Army: Suspected Gunman’s Motive Is Still Unknown

25:42It's all made up. It's all fake news. Well, Jake, I do want to clarify a little bit here because so many sources inside of the White House and inside of Vice President Vance's orbit had told us that this meeting existed. And no one is actually denying that they were going to have dinner tonight. What they're denying is that there was a meeting set to talk about Epstein's strategy. They are being very careful with how they parse these words. And because of the coverage, because of the fact that there was so much focus on the Epstein portion of this meeting or of this dinner, that is why it is now in flux.

26:14They are trying to figure out if they want to move it. Do they want to cancel it altogether? But let's look at the facts here. Let's talk about who is going to be at this dinner. You have Susie Wiles, the chief of staff. You have Vice President J.D. Vance. You have the head of the FBI, Kash Patel. And you have the Attorney General, Pam Bondi. The last time we talked about a meeting that had Pam Bondi, Susie Wiles and Kash Patel, it ended in an explosion where Dan Bongino, the deputy director of the FBI, stormed out after allegations he was leaking information about the attorney general. That was all over the information release of the Epstein case.

26:50So the idea that there would be a dinner with all of these principals who the last time that they had this kind of sit down was explosive and not have a conversation about Epstein or the way that they would handle Epstein as they move forward seems a little bit out of sorts. particularly, as you mentioned, they are weighing a huge issue right now, which is whether or not to release the audio, to release the transcripts from that sit-down with the Deputy Attorney General Todd Blanche and Ghislaine Maxwell. The thing to keep in mind here is that they are trying to take control of the narrative. And in order to do that, White House officials believe the entire cabinet, the entire of the administration, has to be on the same page so they can be on the offensive instead of the defensive when it comes to Epstein, which, of course, is what we've seen for the last several weeks.

27:34All right, Kristen Holmes, thanks so much. Just hours after a top U.S. official met with Vladimir Putin, President Trump says he may now meet with the Russian leader as soon as next week. He himself. What might that accomplish? We're live to Moscow next.

27:54In our world lead, President Trump this afternoon told European leaders that he intends to meet soon with Russian President Vladimir Putin, potentially as early as next week, followed by a trilateral meeting with Ukraine's President Volodymyr Zelensky. Sources familiar with the call said this comes after today's meeting between U.S. Envoy Steve Witkoff and President Putin, which President Trump called highly productive. CNN's Fred Pleitkin is in Moscow. As Russian President Vladimir Putin welcomed U.S. Presidential Envoy Steve Witkoff to the Kremlin, Russian state media with special wall-to-wall coverage.

28:31We begin with urgent news, the host says. Just at this moment, President Putin is meeting with U.S. Special Envoy Whitcoff. One expert warning not to make the U.S. president into an adversary. We need to avoid getting Donald Trump in the ranks of sincere enemies, he says. He himself does not want to be our sincere enemy. Trump is saying, dear Russia, let's do something so that I don't look like a loser. Russia can give him this and not force him to introduce these sanctions. He himself does not need them. President Trump is demanding serious movement towards a ceasefire in Ukraine. I'm here to get us out of it.

29:12And threatening major sanctions against Russia by the end of this week if there's no progress. But while the Russians were laying on the hospitality, the head of Russia's direct investment fund taking Steve Witkoff for a walk in a Moscow park After earlier picking Witkoff up from the airport and then posting this photo on social media, after an almost three-hour meeting with Vladimir Putin, the Kremlin framing the talks as little more than an exchange of positions. On our part in particular, some signals were transmitted on the Ukrainian issue, and corresponding signals were also received from President Trump, this Kremlin aide says.

29:53The situation now is that our president has full information that is our signals, signals from President Trump. Both the Kremlin and the White House say they understand just how important today's meeting is. The Russians, of course, want to prevent any massive sanctions against their economy by President Trump. At the same time, they are still eyeing generally improved relations between Moscow and Washington. But the trajectory seems to be heading in the opposite direction. The Trump administration announcing new tariffs against India, one of the main clients for Russian oil, shortly after Steve Whitcoff's motorcade left the Kremlin for the journey back to the U.S.

30:35And Jake, tonight we're yet to hear back from the Kremlin about whether or not Vladimir Putin is actually up for a meeting with President Trump as early as next week. In the past, the Kremlin has said that Vladimir Putin is very much willing to meet with President Trump, But they also say that such a meeting needs to be well prepared, obviously requires a lot of detail and certainly also requires a lot of very difficult logistics as well. Jake. CNN's Fred Pleitkin in Moscow. Thanks. I'm joined now by former deputy director of national intelligence, Beth Saner and CNN's Phil Manningly. So, Beth, let me start with you.

31:05The White House this afternoon said that President Trump is open to meeting with both Putin and Ukrainian president Volodymyr Zelensky. Sources say Trump told European leaders at the meeting with Putin could theoretically happen as soon as next week. Let's play this reaction from Zelensky.

31:24It seems that Russia is now more inclined towards ceasefire. The pressure on them is working. But the main thing is that they do not deceive us in the details, neither us nor the United States. What's your reaction? Well, I think that Zelensky there is encouraging. It's called positive reinforcement. I've done that with my own kid. So but I do think that in terms of what has really been put on the table today and what has been accomplished, if all that has been accomplished is a meeting between Trump and Putin. And then we have secondary tariffs on Indian goods, which means that Indian goods coming to the United States, U.S.

32:05consumers will pay more for those. And they don't include anything related to fuel or this petroleum that India is re-exporting. then I think that it doesn't really get us very far. Now, if Trump and Putin and Zelensky actually would get together in a room, and this would be a huge concession by Putin, absolutely would be 180 where he was before, then that would be big. But I, you know, we haven't heard that yet. So we have to wait and see. Yeah. I mean, look, Zelensky is saying the pressure on Russia is working. So credit where credit's due. You have some new reporting, Phil, that President Trump's threat of 50 % tariffs on imports from India because India is buying Russian oil, that that threat is in effect too.

