#114: Michael Smoak: The Harsh Truth About Love Men Fear To Admit

27:06We want to know at the end of the day, she is making the conscious decision to be our woman. And then when we feel safe in that framework, we would love to be seen, heard, and understood. That's more in the feminine energy realm. Women, first, it flips. They first want to feel seen, heard, and understood to feel safe. And then they're happy to feel desired, admired, and chosen. But the wounded masculine, a guy who's not really anchored in sense of self, it flips for him. He first wants to be seen, heard, understood. So he just becomes kind of that whiny guy, that guy who just wants to be emotional and talk all the time because he's never felt seen, heard, and understood.

27:42And then the women, it would flip to the masculine, leading forward with masculine, she wants to first be desired, admired, chosen. So it flips for both. So the goal is, if you want to make a man open up to you. I hear this all the time. Like my man's never vulnerable with me or I don't feel like you ever open up. Make him feel desired, admired, and chosen for guys who's like, I feel like she doesn't soften around me. She doesn't bring me peace. That's your fault. You need to make her feel seen, heard, and understood for her to give you that softness and that peace that you're so seeking that you literally cannot have without a woman in your life.

28:14Like I think if we never got married, dare I say we'd be headed down a path of destruction. Like at some point, I know I will need a woman, a particular type of woman to put up with my shit and the lifestyle that I live, to be that softness, to be that peace, that quietness when the world out here is so loud. But it's my job to show up so anchored in my sense of self that she can be that for me. So ultimately the responsibility, sorry guys, falls back on us every time. I wonder why it goes down the path of being reversed. What the, what the reason is like when you're explaining that side of men and having it flipped and they want to feel seen and heard and understood, maybe that's fueled by ego.

28:59And so like, I'm going to overextend myself so I can be seen. So when, so you can remind me of who I am. Correct. And that's ego driven. Correct. We spoke about it on the last pod around confidence and ego. And so, but if it's flipped, it's respected meaning that i know who i am and i'm okay if you don't however in order to be respected you need to understand who i am and respect that and so it's not like you're not flexible and flimsy of who you are anchored you're anchored in you your character who you are you know who you are you know you're trying to achieve you know what you want and for someone to plug into that, they kind of need to respect that.

29:46Yeah. Because I'm not changing. You have to fit. Whereas, whereas if it's ego driven, you're going to blend on whatever they say you are because you want to feel seen and understood. So they tell you this and you can manufacture a look so that they can say what you want to say. And then you get praise for the thing that you're showing up in, which is not really you, but it's so that you can feel seen. And yeah, I mean, that's an interesting frame in itself. I wonder, I wonder, I wonder what really stems, like what, what it stems down to, why, why men, maybe it's like instant, they can manufacture that.

30:24They don't actually need to do the work to understand who they are. I wonder why men go down this route of, of having that flipped and having it the wrong way around. Well, depending on what you believe, I believe a lot of this stems from wounds, trauma, childhood. It makes sense. We have things that we were given or weren't given in our early developmental years that shape how we see ourselves and the world around us. So maybe a guy, a young boy who grew up in a household where he never felt safe to have hard conversations with his parents, or he was the quiet kid and wanted to be unproblematic because he grew up in a chaotic household.

30:59He never had the space held for him with his parents to understand that he can be emotionally vulnerable. And I want to also clarify for people, specifically the guys, it's important to move in and out of being masculine and feminine. Like femininity is creative. It's playful. It's soft. There's a time to be those things. And it can be hard when people view femininity, guys, as weakness. That's not what that means. To submit to God is a feminine act. And that's why so many men struggle. The act of submission, energetically speaking, is a feminine act. And so it can be very difficult. So when the masculine is wounded, it flips feminine.

31:36And when the feminine is wounded, it flips masculine because they don't feel safe presenting themselves as they truly are. They need to mask and appear differently because that's what gave them safety in their prior environments in life. So someone who's hypervigilant and spends a lot of time alone in their adult life or bounces around from unserious relationship to unserious relationship, it can never get to true intimacy, like we talked about, to be vulnerable, the risk of vulnerability and giving someone that to hold is probably someone who grew up in an environment where they didn't feel safe to be vulnerable, to be committed to airing out how they really feel.

