Sheriff’s Dept: Nearly 18,000 Calls Since Guthrie Disappeared

27:14The leader of the Senate, Republican Majority Leader John Thune of South Dakota, He just told CNN that he does not think that you and your fellow five Democratic lawmakers should have faced prosecution. But he blamed you and your colleagues for bad actions. What's your response? Well, my response is they need to actually remind themselves what the United States Congress exists for. We are here to serve as an oversight and a check on the presidency. We are here to make sure people follow the law. And as a combat veteran, now a member of Congress, I know that I have no higher sacred obligation to make sure I'm protecting service members, that I have their back.

27:56That is the message of our video, is that your obligation is to the Constitution and to the rule of law, not to any one man, not to any one president, but to follow the law and the Constitution. And we have a president that continues to threaten to use our military in unlawful ways, whether it's shooting protesters in Lafayette Square, going to war with the city of Chicago, sending troops to polling stations, which he's repeatedly threatened to do, which is against U.S. criminal law, or even on occasions threatening to kill the children and family members of terrorists, which would be a violation of the Geneva Conventions and would be murder.

28:30So if he does any one of those things, we will have people's back if they do the right thing. Congressman Jason Crow, Democrat of Colorado, thanks so much. Appreciate it. One Epstein survivor who was at today's hearing is going to join us next to hear her take on what was answered, how it was answered, what was left unsaid. That's next.

29:10Just use the tax app for all cases. Yes, and she also answers questions. 24-7 and without a German. That's just the app that understands us. Tax done with Visa. Now try it out for free.

29:40on Attorney General Pam Bondi's rather contentious House Judiciary Committee hearing earlier today, specifically on how the department is handling the release of the Jeffrey Epstein files and her response to criticism from Democrats. Here now we want to bring in people who have skin in the game. Danielle Benske, she's an Epstein survivor, victimized when she was just 17 years old. Also with us, Lauren Hirsch, who's National Director at World Without Exploitation. Both were in the room for today's hearing with Attorney General Bondi. So, Danielle, that was a tense and combative hearing. And let me start with the question we ask.

30:16We start with every time. How are you? That must have been unpleasant to be part of and also unpleasant to have your suffering be a political football. Yeah, it's exhausting. I mean, we've said so many times that this is not a political game for us, that we are human first. And I think the complete lack of empathy that she showed for not just Epstein and Maxwell survivors, but for survivors as a whole, was really disgraceful. She had multiple moments where she could have turned around and just acknowledged the fact that we were there and the fact that we are human. And she just chose not to. So early in the hearing, Democratic Congresswoman Pramila Jayapal asked you and your fellow survivors, your sister survivors, to stand.

31:06We're going to show that moment right now. She also asked the attorney general to turn and to apologize to you and the other survivors. Instead of that, there was a heated exchange that took place. The attorney general said she wasn't going to, quote, get into the gutter or she wasn't going to do theatrics. What was it like standing in the back of that room while that all took place? I mean, I'm sure we all had, you know, tons of different feelings. Survivors are not a monolith, but for me it was pure rage. And the rage comes out in ways that you, like, I could feel myself shaking with anger and frustration because it's bad enough that the redaction process was what it was.

31:46I feel like we've been re-victimized over and over again. But she also is just gaslighting the American people over and over by not answering direct questions. And so it's just another moment where our humanity was just not even considered. In her opening remarks, Attorney General Bondi did say this to survivors. I want to play this. Take a listen. I have spent my entire career fighting for victims, and I will continue to do so. I am deeply sorry for what any victim, any victim has been through, especially as a result of that monster. I want you to know that any accusations of criminal wrongdoing will be taken seriously and investigated.

32:36Laura, what's your response to that line? Let's get those investigations going. The files are clear. We're seeing so much evidence and so many investigative leads. And now it's on the DOJ to do their job and investigate those leads. Yeah. Danielle, Congressman Lou Correa of California also asked you and your fellow survivors to stand up. Take a listen to what he also had to say. Can you please raise your hand if you think after everything you've heard today, you feel that AG, the feds, have your back. Do we have your back? Danielle, not a single person raised their hand. Not a person, single person, not a single one of you guys, one of you survivors, thought that she had your back.

33:27What message do you think that sends to other victims of sexual abuse out there? Yeah, there's been a chilling effect. I think even through this process, you've seen the redactions be what they are. And I think that it is trying to silence survivors. Yeah. So it just feels I don't you know, it just feels terrible, to be honest with you. But I do want to go back to an earlier point. She did say something about investigations. Right. And so we this is the first any of us have heard about any sort of investigations whatsoever. Like none of us have spoken to the DOJ. I think we've all lost faith in the DOJ, to be honest.

34:09But these investigations that she was talking about, OK, we need the when, the where, the why, the how. Like, we want to know more about that. So let's talk about it. Right. Yeah. On that matter of investigations, the committee's top Democrat, Jamie Raskin of Maryland, asked Attorney General Bondi if she'd be willing to create a joint task force with the state attorneys generals out there to investigate the crimes that have taken place. But instead of answering that question or others, this is what she had to say. He called Chase Mulligan a wild goose chase and didn't even know who he was. He is a defendant in your own district who preyed on girls.

