WH Confirms Follow-Up Strike On Alleged Drug Boat

24:37What is that? Oh, yeah, it's a World Cup holder. Like the soccer tournament World Cup holder for the world. Fits every car, holds every cup. It has a Carvana logo. Carvana made it. They buy and sell cars, so they made a car cup holder. So, uh, got any good cups lately? I used to. I just couldn't figure out where in the world to put them. The World Cup Holder. Brought to you by Carvana. Proud sponsors of the World Cup Holder. Sign up today to win yours at cup-holder2026.com. Not authorized or endorsed by FIFA. Not a real product. For parity and fair use purposes only. The most memorable gifts aren't found.

25:09They're made. Zazzle is a custom marketplace where you pick any product. A mug, a card, a tote, a phone case, and make it personal. A photo, a name, an inside joke, the kind of gift that actually fits the person. That's what 30 million customers have been coming back to Zazzle for over 20 years to find. Right now, save 25 % on your first order at Zazzle.com. That's Zazzle.com. Make it z-amazing. In our Law and Justice lead today, the White House tried to defend President Trump's decision to bail out to commute the sentence of a convicted fraudster over the Thanksgiving holiday week. President Trump commuted the sentence for David Gentile, a private equity executive, who, along with another private equity executive, was convicted in 2024 in what federal prosecutors described as a$1.6 billion scheme defrauding more than 10 ,000 retail investors.

26:09The New York Times reports some of those investors are farmers and veterans and teachers. Court documents obtained by the Times include victim statements, son of which read, quote, I lost my whole life savings, quote, all of the literal blood, sweat and tears we shed to work hard and be successful was taken from us, unquote. White House Press Secretary Caroline Leavitt rejected the notion that Gentile was part of a Ponzi scheme. This is another example that has been brought to the president's attention of a weaponization of justice from the previous administration, and therefore he signed this commutation.

26:43The Times reports the Gentiles served less than two weeks of a seven-year sentence. CNN says reached out to Gentiles' lawyer for comment. The White House is also attempting to defend Trump's promise to pardon the former president of Honduras, Juan Orlando Hernandez. Trump said on Friday that he would pardon Hernandez, making the announcement just days before the presidential election in Honduras. Hernandez was convicted in the U.S. last year, given a 45-year federal prison sentence for conspiring to move tons, literally tons of cocaine, into the United States. Asked why President Trump would pardon a notorious drug trafficker, well, President Trump said this yesterday.

27:26Well, I was told, I was asked by Honduras, many of the people of Honduras, they said it was a Biden setup. President Trump did not give any evidence to that claim that this was a Biden setup. And just to be clear, prosecutors back in 2019 during President Trump's first term were the ones who accused Fernandez of being involved in a drug trafficking conspiracy. The timing of this potential pardon is particularly bizarre, especially considering the Trump administration is now saying that they're so focused on the drug crackdown in the Caribbean, So much so that they're ordering strikes of questionable legality on suspected drug boats.

28:06Even some Republican lawmakers can't really explain why Trump would pardon a convicted drug trafficker. Here's Congresswoman Maria Salazar of Florida earlier today on CNN. I would have never done that. I don't think that that was what I would have done. But I repeat, I'm not in the Oval Office. Republican Senator Bill Cassidy of Louisiana put it a little more plainly, asking, quote, Why would we pardon this guy and then go after Maduro for running drugs into the United States? Lock up every drug runner. Don't understand why he is being pardoned, unquote. Well, Senator Cassidy, you are not alone.

28:44Also today in the Law and Justice League, a big update after last week's ambush on two West Virginia National Guard members here in D.C. The surviving Guardsman, Air Force Staff Sergeant Andrew Wolf, was able to give nurses a thumbs up and wiggle his toes. That's according to West Virginia's governor, who visited the hospital multiple times and met with the family of the 24-year-old. This is where learning new details about the shooting suspect. Homeland Security Secretary Kristi Noem says investigators believe that he was radicalized after arriving in the U.S. from Afghanistan in 2021. Joining us now, Marine Corps veteran, former CIA officer Elliot Ackerman.

29:19Elliot, thanks for joining us. So both you and the suspect served in the CIA's zero unit in Afghanistan during the war there. I know you didn't know him personally. I read your piece in the Free Press earlier today. Can you explain what his role would have been like? What exactly does this unit do? Well, the mission of the zero units, you know, unlike the Afghan National Army, the zero units were Afghans who work directly for the United States, partnered with the CIA, and their mission was primarily to hunt down senior levels of the Taliban and al-Qaeda leadership throughout the country. Sources tell CNN that in interviews with the suspect's family members, authorities have learned that he might have suffered from post-traumatic stress stemmed from fighting he did in Afghanistan.

30:06I assume that's not uncommon for people who served in the zero unit post-traumatic stress. It's not uncommon for people who served in the zero units or in SEAL Team 6 or the U.S. Army Rangers. I mean, violence has a very long tail and a real psychological burden. In light of this targeted attack on these poor West Virginia National Guard members, the Trump administration is saying that the suspect had not been sufficiently vetted before entering the U.S. We should also note that the Trump administration is the administration that granted the suspects asylum in April of this year. Do you think that the vetting process is thorough enough?

30:50no i think it comes into question of you know what is the vetting process uh my intuition would be this isn't necessarily an issue of vetting i mean this is a an individual issue um specific to this person i think what would be the real shame would be if this was used as a cudgel to categorically demonize an entire group of people uh namely the afghans who come to this country you know specifically members of the zero units who for 20 years fought alongside many of America's most elite special operators to hunt down terrorist leadership and Taliban leadership in Afghanistan. Are you still in contact with any of the Afghans who fought alongside and assisted you?