32:15They don't know what that feels unsafe to them. And then therein you have the principle of avoidant attachment style. That's an avoidant person. Anxiously attached people do the opposite. They overexpress, like you just said, they feel the need to prove themselves and perform for love because maybe the childhood that they grew up in was rooted in performance. They were an elite athlete and if they didn't perform well, their dad didn't speak to them or their dad scolded them. So like a lot of what they felt the love they got or received was based on their performance and that's how they show up in the world, albeit subconsciously, for many, many years.

32:49I was guilty of that. Not that that's what my parents did. I had other experiences that shaped that for me, but my parents were very loving, incredible people. But that is ultimately what most of it shapes down to. However, it's very important to hit a point where you say, okay, then it's your responsibility to change it. Because a lot of times the Freudian psychological approach that I'm discussing can be an excuse for people to stay in victim mentality. Oh, this thing happened to me, so I just am this way. No, no, no, no, no, no. What happened to you was not your fault. Whatever made you the way that you are is not your fault.

33:25However, changing it is unfortunately or fortunately your responsibility, or you can stay stuck in the pattern that keeps you miserable forever. And that's where the work comes in. Yeah. Let's touch on the submission piece. You mentioned it's a feminine act to submit to God, and that makes it challenging for men. do you think submitting to God is harder for men than women? I mean, it'd be painting a broad stroke. It'd be a generalization. And I will say generally, yes. So apply the 80-20 rule to what I say. 80 % true, 20 % not. There's exceptions to the rule. Of course. So generally I can say men who grew up wounded masculine, men who grew up thinking masculinity meant never showing vulnerability, never shedding a tear because tears are weakness.

34:12crying is weak, expressing love or softness is weak. To them, being masculine, driving, being stoic, leading, decision-making, building, there's a time to be in that energy, building a business, being on a podcast. There's a time to be in that state for men and women to be in a masculine energy state, but you can't stay in it. It becomes stale. You just starve yourself energetically. So yes, I would say generally speaking, it can be really hard for guys who maybe grew up with dads who had this idea of masculinity that if you cry, you're weak, you're soft. If you show emotion, you're soft, you're weak, whatever it is.

34:49It can be hard to think about submitting to a male figure and being in that state of softness because we perceive God as a male masculine figure. He, him in the Bible is how we refer to God. It can be really difficult. It was difficult for me at one point. I worked with a guy who told me, you have so much desire to control your life that you can't possibly fathom the idea of submitting to God's will for your life. And it's creating a lot of suffering for you. Do you think that with all of that said, that makes sense why it's hard to submit to God when you're winning? Because, you know, obviously, I mean, you know better than me, but in the Bible, like Jesus comes for the week or when people are suffering at their lowest times, it's easy to be vulnerable when you're at the lowest because like, what else do I have to fucking lose, man?

35:44I'm in the dumps here. Like I need it. But when you're winning and you're up, you're really leaning into that masculine. So it's very hard to even fathom and comprehend submission. Yeah. It's easy to not give God any of the thanks when you're winning and give yourself all of the credit. And it's easy to say, God, pull me out of this when you're suffering and life is going down the shitter. It's very easy to do that. I'm guilty of that sometimes. I try to thank you, thank and glorify God and everything positive. And right now there's so much good happening in my life. I got to remember like, this is part of an opportunity to talk about God, glorify God.

36:18He's given me this platform for a reason. It could be taken away through my own decisions, my own poor free will, or if I'm no longer deemed worthy to hold the responsibility of being a leader to millions of people. Why is there power in your lens of submitting to God even though you're winning and you're up? Because I believe, being a Christian, I believe that God's will for our lives is better than anything we could possibly have planned for ourselves. And it will ultimately make us feel the most fulfilled. It will ultimately make us feel the most whole, the most able to be anchored in masculine, biblical masculine energy is if we understand that whatever God wants us to do, whatever his will for our life is, is far better than we could ever think of for ourselves.

