Melania Throws Donald Under the Bus on Epstein Files

28 Dec 2025 · 27 min · 7 chapters

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In short

The episode centers on claims that Melania Trump is avoiding legal service in a lawsuit brought by author Michael Wolff, after she allegedly threatened to sue him over his statements about her ties to Jeffrey Epstein. Guest/backgrounds: Michael Wolff is described as Donald Trump’s former biographer and a former biographer for Rupert Murdoch; the transcript also references Epstein’s alleged prior conversations with Wolff and Wolff’s connections to Steve Bannon.

Key claims

Melania “threw Donald under the bus” by threatening Wolff, then evaded service; Wolff seeks subpoenas and discovery from Melania and Donald, including emails/texts/phones, to probe their Epstein relationship.

Notable examples

Wolff’s account of process servers being blocked at Trump Tower; alleged Epstein photos of Trump with “topless girls”; and references to Melania’s disputed immigration/education history and Paolo Zampoli’s role in her visa and introduction to Trump.

Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.

Chapters

Tap a time to open that second in VO

Supporting an Autistic Child's Family

0:00 to 0:58

Learn about a GoFundMe initiative aimed at helping a struggling family.

“My name is Mackenzie and I started a GoFundMe for the adoptive mother of a nonverbal autistic child.”

Melania Trump and the Epstein Lawsuit

3:20 to 14:00

Delve into Melania Trump's legal troubles and her ties to the Epstein files.

“Melania Trump has thrown Donald Trump under the bus in perhaps the way he feared the most with respect to the Epstein files.”

Melania's Legal Challenges

14:00 to 14:50

Discussion about Melania Trump facing potential subpoenas and legal actions.

“He's going to want their phones, their text messages, their emails, all of their communications.”

Hunter Biden's Response to Melania

14:50 to 16:45

Examination of Hunter Biden's defiance against Melania Trump's threats.

“By the way, Melania tried to pull the same thing with Hunter Biden and Hunter Biden's like, do it.”

Michael Wolff's Insight on Melania

16:45 to 18:00

Michael Wolff shares insights regarding Melania Trump's feelings towards Donald Trump.

“What's her relationship to the modeling agents who knew both Epstein and Trump?”

Epstein Connections and Melania's Past

18:00 to 20:03

Discussion on connections between Melania Trump, Donald Trump, and Jeffrey Epstein.

“Anyway, I was talking this through with one of the people and asking, you know, so what's going on here?”

Melania's Immigration Background

20:03 to 21:30

Analysis of Melania Trump's immigration status and its implications.

“I mean, we know that Melania gave false information about her background of arriving in the United States.”
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Transcript

Automatic transcript. May contain errors.

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0:47GoFundMe is the world's number one fundraising platform trusted by over 200 million people. Start your GoFundMe today at GoFundMe.com. That's GoFundMe.com. GoFundMe.com. This podcast is supported by GoFundMe. This podcast is sponsored by IQ Bar. I've got good news and bad news. Here's the bad news. Most protein bars are packed with sugar and unpronounceable ingredients. The good news, there's a better option. I'm Will and I created IQ Bar plant protein bars to empower doers like you with clean, delicious, low sugar brain and body fuel. IQ Bars are packed with 12 grams of protein, brain nutrients like magnesium and lion's mane, and zero weird stuff.

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3:19Ben Meiselas:Thanks, Melania. Melania Trump has thrown Donald Trump under the bus in perhaps the way he feared the most with respect to the Epstein files. And now Melania Trump is running away. She is evading service by Michael Wolff, who sued her after she threatened Wolff that Wolf needed to apologize and retract statements about her connections with Jeffrey Epstein. Michael Wolf said that she was chilling his First Amendment speech and that her threats constituted an abusive process. He filed a lawsuit against her in New York, and he's ready to take discovery. He wants her deposition. He wants Trump's deposition.

4:02Ben Meiselas:He wants emails, documents, and text messages from her. He wants emails, documents, and text messages from Donald Trump. In connection with his lawsuit, he's got a process server who's been trying to serve her all across the country. She's not accepting service. Her lawyer who sent the letter threatening Wolf is refusing to accept service. He goes, I'm not representing her in connection with this. And he previously said in the letter threatening Wolf, please direct all of your correspondence to me. And so now this has backfired in Melania's face, but more significantly, this has backfired in Donald Trump's face because Michael Wolff isn't just any author, right?