31:34I am. And these guys are my are my brothers in arms. And many of them have come to the U.S. and they're making a life here. Some are now green cardholders and others are now U.S. citizens. And these are people who will contribute to the United States, you know, much the same way our Vietnamese population has contributed to this country since the end of that war. How are your Afghan brothers in arms? How are they reacting to all this? I think this is a really trying time for that community. And they're extremely sad about what has happened and, you know, in a poll that one of their own would engage in such actions.

32:10Elliot Ackerman, thank you so much and thank you for your service. Appreciate it. Yesterday on Air Force One, President Trump said he had no idea what doctors were looking for during an MRI he had back in October, but now we're finally getting some answers from the White House, what they revealed just a few hours ago next.

32:32Your team just added its 67th AI tool and also your 67th security blind spot. The good news? The Vanta agent works like a GRC engineer in the background, finding every app your team uses, scoring the risk, and drafting fixes for you. Vanta is the platform used by over 16 ,000 fast-moving companies like Ramp, Cursor, and Harvey, who are shaping the future with AI and staying ahead of AI risk. Get started at Vanta.com. In our politics lead, it has been more than a month since President Trump confirmed that he got an MRI at Walter Reed Hospital back in October. Today, White House Press Secretary Caroline Levitt finally gave the public some answers as to why he got the MRI.

33:15Advanced imaging was performed because men in his age group benefit from a thorough evaluation of cardiovascular and abdominal health. The purpose of this imaging is preventative. This level of detailed assessment is standard for an executive physical at President Trump's age and confirms that he remains in excellent overall health. Now, according to President Trump, that is more than he knew, or at least maybe more than he wanted to reveal after repeated questions from reporters on Air Force One yesterday. But if you want to have it released, I'll release it. Can you tell us what they were looking at?

33:51For what, releasing? No, no, no. What part of your body was the MRI looking at? I have no idea. It was just an MRI. What part of the body? It wasn't the brain because I took a cognitive test and I aced it. Okay, my panel joins me now. Shermichael Singleton. I mean, this call could have been shared in October when it happened, right? Why the obfuscation? Not to be hyper-partisan here, but it's a lot better than what we saw over the last four years. The president's almost 80 years old. I think it's the right thing to do to take MRI and any other examination that's necessary for a man of his age so that the American people know that mentally and physically he's up to the task of being president, which we know is a very stressful job.

34:32And so, yeah, maybe it took two months, but I'd rather two months and four years. And you know this because you wrote a whole book about it. Karen? Well, having had an MRI, several, trust me, when they're doing it, you know exactly what they're looking at and what they're looking for. There's no question. And you're, you know, quite aware the whole time. Look, this president has unfortunately, I think what matters about this is it's not just about the MRI, right? It's about this pattern of this lack of transparency and this lack of truthfulness, right? This is a president who's trying to tell us everything's great with the economy when we know that's not true.

35:06He's trying to tell us everything he's doing with bombing boats off the coast in the Caribbean, these Venezuelan boats, is absolutely fine. And then this weekend he also said, well, maybe I wouldn't have done it that way. Now that there are concerns about the way that was conducted. So on issue after issue from the Epstein files to very serious matters of war, we're not getting the truth from him. He's trying to tell us one thing that seems to not be true. So I think it's more about the pattern than I mean, a lot of presidents are not fully truthful about their health. And I agree by the Biden folks should have been more honest, much sooner.

35:44Just just one point of contention, I suppose. I get the comparative nature of Karen's assessment. And I will say on air, she was very strong in her opinion that the previous administration should have been very transparent with the American people. And I want to recognize that. However, I've seen a lot of Democrats saying this is an administration that isn't about transparency as it pertains specifically to this issue, that being the president's health. But those same individuals, Jake, were very quiet during the last four years. When you wrote and released your book and did interview after interview, I saw a number of lawmakers coming out and saying, well, we didn't know that this occurred, despite the number of individuals on background who said the president's mental acuity was not what it was before the beginning of his term.

36:27And so I don't think that you can compare this particular issue to the last president and say that there is a difference, because there isn't. On the matter of health, let us turn to those Obamacare subsidies, which are still set to expire at the end of the year. The Democrats did get a promise from John Thune in the Senate that there will be a vote on whether or not to extend them. How do you see this playing out? It's December 1st. The clock is ticking. That's right. I think there's going to have to be a vote because, again, the pressure is not just from Democrats. Some of these members are also hearing this at home from their constituents.

37:01And this is another issue where the president was trying to obfuscate and didn't want to take it head on. But the reality is this is hitting people's pocketbooks. So certainly I think it's a political liability for the Republicans if they don't allow a vote. But it's they're in a bind here because it's also political liability. If they don't come up with some way to give the American people some kind of relief, you can't say we can find the dollars to extend these tax breaks for millionaires and billionaires. But we can't find the dollars to help give people a break on their health care while also let's also get together and try to actually solve the crisis on health care.

37:40Do you think there's a bipartisan deal that actually might happen? It might happen. I don't know. I wish there were a bipartisan deal that could happen. I actually agree with Karen. I don't think conservatives want to see hardworking American families harmed by their inability to afford proper care. But I think one could also make the case that there are a lot of Americans who have real experiences about how the current ACA system is defunct, how it hasn't worked or benefited them the ways that it was promised. And so can conservatives offer a solution to address that? I think we absolutely can.

38:12And I would argue many Democrats would probably be in agreement with some of those proposed solutions. So it has not escaped notice of my 95 percent female staff that President Trump has taken a harsher tone with a lot of women reporters in the last weeks. He called one piggy. Then he was he was rather nasty to Mary Bruce in the Oval Office. He called another one on social media ugly and then this over the weekend. why do you blame the biden administration because they let him in did are you stupid are you a stupid person because they came into on a plane along with thousands of other people that shouldn't be here and you're just asking questions because you're a stupid person the first of all um nancy cordez is not stupid she's very smart second of all there obviously are a lot of issues having to do with this shooter um but he wasn't just like some random guy that came in on a plane.

