Filipe Luís exclusive: Simeone’s Genius, How I Beat Chelsea & My Managerial Secrets

0:28Hi guys, we're back again. It's the Obi-Wan Podcast. Philippe Luiz, welcome to the Obi-Wan Podcast. Thank you. Thank you, my friend. Thank you. Nice to see you again. Good to see you. You look well. You look like you still could play for the team. Yeah, just... Player coach? Yeah, no, no, no. Yeah, I finished, but I was done. I left everything I had inside the pitch, I think. But then I made the next step to be a head coach really fast. I didn't even stop, but I'm really happy. And also really happy to be with you. Chelsea legend. And we spent a really nice time together. And we've been Premier League champions together.

1:09Yes, exactly. And it was really nice, really nice. So really nice to be with you. Thank you so much. Thank you. I mean, thanks for opening your door for us. I mean, it's great. The facilities here is crazy. It's amazing, isn't it? And I heard that a few years ago, it was not like this. So how did the whole thing come about? Well, when I came to Flamengo in 2019, it's already done everything was already over but I heard that 2015, 16, 17 were really really bad tough time but then the club they pay all the debts they had and they organized themselves now it's a huge club again and the club with the most supporters in Brazil 40 million supporters 40 million?

1:56Wow. Yeah, yeah. So it's really, really big. A lot of pressure. A lot of pressure. Yeah, but we love pressure. We love pressure. So it's nice. It's nice. Really happy to be here. Oh, wow. Wow. That's crazy. And you spent, well, three, four years as a player here, right? Four and a half. Four and a half. Wow. And how was your time back then as a player? And how was your time now as a manager, as the man in charge? Well, when I arrived here in 2019, we had some big signings at the same time, like Rafinha from Bayern Munich, Pablo Mari, he used to play after here, he went to Arsenal. And a lot of new players came and we made a new group.

2:39And in that 2019, we won also the league and Libertadores. So it was a really big season for us. And also with the manager, Jorge Jesus, made history here in the club. So a lot of players had stayed a long time and me as well. I stayed four more years playing here. And after I retired, I retired here. My last game was in 2023. Okay. And just when I retired, just one month after I retired, I started to be a coach as head coach of under 17s. Okay. To learn. The club opened the doors for me. So I was really happy that I had this opportunity and they gave everything I need to become a coach to be where I am right now.

3:30So I'm really happy. Oh, wow. And you've just mentioned it there. What is the ambition of this club? You as a manager, what is your next step? I think you want the legalists in you. We won the Cup. The Cup. Yeah. So what is your ambition now as the manager? I know winning the league will be one of them. And as a player, you just said you won the Libertadores or something like that. Is that the biggest trophy to win? Is that one of your ambitions as the manager now? Well, Libertadores is the equivalent of Champions League in Europe. So it's the biggest trophy we can win. after if you win the Libertadores we have the Club World Cup we also here in Brazil we value this rate a lot this trophy but also league Brazilian league is one of the most competitive league in the world it's really difficult to win it because there's a lot of big clubs but Flamengo with the organization the club has right now and also the signings that we made the money that the club spent on the players and salaries, we have to at least try to win the league.

4:42Of course, win it, the results, we cannot control it. But try to win it and be there until the end is our goal every season. No pressure. A lot of pressure. But it's good and makes us, keep us alive, you know? Does that keep you awake at night? Or do you think, oh, well… I'm sleeping a little bit less, you know? As a player, I slept 10 hours, 12 hours a day now. It's just four or six hours and my head never stops thinking about the team and all the problems the week we have. But I'm really enjoying this new job. I know that I have a lot to learn, but it's a challenge. As a coach, everybody who is a manager knows how difficult it is.

5:32So I'm getting used to this new job and I think we're doing quite well. I mean, everybody, we had one of your players just now and everybody you speak to, even the fans on the street. I arrived two days ago and I keep asking a lot of them are Flamengo fans. I was like, how's the manager? Everybody I speak to, they love you. They absolutely love you. And they all think you're destined to, I know this is a massive, massive job for you. but they think you're destined for greatness. Is that how you see it? Well, I know the position I have here in the club. We have, for me, the best squad in South America.

