How to Stop Fighting at Work

0:02Welcome to The Look 'n Sound of Leadership, an ongoing series of executive coaching tips designed to help you be perceived in the workplace the way you want to be perceived. I'm Tom Henschel, your executive coach, and today we're talking about how to stop fighting at work. Josh and Cheyenne had been feuding so long they couldn't remember how it had started. But it was still radiating heat. When they were in the same space at work, people were nervous a spat could erupt at any moment. Their boss Mike was infuriated by behavior that to him looked childish and unprofessional. He told me, I've talked to them both.

0:45Either they blame the other one or they say they're ashamed of themselves and they're sorry and they'll never do it again, blah, blah, blah. It's like dealing with teenagers. Mike told me Josh and Cheyenne actually had known each other as teenagers. After her mom's second marriage, they had become step cousins. They'd spent a fair amount of time together and they'd liked each other. But then things happened. Feelings got hurt but not forgiven, slights festered into wounds, and now years later, they were co-workers. And at fairly regular intervals, one of them could be heard shouting at the other one, and then a few stormy days would follow.

1:23Mike wanted it to end. He asked me if I'd ever done anything like this before, and I told him that with varying degrees of success, I had. He asked what I thought had made the difference. I said, people have to be ready to stop fighting. If they want a way out, I can probably help them. But if they're committed to keep fighting, I probably can't. Mike was a realist. While they both say they want the fighting to stop, whether they will or not is anybody's guess, I began by meeting with each of them separately. Cheyenne began her time with me by expressing her gratitude for our work together. She told me she felt tired and embarrassed.

2:04She was hungry for whatever I had to offer. So I listened to her. I heard how Josh was a big lunk who had no idea how offensive he was. I heard how he always had to be right and couldn't listen to anyone else, particularly a woman who was as smart as he thought he was. I heard how he intentionally did things just to piss her off. I heard a lot. Then I asked her what her part in the fight was. How was she contributing to keeping the feud alive? I don't cut him any slack, she said, quick as a flash. I see him for who he is. No matter what he does, he's never going to be trustworthy. Never going to be trustworthy, I said.

2:48That's quite something. So you keep the feud alive by denying he could ever have good intentions. It's only fair, she said. He's out to get me as much as I'm out to get him. It doesn't sound like you're ready to stop fighting, Cheyenne. No, I am, she said, but really, Tom, it feels dangerous to let my guard down. And listen, I have always been tough. Show me you mean something by doing it, not by what comes out of your mouth. I don't care about your sob story. He says he wants this all to stop, but he's not exactly a man of his word, at least not with me. Our customers love him, but not me. Could I suggest a piece of homework for you, I asked.

3:28The question made her happily surprised. Sure. I said, let me tell you why this particular tool came to mind. I'm hearing that your heart is closed off to him. He's not trustworthy. You're defended against him. Sound accurate? Yes. She took a breath, ready to elaborate, but she stopped herself. I went on. If you two are really going to reconnect, one tool I think will help you both is empathy. For you, that would mean seeing him as a person who has feelings and emotions It would mean opening up to him a little That would be your homework She did not look enthused She asked, how would I do that?

4:16Have empathy, I said Listen for feelings You know, I could ask you to listen for lots of things Certain types of questions People who speak in generalizations instead of speaking for themselves But in your case with Josh, I'm suggesting you listen for any situation that might prompt a feeling in him, which is most situations. So suppose Josh comes to you and he's complaining that you didn't answer his email for three days. It would be completely natural for you to defend yourself because on the face of it, he's complaining about you. But instead of taking it personally, you're going to listen for what possible feelings that situation might have evoked in him.

4:58and you have some empathy, you'd say, I can see how that could have been frustrating for you. She looked suspicious. And you're saying we're both going to do this? He's going to listen for my feelings too? I nodded. Empathy might not be the first piece of homework I give him, but at some point, yeah, I'm sure he and I will talk about empathy. In fact, empathy was not the first piece of homework I gave Josh Josh had been painted by both Cheyenne and Mike As a bull in a china shop It wasn't so much that he destroyed things As it was about him being stubborn and taking up all the air When he thought he was right He dug in and could be dismissive and mean Like Cheyenne, he expressed gratitude for the coaching and like Cheyenne, he told me his story.

