Iran, Trade, Tech, Taiwan on Agenda for Trump-Xi Summit

25:10She has to resign after two years on the job. And Neil is watching this all in D.C. and it obviously affects him. He follows his mother's principles, I think, here. He's very conservative like her. He's very against the administrative state. But I think that he watched what happened to her and he takes a very different approach personally and interpersonally with how he deals with the press and all kinds of things. Justice Gorsuch spoke to CBS News this past weekend in a rare interview. I want to get your thoughts on this one exchange. Does a justice owe a president loyalty? No, my loyalty is the Constitution and laws of the United States.

25:49That's the oath I took. It's really just that simple. How do you think about that statement and reconcile it with what you've learned about him in the course of your reporting? Yeah, so this is actually one of the reasons why Neil Gorsuch is such a wild card. He has a very principled view towards this theory of the law called originalism, which we get into a lot more on the show. But he does strongly hold this belief. And he follows this way of reading the law to such an extreme that he doesn't always end up in a conservative point of view. That's why he's the wild card. He's made very liberal rulings on both gay rights and on Native American law.

26:35And so there are he I think it's fair to say that he he does definitely think that his loyalty is to the Constitution. And that is what he's trying to do on the bench. So the court has yet to announce decisions on a few cases this term among the decisions we're waiting for. Birthright citizenship. President Trump obviously paying close to that attention to that. Do you have any thought of how Gorsuch might rule or is he a wild card? Well, I think that what we're seeing right now is that Justice Gorsuch has only been on the bench for just about 10 years. He has a lifetime appointment and he understands that his legal career and his legacy is going to be determined well after President Trump is no longer President Trump.

27:20And so I think that most legal experts who are looking at this think that the court is going to rule against Trump in birthright citizenship. I think that Gorsuch is going to be a huge part of that. And I think that that is one of the things that we're watching for. He is one of the most interesting Supreme Court justices that we've had in a long, long time. Susan Matthews, thank you so much for joining us. And the podcast, of course, Slow Burn. Thanks so much. Good to see you. Coming up next, the new questions and the lack of answers from the Trump administration about a particular no-bid contract for one of President Trump's newest projects, renovating the reflecting pool on the National Mall.

28:00Starting a business can seem like a daunting task, unless you have a partner like Shopify. They have the tools you need to start and grow your business. From designing a website, to marketing, to selling, and beyond, Shopify can help with everything you need. There's a reason millions of companies like Mattel, Heinz, and Allbirds continue to trust and use them. With Shopify on your side, turn your big business idea into... Sign up for your$1 per month trial at shopify.com slash special offer. In our politics lead today, Interior Secretary Doug Burgum fielded questions from lawmakers about the cost of some of President Trump's pet projects, including renovations to the Lincoln Memorial Reflecting Pool.

28:43My understanding of federal procurement rules is that a no-bid contract is reserved for situations where, quote, any delay would cause serious injury to the government. What is your proposition is what? That there'd be serious injury to the government if this company didn't get the$13 million contract to do this particular project right now? Well, I think we do have a sense of urgency. I mean, we got handed a record amount of deferred maintenance. We had 19 fountains across the city that didn't work. That's the serious injury to the government? My panel joins me now. Governor Hutchinson, 19 fountains not working.

29:22probably not what the lawmakers had in mind when they said serious injury, right? You could certainly argue that. The fact is this is going to be judged as to whether this actually improves the reflecting pool or not. Yeah. And I thought Secretary Burgum handled the questions fine. I don't think it's a great concern out there. It's not the – and I do like coming to Washington, D.C. and seeing some of the improvements that are made. Might not like all of them, but I sure like it whenever you have a cleaner city and a better looking city for international visitors. Maria, there are probably a lot of Americans out there who are like, well, good for President Trump, cutting through the red tape.

30:00Who cares? It just needs to look good. And I hate all the bureaucracy. I bet you there are more Americans out there who are worried about the fact that they can't make ends meet, that they see how much money the government is spending on a ballroom that nobody needed or wanted, on a war in Iran that nobody needed or wanted, on the reflecting pool, on an arc for Donald Trump, on the Trump-Kennedy Center, on putting his face on the dollar bill. And I think this is part of what Donald Trump's poll numbers are reflecting, why they are so low, and why Americans believe that, 75 % of Americans believe that his policies are actually responsible for the high cost of living, which, as you know very well, is the number one issue facing families.

30:46Do you disagree? I mean, whether or not you agree with him on the reflecting pool or the ballroom, do you disagree that the president sometimes seems distracted on things that are not about improving daily lives for the American people? Well, I certainly agree that that's the number one issue out there. You know, the pocketbook issues, the affordability, the gas prices, those have to be addressed. President Trump is trying to figure out answers to that as well. Well, hopefully the Iran war is not going to be long term and you'll see those prices go down. But I also think it's just amazing and almost impressive that he can do so many things at the same time.

31:24And it surprises me that he focuses on a reflecting pool on a half a dozen different issues. But he has that broad interest. And I want him obviously focused on the meeting with President Xi that's coming up. Sure. I think that's where his mind is now. But clearly, he wants to make America proud of our country, our nation's capital. And that's a big focus of what he's doing. Marie, are you happy with what the Democrats are presenting as an alternative? Because honestly, like, I remember when Pelosi led the charge to take back the House in 2006 and 2018. And both times there were, like, catchy phrases and, like, 10 for this, you know, whatever.