34:52Mr. Chairman. Well, you know what? If he were part of the APSY investigation, you wouldn't do anything about it. So Chase Mulligan, I guess, is a defendant in a completely separate issue. And if he committed crimes, obviously the full force of the law should be brought against him. but he's not relevant per se to the Epstein investigation. Lauren, what was your response to that? I mean, we saw a lot of that today, Jake. We saw a lot of non-response. We saw a lot of we want to talk about one thing and then Attorney General Bondi goes in a totally different direction. We came in and the survivors came in with the hope that we could have a serious conversation to ultimately get to the truth and get to justice.

35:36and what we got was just a lot of nonsense. It's really time for a course correction for the DOJ, and we've got to start getting questions answered, and we've got to start getting these investigations started. And just to reiterate this, Danny, if all the parties were reversed in this, and it was the Democrats who were giving the answers, the Democratic Attorney General and all that, Republicans asking the tough questions, You would be here right now saying the same stuff, right? This has nothing to do with political affiliation. It's never been about political affiliation. And in fact, we're taking all of these meetings with both parties, with both sides.

36:18And we've spoken to so many congressional leaders on the Republican side where these meetings have gone so well. They're really lovely and really receptive. And then we walk out and there's no action taken. So I think on the part of survivors, that's where we're getting so frustrated, right? is that there's this total disconnect that keeps happening where we take a meeting, they say, we're on your side, we shake your hand, we're here for you. And then we go to the press conference this morning where we were hoping that so many Republicans would stand in solidarity with us as well. And we had one Republican show up.

36:56So that's where it starts to feel like, well, what are the promises that you made?

37:03Yeah, partisanship is a hell of a drug and it tends to remove the humanity from people. Danny Benski, we appreciate you. Lauren Hirsch, we appreciate you. Thanks so much for being here. And Danny, thank you for your courage, as always. I know this must be awful to have to come on TV and talk about, but it is so important and we really appreciate your courage. Thank you so much. Coming up next, that horrific school shooting that rocked us, a small Canadian town. Authorities have just revealed new details about the shooter. Stay with us. We're back live in Tucson, Arizona, as investigators are pouring over tips in the disappearance of Nancy Guthrie.

37:36At the same time, we were also following shocking developments in our world lead. The small community of Tumbler Ridge in western Canada, that's about 800 miles north of Seattle, Washington, in the U.S. That community now grappling with the aftermath of a math shooting at a high school. Today, we learn new details about the victims and the shooter, as CNN's Paula Newton reports. Upon arrival there was active gunfire and as officers approached the school rounds were fired in their direction. Tonight new details about a deadly mass shooting in a small tight-knit community in Tumbler Ridge, Canada.

38:13Mobile phone messages warned of an active shooter describing the suspect as a woman wearing a dress with brown hair. The alarm went off that I've never heard before and our principal goes throughout the halls and she's saying people close your doors, lockdown, stuff like that. I didn't, I think I thought it was a secure and hold and something like that at first. So, but once things started circulating, we realized how serious it really was. The town's high school was in lockdown, students barricading themselves in classrooms, a local journalist conveying the terror now rippling through the small town.

38:48I talked to a concerned parent who's here waiting. He got a call from his son who is sheltering in place in the gym. And he's just waiting to hear from his other kid and is quite rightly nervous. Authorities say police arrived within minutes but found six victims already dead at the school, at least 27 injured. The suspect, identified as 18-year-old Jesse Van Rootsalar, was also found dead in the school of a self-inflicted injury. Two other victims, Rootsalar's mother and a sibling, were found dead at a nearby home. Police say a long gun and a modified handgun were used and disclosed that authorities were called to the suspect's home several times for mental health emergencies and firearms offenses.

39:42And they are no closer to settling on a motive. There's been much speculation within the community regarding the relationship between the shooter and some of the victims. All of that remains part of the active and ongoing investigation. Canadian Prime Minister Mark Carney visibly shaken and teary-eyed, expressing the profound grief now felt right across the country. It's obviously a very difficult day for the nation this morning. parents, grandparents, sisters, brothers in Tumblr Ridge will wake up without someone they love.

40:19The nation mourns with you. Canada stands by you. Authorities are now surging resources to the area, including investigative support. Local leaders describe the community as stricken as Canada enters a full week of official mourning. Paula Newton, CNN, Ottawa. Here in Arizona, brand new video. Authorities just moments ago searching a brush area near the home of Nancy Guthrie. The focus of their investigation today, next.

40:58Welcome to The Lead. I'm Jake Tapper outside the Pima County Sheriff's Department here in Tucson, Arizona. We're on day 11 of the desperate search for Nancy Guthrie. The 84-year-old mother of Today Show anchor Savannah Guthrie, who disappeared mysteriously 11 days ago, this afternoon local officials revealed that they've gotten more than 4 ,000 calls over the last day in regard to Nancy Guthrie's disappearance. But still, no suspect or person of interest has been named. The man who investigators detained last night for questioning and later released, he spoke to reporters earlier today. He says he has nothing to do with the case.