32:54It's in effect. And as Fred pointed out, launched those new tariffs, the 25 % tariffs shortly after Steve Witkoff actually left the meeting and have not launched any secondary sanctions on any other country that purchases oil or other energy products from Russia, which underscores a really critical point, which I think Beth actually kind of nodded to a little bit. But this particular set of sanctions was not actually about Russian energy purchases or trying to ramp up pressure. There is still a threat of that could come tomorrow. The White House says it's still going to come tomorrow on secondary sanctions.

33:23This was about bilateral trade talks with India and the president's frustration with the breakdown of a deal and India's unwillingness to open very specific markets that really kind of set things completely ablaze over the course of the last couple of weeks. I would note these new tariffs, 25 % on top of the existing 25%, 21 days before they actually take effect. This is a leverage play, trying to make a bilateral negotiation and trying to get India to open up more markets. This is not about the meetings we were watching today. Because if it was, we would see these tariffs be put on China, which imports a lot more oil than India does.

33:58And we would probably see secondary sanctions and we might see sanctions on shadow fleet on the Russian oil tanker fleet. That is something they've talked about. And this, if they really want to put pressure on Russia, that's what they need to do. And the president's deadline for the Russians to make some movement towards some sort of end of the conflict is Friday. Do you think there's any chance that anything's going to happen? This is that. Yeah, this is that. Friday's gone as far as I'm concerned. I don't really think there's more. Do you? I don't know. What you're saying about the other sanctions that we're kind of waiting, not just on secondary sanctions, but also the Shadow Fleet sanctions, which were kind of a.

34:33All right. If we don't want to go all the way on the secondary sanctions, particularly given how up in the air the China detente trade truce is right now until the president. That was an option they could take. It's still on the table as far as I know. But I think to best point, this seems to be some measure of progress that would cause the president to say, well, I guess we don't need to do this right now. Or if we're going to do it, make it way off in the future and see what else can take place in the meantime. All right. Fascinating stuff. Phil Mattingly, Beth Saner, thanks to both of you. The new move by Health and Human Services Secretary Robert F.

35:00Kennedy Jr. to cancel contracts and pull funding for vaccines that fight respiratory viruses. We're going to get a vaccine specialist to fact check RFK Jr.'s claims. That's next.

35:15And our health lead, the Department of Health and Human Services is canceling contracts and pulling funding for vaccines that fight respiratory viruses such as COVID and the flu. HHS Secretary Robert F. Kennedy Jr. announced that 22 mRNA vaccine development projects totaling around $500 million will be canceled and no new projects will be started. This is certainly an interesting turn of events. While there are those, including many leading physicians and scientists and laymen, like those of us at this show, who give credit to President Trump for Operation Warp Speed, which created the COVID vaccines, which ultimately saved millions of lives, the President now has an HHS secretary who makes arguments that would essentially blame President Trump for what Kennedy has called the deadliest vaccine ever made.

36:07It's false and bizarre and frankly dangerous. Joining us now is Dr. Paul Offit. He's a vaccine scientist at Children's Hospital, Philadelphia, and an outside vaccine advisor to the FDA. Dr. Offit, take a listen to this little snippet of what Secretary Kennedy said in his announcement last night. Most of these shots are for flu or COVID, but as the pandemic showed us, mRNA vaccines don't perform well against viruses that infect the upper respiratory tract. Here's the problem. mRNA only codes for a small part of the viral proteins, usually a single antigen. One mutation and the vaccine becomes ineffective.

36:50Is that true? Is any of that true? No, none of it's true. I mean, you have, in the case of the mRNA COVID vaccines, it coded for the protein that sits on the surface of the virus. Therefore, you make antibodies against that protein, which doesn't allow the virus to bind to cells and enter cells. And it's worked very well. It's, as you noted, saved millions of lives safely. We have other single protein vaccines. The hepatitis B vaccine, the human papillomavirus vaccine, are also vaccines that work extremely well as single protein vaccines. So he doesn't know what he's talking about. It's really weird just to be in a situation where you and I are saying President Trump in greenlighting Operation Warp Speed helped save millions of lives.

37:34And he appoints a health secretary that basically says that that vaccine murdered people. No, I think Operation Warp Speed, frankly, was one of the greatest scientific or medical achievements in my lifetime. And my lifetime includes the development of the polio vaccine. It was a remarkable effort. Within 11 months of that virus coming into this country, we made a vaccine using a novel technology that saved millions of lives safely. And now you have a secretary of health and human services who has said, you said in your intro, what created the most dangerous vaccine ever made. I would think President Trump would be angry about a statement like that.

38:12It's odd. The president was just asked in the Oval Office whether he was at odds with the medical community over this. He said Operation Warp Speed has been amazing, but they are moving on to other things. Do you think that this move by Kennedy undermines the effectiveness of the vaccines created during Operation Warp Speed, which was obviously one of President Trump's greatest achievements? Well, this vaccine had saved lives. And what's more important, I think, is not only was it applicable to SARS-CoV-2, the cause of COVID, it also can be used in other respiratory infections and also other infectious diseases and even more importantly, other platforms like cancer or gene therapy.

38:54We know more about this vaccine than I think any other vaccine that's ever been made. This vaccine has been given to billions of people, including pregnant women, including babies. So we know a lot about this vaccine, which can help us with these other platforms. This decision that Kennedy made is just another RFK Jr. decision that goes along with vaccine skepticism. In the last couple of months, he pulled back vaccine recommendations around COVID. He fired a CDC advisory panel that makes vaccine recommendations. Are any of these decisions that he's making based on scientific data or is it all based on his personal beliefs?

39:31And as we've said on the show before, he has no scientific expertise. He has no medical expertise. And he has said so many things that are just patently false about vaccines. It's hard to even count them. Right. He went on X and in a one minute video said that we health and human services are not recommending this vaccine for healthy young children. We know that thousands of children over the past year were hospitalized with COVID. One in five were admitted to the intensive care unit and 152 children died. He also said that we're not recommending this vaccine for pregnant women. When you know that the pregnancy is a high risk complication for or high-risk condition for severe COVID.