32:09I don't remember. The agenda, right? There were agendas. Here are the four things we're doing. Not unlike the Contract for America in 1994. Here are the 10 things we're going to do, et cetera. I don't know what the Democrats are running on other than Donald Trump, everything you just said, which is here are all the things Trump's doing wrong. But is there a positive agenda that I'm missing? There is. And I do think that it needs to be highlighted more often. And what you're seeing is, or where you're seeing it, Jake, is in the very specific campaigns that are running. And that's why you are seeing Democrats have been winning special elections and elections in general.

32:46because they are speaking to those issues that their voters care about. They are focused on alternatives, on how to bring down costs. They are focused on how to protect communities that feel attacked by ICE. And they are shining the light on all of these other things that Trump is doing because, Governor, you're right, he is doing a lot. But you know what he's not doing? He's not focused on Americans' financial situations. In fact, he said, and I quote, I'm not worried and I'm not thinking about Americans' financial situations. So Democrats are going to continue to shine a light on that. Well, of course, he's worried about Iran having a nuclear weapon, and that's what he's trying to address.

33:27He does have to take care of the challenge we have with the Strait of Hormuz and make sure the oil will be able to flow through there to get the prices down. That's a challenge he has to face. But he's dealing with a serious issue there, And he's trying to address the affordability issue as well, whether it's reducing the gas tax, which might not get through Congress. But he's obviously by expressing his concern on that and looking for solutions, he understands that Americans are hurting right now. But if you're going to win in November, you've got to address those local issues. Affordability and Republicans have to be in a better position in November.

34:08Speaking of elections, there are a lot of Republicans who were 2020 election deniers who are strong contenders to become governors. They include Mike Lindell in Minnesota, Arizona Congressman Andy Biggs, George Lieutenant Governor Bert Jones. We have a little map there of a bunch of them. What does this tell you about the state of the Republican Party and Trump's grip on the party? because some of them are actually the fact that if they emerge as the nominees, probably going to hurt the Republican Party's ability to win those seats, not in Georgia per se, but certainly in Minnesota. Well, I know who won the 2020 election, but that is almost ancient history compared to the challenges of affordability that we see today.

34:53And you have these gubernatorial candidates. If they're going to win, they're not going to address 2020. That's in the rearview mirror. They're going to be talking about the issues that are important for governors to get elected. And that's who's going to win the primaries, and that's what they're going to have to do whenever they run in November. Governors, I bid one, you have to be a problem solver. My governors talk about maternal health care on national news addressing that issue, talking about the affordability, lowering taxes, helping the economy go forward. That's how you win as governor, and I think that's what you're going to see.

35:28Are you worried? Because if any of these people win, and many of them could, they will be in the governor's mansions for the 2028 election. Very worried. And Democrats need to be very worried about it. And Americans need to be very worried about it, which is why, you know this very well, campaigns for governors are so important. And I think that Democrats are going to continue to focus on this because exactly what you said, Jake, if they win come 2028, they're going to have so much power over what happens in the electoral process. Those two candidates that you mentioned, Jones and Biggs, were part of the electoral, the fake electoral scheme of 2020.

36:13And that's of huge concern and it should continue to be for Americans. In terms of 2028, Vice President Vance was asked about his ambitions in 2028. Take a listen. Oh, man. What I think is there are a few topics that I want to talk about less than what office I'm going to run for years down the road. What do you think of Vance's chances? Do you think he's the best chance Republicans have to hold the White House? I think he's marginally ahead right now at this point, but there's so much time left. I think Marco Rubio is in a very good position as well. They both want to suppress this entire conversation.

36:56Obviously, after the elections this November, it will start in earnest. It is unavoidable, and it will be unavoidable for them. I think this will be wide open on the Republican side. I don't think you're going to see a repeat of the same direction of the Republican Party as we've taken in the last three elections. Yeah, three election cycles. Very quickly, one word. Who would you rather run against in the Republican Party? Who is your least favorite? I think Democrats want to run against J.D. Vance because he is less liked, if that's possible, than Donald Trump. All right. Thanks, everyone. Today in Italy, Princess Catherine is making her first overseas trip since her cancer diagnosis.

37:39The greeting and what the palace is saying about her recovery. Royal correspondent Max Foster is traveling with the princess, and we're going to go to him next.

37:54In our world lead, Princess of Wales, Catherine, is conducting her first ceremonial visit in years right now. Her trip to Reggio Emilia, Italy, marks her first overseas royal visit since being diagnosed with cancer more than two years ago. CNN's Max Foster is in Italy where he got an up-close look at the princess's recovery journey.

38:16Chants echoing of chow-kate as the princess starts her comeback tour in northern Italy. Her first official overseas trip since undergoing cancer treatment. thousands cramming into the piazza at reggio emilia to welcome her princess greeting all the well wishes that turned out here in italy a princess coming to town doesn't happen every day so much excitement about that uh she has been in recovery of course from her cancer treatment so this is a huge moment for her the palace saying she's trying to balance her public work with her recovery there's been a nonna to meet her what was your reaction when she came over oh she's amazing I can't believe it's my eyes.

38:59The princess is here to learn about the internationally recognized Reggio Approach, a philosophy of early childhood education built around creativity, relationships and hands-on discovery. What did you just talk about with the princess? I talk about Reggio Emilia Approach. I talk about our integrative, inclusive public system. Palace aides described this trip as an important step in the princess's recovery journey, adding that she takes great joy from this work. The visit also marks Catherine's first official trip to Italy, a country she previously spent time in before university, though she admitted she needed to do work on her Italian.

39:41And the way she has approached the city and the experience shows a real interest, not just something, a facade, but something deep, which is incredible. The princess believes early learning should be creative and prioritised in the same way as climate change. She wants to point people to the importance of those first five years and to work with others to make this a truly global, urgent issue. So it's on the par with climate because unless we tackle this properly, we'll always be playing catch up. This is a global mission for someone coming back to the world stage with renewed vigour after a life-changing health event.

