REPOST: Nicola Tallant on why she chose a life in crime

29:11She was following the jackal, but then she'd come home to her husband and the kids and she'd be cold. because she's completely switched on. And he'd be there like saying, you know, you haven't seen the daughter and your daughter, our daughter in three days and she's doing her leaving like her GCSEs. And she's then, oh shit, sorry. And then she tries to go into empathy mode, but it doesn't come naturally to her. Yeah. Because she's toughened up. She's got this shell that she's developed. Mm-hmm. And I think you kind of, you've thought with yourself as well because you don't, I suppose resilience stops you processing things.

29:46Right. So then if you stop processing things and then you try to just screw that up, you're not able for that. Now, if you don't have any resilience, you end up probably in treatment in a hospital. Do you know what I mean? So resilience is usually good. It's probably most of it is good. But some of it then is you have to have a little bit of kindness towards yourself and others. And, you know, I mean, I have to stop myself. I'm sure my kids say that I'm constantly telling them about. they actually do impressions of me you'd love it they're sitting at breakfast and there's no milk or something and then I go do you not know what's happening in Ukraine?

30:23Like you know what I mean I sort of always bring things to that level of ridiculousness almost and you know You go into sixth gear Yeah because it's like you have this feeling like do you not know how privileged you are but I feel that more for myself I think that you feel you can't I don't know process a lot of things probably Well it was interesting to somebody in your position who go I would wonder sometimes do you feel it hard to open up to somebody and to be vulnerable with people on the basis that your inner brain is telling me what kind of a fucking psycho am I dealing with here potentially?

30:58Well there's definitely a bit of that because like you know in what I do if you show weakness it's the worst thing you can do you can never show weakness you have to just constantly keep looking at them in the eye because criminals always try and threaten you and undermine you and they try and get at you and they try and claim to know little things about you which they just don't. Are criminals intelligent? Oh, mostly. You know, any of them are successful. Probably the ones who are... So like any area that are... They've risen to the top. They have used... They demonstrate intelligence. Oh, they have a brain and they can work systems and they can...

31:31Are some of them very bright? Some of them are extremely bright. Extremely bright. Who do you think is bright? Names that we might know. Well, I mean, you just have to look at the top of the tree at those Kinehans and realise that they're now dealing with the Iranian regime and Putin and they are moving drugs for them and they are, you know, they're working, they're in trouble with the Americans because they've been helping fund Hezbollah essentially. How do they get from Oliver Bond to mixing with that and with royalty in the United Arab Emirates? That is extraordinary. Like, we do have to take a minute and go, how did they do that?

32:07How did they make their way up that ladder into the arena of politics, of world global politics? So I suppose how I'm asking you then, and I'm trying to maybe guess then, you do it by, well, you must demonstrate enormous cunning. You must demonstrate, you must surely demonstrate the ability to think strategically as well, though. But I mean, they've languages. I mean, I couldn't be a little bit of French. They might have eight languages. They've learned about the world. They haven't just stayed in their own little lane. They have learned that they're better than that in a way. And they've gone out and they have trotted the world and they have realized where the weaknesses in countries that I hardly know exist are.

32:49And that's extraordinary. and I suppose if they had gone into legitimate business they would be the likes of the Microsoft heads. So yes they are very intelligent. They're just working in a parallel universe. Yes. But like the kind of the there's only a finite amount of people in the world get to that position top of the tree but mostly they will be sort of scammers fraudsters this kind of thing but they'll also if they want to deal with you because a lot of it is they're having a bit of fun and they will always try and suggest they know where you live or they know this or the other. So you just have to be completely, you know, show no weakness.

33:32When you say show no weakness, I mean, you must almost feel no weakness. Hold your ground. I don't know what you'd call it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You learn how to do that. So then does that kind of go into probably, you know, when I meet people first, I'm probably a little bit standoffish and trying to work out. Are they actually some sort of a psychopath? Are they okay? I know. But trying to have a couple of drinks on the street with you at Christmas is a bloody nightmare. I mean, my defences are down, Nicola. You know, and you're there. I'm just working you out. Right, you might be on your third gin and tonic, but I've got you figured out, Rosenstock.