6:18We have an amazing team. The environment inside the club is amazing. We feel really protected from the club. The supporters, they feel that we represent them inside the pitch. The way we play, we pressure really high. We play always with the ball. We try to be dominant. And that's why I feel that supporters and the players, they are together. And we can feel that everybody's happy. But you know, football is really fast. And we need results. Every weekend, we need to win it. So I'm really humble because it's a long way until we become a champion. And it's almost half of the season now. and we need to get more wins to win the league.

7:03So we have to be humble. I'll tell you a story. Before I came, I messaged him. I said, listen, you need to be on the podcast. He said, listen, I know you can come to Brazil, but for me to be on your podcast, it depends on the games if we win the games. It's true, it's true, it's true. And I told him, I said, listen, fingers crossed. I'll pray for you, you win all your games. And the one was 8-0, you won the last game. So you see. Yeah, biggest win in the Brazilian history league, right? Wow. That's nice. That's nice. That's nice. So tell me, now you're a manager, which manager inspired you? Obviously, growing up when you were playing, which manager inspired you?

7:44You thought, okay, if I become a manager, this is the style, this is the way I want to play. Well, I think I spent the most part of my career with Simeone. He really changed my way of seeing football, the way I think about football. I think about my life as well. I became more competitive, more. I really want to be a champion because he gave that inside my heart. I didn't have that before I worked with him. So I think he's the guy who changed me the most. But then I have a lot of different coaches and managers in this period of my career, a lot. And which one of them taught me something new? And we work with Mourinho, right?

8:30Mourinho, it's amazing. Yeah. I learned a lot from him. I think he's the most organized coach I ever had in my career. Okay. And the way he treated the players, it doesn't matter if it was Diego Costa, Obemico, or me, or he talked to everybody and he demands the same thing from everybody, right? So he really has a lot of courage in his pitch, which I love. And then Tatic, I learned a little bit from every coach I love. I work with it and I love more the way that Jorge Jesus played here. Okay. With pressure really high and he taught me a lot of things about defensive style of play and also building for the back.

9:14So I get a little bit of everybody, but also I try to study a lot because football, I think, changes every season. Every season, some coaches make something new and we try to copy. I'm a copycat. So I try to copy. You're a smart guy. You're a very smart guy. I hate to say, but I'm not Cruyff, you know, and I'm not Guardiola to invent something new. But I love players that play close to each other, connecting to each other and playing and feeling good inside the pitch. I love when the players know they have a solution. Nobody hiding from the ball. That's why I ask for my players the most. And that, I think, happens when I was with Simeone.

10:06that first time in my career that I feel that I knew what I have to do what I have to do inside the pitch in every way in every part of the pitch if I have a throw-in I know how I have to make this throw-in if I have a corner kick where I have to be details that's the first time so that's why I try to that's the way I try to to teach my players Betwinner home of true winners very very attacking your style of play. I mean, I was at a club walk-off. I watched, I covered the games. I watched it. I walked with the zone. I was analyzing the games. I was saying how amazing manager you are. But watching your team and against coming up against Chelsea, first of all, how did it feel for you coming up against Chelsea?

10:56Yeah. It was really special. I played against Chelsea when I went back to Atletico and was special, you know, because when Chelsea, they bought me from Atletico Madrid, I know they made an effort because it was 20 million euros, I think, in that moment. And Marina and also Abramovich, they spent the money. And I feel that I couldn't give it back, you know. I didn't play so well there and I wasn't myself in that time. So I also say sorry to all the guys. No, it's true. I was going to ask that question later. Yeah, I feel sorry. But I have a really special feeling with the club, you know? And a lot of people are still working there.

11:39Billy. Billy, Kevin, and a lot of people working there. And I have good relations. But the days before the game, I feel really bad because when I watch Chelsea playing and the way tactical Maresca is, I thought, oh, we're done. It's going to be tough because for me, it's one of the best tactical teams in Europe. Yes, I think so too. And it's almost impossible to pressure Chelsea the way they built from the back. And I was having nightmares during the night. But then for sure, we have a lot of motivation to the game. Our players really, really gave everything we had and we made a perfect game and we won.

12:31It was a special feeling. You won by imagine like 3-1. I was like, but going into that game, everybody was saying, I was in the studio and people were saying, how do you think Flamingo is going to approach this game? We think they're going to sit back and try to soak up the pressure and then counterattack. But surprisingly enough, you came out like you pressed us high. You were there first ball, second ball. You were very, very confident with the ball. You know, you had so much courage with the ball. You played out from the back and you won with your own style. How did you feel when you see that happen?

