The Indy Project: Daniel Jones Stays, Kyler Goes. Plus: Combine Recap

23:12Dan Pizzuta:So it's a tough place that the Colts ended up being. It kind of seems like it's the least bad answer, because like you said, I would much rather Daniel Jones on the tag than try to have some massive extension with a lowered cap hit for 2026, but now you're betting on Daniel Jones in the future. I would much rather be able to have the tag and kind of see how it goes and see how it plays out and then work from there.

23:41Mina Kimes:one of the other players who was who who was tagged so pickens and pits were already tagged breese hall uh came in let's see yeah as the third jayton daniel's the fourth so four players were tagged um he got the non-exclusive tag there's no chance in hell the team is gonna try to pay breese hall and trade two first rounders so that means he's gonna be a jet But poor Resol, who tweeted, always been the type to bet on myself. Been working. See y 'all soon, love. Okay, so I have trouble getting too worked up about this from the Jets' perspective. They're not going to be good this year. They don't have many foundational players on the roster right now.

24:31Mina Kimes:He's one of them. And they have a lot of money. So it's fine, I think, for them to keep it. Especially, I mean, we'll see what they do at the quarterback position. But if this year just continues to be about developing the foundation of the team that is going to, I understand the tag and maybe, you know, they wanted to get a deal done, it sounds like. I don't, I'm sure that the nerd answer is to say this is a bad decision. but I have trouble getting worked up about this team from an opportunity cost perspective.

25:07Dan Pizzuta:Yeah, for the Jets, I think it's fine just because of, like you said, their situation. You can argue that they don't have anything on the roster, so why running back? But they have like$58 million in effective cap space, and that's when you factor in what's probably going to cost their draft class. That's the fifth most. they freed up about what they're going to use on the tag with the Jermaine Johnson trade that they had last week so it's basically just a net zero there so it's fine I think after not trading Brees Hall at the deadline last year you kind of had to do this you can't not trade him last year and then just let him walk for free and because you have so many holes in the roster you're not going to get a comp pick back for whatever contract he signs uh so now i think you you kind of hold on to him 14 million is you know it's defined it's probably a lot for uh you know when a running back even a player like brees hall but you know i i think we kind of look at the running back landscape there's a possibility someone gets desperate missing out on like the kenneth walker sweepstakes that i think a trade could still be possible before the season and then And again, you have him at the deadline and you're in a similar position that you were last year, where if a team in contention wants a running back for the stretch run, I think that's possibly still on the table.

26:34Dan Pizzuta:So I don't think the Jets are locking themselves into anything here. So I think there's still a couple ways that they can get out of this and still potentially the Brees Hall ends up somewhere else too.

26:45Mina Kimes:Walker would be one of the winners here because I would say him and Brees who are pretty universally seen as the two most appealing running backs in free agency, and now he has the crown. Also, Walker has the explosive play potential that, as much as I would love a guy like Algier or Gainwell in terms of efficiency and style, Walker's your home run hitter. I think he's, to me, a cut above ETN, who would probably be the next back. Right. It is. It'll be, I think I'm really excited for running back free agency because I think it'll tell us a lot about the draft as well. Like who's taking themselves out of the Jeremiah Love sweepstakes in the draft, right?

27:27Mina Kimes:Like Kansas City is the obvious name at nine, but teams like New Orleans, Minnesota, who I mentioned, Houston did a running back trade, which made me think we'll talk about that in a second, but they're not, obviously they're not going to be a big bidder. And also, I don't think they think they're in love striking range. Um, so, uh, it'll be, it'll be fascinating. I, I, I always, the first did I have to like exercise caution. And I, when the first day is a free agency, my mind always immediately spins to the draft and it's like, no, let's take a second and talk about these teams. And we're going to talk about that next week.

28:04Mina Kimes:And I'll put out a lot of stuff around it, but I do love it for reading the tea leaves. And we're going to talk about Jeremiah a lot, by the way, in the second, I should have said this in the beginning, second half of the podcast, we're talking about the combine winners and losers. Sorry, I just got so worked. The Kyler News dropped right before we started taping. We're going to talk about the combine, though, and the draft and some of the ripple effects there. I did hit on two players who were tagged. I didn't talk about either of them really at length on the pod, but Pickens and Pitts, neither particularly surprising, right, given what they would have respectively commanded in free agency.

28:36Mina Kimes:Pickens, most notably, was someone who would have just, you know, exploded with an amount of money. I think they're both some of my hesitation in talking about these players is I think the stories are not quite over right like pits could very well be both could get extensions pits could be traded so I both defensible decisions because of the players and their value but I also Dan feel like something could happen with both these players in the coming months

29:09Dan Pizzuta:yeah yeah and like For Dallas, I think it would be smart to extend Pickens, just because I think financially that helps them too. I think you're looking at, well, a$27.3 million franchise tag right now, and that's something that all of that goes on the cap in one year because it's only a one-year deal. So if you extend them, you can lower that a little bit. Dallas is a team that needs to free up some money, which they can with restructures, a DAC, CD, and Tyler Smith. That can clear almost$60 million. Uh, but I think you, Dallas is a team that needs to bring in some more free agents, probably especially on the defensive side.

