milligrams of D3 with K2 because I don't go in the sun and as much as i know you're supposed to it ages the shit out of me and i see it right away on my skin so i just don't i i should i i'm aware of this but i don't so i take d3 and k2 i take collagen i take creatine i take collagen for my skin i take uh creatine for cognition mostly to be honest um i take a methylated b complex um i also do b12 shots once a week i do glutathione shots uh twice a week and i take a higher dose of that like like well high is relative but like 500 grams micrograms mgs sorry mcgs um okay i take uh i vary my multivitamin so i actually started taking a multivitamin uh from a company that It has something called lithium orotate in it, which is, again, controversial, but it has to do with brain health and cognition because I have an Alzheimer's gene and Parkinson's is in the family.

1:03:07So I can't, all of this is like not medical advice. Talk to your doctor. I don't even know if that's a good thing or a bad thing, but I explore it and mess around with it. And then I take a regular multi from Allian Naturals, which is a company that I've invested in. So do your own homework on all your own supplements. Full disclosure. Let's see. I take, sorry, I take magnesium L-threonate and bisglycinate and I alternate those before bed. What am I missing here? I take, okay. I think I got those. I sometimes take a greens powder. I get a little bit lazy on that one. Peptides. So I do NAD plus injections, subcutaneous on Tuesday, Friday.

1:03:54I do glutathione intramuscular twice a week, as mentioned. I do vitamin B12 once a week intramuscular. And then I take a lot of stuff for brain health. So I take something called cerebralizing. I do that quarterly. I cycle that with Cortexan and Penelon and Epidolon and a Solanquin Samax nasal spray and Dihexa. And I do it over the course of a year. So I cycle them and then wash them out and cycle them and then wash them out. And the funny thing is I couldn't begin to tell you what actually helps because I'm on so much.

1:04:34Katie Miller:I'm going to say something. You said a lot of words that I have no idea what they are. I know, I know. I am very shocked and impressed because I could not remember everything I take. It's not relatable at all. and I appreciate that. No, but you know what though? There's a lot of people out there who would be fascinated to know what you are taking and maybe they're taking a few things and maybe they switch it because they just heard you say this. You know what I'm supposed to say though? Here's what I'm supposed to say and I mean it. Focus on the big rocks. Get your sleep. Don't overeat. Use common sense with your food choices.

1:05:03But if you're doing all those things

1:05:04Katie Miller:and you want to level up, I think there's a good space for what you're taking and informing other people that that's what you feel is safe and good because I think a lot of people will take that and say... Safe and good is a strong word. The vitamins, yes, of course. Talk to your doctor, but you know, the supplements short. Peptides safe and good. It's a very, it's the wild West. That's the problem. And it, it is for a lot of the obvious reasons. We don't have the data that we should, a lot of it's observational, a lot of it's animal studies. This is a conversation for you to have with your doctor and where you get peptides is really important because right now the FDA is not legalizing these for compound pharmacies to make.

1:05:50So when you buy them, it's going to say, you know, for research only, not for human use. But then there, of course, there's people like me that like, that know what that really means and know how to reconstitute the peptides and know how to dose them. And it's, could I grow a third nipple? Yes. So this is, I, you know, very new stuff. Talk to your doctor. And one of the things that they say all the time is the people who get the best healthcare, I'm sorry, the worst healthcare are the people that are, have the least access and the most access. You see Brian Johnson, it's like, I've drained all my blood.

1:06:24And I edited my genome off the coast of Nicaragua. The craziest shit. I, you know, I just wait to see, like, what? Human experimental skull. It's like,

1:06:34Katie Miller:is he alive? Oh my God, he made it. Okay, great. So on every episode, we've played Would You Rather. Okay. Would you rather lift weights that scream motivational quotes at you or run on a treadmill that insults you when you slow down? Treadmill. Would you rather be the token conservative on a CNN panel every night for a month or compete in the U.S. Open against Serena Williams? The first one, but I don't think they'll have me back. I mean, what more damage can they do at this point? Would you rather eat nachos made out of seaweed or cupcakes made out of cauliflower? Nachos made out of seaweed.