13:11Well, first of all, I think Brazilian players, they know how to treat the ball and they are never afraid to play. You know, you can see the quality. and sometimes our job is just to give solutions and sometimes they play better and sometimes they don't play so well but that game they was really really special because they were playing so well Gerson our player was amazing and also Plata Rascaeta they made a perfect game especially our two midfielders Jorginho and Pugar they are the engine of the team and they always build him from the back so that game I feel really proud of that. But for me, what I feel about football is if you give time to Cucureia, if you give time to the center backs and to especially Kai Sedo to have time with the ball, you are done.

14:06So I thought, if you're going to lose, you're going to lose trying to press high because if we stay waiting here from Chelsea, we're never going to touch the ball. They never lose the ball. You know, Palmer is going to have time. Yes. Also, Neto is going to have time and I don't want that. So let's try to pressure. We saw a little bit of Liverpool, the way they played, because it's impossible, almost impossible to pressure Chelsea. And we saw Liverpool, how the Liverpool did in that game. And we tried to copy a little bit of pressure and it works well. Wow. Yeah, that was amazing. I know you as a player, you're very calm, you're very quiet, you don't speak much.

14:49as a manager obviously you've played on the Simeone who kicks everything on the touchline he screams he jumps everywhere and then of course Mourinho we know in the dressing room we lose him he comes he smashes everything what are you as a manager what are those oh man do you come in the dressing room smash up everything or what we have stories to tell right of all our managers we do yeah no No, look, I'm really rational. I try to be. And I think everything that happens inside the pitch and with the players, it has a reason. So if the player is not playing well, it has some reason. Maybe he doesn't have enough players close to him.

15:38Maybe he doesn't have a solution. Or maybe the pressure against him is really strong. But maybe he didn't sleep so well and he's not having a good day. It's not a problem. Everybody can have a bad day. So I try to be rational and try to see what is going on. And then my decisions, it's made on rational things, you know? What is happening? What is going on? So this is going on. So let's try to help this guy. And that's, I'm really calm, really calm. Really? Yeah. They never smash anything. No, not yet, not yet. Maybe one day, you know? A few words about our proud sponsors. Betwinner is your reliable partner in the world of sports betting.

16:22Enjoy placing bets on any sports event with great odds and maximum convenience. Visit betwinner.com now. So are you also the type of manager that, you know, like you just said, sometimes players find it difficult to find out why they're not playing well. Is your door, if a player is not playing the way or playing enough, are you the manager that your door is open to have a conversation, to tell me this is why I'm not playing, this is why I need to, or you don't want to have a conversation with the player. My decision, you're not playing, that's it, final. No, no, no. My door is open. I'm the kind of manager who doesn't talk too much.

16:59I don't explain everything to the players. Sometimes, of course, we explain, but because it's a lot of games, and sometimes one guy plays now, and next weekend he doesn't play, so because of the game plan, or maybe I, I don't know, I decide something that I think for the team is the best way. And I always tell the players before the season starts that they are not the same. They're not going to have the same treatment as a player. Everybody is different. So I treat everybody different. But I try to always think what is best for the team. And that way of thinking, I try to choose the players who I believe is the best players for win that game from the team.

17:50And then I sleep really well with it. I don't mind if the players, I don't play, I don't like this coach. It's okay. I've been a football player. I know. We know. We talk about a lot of the manager. We talk about a lot of it. And no, but if the guy wants to talk to me, okay, of course, I can explain everything. I never hide anything. and I always try to tell the truth to them, even if it hurts, but I think it's the best. If you tell the truth, they're going to appreciate it. Yeah. So, I was just going to ask, I know that the fans here, they love you. Love you. And you want to be here. They want you to stay for 20 years.

18:28Yeah, no, it's difficult. What would you ever, obviously, would you ever consider, you know, Chelsea, Atletico Madrid, You play for both clubs. I mean, it might be like, you know, somewhere where you're looking. I know you want to be here for a long time, but we all have goals in life. So is that something you might be looking at one day? Yeah, of course. You know, I really love the club, Flamengo. It's the club I loved when I was a little kid. And I grew up with a Flamengo shirt. I wore it everywhere I go. And I feel this connection with the supporters, with the club. They help me a lot. so I'm here to help the club as well but of course the manager this job it's week by week even if I want to stay maybe someday you lose two or three games and the supporters say okay you can go you go but of course I'm preparing myself because I think most elite of football it's in Europe of course in the Champions League so it's our dream to be there and I'm trying to prepare myself one day goes there, of course.

