Is Trump now bankrolling a MAGA paramilitary?

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1:03This is a Global Player original podcast. How long has he been inside for? I'm not even sure how long he's been inside for. He's a brother of ours in another chapter, so we're picking him up. These were people who were right at the coalface of that revolution and they were injuring police officers, which is why you get people now in the Democrats, critics, who say this is essentially a slush fund for cop killers. This is the stuff of tin pot dictatorships where the president gives himself a new armoured plate in Rolls Royce and new uniforms for his personal guard while everyone else is just left by the roadside.

1:46The Justice Department has this new fund that was announced today, $1.7 billion. Why should taxpayers pay for the January? Well, it's been very well received, I have to tell you. I know very little about it. I wasn't involved in the whole creation of it and the negotiation. But this is reimbursing people that were horribly treated, horribly treated. It's anti-weaponization. They've been weaponized. They've been, in some cases, imprisoned wrongly. They paid legal fees that they didn't have. They've gone bankrupt. Their lives have been destroyed. and they turn out to be right. Trump calls this a compensation fund for those who were victims of a weaponised Justice Department.

2:30The Democrats call this a slush fund for cop killers. Is this the most brazen act of presidential corruption this century? Welcome to the News Agents USA. The News Agents USA with Emily Maitlis and John Sopel. It's Maitlis. And it's John in a rather wintry Australia right now. And what has emerged over the past few days is astonishing because the background to this is that the leader of this government, Donald Trump, sued his own government for$10 billion over the fact that his internal revenue tax returns were leaked out when he was running for president. And he is sowing the IRS for that. There has been a settlement where the IRS will give him$1.7 billion.

3:29This is the leader of the government negotiating with his government over how much money he should be given. And he's saying he is giving this money to those people who were imprisoned for rioting, for wrecking the Congress on January the 6th, for beating up police officers, for causing unbelievable damage to America's reputation and to physical damage inflicted. And he's saying these people have been treated so badly and they are victims. And he is going to set up this fund, which although he denies any knowledge of any of the details of, you can be sure he was intimately involved because he agreed the settlement with the IRS, all negotiated via his acting attorney general, Todd Blanche.

4:17Yeah. And when you hear the title of it and it's for victims of a weaponised justice department, you think, oh, I get it. OK, so that might be, for example, James Comey, who was fired without due cause. It might be his daughter Maureen Comey fired without due cause. It might be Hunter Biden. It might be any of the people who think that the system has been turned against them, you know, fairly or unfairly, but they have a chance to fight it and ask for compensation. But I think something that is possibly worth noting is that the fund, this fund, which is not quite 1.7 billion, not quite 1.8 billion.

4:59It is 1.776 billion, which for anyone who's kind of, you know, thinking about that or seeing it on a page will understand. It is a reference to the Patriots of Independence Year 1776. So there is more than a hint of a troll in this whole fund. it will be administered by a five member commission that will be appointed by the acting Attorney General, Todd Blanche, or whoever is Attorney General at the time. One member chosen in consultation with congressional leadership and the president can then remove any of them at any time without explanation or cause. So in other words, if James Comey did come to seek redress and the commission did want to hear him out, you can imagine that that person would be gone from the commission pretty quickly.

5:54There is almost no transparency to how this works. We will not be hearing who gets money. We'll not be hearing why they get money. It is absolutely in the dark. And here's an example of some of the lawmakers in the US trying to get their heads around it. First of all, a Republican, Brian Fitzpatrick, who's asked if fundamentally he agrees with this idea. You know, every dime that we spend ought to be going to and especially with people in mind over half of Americans that are living paycheck to paycheck. That's got to be at the forefront of every single House and Senate members mind with every dime that we appropriate.

6:34So for that and many other reasons, I am completely objecting to this and I'm going to do everything I can to fight it. So look, you on the podcast yesterday talked about Thomas Massey and the fact that he had been kind of effectively deselected to be a candidate for Kentucky because he had incurred Donald Trump's ire. The control that Donald Trump still has on the Republican Party is immense. It will be interesting to see whether other lawmakers like the one we've just heard will show similar courage, because I think that what people are beginning to see now is a president who is feeling increasingly out of touch.

7:15He's always been the billionaire, the showman, but he always had a good feel for what ordinary Americans were thinking. And when we did the podcast last week and we were talking about how Donald Trump kind of just kind of, you know, said, I'm not considering ordinary Americans and the cost of living when I'm dealing with Iran. it was so tone deaf and I think that Republicans who are kind of they're torn between on the one hand their self-preservation in the midterm elections and absolutely getting you know run down by Democrats who've got so much ammunition and fear of offending the president and where are they going to go with that because at the moment the opinion polls show that this is unpopular, that Donald Trump is unpopular.