40:12We're the only country in the world that doesn't consider pregnancy a high-risk condition for severe COVID. He just makes it up. He talks about ushering in an era of radical transparency, and nearly, as I can tell, the only thing he's ushered in is something that's radical. It's certainly not transparent. Dr. Paul Offit, thanks so much. Appreciate your expertise, as always. We're following breaking news out of Georgia. Five soldiers were shot at Fort Stewart today. Our team's just got brand-new information about how today's tragedy unfolded. We're going to bring you those details in moments.

40:47When it's time to scale your business, it's time for Shopify. Get everything you need to grow the way you want. Like, all the way. Stack more sales with the best converting checkout on the planet. Track your cha-chings from every channel, right in one spot. And turn real-time reporting into big-time opportunities. Take your business to a whole new level. Switch to Shopify. Start your free trial today. Amazon Health AI presents Painful Thoughts. Why did I search the internet for answers to my cold sore problem? Now I'm stuck down a rabbit hole filled with images of alarmingly graphic sores in various stages of ooze.

41:33I can clear my search history, but I can never unsee that. Don't go down the rabbit hole. Amazon Health AI gets you the right care fast. Health care just got less painful. This is CNN Breaking News. The lead tonight, breaking news from Georgia. Key new details about the suspect accused of shooting five soldiers at Fort Stewart earlier today. A law enforcement official now telling CNN that the suspect had a disagreement with one of the victims yesterday, which allegedly erupted in shocking violence today. The suspect is a 28-year-old Army sergeant. He is in custody. All five victims are expected to recover.

42:13I want to get straight to CNN's Ryan Young, who just arrived at the base, Fort Stewart. Ryan? Yeah, absolutely, Jake. We learned from CNN's Mark Morales about this new information that apparently the suspect had a beef with a fellow co-worker, then showed up with a weapon, opened fire on that co-worker, and then shot for others. And, of course, we've learned about how other soldiers jumped in to subdue him. He was taken into custody very quickly. Right now, the base is back to normal operations coming from the standpoint of all the gates back here open. This place is massive. As someone who's been in this area at this base several times before, I can tell you this is like a mini city here.

42:54It's one of the largest bases, of course, across from the Mississippi. And people know this for how much work this base does across the world. But we do know the soldiers who were injured in this suffered those injuries. We know they will survive. Three needed surgery. But listen to the general talk about what happened here today and how soldiers jumped in to help out. Soldiers in the area that witnessed the shooting immediately and without hesitation tackled the soldiers, subdued him that allowed law enforcement to then take him into custody.

43:30So Jake, I've been able to talk to a couple soldiers through text message, and they were able to tell me, look, they were shocked by this. This was put on lockdown. They were worried about what was going on. We do know apparently this soldier bought this weapon back in May in Florida. I know several federal agents have been trying to track down where this gun originated from, but we now know through that CNN reporting from Mark Morales that they were able to track this gun back to purchase in Florida in May. And there was some disagreement at work, and then he showed up with that gun and opened fire.

44:02Hopefully to get more information about the motive, we know the suspect is now in military custody. A lot of times, Jake, when we talk about cases like this, you think about a first court appearance, that's something that we will probably not see in terms of him being held in front of the camera and facing a judge. So we'll have to see what he faces. But also the good news here, even after two soldiers had to be moved to Savannah to get that expert trauma one level care, that all the soldiers involved in this should survive. So people are in shock here, especially in the small community that surrounds this area.

44:32But at the same time, this is going to turn out with those soldiers being able to make it through this. Jake. Ryan, can you talk about any of the major questions investigators are still seeking answers to? Well, I think one of the things that they'll be focused on is, one, his preparation in terms of bringing that gun onto the base and showing up at that facility. There's been a lot of question about what happened preceding that shooting. So, of course, they'll analyze the gun. They'll see what happened. There's also been that conversation about him being pulled over for DUI. So I'm sure they'll be scrubbing through his history to figure out exactly what started this sort of cascading events that may have led to this shooting.

45:10And what could make someone so angry enough to show up to work with a weapon to shoot a co-worker. Again, this is a large footprint area. Everything around here is touched by this military base. Even on the way in here, it really shocks you in terms of all the firepower that you see here. But at the same time, weapons are usually under control in this area. So, Jake, just a lot of questions about how this happened and what was his motivation, even after we know it was a beef. Yeah. Ryan Young at Fort Stewart. Thanks so much. Let's bring in Donnell Harvin. He's the former chief of Homeland Security and Intelligence for the D.C.

45:41government, also with us, Darren Porcher, a former NYPD lieutenant. Donnell, what do you make of these new details that the suspect had a disagreement or a beef with one co-worker the day before and then allegedly brought a gun to the workplace today? Jake, this isn't that dissimilar from other workplace violence we've seen in other settings. I think what's so shocking is that it happens on a tightly secured military base. I'll also add that the Department of Defense, after the Navy Yard shooting, which you recall in D.C., implemented a very robust program to detect what we call insider threats.

46:17These threats that emanate from inside your organizations, in this particular case, the are extremely hard to detect, extremely hard to interdict and deter. And so they'll be looking at that, I'm sure, at the Pentagon over the next days and weeks on how they could have perhaps prevented this. Darren, what do you think investigators are looking into right now? Well, you're going to have CID, Criminal Investigations Division of the Army, that's going to investigate this. I'm a former executive officer in the Army, so on many occasions I've introduced discipline against soldiers. The investigators are going to sit down with everyone that worked in that workplace area.

46:56He was a logistics specialist. So I take it he worked in a warehouse facility. So all of those individuals are going to be interviewed. But what's really interesting about this is there was a 40-minute gap from the time when the shooting started to when the shooter was, quote, unquote, taken into custody, which is kind of strange because there were people that were in that workplace that were able to take him down and I want to say neutralize him pending the arrival of law enforcement. But once again, it's going to be a contingent of various interviews as to what the dispute was. And did anyone have information that revealed there was a propensity for him to come back and introduce violence in the workplace?