40:24so jake i've been reporting on kate actually since 2011 when she joined the royal family she wasn't always comfortable with this spotlight that she lives in but i have to say i've never seen her as energized as she was today which is extraordinary considering what she's been through she's still recovering but i think she's actually just found an issue that she wants to spotlight she can spotlight and she genuinely thinks that in those early years when the brain is forming, you can resolve so many issues later on. This all comes, all really started when she's found out about addiction and you can solve addiction if you don't have the problems early on.

40:58So it's been quite interesting to see her evolve. All right, Max Foster in Italy. Thanks so much. Welcome to The Lead. I'm Jake Tapper. This hour, a legal shocker, a court overturning the murder convictions of Alec Murdoch, the South Carolina lawyer found guilty of killing his wife and son. How soon could a new trial happen? Plus, former President Obama jumping into the political fray in Texas, backing the U.S. Senate candidate, whom Democrats say could flip the state. Could the big name finally drag the current president, Donald Trump, into that race? Also, Cindy McCain will be here on the lead.

41:34The urgent plea she needs you to hear about the food supply around the world as she prepares to leave the world food program. But first, incredible insights into what life was like aboard that cruise ship as passengers learn of an outbreak of Hantavirus.

41:57We'll meet tonight an inside look at life on board and right now for passengers of the MV Hondias cruise ship amid the deadly Hantavirus outbreak. In moments, you're going to hear some fascinating new details of what it was like on board that ship as things got worse and worse. Here in the U.S., Dr. Stephen Kornfeld is now identified as the passenger inside the biocontainment unit at the University of Nebraska Medical Center. He revealed more about the possible spread on the ship last night to CNN's Aaron Burnett. Early in April, maybe the 10th or so, a number of us on board came down with what felt like a flu-like illness or the ship's flu.

42:37Now, in retrospect, there is a question, could it have been hot to virus? The CDC now says Kornfeld's case is considered inconclusive after he tested positive and then negative. There are no new confirmed cases as of now, according to updates from the World Health Organization and the CDC today. Eleven individuals have tested positive, including the three passengers who unfortunately died last month. The CDC encourages 15 other passengers from the U.S. to remain at the University of Nebraska's National Quarantine Unit for the next six weeks. Two other passengers are at Emory University Hospital in Georgia.

43:15One is symptomatic, but is testing negative. The other, a close contact of the other one, is not showing any symptoms. Dr. Jodi Guest from Emory University's Department of Epidemiology joins me now. Dr. Guest, no new cases reported today. What's your reaction? Yeah, that is great news. I don't know that we can count on that being consistent every day from here on out, given the long incubation period, but we'll take it for today. What do you make of the development that the mildly positive case in the U.S., the passenger in the Nebraska biocontainment unit, Dr. Stephen Kornfeld, is now being called inconclusive because officials are waiting more test results for him.

43:56He tested positive, then he tested negative. Yeah, all tests can have a certain number of false positives or even false negatives. It also is about when you're tested in your viral syndrome period. And so we really don't have a lot of information on that, but we do know that tests can be inaccurate, and that is why we do repeat tests. So at the moment, we don't really know the status of that patient. Is there anything you can share with us about the current status of the two individuals being monitored at Emory University Hospital? I cannot. I'm not part of their care team, but I can tell you that the care team at Emory is excellent and well-trained for this and a great place to be in a situation like this.

44:39Meanwhile, across the U.S., health officials are monitoring other individuals who may have been exposed, either from being on the cruise or being on international flights with passengers. This is taking place in nine states. The CDC says anyone who has been exposed is being encouraged to take a PCR test. Is a PCR test for Hantavirus similar to one for COVID-19? It is. It's the same kind of test, but it's very specific to the Hantavirus. How many times would you recommend an exposed individual be tested over the next six weeks? The incubation period is 42 days and the testing is actually still research testing is not available clinically anywhere in the world.

45:23So there are only specialty units that can do it. And they are creating the protocols to follow these groups of individuals. We've not seen this many people need to be tested in quite some time. And so coronavirus experts will be dealing with how often they will get their PCR tests. Do you have any idea, just as a rough estimate, would it be daily? Would it be weekly? What kind of testing protocol are we talking about? It won't be that often. And most important will be the symptom tracking. We are looking multiple times a day at each one of those individuals that are under suspicion or isolation or containment in a quarantine zone to see if they have any onset of symptoms.

46:05That will be a very fast turnover to want to get a test after they distribute, show any level of symptoms. But at the moment, the good news is none of them are showing them. They're all asymptomatic. For some of the individuals being monitored by state health departments for possible exposure, nothing conclusive, not talking about the people in Nebraska or at Emory, what is likely their isolation guidance, given they likely don't have negative air pressure or the other conditions that the hospitals do? Should they just live their lives as they normally would? No, they're under quarantine and they are in contact with state and local health departments.

46:43And that quarantine looks like multiple times a day, taking your temperature and talking to someone through telehealth and tracking your onset of symptoms, if you have any, or the lack of symptoms, which again, all of them are currently displaying, and making sure that you're not going out in the public and being in close contact with anyone other than those who are maybe isolating in the home with you. All right, Dr. Jodi Guest, thank you so much for your time. We appreciate it. A scientist aboard the cruise, the MV Hondias, was messaging a writer from the New Yorker with details about the outbreak as it was unfolding in real time, like the reaction when the captain first made the announcement that would change everything.