41:32He wants to clear his name. And now TMZ reports that it received a new letter. This one from someone claiming to know the identity of the kidnapper. They're demanding a Bitcoin, about$67 ,000, to give up that information. We're going to have much more on all of these developments and moments. But we're also following another major story today. Back in Washington, D.C., where Attorney General Pam Bondi testified in an incredibly heated hearing on Capitol Hill. Bondi defended the administration's handling, some might say mishandling, of the Epstein files, while apologizing to the survivors present in the hearing room.

42:07The attorney general also sparred with House Democrats, at one point calling the top Democrat on the committee a, quote, washed-up loser lawyer, unquote. We're going to get back to that story in moments, but let's start here in Tucson, where I'm standing with CNN's Nick Watt. Nick, several FBI agents were out along the roads near Nancy Guthrie's home earlier today. Do we know what they're looking for? They are looking for anything that might have been dropped or discarded by that person we see in that Nest camera video, the armed masked person we see at Nancy Guthrie's door in the early hours that Sunday morning.

42:44Now, the New York Post has just reported that investigators have found a black glove within two miles of Nancy Guthrie's house on a roadside. that could be connected, that could have absolutely nothing to do with this. We don't know that yet. Now, we are told there are now hundreds of agents and officers working 24-7, and we're told to expect to see this expand as the investigation expands over the next few days. Now, we also spoke to a neighbor of Annie Guthrie. She is, of course, one of Nancy's daughters. This neighbor said, you know, the last time I saw investigators was about a week ago. the FBI came around canvassing.

43:21Yesterday, they came back and said, do you mind if we look around the back of your property? His property backs on to Nancy Guthrie's. So the FBI, they say, Kash Patel says they are looking for persons, plural, persons of interest, looking into them. $50 ,000 reward. He would not give any more detail as to who those persons of interest might be. You mean the neighbor's property is the backyard of Annie Guthrie's? No. No. Sorry, sorry. Annie Guthrie. Annie Guthrie, yeah. His house is, like, behind. He said he had no idea that Guthrie even lived there. He said he hadn't seen investigators for a while until they came back yesterday.

43:58Could we look around the outside of your property? And what do we know about the gentleman that was picked up and detained and questioned yesterday? And then he calls himself Carlos. And then released, saying he wants to clear his name. He talked to reporters. His mother-in-law let investigators into the house, said she had nothing to hide. What do we know about that? So Carlos, one of our producers spoke with him this morning. He was released without charge, said he had nothing to do with it, didn't even know who Nancy Guthrie was. Now, his mother-in-law apparently told him the reason that he was stopped is that there was an anonymous tip.

44:32You mentioned 4 ,000 tips came in in a day, an anonymous tip that his eyes and eyelashes resembled the person in that video, that masked person at the door. Now, his car was searched, his house was searched. He was questioned. He said that he was stopped at a traffic stop at about 4 p.m. He didn't know why until the FBI showed up and I think we've got a little clip of him that we can show you. All of a sudden, the FBI pulled out the Miranda rights and he read me Miranda rights and that's when I asked, so I'm being arrested. They're like, no, we're just reading your Miranda rights so we can ask you some questions.

45:08What kind of questions? It's about a kidnapping. What the ? I didn't kidnap no one. So I started asking my name and all that, but all of a sudden I felt like they were trying to incriminate me in something I didn't do.

45:21Now, Carlos said, listen, I had nothing to do with this. I hope they find the lady and I hope they find the guy who's taken her. You know, Savannah Guthrie released or she retweeted some of that video of that person at the door. And she said, we believe she is still alive, talking about her mother. But listen, the investigation, hundreds of officers, still we don't have a named suspect. Let's hope Savannah's right. Thank you so much, Nick Watt. Appreciate it. Let's bring in CNN's chief law enforcement and intelligence analyst, John Miller. Also with us, Jeff Halstead, who served as police chief in Fort Worth, Texas.

45:59John, it's not clear if authorities believe that the black glove that the New York Post talked about, they said that investigators recovered it near Nancy Guthrie's home. It's not clear if it's the same glove worn by the person seen in the doorbell camera footage. This isn't exactly a place. This isn't exactly glove weather right here in Arizona. By the same token, there are people who wear gloves when they do like construction work, etc. But if it is connected, what could investigators uncover? Do the gloves, do the inside of gloves, do they carry fingerprints? No, but they do carry DNA. So, I mean, there's a number of steps we've got to look at here, which is, is it similar to the glove that we've seen on the video?

46:42If it is, then it really is the kind of thing you want to get into it. You want to see, can you recover DNA, fiber, hair, all of those things. traces of the plant that was pulled up. I mean, there are opportunities there. But on the other hand, if it's not the same glove we're looking at here, it should be probative anyway. Because as you pointed out, it was 50, between 50 and 55 degrees that night. That's not glove weather. So if somebody is discarding gloves along the roadway, is that the man in the video? Is that perhaps an accomplice who was driving a getaway car, it's still worth examining.