39:13He'd been working with the CIA and had been vetted just for that job in Afghanistan. But beyond that, what do you make of this? A lot of strong women getting a lot of heat from the president. Yeah. Oh, I have lots of thoughts. But what I'll say, he was like this actually during the first term as well. We heard particularly with black female reporters, he called them stupid and other, you know, sort of derogatory things. Look, this is a president, and I'll bring it back to where I started, who does not feel that he is accountable to anyone for anything. The Supreme Court basically said, you've got full immunity.

39:48He takes that very seriously and seems to walk around that he doesn't need to answer questions with any sort of thoughtful, fact-based answers. He obfuscates. He'll berate people if they don't like the question. We've seen him do it to our own Caitlin Collins. So not surprising to see this. He didn't want to answer that question. He probably didn't know the answer. Shermichael, you are like the last person I would ever think would ever say anything like any of that. You are, the way that you treat people is so kind and nice, even when you're disagreeing with them. I try. That must, but that must, I mean, and the man you used to work for, Dr.

40:26Ben Carson, was the same way. That must bother you, the style. This goes to the point that I was making, and I was saying that when you were talking about the president on the health issue, and I said it's a distinction without a difference, many Democrats have argued. I said that there is a difference. I'm happy that the president is actually answering questions from the press. That's number one. Even if they're not just going to answer questions, they're agreeing people. He's doing a lot better than the last president, in my opinion there. That said, is there a different way that one could answer certain questions?

40:55Sure. The president has a unique style in answering things, and some people aren't going to like it. I completely get it. But I would say, Mr. President, look, if you don't want to answer the question, don't answer it. Be a little calmer if you want to. There's nothing wrong with that. Thanks. Calm is a good thing, I would say. Calm is a good thing. Thanks to both of you. Appreciate it. Millions of you are going to be hit by a powerful winter storm in the next 24 hours. Forecasters are calling this one a bomb cyclone. We're going to tell you what that is and bring you its track next.

41:25Internationally, an already powerful winter storm will soon morph into a so-called bomb cyclone. Nearly 70 million people could feel this one as the system moves quickly from the plains all the way up to the state of Maine. Let's go to meteorologist Chris Warren in the CNN Weather Center. Time out this storm for us, Chris. Who's going to see what and when? Well, we are seeing the winter weather, Jake, here stretching. from Kansas to Maine, about 1500 miles worth of winter weather alerts. Here it is right now. And the timing you can see this evening and the heaviest snowfall in the darker colors here, green and yellow is rain.

42:01By tomorrow morning, Boston, New York still should be dry for the morning commute. That changes for the evening commute, a wet mess closer to the water, more snow farther away from the water. And this is the point where the storm will rapidly strengthen or bomb out, as it said. You can see kind of that swirl right in there, that kind of look that we're going to see. The amount of snow that'll be widespread in pink, about six inches. Some of the higher elevations closer to perhaps to a foot of snow. And on top of that, or in addition to that, there is going to be a freezing rain threat. When the rain freezes on contact, either power lines or roadways, which of course that could lead to power outages, Jake, and also some dangerous travel.

42:44Appreciate it. Welcome to The Lead. I'm Jake Tapper. This hour, President Trump and his top national security officials meeting behind closed doors about the next steps for Venezuela. This comes as lawmakers from both parties are raising grave concerns about a follow-up strike, a double tap on an alleged drug vessel in the Caribbean where the U.S. military killed survivors of the first strike. I'm going to ask a former US Army Ranger who now serves in Congress about this in moments. Plus, accused killer Luigi Mangione appearing in a New York courtroom today as his attorneys try to get key evidence thrown out from his murder case.

43:22This comes nearly one year after his arrest and charged with killing the United Healthcare CEO on a Manhattan sidewalk. Did the judge give any clues as to how he will rule on this evidence? Also, we're just hours away from the special house election in Tennessee. one that some polls suggest is proving to be closer than either side expected. President Trump won the district by 22 points last year. So why are Republicans now pouring money into the race? Do Democrats really have a chance? And the New York offices of Senator Chuck Schumer are receiving multiple bomb threats today. Schumer saying the email threats included the subject line MAGA and came from an email address alleging that the 2020 election was rigged, which of course it was not.

44:07He's going to join me live ahead as police carry out security sweeps at his offices.

44:15The lead tonight starts at the White House with a high-stakes meeting in the Oval Office as President Trump and his cabinet are facing expanding criticism over aggressive tactics in targeting alleged drug traffickers in the Caribbean. Sources tell CNN that the first of these strikes, which The Washington Post reports Secretary Hegseth ordered to kill everybody on board, was a so-called double tap, killing survivors clinging to the wreckage after the initial strike. The White House insists that the admiral in charge was the one who ordered that second strike. Republicans on Capitol Hill say they're looking into this directive with vigorous oversight.

44:53Here is how Independent Senator Angus King of Maine, who caucuses with Democrats, put it earlier today. If the facts are, as have been alleged, that there was a second strike specifically to kill the survivors in the water, that's a stone cold war crime. It's also murder. This just one day after Trump insisted he didn't know anything about Hegseth's order and said he, quote, wouldn't have wanted a second strike. CNN's Kaitlin Collins is at the White House. Kaitlin? Yeah, Jake, a lot of questions about these strikes that are intensifying here at the White House and it also comes as the president right now is set to meet with his team inside the Oval Office to talk about what they are doing when it comes to options that are on the table for Venezuela.

45:37Obviously the president has been ramping up pressure. He himself has been alluding to direct military action there. And so those are the key questions that have been facing people including the president, his defense secretary, the joint chief's chairman and the secretary of state who we all know were scheduled to be in this meeting which the White House confirmed earlier today that it will be taking place. They said it will be on many matters, but did confirm, as we had heard, it was primarily centered around what the president's options are, Jake, when it comes to Venezuela and what that's going to look like.