4:43Ben Meiselas:Michael Wolff is Donald Trump's former biographer. Like he knows Donald Trump well, he knows Melania well, he sat down with both of them. He's spoken with so many people in Donald Trump's orbit. He knows where a lot of the bodies are buried. And so for Melania to go after Michael Wolff and then now run away from Michael Wolff after she threatened Wolff that she was going to sue him, you can see a disaster on the horizon for both her and Donald Trump. And not only is Michael Wolff Donald Trump's former biographer, he's a former biographer for Rupert Murdoch, but you know who he was potentially also going to be a former biographer for?

5:27Ben Meiselas:Yep, you know it. Jeffrey Epstein, who spoke with him and told him about and showed him photos of Donald Trump and young ladies or perhaps girls, individuals of indeterminate age. And Wolf says, I've seen photos that Epstein showed me. Wolf was told a lot of inside stories from Jeffrey Epstein, from Steve Bannon. about Donald Trump's fears regarding what Epstein knew. So Melania threatened Wolf. Melania said, I'm going to sue you, Wolf. Melania has not sued Michael Wolf. Wolf sued Melania. And now Melania is refusing to accept service right now. And Wolf, he's ready to go. He wants to go into court.

6:15Ben Meiselas:He wants discovery right now. So why I'm saying Melania threw Trump under the bus, because now you have Michael Wolff who is out there aggressive. It's like his dream come true as a former Trump biographer, right? He can get all this information in discovery now. She's opened the door to that. So here's what Michael Wolff recently said about his attempts to have a process server serve Melania Trump and her efforts to evade service of process. And so it's like, you know, she wants to be a bully. She threatened to sue Michael Wolfe for$1 billion. Michael Wolfe sued her. She didn't counter sue. And now she's running away.

6:59Ben Meiselas:I want you to watch this here. Play this clip of Michael Wolfe talking about how Melania is now running away. Play this clip. This is an update about my lawsuit against the First Lady of the United States. I think she's running from us. By suing her, we have the right to subpoena her and her husband and their friends and to ask all concern about their relationship with Jeffrey Epstein. We have tried to serve her lawyer in Florida. He has absolutely refused to take service of our lawsuit. We've sent a process server to Trump Tower, where we understand she lives, not in the White House, but in Trump Tower.

7:52And that process server, who seemed perfectly familiar with serving people in Trump Tower, a lot of dubious people there, when the server found out that it was the first lady. They panicked. They refused to do it. We got another server to go, and this was just yesterday. They arrived at Trump Tower. They were prevented from getting in by security. Security told them that they would take any papers and throw them in the garbage. But they did confirm that Melania Trump lives in Trump Tower. So this is a kind of historical point. The First Lady of the United States does not live in the White House.

8:39She lives in Trump Tower. We will now go into court as early as tomorrow.

8:46Ben Meiselas:Now, just a reminder about Michael Wolff's lawsuit. You see it right here. He filed it on October 21st of this past year. So before the Epstein files were released. And by the way, Michael Wolff, you've seen him here dozens of time on the Midas Touch Network, where he's talked about things that you're now seeing in the release of emails from the Democrats on the House Oversight Committee from the Epstein estate. Because remember, Wolf mentioned the Steve Bannon-Epstein connections, and now we're seeing lots of emails of Epstein emailing Bannon and what Bannon was telling Wolf. So everything that Wolf said is spot on.

9:27Ben Meiselas:Here's Wolf's lawsuit, and he says, On October 15, 2015, defendant Melania Trump, through her counsel, demanded that Wolf immediately retract certain statements, which Wolf allegedly published about Mrs. Trump. a copy of Trump's attorney threat letter, Melania Trump's attorney threat letter, is attached as an exhibit. Number two, the threat letter insisted that if Wolf did not comply with these demands by October 21st, 2025, at 5 p.m., that Mrs. Trump would initiate legal action against Wolf for over$1 billion in damages. And then Wolf says, as a result of this threatened legal action, It creates a climate of fear.

