Survivor Steps Forward to Expose All as Trump Hides Files

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2:24Ben Meiselas:As we know that one of the reasons for this government shutdown is because Donald Trump and Megan Mike Johnson are trying to prevent this discharge petition from getting its 218th signature in order to stop the release of the Epstein files from coming out. I don't want to lose sight of the survivors who are being impacted by these, I think, malicious moves that are just taking place in plain view to cover up the Epstein files, to cover up Epstein's dastardly acts. And I just want to remember the powerful, powerful move when the survivors were there on Capitol Hill last month, demanding the release of the Epstein files, demanding accountability.

3:12Ben Meiselas:And one of the moments that stood out to me during that press conference that was held by the survivors is a survivor by the name of Lisa Phillips. I'm going to be interviewing and bringing Lisa Phillips in. Why don't we bring Lisa Phillips in now together if we can? Lisa, it's great to see. I want to show our audience this clip though right here of you on Capitol Hill. More I want to speak to you about your speech then, what you make of what's going on now with the cover-up of these files, how that's impacting you as a survivor. But then I also want to talk about your background, how you ended up on Epstein's Island, starting as a fashion model for the top modeling agency in the world at that time, elite model agency, when you were 17 years old.

4:00Ben Meiselas:You then were a model for about four years or so before you arrived at that Epstein Island and you observed the trafficking there. You saw that this was not just Epstein. you were able to observe what the ring, the trafficking ring that was taking place there at the time. And I want people to hear your story because I think it's important that it's told that way, not through the prism of Democrat, Republican, Independent, but from the prism of a survivor of a human sex trafficking ring, and that there are these predators still out there right now who are being protected by other powerful rich men.

4:42Ben Meiselas:And so let me just play this brief clip of you on Capitol Hill to remind people of your incredible speech. And then let's talk about it. Let's play this clip. A platform supporting survivors. I want to thank all of my survivor sisters who came before me today. I'll be very short. In the year 2000, I was taken to Jeffrey Epstein's island while on a photo shoot on a nearby island. Who I saw and what I experienced there was a glimpse into a very dark and disturbing world. For years after, I tried to avoid Jeffrey, but he had introduced me to Katie Ford, the owner of the Ford Modeling Agency. Epstein's reach went to the very top of fashion, arts and entertainment.

5:28This did not just happen to underage girls in Florida. In New York City, hundreds of young ambitious women were abused by him. Epstein was not just a serial predator. He was an international human trafficker. And many around him knew, many participated, and many profited. And yet he was protected. So I stand here today for every woman who has been silenced, exploited and dismissed. We are not asking for pity. We are here demanding accountability and I'm demanding justice. Congress must choose. Will you continue to protect predators or will you finally protect survivors? And also, I would like to announce here today.

6:18us Epstein survivors have been discussing creating our own list. We know the names. Many of us were abused by them. Now together as survivors, we will confidentially compile the names we all know who are regularly in the Epstein world. And it will be done by survivors and four survivors.

6:42Ben Meiselas:Lisa Phillips, great to have you on here. It was a powerful day. Since that day, you've seen, though, the cover-up continue. I want to know what you make of that day. But since then, it seems that the people covering this up have only dug in their heels further.

7:03Unfortunately, everyone focuses in the media and in the press on the relationship with Trump. and the cover-up of just a little bit here, a little bit there, just to keep the public interested, but they're not really exposing what they really have, and they have everything. There were cameras everywhere. There were documents. They've seen the emails. They basically have gone through everything, and they're not letting the public know what's going on. And I want to rewind the story and then we'll catch us up to the present because I think that so much of the way this is reported out there is through a political lens.

7:51Ben Meiselas:and the reality is it should be reported through a survivor lens and it should be reported through the lens also of exposing what was taking place that this was a heinous human sex trafficking ring with hundreds potentially thousands of victims underage girls young women you were a victim and now survivor of it. How did you end up on that island? And what did you observe when you were there in 2000? You have this great modeling career, top modeling agency, viewed as the top modeling agency really in the world, that one of the top modeling is in the world. And then you get an invite. How do you get the invite?