47:30The passenger had died. Quote, we're literally in the middle of the South Atlantic as far from land as possible, the scientist wrote at the time. It's really an unfortunate place to die. The only logical place to go is Tristan de Conha, which is about two and a half days away. Everybody thinks this man had a heart attack or some preexisting condition. Nobody thought this was an infectious disease. Joining us now is the writer who turned all these messages into a fascinating piece to the New Yorker, Akash Kapoor. Akash, what was your reaction when the scientists first told you about the first death and then the subsequent deaths?

48:11yeah um i mean it was a real drip drip drip of news coming out there um and i think it's important to realize that it wasn't until very late that they realized that this was you know actually hantavirus um and and part of the part of what he told me is he's been on these types of expeditions before he says it's very normal to have bugs and for people to be sick and so they were i mean you know they're noticing that more and more people are getting sick um but they they just had no idea that it was anything serious. And then at a certain point, you know, I think it's the third patient gets tested in, I believe it was Johannesburg, and the message comes back that it's hantavirus, and then everything just changes on the ship.

48:50Yeah, it was just an absolutely fascinating story. The one gentleman dies, and they think it's horrible, but people die. It happens to all of us. Then his wife dies, and he writes about broken heart syndrome, and then the third person gets it. He told you on May 2nd after the third death and another person on the ship with symptoms, there's finally this announcement that it's a Hantavirus outbreak. The scientist said, quote, all of us look up Hanta and realize this has up to a 40 % death rate. People really sober up, but there's no panic. Everyone has masks and stays away from each other, but it's not like you hear cries in the corner or everybody keeps saying, we are literally in the same boat, gallows humor, unquote.

49:35It seems like the reality of the situation, however, didn't sink in until later. Was that the case? Yeah, I mean, I think, you know, one thing I noticed is as I was messaging and speaking with him, the mood, I mean, you know, the mood was even after they found out it was hantavirus. They weren't panicking. They were distancing. They were masking. They were isolating. There was not a huge amount of, I mean, I don't want to underplay it, but there wasn't a huge amount of anxiety and stress at that point. Partly they have doctors on board from the WHO and other places telling them, look, you know, this is a heart disease to get.

50:13The mood in my experience with them really changed actually when they get to the Canary Islands and Tenerife, and then they start seeing all the press crew outside, and they start realizing that this has become a bit of a political thing, that the evacuation itself is controversial. So that was the first sort of sign of anxiety that I heard in his voice. The scientist messaged you this while on the runway in Tenerife, quote, this is the most historic thing I have experienced. It is not a history I want to be a part of, but we have no choice, unquote. Have you been able to speak with the scientist since he returned to his home country about how he is feeling about everything and about another stretch of quarantine?

50:56Yeah, I have been in touch with him. And, you know, we have to fact check the piece for The New Yorker as well. And so we have been in touch. And I mean, you know, he's dealing with he tested negative and he's watching this play out. He's dealing with what he's going to be in quarantine. He's going to be in isolation. I think that the feeling is, you know, we're still watching this thing play out. Let's see where it goes. He very much keeps emphasizing how professional the crew was and how well the crew handled it. And he sort of wants that message out there. But yeah, for the moment, he's kind of watching it like we all are, except that he's in isolation and has had a negative test, which is a good thing.

51:35Well, it's a fascinating story. You can read on newyorker.com or at the New Yorker if you get the magazine Akash Kapoor. Thank you so much for your time. Appreciate it. Thanks. Next, the shocking ruling today from the South Carolina Supreme Court, why Alec Murdoch, convicted of killing his wife and his son, will get a new trial. And the, quote, anti-Semitic diatribe, unquote, that a Republican lawmaker says was hurled at him from the adult son of Senator Rand Paul.

52:07In our Law and Justice League, today in Utah, a judge sentenced Corey Richens to life in prison without parole. The mother of three convicted of fatally poisoning her husband in 2022, then writing a children's book about grief. I mean, that is just too much. Richens also was found guilty of insurance fraud and attempted aggravated murder. for a previous unsuccessful attempt to kill her husband. The judge today said, quote, a person convicted of those things is simply too dangerous to ever be free. Also in our Law and Justice lead, a stunning decision today in South Carolina may set the stage for a sequel to that popular Hulu drama.

52:44I would never hurt Maggie Murdoch. I would never hurt Paul Murdoch under any circumstances. Say that. But you lied to Maggie, didn't you? Yes, I did lie to her. You lied to Paul.

53:05Yes. So a scene there from season one of Hulu's Murdoch, Death in the Family. But today, South Carolina's top court overturned the murder convictions of Alec Murdoch and ordered a new trial. Prosecutors say Murdoch killed his wife and son in 2021. Today, the court found, quote, shocking jury interference by a court clerk who oversaw jurors in the 2023 trial. Here now is CNN chief legal analyst and author and my friend, Laura Coates. Thank you so much for being here. So I know you followed every twist of the case. First of all, was there a jury interference? Was this the right call by forgetting his guilt or innocence or whatever?

53:47Was this the right call by the South Carolina Supreme Court? Well, yes, because they say this is not really about guilty or innocence. They're not actually looking at that. They want everyone to have, as is your right in the Constitution, an impartial jury. But someone has their thumbs on the scale, or in this case, the fingers, somebody who's in charge of logistics, somebody who is working with the jurors, and even the person who read the actual guilty verdict is saying things to you as you go out as a jury, hey, watch his body language and don't fall for it. Don't be fooled by what he's saying.

54:14That might have an undue influence. And by the way, she also resigned from her position. She wrote a book. They said that she was using government resources and beyond to promote it in other ways. And so somebody without credibility was hoping to capitalize on something that is supposed to be part of our civic duty. So you're talking about the clerk of the court, Rebecca Hill, and the judge's opinion notes that Hill placed her fingers on the scales of justice. Yes. Not just a thumb, thereby denying Murdoch his right to a fair trial. Now, since his conviction, the Murdoch murders have been the subject of over 10 books, one a New York Times bestseller, that streaming TV miniseries on Hulu, a Netflix docuseries.