10:11Ben Meiselas:It creates a chilling impact on Wolf's First Amendment speech. So Wolf says, I'm suing. Here's the letter just so you can see the letter that was sent by Melania Trump to Michael Wolf. The lawyer is Alejandro Brito. Notably, Brito also represents Donald Trump on a lot of actions right here, October 15, 2025. And here's what it says. This law firm serves as litigation counsel for the First Lady of the United States of America, Mrs. Melania Trump. Please direct all future correspondents relating to this matter to my attention. This correspondence serves as a demand under Florida law that you must immediately retract and apologize for false, defamatory, disparaging, and inflammatory statements made about Mrs.

10:57Ben Meiselas:Trump, which were published in the Daily Beast and contained in the article titled, Melania Trump, Very Involved in Epstein Scandal. Author, failure to comply will leave Mrs. Trump with no choice but to pursue any and all legal rights and remedies available to recover the overwhelming financial and reputational harm that you have caused her to suffer. So you see right there, by the way, this lawyer, Alejandro Brito, is saying, please direct all future correspondents to my attention. So now that Michael Wolff has filed a lawsuit against Melania. He's directed it to Brito's attention. He goes, hey, you're the lawyer, right?

11:37Ben Meiselas:You threatened to sue me. Can you accept service of the lawsuit? Because you have to serve somebody with a summons after you file a lawsuit for you to then start discovery. The lawsuit gets filed, then you have to serve them. And you know how sometimes people avoid process servers? That's what's going on right now. But she's represented by a lawyer, right? So Michael Wolf's like, yeah, let me try to serve the lawyer and the lawyer's not accepting service. So here's what Melania says was defamatory. The article's defamatory statements. Here are the false statements in the article that were made by you, which are defamatory per se, and which were published by the Daily Beast.

12:20Ben Meiselas:Melania Trump is very involved in the Epstein scandal. First Lady Melania could be the missing link in President Trump's ties to convicted sex offender Jeffrey Epstein. Melania was very involved in Epstein's social circle and noted that this is how she met Trump. She's introduced by a model agent, both of whom Trump and Epstein are involved with. She's introduced to Trump that way. Epstein knew her well. And then the lawyer for Melania says, all of this is false. All of this is defamatory, disparaging, inflammatory. You publish this deliberately to denigrate Mrs. Trump, immediately issue a retraction and immediately issue an apology.

13:01Ben Meiselas:If you do not comply with the above by October 21st, 2025, Mrs. Trump will be left with no alternative, but to enforce her legal and equitable rights, all of which are expressly reserved, including by filing a legal action against you for over$1 billion in damages. You are hereby put on notice. And so Michael Wolff said, okay, you're putting me on notice. I'm suing you. He sues. She's now running away, avoiding process servers. He's going to have to go into court now to make a court order that says that basically after you try to serve someone a certain amount of times, a court can deem the lawsuit served.

13:42Ben Meiselas:So the court's going to deem the lawsuit served because he's gone through all of these efforts to serve her. And you know now that she actually lives at Trump Tower and not at the White House. That's been definitively established according to Michael Wolff in his opinion, my opinion. And so now he's going to get ready to unleash discovery. And who's he going to subpoena? Donald Trump. He's going to subpoena Melania. He's going to want their phones, their text messages, their emails, all of their communications. And they're going to be hauled in to have to testify right now. So when I say Melania threw Trump under the bus, Melania, if you're going to go and do this and threaten people, then you better be ready for them to file lawsuits against you for injunctive relief, anti-slap actions for abuse of process as Michael Wolff just did.

14:33Ben Meiselas:And you're going to have to be prepared. Otherwise, why would you provoke? Why would you poke a sleeping bear like Michael Wolff? Granted, he wasn't necessarily sleeping. I mean, he was covering the stuff, but now you're giving someone like that an inside track to get discovery on you and Donald Trump. By the way, Melania tried to pull the same thing with Hunter Biden and Hunter Biden's like, do it. Sue me. Please sue me, Melania. And she never sued Hunter Biden. And Hunter Biden said what Michael Wolff said. He was citing Michael Wolff's report. Here's what Hunter had to say. Here play this clip.

15:07Melania's lawyer sent me a letter saying they're going to sue me for a billion dollars. My response to that was, please do. In court, I would have the right to, number one, depose the person that sued me, and that would be the individual Melania Trump. And I would have the right to subpoena and depose and seek discovery from every single person in their circle that would potentially have knowledge about the genesis of the relationship between Donald Trump and Melania and their relationship with Jeffrey Epstein.