46:07And so this is happening as today at the briefing, basically a large majority of the questions were about the justification for these strikes, comments like that from Angus King and other lawmakers who were demanding answers and saying that they are worried that a war crime was committed as these strikes on these boats were taking place inside the Caribbean as they've been talking about trying to stop narcotics from making their way to the United States. And when they were asked, Jake, about the technicalities here, who actually ordered this strike and the second follow-up strike that the White House did confirm today had happened, this is what Caroline Levitt, the press secretary, told reporters.

46:44Does the administration deny that that second strike happened or did it happen and the administration denies that Secretary Hegseth gave the war. The latter is true. With respect to the strikes in question on September 2nd, Secretary Hegseth authorized Admiral Bradley to conduct these kinetic strikes. Admiral Bradley worked well within his authority. So you heard the direction there from the White House in terms of the layers at the Pentagon of how this went down. That comes, Jake, after you rightfully mentioned those comments from the president himself last night that stood out where he basically made clear that he had a conversation with Secretary Hegseth about this and he said that Secretary Hegseth told him he did not order the deaths of those two men.

47:27It still raises a lot of questions, Jake, about whether they knew that those two people were still survivors after the first initial strike and then the second strike was ordered or if the second strike just happened to comply with what the directive was for the first strike overall. So those are key questions, Jake, and it also comes as we talk about this meeting on Venezuela that the president is having right now with his top advisors. He just confirmed he did have a call with Venezuela's Maduro. He wouldn't say it went well, Jake, but he also did not say that it went badly. All right, Caitlin Collins with the White House.

47:57Thank you. And don't miss Caitlin on her show, The Source with Caitlin Collins. That's tonight and every weeknight, 9 p.m. Eastern, only on CNN. Let's go to Caracas, Venezuela next, where we find CNN's Stefano Pozoban. And Stefano, we're seeing videos of these huge pro-government, pro-Maduro rallies there today. Yes, indeed, Jake. I think that today the government really wanted to send a message of defiance. Maduro himself, for example, spoke for several hours today. He was flanked by all the top officials from his government, saying that they are not bending down from the pressure coming down from Washington.

48:37He really sent a message of stability. We spoke with several of his supporters. What we saw today was, Jake, frankly, the power base of this government. We're talking about public employees, workers' unions, for example, people who depend on government benefits to make it through their daily lives. And this is a movement, Jake, that has been in power here in Venezuela for more than 25 years. They told us that they consider this just the latest in a series of confrontation between Washington and Caracas, and they don't expect their leaders to leave power anytime soon, frankly, Jake. There were rumors that Maduro fled the country, but then he showed up at a public event yesterday, right?

49:20Yes, exactly. It's remarkable what happened last week, Jake, because Maduro is a president and a leader who spends hours on television almost over on a daily basis. He likes to rule on television, making decisions and calling up ministers and announcing the government plans directly live on Venezuelan public TV. We had not seen him for a few days last week. The last appearance was on Wednesday, then on Thursday he delivered a message, but from an undisclosed location. It was probably a recorded message, and then we didn't see him on Friday. On Saturday he sent a voice message, which is frankly the type of message that you send when you don't want people to know where you are.

50:03The fact that he appeared once again on Sunday and even today exactly sends the message that I was trying to portray before, the message of stillness, the message that he is unshakable and standing up to the pressure. Jake. Stefano Pozumon, thank you so much. Appreciate it. Now to Capitol Hill. CNN's Manu Raju just caught up with the chairman of the Senate Armed Services Committee, Roger Wicker. Take a listen. I've spoken to the secretary of defense and will be speaking to the admiral that was in charge of the operation. The secretary did indicate, which has now been in the news media, that there was a second attack.

50:43Were there survivors who were killed in that second attack? I don't have that information. Do you worry that? But I do think we'll get that information, and we're certainly going to have available to us all of the audio and all of the video. Chairman Wicker did not directly answer when Manu asked him whether or not he thought the second strike on those survivors was a war crime. Joining us now, Democratic Congressman from Colorado, Jason Crow, who's on the House Armed Services Committee and the House Intelligence Committee. He also served as a U.S. Army Ranger deployed to Iraq and Afghanistan.

51:16Congressman, what do you make of Chairman Wicker's comments there? Well, all of this, Jake, just illustrates in great clarity the untenable and horrible situation that Donald Trump and this administration continue to put our service members in. When you have no clear strategy, when you're given very little to no guidance, and you're putting people in a situation where the law is very unclear, you're putting our service members in positions where they are at great risk, which is exactly why I and several of my colleagues a little over a week ago put out a video reminding our service members of their obligation to follow the Constitution, to have fidelity to their oath, and to abide by the law.

52:01Because this administration continues to put them in terrible positions, and then the second somebody calls foul on it, they seem to hang people out the dry. So the strike, this double tap strike took place on September 2nd. Your video was at the end of November. Did you know about this? Had you heard about this and the questions of the legality of that particular strike? Now, our video was not aimed at any one particular example or circumstance or attack. Our video was about the overall lawlessness of this administration. Time and time again, over years, President Trump has said things and has asked the military to do things that would be unlawful and unconstitutional, whether it's shoot protesters in the leg in Lafayette Square, whether it's go to war in Napalm, the city of Chicago, whether it's send our troops to polling stations, which would be a violation of U.S.

52:54criminal law. And now, in a very legally ambiguous situation in the Caribbean, he continues to run fast and loose with the law. They run fast and loose with the security and the responsibility the commander-in-chief has to our service members. And I'm going to stand by them. I'm going to be very clear what their obligations are. And I will defend our service members and I will stand by those who are fulfilling their duty. And we should note, it's not just Democrats or liberal or progressive legal commentators who are being critical of this specific operation. Conservative legal commentator Andy McCarthy wrote an opinion piece in National Review in which he said in part quote, if this happened as described in the Washington Post report, it was at best a war crime under federal law, adding even if you buy the untenable claim that they are combatants, it is a war crime to intentionally kill combatants who have been rendered unable to fight, unquote.