47:24And the other thing you want to do is, if they found one glove, where's the other? So you want to expand that search and say, did they toss it one out the window and then 500 feet later toss the other? Do you expand, do you focus on that search area going forward and see, do you find a ski mask? So they're on the right track about looking for things to see what they find. Jeff, I guess that there's no accounting for the intelligence of any criminal. But to throw a glove out the window within two miles of a place where you've perpetrated a major crime seems really stupid, especially in a place with as much desert as Tucson, Arizona.

48:10know. You've handled lots of cases. Is it possible that a criminal would be that dumb? Well, we thrive on the lack of intelligence on many of our violent suspects and actual career criminals. With that said, you got to remember in today's culture, many people, including criminals, they're going to finish their criminal act and then they're going to go right back to their lifestyle, which is getting on their smartphone. And with those types of gloves, You can't operate a smartphone. So more than likely, that's probably going to be his right hand and the right handed glove. If it is the suspect discarded so they can get on their phone and see what they have missed, because most of the times they will not carry smartphones or other technologies while they're inside committing a crime.

48:54They'll keep it far away in a vehicle so it doesn't ping them to an exact location. Well, speaking of smartphones, if the criminal had a smartphone on him or her, and if a criminal, if he or she left it in the car or had it on him or her, would they not, would law enforcement not have been able to trace the presence of that phone? Or is it only if they get a call or a text while the phone is there? Depending on the amount of intelligence that's received and specifically about the triangulation of different cell towers and different smartphone applications that can be utilized here, there is a possibility for that.

49:35You're going to have to narrow that search for specific devices or the peams that are coming from that device. That, they're probably not there yet on the intelligence side and or the investigative search, but I know they're going to start closing in on that very, very soon. So, John, what's the harm if the FBI came out and went frame by frame and discussed what they see in the videos, instead of just letting the public try and figure out what they think who the person could be? Well, no harm. The utility of doing something like that is, as the FBI formulates questions, they might want to point out specific things to flag and ask for the public's assistance with those specifics.

50:25So it's not a bad idea, but I think what they've been doing is incrementally kind of letting this out, letting people look at it, letting it set in, see what they get. 4 ,000 tips. You know, Jake, as you said before, and as Jeff knows from his police career, most of those tips are going to be not the kind of thing that's going to get you to the solution. But even if just 5 % of those 4 ,000 tips are things that you're going to look at and say, we really got to check this one out, that's still 200 viable tips. And it could be more than that. Let's hope something viable comes in soon. If it hasn't already, John Miller and Jeff Halstead, thanks to both of you.

51:10Appreciate it. We're going to have much more on our coverage from Tucson, Arizona in moments. Investigators pouring through the thousands of tips in the search for Nancy Guthrie. Plus Attorney General Pam Bondi on Capitol Hill today pressed on the Trump administration's handling or mishandling of the Epstein files. One of the two lawmakers who led the push to get these files publicly released will join us to react.

51:37We're back with our national lead live outside the Pima County Sheriff's Department in Tucson, Arizona. It is day 11 in the urgent, desperate search for today's show anchor Savannah Guthrie's 84-year-old mother, Nancy Guthrie, who's been missing since February 1st. The biggest clue so far remain the images, six still images, and three videos that the FBI recovered, working with Google, from Guthrie's doorbell camera, a Nest camera, from the early morning when she disappeared. Former FBI profiler Greg McCrary joins us. Now, Greg, when you look at the still images, when you look at the video, what stands out to you about this person's behavior?

52:16Well, I think we need to open the investigative aperture a little wider and take in a lot more information in addition to what we're seeing on the videos. You know, everybody's looked at the videos, everybody has their ideas, but he doesn't seem to have anticipated the camera. He goes back and picks up the flowers and is always trying to hide behind that. And then eventually he dislodges the camera and takes it with him. But the crowdsourcing is going to be the most important thing. So we look at the videos, look at the stills, look at the gate. People may recognize the jacket, the backpack, the gun, that sort of thing.

53:01But when I'm talking about widening the aperture, here, talking about pre-abduction and post-abduction behavior. This is a targeted crime. He just didn't knock on a door randomly and bump into Ms. Guthrie. So there would have been some pre-selection and pre-targeting, some kind of contact perhaps with her or her daughter or Savannah Guthrie or something in there. So that's more of an investigative thing. But for the viewers out there, if anybody was fixated or talking about her or the Guthries or anything like that, that's one thing to consider in addition. And then the post-abduction behavior after this has taken place, this has completely absorbed this individual.

53:52His normal routine is basically gone at this point. But he may have made an excuse in advance for this. He clearly he did some planning, he may have told friends or families, hey, I'm going to be out of town for a couple of days, going to be visiting here, visiting my aunt, taking a vacation or something. So people may not be suspicious of the fact that he's gone. But if all this comes together, he looks like somebody you know, especially if he talked about the Guthrie's at all. And then even if he's made up an excuse, he's gone now. But if he's around, if he happens to be around and they see this individual, he's going to be very stressed.

54:33He didn't anticipate this video coming out. This is going to be elevating his stress level. So he's going to be rigid, over-controlled, didn't have time to talk, those sorts of things. So all that needs to be factored in the equation. When you look at how the person approached the house, is it likely, and we only have about a minute here, is it likely that this person came with the intention of abducting Nancy Guthrie? Is that what it looks like to you? Or does it look like they may be going in there to rob the house and something happened? It's difficult to know, looking at that, what the motivation would have been.