37:01You know, if I didn't follow what I thought God's will for my life was, I'd still be in corporate America because I thought that's what I was supposed to do. But there was literally suffering going on inside of my soul not doing this full-time. It was miserable. Felt like I was cheating on a partner. I was half in content and coaching, half in corporate. And I think God pulled me here to give me this platform because it's part of his will for my life. And suddenly I'm way more whole. I'm way more fulfilled But it was never something I saw for myself Never something I even considered So I'm living in an example of When I feel like I'm on alignment to what he wants for me I feel more aligned internally And so I'm speaking from my experience and what the Bible says What do you think gets in the way of people taking the leap?

37:46Like why are people Why are people knowing that they should be doing something different But then they don't leap? I'm so glad you asked this question because I was sitting in the shower this morning, just like thinking about what we were gonna talk about. And I became randomly very convicted about this topic because there's a piece of scripture in the Bible that pertains to this. So the question you just asked me, why do you think there's a gap in what people do? Or if they think they should know, they know they should do something different or better and they don't, why don't they do it? We can talk about that, but I'm one, if there's Christians listening to this that are in that situation, if something is biblically in there and it really stabs me in the chest, I feel like I have to dive into it.

38:29James 4, 17 says, James chapter four, verse 17 says, if a man knows the good he ought to do and doesn't do it, it is sin for him. So you are literally sinning when you are not doing the thing that you know you are supposed to do. So many people have a gift that they could share with the world in the form of content. We were talking to that 18 year old in the gym. We were just saying, dude, if you feel called to do it, you gotta lean into that. You never know what's gonna come out of it. So many people have these things on their heart that they don't act on and it can literally, this might not be convicting for everyone who's not a believer, but it is literally a sin.

39:05It is missing the mark on God's will for your life to not do that thing. You are depriving the world of something they need from you by not doing this, by you not doing a podcast. If you would have bailed on the pocket and never done this, you would be sinning, you would be disservicing so many people who have gotten an impact from your message. If you would have stayed in the food service industry or whatever bartending job that you were doing back in the day and just said, this is safer. This is more comfortable. And so getting into the nature of the question of why don't people do that? Made a video about this last night.

39:39I believe a lot of it, if not all of it, has to do even less with the fear of failure and more the fear of being perceived. The fear of being perceived is something that really gets to people because to show up unapologetically authentic to who you are is to be judged, is to be characterized as wrong or hated by some. Because if you show up as who God designed you to be in your purest essence, some people simply aren't gonna like what that essence looks like. And to some people, it's gonna hold up a mirror to them as to what they're not doing. And they're gonna know that and they're gonna hate you for it.

40:15and that's tough dude there's an unlock here there's an unlock here so the act of inaction and not doing it is selfish correct correct yes that's the thing you're being so selfish you're being so short-sighted so selfish with your actions you working for someone else doing something that you hate, starving your soul is a fucking selfish act. Yep. Because you're starving everyone from the wisdom that you can give when you're living with the soul-led version of yourself. You are shutting down the opportunity to touch people and move people in a way that sometimes they need to be moved. And you have the gift to be able to do that.

41:03And you're shutting it down. like you're take take your lens away from your selfish ass for a second it's it's you it's not it's not what people think of you that that shit doesn't matter like you you're you're you're stripping away your ability to help others so by you people pleasing in hopes of pleasing other people you're actually pleasing far less people you're doing the opposite you're literally doing the opposite. I have started saying, I'm so glad you said this, dude. Fuck yeah, dude. That's great. That's it. That's it. Selfish people. That's literally it. I have started telling people when they tell me they want to create content and they don't, I very, I stone face look at them and I say, how dare you?

41:47And I don't laugh and they laugh. They think I'm joking. I say, no, how dare you? You selfish bastard. You have a gift that you're sitting on. You don't know what it is yet because you haven't started creating. You can't identify it. Someone needs what you have and you're just depriving them. You could change somebody's life. You're supposed to change somebody's life and you're not doing it. How dare you? You selfish asshole. And when you start, most people are so scared to do this because they're looking at it through a selfish lens. Like you just said, what about me? What if I fail? What if I look like an idiot?