34:09Yeah, there you are. Looking all sort of cheery and smiley and kios in South Down Street. But why are you here really, Rosenstock? Just for my listeners, we had a few drinks together at Christmas and we met some people and I bumped into Nicola during the evening and we had a great royal time. We had a really good, we were all on good Christmas cheer. Absolutely. And I was taking the piss out of people and you were in good top form as well. We were kind of running the crowd for a while there in Kios, I think. We were, yeah, we were putting on a mini podcast. People were gathering around. It was a little mini podcast.

34:40That was funny. So interesting, so interesting. So a couple of other, like the Kinahans, you said the Daniel Kinahan there, that he's a fascinating character. Is he more, is he of Christie or is he even beyond Christie? Is he like, you know, completely outdoing his father? Or is he trying to? I don't know. Or is he trying to? Maybe. Do they have a relationship? Yeah. Yeah. Father-son relationship? Yeah. And, you know, funny, there's some creepy little things that you hear about. he people who would know him would always say he's sort of his sort of baby-like to the father on the phone and stuff and yet you know he's ordering murders like they're pizzas yeah peculiar character the father was definitely is a peculiar character and he is too Is the father alive?

35:29Yeah yeah 80s, 90s? No no he would be only in his 60s now Really? So he obviously had the son very young He had them well they're 40s you see They feel like they're around forever, don't they? So, yeah, he's in his 60s, but still very much, you know, and resolved to, up until recently, take over the shipping routes of, you know, the world. Like, I mean, the ambition knows no end. You know, buying planes from the Israelis and moving cocaine up through Africa during COVID and air ambulances and things like this. The brain never stops. Highly intelligent. he is supposed to have been a member of Mensa the father Daniel Kinahan for me when you look at his achievements I look at Tyson Fury I knew nothing about boxing at all I can tell you from South County Dublin it wasn't a sport I would have known anything about but it is an amazing sport and very interesting I only know about it through my crime work but he did take Tyson Fury from the scrap heap and he you know brought him back to become the heavyweight champion of the world which is an extraordinary thing to do.

36:39Even though the accusation is in the background he was using, you know, his influence and probably dirty money to make things happen. But even without that, to have done that, to have had that one achievement in life and it's never enough. There's never enough. So no matter how intelligent people are, I always envy people in life who are satisfied with their lot. I think that is happiness. When people are just satisfied. They mightn't have a huge amount, but they're satisfied in their home with their partner, with their kids, with everything around them. They don't constantly strive for more because that's an irritant when you're like that.

37:19You can never just totally relax when you're constantly striving for more. And, you know, it's illogical. What are you striving for when you have really everything that matters at the end of the day? I see it slightly differently. I mean, I do understand exactly what you're saying, but I think there's more to striving for more than striving for more material gain. I think there is striving because you want to deliver. Like, I'm not a religious person at all, but I do have a kind of a, I do have a spiritual belief in the idea of be thankful for the talent you were given and honour it. Honour it.

38:00Have you always felt that or is that more? It's something that's grown in me, this idea that it's a sense of privilege, luck that I feel I've been given. And I see people who are laughing at things that I do and I feel so gifted and blessed that I can do it. And then I feel I've got to deliver on this. I've got to keep working on my talent to almost honour the fact, don't let it lie fallow. Keep at it like more, more, more, more, not for more money or for more fame or adulation. it's definitely to keep honouring the thing that you have been lucky enough to be given because so many people are just so in you know I mean you said it there a minute ago Ukraine and the vast majority of people don't even have fresh water to drink you know and I have this thing that I've been given to make people happy and laugh honour it honour it I get that it's like that thing and did you ever see Chariots of Fire and the guy who was very religious and he said God gave him speed and he must honour God he must honour God and deliver on it.

39:01But anyway, it's an interesting one. And haven't you luck if you've found what you're good at early on? Oh, it's a fluke, total fluke. That is a kind of a very, you know, you see people who are still in careers going, oh, I don't really know what I want to do. Well, you said people who are satisfied. There are a lot of people who settle for things and they appear satisfied. But they're the people I worry about because they're the people that later in life, a lot of the resentment surfaces. Maybe, yeah. And, you know, you go, oh, right, like, so I have no relationship with the kids and I broke up with the wife when I was there.