53:52Do you agree with that? Yeah, that's right. I mean, this is training that combat soldiers, sailors, Marines that you get in your training before deployment. You understand the difference between combatants and non-combatants. You understand when somebody's trying to surrender or has been rendered combat ineffective that they're no longer a viable target. You understand the difference between what is a viable military objective versus a protected cultural site or a religious site. You actually get this training. This is a part of being a service member. It's a part of being ordered into combat.

54:26It can be tough. It can be challenging, but it is actually an essential part of the job. But again, this administration continues to put people in these situations and bend or break the law. So, you know, why am I not surprised that after years of threatening to break the law or even breaking the law in many instances, we are once again in a situation where they have put our service members in this position? So after you and and Senator Kelly and others put out that video telling troops that they should not obey illegal orders. President Trump went after you, and you posted some shocking recordings of threats you received after Trump reacted to that video.

55:08Here's part of those recordings. I hope whoever blows your brains out records it, because I would like to watch you stupid You deserve to die. I hope you all get murdered. I hope you all get f***ing throat slashed. You disgraced America. That's just some of it. Why did you decide to share these threats? Well, because America needs to know, everybody needs to know what this president is trying to get people to do. You know, this president is reckless beyond belief. This president doesn't understand the impact of his words and his actions. And even if he did, he does not care, which is even worse.

55:51This president called for my execution, for my hanging, for my arrest, and is even weaponizing the FBI to this day against me and the others who simply remind people of their oath to the Constitution, who remind people of their legal obligation, which to Donald Trump and in Trump world is a great sin, because they cannot tolerate people that have fidelity to anything other than Donald Trump. Well, guess what? But he picked the wrong person to pick a battle with and to pick a fight with. My obligation is to the Constitution. I have taken many oaths. I will not back down. I will stand by our service members, and I will continue to do so.

56:28And he's not going to threaten me. He's not going to intimidate me, and he's not going to get me to bend down. I will be unrelenting, unrelenting in my pursuit of the truth in this instance and my fidelity to my oath into the Constitution. Former Army Ranger Democratic Congressman from Colorado, Jason Crow. Thank you, sir. Appreciate your time. Thank you. Much more ahead on The Lead tonight, including what we learned when accused murderer Luigi Mangione appeared in court today as his lawyers tried to get some key evidence thrown out in his murder case. Plus, the White House acknowledging today it is also targeting legal, legal immigration as part of President Trump's intensifying crackdown.

57:06I'm going to ask former Homeland Security officials from both Democratic and Republican administrations about these new moves ahead.

57:16In our Law and Justice lead, Luigi Mangione, the 27-year-old accused of murdering United Healthcare CEO Brian Thompson in the streets of Manhattan one year ago this Thursday, is back in court this week. His defense team is seeking to have key pieces of evidence tossed from his state murder case. A handgun, a loaded magazine, and a notebook with writings that authorities call a manifesto, ones that prosecutors allege tie him to the killing. His defense argues that police searched his bag without a warrant. Joining us now, John Richardson. He's the author of the new book, Luigi, The Making and the Meaning.

57:50John, thanks so much for joining us. What do you think this move from Mangione's attorneys signals about their strategy overall?

58:04Thanks, Jake. I mean, I got to say, I'm not a lawyer. So as I'm a reporter, it's awkward for me to comment on that. But, you know, they're doing what it seems like they're doing what attorneys do, which is try to get evidence thrown out, try to delay and, you know, hope for the best. so Mangione's attorney Karen Friedman Agnifilo filed before the trial to prevent the prosecution from showing the contents of her client's writings in the hearing worried that it could taint the jury pool she objects to those who call it a manifesto from what you know of the writing is it a manifesto I have to go with her on that it doesn't really read like a manifesto I mean for me, one of the most interesting things that came out of today was that he asked the police for an opportunity to make a statement to the public.

59:03Because I mean, my book, the reason I called it Luigi, the Making and the Meaning is I was trying to figure out like, first off, how did where did he come from? What did he read? What radicalized him? That kind of thing. What were his concerns? And also, like, how did he fit? What did it mean? How does he fit into the culture and is this part of a broader pattern which it seems to be uh but you know the the problem is is that the if it's a manifesto quote unquote it's not a very good one and it doesn't really make clear what he was thinking um so uh uh you know i don't think it's effective as a manifesto.

59:46And I think like, to me, the mystery is why he had that stuff on him in the first place. And was he intending to give it to the police? Was he hoping to get caught? Was he hoping to turn thinking of turning himself in because he threw a lot of stuff out? Why wouldn't he throw out the gun? It's weird and mysterious, like so much of this case really mysterious. Why do you think he has become such a cultural phenomenon? I mean, he is an accused murderer. And I think there are a lot of people who are just horrified by the fact that anybody thinks that he is, you know, some sort of Robin Hood or some sort of noble figure.

1:00:30What do you make of it all? Right. Well, sure. I mean, he killed the father of two children, a man just walking to work, shot him in the back. I mean, it's a horrible thing. Allegedly killed. But, you know, the reason people who want to say murder is bad and this is a terrible thing and we shouldn't do these things, which is a platitude, are sort of like overlooking why this case is different and unique. I mean, most of these killings are pretty unpalatable. They're in a church or in a synagogue or they're in a school. You know, maybe they have a philosophy behind it, but, you know, nobody really cares.

1:01:22But this was different. This seemed to be like the rare idealistic trying to do something good kind of killing. I mean, I feel nervous even saying that, but that's the fact, I think. You know, when I looked at his track record, it really seemed like he was trying to figure out what was wrong and trying to like with climate change and artificial intelligence and the world that we live in. He had the concerns of a typical young person. which makes it even more agonizing that those concerns would bring him to this point. So then you think, was he crazy? None of those things really click in. One of the things I do in the book is talk about the peaceful environmentalist theory.