42:19What about everybody else? What if you become the biggest content creator in the world? What about the millions of people that are going to hear your message that you're going to empower, that you're now withholding that message from? How dare you? It's disgusting behavior. And a lot of the lack of action and urgency and anxiety and negative self-talk is all rooted in selfish desire, all of it. And if you can stop saying, what do I want for myself? Or what, excuse me, what do I want from the world? What do I want from the world? What do I wanna get? What do I want money? Do I want power? What do I want from the world?

42:53Instead say, what do I want for the world? And take yourself completely out of the equation. you can make those decisions more swiftly something my friend nick told me before one of our presentations we gave at these in-person events i do that he used in an exercise with a relationship that he was in and out of and he kept thinking what do i want from her what do i want from her and instead he just started saying what do i want for her and that list was a lot longer and it became a lot easier to do so people can just start saying what do i want for the world what i want for people like me, then maybe they can make decisions independent of that selfish frame.

43:31Yeah. And it doesn't need to be, we can remove the idea of just content for a second and just actually talk about making impact. Some of the most powerful people in the world don't post content every day. Like Mr. Moran. Yes. That's a powerful guy. Yeah. It's far greater than just filming some videos and posting stuff. But it's got to be fueled by impact. Like... People seem to hate on Jeff Bezos or hate on Elon Musk, but every single day you are using things that they've created for you. What are you doing? Think about your life without their creation. Literally undeniable impact. Impact. Impact has to be at the forefront.

44:15And you know what? Impact is the new drug. Impact feels greater than any money that I've ever made. any material thing I've ever bought, any muscle that's on my body, impact feels greater than everything. So if you know that and you've experienced it, like someone that we're blessed to be able to have experienced that, you know that that's the most important fucking thing. It's the most important thing. Like make impact, your life will get better. People talk about this all the time. They say, uh, like if you, if you're feeling shit, you need to give more. Like, are you having a bad day? Go buy someone's fuel or gas.

44:59Like if you haven't, if, if you, if you've, if you've got a hundred dollars, spend 10 on someone. The feeling you get from giving is, is the most euphoric feeling and seeing someone smile on their face or, or, or seeing that you can actually make an impact on someone's life is far greater than most of the self-centered stuff that we do on a day-to-day. It's the greatest thing. And when you can experience that and tie yourself to that, you get this pretty profound unlock in your life. You do. It's the metric for impact. And you said impact is the new drug. I love that terminology. Someone is immediately going to say, but how do I make impact?

45:41Your impact is directly correlated to your ability to serve others. That's it. You just, you just summed it up perfectly. The ultimate source of fulfillment is service. It doesn't always have to be in the form of content. It's an easy platform for many to do that, but it can be buying groceries for people. Go out and feed a family for Thanksgiving. Tony Robbins talked about how he started off feeding one family and then doubled it. So next year it was two, the following year it was four. And now I think Tony Robbins literally feeds millions of families Thanksgiving dinner every year through his donations, every single year.

46:13It's incredible. but you can do that on a relative scale to your income, your capacity, and your potential. So Arthur Brooks, I think, says if you want to have the ultimate path to fulfillment, do something for your physical health every day, so exercise every day, call a loved one, do something random for a stranger, and pray. If you did those four things every day, you probably wouldn't be nearly as anxious or depressed, but in there is that ability to serve a stranger. That is one of the best feelings ever. It is literally unbeatable. It doesn't have to be done on a camera. It can be for, I just had a memory pop into my mind about this, but it can be for a stranger at the checkout line.

46:55It doesn't matter where it is. Your ability to impact others is literally all around you. Yeah. We spoke four months ago now. It wasn't that long ago, I think. I think it was like four or five months ago. Totally different conversation, by the way, which just makes me really excited. Which I love. And I think when we look at this, and if you listen to the start of that podcast, we were talking about the set and I was a bit in my head about it and you're like, oh, it's going to turn out great. And comparatively to this, it's like nothing. And so it's really cool to see the progression. But what's changed in your life?

47:27Anything in the last four months?