39:30And why? Well, because there was something there the whole time that you never itched the scratch. You never scratched the itch, you know? But anyways, but I do broadly understand what you're saying. I'm fascinated by this, you know, now that we're on the Cainahans thing. So the father is still working away. The son is trying to emulate maybe the father and go beyond him. He's an international player of Ronaldo or Messi-like levels. He's sanctioned by the Americans. he's doing business with the Iranians and the Putin and the Russians running drugs all over the world. Do you know where he is? He's in Dubai.

40:06Yeah. And what do the Dubai authorities, they know where he is. Yeah, this is where it gets complex because so we're putting together a file. The Americans obviously have a bounty on his head. The Emirates are playing a game, a political game. They're signing treaties and they're saying, oh yes, yes, we'll hand them once. The paperwork is there. But it's a long time happening now. All these things that are a long time happening end very quickly and swiftly. I mean, I've seen it before, these people that are untouchable and, you know, very, you know, within a few days they're behind bars and that's where they're staying and it's all over for them.

40:46But it feels like certainly this political games. I do know that Daniel Kinahan has a very good friend who's one of these sort of bratty younger royals. and he probably got into mixing with him through the boxing. I think their connections with that part of the world started way back around the early 2000s when they were on the racetracks in the UK, kind of period forgotten nearly. They were dipping in to try and see how much money they could launder through horse racing, which is a brilliant way of laundering money. And there's a lot of very rich people that own horses and that are mixing and mingling in that world.

41:26And I think they made strong connections there. They have some protections. At the same time, there's very few people who appear on a wanted poster, you know, for the DEA, for the US Treasury, who actually live out to see the retirement. You know, they look untouchable until they're not. Yeah. And, you know, cops would always say to you, the criminals have to be lucky every day. We just have to be lucky once. And it's a kind of a little thing that come out. Do you think he moves around between Russia and Japan? No, no. No, I think he stayed in the Emirates. I think he's afraid to move. I think he's protected somewhat there.

41:59And, you know, I mean, what would life be like? I mean, I certainly wouldn't sleep straight in bed at night waiting for the any day or when will it? Will they come for me? Will they not? He has a confidence. He has gone to ground with the social media stuff. He did pop up really heavily in around 22 after Tyson Fury. He was on social media. Yes. And he was being photographed. He was being spoken about. He actually made a big long podcast with a guy called James English in the UK, which has never seen the light of day. Never? No, it never got out. It was three hours. Have you ever been allowed to do three hours in a podcast?

42:37You would be, but... I wouldn't. They'd edit me. They'd chop me down. Well, we edit ourselves here. Well, I would edit myself. Sorry, rather Patrick would edit it. Patrick would tell you to wrap it up if it went on for three hours. Well, he'd let me do three hours with you and then... He'd wrap it up. Well, he'd possibly go, I thought that was so interesting we'll do it in three episodes. Yeah, well. Well, I mean, Joe Rogan does three hour podcasts with Elon Musk and people like that and anybody. Anyway, he's done that and it's sitting somewhere on the cutting floor. I don't know, but he was very much coming out and then the sanctions and he's gone back to ground.

43:09Just sorry, jumping completely. Have you any interest in, have you had any interest in covering Conor McGregor? Well, Conor McGregor sits in a kind of a complex position because obviously we covered the trial, the civil trial. He's appealed that now and waiting decision on what's going to happen with that. He floats beside a lot of people that we're talking about. Adjacent. He knows a lot of the kind of the Cunningham cartel from growing up with them. And a lot of them were involved in boxing, which, you know, in that kind of industry, they love going, they always went and went to the Conor McGregor fights and all the rest of it.

43:49And he would have been photographed with them and that. But there's, as we have to constantly remind ourselves and say, to keep ourselves clean, he's no involvement in organised crime. He just knows these people and he's floating around with them and he doesn't mind hanging out with them. He's moving into an arena now that is very political and far right. And you kind of, I don't try and avoid it if I have to cover it, but it just results in such a pile on. Do you find him an interesting character? Or is he in your world? Or not so much? Personally, just I don't. I find him quite abhorrent, to be honest with you.