47:38Donnell, is it odd that the suspect's chain of command did not know about his recent DUI? Is that something that the local law enforcement would automatically notify the military about or the military would be alerted about in some way? I mean, not necessarily if you don't disclose to the law enforcement what your occupation is. But I will tell you that, once again, this is an aspect that came out of the after-action report from the Navy Yard shooting. There was a lot of red flags with that individual shooter who took the lives of nine people, 12 people rather, excuse me, at the Navy Yard that day.

48:14And there was a whole host of things, interactions with law enforcement that weren't picked up. And so after that, the Department of Defense started doing more regular background checks. All these individuals who are on bases, whether they're uniformed or not, go through a rigorous background check process. But what they found is that once you go through that initial process, they weren't doing follow ups. And so those follow ups that have been in place now are there to pick up things that happen just like this. And hopefully they'll look at that and see if that would have triggered some follow up investigation in this individual.

48:47But once again, Jake, you know, unless he told somebody or he made a threat, it's really, really hard to interdict and stop somebody who's determined to hurt somebody at their workplace. Darren, do you think other U.S. military installations need to be doing security reviews in the wake of this shooting, maybe just to fend off any copycats or maybe there are lessons to be learned? There's going to be an after action review that's going to be quite telling to other military bases, be it the Army, Navy, Air Force and Marines. And that information would be extracted to make a robust, a more robust security component in any base.

49:23But what's interesting about this is you as an active duty soldier, you have an access badge that affords you the ability to get on base. Those individuals that have access badges are not searched as they enter the base. Bear in mind, this was a personal weapon that he came on base with. And we have to trust our soldiers because these are the individuals that we arm in combat to protect and defend the democracy of the United States abroad. So we're just not going to search them when they come on base. And this was one of these things that more so slipped through the cracks. But I agree that we need to do a more robust job in terms of creating that security matrix on base.

50:05All right, Darren Portcher and Danelle Harvin, thanks to both of you. Unfortunately, this is not the first time a deadly shooting took place on a U.S. military base. CNN's Brian Todd joins us now. Brian. Well, Jake, Brigadier General John Lewis today, he's the commander of the 3rd Infantry Division at Fort Stewart. He told reporters this afternoon that other soldiers in the area who witnessed this shooting, in his words, quote, immediately and without hesitation, tackled the alleged shooter. Now, General Lubas said without a doubt that prevented more casualties. But there have been other mass shootings at U.S.

50:35military bases where some worst-case scenarios did, in fact, unfold. November 5, 2009, a U.S. Army major and psychiatrist at Fort Hood, Texas, he shot more than 40 people. He killed 13 of them. He was shooting his fellow soldiers at a processing center on the base at Fort Hood. Prosecutors said the shooter, an American-born Muslim, underwent a progressive radicalization that had led to that massacre. That shooter was convicted and sentenced to death. He is currently being held at Fort Leavenworth, Kansas. This remains the deadliest shooting ever on a U.S. military base, that shooting at Fort Hood on 2009.

51:13Now, on December 16, 2013, a defense contract worker and former Navy reservist killed 12 people at the Navy yard right here in Washington, D.C. At least eight other people were injured in that shooting. The shooter was then killed in a gun battle with police. Subsequent investigations found that the shooter had suffered mental health problems. But despite those issues, he still held on to a security clearance with the Navy, allowing him access to that base, Jake. I remember you and I both covered that shooting and that whole issue with his access and the clearance was a big deal at the time. Now, on April 2nd, 2014, another shooting, just get to that one, that was another shooting at Fort Hood in Texas.

51:55A soldier opened fire on fellow service members, killing three people, wounding more than a dozen before he killed himself. That shooting actually played out in multiple buildings at the base on Fort Hood as the shooter moved around. That was before he was engaged by military police. And on December 6, 2019, an aviation student from Saudi Arabia opened fire in a classroom at Naval Air Station Pensacola in Florida. He killed three people and injured another dozen people, including two sheriff's deputies. The shooter was killed at the scene by deputies. Investigations later revealed that the shooter had self-radicalized and had been in contact with al-Qaeda operatives in the years prior to the shooting.

52:36Jake, in all of these incidents, including today's shooting at Fort Stewart, one common thread. The shooters all had access to the bases in question. As for the weapon, well, today General Lubas said the Fort Stewart shooter had used his own weapon, a handgun, not a military-issued weapon. But, Jake, horrible precedence for the shooting today. Thankfully, no one was killed today in that incident. Yeah, Brian Todd, thanks so much. Moments ago, President Trump and Vice President Vance responded to CNN reporting that Vance had been scheduled to host a dinner with other Trump officials this evening.

53:08And among the topics they would discuss would be the fallout around the Epstein file scandal. And what, if any, other materials they should release. Those new comments are next.

53:21in our politics lead sources tell cnn that a dinner scheduled today for top trump officials to meet and discuss at least in part a strategy over the administration's handling over the jeffrey epstein case is now in flux due to intense coverage cnn previously reported that white house chief of staff susie wiles u.s attorney general pam bondi fbi director cash patel u.s Deputy Attorney General Todd Blanche were expected to gather and dine at the residence of Vice President J.D. Vance. However, those not included include any of Epstein's victims, the people most impacted by this entire ordeal. CNN's Caitlin Collins is at the White House.

53:59And Caitlin, President Trump and Vice President Vance were just asked about this dinner. What did they have to say? Yeah, Jake, the president said he wasn't aware about this dinner, but then turned to the Vice President J.D. Vance, who was in the Oval Office with him just now as Tim Cook was making an announcement inside the Oval separate from this. But they were asked multiple questions about Jeffrey Epstein overall. I want you to listen to not only what President Trump had to say, but also the Vice President J.D. Vance. Is he working on what? Is he hosting some kind of gathering of top advisors this evening to talk about how to respond to the Epstein situation?

54:39I don't know. I could ask you that question. I don't know of it, but I think I here's the man. I saw a reporter today and it's completely fake news. We're not meeting to talk about the Epstein situation. And I think the reporter who reported it needs to get better sources. Look, the whole thing is a hoax. It's put out by the Democrats because we've had the most successful six months in the history of our country. And that's just a way of trying to divert attention to something that's total bullshit. So Jake, as you heard Vance denying there that they are meeting to talk specifically about the Jeffrey Epstein situation and how this administration has been handling it.