15:41Ben Meiselas:So I had the opportunity to interview Michael Wolff and I asked him, I said, so are you going to go after discovery? Are you going to get depositions of Donald Trump and Melania? Here's what he told me. I'm going to talk about all of the Epstein connections. You wanted to do this. We're going to do this and we're going to do discovery. I want Donald Trump's deposition right now as well. So talk to us about the discovery that you're looking to get in this Well, you know, I think that this is an opportunity to ask all of the questions that they have refused to answer. I mean, it's very straightforward.

16:14I mean, we know that Donald Trump had a long, long, deep abiding relationship with Jeffrey Epstein. Let's hear the details. Let's hear the details of their financial involvement. Let's hear the details of their sexual involvement. Not that they were involved together, but one or the other as each other's wingman in many situations. And I say that using the politest words. Let's get into it. Let's get into Melania's history. How does she come to this country? What does she do when she's here? How does she meet Donald Trump? What's her relationship to the modeling agents who knew both Epstein and Trump?

17:04I mean, these are all of the questions which I think once they are answered, we will have a much clearer picture of what Jeffrey Epstein did, who he did it to, and how the president of the United States was involved. And here's what

17:25Ben Meiselas:Michael Wolff told Anthony Scaramucci about how Melania hates Donald Trump's effing guts. Play this clip. And she hasn't shown up for the, in any instances, in any of his court appearances. You know, and I had, you know, somebody told me the story of Jason Miller approaching her and saying, hey, it would be great in terms of the first indictment of you coming there and stand by your man. And then she laughed and said, nice try. Anyway, I was talking this through with one of the people and asking, you know, so what's going on here? Really, what is this about? And And I remember this person looked at me with incredulity as though it should be obvious to anyone.

18:19And this person said she hates his fucking guts. And then at that moment, you go, oh, my God. But could this be anything else other than that?

18:31Ben Meiselas:Now, Michael Wolff knows a lot because he was also going to be Epstein's potential biographer. And Epstein told Wolff a ton of things. So Wolf knows, for example, photographs that Epstein showed him. So Wolf's going to go and ask Trump and Melania questions like this. Here's what Wolf said about the photographs that he saw. Here play this clip. And I've said before that Epstein used to bring out this set of pictures. There were about a dozen snapshots. And among them, there are at least three that I remember, two of topless girls sitting in Trump's lap around Epstein's swimming pool, and then one with a stain on the front of Trump's pants with three or four girls laughing and pointing at it.

19:34So I have seen those pictures. So what's your best guess? I see where they are. Well, I'm my best guess is that they that that Epstein kept them in the safe. A safe was emptied out by the FBI. Where are those pictures?

19:55Ben Meiselas:Now, I think that Wolf is also going to ask Melania a lot of questions. I think she has a lot of explaining to do. Right. I mean, we know that Melania gave false information about her background of arriving in the United States. Pull up this article right here. She said she graduated from a university that she didn't. Take a look at this article. With degree debunked, Melania Trump website is taken down. Melania Trump's cribbing last week of Michelle Obama's lines. She stole Michelle Obama's convention speech. Do you remember that? Was not the first time she claimed something that was not hers.

20:32Ben Meiselas:For months now, reporters have noted that Ms. Trump, who grew up in a small Slovenian town of Svennika did not obtain an undergraduate degree in architecture from the University of Ljubljana, and her professional website claimed she did. Instead, she left after her first year to pursue a modeling career in Milan. As recently as a week ago, Ms. Trump's website stated that she had obtained a degree before going on to become a philanthropist and skincare entrepreneur. On Wednesday, the Huffington Post noticed that the site had been entirely scrubbed. of its content, people clicking on its address are now redirected to the Trump organization website.

21:08Ben Meiselas:That was July 28th, 2016. And Melania posted the website in question was created in 2012 and has been removed because it does not accurately reflect my current business and professional interests. No, it was removed because it did not accurately reflect your past. And I think that there's a lot of questions to ask Melania about her past. And so if I were to have her deposition as well. I'd be asking a lot of questions about how'd she get here into the United States? How would she get an Einstein visa? What's the connection with Paolo Zampoli? You all know Paolo Zampoli. March 11, 2025, Donald Trump writes, I'm pleased to announce that I appointed Paolo Zampoli as special envoy for global partnership.