29:49Dan Pizzuta:Uh, so I think if you get pickings on extension, not only does that help you by having a receiver who we saw what that does to open up the offense, it also just gives you some more financial flexibility down the line. Although we also have seen Dallas is not a team that particularly cares about that could have gotten so many extensions earlier to help them out.

30:09Mina Kimes:just do a normal contract and do it early and then use the money like dan said please don't drag this out don't be i also feel like with a player like pickens like do you really want him playing on the tag yeah is he gonna be is he gonna be normal about it i know that's unfair because um you know i think it's reasonable for players to be upset about being tagged but he would be a guy here like oh there's a little bit of the personality management as well um you know i've gone back and forth on pickings in the extension and bangles being a potentially cautionary tale with the two wide receiver thing i will say this though with dallas last year they had an offense that was like fourth in yards per play and fifth in epa per play so the decision to run it back with pickings and williams who did get done on a very normal reasonable contract the running back it it it's makes you have proof of concept um you just got to smash it on the draft and like you said if you do a pick and steal you also clear up a little bit of room i think there's some other contracts like you know but you got to smash it you gotta you gotta hit every pick every little contract every vet to get that defense towards average you got to be pretty flawless

31:19Dan Pizzuta:this offseason yeah yeah absolutely and then you know going to to kyle pitts it's fascinating just because of how relatively cheap it is 15 million dollar tag uh which makes yeah um you know so i I was looking right now, tight end and center are the only two positions that don't have a player making a$20 million average. And that's going to change with center because of Tyler Linderbaum this off season. So you have a, and I think this is just going to kind of be fascinating to see where the tight end market goes, because you have a guy like Pitts who's when he's healthy has been good. We have about two healthy seasons from Kyle Pitts right now, and they were both very fun.

32:02Dan Pizzuta:uh he was what second in receiving yards uh last year uh 2.14 yards per route run against man coverage which he did on over a quarter of his routes and that was second to tucker craft and colby parkinson um there's a you know 12 million dollar difference between the wide receiver tag and the tight end tag and we're seeing those types of players kind of be closer together than they have been as we see more tight ends so i think more so than like kyle pitts in general I'm just kind of fascinated to see what the tight end market starts to look like if we have an extension here. Because you're only going to push it so far.

32:38Dan Pizzuta:Kyle Pitts isn't going to make more than George Kittle on an extension. So I just think kind of like the dominoes that we see now with the next couple of draft classes that we saw from tight ends. I just think that we have a bit of a market of inefficiency here while tight ends are getting more important.

32:57Mina Kimes:yeah uh i think it'll be interesting pitts is such a complicated case too because of the production the which is to say the barbell nature of his career um even last year like there was some streakiness to his what what he did and you know obviously london being hurt you saw some of his usage step up so i would say you know he's improved as a blocker but he's still not like a all around guy. So it'll be interesting to see how he is valued. You mentioned center. And I wanted to hit on a piece of NFL news before we get to the David Montgomery trade to wrap this part, which is that Drew Dahlman, the bears center retired surprising after getting an extension, big part of the turnaround and the bears run game and the offensive line massive hole, right?

33:52Mina Kimes:Right. If you're Chicago, you feel like great. You finally got the offensive line set. Offense is trending in the right direction, and boom. The first thing that hit me is a lot of teams need centers right now. I was thinking about it because when we did free agency preview and I talked about Tyler Linderbaum, I just started rattling off teams, and there were so many. And now, first of all, he's going to make an incredible amount of money, obviously. Yeah. But I can think of like on the top of my head, like 10 teams that like, and yeah, it's just, I think from what I gather of the draft, I texted Michael Jr.

34:36Mina Kimes:and asked him what he thought about the class. he mentioned there's the Iowa kid whose name is Jones or Johnson excuse me, Slaughter from Florida Hecht from K-State, he said he likes Parker from Duke, Zune so there's definitely some options in the draft but as far as like a guy to come in and start I don't know for these playoff teams that need centers I'll be curious to see what they do

35:04Dan Pizzuta:yeah and I think we've seen when you have you know a guy like dolman coming in who you know not i wouldn't say it was a you know top tier center but i think you see from what someone like him as an improvement on what the bears had in previous years what that can do for a young quarterback um having that type of center is it really matters and kind of what he was able to do with some with some of the you know the in the run game and all of that that in the ben johnson offense it's yeah it's fascinating it's definitely shocking that, that it came in. It seemed like they had some cohesiveness along that offensive line.

35:43Dan Pizzuta:That seemed like it was going to be a bit of a strength. Uh, but now for the, you know, the bears specifically to have to rework that, find another center. Uh, and then, like you said, you know, we, we don't really get a lot of centers, center movement around the league to where it's great. And they, I think even if Tyra Linderbaum, isn't a great fit for everyone, I think everyone's going to be invested in Tyra Linderbaum just because the other options, you know, you have a cave maze and, and, you know, there's some other like, you know, mid tier free agency who could certainly help. Uh, but I think Linderbaum is going to, yes.