19:38Okay. And you still watch the Premier League, right? Yes, we copy a lot of things, as I said. A lot of things. I know you still watch the Premier League. What team do you think is more likely to win the Premier League this season? Well, I think Manchester City is always going to be there. Top four, for sure. They have an amazing squad. And for me, for me, my opinion, the best manager ever. Yeah. And Guardiola. but Arsenal they also spend a lot of money and they have the same manager as well and they want to win something I believe they're going to be there and for sure Chelsea I believe in Chelsea because the way I see Maresca playing and his style and when he thinks about football it's really difficult to play against Chelsea for every manager I think you're going to play Chelsea.

20:35You have to prepare this game really well. Otherwise, you're not going to touch the ball. So there's three teams. And OK, also Tottenham, they started really well the season. But Liverpool, yeah. Yeah. I forgot about Liverpool. Yeah, Liverpool. Liverpool, they have to defend the title, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. But yeah, I think these four. No City, Chelsea, Arsenal and Liverpool. But I think City, for me, it's the most favourite to win is Manchester City. Club World Cup, you participated in it. How important, how good was the Club World Cup? For us, it was an amazing experience. We had the experience to play against Chelsea and Bayern Munich and the other clubs to compare how is our level, level, how we can compete with them.

21:30They are better. They have better players, but we can compete. We could win against Chelsea. We had an amazing game against Bayern Munich. They were better, but we could compete with them. And I think it's really nice to all the countries and their organization and all the fans can get in one place and live and experience these teams, This kind of games. I know it's a lot of games. It's really difficult to find the dates to put these games. But I think they have to keep doing this amazing tournament because it's special. Simeone, how's your relationship with him? Well, I always send messages to him.

22:20He's like a father to me and I ask a lot of things to him. And how he deals with some things in the dressing rooms. Because a lot of things I learned from him and I behaved the same way. The same way he transmits to the teams, to the players. And I try to talk like him sometimes because I learned from him. And as I said, he changed my life. So I have a really good relation. We talk much. And every time we stop here, we have vacation. I got a flight, I go to Madrid. Wow. And you see him. Wow. Yeah, yeah. It's really special. It's really special for me. It's like a father to me. And Mourinho, obviously.

23:02I know you came to, obviously, one season, right, at the club. You've just said it there. What do you think happened that it didn't work out the way you actually wanted it? And what was your relationship with Mourinho when you told him, OK, I'm leaving, you know, that's it, I need to go back to Atletico? Well, it's amazing because, amazing story, because Mourinho, he called me a lot of times there when I was in Atletico and he said, come here, come to Chelsea, we're going to be champion. For sure, it's going to come Fabregas and also Didier and also Diego Costa. and knew we think Ashley Cole was leaving that time, so we need a left back, so it's going to be you, okay?

23:51So I decided to go there. I had an opportunity to go with Bayern Munich, but I decided to go to Chelsea. Oh, wow, Bayern Munich. At that time, yeah. Oh, wow. And I chose to go to Chelsea because, also because of him. And then the first games of the preseason, I was playing really bad. Oh, man, I feel I didn't adapt so well. and the first league game I was already on the bench to Aspie and I went to talk to him I said look why you brought me here because first game of the season yeah wow you brought me here to stay on the bench because otherwise you're going to stay in Atletico and he was really honest to me he said look you're not playing well you're playing sorry you're playing shit that's how we speak yeah Aspi is playing way better than you.

24:47He's defending better than you. He's attacking, he supports Hazard, Eden. Defending really well, so you have to be better than him to play. I say, yeah, you're true. It's true. You're right. I have to work. And I worked really hard that season. I also, I was with you on the bench a lot of times, right? You killed me. No, no, no. because we played a lot of games because it's a lot of games. But the team was playing amazing. I think the second time he came back, I didn't play much. No, definitely I didn't play much. You're right. Yeah. And yeah, when he came back, because he told me the same with you, like, oh, come on, you're going to play.

25:26But then he came, I was like, I was not playing as much. I was like, what's going on here? Yeah, I remember, yeah. We used to sit on the bench, me and you. Yeah, but then I was looking and it's totally true. The players who they were playing, they don't give chances to me. Aspi, best season ever. Oh, yeah, Aspi. Ivanovic, score seven goals. Terry Cahill, amazing. So I didn't have a chance to play. And we won the league. Yeah, we won the league. I play a lot of games. I play, I don't know, 15 games. Or, I don't know. And also the cup games. And I had a lot of opportunities to play. And I believe I became an important part from that group that won the Premier League.