5:53I heard that he wasn't sure why this feud was so hard to put to bed, that he was just being himself, which is what he always was with Cheyenne. But he would do whatever it took to cool down the temperature. I asked him, if Cheyenne were here right now, and if we asked her why she still gets so pissed off with you, what do you think she'd say? It could be a hundred things, he said. Sometimes she says I don't do things fast enough, and that pisses her off. Other times, I do things too fast, and that pisses her off. It's never just one thing with her. I have no idea what would come out of her mouth today.

6:29Is she unreasonable, I asked. I understand a lot of different things irritate her, but are they reasonable things? Can you see her point? Grudgingly, he said, some of the time. I said, it sounds like mostly you think whatever's bothering her is pretty small potatoes, am I right? They are, he agreed. I nodded and then asked, Can I give you a piece of homework? Homework? He was a little puzzled. Something to think about, I said. Something to try. Something to remember as often as you can and see what happens. Okay, he said, intrigued but skeptical. Validation, I said. Your homework is to validate what you hear from Cheyenne.

7:15So when she tells you an idea or she complains to you about something, when she tells you what's gone wrong, try to understand what she's talking about and validate what you hear. I don't think I can do that, he said. A lot of what she says I do not agree with at all. Ah, right, absolutely, I said. Josh, I'm not suggesting you agree to anything. Validation is not agreement. Validation just says, I understand how you think. I see how you got there. Or, I see why you might feel that way. Your feelings are understandable. He shook his head. She's going to hear that as agreement, no doubt about it.

7:56And then she'll use it against me. She'll say, yeah, but last time you said whatever. I suggested, so agreeing with her feels like a trap. Sometimes for sure, he agreed. Well, then I understand why you two would still be fighting. Agreement doesn't feel safe. It sucks, doesn't it, he said sadly. I think you could change it if you wanted to, I said. He gave me a side eye. How? Validation, I said again. I understand it feels risky, but I don't think it's that big a risk. I think if you started validating what you hear, just giving a little love to what she says, it could help stop the fighting. He considered for a second and then said Are you giving her the same homework?

8:45Is she going to be validating me too? Or at least understand I'm not agreeing with her? I laughed I am sure that at some point she and I will talk about validation But we haven't yet Does it matter? I guess not, he said a little sheepishly And then he said Can you help me out here? I mean, this really is not my style Not even as a dad I think I'm good with the attagirls, but I don't validate their ideas or validate their feelings. It sounds really awkward. I completely understand how it might, I said, validating his idea. He went on, not noticing. So what am I supposed to say? Like with Cheyenne, she says, I ought to respond faster to the people in accounting.

9:30But there are all sorts of reasons why I can't. So what do I say? Oh, Cheyenne, that's a great idea. I asked, do you think it's a great idea? No. Then don't, I said. Validating isn't about saying anything you don't mean. It's about validating that her ideas have value in and of themselves, regardless of what you think of them. Cheyenne tried to practice empathy. And Josh tried to practice validation. It was hard for them both. But then they noticed a shift. They noticed they were each ascribing less ill intent to the other person than they had been. They were beginning to see each other as separate adults, each deserving respect, which allowed them to move toward the look and sound of leadership.

10:32I'm going to make a guess that there is someone in your workplace Who when they pop into your mind, they hit you like sour milk You could be having a lovely weekend day outside with friends and family And this person suddenly invades your brain You flinch And I'm also going to guess that if you're like most people Your co-workers know how you feel about that person You might not be in open warfare with them, but I'm guessing it's pretty clear to everyone what you think about that person. None of this is unusual. But here's the problem. That sense of fight that you bring to the table is absolutely not the look and sound of leadership.

11:17That sense of fight that you bring to the table makes you look like Mike the boss said, childish and unprofessional. But on the other hand, really, it's hard not to flinch when you get a dose of sour milk, right? So in addition to all the ideas you heard in my conversations with Cheyenne and Josh, in this part of the episode, I want to give you a three-step process you can take to quiet your sour milk response. And then I'm going to end with a story about a fight at work that I just am still embarrassed about it when I look back on it. But first, three steps to stop the fight There was a period of time on this show about 10 years ago When I talked a lot about a two-stroke cycle That you have to use over and over again If you want to grow as a leader And the two strokes of the cycle are Self-awareness and self-management Self-awareness and self-management Self-awareness, what am I doing that is getting me the results that I want?