1:02:12I mean, a lot of his writings focus on climate change. although he's not a doomer he's been interested in nuclear power it's all very like non cliched i mean it's it's complex uh but but you know in trying to solve these problems like the peaceful environmentalists the scientists went through all the crimes that ever were committed by environmentalists. And it basically comes down to sabotage, not to murder. The only murderer in environmentalism is pretty much Ted Kaczynski, which is sort of part of the stuff I discuss a lot in the book, because that's what sort of pulls Luigi into a story. And I think he is unique.

1:03:06Okay. Luigi, The Making and the Meaning is available now. John H. Richardson, thank you so much. Special Envoy Steve Witkoff and Trump's son-in-law Jared Kushner are getting ready to meet with Vladimir Putin as they try to negotiate an end to Russia's brutal war against Ukraine. We're going to go live to the Ukrainian capital ahead of that key meeting next.

1:03:28In our world lead, several high-stakes diplomatic peace talks over ending Russia's war in Ukraine are ongoing. And according to a White House official, President Trump's son-in-law Jared Jared Kushner is traveling to Moscow, joining Trump's top negotiator, Steve Witkoff. Witkoff is expected to meet with Russia's Vladimir Putin. CNN chief international security correspondent Nick Payton-Walsh is in Kiev, Ukraine for us. Nick, where do the negotiations stand right now? We don't know exactly what it is that Steve Witkoff and Jared Kushner will present to Putin in the coming hours, but it is the product of hours of negotiations with Ukraine's team in Florida, including, we've learned, a Monday morning Miami early second meeting between Wyckoff and the top Ukraine negotiator, Rustam Umerov.

1:04:11Clearly hammering out details down to the last minute. Ukraine's president, Vlodymyr Zelensky, in Paris meeting the French president, Emmanuel Macron, discussing the details of this proposal with Wyckoff on the phone and the UK prime minister as well. Clearly briefing allies there and clear in public that it's territorial concessions that are going to be the key sticking point here. for many months a red line for Ukraine, although it does sound as though the concept of territorial swaps is becoming more frequently discussed in the noise we've been hearing around these particular negotiations, as indeed too vitally important for Ukraine.

1:04:45If any of that is to be entertained, security guarantees potentially as well, possibly from the United States and Europe as well. Is any of this going to be enough to sway Putin, who's been public on his demand for all of the Donetsk region to be given to him without a fight in exchange for peace? That's unclear. We'll find that out in the hours ahead, Jake. Does Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky feel pressured to make a deal, even if it's not one that he finds acceptable? I think unquestionably, Jake. That is what really has changed. It's not just because of the position on the front line that he's in.

1:05:21And make no mistake, that is bad. On multiple different points, Russians moving forward in slow incremental amounts. But make no mistake of the direction of travel here, particularly today, the Russians claiming to have taken the strategic hub of Pukrovs. They've been fighting for it for many months, lost thousands in that particular fight. And of course, it's massively convenient that ahead of the meeting in the Kremlin, they claim to have made that particular gain, something Ukraine will surely push back on. but also Zelensky himself under increased domestic political pressure. Friday, his chief of staff and top negotiator resigned after his home was searched by anti-corruption investigators.

1:05:59That has left Zelensky weak domestically, really for the first time since the war indeed began. That's likely playing on his mind as well. And don't forget, Jake, we had a Thanksgiving deadline for a peace proposal. That has whizzed past into this new phase of negotiations. But clearly in the backdrop of all of this, Zelensky acutely aware of President Trump impatience for peace here and the damage that might do to Ukraine's support and position if they don't try and find something. Ultimately, though, the question is, does Putin want peace? And I think many see the barrages Ukraine sustaining every night here.

1:06:32One last night, killing four in Dnipro with a ballistic missile and think the Kremlin does not want peace, particularly unless it sees grossly favorable terms to itself. Nick Payton Walsh in Ukraine, thanks so much. As President Trump ramps up his immigration crackdown in the wake of the National Guard shooting in D.C., I'm going to be joined next by two men who worked at the Department of Homeland Security, one under a Republican president, one under a Democratic president, to get their thoughts on the new policies and if they think they'll work.

1:07:04In our national lead, cities nationwide are bracing for an intense crackdown on immigration in the wake of last week's shooting of two National Guard members in Washington, D.C. The Trump administration's plan is two-pronged. One, launch an interagency federal investigation into the shooting and the shooter's past, while also directing senior officials to stem migration in general into the United States. Ken Cuccinelli was President Trump's former acting deputy secretary for Homeland Security. John Sandweg is the former acting director of ICE under President Obama. Thanks for joining us. So White House Press Secretary Caroline Levitt was asked about what the administration is doing now in the wake of this horrific shooting.

1:07:44Take a listen. We have paused all asylum adjudications. And then, of course, the special immigrant visas, which we know many Afghans utilize to come into the country under the Biden administration, have also now been paused. Ken, do you think that's a good idea? Yes, I thought it was a good idea years ago. And not just for Afghanistan. Of course, the shooter was Afghani. But there are a number of countries, particularly in the Middle East, where we don't have a practical ability to vet people. So we can have a process set up. But if you don't have a process set up that involves reliable sources of information that are thorough on the other end, which doesn't exist in good chunks of the Middle East, then we shouldn't be accepting people from those countries.

1:08:30And that finally seems to be the step that this administration is moving toward. Obviously, the special immigrant visas that Caroline Leavitt was referring to there, those are for individuals who served, Afghans who served with the U.S. in Afghanistan. John, if you were still working at ICE, what changes would you support? Well, Jake, I think it certainly makes sense to take a hard look at the vetting operations and make sure nothing failed here. I'd be especially concerned about stove piping. I mean, these guys go through biometric, biographic background checks with multiple agencies. Certainly the concerns we've seen historically where there have been vetting failures in the U.S.