8:37Ben Meiselas:How do you end up there? And then tell us, what did you see when you got there? And how did it get from kind of getting there to the part where the exploitation was taking place. Yeah. So my whole point of speaking out was just to get people an understanding of what really was going on in that world, that it wasn't just, okay, I'm taking a young girl to a massage and that was it. It was, he brought you into his world. And so I was trying to get an understanding of that. And that's what most survivors standing on Capitol Hill were trying to get the public an understanding of what really was going on.

9:12And so for myself, I was a young model living the dream in New York City had worked really hard to get there at a graduate high school in Belgium and so I just had worked my way Miami LA Cape Town South Africa Europe and then I arrived in New York City and shortly after I arrived I booked a really big job with another girl from my agency she was a Polish model beautiful and we flew to Tortola in the British West Indies next to St. Thomas and just spent a few days shooting there. And then we had an extra like a free day. And the other young model was like, well, I know this guy who owns an island nearby.

9:54And I spoke to him and he said that we can go and hang out there for the day. And I was like, oh, they're never going to let us go. So we spoke to the clients and they were actually like, well, go ahead. And so we got on a boat and we went over to little St. John's. And so, you know, I just spent the day at the pool and at the pool, I observed an older man there with a couple young girls. They were blonde. And the girl who took me was blonde and started noticing I was a little kind of out of place, but everything was fine. I got to know the girls. We played in the pool. We played in the ocean.

10:38And we actually had a really fun day. And then we got ready later on for dinner and went to this beautiful long dinner table, lots of delicious food and seafood, and had a really great time talking with the other young girls. And that's when this charming man walks up and says, Hi, I'm Jeffrey. And, you know, kiss him on the cheek, sits down right next to me, and begins to, you know, focus in on me. He had already known the other girls there. So he was just asking questions and wanted to know a little bit more about my life and where I grew up. And I told him, you know, I'd lived in England as a child, because my father was in the Air Force, and we traveled around a lot in Europe.

11:23And he said, Oh, do you want to meet a prince? and I was just like sure and so at that moment there was a man that was walking up I recognized him from the man from the pool and just met him briefly and then he walked away and then Jeffrey would ask me questions about my family and my relationship with my father and how close I was to him these kind of questions that I triggered me a little bit at the time because I didn't have a very close relationship with my father and I think he could sense that. And, and, um, so we spoke kind of a deeper conversation that you don't normally have with a man.

12:03So he made me feel really comfortable and, and almost like he cared about me in a weird way. And, um, I don't know, he just had this mentorship quality about him asking about my dreams and aspirations. And I felt like I had really great conversation with him and I felt good about the situation at that point so finished up with dinner and then went back to our quarters and got ready for bed because it was the evening we were going to spend the night there and then head back to our island and photo shoot early that next morning so I remember being on the sitting on the bed with the other young model and talking to her and then there was a knock at the door and one of the other young girls walked in and say, you know, Jeffrey's ready for his massage.

12:51And at that point, I just looked at the other girl and was like, what's going on? Like, I don't know how to do a massage. And she's like, oh, well, Jeffrey just likes massages. It's kind of what we have to do. I wasn't really expecting for you to do that, but you know, I guess he likes you and we're just going to have to go do it. And so I kind of argued with a little bit with her because I just thought it was kind of weird. And, but I ended up going with her and walked across, you know, the island to where Jeffrey's quarters were in his bedroom. And we walked into that room and, you know, he was lying down on a massage table naked and, you know, had this little silly grin come in and was very playful.

13:37The energy shifted a little bit. It was now more personal questions like, do you have a boyfriend and, and asking a little like sexual things and, um, you know, did a real massage and, uh, taught me some massage techniques and it was kind of, you know, it was uncomfortable, but at that point it was, it was just like a weird creepy massage. And then he turned over and that's when things got a little bit dark as a demeanor changed. And, um, I didn't feel really safe anymore. And I didn't really know what was going on. And I kept looking at her and she was just like looking at me like you need to do this and so you know at that point that's when he assaulted both of us together in that room um yeah so that that's basically what happened on the island and we kind of just finished up and ran out of there

14:31Ben Meiselas:then where did you leave the next day or do did you go back to the where you were before where with the where the client was well we had to stay the night there So we went back to the room and I remember, you know, staring at the ceiling the entire night in sleep. Like, what the heck does happen? And I didn't really understand what was going on. And I was scared to death that he was going to come back or there was going to be another knock on the door and it was going to get worse. But it didn't that night. I just, like you said, got on the boat, went back to the photo shoot, did my job, flew back to New York City.