12:24And what am I doing that is getting me the results I don't want? And self-management. Choosing to repeat the behaviors that get you the results you want and choosing not to repeat the behaviors that don't. The first of the three steps for stopping a fight at work is self-awareness. Let me use Cheyenne as an example here. You remember I asked Cheyenne how was she keeping the feud alive? I was basically asking what was her self-awareness in her fight with Josh. And she told me she was keeping the feud alive by telling him the truth about himself, whether he wanted it or not. She knew the real Josh, and he was not trustworthy, not today, not ever.

13:05He was pissing her off intentionally, and that was what was keeping the feud alive. She was self-aware about that. What she was not self-aware about was that none of those were facts. She was driving her behavior based on her feelings, and yes, it was keeping the fight alive. Over and over during the coaching, I reflected back to her when I was hearing facts and when I was hearing feelings, and her awareness about her thoughts and her feelings and her beliefs and her predispositions began to grow. She began to be self-aware that all those things were keeping the feud alive Self-awareness was her first step towards stopping the fight For you, ask yourself, how am I contributing to having this person taste like sour milk?

14:03And I think it can be hard to see how we're contributing It's like trying to see your back in a mirror But we have a lot of episodes around building self-awareness I put them all in the show notes. Please take a look. Help yourself. So that is step one, self-awareness. How are you contributing? Step two came pretty naturally to Cheyenne. As her self-awareness grew about how she was keeping the fight alive, she wanted to know what to do next. And I challenged her, choose a different mindset. That's step two. After self-awareness, choose a different mindset. And Cheyenne asked me, like what? So I gave her two examples, and one was equity.

14:50I wonder if you noticed in the episode that Cheyenne and Josh both wanted me to reassure them that the other person was going to get the same assignments they were getting, right? They wanted everything to be absolutely fair. Whatever happens to me should happen to them too. That is not the equity I'm talking about here. My experience tells me that life is not fair. People do not have equal scores on their scorecards. So the equity I'm talking about is not in the scores. It's in the scorecards themselves. Each one of us has a scorecard we are building in our lifetime. And they're all wildly different from each other, but we all have one, all of us, including your sour milk person.

15:39And that is the equity I'm talking about. When you choose the mindset of equity, you see that no matter how sour your sour milk person is, they're just trying to get some numbers on their scorecard just like everyone else, including you. They're deserving of equity. They have feelings that are valid. They have ideas that are valid. They are a separate individual living a life deserving respect. When you choose an equity mindset, it makes it really hard to feel justified about treating someone like sour milk. Here's the second mindset I gave Cheyenne. Curiosity. Over the years, a lot of listeners write to me about conflict house.

16:27Conflict house is a concept that I introduced in two episodes. One was called Conflict and one was called the Conflict Conversation. So the idea is that Conflict House is where you are going to go with every conflict you ever have. And while you're in Conflict House, you will move between three rooms. There are two ways in to Conflict House, and those doors have different labels. One door, the one that most people use, is labeled black and white. Josh and Cheyenne came in through the black and white door. And anyone who feels justified about their position comes in through the black and white door.

17:08People who come in through the black and white doorway tend to not have a lot of self-awareness about how they're contributing to the fight. And often they are in conflict house a long time, like Josh and Cheyenne. And the going can be rough. The second door, which a lot fewer people use Is labeled curiosity People who come into Conflict House through the curiosity door Are curious about their sour milk person They are willing to listen And they're confident that things will turn out well for everyone Coming into Conflict House through the curiosity door changes your experience while you're in there, and it changes what you take away when you leave.

17:57And it's next to impossible to feel justified treating someone like sour milk when you are genuinely curious about them. So curiosity is the second mindset that I gave Cheyenne as an example. After she had done some reflecting, she ended up choosing a mindset that she called grace. She was going to work to give Josh grace. She adopted the mindset and it helped stop the fighting So first, there's self-awareness Second, choose a different mindset And here's the third step Self-management What this really is is behavior You are going to manage yourself In order to be perceived the way you want to be perceived Cheyenne wanted to be perceived as having grace And so I thought my empathy homework was going to be great for her.