1:07:08Well, that at least sounds like it could be edible. The second one just sounds like torture.

1:07:13Katie Miller:I feel like it could make a cauliflower cupcake and it would just taste like a cauliflower. Yucco. Yeah. Would you rather be stuck in a spin class with a horrible instructor who's super cheerful or in a yoga retreat with reality TV stars? Spin class. Would you rather have a six-pack where you have to watch what you eat or eat whatever you want and have a big ass? Oh, I never had a big ass. so I get to eat what I want and have a big ass? Well, that's the whole name of the game, right? Like, abs are made in the kitchen but, like, the glutes are made from, like, all the trash you eat, right? That's, like, what they...

1:07:44Katie Miller:But, see, I don't get, like, a big ass. That's what they tell me on TikTok at least. Like, a juicy booty. I don't get that. I just get, like, flab everywhere. So, like... If it's going to my ass, that would be amazing, actually. Like, you can't spot reduce or spot gain but if you've created this magic world or I can eat all this crap and it just makes my ass grow. That sounds incredible. I want it to go this way, though. I don't want it to grow towards the ground. Is there a levitating component to this giant ass? I think it's like those glute bridges. Hell yeah. I like it. All that stuff. What's your number one pump-up workout song?

1:08:27Oh, my gosh. I change it all the time. This is so cheesy. I want to give you something cool and try to pretend like I'm better than I am. I don't know, some random metallic. I have no idea.

1:08:38Katie Miller:The truth of the matter is just like old EDM, like rhythm is a dancer. Like Ibiza circa 2011. Like Eric Prides kind of, if every day goes like this. I'm like, jump in my rope. You're like, I can keep going. Tragic, tragic. Like EDM Ibiza circa 2011. What's the first thing you do when you wake up in the morning? Coffee. I know, like, oh, get your sunlight. Such grass. Get the sunlight in your eyes and ground yourself. Although now, at the moment, we have this little rescue kitten. So this little creature is still bottle feeding. So I think I'm covered in scrapes all over my entire body from this thing.

1:09:25So first thing I do is bottle feed this wild cat.

1:09:29Katie Miller:And then now I have coffee. Are you a planner or you go with the flow? No, no, no, no. No. No going with the flow. No plan. Planning. Not having a plan is planning to fail. My wife is a go with the flow and it makes me insane. Those people find each other? What is that? Those people find each other. It's like the thermostat people. Yeah. You know the ones that like the room cold and ones that like the room. It could be a fucking arctic tundra in there. and I'm like, I'm developing hypothermia and my wife is like pushing the down button on the thermostat. And the no planning, she's like, I don't know.

1:10:03I just don't want to commit to that. I'm like, well, you're not going to get a reservation if you don't make a phone call and make a plan. It drives me insane.

1:10:09Katie Miller:And then when she decides she wants to go somewhere. You're staying there refreshing? They don't have a reservation. And I'm like, I told you they weren't going to have a reservation. Should have called when I told you on Wednesday. Drives me crazy. I understand it yeah reservation culture is real what is that? just pick up the phone you gotta wait like 30 days in advance then refresh on some website oh my gosh it drives me insane you have to have a plan what's the last thing you were influenced to buy? oh god hold on it would definitely probably be some like the peptide something like that I'm not highly susceptible to this shit though do you operate your own Instagram TikTok or do not what do you have x account I don't love social media and I hate to say that because it's like of course you would want someone to follow you on Instagram but the reality is I don't I'm not that generation I don't love it I don't even use it really and what's unfortunate is people message me on there and then you don't see it like a month later I'm like oh god sorry yeah um i don't relate to it so i i wish i i really it's just not i don't get it dude it just this is my family and this is my this and this is my vacation this is what i'm eating and i don't it's just not how i grew up it's weird i don't relate to it i wish i did i like x i think that's fun that's a really underrated form of cardio is sparring on there I enjoy that a ton underrated form of cardio yeah like sparring with people on there is such a good time this one guy is like sounds like you're quoting Chad GPT and I was like Thomas Sowell people are so dumb it's staggering and I do enjoy exposing that in this sort of witty back and forth but outside of that I just don't really relate to it the occasional cat meme gets you?