55:20Of course, you just listed the people who are expected to be there at that gathering at the vice president's residence tonight. And all of them have played a role in terms of what this looks like, whether it's public comments they've made about Jeffrey Epstein or Todd Blanche's meeting with Ghislaine Maxwell that lasted for nearly 10 hours, as there are still questions about what the next step forward here are going to be when it comes to Jeffrey Epstein for this administration, if they release a transcript of that conversation with Ghislaine Maxwell or what that looks like. You referenced, Jake, no survivors being invited.

55:51That is something that an attorney, the family of Virginia Jufri, the late Virginia Jufri who died by suicide earlier this year, noted in a statement earlier. And that is a complaint that we've heard from a lot of survivors and victims in recent days and weeks, Jake, is that they feel that they don't have a seat at the table in the conversations that are happening, whether that be here at the White House or Republicans on Capitol Hill, in terms of what they are trying to do and achieve here with the release of the Epstein documents that we know lawmakers are seeking. So still major questions, Jake, about what that strategy is going to look like, what those next steps look like for this administration.

56:26It's odd, Caitlin, hearing President Trump call this a hoax invented by the Democrats because it's actually J.D. Vance and Pam Bondi and Dan Bongino and Kash Patel and Trump himself who talked about releasing the Epstein files. And the outrage has been from the MAGA base and Republicans. And the reason that this is all in the news is because, A, they promised they would release this stuff. They didn't. B, Elon Musk said Trump is in the Epstein files, providing no evidence for it. And then, C, they themselves keep doing things to keep this in the news, like the deputy attorney general flying down to Tallahassee and having two meetings with Jeffrey Epstein's co-conspirator, Gillian Maxwell.

57:12moving her from the prison that she was being held at, the correctional facility in Tallahassee, to a much lower security one in Texas that has been described for its way more relaxed conditions there, as you've seen other people there who have committed white-collar crimes and whatnot are stationed there. And so that has been a real question in terms of who authorized waivers for Ghislaine Maxwell to go there. Remember yesterday, the president told me he was not aware of that move before it happened. I've talked to a lot of people who've said they're skeptical of that, because it is such a big decision by this Justice Department to make to not keep the president in the loop on that.

57:47But he said he didn't know about it before, Jake. Weird stuff. Caitlin Collins at the White House. Thanks so much. And don't miss Caitlin on her show, The Source with Caitlin Collins. That's tonight and every weeknight at nine o 'clock Eastern on CNN. Let's bring in crisis manager and attorney Lainey Davis. He served as special counsel for President Bill Clinton during Clinton's impeachment. He's represented Trump's former fixer, Michael Cohen. Thanks for being here. Really appreciate it. So you heard the vice president say this Epstein strategy session is fake news. And you heard the president say it's, quote, bullshit.

58:21Either way, the five reporters who broke the story, including Caitlin, had excellent sourcing on the fact that this dinner was supposed to take place and this was going to be discussed. And it upset Virginia Giuffre, one of the victims of Jeffrey Epstein. And as you heard Caitlin say, her family put out a statement saying, missing from this group, of course, any survivor of the vicious crimes of convicted perjurer and sex trafficker Ghislaine Maxwell and Jeffrey Epstein, their voices must be heard above all. So stepping aside from this back and forth between the White House about the dinner, this is an issue, right?

58:58These files, the release of it, the administration has to deal with it. It's not going to go away. What should they be doing when it comes to the victims? Well, first of all, the victims should be in the room and should be part of the conversation. And I don't see them even being consulted, much less in the room. Secondly, Vice President Vance, President Trump, and Chairman Coma, who has issued these subpoenas, need to answer one simple question. And this is quite simple for everybody watching and for the American people, Democrat or Republican. Release the files. Yeah. Why not release the files?

59:37Did President Trump answer the question? Did Vice President Vance answer the question? Right. Why not release the files? They made this an issue and the victims are suffering because it continues. One of the things that was odd. So James Comer, the chairman of the House Oversight Committee, issued a bunch of subpoenas. Yeah. from that committee among the people subpoenaed, including two former FBI directors, I think five attorneys general. If you look at them, two Democrat and three Republican. I'm trying to do the math there. They're not all listed. Three Democrat and three Republican. And Bill and Hillary Clinton.

1:00:15Not on the subpoena list is Alex Acosta. Alex Acosta was Trump's former Secretary of Labor in the first term. He was the Bush-era U.S. attorney that negotiated this sweetheart plea deal for Jeffrey Epstein that allowed him to only do minimum time in state prison with work release, and he would never be prosecuted for anything else. Can you think of any explanation why they wouldn't go after the testimony of Alex Acosta? Look, there's political machinery going on here that's diverting attention from the simple question, why not release the files? Chairman Comer and all these subpoenas is simply changing the subject.

1:01:00Throwing out names is changing the subject. There's only one subject the Republicans raised, as you pointed out. The files are on Attorney General Bundy's desk. She said she would release them. why is Chairman Comer issuing subpoenas rather than getting the files? In his defense, he did also issue a subpoena for all the documents from the Justice Department. We just don't know what's going to be turned over. So he is seeking that. I have not heard him say to the President of the United States and the Attorney General, he's a Republican chairman of the Oversight Committee, release the files. Whatever else he's doing, he has not said publicly, release the files.

1:01:36Republican leaders in the House have opposed releasing the files. Why? I think we can all agree that the names of the victims should be redacted. Of course. Of course. What about the people, and there are no doubt dozens if not hundreds of people who are mentioned in the files who were Epstein associates who didn't do anything wrong, but maybe they were flying down to Epstein Island to try to get him to contribute money to a university or whatever. I'm sure there are people who did things wrong also that are in these files also. but one of the arguments is going to be made, oh, we can't be naming people that didn't do anything wrong, and that's one of the reasons why these files in general are not released.