21:51Ben Meiselas:With his extensive experience working with the United Nations, the Kennedy Center, and various international initiatives, Palo will help us advance America's interest on the global stage. Congratulations, Palo. That's March 11, 2025. Well, who is Palo Zampoli? When Donald met Melania, Palo was there. Here's how the New York Times described things in an August 31, 2016 article. A couple of weekends ago, Palo Zampoli received a text message from Melania Trump, the wife of the Republican candidate for president, urging him to give her a call. Well, the next day, Mr. Zampoli, a former modeling agent who discovered the Slovene 20 years ago from Slovenia in Milan, listened as Mrs.

22:33Ben Meiselas:Trump expressed anguish over a gossipy report in the British tabloid, the Daily Mail, accusing her and Mr. Zampoli of operating an escort service in the 1990s. This is outrageous, the New York Times writes, Mrs. Trump said on the call, according to Mr. Zampoli, explaining that she was considering filing a lawsuit against the Daily Mail for making false and defamatory statements. He said she sounded extremely disturbed. Mr. Zampoli, 46, sounded less than disturbed as he spoke over a recent lunch of pasta in Gramercy Park Townhouse, which is decorated with works of Picasso and others. In his monogrammed dress shirt and Italian-accented English, the one-time mainstay of New York gossip pages called the report rubbish and disgusting, but also seemed to relish his return to the public eye.

23:20Ben Meiselas:And now here's what else the article talks about how they met each other at the Kit Kat Club when Paolo Zampoli introduced them. He secured Mrs. Trump's visa to the United States and introduced her to Donald Trump at a 1998 party he hosted at the Kit Kat Club. Mr. Zampoli's parties have featured an alligator, tiger, cubs, and models at nightclubs blowing kisses at fashion television cameras. So that's Paolo Zampoli. I'd be asking a lot of questions there. Here are some questions that were posed by Simon Rosenberg back in 2016. And I think these are questions that would be asked at her deposition at well, if she wants services effectuated.

24:03Ben Meiselas:Now that Donald Trump has promised, this was August 10th, 2016. Now that Donald Trump has promised to address the question of whether Melania Trump broke immigration laws when she emigrated to the United States in the mid-1990s. And in the process of gaining her citizenship, there are at least four questions that need to be answered directly by the Trump campaign in the coming days. By the way, this was August 9th of 2016, when Trump said he would hold a presser and answer questions about Melania's immigration status. Play this clip. Maybe she came in illegally, maybe. Let me tell you one thing.

24:38She has got it so documented. So she's going to have a little news conference over the next couple of weeks. That's good. That's good. I love it. I love it. They said, Melania Trump may have come into our country illegally. And how would that be for Donald Trump to be talking? He's the only problem. She came in totally legally. I mean, you know, so it's one of those. All right. But you'll see it in a little while. I said to her, no, no, let it simmer for a little while. Let them go wild. Let it simmer.

25:35Ben Meiselas:means? Can you produce the green card? Purpose of early travel to U.S.? Can Mrs. Trump provide the date and purpose of each of her visits to the United States prior to moving here in 1996? Did she work even for free during any of these visits? We know she was here in 1995 and an associate from those days, Paolo Zampoli, has said on the record that she was living here before receiving a work visa in 1996. As you are aware, the United States government has a record of every trip she made in and out of the U.S. prior to her receiving a green card. So it would help us all understand her complete immigration story by providing this information as it is already known by the immigration authorities in the U.S.

26:13Ben Meiselas:Those are the questions that will be asked. We will keep you posted every step of the way here, of course, at the Midas Touch Network. But now she's running away. These are the questions that will be asked in a deposition. Let me know what you think. Hit subscribe. Let's get to six million. We appreciate you. Love this video? Support independent media and unlock exclusive content, ad-free videos, and custom emojis by becoming a paid member of our YouTube channel today. You can also gift memberships to others. Let's keep growing together.

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From the publisher

MeidasTouch host Ben Meiselas reports on how Melania Trump screwed over Donald on the Epstein files by threatening to sue Michael Wolff who responded by suing her and demanding discovery which has caused her to now run away and hide from the process server. 

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