36:19Mina Kimes:Buffalo would, it's going to make a lot of money. Yeah. Uh, I was just about to pull up my list of free agents to like, think about the next tier. That would be the one name that – there's not a lot of centers, man. It's a lot. I don't see it. Like, yeah, Maze. It's – I don't know. I wouldn't be surprised if we see that not just Linderbaum, but some of those other contracts surprise people because of the amount of need. I mean, the Bears do save some money with their retirement. Not like a ton, but they do not have a lot of cap, and there's great needs on defense, obviously. So it's going to be an interesting, interesting juggling for the interesting decisions to be made.

37:08Mina Kimes:Okay, well, let's stay in the NFC North and talk about the Lions trading David Montgomery, because I found this to be kind of fascinating. The Texans had a really busy day. They did a couple of trades, not just the David Montgomery trade. They also traded Titus Howard, their offensive tackle, to the Browns. and they got a fifth-round draft pick in return, and the Browns gave Titus Howard an extension. And then they traded with the Lions. They sent – I want to make sure I get these details right – a fourth-round draft pick and Juice Scruggs, who is an interior offensive lineman, in return for David Montgomery and a seventh.

37:52Mina Kimes:Okay, so let's talk about this from the Texan standpoint. I'm kind of torn here because first of all Montgomery the player I actually like separate from the value I actually like the player a lot for them I thought he's just more of an all around back you know he can also I would say he's under he was underused in Detroit as a pass catcher because of the rise of Javier Gibbs people forget Chicago he caught a lot of passes he can pass protect I think he's suitable for different schemes Texans have started doing a bit more in terms of on the ground scheme-wise. He's not making a ton of money. He's 29, but last year he had like 0.8 rushing yards over expected for carry, which is quite good.

38:34Mina Kimes:It's 11th amongst high-volume backs. People listening to this podcast know I always like to look at that because it tries to separate the back a bit from the offense. So I do like the player. I think it was a lot to give up. and I also I'm just a little shell-shocked from last offseason when they ripped up the offensive line it's hard for me to say how dare they send away Titus Howard and Juice Scruggs Howard is the better player but they did this last offseason and they ripped up the offensive line and started over and I just don't know if I trust that they'll replace them with better players.

39:19Mina Kimes:Does that make sense? Like, that's where I am. Because obviously the offensive line in the run game, while improved, the offensive line was improved, still wasn't good enough. Right.

39:29Dan Pizzuta:So I think that the Titus Howard probably is a little more, you know, monetary than play-wise. The contract. The contract, it was probably the easiest way to get some money off the books because if he was looking for a new deal, he played right tackle in both guard spots for them last year. And so if you want to potentially resign Trent Brown, who was playing a bit of right tackle, you can probably do that at a cheaper rate because of his age. And it's probably cheaper to find guards than it would be to just bump Howard inside and pay him what he was making to play guard. So I kind of understand it in that way.

40:14You know, Scruggs was, you know, just kind of a backup, played sparingly.

40:22Dan Pizzuta:So probably he wasn't in their plans, I guess. But that is to trade the offensive lineman and then try to bring in a running back is certainly a choice. And they had a real bad run game last year. I think they were 27th in success rate among teams on running back carries. And Montgomery was 24th of 49 backs in success rate. And again, it was originally reported as that was also going to be a fifth round pick for Montgomery. And then it sounds like there were other teams who kind of sniffed in that market. And that's what bumped it up. And then like to go form a fifth to juice grugs, a fourth and a seventh kind of, that is certainly a higher price of pay, but kind of, as we talked about, there's not a lot on, on the running back market, unless you're really paying up for, you know, a Kenneth Walker or a Travis ETN, there's not going to be a lot in the draft outside of Jeremiah Love.

41:25Mina Kimes:That's my big takeaway from all of this, by the way, like this, coupled with the Cowboys bringing back Williams on the extension. These teams do not love this running back draft. It seems pretty clear.

41:38Dan Pizzuta:Yeah, and Houston has kind of always been a team that if they want a player, they will overpay for him in a trade. I think we've kind of seen that a couple of times. So I think they were kind of fixated on having a guy like Montgomery, who I think is going to do well. Cap hits a$6 million and$9 million over the next two years. I think there's nothing guaranteed for 2027 unless he's on the roster by March 13th of next year. And it's like a very small roster bonus. So you can get out of it also. You know, it's a lot to give up for a running back, but it does seem like they just wanted something stable at that position.

42:18Dan Pizzuta:And I think without giving somebody$14,$15 million in free agency this year, it would be kind of hard to do that.

42:29Mina Kimes:All right, let's take a quick break, come back, and then let's talk about Jeremiah Love because we're going to do combine winners and I would say question marks rather than followers after the break. If you're looking to bring a little celebration to the everyday, Confetti Craze 5-Hour Energy tastes just like birthday cake. Think rich vanilla, buttery funfetti flavor, basically a party in a bottle. And here's what makes it even better. It's all the delicious cake flavor you're craving with none of the sugar to worry about. And the small portable bottles let you bring your favorite flavor with you to cakeify your day with a tasty caffeine boost wherever you are.

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44:47Mina Kimes:That's Amazon.com slash H-U-B Delivery. All right, we're back. Dan and I were both in Indianapolis for the combine which is interesting not only in terms of the athletic performances but also in just the conversations you have with scouts, coaches, NFL media and the Stars Jeremiah I love because he was both a winner and I think a winner on and off the field is how I would describe it unsurprisingly of course this was kind of like almost everybody who came into the combine and was supposed to put on a show did, it felt like. That was the theme of the week for me. And he came in, he's six foot tall, 213 pounds, and he ran a 4.3 second 40.