1:02:14What about that argument? It's too late for that argument. The transparency argument has to, I'm sympathetic with people whose names are innocently in the vows, including Donald Trump. Sure. Or Bill Clinton. I mean, nobody has any evidence that either of them did anything untoward with us. It's too late to say we need to be worried about embarrassing people whose names are mentioned in the vows. It's far gone. This needs to be transparent. Donald Trump has deliberately not told his attorney general. It's not unintentional. Just released the darn files. Susie Wallace hasn't said that. Chairman Comer hasn't said it publicly.

1:02:47He may say he's subpoenaing. He doesn't need to subpoena anything. Call the president of the United States, hold a press conference and say, Attorney General Bondi released the files. We all know what's going on here. It's not magical. Something is being hidden. They're embarrassed about something or there's a reason why they're not releasing the files. And I'm just being logical, not political. You're saying they're playing hide the ball. Some reason, and it's got to be that. But I am focusing on the victims. The children who are now adults are living through this nightmare every day. And we ought to be focused on them.

1:03:18And they get mad. You just heard the president get mad. You heard J.D. Vance call it fake news, this report about the meeting that they're supposed to have. They get mad about it. And, you know, as my late father-in-law used to say, you're maddest when you're mad at yourself. They created this situation. They created it. It's very strange. It's their issue. It's been the podcaster MAGA industry that raised this issue. If it's an issue of transparency, then release them unless you have something to hide. Release the files. Lanny Davis, thank you so much. Democratic Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez today called on Democratic leaders to unite behind the Democratic nominee in New York City's mayoral race.

1:03:57They have not. Schumer and Hakeem Jeffries have not endorsed Mamdani. The report involving President Trump that got her fired up. That's next.

1:04:11Introducing Meta Glasses. Hey, Meta. Any last-minute tables for two tonight? Sure. There's a great Italian restaurant 15 minutes away. Hey, Meta. Where's the nearest flower shop? Five minutes away. Straight down Broadway, past the bodega. Their lilies are trending on Instagram. Just saying. Hey Meta, am I forgetting anything else? How about setting a calendar reminder for next year? Meta Glasses, available in more than 20 styles. When it's time to scale your business, it's time for Shopify. Get everything you need to grow the way you want. Like, all the way. Stack more sales with the best converting checkout on the planet.

1:04:54Track your cha-chings from every channel, right in one spot. and turn real-time reporting into big-time opportunities. Take your business to a whole new level. Switch to Shopify. Start your free trial today.

1:05:10Back to our politics lead, the president and vice president, J.D. Vance, now responding to CNN's report about a scheduled strategy meeting, dinner between or among top Trump administration officials on the topic, at least partly, on how to handle squash, discuss the lingering public interest in the Jeffrey Epstein case. Vance, whose sources tell CNN, was set to host this dinner. He called the report fake news. My panel's here with me now. Brian, let me start with something on Vance, but peripheral to the Epstein thing. The idea that J.D. Vance was going to have this dinner, and let's say that Epstein was just one of many topics, okay?

1:05:48But also there was going to be the FBI director and Attorney General Bondi and the Chief of Staff and Deputy Attorney General Todd Blanche. This comes just a day after Trump basically said that Vice President Vance was the heir apparent to the MAGA movement. You know, he said there are other good people, but how do you see Vice President Vance? I mean, because that would be a leadership role, and I don't doubt it, whether it was about tariffs or Epstein, I think it was probably about lots of stuff, but Epstein certainly, it's certainly something they have to deal with. But beyond that, the leadership of Vance within the administration, you have good insights into this administration.

1:06:29How do you see it? Listen, I think it's a good influence. And it's not just this moment. You've seen these leadership moments during the campaign where he was involved in debates and helping in the second debate for President Trump. You've seen these leadership moments during transition where he was heavily engaged in the helping staff of this government. But what now you're seeing is now it's being highlighted as vice president. This isn't the first dinner he's had with cabinet officials. He's actually had several dinners with cabinet officials throughout the year, or throughout the six months so far.

1:06:55But what you see is J.D. bringing people together, finding the right focus, and making sure that this team can execute. I think that's what President Trump likes in J.D. is that he can go into a room, he can command, he knows how to create a plan from this and figure out what we can do to execute. And he's going to have more dinners like this. It's a good thing. Yeah, it's interesting. And Mo, as CNN's Christian Holmes pointed out, Vance carefully said, quote, we're not meeting to talk about the Epstein situation. It's Washington language. Like, they're having dinner. They're going to talk about lots of stuff.

1:07:24I'm sure they're excited that the Phillies are in first place and the NL East. But they didn't deny that the dinner was happening, and they didn't deny that that was going to be a topic. And by the way, they should. This is an issue they have to deal with. This is my point. I mean, they didn't deny who the guests were at the dinner. It just so happens that all these guests are the ones who are on the front line of dealing with the incoming on the Epstein case every single day. I'm not sure this is the group that he would pull together to talk about tariffs. Probably not. Right? But yes, they should have this dinner.

1:07:58And they should invite someone in to represent the victim's point of view. But they should have this dinner because they have yet to figure out how to solve a problem that they created themselves. It shouldn't be a very long dinner because at the conclusion of the dinner they should say, all right, we got to release some stuff. Because that's the only way to make this go away. Every single day this is in the news, it is because it is self-inflicted, because they are the ones who are putting it in the news. Let me ask you, Elliot, looking at the guest list, is it on you? Let's say that, let's assume that they were talking about the Epstein files, because frankly, they should be.

1:08:34And if people think that we're talking about it a lot, turn into MAGA Media if you want to see people talking about it a lot. not Fox, but everyone else. But beyond that, look at the guest list. Is it unusual to have a meeting like this, Vice President, FBI Director, White House Chief of Staff, Deputy Attorney General, Attorney General? Is that? It is, Jake, it is spectacularly unusual. And I have to disagree with both of my esteemed colleagues here in that, no, it's not just an ordinary dinner when the FBI director and vice president of the United States get together. There is, going back to Watergate, a separation between the day-to-day work of the Justice Department, the policy and prosecution work of the Justice Department and the White House.