44:30No, I didn't mean that. He makes my lip curl. Yeah, but so do a lot of these people. So do a lot of people you have to deal with. But I suppose he's not, he's coming onto my radar as somebody on the periphery. He's not actually doing anything that's illegal. He's making his money legally. He's mixing with interesting people, I suppose. So I have the same attitude to him probably that a normal, you know, anybody would have. Yes. He's done a big interview that'll be probably out by this. Tucker Carlson, yeah. Tucker Carlson. I'll probably tune in to listen to what he has to say and just, you know, curl my lip at it.

45:05But yeah, he's moving into strange arena, isn't he? Yeah, he is. And definitely there's going to be a reduction in sales of those cloth caps. Has he disconnected from reality? and that does happen funny enough to a lot of people that live in that world where they're completely surrounded they've too much money really My opinion? Utterly completely divorced from reality Yeah Yeah I think so too So he hasn't a clue what's going on And those around him as well Yeah but it's the same as Trump in the sense of it's the yes people It's totally People who won't say no to you Yeah Yeah And you know anyway he's he's not a proud son of this city maybe is he and yet he wants to Yeah Yeah, it's a pity because he could have been Muhammad Ali.

45:48He could have been, yeah, he could have been somebody that we would have. Well, I remember when he first emerged on the scene, I mean, he used to talk about, I never have a drink, I never have a drink, that kind of, you know, that voice, that thing, I don't have a drink, I'm clean, I'm pure Buddhist, the Buddhist mentality, I am only in the... Did he always talk as if he was from a foreign country and was speaking English? No, no, no, no, no, no, no, that's a Dublin thing. that thing no that's a Dublin thing that thing of it's almost a trade union thing of I have educated educated myself into the institutionalisation and colonialisation of you and I pronounce my I-N-G's yes I am ing ing ing I'm not the normal Dubliner I don't say in in like I'm throwing I would throwing throwing you know because my father was a member of the ITGWU and I fought for the unions this thing you know but then he does this thing as well like nice to meet you my friend it's very good assholes do that we've all had an asshole friend who's visited feckin Spain for the weekend and he comes back going hey Ming what the fuck and you're there Tony you're from Rant Mines yeah yeah but he's doing it yeah no it is it is bizarre yeah but he could have been because he used to talk about how this is like back to 2015 how his body was clean and how he believed in training and almost like I just said a minute ago honouring the Lord with the grace with good grace and being good to yourself and being honouring your opponent.

47:12Because this is, of course, in real martial arts, you honour your opponent. Four years later, he's saying dance, dance, dance boy, dance to Floyd Mayweather in one of the lowest racial slurs you can do. He's throwing chairs at a window at Khabib on a bus. He's... Spitting in people's faces. Yeah, no, he's... It's just disgusting. So something went completely wrong in his life. And that's what happened. So what about The Witness? Tell me about The Witness because Eamon has been on this podcast before and I know you're doing with Jane Gogol. Tell me all about that. So The Witness was a story of redemption in a way.

47:53It was a young boy who was groomed into a drug gang very early in his life and had a horrendous time. Was forced to go out and sell drugs, deliver drugs and was abused also by a very dark character called Brian Kenney. and he, Kenny then commits a murder along with Thomas Hinchin and he comes back to where he's living with Joey O 'Callaghan and he asks him to go hide the gun, hide the get rid of the motorbike, blow it up burn the leathers but Joey escapes, goes to the police and becomes a witness and his evidence along with some other evidence puts these two guys away for life and he goes into witness protection programme, disappears he's expected to set up a new life and to live as if he never came from Dublin, never had a family, never had friends.