45:34Mina Kimes:And this has been mentioned a lot, and I think it was mentioned in the broadcast, but that's how fast Jameer Gibbs was, and Jameer Gibbs is much smaller than Jeremiah Love. It reflects how he looks on the field. He has unbelievable long speed. He is an absolute nightmare in the open field when he turns the corner. It is night-night. But I mentioned him as a winner not just because of that, which was not too surprising, Dan, but because I came away from Indianapolis being convinced, unless it's all smoke, he is going to go a lot higher in the draft than I thought going into Indianapolis. Going into Indianapolis, I was like, great player, but coming off the Ashton Gentry year, a lot of these teams in the top 10 have bigger needs at higher value positions.

46:17Mina Kimes:top 10 shore Kansas city at nine. I left Indianapolis with people being like nine. Ha good luck. Was that your experience before we talk about like, whether we think that's a good idea, what did you hear about Jeremiah love and how do you feel about him now?

46:36Dan Pizzuta:Yeah, I very, very similar. And it kind of felt like this is it's one, definitely the, the player himself being great. It's, I think it's also to the rest of the players at the position. I just like, he's so far and away the best guy. It's not even like in the, you know, the Saquon Barkley draft when he went to overall, like there were still people who liked, you know, a Nick Chubb. That was, that was Jonathan Taylor draft class too.

47:09Mina Kimes:You were all the same year. That's maybe,

47:11Dan Pizzuta:maybe Taylor's maybe Taylor's Chubb was Chubb was in there. Right. But there were still backs in the class that people liked. That's not the case this year. I don't really know who running back two is. We had some players come up. It might be his teammate. It might also, after we had Mike Washington from Arkansas, had a really nice, fun combine. He might have bumped himself up, but these aren't guys who are going to go early day two either. So it's Jeremiah Love and then a big jump. And then when we kind of talk about positional value, the other positions that we like, we view as premium, especially on offense, they're just not there.

47:59Dan Pizzuta:There's, there's one quarterback, there's a couple of good wide receivers, but probably only one we're really viewing as like a top 10 guy. And then it's kind of offensive linemen. And so it is, I think just kind of all of these pieces coming together that are going to make Jeremiah Love a very high draft pick.

48:20Mina Kimes:Teams that I have heard associated with him since then there and since then, obviously Kansas City, that's the one everyone has. Working upwards, New Orleans. I've heard Washington, which is insane. I've heard the Giants, which is insane. The Titans, the Cardinals. I haven't heard anyone say the Jets, obviously, with Brees Alvin.

48:46Mina Kimes:I would not do it. I, I, it's still hard. Kansas city. You can justify to me. Um, I think where I said this last week, but I get nervous if like one of the three edge rushers is there for Kansas city, because that's such a big need for them. And I think there's a pretty big drop off after the big three of Bailey Reese and Bain, but a team like Arizona, you don't even know who's playing quarterback there. You can't run it. So maybe it's part of, oh, we're going to bring in Malik Willis and him. I'm not going to lie. That would be fun. But are you competing with the others in the NFC West with your defense in the state?

49:30Mina Kimes:Titans, I mean, just such glaring edge. Even if you don't go wide receiver there because you feel like Tate, maybe that's too rich, fine. But you really pass up on one of those edges there. You do not have pass rush. um new orleans washington this would be unhinged to me new orleans is a little bit more defensible because i do feel like that roster is trending in the right direction and it would certainly and you would have you kind of like you're on quarterback you've got lave you've got a decent decent pass rush and if the big three edges are off there and i start i do feel like I mean, but like, how could you not take like a Sonny Stiles?

50:13Mina Kimes:I don't know. But that's at least, I would say more defensible. And then, like I said, Kansas City makes sense. But my general feeling about all of these spots, Dan, is if you're a team that needs edge and any of those three players are here, it's hard for me to pass up the value you get and to go for a running back.

50:35Dan Pizzuta:Right. Right. And, you know, if even like to go back to the Chiefs, would you rather have a edge rusher on a rookie deal and maybe$12 million on Travis CTN or would you rather trying to be fine finding, you know, trading for or, you know, it's signing like a Jalen Phillips at like, you know, $25 million a year and then having Jeremiah love. I kind of feel like you would rather bet on the, the younger edge rusher and kind of that's the way to do it so i it just kind of feels like that's how how reviewing it is it does feel like he is kind of objectively one of the best players in this draft class i do just find it really hard like even though the chiefs do make the most sense the chiefs sitting out free agency and hoping they draft jeremiah love also doesn't feel like it makes a lot of sense to me just in the way they would build this roster do that cannot do that