8:02But among Republicans, there is still an absolute terror of incurring his wrath. Yeah. And I think we should just dig into where we are with this fund a little bit deeper, because when you hear Brian Fitzpatrick, that clip we just played, you saying, oh, I don't want to see taxpayers' money going on this. On the one hand, that is absolutely right. He's talking about affordability. Why should taxpayers be paying any money towards a fund, but actually stand back and realise that that criticism does not even touch the sides of what Trump and Todd Blanche have just decreed, that they are going to be using taxpayers' money to pay out to people they call victims that many Americans, most Americans, would see as convicted felons.

8:58Trump has made it clear that the people who were involved in the Jan 6 riots, the people who tried to overthrow democracy, the people who left several police officers dead or suicidal after that eruption of violence at the Capitol, should not only be set free, but should also now be able to receive compensation. And if you remember, Trump's first act as president, he was sworn in on the 20th of January. On the 21st of January, he signed into law the freeing of the Jan 6 rioters. I caught up with a friend of one of those who was about to be released from prison in Washington, D.C. that day. Just to remind you.

9:47His name is Tom Vornis. And how long has he been inside for? I'm not even sure how long he's been inside for. He's a brother of ours in another chapter, so we're picking him up. You mean as a Proud Boys brother? Yeah. Okay, so not a brother brother? No, he's my brother. He's your actual brother? My Proud Boy brother. Okay. And what was he being convicted of? Nothing. So he's inside jail for nothing? Well, he was, yeah, well, yes, exactly. He's inside jail because he's an American patriot. these were people who were right at the coalface of that revolution and they were injuring police officers which is why you get people now in the democrats critics who say this is essentially a slush fund for cop killers and frankly instead of kind of doing it could be this or it could be that It kind of is.

10:40I mean, it sort of is. It is compensation for people who put police officers' lives in danger or worse. The acting attorney general, who, lest we forget, used to be Donald Trump's personal attorney and still seems to be acting in that role, was grilled on all of this by Senator Chris Coons. I heard from a number of law enforcement friends who found it appalling that there was the possibility that folks like the peace, the oath keepers, the proud boys who had assaulted Capitol Police officers could receive multi-million dollar payouts from this fund. Will you commit that no one who has been convicted of assaulting a police officer will receive a payout from this fund?

11:25So I share the concerns that apparently members of law enforcement gave to you last week, although none of this was announced last week, so that's surprising. They had heard rumours there would be a settlement fund. Okay, but anybody can apply. The commissioners will set rules, I'm sure. That's not for me to set, that's for the commissioners, and whether an individual, an oath keeper, as you just mentioned, applies for compensation, anybody in this country can apply. Anyone can apply, even people who've been prosecuted already, even people who've been convicted already, because those people have now been freed.

12:00In other words, there is nothing stopping any of those who were released from prison, the January the 6th rioters, from going and saying we'd now like compensation. And let me posit something that is even more worrying about this. This comes from one of the police officers, one of those who was injured on January the 6th, Harry Dunn. And he is trying to stop this fund from happening because the way he the way he sees this, it is not just compensation. It is a reward and it is very possibly an incitement for those who might be considering future political violence should Trump need it in the coming elections.

12:48Just listen to Harry Dunn trying to set this thought out. I do believe that it absolutely sets the stage for Donald Trump to do it again. I call it Donald Trump, this payment is going to serve as a retainer. People have retainers for their lawyers. So when they need them, they're available. Donald Trump is putting a retainer on a mob, on a militia that's already showed the violence that they're willing to enact on his behalf. And he's incentivizing it, too, because I don't believe that in 2029, Donald Trump is going to leave office peacefully. Why? Because he doesn't have a track record of doing it.

13:22He's the first president in over 250 years to say we're not going to have a peaceful transfer of power. I mean, when you think of it in those terms as an incentive, what does that make the next few months look like? if Donald Trump has essentially gathered around him. As we said at the time, actually, when he released the Jancic rioters, he has created a vigilante army should he ever need one in future. If these people are not just indebted to him for their freedom, but are actually coming to him for their money, actually getting paid out of a slush fund of taxpayers' money to do it again, well, what's stopping them?

14:03There's another aspect of this which we haven't even talked about yet, which to my mind is even more egregious. And this is the deal that has been announced by Todd Blanche in a separate memorandum that came out saying that in this settlement between Donald Trump and the IRS, he will no longer nor will his family be subject to audit for things that they have done in the past or will do in the future. Now, just imagine that for a second. Hang on. So what? Whatever tax return he submits, you have to accept. We talked about last week Donald Trump's son, Eric, going to China with the president. Now, either that was bring your son to work day and that's why he went to China, or he was there to try and capitalize on the fact that his dad is the president and get business off the back of it.