47:33Oh, man. I mean, a lot's happened. if I'm being really honest and I want I want this to land properly I've been receiving a lot of opportunity to do really cool things and I'm so grateful but it's felt really overwhelming a lot more opportunity of doing cool things, meeting really special people, really incredible people that I've listened to not idolized but really taken a lot from and now have the opportunity to view them as a peer or in a level playing field. I've been presented with opportunities like that, trips, opportunities through partnerships, going places, not paying for anything. I've had so much incredible opportunity and it's unlocked a new piece of me that is, I didn't know was there, which is I'm really uncomfortable receiving because I feel like I have to give directly to receive.

48:29And I think this is something a lot of people struggle with. My nervous system feels a bit unsafe in a state of giving. Like even when you bought coffee the other day, like there's a little part of me that's like, I can do it, let me do it. I'm so used to the transaction of love and not just like doing something because you love people or because you just wanna do it. And it's something I'm working through. Like with my coach, we talk about it and understanding like I've been giving for so many years through content, through free value, just through doing my best. And I think now if I'm being paid back in a way, It sounds strange, but I'm actually having a hard time with it.

49:06Like it makes me uncomfortable when someone just wants to do something nice for me. And that's my problem. That's my problem that I'm working on. And I know it's a blessing and I'm not trying to sound arrogant or ungrateful. Like I am so grateful for some of the things I get to do and I'm getting to do in the very near future. But it's been a challenge. Like the business and the following and the pages leveling up is bringing this new energy and opportunity with it. And it's uncomfortable as shit, honestly. And I feel like I have to do more to earn it rather than just be grateful and be in a state of receiving it.

49:41And in that, I have sort of identified, this is something I opened up recently about on a podcast. I've identified that in that state of giving, for so long, I've become quite burnout and quite low energy. And I think it's beginning to manifest into my physical health pretty badly in terms of low energy levels, low vitality, poor digestion, poor gut health. I just kind of feel shit frequently. And I think it's because I've been burning the candle at both ends, if you will. And I feel like God's pulling me into a state of like true rest with him and with my business and to relax and just be grateful for the gifts I'm receiving.

50:19And I'm starting to cut off things that I said yes to because it's an opportunity to give and let my body rest and recalibrate. So while I'm super excited for all the cool things I'm getting to do and being offered as a result of this gift that I've been given to build this platform on social media, I also am diving into some health struggles that I'm dealing with lately that have been a bit of a pain in my side, if you will. So what are the action steps to get out of that? What are some of the things that you're doing to improve and get out of that low energy state? Yeah, I'm glad you asked because when I mentioned that I was dealing with some of these symptoms a lot of people said can you please keep us posted because I'm dealing with this too.

50:59So pragmatically on the physical side, I do think there is a physical component to this and I think there is an energetic and spiritual component to this. I do. It's my personal belief. on the physical side. I'm meeting with a doctor, a functional medicine doctor. He's actually up here in the Alpharetta area. I'm going to try to meet with him after the pod. And we're going to talk about a protocol to get my gut health in check because I really am experiencing extreme lethargy after meals. I'm very tired. I get very bloated, very uncomfortable. And that's not normal. I don't think it's normal to eat and then immediately feel like shit.

51:34No matter what I eat, whole foods, shit food, doesn't matter. So I'm gonna meet with him, talk about that, talk about a protocol. Potentially, I'm not advising anybody to do this. I haven't done this. I'm gonna need to do far more research. He recommended the possibility of me getting on peptides, BPC-157 specifically, for my gut health, not for performance or anything, but injecting locally into around the abdomen. He said I would notice some pretty steep, drastic, quick improvements in my gut health. So considering that and working with this functional medicine doc on a nutritional protocol, to feel better.

52:09I've cut way down and will probably just cut out on drinking alcohol. I preach about how you can do that and have balance, but it is a poison and I don't think it aids in the whole gut health issue. So that's the physical side, to hopefully not feel so sore and run down and not have such poor recovery all the time per my whoop and how I literally feel. on the spiritual side the mental side i have overextended myself a bit in the terms of saying yes to too many things that i don't think serve me and some of these i'm going back on and saying no to and it's uncomfortable because it's what does that mean about me i'm a guy who doesn't follow through all my programming kicks in to be a nice guy and a people pleaser but i need to cut off some opportunities some obligations some opportunities that have started to feel like obligations if I want to show up as who I need to be in the new year and in the future for my career.