1:12:15I don't know. I just don't follow it. It's not my generation. What's your biggest pet peeve? People that don't make a plan.

1:12:27Katie Miller:God! Who does that? There's no groceries in the house. You can't get tickets to anything. You're sitting in the worst possible seats. It just makes me insane. I get that. Yeah. Yeah. If you could host a dinner party with three people, dead or alive, who's sitting at the table and what are you eating? Oh! Maya Angelou Einstein The third one is always tough for me those are my two sort of regulars but it depends on the mood I'm in so now I would have to say Ozzy I'd like to see Ozzy again that bummed me out that was very sad even though he did have a huge incredible life I also think that would be so interesting to watch Maya Angelou Talk to Ozzy Osbourne.

1:13:14What are we eating? Oh my God, whatever we want. If I get to have those three guests, I'm sure that the calories don't count at this dinner, right? No. So for sure, French fries. For sure, red wine. For sure, peanut butter. I love peanut butter. Peanut butter, red wine, hot sauce is important. As I mentioned, French fries, some sort of like ice cream situation. and I think that's all we need. What's your guilty pleasure food? Don't eat a ton of that. So a ton of anything that's like not considered great for you,

1:13:55Katie Miller:but I will have an occasional drink and so that would be it. So when you go out to dinner and they offer you dessert, you say nothing to do? No, I never touch it. Really? I do not eat it. There's nothing that ever looks like man... Never touch it. Never. I stopped years ago. And what does your wife do? She's like just, or does she eat it? She's this big, this bitch. And my ex is also this big. Does she eat it? She can eat whatever she wants. So you sit there and she'll eat it and you're like staring at them? You get past it. It's really weird. How many years? Okay, so. How many years did it take you?

1:14:25Mind you, I was an overweight kid. So when you start to realize that this stuff does have some sort of power over you, that's annoying. And my ex's mom used to make these cake balls. and one of my low points is when i ate all the cake balls and i think it was my daughter

1:14:44Katie Miller:i was like mom where's grandma's cake balls and i was just i i don't know how i'm like honey you sure grandma i don't think grandma brought cake balls this time she's like she did oh god that's when i i was like all right you know what i want to give this stuff up for a month and then after i did it for a month it's like how far can i go and now i think i think i'm in like seven years. But what if there was like an organic like oat flour with cacao and like a stevia or like something that's like a healthier version of it? Do you still say no? It's not necessarily like the oat flour or the cacao.

1:15:20It's this concept of dessert. Some sort of treat that I resist now just because it's been so long. I don't want to give up my sobriety, if you will. I would tell any normal person though, we're getting into your calories. You know, follow the 80-20 rule, make 20 % of your calories, stuff that you like, foods that you enjoy, and 80 % should be healthy. So you subscribe to 80-20? I am a total middle-of-the-road normie in my advice. It's the big rocks, it's the get your sleep, it's the drink your water, it's the go for a walk. All those things are going to make a big difference. When you look at me, I personally am a bit of a weirdo.

1:15:59So whether these suite of peptides gives me a third nibble or a lift to 200 remains to be seen. this is just a gamble that I'm having fun with on my own but it's not advice I would you know I

1:16:10Katie Miller:would give people okay last one what's the craziest advice someone's given you when it comes to health oh my god there's so much bad advice out there what's the craziest when someone's come up to you and they're like but Jillian you only have to know yeah I mean okay colonics are exceptionally bad advice who came up with that by the way stick a fire hose up your butt turn it on sure about that like who discovered that by the way you know what we need to do you can perforate your bowel you completely disrupt the microbiome down there like who in the world was like and a coffee enema like somebody squared that fucker it's like let's take an enema and push the up button on that.

1:16:59No pun intended. Like that just to me was always a big, a big, a hard no. And again, like no pun intended on that. It was just bad advice. Like blow fluid up your rear end as high as you can. Um, terrible advice. I think also some of the, honestly, if I, some of this stuff is just super questionable. I'm not on the methylene blue team does not make sense to me for healthy people. Could be wrong. Remains to be seen. But, you know, we went through this with metformin and you had all of these really awesome doctors who I respect immensely that were taking metformin for longevity. And I remember thinking like, this does not make sense.