15:00We have seen the monetization of the U.S. presidency in a way that has never been seen before in anyone's lifetimes in any part of the history of the United States of America. And here we have the acting attorney general and former lawyer to Donald Trump say, don't worry, boys, you're fine. You're not going to be audited again. Now, on a conservative estimate, there are some who are saying that on the basis of his previous tax returns, if the IRS had found him against him, he could be subject to a hundred million dollar fine. That's gone now. That's gone. He's free. That's another hundred million in the bank coaching of Donald Trump.

15:41So what we're seeing as well is as well as this slush fund that you have so eloquently described, you've got Donald Trump now free to do what the hell he likes and his children do with their tax returns is just mind boggling. And, you know, I do think one of the things that we're coming up against time and again is the asymmetry of the politics now in America 2026, because Donald Trump, as you say, has basically got himself off scot-free whatever he does with his taxes, set up a slush fund of 1.776 billion to pay out essentially convicted criminals. He's done that without judicial approval, without congressional approval, having five members of a committee that he can fire at will.

16:27And what are the Democrats doing it? What are the Democrats doing? They're saying, oh, we we are going on the attack and we're going to try and offer a bill to block it. And, you know, just hang on a second. Hang on. It's like you are still using the old levers of democracy. You are using the levers of Congress. You're using the levers of the judiciary. You still have a belief. I mean, what else can they do? What else can they say? But you still have this belief that America is working with its old institutions. And clearly it isn't because this thing is going to happen. It's going to get through.

17:03Todd Blanch is going to be in charge. The money is going to exist. it does seem that the Democrats are playing this sort of, you know, 1990s game now, instead of being kind of up in arms and frankly rioting on the streets about what's going on. I look at the opinion poll data for Donald Trump's support among Republicans, and given the scale of what we are describing, which is essentially lining your own pockets are letting off rioters so you've created your own kind of army as you described it. Yeah, yeah. And people are going, yeah, whatever. Yeah, fine. 75 % of Republicans. We'll try and offer a bill.

17:4475 % of Republicans still absolutely solidly behind him. Now that's, okay, the MAGA wall still remains solid. But I think the rest of America is looking at this and thinking, this is crazy. This is the stuff of tin pot dictatorships where the president gives himself a new armoured plated Rolls Royce and new uniforms for his personal guard while everyone else is just left by the roadside. And I think there is a danger that Donald Trump is looking ridiculously out of touch with some of these things that he's doing, which seem just to be about the self-aggrandizement and self-enriching of him, his family and all those close friends around him who've also got very rich off this second term of his presidency and the normal rules as you say are just not applying the checks and balances what checks and balances in a moment we'll be back talking about trump's ballroom again and whether he really is going to make the people of america pay for it

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19:30Hello from me, crime journalist Andy Hughes. I'm one of the hosts of The Crime Agents. This is true crime like you've never heard before. And I'm the ex-cop Neil Basso. Well, ex-cop isn't really doing it justice, isn't Neil? I mean, you did head up every major department of Europe's biggest police force, the mighty Met. You're no slouch in the crime department yourself after 20 years as an investigative reporter and also as an undercover journalist. On this podcast, we tackle the major crime stories in the news, like the arrest of Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor, as well as delving into some of the most famous cases in criminal history, like the murder of Stephen Lawrence.

20:11Check out The Crime Agents on Global Player, YouTube or wherever you get your podcasts.

20:22The News Agents USA

20:48such a way that we can have military there. But the entire roof is developed for military. They're very high. They're higher than just about anything else. They have a 360 degree vision of Washington, D.C. They have a massive drone capacity. Not only is it drone proof, if a drone hits it, it bounces off. It won't have any impact. But it's also meant as a drone port. So it protects all of Washington, the roof of the building. Okay. Now, does anybody have any questions? That is Donald Trump describing his ballroom. Still not complete, but a lot of the East Wing of the White House has been destroyed to make way for it, even though it has no planning permission, no proper engineers' drawings, no proper anything, really.

21:39But this is Donald Trump's vanity project writ large. And it was really interesting that when he came back from China and this key critical talks that took place last week with President Xi, the first thing he put on Truth Social was not about the Strait of Hormuz, not about rare earth minerals, not about trade. It was about China's got a ballroom. Why shouldn't I have one? And it's like it's kind of the latest vanity project that, you know, the people next door to us have put up a conservatory. Why shouldn't we have a conservatory? The problem is that it's going to cost a huge amount of money.