53:01And I think a lot of people are guilty of this. We say yes to things we don't really want to do because we just think it's the right thing to do. And there's a season that every person should be in when they're building. You know, Jesse Itzler talks about how when he was in his 20s, he said yes to everything. Well, we have sort of an accelerated opportunity with growing a platform and notoriety in our network through social media that he didn't have back then. And so now we have a little bit more of a luxury to be selective. And so I'm being a bit more selective. Like I can't go get coffee with 10 people a week for an hour so they can pick my brain because I want to, I truly want to, but that's actually a huge energetic suck for me because there's a lot of people in my life who just want to pick my brain and take something from me, but not necessarily give me anything in return.

53:45That's not to say that I'm looking for transactional friendships. It's saying that my spirit is tired. I'm energetically exhausted and stuff like this fires me up because there's this reciprocal energy in what we're doing here. And so I'm being much more selective about what I do. And then just spending more time with God and just taking my faith more seriously again, because I felt really on fire for life and for the Lord when I was doing that. And I fell away. And that's where we can really seek true rest. So that's what I'm doing, to answer your question. Yeah, the physical realm and then the spiritual realm and mental realm, It's important to acknowledge all the boxes, right?

54:23Because we think about our physical pains and go straight away to our physical body. What can we do to fix the physical body? Yeah, that's good. That's so spot on. So we have a sore hamstring. So we go, okay, what are some hamstring exercises to get it better? Not realizing that maybe you've got all this tension, your nervous system's fried, and then maybe your calf is sore and you need to calm down the late night caffeine consumption and maybe stretch out your calf and roll on your foot for a little bit and your hamstring will get better but we seem to like isolate the thing that's painful right there and go okay how do we fix that thing when in reality it's it's it's much more broad than that there's so much more to it.

55:11Um, like I had really sore upper back and traps, especially when we're running and you've experienced stuff like that as well. And I couldn't run more than five kilometers without it being like excruciating pain. And I was training or getting ready to do an ultra marathon that was 38 miles, like 60 kilometers. And, uh, and, uh, yeah. And, and I couldn't even run five. and then when I get to the cabin out in the woods with Hunter and I was telling him like dude I've not even been able to run the last few few weeks I've not run more than 10 kilometers um in the last like couple of months and I was like he's like oh what's sore oh my like my upper back and my my like shoulders and traps all like seize up and get really really painful and he's like dude you're just redlining.

56:03Like you're carrying this load on your life and your physical body's representing that and reminding you of that by having sore shoulders. And put me on these like spike mats and I just like excessively use these spike mats, which help like reset the nervous system. And I'm lying down on it and I'm standing on it. It's painful, but like everywhere but my shoulders and I just did it for like five days straight all the time and then I went out and ran 60 kilometers and didn't feel my shoulders once at all and it was just this reminder of maybe we should actually look a bit beyond where the pain is in our life like if we're if we're waking up and we have a headache is it actually because we are dehydrated or is it because our waking hours drain us and we're not looking forward to our day.

56:56And maybe that's why we have a headache. Todd Anderson was talking about on the podcast, I was recording with him a couple of weeks ago around, you don't have a sleep problem. Your mind's a storm. And so you actually can't get to sleep. You don't have like a problem with your breathing. You're actually just on your phone before bed and it's waking you up. And then when you wonder why you can't get into a deep sleep, it's because your mind hasn't switched off. And when I asked him what the most important thing was for sleep, he said the sleep mask, because it creates a routine that when you put it on, it's time for bed.