51:32Mina Kimes:But I think one of the other things I like about the Chiefs is at least the offensive line is headed in the right direction, and a lot of the teams I've mentioned I don't feel that way about. And that's the gentry lesson, right? I know most people seem to view as a better prospect, although it's a lot easier to say now because people weren't talking that way last year. I'm just going to say that. Go back and watch everybody's Ashton Gentry takes. But the lesson from that was you do not draft a running back if your offensive lines are out ready. we feel that the saints line is ready do we feel that the giants line is right like that just seems crazy to me um so yeah i would love it in kansas city um so funny i was in kansas i was at prime one night at like 2 a.m and ended up chatting with demarco murray and we were talking about jeremiah love i was asking him this is not like intel and i was like you know he's built a lot like you actually and i was like so what are you doing now he's like i'm coaching running backs for the kansas city chiefs like brian uh no uh yeah we'll see what happens there um okay winners again sticking with the theme of predictable winners all of the defensive players that people thought would ball out balled out starting with of course sunny styles which is actually kind of a similar conversation so maybe we can um right non-premium value position um but an unobviously dominant player at that position and he was unbelievable i mean he's six foot five yeah and he jumped 43 and a half inches he had 11 foot two inch broad and ran a 4.4640 by the way that vert is the best player, best linebacker since we've ever tracked it.

53:18Mina Kimes:He is a freak. He is, I talked about him, I'm going to talk about him at length so we don't have to get, his tape is tremendous.

53:26Dan Pizzuta:Yeah, and it's one of those things where the testing matches what you see when he plays, and I think that's similar for a couple of guys that we're going to talk about, but I think that is a position where I think linebacker matters now. I think we like we said it that it's not a premium position, but I think when you look at how heavy offenses are starting to get having a guy like Sonny styles, who can play whatever linebacker position you need to, uh, he's good in coverage can be kind of one of those guys that also helps in like when you're trying to some of the simulated pressures, you have him in the a gap where he can either rush or drop back in coverage.

54:09Dan Pizzuta:I think having a guy like that matters a lot. So I think we are seeing the positional value of a guy like that jump. And having someone who is that athletic, I think also that smart, certainly I think is going to all come together to be a – that's worth a high draft pick in my opinion.

54:28Mina Kimes:I think his impact would actually be kind of similar to – he could be like a Nick Aminwari type who weirdly he kind of reminds me of. and nick gaming war it was basically a sam like he right you know um but just in terms of the versatility he allows you to um play the run without you know putting big bodies on the field at all times um it's really good in coverage yeah like that one where i you know with love it's like harder for me to find destinations than it is for sunny styles personally like i'm looking at the top 10 and jets probably, you know, not, but Arizona. Sure. Tennessee. Probably.

55:16Mina Kimes:That's not what I would do, but yeah. Giants. Yeah.

55:20Dan Pizzuta:And that's an art Robinson defense. It would be a lot of fun.

55:23Mina Kimes:Washington. Yes. New Orleans. Put him next to Demario Davis. Let him wear him. Come on. Uh, Cincinnati. Amazing. so there's multiple teams that i i would be i think where it gets tricky is if you it really comes down to how you feel about the edges and we're going to talk about one of them and there's there's they're all a little bit complicated right there's no like obvious like you know miles garrett type they're all there's really exciting edges and i think the top three are certainly the top three but yeah it all comes down because a lot of those teams i mentioned could use an edge more but the question is if you're like in arizona do you want a sunny styles who you know you feel like higher conviction in or one of these past rushers like his teammate reese knowing that you could it could end up being a much greater value because he rushes the quarterback but there's less certainty about him that's this is the draft this is the calculus of it but he balled out david bailey was blazing out there um he ran a 4.5 40 um so that was like a you know i i'm sort of predictably great performance um moving on to the the tight ends i thought were the other big winners of the week i mean we should just talk about kenny sadiq he ran a sub 440 he broke the 40 record for tight ends which was held by Vernon Davis, interestingly enough.

56:58Mina Kimes:But he did a million. He had a 43-and-a-half introvert. He was putting up just alien numbers. Again, he was one of the players we talked about, but that's, wow. I guess that's the theme. Positional value, be damned, right? Because that's a tight end, who I think was more impressive than any of the receivers from a testing perspective.

57:17Dan Pizzuta:Yeah, and it was nice to see because it's, you see it when you watch him, but again, like he doesn't put up crazy numbers. I think also because Oregon just kind of spreads the ball out a lot. And a guy like, even when you look at the receiver, like Malik Benson did not have a lot of opportunity just because the ball went everywhere in that, in that offense. But so many explosive plays that, that happen with Sadiq. And it's, you know, not every great athlete is like a top tight end, but like every top tight end is a great athlete. so it is good to see that and then like just going down the line for for all these tight ends that were good um you know there were a bunch a bunch of guys you know uh max claire um came out of uh ohio state uh eli stauer is going to be like an interesting guy where that's kind of like a slot only can he block enough but like we just had like super human workouts from all of these tight ends.

58:18Dan Pizzuta:And then I think you go back to last year, we've seen how much better teams are at figuring out how to use rookie tight ends. Tight end not too long ago was a position where it took two, three, four years for these guys to make it because they were asked to do so much more than they were in college. But we're seeing a much smaller gap between those responsibilities right now. So yeah, I think this is a fascinating tight end class and Sadiq going somewhere in the mid first round. I've seen a couple of people put him on the Rams in mocks coming out of the combine, and just in the amount of fun that would be, absolutely.

58:59Yeah.