55:19It's just difficult to tell if this is a robbery gone bad or the abduction. So it's difficult to tell just looking at the video. That's where looking at the pre-effects behavior, any sort of contact, anything like that. Thank you, Greg McCrary. I really appreciate your time today. And of course, you out there, if you have any information about the disappearance of Nancy Guthrie, if you have seen somebody who looks like her, if you have seen somebody who looks like the abduct her. There are multiple ways to alert authorities. Call the Pima County Sheriff's Department at 520-351-4900. Call the FBI at 1-800-CALL-FBI.

55:55You can also reach the agency online at tips.fbi.gov. My next guests were in the room for today's Capitol Hill hearing with Attorney General Pambandi, where she was asked repeatedly about the Justice Department's handling of the Epstein files or mishandling the brother and sister-in-law of Epstein victim Virginia And did you, Frank? They're here to react to what they heard in moments.

56:21In our Law and Justice League today on Capitol Hill, Attorney General Pam Bondi fielded heated questions from Democratic House members on multiple fronts, most notably on the Justice Department's handling or mishandling of the Jeffrey Epstein files. The hearing at times devolved into personal attacks and shouting matches. Here's one example. It is about you taking responsibility for your Department of Justice and the harm that it has done to the survivors who are standing right behind you and are waiting for you to turn to them and apologize for what your Department of Justice has done. Members get to ask the questions, the witness get to answer in the way they want to answer.

57:03The Attorney General can respond. That's not accurate, Mr. Chairman. Because she doesn't like the answer. I'm not going to get in the gutter for her theatrics. We should know Bondi did acknowledge the survivors in her opening statement. She said she's deeply sorry for what they have been through, but she did refuse to apologize for the department's treatment of them or for any mistakes in their redactions. Before today's hearing, some of the victims or loved ones of victims of convicted sex offender Jeffrey Epstein gathered outside the Capitol and they shared their messages for their attorney general.

57:38Take a listen. The way this administration and you specifically have handled survivors has been nothing short of a failure. We ask you to remember the lives that we have lost during this process. Accountability means real answers, not evasion. It means transparency, not more hiding. Here now were those people. They were on the steps speaking ahead of time, and they're in the hearing room watching it happen. Skye and Amanda Roberts, they are the brother and the sister-in-law of prominent Jeffrey Epstein accuser Virginia Giuffre, who died by suicide last year. Sky, let me start with the important question.

58:21How are you? How are you doing after being in the room for that hearing where your sister's suffering was to many of the politicians in that room a secondary consideration? It was a very surreal moment for us. I mean, we continue to say it as a survivor community. This is not a political issue. This is a human issue. And like, you know, to hear it more politicized and, you know, it really felt one sided aside from, you know, the brave Thomas Massey coming forward and actually asking some hard questions. You know, it really felt like the Democratic leaders led the way today. And Pam Bondi didn't want to answer those questions.

59:01She kept evading. And it was really disappointing because, you know, on a human level, she couldn't even I mean, we're feet from her, Jake. We're feet from her. And she couldn't even just turn around and acknowledge the survivors. And really the first step in healing for any survivor, including my sister, was acknowledgement. It was to say something happened here. And, you know, she really, I think she did a disservice to herself. And she certainly did a disservice to survivors today. There's no doubt about that. Amanda, you told us before that you were looking for accountability. You were looking for transparency.

59:31Was any of that present? Absolutely not. I think when the hard questions were asked of Miss Bondi, when the representatives really went there and asked how this happened, it was a complete evasion or an excuse. She was making excuses that, you know, the timeline was too fast and it was a rush. And that was why, you know, the names of the victims were unredacted. However, they were really able to go in there and redact the names of the perpetrators. And so, no, there was no ownership. And that was the thing. It was about her taking a little bit of ownership and turning to us and apologizing. But if she were to apologize, then that means that the Department of Justice did something wrong and they just refused to go there.

1:00:17It was just disheartening. I want to play a moment when Congresswoman Pramila Jayapal of Washington State, a Democrat, she asked you and other survivors to stand. But take a listen. Let's let's show this moment. To the survivors in the room, if you are willing, please stand.

1:00:46And if you are willing, please raise your hands if you have still not been able to meet with this Department of Justice. Please know for the record that every single survivor has raised their hand. That's really shocking and disgraceful. I mean, just for anybody watching at home, think about how much time this Justice Department has spent trying to bring charges against Democratic officials who President Trump doesn't like. Later, the Attorney General was asked to apologized to you for the way that you and the other survivors and their families, their loved ones have been treated. She did not.

1:01:28She said that the Democrats were engaging in theatrics. Sky, if you got a chance to meet one-on-one with Attorney General Bondi, what would you say to her? This is not a hoax. This is real. This administration has done a disservice to survivors this up to this point I think that they want this to just go away and I want it to be a stark reminder that this isn't just gonna go away and my sister was real and these survivors are real and they have real stories and I do challenge her to meet with us and don't just give us this this isn't theatrics three at theatrics is not what this I mean Amanda said that in her speech today this isn't a theatrical performance this is lives human lives and there's so many survivors out there and I need her to understand the gravity of this because today, to be honest with you, it really felt like she didn't take it seriously.