57:33And it's just this powerful frame that I think we can apply to everything in our life. When something's not right, maybe we look beyond the actual thing and remove it from isolation and actually apply every area of your life to that problem and see where you can connect the dots. Yeah, I love that. So many people are just plagued by the grievances of their mind and their heart, and it actually shows up in their physical body. There's a book called The Body Keeps the Score. I can't remember if we talked about it last time, but it happened for me too. I had so much lower back pain all throughout high rocks prep in the spring or the winter in the spring of, is it April 25 I did high rocks?

58:11Yeah, I think. And low back would just go totally numb when I would do the skier specifically. And it wasn't until doing a deep breathwork session and really processing some unresolved emotion and stress that I had built up that I was literally just carrying in my lower back. Energy can neither be created nor destroyed, only transferred. And so when you endure energy in the form of emotional stimulus and you don't process that emotion and move through it and release it, it will literally manifest in your body. And there's a theory that this is the root of much sickness, that trauma, wounds can actually turn into tumors and cancer and autoimmune diseases.

58:47I mean, we have proof. I have a friend who literally stressed himself into ulcerative colitis, and he will have it for the rest of his life because he was so stressed about his academic and athletic performance all the time that he created an autoimmune disease in his gut that will plague him possibly for the rest of his life. This is very real shit. a lot of people's physical ailments are manifestations of what is going on in their spirit and in their mind. And if they don't process that shit, it is going to show up in their body, in their relationships, in their lives, and they're going to be miserable and they're not going to know why.

59:22Yeah. It's so crazy. And I think suppression plays a big role into this. There was a, there was a quote that you got from a friend. You said suppression of expression leads to depression. Where do you think suppression plays in this conversation and suppressing your emotions and everything that you're dealing with, kind of just kicking the can down the road? Yeah. Suppression of expression leads to depression. That's a quote I got from my friend Gabriel Pinto. It was one of those things I heard and it shifted my entire paradigm. The things that we suppress will lead to us being depressed. And for a lot of people, that's unprocessed emotion.

59:56And so earlier we discussed the concept of masculine and feminine and how submission to God is a feminine act. Well, going all the way into emotions, really feeling and being guided for a period of time, albeit by emotions, is a feminine energy act. Women are much more emotional beings than us, and it's beautiful. That's why we need them to counteract our logical, analytical decision-making. That's why their discernment is so strong, because they're so much more emotionally attuned than us on average. In order to dip into that state of feeling, unprocessed emotions, trauma, events that you blocked out, whatever it is, at any varying level of depth or severity, it must be required of you to dip into a feminine state.

1:00:40And that can be really difficult for guys. And if you don't do it, it will manifest. So someone who has, I don't know, let's say a deep history or a deep wound or series of traumas around their mom, and they're a guy. Mom wasn't in the picture. Mom was emotionally unavailable. Mom was abusive. It's very possible that if they don't process that, fully feel the emotion, that it's gonna show up subconsciously in how they treat women or how they show up as a partner towards women because subconsciously they actually have hatred towards women, which is not accurate. It's not fair. It's one person that did one thing to you.

1:01:14But in order to understand what happened to us and the emotion it creates, we need not suppress it. We need to go all the way into it. So if you feel anger about a thing or guilt about a thing or sadness, what we don't need to do is try to manage that emotion or label the emotion and say, why I shouldn't feel guilty about that thing? I just did the best. No, feel guilty about it. Feel guilty about it independent of what your programming and your mind is trying to protect you from. Well, I shouldn't feel sad about that breakup because they weren't right for me anyway. No, no, no. Feel sad about it.

1:01:48Go fully into the sadness. Cry, weep, scream, curse, put on Marvin's Room by Drake, whatever you need to do to get there. because only on the other side of the fully expressed emotion can you have clarity. You have to process it. It's energy. And if you don't process it, it is going to just metastasize to your soul and your spirit, and it's going to affect you forever. And it's difficult to do. It's really uncomfortable for a man, for a lot of people, men and women, but for a man who associates strength with stoicism and never letting emotions come to the forefront, it can feel scary. And our brain, we live in this safe society, our brain is always trying to keep us alive.