59:00Mina Kimes:I mean, the Rams started leaning into the 13 personnel last year, drafted another Oregon tight end in the second round. This would allow them, I feel like, to continue expanding that part of their offense because of the complete nature of his game. He blocks, right? I mean, I would argue you can do a lot more than with him. You kind of touched on this and what we saw in Oregon, but he has a complete skill set that it feels like coupled with his athleticism, that combination is what's been missing. It would be so like rammed, like if they were to take him instead of a corner after everyone all season is that's another team where watch what they do in free agency.

59:41Mina Kimes:Let's see if they pick up any corners because that could be telling of how they could use these draft picks early on and how they regard the corners who I barely talked about okay so those are some of the winners oh we have some bonus winners but we can get to those at the end just guys who jumped out to us but let's do some of the I wouldn't say fallers but some of the key questions coming out of the combine when you want your spring break to feel like and your kid's pool day to feel like and your hotel bed to feel like and room service to feel like because at Hilton, hospitality feels like Your cabana's ready.

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1:01:36Mina Kimes:So Ruben Bain Jr. Nobody knows how long his arms are. Came in at 30 and 7 eighths. Cassius Howell of Texas A &M was also even shorter. According to ESPN Research, those two arm lengths are the shortest of any defensive lineman draft in the first round ever or since we started tracking. Who knows about like, you know, 1942 right um then there was some conflicting reporting that actually teams measured his arms and they were longer which you know what it reminded me of so i have a two and a half year old and when you go to the doctor every six months to get him measured they can weigh him but the arm length like he'll get him or an arm like his total length they'll measure they'll put him on they put the way it works is they put you hit the kid on a table with like a ruler and then the nurse just does their best.

1:02:30Mina Kimes:So they'll be like, oh, wow, he was the 42nd size percentile. I was like, damn, really? Because he was like 75th and they're like, let me do it again. And he wiggles a little bit. They're like, actually, he's the 90th percentile. And I'm like, you just can't measure babies, can you? Because they're wiggling. And so whenever I saw this news coming in about Ruben Bain, I just pictured like teams trying to wiggle him while his arms or measure him while his arms wiggle around. Anyways, whether it is slightly more or less, he has short arms. Dan, this is really tricky for me. I want to hear your thoughts on this because I am trying to work through it.

1:03:05Mina Kimes:I'm going to talk about him at more length, but I love his tape. I think it's awesome. I think he's explosive. He's bendier than, I would say, the other Rushers in a way, and certainly Bayley. He already has a pretty decent repertoire of moves. He has a plan. his motor runs crazy hot he's unbelievable against the run so i want to be the person who says screw history the tape doesn't lie and i i'm still advocating for him to go top 10 but also saying screw history is not a thing that's historically worked out in the nfl draft so how do you regard this and how much it matters or doesn't matter yeah well i i think we needed a

1:03:48Dan Pizzuta:picture of uh him and your arm weights together because i think that's how you know the internet measures uh you know size sure size questions uh at the combine but yeah so it is interesting because it's we we came in thinking he was going to have short arms and then he did so it's not we're not really breaking new ground here and when you watch him play and a lot of times like the short arms are a feature and not a bug. I think he's learned to play like that. It's not like we're watching him try to use his arms and have a bull rush and use length to win in his ways. He has like this really good hump move when he gets, you know, close and gets his shoulder into offensive linemen.

1:04:35Dan Pizzuta:So I think he already knows how to play there. So it's not, it's like, we're not breaking news to him that his arms are short. So it is a place where I feel a little more comfortable because I think he's already shown he has that tool in his bag to use that to him as an advantage. And he's not necessarily like running over to college tackles because he has like this great stiff arm and he's running through these guys. So I think in a way it does lessen some of the concern. I think there are certainly going to be some times when he rushes against the NFL offensive tackle and they're just going to be able to get his arms on him and it's going to.

1:05:15Dan Pizzuta:But I think there are a lot of other pass rushers who, for one reason or another, are going to get stood up by some NFL caliber offensive tackle. Yeah.

1:05:23Mina Kimes:I love your point about his, how he already is able to mitigate that discrepancy to some and, and true NFL tackles different and, you know, arm length matters because if you come up against a guy with a large frame, he's able to use that to keep you at arms, literally. But Bain hasn't, you talked about the, he's very good at closing the gap very quickly to the point where it's actually doesn't become a factor. And this is just going to be on the evaluators have to figure out if they feel like that translates to the nfl like i said he's still a top 10 player to me no question i if he was at since you know uh kansas city at nine i would frankly advocate for them to take him over the back but um it's definitely going to be it's a real thing it's something we have to acknowledge um okay so the other uh baller um it's not really but kind of uh controversy of terms of numbers was how fast did cardinal tate actually run uh 40 time came in 4.54 uh but then there were reports that actually it was lower according to some people's watches uh it's very funny it's like it reminded me of you know the the drake like meme where he's like looks unhappy but then it's like 4.54 disgusting 4.49 cool is how i thought like just so silly um but it matters you know it is a thing that uh not that small of a discrepancy but he didn't he didn't he didn't blaze you know he's um people have pointed out that there have been a lot of receivers his size he's six foot two and he's he's pretty built i would say he's not like a super skinny six foot two that have run similar times um naku is the famous one but like cd lamb you know it's not his how he wins i would say he's plenty fast but um the thing about tate's game there's a lot of things i like about his game is how well the thing i like he separates downfield and how he does so with his route running.