15:05Ben Meiselas:Did he try to contact you afterwards? was there further kind of communication or contact that took place? Yeah. And this is the part of the story I really like people to understand about Epstein and his world. You're not getting away from his world. So once you've been abused by him, and I actually saw someone on the island that day. So I was kind of in and wasn't getting away. I didn't know that at the time, but I, his, his, the young, sorry, those secretaries that worked for him would call me profusely. They would call me every single day saying, Jeffrey really liked you. He thought you were powerful.

15:42He thought you were incredible. All these compliments to get me to go back and meet with him at his Upper East Side home. And I just refused every single day. It went on for months and they were basically harassing me. And one day Jeffrey called me and he just said to me, Lisa, I remember what you said on the island, that your dream was to be a four model. And I know Katie Ford and she's a good friend of mine. And I would love to send you over there. He told her about you and you know, you just need to go meet with her. And I was like thinking, okay, he's not a bad guy. He wants to help me out.

16:19He listened to me. Maybe that was just like my fault. Maybe I was flirty. I don't know. I had just, you know, victims of this, to blame themselves in these kind of situations. I think it's a coping mechanism just to say, oh, maybe he's not bad. And, and so I just did what he said, because it was the biggest goal for me. I told him that on the Island and I went and met with Katie Ford a couple of days later, and she signed me up and, you know, got into Katie's world at that point. Uh, thinking at the time that you know i've made it and this is this is like the next step for me and this is what i deserve and i just started seeing jeffrey more in a a light of a mentor and helper like he presented himself in the beginning and katie ford said i love jeffrey and everyone that i would meet in new york at that time also did love and adore and spoke very highly about jeffrey epstein at that time.

17:20So I was starting to get a little confused about him, but I never forgot what had happened.

17:27Ben Meiselas:And then what happened next? When did the kind of communication stop with Epstein in that world? Was it around the arrest? When did communications really cease? Oh, no, it didn't stop after that. Because now I was in the modeling industry world. There's a very well-known sex trafficking ring that was going in the modeling industry world, John Luke Burnell, you know, John Casablanca, you know, Katie and many others that were sending young girls to Jeffrey. And Jeffrey was also, you know, would use, you know, I know, you know, Victoria's Secret, I have a part ownership. And so there was a lot going on in that world.

18:06And that's actually when I spoke out at Capitol Hill, I brought that into it. So people can be aware what was going on during that time. Jeffrey would call me up and say, I have an audition for you, put me on a plane, go travel for an audition, who was with a very powerful producer or a director at the time. And I'm thinking it's an audition. Found out many years later, the same many girls were sent to the same producers, directors or people in Hollywood for an audition. But it was a lot more, it ended up being a lot more than that. I also have an NDA with a very big celebrity that Jeffrey had sent me to for like a party.

18:46And later on something terrible happened. So there were things that were going on that I was just like, what is going on? Then to answer your question, I had a young friend who was blonde, who was beautiful, an ambitious young woman who knew Jeffrey at that time. And she came to me crying one day and said, you know you don't really understand who jeffrey is and i'm like i'm starting to get a i don't understand what's going on here either so we started talking about it and she said she was made to have sex with someone and she could it she just spiraled out of control and um and the young girls at the time we just all started talking and started to figure out something's going on and that's when the vanity fair article was released with him flying with bill clinton to South Africa, Kevin Spacey, and then shortly after he was arrested.

19:40So he started unraveling through those years and getting more exposed in that world and people starting to figure things out. And then of course, the major coverups that were happening.

19:53Ben Meiselas:So as you brought the other survivors together and you all started kind of talking and sharing these experiences, is what were some of the themes, if you will, that came up kind of over and over again? It seems that this was a highly structured, kind of an organized thing. You arrive at the island, they impress you with the pool and owning an island. Then the dinner takes place where he does the routine. He seems to be asking certain questions to determine family relationships. You know, are you close with your parents? Things like that. Have the initial sexual assault take place and then afterwards utilize a victim or survivor to then send to the other rich people and other celebrities fake auditions and things like that.