1:09:07have been certain agencies, intelligence agencies, don't want to disclose additional data that they have. But I'll tell you, Jake, another thing I look real hard at here is was this a vetting failure at all or was this, as Secretary Noem said, a potential radicalization after he entered the United States? And in that case, what concerns me is have we weakened our capacity to detect someone who becomes radicalized after they're in the U.S. by pulling these FBI agents off the JTTFs or pulling special agents from Homeland Security investigations or ICE criminal investigative agents away from their national security work in furtherance of this routine immigration enforcement and mass deportation effort.

1:09:43Those are the agencies that would detect whether a threat develops in the United States. And I'm not saying they would have detected this, but certainly I'd say that had we have them operating in their national security functions at full capacity, we'd have a better chance of detecting this before the shooting happened. Well, respectfully, that, you know, when when when the Biden folks were dumping people into this country, the idea that we could be rolling a continuing vetting process over numbers that large really is is is not practical. It wasn't doable before that point in time. The Department of Homeland Security was starved of the manpower by Congress that it needed to do that kind of vetting.

1:10:28The better long term solution is keeping anyone out who we aren't quite certain is safe to bring in. Now, John makes the very good point that Kristi Noh made. You know, there is the other question of radicalization within the United States. But let's not kid ourselves about the capacity of the Department of Homeland Security following an invasion, a voluntary allowed invasion by the last president. Those numbers are just overwhelming. And until we start removing millions of them, DHS will not be able to keep up with the vetting necessary to continually keep this country safe. John, what's your response to that?

1:11:07I mean, obviously, a lot of the individuals that were brought in from Afghanistan after the war was brought to its ignominious end were individuals who had worked with the United States and were, you know, possibly going to be murdered by the Taliban if they stayed behind. Yeah, Jake, I think it's important not to conflate two issues. I agree with Ken that we had the system overwhelmed. The numbers we were seeing at the border were simply too great. Fortunately, those numbers are now down to zero. Credit to the Trump administration for that. But at the same time, I think we have the capacity to do the recurrent vetting.

1:11:41What concerns me, though, again, vetting, when we say vetting, all we're talking about is running biometric and biographic information through U.S. government holdings, intelligence holdings, but also critically the holdings of domestic law enforcement agencies whose job it is to detect terror threats in the U.S. And my point, Jake, is that we've diminished our capacity to collect that information. This is now September 25. His asylum application was granted during the Trump administration. He's been in the U.S. nine months. During that time, we pulled FBI agents, like I said, diverted their attention away from their core functions and ICE agents away from their core national security and public safety criminal investigations to doing, you know, Home Depot parking lots.

1:12:18And what I'm saying is we've diminished our capacity to detect new threats. So it's not so much a vetting thing as it is an intelligence for incapacity inside the United States. Yeah. Yeah, John, your audio and video is going in and out a little bit. We're out of time anyway. So thanks to both of you. Really, really appreciate it. President Trump won Tennessee's 7th congressional district by 22 percentage points last year. So why are Republicans spending so much money into the special election there tomorrow? We're going to go live to the campaign trail next.

1:13:00In the politics lead, cue the election music. Yes, the CNN election jam. Tomorrow night, one last special House election is the final chance this year for Democrats to prove that their momentum is no fluke as Republicans are now fending off a potential upset in what's usually a very reliably red district. It includes parts of Nashville, Tennessee. CNN's Eva McKen is on the ground in these final hours of campaigning in this special House race. A special election Tuesday in a heavily Republican congressional district in Tennessee is emerging as an unlikely political battleground, with Democrats eyeing an upset.

1:13:39I don't care who you voted for. I don't care what political party you belong to. But if you are upset about the cost of living in the chaos of Washington, then I'm your candidate. Democrat Afton Bain, a state representative and progressive organizer, is centering her campaign on affordability, seeking to harness the party's momentum after big wins in Virginia and New Jersey last month. But in a district that Donald Trump carried by 22 points last year, Republican Matt Van Epps, a former Army helicopter pilot running with the president's endorsement, is seen as the favorite, even as both parties expect a closer result.

1:14:14We need all Republicans in the Tennessee 7th Congressional District to put on their jersey, get on the field and get out and vote for us. The 7th District is largely rural, including parts of Nashville, but stretching from the state's border with Kentucky in the north to Alabama in the south. The election here drawing national attention with Trump holding a virtual rally today for Van Epps and House Speaker Mike Johnson joining the Republican nominee on the trail. Bain is receiving help from the party's leaders, such as progressive Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez and former Vice President Kamala Harris.

1:14:51Since the primary last month, more than$5 million has been spent on advertising in the race, fueled by outside groups, with Republicans accounting for more than$3 million and Democrats about$2.1 million. I'm a very radical person. The GOP advertising has focused on portraying Bain as out of step with the conservative-leaning district. Bain says Republicans are trying to distract from cost-of-living concerns. As an activist and organizer, a lot of those comments have been taken out of context and or mischaracterized. I just feel like the Republican apparatus is breathing down my neck, but it's because they don't have a plan to make health care more affordable.

1:15:29Republicans believe the district's partisan lean, along with Bain's progressive profile, will tilt the race in their favor. She is pretty far away from the mainstream of even Tennessee Democrats, much less Tennessee Republicans. But, you know, those are going to be for the voters to decide. While Democrats who have overperformed in special elections this year are hoping to send a message heading into next year's midterms. It's a very important chance for Tennessee voters to really speak loudly and clearly and say, hey, we're upset. We need some help.

1:16:05And Jake, what is remarkable is that Speaker Johnson, not in Washington right now on the first day back from the Thanksgiving recess, he is here in Tennessee barnstorming the state with Van Eps a dozen events, he says today. And I put that question to him. Is this a warning sign for the GOP that they have to campaign so hard here in this district that went big for Trump? He downplayed it, said he would be here anyway. but it really speaks to the tight margins in the House right now, especially with Marjorie Taylor Greene set to retire next month. Jake? All right, Evan McCann in Tennessee's 7th District.