18:50I told Cheyenne I wasn't asking her to feel empathy for Josh. I was asking her to display empathy for Josh. I was asking her to manage herself and display new behavior. Cheyenne's grace mindset took her in a slightly different direction. She was focused on trying to display empathy. But what she discovered was that she was listening to Josh in a way she never had before. That was her self-management, her new behavior. So the three steps to quiet your sour milk response, self-awareness, how are you contributing to the outcome, choose a different mindset, stop justifying your anger, and self-manage, choose new behavior.

19:41Next, I am going to tell you this story that even after 30 years, I'm a bit ashamed of. I'll give you the gory details right after this month's gratitude. Gratitude this month to the folks who came to Irvine for an evening of community with Dave Stachowiak and me. Dave is the host of the Coaching for Leaders podcast. He put this night together. It was really fun and interesting and exciting. And first, thank you, Dave, for making me a part of the event. And thanks to everyone for showing up so generously. It was a joy. Special thanks to my friends Susan Smalley and Kenny Rhodes. They both came out.

20:15It was so much fun to look around and see both of you there. Thanks for coming. Thanks this month to people from my past who have suddenly reemerged. A woman reached out to me recently. She told me that she had never forgotten something that I had said in a training eight years ago. And she was finally in a place in her career where she wanted to dig into it with me So we just started working together yesterday Thanks It's just one example, it's been lovely to reconnect with people Thank you so much Thank you to all of you who are in touch with your stories, with your questions, requests for materials I love hearing from you, thank you so much And of course, thank you to the people who take the time to leave a review I am so grateful This month from Australia, a listener named ZZ Noise left a five-star review titled Clear and Considered Coaching.

21:10Thanks for what you wrote, ZZ Noise, and thank you for leaving a review. Much gratitude. Okay, a story about a workplace fight that when I think back on it, it makes me cringe. This took place over 30 years ago. I'd been invited to direct a play at a summer festival in Utah. As part of my team, I brought along a woman I had known for many years to design the sets and costumes. Her name was Elizabeth. One of the things I really liked about Elizabeth was that she had strong opinions about everything. In the theater, she had opinions about the productions and the performances and the design work and everything.

21:47And she had opinions about people, too. When they displeased her, she didn't necessarily tell the person directly, but she certainly would tell me. And I usually agreed with her. One night, after rehearsal, she and I are each going over notes with a separate tech person. So she and I are standing near each other in the well between the front row and the stage, and the techies that we're talking to were both sitting on the lip of the stage looking at us. So I'm talking to the lighting designer, she's talking to the prop person, and suddenly Elizabeth began shouting at this person, name-calling, shaming.

22:24I mean, Elizabeth was blasting away at this poor girl who was a college student with a summer job. Elizabeth was really vicious and mean. If anyone had done that to me in those days, boy, I would have felt shattered. All this is happening basically right next to me. And I was frozen solid with my mouth open. I had no idea what to do. I remember feeling panic. I really wanted to protect that poor girl, but I did not know how. And I really wanted to stop Elizabeth, but I had no idea how to do that. I just stood there, and so did the lighting designer. She didn't know what to do either. Suddenly, Elizabeth orders the girl out, and she scurries away, and I'm sure she was in tears.

23:12And then Elizabeth scrambles and gathers her stuff up and gets herself out of there, and I'm sure she was embarrassed too. That was an extreme workplace fight And I had no idea how to stop it I look back and I wish I could have protected that young woman I wish I could have protected Elizabeth too But I couldn't do anything I did not know how I had zero tools Today, when I ask myself What would I do today if something like that happened? I shrug. I just think, oh, I could do any number of things. I have total comfort in my capacity to help stop a fight like that today. I have learned a lot of tools.

23:58They have helped me. And I have shared many of them here on episodes, and they're in the library for you. If you want to dig in and learn these tools for yourself, please do. I'm going to mention five episodes here that you could listen to, but there are lots more in the show notes. And also, by the way, those three steps, they're in the show notes too. So please help yourself. If you want to explore this topic further, five episodes you might listen to are first, the two that I mentioned, Conflict and the Conflict Conversation, and then the Conflict Resolution Wheel, Don't Take Anything Personally, and How to Guarantee Psychological Safety.

24:41Okay, that's it from me. Until next time, I'm Tom Henschel. Thanks so much for listening.