22:18No one's quite clear who is picking up the bill or what indeed it's for. And Senator Bill Cassidy from Louisiana, soon to be the ex-Senator from Louisiana because he incurred Donald Trump's wrath, is now speaking more freely. Yeah, interesting to hear these sort of newly courageous voices. And I guess this is, in a way, the trap that Trump has set himself, that anyone now who has lost their primary to a Trump MAGA sort of opponent is now thinking, what have I got to lose? What have I got to lose? Between now, May and November, when I have to relinquish the seat, or actually the following January, I can say exactly what I want.

23:04So Bill Cassidy is spelling it out. And to be fair, Senate Republicans are starting to get the message. They have now offered to remove a$1 billion Secret Service funding request that would basically help his ballroom project. And they are going to take it out of their funding bill, which was actually called the Immigration Enforcement Funding Bill. I mean, how it got in there in the first place is frankly anyone's guess. But it's almost like and I wonder if you remember a couple of weeks ago, we were talking about the latest attempted assassination tack at the White House dinner. I mean, very little has actually been heard about that since we still don't know what has happened to the then active shooter.

23:51We still don't know how that sort of trial or prosecution is progressing. But shortly after that, Trump tried to make the case for the ballroom being absolutely vital and absolutely important. And I think there were a lot of nodding dogs at the time. I was probably one of them who went, oh, I can see. And of course, you can't. You have to have a ballroom. And of course, as soon as you think about it logically, what are you saying? That the president could never go out to dinner, could never be anywhere else except his ballroom, could never be in a group of people having dinner without a ballroom?

24:23The whole thing is absolutely absurd. And yet he tried to sort of squeeze it through on the back of whatever happened in that room that Saturday night and said, that is why I need the American people to pay for my ballroom. And now I guess there is a certain sort of sanity and relief in the fact that his own party, Senate Republicans, are now saying, yeah, we cannot put this in the immigration enforcement funding bill. Whether it creeps into something else, who knows? You know, in the context of Ukraine, we've talked about dual use technology where you send something and it can be used as a military thing.

25:03Donald Trump is using that argument for his ballroom. It's dual use. You won't be able to just dance in this ballroom and have fancy pants dinners in this ballroom. You'll be able to launch drones from it and the military will have the latest hardware and it will become a defense installation in Washington, D.C. to keep Donald Trump safer. I think the whole argument, you know, we talked in the first half of the episode about the danger of Donald Trump looking out of touch. There is a real element of kind of, he hasn't got the powdered wig, but of marry Antoinette and let them eat cake. You know, I'm going to have this incredible ballroom, but I know you Americans are having to pay over four.

25:46The price of fuel now is over$4 a gallon across America. in all 50 states. Some states it's over$5 a gallon. People are suffering. The affordability crisis is real. People are living paycheck to paycheck. And, you know, and a lot of people are really, really struggling. And Donald Trump is obsessed. He does seem absolutely obsessed about this bloody ballroom that nobody seems to want. No one has given permission for. But Donald Trump is insistent, has to happen. What I would say, though, is we are in this very odd moment of time. The next four weeks, we are going to see more of those Republican primaries.

26:28We've already seen Trump exerting his power over MAGA Republicans in Indiana, in Texas with John Cornyn, now looking like he won't be able to fight against Ken Paxton. We've seen it in Louisiana with Bill Cassidy. We've seen it in Kentucky with Thomas Massey. Let us not forget Thomas Massey was part of that campaign, a key member of that campaign to get the Epstein files released. He provoked Trump's ire. And so I guess this is a fairly critical few weeks because there will be Republicans who are looking around now saying, well, do I want to put my head above the parapet? I know what I should be doing.

27:13I know how awful this sounds. I know how hard it's going to make it for me to win my my general election against the Democrat. But right now, just when he's kind of, you know, snipering, do I really want to put my head above the parapet and be in Trump's line of fire? And the answer to many of them, you know, the cowards, the ones with no backbone might well be not now. It's a fascinating point in American politics where, you know, we're coming to the end of the primary process. So, you know, for the next two years, the people that have got a safe seat in the House of Representatives will be fine.

27:52They'll be in the House of Representatives of that. Just that basic question of do I incur Donald Trump's wrath, but perhaps make an argument that resonates with my voters? Exactly. Or am I so terrified of Donald Trump that I have to keep Stund in the hope that he won't go after me, even though I may go down in flames in the midterm elections, because I've supported a whole bunch of ludicrous policies like the slush fund for cop killers, like the, you know, amnesty for the Trump family in future audits and the ridiculous ballroom. Right. Because there's there's a chronology, right? There's no point in being able to win your state or win your congressional seat against a Democrat.