1:16:40Thanks so much for that report. Have fun in Nashville. Tonight, police are investigating multiple bomb threats made against the offices of the Democratic leader of the Senate, Chuck Schumer of New York. Senator Schumer is going to join us live in moments to tell us the details.

1:17:02In our politics lead, Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer, Democrat of New York, said his offices in Rochester and Binghamton and Long Island all received bomb threats. In a statement, Leader Schumer says the threats contained, quote, the email subject line MAGA and from an email address alleging the 2020 election was rigged. Local and federal law enforcement responded immediately and are conducting full security sweeps. Everyone is safe, unquote. And Leader Schumer joins us now. Senator, We're glad everyone's okay. What more are you hearing from law enforcement about these threats? Well, we've asked the FBI, Jake, to undergo a full investigation, find out who did this.

1:17:38Obviously, it's someone intent on doing a lot of harm, and we need to get to the bottom of this. Now, thank God everybody's safe. I want to commend law enforcement. We had federal law enforcement as well as local law enforcement from Binghamton and Long Island. They had the dogs there right away. We evacuated people as quickly as we could. And thank God no one was hurt. But this is not the end of it. We've got to find out who did this and how dangerous this person obviously is and make sure they never do it again. Was there, I mean, the bomb threats obviously are horrific no matter what. But did they, was anything found, any incendiary device?

1:18:16Not yet, but the investigation is still ongoing. You know, the bomber, the threat person who made the threats said that he had hidden the bomb. But they've done a very thorough investigation. They think the buildings are safe. I want to ask you about today's Oval Office meeting about potential U.S. military action against Venezuela. You have warned that senators will force another vote under the War Powers Act to block military action in Venezuela if Trump goes any further. Are you hearing privately from any Republican senators who might be concerned about military action against Venezuela? Tell us more.

1:18:52First, the bill is bipartisan. It's Rand Paul, Tim Kaine, myself, and I think now Senator Schiff. And we are hearing in this area there are a lot of Republicans who are troubled. Frankly, there are Republicans who don't have faith in Hegsef and in what is going on there as well. And so we are seeing for the first time some of our key Republicans who are defense hawks really worried about what the administration is doing in both the Caribbean and in Venezuela. You've also called on the Secretary of Defense Pete Hegseth to testify before Congress about what the White House admitted today happened, which was that follow-up strike, the double tap on an alleged drug trafficking boat in the Caribbean on September 2nd.

1:19:35You called on Hegseth to release the full tapes of the attack. We heard earlier in the show Chairman Wicker saying that he is seeking those tapes as well. What sort of action are Democrats prepared to take to try to make this happen, getting those tapes? Well, we hope that we can bring before the committees bipartisan, as you said, Senator Wicker has been very much involved here, and get the top military people to testify. And we hope that they will release the tapes. You know, Hegseth is hiding something here, and he's known to be a liar. He said that the Washington Post story had no validity, and today the White House directly contradicted him that it did.

1:20:15And if he has nothing to hide, if he said he did nothing wrong, if he said no laws were violated, release the tapes. That's the first step. And second, we need to bring top military brass before the committees to testify as to what they knew happened and how it happened. I want to also ask you about the Obamacare subsidies that are now set to expire at the end of this month. It's December 1st. It's going to expire December 31st. Obviously, that will send premiums skyrocketing. House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries says that House Speaker Mike Johnson tanked Trump's counter-healthcare proposal.

1:20:51There was some talk of Trump talking about a short extension of these subsidies. Do you agree that Trump tanked this proposal? I'm sorry. Do you agree that Speaker Johnson tanked the Trump proposal? And is there any bipartisan fix in sight? Well, look, here's the bottom line, Jake. The Republicans are a total mess on health care. They don't know what to do. More than half the House members are against anything in ACA, any extension of the ACA premiums, so to avoid the great harm that people will face. Their premiums going up$500,$1 ,000 a month. How is a working family going to pay for that? They have different views as to what to replace ACA with.

1:21:34They're not even ready with a proposal. and furthermore they're all hung up on the issue of extending the Hyde Amendment, which precludes abortions from the federal government, federal money from being used. Now they want to stop the states from doing it as well. So they can't even come to an agreement themselves. So Johnson is a mess, Trump is a mess, they don't know what to do and the American people are left hanging out because this is going to be one of the greatest increases in their cost of living that they have seen in a very long time. I have heard from Democrats who say that Obamacare is not functioning as well as it should.

1:22:11And obviously health insurance premiums, not just in Obamacare, but throughout the country for everyone, are skyrocketing. Is there room for bipartisan work there on the fact that health insurance companies are making record profits and increasingly Americans can't afford insurance? Well, the bottom line is there's such a division between the parties. Republicans want to make people pay more. One of their major proposals is privatize the whole thing, which will raise people's costs. What Democrats want to do is lower people's costs. The first step, of course, is extending the ACA premiums, which were totally, unlike the Republicans, were totally united on that issue from one end of the party to the other.

1:22:55And then we want to make health care more effective and cheaper for the average American, just the opposite of what most of the Republicans want to do. If they want to come to us and say we want to work with you to lower premiums, I mean to lower costs, to make health care better, fine. But right now they're headed in the opposite direction. All right, Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer, Democrat of New York, thank you so much for taking the time to talk to us. We appreciate it, sir. Jay, nice to talk to you once again. Thank you. You can follow me on Facebook, Instagram, threads, Blue Sky Accent on the TikTok at Jake Taffer.

1:23:28You can follow the show on X and Instagram at The Lead CNN. If you ever miss an episode of The Lead, you can watch the show on the CNN app. Aaron Burnett out front starts now.

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