54:54Is it even possible at this point to find an impartial jury for a retrial? The prosecution hopes so because they're going to retry this case. Double Jeopardy has not attached in the way you normally would think. I've already tried you for this. I have an outcome. I can't touch it again. this was appellate reasons to bring it back down and so they want there to be an impartial jury but it's not somebody who's never heard of the case it's not about the notoriety it's about whether somebody can follow the instructions the court will give about how to evaluate the evidence how to assess the various claims and the evidence are going to bring back again Jake are largely the same you're gonna have data about ballistics you're gonna have data about phone technology you're gonna have his shifting stories and beyond but here is why it's harder for the prosecution this time around the element of surprise is gone.

55:39I've had to give you my entire trial. I would be furious as the prosecution, not because I did anything wrong, but because my clerk somehow wanted to write a book about something that I got to try a six-week trial again. And this time I got fading memories. This time you have the defense team who knows every single thing I'm going to do and can compare the last trial transcripts to whatever they're going to say next time. It's a harder case. Yeah, I was going to say, is there anything that you think that the defense will have a leg up on because they know exactly the case that the prosecution is going to bring?

56:11All of that, plus the Supreme Court in South Carolina also said it wasn't just the clerk. It was also the use of so much financial crimes evidence that they felt was overly prejudicial and the trial jury should have limited the amount that they could have actually seen through the judge. This time around now, the defense can say, okay, well, I know that the prosecution before wanted to say that the motive was financial, There was a gathering storm and he had to kill these two people because of what was ahead financially for embezzlement and other things. Now I know they can't use all of that. So now I can sort of erode those sort of motive based evidentiary claims.

56:48So I've got a leg up there. But still, he's always professed his innocence. He said it does not make sense that I had a gathering storm ahead. That's why I killed my wife and son. He says I'm innocent. But don't expect him to walk free anytime soon, because even though this is a retrial and somebody who has, because they're returned, he's still serving time for those financial crimes. And that's decades long. Okay. Lara Coates, fascinating stuff. And don't forget to join Lara on her show, Lara Coates Live. It's tonight and every weeknight at 11 p.m. Eastern, right here on CNN. Coming up on the lead, a Republican senator for America's heartland on the soaring cost of gas and diesel in his state.

57:31Intermoney lead yet another sign that the war with Iran is having a huge hit on the American economy. Today's wholesale inflation report for American businesses jumped to the highest rate in nearly four years. It's now 6%. This means consumers could be hit with higher prices at a time when inflation is already eroding Americans' paychecks. The Iran war is also causing a surging price for diesel, a crucial fuel for the U.S. economy. The average price of diesel is now the highest it's ever been in four Midwestern states, Michigan, Illinois, Indiana, and Wisconsin. Diesel, of course, a crucial fuel for the American economy.

58:06It powers tractors, trucks, buses, boats, trains. Republican Senator Ron Johnson of Wisconsin joins us now to discuss this and other issues. Senator, diesel is up 82 percent in Wisconsin from a year ago, 82 percent, now 587 a gallon. realistically, can farmers in Wisconsin and those who rely on diesel tolerate these prices and still make a profit this year? It's going to be tough. I'll just remind your viewers that in June of 2022, because of Democrat policies, their war on fossil fuel, average gasoline prices nationwide were$5 a gallon. The reason they're high now is because President Trump made a very difficult decision to make sure that Iran would never become a nuclear power.

58:45If you want to see a ruined economy, let the Ayatollahs have a nuclear weapon, put it on a missile, on a barge off of our shore, throw it up, launch it over our country, explode in the atmosphere, have an EMP event, and wipe out our electrical grid. That is the existential threat that those crazy, evil Ayatollahs represented to us, and Trump finally took care of it. Every president said there couldn't be nuclear power. Trump decided to make sure that didn't happen. Again, not easy. There's no guarantee here. But I, for one, support him ending that war for all time. Well, I don't know when it's going to end.

59:24And meanwhile, so many Americans are so worried about their financial situations. I understand your argument about a hypothetical, theoretical nuclear armed Iran. But American consumers are not feeling that excuse is sufficient for their hardship, as I'm sure you hear all the time from your voters. Some of them told us, quote, my life is not affordable. No one cares. Another one said it's more expensive to exist. Another said you're just staying afloat instead of getting ahead. Another said it should not be like this. Now, before Trump left for China, a reporter asked him, what was the extent to which Americans' financial hardships was motivating him to make a deal with Iran?

1:00:01Take a listen to what he said. The only thing that matters when I'm talking about Iran, they can't have a nuclear weapon. I don't think about Americans' financial situation. I don't think about anybody. I think about one thing. We cannot let Iran have a nuclear weapon. Now, I understand the president's not just thinking about the nuclear weapon, but do you think America's financial situation should play more of a role when it comes to his decision to end this war? No. No, I don't. Again, I believe, I've always believed that Iran posed an existential threat to America if it became a nuclear power.

1:00:39The fact that they won't even give up their nuclear ambitions now after we bomb the you-know-what out of them just underscores the point that you cannot trust these people. All that Iran had to do to have us leave them alone is just stop enriching uranium, turn over their stocks, and vow to become a nuclear power. They wouldn't do that. They're still not doing that. So no, I understand the pain. I'd be interested to see how many stories you held back in June of 2022 about the pain of$5 a gallon of gasoline. But set that aside. I appreciate President Trump's leadership here. This is a tough decision.