20:45Ben Meiselas:And again, it seems highly structured. It's why I wanted to talk to you about this too, is just so that people understand the way this sex trafficking organization worked. It was methodical. It was, there were levels to it. There were lieutenants and there were generals and there were different tiers of the people who young models were being pushed to, to be sexually assaulted. Yes, you just summed it up right there. And that's why I spoke out originally. And you understand this is 15 to 20 years later for a lot of us survivors. So back then we were kind of figuring things out, but we had no idea the magnitude of what really was going on.

21:26And we wanted to get on with our lives. And most of us, we got on with our lives, became mothers. And a lot of us work in this advocacy world or became therapists. But it wasn't until he died in 2019. I mean, until he died, it was when I realized, okay, wait a second. Now I feel safe enough to start like understanding what happened to me back then. It was always so confusing and there was never anyone to really talk to about it. So it was Virginia Giuffre who spoke out and said, I was trafficked to, she has a long list of men. And when she was saying these men, I remember seeing some of those men.

22:06So I believed her. and I had a friend also who was trafficked to the same one and so I said you know I want to support this woman and not knowing what I was getting into at the time but I started speaking out of documentaries and and then slowly I had to start telling my story and I wasn't ready for it because I had so much to support the other women I wasn't really ready to start saying I was abused too because I didn't understand my role in it I always felt like it was my fault and I didn't know how to get out of it. I just was so confused about it until we start learning about the grooming and how all these young women were just groomed by him masterfully, masterfully manipulated and groomed by the best of all time who had enablers and all these other people helping him.

22:55And Jeffrey was a fiend. He was a sex fiend. All he talked about was sex. He had to get off six to eight times a day. Young woman going into his Upper East Side mansion six to eight times a day. And a lot of the girls knew about his creepy massages, but we didn't speak further on how, and this is common among serial predators. Most of the Larry Nassar, you know, the doctor for the gymnast, like none of them, they was like, oh, you're getting this weird doctor thing. No, but no one spoke about it until many years later when someone had the courage to speak up. Then And it's like, oh, that's what's happening to me too.

23:33And when I spoke to these survivors that were underage at the time, I was like, okay, I was in my early 20s like hundreds of others, but it was the exact same type of abuse that he was doing. It was the exact same MO with the massage turning into an assault. So I just started speaking out and gained confidence and through therapy. And I just was building into this powerful woman who wanted to make a difference. So that's kind of what led up to today.

24:08Ben Meiselas:So you've spoken Capitol Hill. It's important for you and the survivors you were with to have these files released to bring transparency to what's been taking place. Tell us why that's important. Just so people, it may seem obvious, but it may not be obvious. Why do you want to see those files get released and bring transparency there? Well, really, for me, it's just because people are so confused about what's going on. Not only us survivors are still confused, but like the transparency, what is really going on? Everyone makes it about Trump and Epstein. OK, maybe there's something there. But and about Epstein.

24:50But it's about this whole ring of men. The only person in jail is Ghislaine, a woman. So where are all the other men that were benefiting and profiting from all of this? That's what makes me upset because us survivors, we know that they were there. We saw them. We know that we're royalty princes, very powerful people in academia and tech. And we saw them at parties. They knew what was going on. Why aren't they exposed? And people say, well, why are you speaking out now? now well we're pissed off now because nothing has happened and yeah it's just it's it's just a frustrating thing for me so i'm at the point where it's like i'm at my wits end standing on capital hill it was more just like look i'm not going to sit up here and just tell my my sob story like everybody else is we need to do something about it you think you have the power i mean you don't think that we have the power too you don't think that we understand what's going on here So it was really just to say, you need to do something because we also have the power to do something.

25:58And as you saw, look how many people stood up for us, too.

26:03Ben Meiselas:Absolutely. I mean, look, the country standing up for you. I mean, the frustrating thing is that most of the country standing up for you and saying, release these files. And it shouldn't be a political thing. Just release the files and support the survivors. It should be a very, very simple thing. I mean, it should be the obvious thing. Now, the Speaker of the House, Speaker Johnson, he often invokes the victims and the survivors. He says, the reason that we can't release these files is I'm looking out for the survivors here and the victims. He said that over, thus we can't release the files. So what would you say there to Speaker Johnson or anybody who invokes the name of survivors as the reason why they're not releasing the files?