1:09:17And I know the argument of, oh, the president appoints the attorney, Joe, and the FBI director. That's not the way the conduct of the actual work of the Justice Department works. And so this idea that they're merely getting together to just talk, No, it's remarkable. And so, you know, we just need to, yes, the White House has a problem. Yes, the White House has a PR crisis on its hands. But this is a PR crisis dealing with the conduct of prosecutions and the rights of victims and the rights of defendants. And it's bad, bad, bad for this meeting to be had. Let's switch gears because I just saw a tweet from Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez.

1:09:54She was quoting a New York Times story suggesting, well, let me read the clip. President Trump just denied this, by the way, from the New York Times story. In a previously undisclosed call in recent weeks, Mr. Trump spoke with the New York City mayoral race, about the New York City mayoral race directly with former New York Governor Andrew Cuomo, an old associate in FOIL, who is running in the mayor's race as an independent, according to three people briefed on the call who were not authorized to discuss it. And what AOC wrote is New Yorkers knew Andrew Cuomo was backed by Trump's orbit. That's why he lost the primary.

1:10:29Now we have confirmation it's time for Democratic leaders to unite behind Zoran Mamdani. If they don't now, how can they call for party unity later? Now, Trump said to reporters, I haven't. No, I haven't in response to talking. But one of the things so interesting is how frustrated AOC is that both Hakeem Jeffries and Chuck Schumer, the House and Senate Democratic leaders have not endorsed the Democratic nominee for mayor. Yeah. Well, the other interesting line in there was that Trump's thinking about weighing in in order to consolidate the anti-Mamdani vote. He can do that. He actually could against whoever he doesn't or, you know, just endorse Mamdani.

1:11:06Right. If he wants Mamdani to lose, he should endorse Mamdani. But there is a lot of frustration amongst a lot of people in the party that we're still having this conversation. You know, weeks after the primary was settled and there's a Democratic nominee that we're still having this conversation about, should we endorse or should we not? He's the Democratic nominee. And there are a lot of times when you don't like your party's nominee for one reason or another. My party has nominated several candidates in my lifetime that I wasn't crazy about. But if the other options are Eric Adams and Cuomo and you weren't thrilled about either of them, then get on board.

1:11:46Last word. Sure, pick the socialist. Pick the socialist. If everybody else sucks, pick the socialist who's going to make everything worse. I'm glad the Democratic Party's having the civil war. This is a precursor to the presidential elections in a couple of years from now. We're even going to see a larger civil war. I mean, they have to decide, the Democratic Party, and that's why their approval ratings are so low, they have to decide who they are. And I think they're struggling to figure out their identity. And this civil war that's taking place, I'm just going to love watching it. It is. I mean, I don't think he's overstating the case that the pull between the normies, the normie Democrats and the and the and the DSA Democrats is going to be considerable.

1:12:21Yeah. And look, I don't know nationally what direction the party goes in, because you look at some of the other primaries that are happening around the country. And you've got the normie, the establishment Democrats beating socialist candidates or progressive candidates. Right. So the party is not in Minnesota, not in the Minneapolis mayor's race. The party endorsed the DSA candidate. Right. But not in Arizona. Right. In the special election, congressional election there went the other direction. You take my point. It's going to be interesting. It's going to be interesting. Brian, we'll have the popcorn.

1:12:55Get your popcorn. All right. Thanks to my panel. Coming up, President Trump was able to get his mega bill through Congress. How's it playing out in battleground states that'll be key to the midterms? We're going to take you to one next.

1:13:09President Trump was able to get his big, beautiful bill over the finish line. But now, of course, he and Republicans have to sell it to voters, especially those in swing states ahead of the midterm elections. While some say that the megabill will help the economy, others warn that it hurts the social safety net. In his latest installment of All Over the Map, John King checked in with voters in Battleground, Arizona. A scorching summer in the Arizona desert. A risky time to open a new restaurant. Add in higher beef prices and an unpredictable economy. Confident, hopeful. I believe a lot in this brand.

1:13:47I believe a lot that what we do is different. Charro Steak North is just about ready. The bar is stocked, supplies delivered, the team is hired. And for that, Ray Flores gives President Trump some credit. Specifically, the new law lowering taxes on tips and overtime. We had a really robust hiring fair. Lots of applicants, way more than we've had in previous hiring fairs. A lot of quality applicants, a little higher quality. I do believe that those messages of some kind of tax relief created some of this. This is Arizona's 6th Congressional District, one of the battlegrounds that will determine whether Republicans keep their House majority after next year's midterms.

1:14:24Republican Juan Siskimani is the incumbent. Charostake North is in his district. And Flores, an independent, has supported Siskimani in the past. How they sell that bill, whether that bill actually improves the economy because of the tax cuts or the no taxes on tips or overtime, that's a big deal for his political fate. What do you think at this moment? Got a ways to go, but what do you think now? I mean, I think unfortunately for them or for us to give a good answer right now, we're in the middle of the offseason. I think it's probably a question that needs to be asked a year from today. So welcome back to Sun, Arizona.

1:14:56This food bank serves both the 6th and 7th congressional districts and is already dealing with some Trump changes. I believe you live from Mexico right now. Right. You are correct. That's going to change pretty soon with the tariffs and all that, so we're going to be definitely seeing less produce come in. But the biggest test is down the road. The politically popular tax break on tips in overtime takes effect immediately, but the politically risky changes to Medicaid and food assistance don't take effect until 2027, after the next election. I know some things are going to roll out after the midterms, which is a very nice play for some folks to wait until after that.

1:15:38Jake, this is a place we have visited now a half dozen times in the last year's campaign and now into the first Trump term. Fascinating for a number of reasons. The economy and the big, beautiful bill, as Trump calls it. Those social safety net programs and what happens when the changes and the cuts begin to kick in. Also, to me, one of the greatest laboratories of the question, can Republicans continue their growth among Latino voters? Trump's growth, he grew to 44 percent last year among Latinos in Arizona. That's why he won. And that's why he's back in the White House. This district, 25 percent Hispanic voters.