1:01:12It was not going to be easy, but imagine what the world's going to look like if we could put the ayatollahs on the dustbin of history. I mean, the positive impact on world peace and the Mideast region is going to be stabilized for generations. I, for one, am hoping President Trump succeeds, and I don't want to in any way, shape, or form dissuade him from finishing the job. That would be the worst thing is declare a false peace and have the I told us, we mean there's a menace, you know, being able to hold the Strait of Hormuz hostage. We can't allow that to happen. So we have to finish the job.

1:01:45We covered inflation during the Biden years quite a bit. Let's let's turn to another subject I know you want to talk about during a Senate hearing earlier today. You heard from a CIA whistleblower who accused intelligence officials and specifically Dr. Anthony Fauci of downplaying the possibility that the origins of COVID came from a Chinese lab. Dr. Fauci declined to comment when we reached out to him to respond to the hearing you held. But I think it's fair to say that the most objective assessment of the situation is that there continue to be highly respected evolutionary biologists reporting in respected peer-reviewed journals who suggest, though nothing's proven, that they continue to think it was a natural spillover from an animal reservoir.

1:02:27Now, I might disagree, you might disagree, but it seems like there's still lots of opinions, but no definitive proof one way or the other. A CIA spokesperson called this hearing nothing more than dishonest political theater, and that the CIA had already assessed COVID-19 most likely originated from a lab leak. Efforts to undermine that conclusion are disingenuous. So this is Trump CIA saying this. What was your reaction to that? Well, first of all, what we learned, we already knew or certainly suspected, but it just confirmed what we knew or suspected. You go back to the end of January, early February, when you see Fauci assembling this group of people who are probably still saying, well, this might have sprung from nature.

1:03:06They're all people he'd given millions and millions of dollars of grants to, and those are the same people he assembled in the center of the CIA. But I'll tell you the story I really want you to cover. I sent you this report just as I was standing here. It's the major scandal we uncovered in my committee two weeks ago about how the FDA on March 1st, 2021, knew that their safety surveillance system was going to hide and mask serious safety signals on serious adverse events. 26 days later, they were shown the safety signals on things like sudden cardiac death, pulmonary infarction, bells, palsy, other types of strokes.

1:03:45They continued to use the system that they knew hid these signals. That's what you ought to have me on. The mainstream media is completely covering this up. I'm calling out the mainstream media. Start covering this major, major scandal. Senator, I mean, I see you sent this to me at 622. No, I'm not. I'm saying have me on in the future. You know, I was invited on last week. I sent it. The producers canceled it. But not to you. Not to you. To somebody else on CNN. But not ABC, not NBC, not CBS. Yes, none of the major news stories are covering this major scandal. I'm giving you an opportunity to be the lead on CNN.

1:04:23Cover this. Read that report. Read that report and have me back on. All right. Well, I'll read the report. But like I said, you just sent it to me. Oh, I read. I'm not going to be rude to my desk. You. Not blaming at all. And read your text message during the interview. But Republicans said. I'm not blaming you. I realize it. I'm just asking you to have me back on. All right. Well, I'm sure we will. We have you on quite often. And we'll have you on again. Republican Senator Ron Johnson of the great state of Wisconsin. Thank you, sir. Appreciate it. Take care. Cindy McCain is coming up next for urgent plea about the world's food supply and how it's directly impacted by the war with Iran.

1:05:03In our world lead with the continued blockage of the Strait of Hormuz by the Iranians, the global food supply is under tremendous pressure. About a third of the world's fertilizer needed to grow crops, of course, passes through that waterway. According to the United Nations World Food Program, the fallout from the Iran war could push 45 million additional people into hunger, hitting Africa and Asia the hardest. Here to discuss is the executive director of the World Food Program, Cindy McCain. Cindy, it's so good to see you. Thank you so much for being here. So the World Food Program, your organization forecast that if this conflict doesn't end by next month, by June, and we're now in May, the millions of people far beyond the front lines are going to face hunger.

1:05:47Two-thirds of those people being in either Asia or Africa. How is the World Food Program preparing? Because honestly, frankly, that looks likely. Well, our estimates would be about 45 million more people will be in severe hunger status. We do exactly what we do. This is our job. We prepare. We have people on the ground. We have people in various parts where we're trying to figure out not just when this occurs, but where the flow of people will go also, because that's the other element of this, where there's no food, they're going to walk. Right. There is a huge migration crisis coming probably.

1:06:25Yeah. It's a huge crisis. Yeah. So the conflict started at a time we're funding for operations at the World Food Program already failing to keep up with the pace of humanitarian needs. So how have you already adjusted for the situation? Well, not just for this situation, but all situations. It was clear to me when I came into WP that we needed to scale down. It was not going to be the kind of money that had been there before. Plus, we were fat. We need to rearrange, realign, do things better, more efficiently. And so that's exactly what we've done. We're through that. We've had to let people go as well.

1:07:02But we're through all of that now, We're a much better run organization. And what we do in the field, we push everything we have to the field so that the field is equipped to do their jobs. Again, it's still not enough right now. Over the last three years, you've led the World Food Program through extraordinary times. You were among the first prominent voices to warn of a full-blown famine in northern Gaza. You have continuously sounded the alarm on the crisis in Sudan. And you've also steered the organization through the deep funding shortfalls that we discussed and honestly, an increasingly dangerous, unpredictable operating environment.

1:07:37What do you hope to see next for the organization? And what do you hope your legacy will be? Well, what I hope to see next is a world beginning to understand the need, not just for WIPP, but aid agencies like ours, and do something about it. help us politically, help us diplomatically so we can get our job done. When you start targeting humanitarian aid workers, which is exactly what's happened, I'm sure you saw what happened just the other day, or one of our trucks was hit by a drone in Ukraine, it's uncomfortable. The respect for humanitarian law is not there. So I'd like to first see the world help us with that, along with all the other things that we need.