1:02:17And no, Jake, the Department of Justice has never reached out to us. They've never given any survivors that I know of the moment and time to come forward. And I do challenge her to understand this a little bit more thoroughly because these lives matter and survivors are real and they exist everywhere, even if they haven't come forward now. And I mean, beyond not meeting with you and the survivors and other survivors' families to offer sympathy or apologies or whatever. There's also the issue of clues and investigations and saying, who did Virginia say we should look into? You noted Congressman Massey earlier, Republican in Kentucky.

1:02:58He pressured the Justice Department to unredact some of the names of perpetrators or alleged perpetrators in the Epstein files. And he asked why they're not releasing more names. Take a listen. Because the victory is forcing them to release their own documents that show they listed them as coping scores. I could go read the names, but I don't have the evidence with me. They hold the evidence attached to the names. Do you agree with that, Amanda? That's the issue with naming the names, right? So, you know, there's this idea of like, oh, come forward with what you know. Name the names on the floor.

1:03:37Even the congresspeople, they can name the names. But it's more than that. There is substantial evidence in this in these documents and in these files, whether that was victim testimonies. There is financial evidence. We need to follow the money, the transaction, the flight logs. And so that's what we're saying. We know that there is substantial evidence to tie these people, these potential co-conspirators. And that's the point of this. It's yes, their names. We need to unredact them. We need to also see their communications. And we know that evidence is there. So yesterday you were in the Capitol as Democrats introduced what's called Virginia's law.

1:04:16This is named after your sister, Virginia Giffray. And that would remove the time limit, the statute of limitations for survivors of sexual abuse so that they can file civil claims. Sky, will there be enough support from Democrats and Republicans to pass this into law? Yeah. First, I'd like to say that what an absolute honor it was to be there on Virginia's behalf.

1:04:43This was her dream, Jake. I mean, she wanted to affect real legislation. And Virginia's law essentially eliminates the statute of limitations so that survivors can come forward when they're ready. So that they don't have a ticking time clock. Because it does take years and years and decades to sometimes come forward about your abuse. and I do think you know this is something that America can stand by this is something that we can pass along to our next generation and I really do hope we have the the Republicans support I mean if they haven't already they should read my sister's memoir Nobody's Girl the truth is is that will tell you the inside scoop into how a survivor thinks and it's very intimate it's very detailed it's a hard read but it's necessary because of just how hard this topic is and how hard survivors have to fight.

1:05:31And we're ready to fight, Jake. We're ready to fight. I will meet with them. I will meet with anybody tomorrow. You tell me the place and time and we will be there. I will meet with you. I will give you a face to face so that we can have a true conversation on what this bill means and what it means for our next generation. Sky and Amanda Roberts, we always have seats for you to wage this fight on behalf of Virginia. May her memory be a blessing. Thank you for joining us on what I know is a very, very difficult day. We'll be right back. Thank you, Jake.

1:06:04We're back from Tucson, Arizona, live outside the Pima County Sheriff's Office, where the search for Nancy Guthrie, Savannah Guthrie's mother, continues. Today the FBI conducted what they call an extensive search around the Guthrie's neighborhood in the Catalina Foothills area. I want to bring in Jeff Lemie. He's Nancy Guthrie's neighbor and lives in that Catalina Foothills neighborhood. Jeff, nice to talk to you again. And it's been almost a week since law enforcement in Pima County held a news conference. Do you and your community feel as though the sheriff and law enforcement here are providing enough information and sufficient answers to questions you might have?

1:06:41I know yesterday we were so hopeful with a breakthrough. And I think there's folks very impressed by the ability to retrieve those images. I guess to keep hope and faith in the investigation and that perhaps the next breakthrough is the one that really can make a difference. Besides the lack of news conferences, the Pima County Sheriff has been criticized for a number of things. He initially said there was not any video from the cameras at the house because Nancy Guthrie didn't have an active subscription to Nest, which is the camera company. Some law enforcement experts have said investigators released the crime scene too early.

1:07:23They obviously released it, then closed it back up, then released it again. It suggested that that decision potentially have compromised evidence. People, reporters were on the property filming things, taking pictures of things. Do you still have faith in local law enforcement? We have seen a robust and not just local, but national, the FBI, et cetera, have. And the volunteer groups have scoured the neighborhood, been speaking to all our neighbors, have asked us to provide any ring footage. So we have seen collectively, whether it's national, local, regional, we have seen a large response. And as I mentioned, we were hopeful last night.

1:08:07I mean, we're also hopeful that this maybe was coming to a positive closure. And that's where we truly hope that that is arrived at, that we do see that next breakthrough through whatever efforts will achieve that. Yesterday, we spoke about your neighborhood. We went there last night. It's really dark at night. There are no lights. It's covered with dense trees, cacti, bushes. that could easily obscure views of who's coming and going. A lot of houses, you can't even see the road because of all the foliage. Has this at all, is what happened here, this tragedy sparked conversation about increasing security in the neighborhood, whether that's adding more lights or more cameras or what?