26:14Because not just 11 players win it. They need the team, the whole team. And we helped a lot, especially Didier also didn't play. He didn't play much as well. Also, Peter Sech didn't play. He didn't play and then we helped from the bench. you know and Oscar Ramirez we were there helping the team and we won the Premier League which is really difficult to win it right you can see how many players play a lot of times in the Premier League and never won it we won it and also we won the Cup the Cup League and but then in the end of the season I felt that Simeone was calling me to come back and I told him look I I think I need to come back and he said if if you want it I just need a replacement, you know.

27:01And Marina decided to sell me back to Atletico, which I was really happy because I went back home and I played again. But I'm really grateful for how I live in Chelsea. A couple of more questions and I'll let you go. Simeone, do you think he will ever win the Champions League with Atletico? He's been there. He's the godfather. Yeah, he is. In Atletico. Do you think? I think he's just going to walk away when he's tired. But you think he will win the Champions League with Atletico? Well, one thing I can say to you is his dream. And you can feel that he never, never loses passion. He is so passionate.

27:42The way he goes to the training, he speaks and speaks to the players. He really wants to win it. So I believe that it's going to happen someday. The team is amazing right now. They made a lot of huge signings and the team, the squad is really strong. And I hope he can do it because I think Atletico deserve it. Champions League was really cruel to us. We lost two against Real Madrid, one in the last minute, one in the penalty. So I think Champions League is going to give some chance back. And I hope with Simeone because he is the godfather, right? He is the godfather. Yeah, he deserves it.

28:25He spent over a billion at Arsenal. Five, six years now, something like that. Do you think, I know this is the time everybody is talking about Arsenal winning the league. Even Arsenal fans as well, they're tired of coming second. Do you think this is the season? Because now he has the best squad in England for sure. Also maybe in Europe. Do you think this is the season? And if you think this, if he doesn't win it this season, do you think it's time for him to say, you know what, I've tried my best, it's time for me to go? It's really difficult to say because managers, we don't control their results.

29:06We control a lot of things. Special Arsenal now brought Andrea Berta, the sport director. Yeah, okay. And I work with him. He's amazing. He's really good. He knows about players and signs really good players. And they give everything Arteta needs. So I think they believe in him and he needs to be consistent, have luck, a little bit luckier with the injuries. Because if you lose in the most important time of the season, you lose three, four players, you are done. So he needs that kind of luck. And I think it's the year they're going to have more chances. But as I said, it's not easy to compete against City.

29:55if you see Manchester City bank bench bench yeah and also bank account and also bank account both yeah it's so difficult to compete with them and but I think everybody wants to win and ambition is important amazing I'll just quick fire question this what is your most favorite stadium to play in well I think the one You play there, but it doesn't exist anymore. It's Vicente Carderón, remember? Yeah, yeah. Atlético Madrid Stadium. Yeah. And now it doesn't exist. They built a new stadium. Oh, wow. But that's my favorite stadium to play. It was amazing to play there. Oh, good, good. Free kick or penalty?

30:43I know you like the kick. Oof, I miss a lot of penalties. Yeah, no, no, no. Free kicks is no pressure. I don't like penalties. Manager that got the best out of you as a player? Yeah. I think Simeone. Yeah? Yeah, I think so. Greatest player you played with? I play, I can choose two, right? I play against Messi for sure, number one. By far, by far. Not even close. And with, which I play with, Eden Hazard. and Neymar in the national team. Amazing. But Hazard in that season? Should I be Mikael now? No, no, no. It was nice. Nice in training.

31:38We made a lot of good games as well, right? We did, yeah. We play. We never shoot long balls. We always try to build from the back. Tiki-taka, yeah, yeah. I know, you know. But you also think Hazard. Yeah, I was like, yeah, yeah. That season? Yeah, yeah. He was playing like with kids. Yeah, exactly. It was so easy for him. So good, so good. One word to describe these managers. Pep Guardiola. Well, Pep Guardiola is, he changed football. So I'm a huge fan. I think he's the number one ever. Jose Mourinho. Well, that one is a, He's a champion. Born to be a champion. Diego Simeone. Well, that guy changed my life.