1:08:22And my legacy, I guess, would be I tried. I came and I did the very best I could. And this organization is built on the backs of incredible people. And just to be a part of it is really, really amazing. I also just want to note that the effects of the war go beyond food because fuel shortages tied to the war have pushed countries like Sri Lanka and Pakistan to shorten school weeks to conserve energy. What other trends are you seeing out there? Well, with the fuel specifically, WFP in general, what we do is, of course, we bring food in, take it, drive it to where it's supposed to go, fly it to where it's supposed to go, et cetera.

1:09:06Well, right now, we can't do that. And to get it, say, from our ports and where we should be in the Middle East to get food to Afghanistan, for instance, where it normally would take about three weeks, we're having to circumnavigate everything. Now it's taking about three months to get it in there. So it's affecting everything, not just us, but it's affecting everything, and it's pivoting. It's cascading into South America and into the Pacific as well. It's hurting everybody. This is really dangerous. Cindy McCain, thank you for being here, and thank you for what you do. It's just so important, and there are so many people who come behind that desk, and they're not in it for the right reasons, and they're in it for themselves or whatever, and that's never been you.

1:09:49Thank you. I appreciate it very much. Thank you. Appreciate it. Cindy McCain's last day is executive director of the World Food Program. Will be June 1st. Coming up next, the quote, anti-Semitic diatribe, unquote, that a Republican lawmaker says was directed at him from the son, the adult son, of a U.S. senator.

1:10:16I asked him, well, who is my people? And he yelled out Jews. And I asked him, you know, you think I'm Jewish? And he said, yes. I said, well, I'm Irish, Italian, Catholic. And he goes, oh, oh, I'm sorry to accuse you of that, which is just a remarkable statement in and of itself. But he then went on a, you know, roughly 10 minute diatribe about Israel, about Jews. In our politics lead, that's Republican Congressman Mike Lawler of New York earlier today describing some of the anti-Semitic and anti-gay insults he heard and the anti-Semitic ones that he received last night by William Paul, the adult son of Republican Senator Rand Paul of Kentucky.

1:11:03In studio to discuss is our panel. So William Paul, after this was, this was witnessed by a reporter with notice, soon to be the Washington Star and he wrote it all up and Lawler confirmed it all and then after that happened William Paul posted on Twitter last night I had too much to drink and said some things that don't represent who I really am I'm sorry and today I'm seeking help for my drinking problem what's your reaction obviously it's horrible I mean I don't even I can't even believe that this is happening and I think I'm surprised Rand Paul hasn't said anything but maybe he's just trying to like stick back from it but if the son's really in his 30s i mean well no matter what age but i mean he's an adult person that's he's in his 30s yeah yeah i mean this is obviously there's nothing good to say about it it's a horrible thing to say so congressman lawler says i give lawler a lot of credit for coming out and well and also he was also like defending jews and uh he said this speaks to a larger issue with anti-semitism in america today take a listen This is the level of hatred and vitriol, frankly, that some of my Jewish colleagues experience, but many of my constituents experience.

1:12:13I have one of the largest Jewish populations anywhere in the country in my congressional district, and I'm not going to stop standing up for my constituents. So, I mean, we should note, so apparently Rand Paul's son is from the right, But this also, it could have been somebody from the left yelling at Lawler. It wasn't in this case, but we're hearing a lot of this all over the political spectrum. Yeah, we've talked about this on this program before. This is the big difference of where, when I was running campaigns 20 years ago. This is because of social media and all the hate out there in vitriol, whether somebody's had an assassination attempt or whether somebody's stepping to somebody in a bar.

1:12:49Where I grew up, if you stepped to somebody in a bar like that, you'd be hit, not shot. But you wouldn't start by doing this kind of insults around Jewish people. Let me also say this about Lawler. Lawler has a district, and this is smart for him to do this, to stand up, because Lawler's one of those few Republicans that we talk about that's in a district that could swing to the Democrats. I've run a lot of TV commercials against Mueller. Kamala Harris won his district. Yeah. That's what I'm saying. There's very few of these kind of districts, and for him to stand up, Democrats or Republicans don't like to see a bully like this.

1:13:14Let's turn to Texas. Former President Obama down in Texas getting tacos with James Tallarico and Gina Hinojosa. Tallarico running for Senate, Hinojosa running for governor. giving their campaigns a boost as Democrats are trying to turn the lone star state blue, a state, by the way, where Democrats have failed to win statewide race in 30 years, 30 years, which is older than Ashley. Tallarico is running as a Democrat, as I said, for the U.S. Senate. We'll face either Paxton or Cornyn. He knows a challenging habit. Do you think that Democrats actually could win either of these races? Look, I've been one of those folks who've, you know, hollered at fool's gold for a long time.

1:13:56I worked for Ann Richards. I've worked there for 36 years. I grew up in East Texas. I actually work for both of these candidates at some level. And you work for Tallarica right now. And I work for Gina Helmstra right now. Both of them out there. I have a long client list, Ashley. I work for lots of folks. I know. You're very popular. But the real truth here is about, I do work for them, is that something's different. I've done a lot of rallies. You've covered a lot of rallies. We've covered a lot of fundraising in Texas. Very rarely do you see a former president show up at a taco shop. He wasn't doing a rally.

1:14:20He wasn't under having a fundraiser. He was actually showing up old school style and shaking hands, which says a lot about where we are. There's something very different about what's happening now. It's a combination of anxiety with Republicans, with gas prices and other things. But then also Tallarico and Gina being two different kind of candidates that we haven't seen before. And we should note that one of the reasons why, especially if you'll permit to say Tallarico might have a chance, is if Republicans pick Ken Paxton, the embattled and perceived by many voters, including Republicans, as deeply corrupt Attorney General of Texas.