1:07:37Mina Kimes:And I think 40 time to me doesn't affect that at all because I never watch him on tape and feel like he's not fast enough, Dan.

1:07:46Dan Pizzuta:Right. And that's kind of my takeaway here. For the most part, the position I cared the least about 40 times is wide receiver. and it feels like publicly that is not the case because we love fast wide receivers but my least favorite type of receiver is the guy who runs fast but doesn't know how to play wide receiver and we've seen that fail a lot at the NFL level we see you know the Xavier Borsley we see the A.D. Mitchells you know um the the other reason like last year that I didn't really care if Matthew Golden was, you know, 4-2-8 or not, whether, like, that was fast. Like, he knows how to play wide receiver, and I still have, you know, yes.

1:08:30Dan Pizzuta:So with Tate, like, whether it's a 4-4-9 or a 4-5-4, it doesn't really impact his game. He is such a smooth, long strider. He knows how to get separation with how he sets up defenders. um he he has all he has a lot like more wiggle at that size that i don't like it he is not like this you know blazing fast guy who's going to just use speed like he he knows the the nuance of of receiver and so when you look at it um so i put together a metric every year for wide receivers and it's basically like what you added to an offense so it takes your yards per target and then subtracts what the quarterback averaged in yards per attempt to any other player on the field.

1:09:18Dan Pizzuta:So you basically just kind of get the difference between when you're targeted, when anyone else is targeted. This metric usually has some trouble with Ohio State receivers because there's usually a lot of them and they're all really good. But Tate this year comes out third in this class. So the fact that he was so good on that offense that was able to, and he was able to produce in a per play way like it when the like top scouted receiver and a guy high in this metric like come together we have a pretty good hit rate in that so the way tate plays i like a lot of it i think he should be the number one receiver in this class and his his four five four it does not really do anything to me because i think he has so many other ways of getting open yeah we share

1:10:06Mina Kimes:that opinion um makai lemon was the only one i i just because there were you know he was the class that comes out of the combine didn't win the interviews and i i don't know i have very little to talk about him a lot as a player in the coming weeks yeah um that i bring that up not because i think it affects how i feel about a player and i hate to be the person who's just like here's some anonymous reports but we have seen time and time again it does affect draft status coming out of this week if there's some reporting around you know maybe guys being or guys who are conversely very impressive so um you know i i like the player a lot and i don't have him like he's not at tate's level for me but i do think he's a really great fit for a lot of offenses so something to keep an eye on um i alluded to this but i did want to mention a few other players who I would say put on impressive performances that could bolster their draft stock.

1:11:07Mina Kimes:I'll go first. I didn't mention this to you, but I want to mention, I practice saying his name, Max E.A. Inacor, the ASU offensive tackle. E.A. Inacor, the right tackle. So he ran a 4.95, 40, 321 pounds, which is impressive at that weight. and I mentioned that because it squares with how he looks on tape so I I don't like to give too strong opinions about offensive linemen it's just not a position I'm super comfortable scouting but right I have I was watching him against David Bailey um because I like to okay let me see you against an NFL rusher and I was really impressed with his speed and his foot speed in particular and his athleticism in that game, ASU against Texas Tech.

1:11:57Mina Kimes:And so to see that reflected in his testing numbers, just for me, I feel like there's a lot of upside in the player.

1:12:06Dan Pizzuta:Yeah, it feels like we did have some very athletic offensive linemen too, which is fun. And yeah, I'm like you, especially in the draft, the offensive linemen are probably the guys I have the least opinions about because it is still the position I don't have as much experience in. But yeah, there are some fun guys coming into this class and the amount of kind of first-round offensive linemen that we might see. And again, it's kind of like the tight end thing. We see the more you can bet on some of the athleticism from these guys and the way they can move, especially the way we see a lot of these, you know, the gap and zone schemes coming together now in the run game.

1:13:01Dan Pizzuta:It is having some of these guys that can really move is certainly helpful.

1:13:07Mina Kimes:All right, who you got?

1:13:08Dan Pizzuta:All right, we're going to stick to some big guys, and that is Caleb Banks, defensive tackle from Florida. He missed a lot of 20-25 with an injury, And he's still a guy that's like kind of figuring out how to play defensive tackle. But in previous two years, Florida, there's a lot of fun stuff on his tape, a lot of interior pressure. And we've seen how important having some big guys who can get quick pressure up the middle. And so he measured in 6 '6", 327 pounds with a 504.40, which I mean, to move like that at that weight. And then did great in the jumps, 32 inches on the vertical, nine and a half on the broad.

1:13:57Dan Pizzuta:So you just kind of look at what he's able to do, having that big of a body, being able to be in the middle of defense. And that's something that back part of the first round can bet on some of that development. I think that could be potentially a lot of fun.