1:08:52Well, I know many, if not everyone, has some sort of ring system. many houses our house included have some lighting there is talk about you know folks getting involved in maybe a neighborhood watch which would be great in any neighborhood that you live in also getting involved in HOA maybe having conversations together about making the neighborhood safe as you would want every neighborhood to be safe so it's created dialogue about perhaps how to react collectively. And also individually, you know, as I stated, a lot of houses, we don't have the great streetlights, but we do have illumination around people's homes.

1:09:41Jeff, let me thank you so much. Appreciate it as always. Coming up more on today's combative hearing as Attorney General Panbani appeared toward the House Judiciary Committee. Democratic Congressman Ro Khanna has been leading the charge with Thomas Massey to get the Epstein files released to the public. He's going to join us live in moments to react to all of today's drama.

1:10:06We're back with the long justice lead in today's combative testimony between House Democrats on the Judiciary Committee and Attorney General Pam Bondi. Bondi was pressed repeatedly by Democrats on her department's handling or mishandling of the Epstein files. My next guest co-sponsored the legislation that became law and forced the release of the files. He did it with Republican Congressman Thomas Massey. Democratic Congressman of California Ro Khanna joins us now. Congressman Khanna, thanks for joining us. So your colleague, Jim Jordan, he is the chairman of the Judiciary Committee. Here is how he summed up the Attorney General's appearance today?

1:10:46I think the Attorney General is doing just fine. We appreciate your willingness to come and answer questions and the great job you're doing for our country. How do you think the Attorney General did? Do you agree with Chairman Jordan? Well, let me tell you how the survivors think. One survivor texted me saying, I'm glad I wasn't there. And she said, I feel hopeless after today. And what was lost as the insults were hurled from members of Congress to Attorney General Bondi and back is how this is impacting survivors. I've met many of them now. This is personal for me. And what we owe them is justice.

1:11:30And what we owe is to listen to them. They don't care whether it's Trump's fault or They want justice for the people who raped them. So a lot of people watching the hearing, critics of Bondi, say that it seemed as though she was playing to an audience of one. She didn't care what the survivors thought. She only cared what the president thought. Take a listen. REP. ROBERT MULLER FOUND NO EVIDENCE, NONE, OF FOREIGN INTERFERENCE IN 2016. Have you apologized to President Trump? Have you apologized to President Trump, all of you who participated in those impeachment hearings against Donald Trump? You all should be apologizing.

1:12:12You sit here and you attack the president, and I am not going to have it. I'm not going to put up with it. So just in point of fact, it's not true that Robert Mueller found no evidence of foreign interference in the 2016 election. He did. And it is also not true that President Trump was impeached for anything having to do with the Russiagate investigation. But she did give a lot of answers like that on other topics that had not been raised. Did you think it was effective, what she did? I mean, you're right. She was appealing to Donald Trump for her job. And ultimately, Donald Trump gets to decide.

1:12:54But this was never about Trump. I mean, when Massey and I started with Marjorie Taylor Greene, Nancy Mace, Lauren Boebert, this was about getting justice for survivors. Donald Trump actually campaigned on releasing the files. And to this day, Massey and I haven't made it about Clinton or Trump. What we want is the names of the people who actually abused and raped these girls. And by the way, Jake, they're not always the most famous names. I mean, yesterday I went on the House floor to name six names of people who were redacted. Many of those people were not famous. There are people who are being protected in those FBI files.

1:13:35They were scrubbed in March. We want them unredacted. And instead of answering why those files are still scrubbed, the attorney general was playing politics. So, as you just said, you read aloud the names of six men who were in the files. We know at least two of the men are wealthy and powerful. You did this after reviewing unredacted materials behind closed doors for hours. Tell us what else you learned from those documents. Well, the biggest thing I learned is that most of them are still scrubbed. I mean, they were scrubbed in March. And we aren't going to get the information that the survivors want released until those FBI files are unscrubbed, because that's where they named the people who actually were on the island and who committed the abuse.

1:14:21And the other thing, and you can ask other members who have seen the files, is it's pretty sickening. I mean, it's not just sexual assault and graphic. It's violent. It's talking about torture. It's just really a disgusting look at behavior. And one of the things that's sad to me is how many people have been implicated, not necessarily in committing rape or abuse, but in being willing to invest with Epstein after he was a convicted pedophile, go to his island after he was a pedophile, and how in America we seem not to want accountability. Other countries, they're having accountability. The British monarchy, the British government, Norway.

1:15:02Here, let's just be honest. Some of these people fund our nonprofits, fund universities, are in positions of power. And we have to decide as a country, are we going to say it's okay if you wanted to do business with a convicted pedophile let's move on. Are we actually going to have accountability? Congressman Ro Khanna, Democratic California, thank you so much. Thank you. Coming up, the massive confusion over why the El Paso airspace was suddenly closed last night and what we're learning today about how it may be connected to drones, lasers, and balloons. Stay with us.