48:44He's given a backstory and he's 19 and it doesn't work out like that. He's too young. He's got no support system. So he sort of came back and in a bad way and I met him actually. And we sort of forged this, what is now a really good, strong friendship. We wrote a book together. We went on to do a podcast, The Witness in His Own Words, which was just Joey talking really and I suppose showing people maybe why I believed him because he's very genuine he's very articulate at telling a story and hopefully now that story is going to move into the next medium of film drama which is very exciting but for me it's always been the project that has been non I suppose financial it's the one that I really was worth doing it was worth helping Joey tell his story get it out I think it's a really valid I still get an email practically every day from somebody a teacher or something saying they've just stumbled upon the podcast or the book and they really think this should be in the schools and kids should be you know taught this story you know told this story not taught it but certainly exposed to it maybe you know all of this happened quite some time ago but it's still very relevant in modern society it's the story of how a child can be lured into a situation and then feel they've no way out and yet they do find the strength then to become ultimately a man who can who can become a very strong character and a very strong voice and it's going to go to it's going to be made into a film certainly the is there script being written at the moment yeah it's great to see something get to that place you know like I would write books every nearly a year at the moment but anyway I'll slow down with that but you sort of you know I'll write the book but that one I really had I really wanted to tell someone else's story I wanted him to tell his story he didn't have the ability to write or to put it together I did and I sort of sat in the middle of that thing and we brought it to life Do you like movies about criminals?

50:57Oh my god yeah Do you? Oh my god I mean go to bed at 10 o 'clock I can't if it starts and even on oh yeah yeah Talk to me because I love movies Oh my god I'd watch anything For example The Godfather is that that's Yeah I re-watched that every now and then I actually re-watched Love Hate which is something if anybody hasn't done that in the last decade or whatever we're talking about go do it again I love re-watching those re-watching The Sopranos The Wire some of those things Breaking Bad Yeah I loved Breaking Bad So many good series. When we started really being offered these offerings from those streamers, you know, Netflix and stuff.

51:37I would say you love ones which involve double crossing and moles. Like Donnie Brasco, I think, is one. Love that. Yeah. Isn't Johnny Depp? Yes. Johnny Depp is the mole. Is the mole. I love really intriguing stuff. But I will also watch some of those crappy kind of documentary things that, you know, of a crime in Scotland. where I've never heard it before. I love a lot of the Nordic stuff, the dramas. I pretty much watch absolutely anything and I'll know in the first 10 minutes if I'm going to get to the end of it. If I like the characters, if they've... Yeah. I mean, I'd say now... Nicola Talent says this is class.

52:17You're a good reviewer for this. Yeah. So, not Dancing with the Stars then? Not Dancing with the Stars. Unless they're all criminals. I love that. This week on Dancing... It's Dancing Daniel Kinahan doing the rumba. And here is the monk with his foxtrot. That would be grass. He probably would as well. My God, I think I've just come up with a great sketch. He'd probably be game for that. Dun, dun, dun, dun, dun. Get out of it. You're a dirty old bee. Paul Reynolds, get out of it. Paul Reynolds? You're a buzzing wasp. Match the two of them. Yeah. Paul Reynolds dancing with the monk. With the monk.

52:51That would be something, yeah. We'd all tune in for that. Have you been in touch with the monk recently? Yeah, be in touch a bit, yeah. he had an interesting experience didn't he nearly getting into power or into the Dáil at least and I sort of He did we had from my point of view we had some interesting times as well we did some sketches on him Yeah and I kind of it was a little tricky getting it over the line with the guys Yeah and I appreciate where my team Ian Dempsey and Charlie and my producer Right what were they worried about him? No no it was more like because we hadn't done a sketch on the monk So basically we were deciding to do a funny sketch on a known criminal.

53:34All right. Yeah. So that means that takes it to a different level. So that means you're making fun, if you like, of a potentially very dangerous person who has been involved in violent crime. And so that was a moment where we all have to kind of decide, well, where do we stand on this? And I guess I would have been pushing to do the sketch on the basis that he's really out there. and now he's in the public arena where the public are voting on him. Yeah. And so that brings him into my arena, if you like. Yeah. The democracy thing, you know. He's now entered our world. And so we did a few sketches on him and they went down really well.

54:13And he would totally get that, by the way. Oh, I understand he would get it. He enjoys the bit of fun that goes on with it. One of the things was he came to the door, sorry, just a woman and a husband were at the door, just they're normal people. And they go, Jesus, Gerry. there's a figure at the door. And I said, who is it? I don't know, it's a dodgy looking figure. And they go, I'll go out to him. And they open the door and it's the monk. And he's standing there with his polling card going, how are you doing, I'm the monk. Yes. Just be there around the yard here. I noticed there's things going wrong.