1:14:12Mina Kimes:It's a good one too, because I feel like the defensive tackles right now could go in any order. So testing numbers could be. And he was a player a lot of people had questions about because of the injury. So for him to test well is a big deal. I want to throw out one more. Dylan Theoneman, the safety out of Oregon, who ran a 4.3540. He's six feet tall and had a 41-inch vert. But the 40 was eye-opening. so I feel like a dummy because I come late to the draft every year and while watching I don't even remember I think it was Mendoza against Oregon twice I texted Daniel Jeremiah and I was like hey is anyone talking about 31 on Oregon the white safety and he was like yeah I have him 18 in my mock draft I was like all right okay cool cool all right so this is like I thought I was being real slick um but as much as i liked him on tape i didn't think he was this fast uh he's pretty you know i thought closing speed was impressive whether from a split safety or a single high um look and he's a great tackler he just plays like his hair is on fire and i didn't i don't know it sounds like i'm like what he's sneaky fast but he really didn't look this fast and so So I think game speed is different from straight line speed, no doubt.

1:15:38Mina Kimes:But for him to put up those numbers, I think, if we thought he was possibly first round before, to me, this cements it. He's going in the first round, and I'm pretty high on the player.

1:15:50Dan Pizzuta:Yeah, and I think he always seems like he knows where he's going to, so I think it makes him look maybe slightly slower, actually, just because he's so smooth in where he goes. And there were some fun things that the Oregon defense did where they played like a lot of like three, three, five. And he was like in the Buddha Baker Cardinals, like middle of the three safeties, like three deep safeties. And then he was just kind of like unleashed to go anywhere. And that was a lot of fun to watch. So like you said, I think he can play in a kind of any kind of scheme. And he was lined up all over the field, you know, like 13 % in the box, 14 % in the slot, and then it's like 71 % deep.

1:16:35Dan Pizzuta:And just the way he was able to kind of fire downfield, it seemed like he always knew where the rush lane was. And when you combine it, kind of like we said with Sonny Siles, you combine the mental acumen that I think he showed a lot on the field with the athleticism that he has. It's a fun prospect, especially for safety, which again, we've seen as a position that I think is going to matter more, especially when you have the versatility like that.

1:17:01Mina Kimes:Would it be too on the nose if Minnesota replaces Harrison? Or he's there, I guess. Would be a great fit. He would be – by Ryan Flores, I would love that. Is there anyone else you wanted to highlight as someone who impressed you this week?

1:17:16Dan Pizzuta:There were – so as much as I did say that wide receiver testing doesn't do a lot, uh bryce lance uh who is trey lance's younger brother uh receiver from north dakota state uh he's awesome he's a lot of fun he does not have a lot of like nuance to the route tree which i think is also part just kind of part of what the north dakota state offense was it was a lot of uh it just goes and and hitches but man he's he's fast he's smooth he knows how to win in in that way where it's not just straight speed that he's winning with. And he comes out favorably. I was talking with some of the metrics I do for wide receivers, comes out very favorably with Christian Watson and Jalen Coker, who were two guys that stood out on the FCS level.

1:18:04Dan Pizzuta:And Bryce Lance actually comes out first in this class for that metric I put together. So to have him look as athletic as he is, a day two dart throw as kind of a guy who can give an offense juice. It was a lot of fun to watch.

1:18:22Mina Kimes:Bryce Lance is too confusing of a name.

1:18:24Dan Pizzuta:Yeah. I very much have to make sure I am saying that slowly when it comes out.

1:18:30Mina Kimes:I would be remiss if I didn't highlight that the Arkansas quarterback, Taylin Green, I asked him, is there any quarterback who do some freaky stuff? We're at a 4-3-7-40, which is an insane number for a quarterback. He's one of the highest, fastest ever, obviously. uh we'll see you know that but as far as like dart throws later rounds why not um yeah yeah that that was that was an interesting one okay so uh obviously free agency really kicks off next week so i i am planning on keeping this cadence so taping tuesday for wednesday but it's going to be an absolutely insane few days so i'll be putting out stuff everywhere as well and go check out if you're listening to this my youtube channel youtube.com slash i'm gonna publish shorts there reacting to some of the news as it surely will come out on monday and tuesday um in addition to being on tv dan can you tell folks where they can find your work throughout

1:19:29Dan Pizzuta:free agency yeah i'll be uh doing some similar stuff posting a lot on on blue sky which is probably where i'll link everything but i'll probably also be doing some uh short form video which everyone at the compound was like, you should be doing that more. So I guess I'm going to take that advice for free agency. I'll have some things, some stuff for positions in the draft up at FTN. And I think I'm going to grade free agents and stuff too on snaps and stats. So I will, I'll have all that linked up on, on blue sky. If you take a look.

1:20:02Mina Kimes:This time next year or this time next week, pardon me, Kyla Murray could be a Viking, a Steeler, a Dolphin. Falcon, a jet, who knows? So I'm excited to react to that. So great having you on the show. As always, Dan, go check out Dan's work. Go follow him on Blue Sky and everywhere else to get some of those reactions he discussed. I'll be back next week. In the meantime, I will be recapping the Love is Blind finale with David Dennis Jr. over at Viewer Discretion Pod. We are contemplating which shows to start next. So if people have thoughts on that, maybe Paradise, I don't know, is one that's come up.

1:20:39Mina Kimes:and in the meantime thank you as always to the folks at Omaha Productions, Kirsten Semecki, Owen Saylor, Jack Foster and Tucker Tashin. See you guys next week