1:16:05So if the Democrats are going to fix their problem with Latino voters, it's a great place to watch. Fascinating stuff. John King, thank you so much. Today, UCLA announced that the Trump administration has frozen more than half a billion dollars in research funds. The reported reason is next.

1:16:24In our World Lead Now, we are waiting on word from Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and his security cabinet who are meeting to decide, reportedly, whether Israel is going to move forward with what Netanyahu has reportedly described as a, quote, full conquest of Gaza. The IDF says it already controls about 75 % of the Gaza Strip, but polling shows most Israelis want a deal that frees the 50 hostages still in Gaza. Most Israelis seem more focused on that. Humanitarian access remains limited. The Israeli agency that coordinates aid says nearly 300 trucks entered Gaza on Tuesday. Hamas officials say that the actual number is 84 and that the territory needs at least 600 trucks of relief and fuel per day.

1:17:10Meanwhile, Hamas says it will allow the Red Cross to deliver food and medicine to hostages, but only if permanent humanitarian quarters are opened and airstrikes are halted during deliveries. Let's bring in now Fabrizio Carboni. He is the head of the International Committee of the Red Cross delegation to the United States and Canada. Thank you so much for being here. Obviously grim times in that region. What is the current status of the Red Cross's efforts to deliver food and medical aid to the hostages in Gaza? We're still in the same situation in the sense that our movement in Gaza and accessing hostages is only possible if all the parties give us the needed security and tell us that we have the green light to visit the hostages.

1:18:02But first, the hostages should be released. Because this is a very important point. This is illegal. Us visiting hostages is a failure to release the hostages. And the second point, it's again, there are conditions to visit the hostages, is more humanitarian assistance in Gaza. And this is again one of the main issues we face in Gaza, is that everything is conditional, while it shouldn't be conditional. By everybody or by Hamas? All parties. All parties. All parties always or often condition humanitarian assistance and protection to other parameters which shouldn't be involved. In this case, we should have access to hostages because this is the right thing to do when people, and we saw the images, are exposed to life-saving challenges.

1:19:00The same goes for the civilian population in Gaza. Right. How does the Red Cross operate safely in what is obviously a battlefield, Gaza, given reports of your colleagues being shot at and in some tragic cases killed? We don't. We don't operate safely in Gaza today. We take a level of risk that we're not taking in any other region of the world. And one of the reasons we're taking those risks, it's also to be there when we are needed for the release of hostages, to visit them, to assist in our hospital. So we're taking a level of risk. We have a number of security incidents and casualties that we never had in other places.

1:19:42Or when we have them, we leave. Here we decide to stay because we know that the stakes, the humanitarian stakes are so high that we need to accept those risks. What's the reality on the ground? You talked about the starving population in Gaza, the Palestinians that are starving because of lack of access to food and aid. What is the reality on the ground for civilians there? We hear these reports about famine, malnutrition, just horrific conditions. What are you hearing from your aid workers on the ground there? Look, I mean, if I take our field hospital, Field hospital, we receive over the last six weeks, 300 and 400 weapon wounded, 250 died.

1:20:29Most of them, if not all of them, gunshot wound and they were on their way to a food distribution. I think people are so desperate today that they are ready to risk their lives, to have access to assistance because they are on the verge of... It's a breaking point. Are they all shot by IDF? Are they some shot by others in the region? Look, you know, this is to some extent, I would say from our perspective, not the point. It's that there are too many people wounded and killed to have access to essential services. The dialogue with all the parties, we do it in a confidential way. And if we have findings on who is responsible, we deal directly with the authorities involved.

1:21:17But today, the point is that we shouldn't reach a point where we see those hostages in an unacceptable situation. We see those patients, our own staff. We can't feed our own staff. Our surgeons working in this field hospital are struggling to find food and function every day. Too much suffering, too much death. Fabrizio Carboni with the International Committee of the Red Cross. Thanks for being with us. Thank you for having me. The$100 billion announcement today from Apple that could affect your future iPhones.

1:21:59Our last leads start in our national lead. The University of California, Los Angeles, says that the Trump administration has frozen more than half a billion dollars of research funds. UCLA is the latest school to be targeted by the Trump administration over claims of rampant anti-Semitism during pro-Palestinian protests in 2024. This comes just days after both Brown and Columbia universities had federal funding restored after signing settlements with the administration over similar claims involving tens of millions of dollars. And our money lead in the Oval Office today, Apple announced a$100 billion investment to expand its operations in the U.S.

1:22:37President Trump doubled down on his tariff strategy by threatening 100 percent levies on semiconductors and chips made internationally, but said companies that have committed to building in the U.S. would not face a charge. For Apple iPhones and watches, the company is also broadening its partnership with a glass supplier in Kentucky. Apple CEO Tim Cook presented Trump with Glass made at that facility. You can follow me on Facebook, Instagram, ThreadsX, and on the TikTok at Jake Tapper. You can follow the show on X at the Lead CNN. If you ever miss an episode of Lead, you can listen to the show once you get your podcast.

1:23:12Aaron Burnett out front starts right now. I'll see you tomorrow.

1:23:21Starting a business can seem like a daunting task. unless you have a partner like Shopify. They have the tools you need to start and grow your business. From designing a website to marketing to selling and beyond, Shopify can help with everything you need. There's a reason millions of companies like Mattel, Heinz, and Allbirds continue to trust and use them. With Shopify on your side, turn your big business idea into... Sign up for your$1 per month trial at shopify.com slash special offer. Evening, buyer's remorse. Buy a new car? I'll be moving in. Let's get started. Uh, sorry, I think there's been a mistake.

1:23:59I bought it from Carvana. You what? Yeah, great price. I even have seven days to love it or return it. So there's no... No, no buyer's remorse. More like buyer's rejoice? I guess I'll let myself out. Congratulations. I mean it. Buyer's rejoice. Buy your car today on Carvana. Limitations and exclusions may apply. See our seven-day return policy at Carvana.com.