54:49Are there any complaints to yourself? There's a lot of complaints. There's problems with gangs around here. And you go, gangs, that's dreadful. No, that's awful to hear. that's gang G-A-N gang's all right anything else well there's some you know people burglars and stuff oh that's absolutely terrible terrible terrible terrible okay thank you I appreciate your vote goodbye so shut the door and they kind of went it wasn't too bad next thing they said wrong on the door it's Pascal Dunne get the fuck out of it you scumbag criminal yeah that was the end of the sketch in other words I suppose the motto of the thing was even Monk was regarded as halfway decent in comparison into the crowd that are in there.

55:28And you know, you've just hit the nail on the head because that's why he got so many votes. Exactly that was the attitude. They thought he was better. It was this kind of like, I had an interesting experience with the whole thing, to be honest with you. So he agrees to do the podcast, which is like brilliant, but I'm not telling anyone he's coming into the building because I look for forgiveness afterwards. so we bring him in at night in the basement and up the lifts and everything and he comes in and there's very little planning in this done but he sort of says he'll tell, I wasn't really interested in his politics because I didn't think he had any I wanted him to tell me first hand about this Kinnaghan-Hutch feud, I wanted him to tell me about meeting Daniel Kinnaghan, doing a deal, the double cross how he was nearly shot in Lanzarote this was my thing you know and of course he did it all he did it all and you know we challenged him on various things you're not going to actually you know do a Paul Reynolds on it are you in a podcast studio because someone's just going to get up and walk out certainly different journalism you're not doorstepping them and shouting allegations at them you need them to talk to create something and also he's a really interesting character and he hasn't sat down and done an interview like this ever so that was all great and then we put it out in three parts yeah it was one of those it was worth a few hours it goes off the scale absolutely like the biggest ever listened to and watched podcast I think ever made in Ireland just unbelievable yeah really figures are mental yeah about 1.5 million on YouTube alone you know 1.5 million that's kind of views on YouTube but as in that's watching it that's listening to it and watching it that's just watching it that's before you hit your audio you know figures so this is off the scale this thing you know and he went out then and he, because I think he people hadn't really heard him talk like that and I think people realised well maybe they could approach him and could say hello to him, people start kind of greeting him warmly, now he's known within a part of the North Inner City but he found that warmth elsewhere and people waving at him, doing selfies with him, going down the street, it's all gone down very positively for him and he's clever enough like his team behind him sort of suggested to him that he didn't do any more interviews because he was up there and shut your mouth say no more going forward which was probably a clever political strategy in fairness so anyway we go on and you can nobody expects him to get anywhere and then the election and then the polls are coming in and by the saturday night he was i think almost a shoe in yeah and niall who's my my co-host rings me now i was actually out you know and a couple of glasses of wine in and he had been in the newsroom and he could feel the tide turning and a lot of kind of whispers about that podcast and, you know, hmm.

58:25And he was going, listen, it's looking like he might be getting in. And I'm going, great, no problem. We'll deal with it tomorrow, it'll be grand. So then the next morning I wake up and I'm going, oh my God, he's going to get in. Oh my goodness me, this is going to be, you know, stand your ground here. Because a lot of criticism was coming then about him getting a platform, about, you know, other politicians didn't get the same. platform. There was a lot of this kind of, you know, RTE talk shows and all this sort of stuff and then he didn't get in. But this sort of wave of almost cancellation came.

59:02I just had to put my head down. It was interesting. It was interesting and there was this kind of like, nobody really wanted to quite say it, but they were going around it. But I mean, you're talking, Simon Harris, everybody was, everyone who's been interviewed was talking about the platform he got. and of course he only got one platform. Anyway, we rode the wave and came out. And ironically, Pascal got in to keep him out. Democracy won at the end of the day. Thank you, Nicola. Maybe I should appear on Crime World the next time, the Minister for Finance. I've committed some very grievous crimes.