1:17:45Why are we giving healthy people who are healthy metabolically metformin and that the whole concept pretense was that it's anti-aging and long story short the data didn't bear out and so then all those doctors got off of it now it doesn't mean they're not amazing doctors it means they do what i do and they're trying it out you know they're putting themselves out there they're making themselves their own study so to speak but with things like that even though i did just talk all about these peptides they've been using these things in russia for like three decades for stroke victims and so on and so forth like there is it's not completely off piste to do that.

1:18:20But some of this is very fast follower. And what I mean is you guys want to drink fish tank cleaner, go for it. Let me see how that pans out for you. I just, some of this shit dude just does not, from a common sense perspective, you're drinking fish tank cleaner and you're healthy. Like I get it if you're metabolically unhealthy, but if you're not, and to give you an idea of what I mean and here's an extreme example chemo's bad right can we okay give them it's gonna kill everything in your body now if you have a stage four cancer you're gonna do chemo everything is gonna be a cost-benefit analysis so my question with methylene blue is like if you're metabolically unhealthy and we're borrowing this you know like it's a whole chemistry lesson and watch people break it down but the bottom line is if you're metabolically unhealthy they can make a decent case for it but if you're healthy, then it comes back to my kind of chemo, no cancer conversation.

1:19:19Like you're drinking fish tank. I just can't, I don't know. I'm not there. And there are a lot of people that will kill me over this and they all take it. I just, I'm not there on it.

1:19:28Katie Miller:So we'll close on this one. And thank you so much for joining, but we will close on this. If you would have known that 20 years later from when you started Biggest Loser to, is it 20 years? 15? 20. Okay. 20. I was Washington, D.C., you know, with going to the White House where President Trump is there and this is the turn your career has taken, would you have believed it? I think I would have. And the reason is because I worked to make this happen. And I remember when I got the opportunity on Biggest Loser, I actually thought that I was going to brand my gym. I own a sports medicine facility and that's when things like Curves were just starting and they were franchising these models so i saw myself doing something of that nature and then i ended up becoming the brand but nevertheless when i looked at people who i respected and admired that did what they loved and built a business out of it whether it was caesar milan who was a guy that really loves dogs or and this is so unfortunate i just found out she was a nazi coco chanel an orphaned seamstress yeah who loved fashion then i'm like now that she's a nazi i must come up with a new example but But my point is simply, if you do what you love, this guy really, Martha Stewart ran a catering company out of her basement.

1:20:50That's a better one for you. So if somebody said, I'm going to be going to the White House or I'm going to be doing this or I'm going to be doing that, what do you do? Oh, I'm a seamstress. Oh, I'm a dog trainer. Oh, I'm a caterer. Oh, I'm a fitness expert. I'd be the first one to say, like, I can see it. Because when you do what you love, the universe conspires on your behalf, right? It's when you do the things you think you should that it all falls to shit.

1:21:15Katie Miller:That's very motivational, I think, for a lot of women who are watching it, and men. I think it's a challenge to want to put yourself out there and follow your dream, because if you fall flat on your face, then either a lot of people are watching, or maybe that's just your friends and your family, but it's something where it's like, get back up and keep trying, because to your point, if you do what you love... Success is a matter of attrition as well. You got to learn from those mistakes, and of course, educate yourself as best you can. You want to mitigate it. You don't just jump out of a plane without learning how to pack a chute for God's sake or figuring out what's the ideal altitude or what is topographically, is that even a word?

1:21:51The best place to go jumping out of a plane, not into a forest clearly or an open ocean. But the point is that if you're not failing, you're not trying hard enough and you have to adopt that mentality. And once you do, as mentioned it's all a matter of attrition wait them all out or launch a podcast

1:22:11Katie Miller:and with that thank you for watching this episode of the Katie Miller podcast we're available every Monday at 6pm where you get your podcasts thank you so much for watching this episode with Jillian Michaels please remember to like, follow and subscribe thanks so much, see you next week

1:22:35you