1:14:52How much are you praying for Cornyn to win that nomination? Well, I've known Cornyn for many years, but I'm actually one of the few that say that the opposite, that Paxton actually is going to get the base out. Oh, interesting. doesn't and i'm not i've watched tellarico and i and you've talked to me a lot about him he's different than beto beto beto beto yeah um in regards to when he ran and i think that the countries in a or at least the states in a different way i don't think governor abbott is losing at all um but i think that tellarico has some sort of movement that only paxton can maybe beat not cornyn i don't i just don't think people come out to vote for cornyn but Here's a recent University of Houston poll.

1:15:34It finds a toss-up right now for the two Texas Republicans. Paxton leads Cornyn by three percentage points, which is basically the same as the poll's margin of error. Seven percent still unsure how they're going to vote. Actually, there's seven percent still there. That means, well, let me go to you on this. That means Trump's endorsement could have a huge impact. He's been saying for a while he's going to weigh in and whoever he doesn't endorse needs to drop out. We're getting past the point of that even being a possibility. We've covered that this week with these Indiana primaries. It means something in a Republican primary if nowhere else.

1:16:03It does mean something. And this election's happening in two weeks in the middle of nothing right after Memorial Day when nobody's going to vote. Nobody but the base. This is the point that Ashley makes. It's really smart. It's like Paxkin can really turn people out from the base of, if nobody else, the base of the base. That's why I think that he's the one positioned to win this. Yeah, but what about those Houston moms when it comes to November? You're not worried about? I don't know, but are they really going to come out and vote that day? or is Tallarico going to have such a groundswell of people?

1:16:32I mean, there's excitement behind him, which this midterm election is all about getting people out to vote. All right, thanks to both of you. Great to have you. A man who spent nearly nine months in ICE detention centers, forced to surrender despite winning his immigration case. How the determination of supporters changed what looked like a dire situation. That's next.

1:16:56In our national lead alligator Alcatraz, Florida's controversial detention center in the Everglades is expected to shut down this summer, sourced LCNN, after a year of legal challenges, high costs and allegations of inhumane conditions. CNN's Danny Freeman sat down with one man who spent months in ICE custody, including a stay at Alligator Aquitras. He's just returned home to Pennsylvania thanks to his community rallying for his release. In a quiet suburb of Philadelphia, signs like these have dotted lawns for months. A plea from a close-knit community, bring Carlos home. When you're inside, there's really not much you can do other than endure, be strong.

1:17:41This is Carlos De La Valle. He's been living in Downingtown, Pennsylvania for nearly two decades, working, raising a family with a U.S. citizen wife and a U.S. citizen son now in college. But for years, Carlos had a secret. The Mexican national says he crossed the border illegally back in 1997 when he was just 20 years old, fleeing violence in his home country. If I had known what I was doing at that moment, I probably would have never done it. Carlos fell in love with his wife, Angela, and said the two consulted with immigration attorneys to get him legal status once they were married in 2002.

1:18:17but they say the advice they got was wait for Congress to pass laws helping mixed-status families. When we got together, we had no idea that there was not going to be a pathway for us. They did say, stay out of trouble, don't do anything that you might regret later, and that's what I've been doing personally. But in 2024, during the final days of the Biden administration, his luck ran out. On Christmas Day, while on vacation with his family in the U.S. Virgin Islands, Carlos was stopped at the airport in St. Thomas. He was told he had a final order of removal and was charged with illegal re-entry.

1:18:54His trial was set for the following August during the first year of the new, more hardline Trump administration. Did you have a sense that it might become harder in the next administration? They actually said it right there. Someone mentioned something to her like, oh, you know, We're in the process of changing the way we do things. His community rallied. Family and neighbors from Pennsylvania wrote letters, and some even flew to St. Thomas to advocate for him in open court. Carlos was found not guilty, but DHS still detained him because he still lacked status. Come on. For the next nearly nine months, Carlos was in custody, shuttled between ICE detention centers all throughout the South, including the infamous alligator Alcatraz in the Florida Everglades.

1:19:43Whatever anybody has seen on TV is true. You are in cages. It's like tents and eight cages per tent, you know, and 32 people in each cage and, I mean, no privacy. All the while, his wife Angela followed. How have the past nine months been for you? They've been the hardest days of my whole life. Every day felt like a year. I was worried about my body, not my mind. I believe I got all the strength from the people outside fighting for me. Back in Downingtown, support and awareness grew. Neighbors started raising money. The local church held rallies. Politicians took notice. And then, without explanation, after more than 250 days of detention, Carlos was released.

1:20:36He arrived home last week. You did it. All I wanted to do was hug people. And that's really all I did. Carlos means everything to this community. We are a community of good neighbors here. It has restored my faith in who we are as Americans. Just because I wasn't born in this country doesn't mean that I don't love this country. Danny Freeman, CNN, Downingtown, Pennsylvania.

1:21:36The Lead CNN. If you ever miss an episode of The Lead, you can watch the show on the CNN app. Our good friend Erin Burnett and her show Erin Burnett Out Front starts now.

1:21:51I'm Daniel Dae Kim. I'm going to South Korea to figure out how this small nation conquered the world with its culture. Join me and meet the artists and creators behind the phenomenon. K-Everything, now streaming on the CNN app. Influential journalist Kara Swisher is taking a hard look at the longevity industry. There's so much bad information that the really good information gets drowned. The new CNN original series, Kara Swisher Wants to Live Forever. Now streaming on the CNN app.