59:38I swear I have. There was the budget 2024. That was horrific. I robbed everybody blind. I almost, I pillaged and robbed them. I practically went up and took the wallet out of their pockets. So, I'm ready to confess. 7-1-7, 7-2-14, 7-3-21. Oh yeah, I don't think any of the rest will get those figures as I would like. No, I'm not looking for views. I don't want clicks. I'm a nice criminal. I'm a nice criminal. We'd be gassed if you interviewed all the criminals on Crime World, Crime World. Simon Harris, let me say I'm deeply proud of the crimes I've committed Nicola Tallent I've left bodies everywhere I swear I have killed people I'm proud of the killings I have done I've been a leader of a gang Fine Gael one of the dirtiest nastiest ringleaders of gangs in town we're running all sorts of stuff Brilliant Crime World the Fine Gael special They all wanted the same platform as he got so actually I should open the door You should.

1:00:46Well you can have it. Yeah. What the hell am I going to ask them? Like apart from apart from the the monk I mean and the seriousness of it which it is serious as any person who's involved in crime it is serious. He has that thing though that a few of them have which is charisma. He has a charisma. Dare I say almost I put it in movie terms kind of an almost Steve McQueen stillness to him. But he's also up to something and even... I know he's up to something. Jesus Christ. What do you think I'm stupid? I mean, I think of the understatement of the fucking century. Nicola Talent has come on my podcast and go, would you not think the monk is maybe up to something?

1:01:31After all your years and that's all you have left. I'll fuck off, Paul Reynolds. Of course I'm up to something. Have you ever heard of Brinks Allied? Come with the headline. Nicola Talent. I think monk may be up to something.

1:01:49That is the best. That is the best. We've just got there, Nicola. We've got there, yeah. This is what my whole career is about with a statement like that. That's like me saying, marry a Rosenstock. Do you think Flatley might be worth impersonating? Says Rosenstock. But he's up to something when he's doing that thing, when he's coming on a podcast. He's not just coming on because he's decided it's the moment to talk. He's sending a message. But that's... He's sending a message. But that adds to his aura as my son. It does. My 17-year-old son would call it. He has aura. It adds to his aura. Yeah, it does.

1:02:22But he's actually doing far more than he looks like what he's doing. He's given an interview and he's saying this and he's saying that. But he's actually taking back his city. Yeah. That's what he was doing from the Kinnahans. And if you look at the psychology of the whole thing and who they went to war with and everything. And even actually on New Year's, he actually sent me a photograph of himself in a silly hat. Right. and you know he sent the photograph we actually ran it in the paper there was nothing else on the go he knew you'd run it of course he did and he didn't send it for my personal collection you know what I mean we have got a totally and let me see I know what you I know what you said when you received the picture you said Niall I think he didn't send this just for my personal collection well bully fucking who Batman he sends it to the investigations out of the Sunday World just wild but we were in of course I mean it was a brilliant picture and he had a ridiculous hat on and all this sort of stuff and Happy New Year on it okay but Daniel Kinnaghan sent his hit men to kill him on New Year's Eve and that's a message that not everybody gets but I get that and that's what he was doing and I'm actually you know what we get a picture of the front page of the newspaper we are running something as well and you know if Daniel Kinnaghan probably wanted to send me a photograph we would have run that as well but it was a subliminal message I'm still here Yeah.

1:03:44Wow. You know, interesting. That's how the minds, they're always about two steps ahead of you. A little bit like an addict who's trying to get you into a corner to panned over a card at a bar or something. You always have to be thinking, you know, I cannot be charmed by this. This is a really, I'm enjoying the company of this person, but he's doing something here. He has a reason. He's not just sitting here talking to me because he thinks I'm OK. you know so interesting he's up to something yeah I knew it I knew it it only took us two hours to figure that out and 30 years that's class the monk is up to something I knew it we'll leave it with that folks monk is up to something watch this space exclusive from Nicola Talent next week in the crime world she also reveals that so maybe too is Daniel Kinahan but listen she's not sure yet bye bye

1:04:44And my thanks to Nicola Talent for coming in to talk to me about her fascinating life in the crime covering business. And my thanks to you, as always, for listening to this podcast. Please tell one other person if you can. That's all I ask about this podcast. Same time, same place next week, folks. Happy Easter. Take care.