1:15:46Welcome back to The Lead, live in Tucson, as we continue to follow the desperate search for Nancy Guthrie, the mother of beloved Today Show anchor Savannah Guthrie. We are also monitoring a major and kind of bizarre story in our national lead. We are now learning why the airspace over El Paso, Texas, was suddenly closed late last night. What originally was announced as a 10-day closure, raising serious concerns among airlines and travelers, didn't even last one day. This morning, the Secretary of Transportation, Sean Duffy, posted, quote, The FAA and DOW, that's the Department of War, what others call the Department of Defense, acted swiftly to address a cartel drone incursion.

1:16:28The threat has been neutralized and there is no danger to commercial travel in the region. No danger is right because a source told CNN that the military counter-drone mission targeted what turned out to be party balloons. That's right, party balloons. Let's bring in CNN's Pete Muntean and retired Air Force Colonel Cedric Layton. Colonel Layton, are the military lasers that target things such as drones strong enough to affect commercial jets? Yeah, they could actually, Jake. And one of the key things here is that depending on where those lasers are set up and how powerful those lasers are, they could actually impact pilots, commercial pilots, as they are on final approach to an airport like the El Paso Airport.

1:17:14And as Pete knows, it's very close to Biggs Army Airfield, where this testing was going to take place, is pretty close to El Paso International. Pete, what is the FAA saying about this? Well, the FAA has remained mostly mum all day today, although FAA Administrator Brian Bedford just left a closed-door briefing with senators on Capitol Hill in which he refused to comment about the cause of this really sweeping and unprecedented airspace shutdown. We did hear, though, from Senator Ted Cruz, who chairs the committee that oversees aviation in the Senate. He says he still believes the White House excuse that this was all inspired by a cartel drone that was flown over the U.S.-Mexico border.

1:18:02A lot of conflicting information here. And that excuse really conflicts with what we're hearing from multiple sources who say that this was all because the Pentagon planned to use this high-energy laser without consulting the FAA, without regard for civilian aircraft in the area. Senator Cruz says he still wants a briefing from the Federal Aviation Administration and the Pentagon about why this initially took place. A lot of big questions to get to the bottom of here. Colonel Leighton, an airspace closed for 10 days. That feels like a long time for balloons or for even a drone. Is the threat of drones that serious?

1:18:43Well, from Mexico, Jake, there actually is a threat that narco-traffickers would use drones to potentially go after targets in the U.S. Now there have been reports of incursions. In some cases they talk about thousands of drones over a year or so period getting close to the U.S.-Mexico border. But very rarely do they actually cross the border. So this kind of a threat could materialize, but it is something that the Pentagon obviously needs to prepare for. But you shouldn't shut down commercial airspace for 10 days. Pete, this is not the first time the FAA and the Pentagon have, shall we say, not been singing from the same choir book.

1:19:28What do we know about the communication issues between these two agencies? At the macro level, they're pretty strained. And you have to color all of this, at least according to Federal Aviation Administration sources, against the fact that there were so many incidents last year involving commercial flights and military flights. Of course, the mid-air collision tragically over the Potomac River of American Eagle Flight 5342 landing at Reagan National Airport, colliding with a U.S. Army Black Hawk helicopter, 67 people killed. And then there was the near collision that we reported on, a story that we broke of T-38 trainer jets performing a flyover at Arlington National Cemetery, not far from Reagan National Airport, causing incidents and near collisions with commercial flights.

1:20:10So the FAA is really trying hard to insulate civilian flights for military flights, especially now. All right. Thanks to both of you. Appreciate it. We have some sad news for you and our pop culture lead. actor, father, teen heartthrob, James Van Der Beek tragically passed away today at the age of 48. James had been battling stage three colorectal cancer, first announcing his condition in November 2024. Van Der Beek began his acting career at age 16 with his off-Broadway debut in Finding the Sun. He moved to film at the age 17, age of 17 with Angus and I Love You, I Love You Not. But it was in 1998 when James Van Der Beek became a household name in the popular show Dawson's Creek.

1:20:56He played Dawson.

1:21:00Dawson, that wasn't your fault. It was my fault because I should have made you go. But I was selfish and I didn't want you to go. I wanted you to stay here with me.

1:21:12James went on to work on numerous projects since Dawson's Creek, even as recently as last year. I, if you'll allow me a personal moment here, I was lucky enough to know him, be friends with James, and to see his passion and his love of life firsthand. He will be dearly missed. May his memory be a blessing. James Van Der Beek was 48. Aaron Burnett Upfront starts now. Hey, I'm Anderson Cooper. On my podcast, All There Is, we explore grief and loss in all its complexities. You'll hear deeply moving and honest discussions with people who have faced and are living with life-altering losses. My guest is writer, poet Megan Fowley, who is married to the poet Andrea Gibson.

1:22:01Andrea died last summer after a years-long battle with cancer. Is grief different than you thought it would be? Yes, it is. I don't think that I thought that I would be able to have as much joy as I've had. I guess if I wasn't able to find joy and laughter now, I would have missed the point of Andra's messaging. Talking grief, building community. That's what the podcast is all about. This is all there is. Listen and follow wherever you get your podcasts.