1:02:29And now we live in a place where we're relatively safe, where it's pouring rain outside all around us. We're in a safe, climate-controlled room. So our brain's still going to try to identify threats everywhere. And for a lot of people, our brain will perceive our emotions in their full expression as a threat. Someone who endures a severe trauma, it can feel unsafe to go back and relive that memory to its fullest. But for some people, what they need to go is go all the way into that emotional experience so that they can process it and be free from it. But it's hard. And for me, it's about having a space where you can go.

1:03:03And for most people, for me, that's the relationship I have with God. And then I have a coach that I work with that helps me sink into that space because it's very hard for me to pull myself out of the mental programming that tells me it's wrong to feel a certain way. And when I say, I'm angry at this person for something they did, but I know they were just doing, he will go, no. My coach will go, no, no, no. Fuck them. Be angry. Go all the way in. That doesn't mean that I stay angry. It means that I felt and became aware and noticed the full spectrum of the emotion. And typically on the other side of emotion comes revelation.

1:03:38And then I learn about myself. Yeah. The real strength is the polarity between how low you can go and how high you can go. Yes. So the bounce back, if you can get down to the depths of low, it means you can feel the deepest of the lows, which means you know what it feels like. And there's nothing unknown, untold, suppressed. You've been there, but your ability to bounce back as a man is really important because or else you're just going to be a soppy mess. And you know what that'll do? Your woman's not going to feel safe. And so it loops back into that whole thing, right? The strength in someone and representing vulnerability, it's only represented in a form of strength if you can bounce back quick enough as well.

1:04:26It's like, don't suppress the shit, but also don't dwell in it and pull up a chair and sit in this dark tunnel. Correct. Feel it. Just dust it off and keep moving forward. Yeah. It's just a bucket that needs to be emptied. The bucket of shame, guilt, regret, sadness, those negative emotions, they're not really negative. They're just buckets that need to be emptied out every once in a while. And what you just said there, your ability, you can feel the highs because you can feel the lows. That's correct. I believe your potential to go as high as you possibly can is also dictated by your ability to go as low as you possibly can.

1:05:06because if you don't, like you just said so beautifully, it's going to kind of leak out of you during the highs as a guy. Like you'll just be, would you say a soppy mess? Like you'll just randomly have weird fits where you're in a bad mood and you don't know why, or you cry and you don't know why, but it just like a little bit, you like wipe the tear off, you keep going. It'll leak out of you energetically if you don't empty the bucket. Like I like to view life force and energy and what happens and flow to us in life like a hose. What runs through us like a garden hose and the water running through the garden hose is the energy of life.

1:05:38And if you don't tend to the hose, it's going to get holes in it and the water is going to leak out on the way down and through you, up and through you. If you don't tend to the garden hose, it's going to spring leaks and eventually it's going to burst and you're going to be a wreck. Yeah. This is an interesting take. If you think about the closest connections that you have in your life, think about the people that you are closest with. What's the common denominator in all of them? You've experienced extreme lows and extreme highs. Think about it. All of the people in our life that we're closest with, we have not just experienced high times with, we've experienced real low times.

1:06:24The quality of the connection comes down to the depth of experience that we've had, the low and the high. Because if you've only experienced highs, you're not going to feel the connection that you have when you've made it out of a low together. And so the quality of everything really comes down to the polarity of what you're comparing it to as well. I can sit with my best friend, Sam, by a lake and a fire and look back at life with so much more joy because when our bank accounts were merged and we were sharing a studio apartment that smelled like salmon because the kitchen didn't have a vent and it was right next to our bed, that was a mattress on the floor because the bed got moldy and it was a studio apartment underneath someone's garage and we were in a lockdown in COVID where we weren't even allowed to leave the place, I'm comparing the high with that low and it makes the high so much more special.

1:07:25We've bonded in a low and we've made it out of the low. And by virtue of that, when we reach a high, it's way more powerful. So the polarity between the two is what makes it special. And so suppressing the low things that you're feeling is actually stripping away your possibility to strengthen the connection that you have with the person you're suppressing it from. The shared low makes the shared high greater. Absolutely. Absolutely. And I like this idea because yes, we suppress the emotions ourself, but we also hide shit from people that we care about in worry of what the outcome could be. And it's actually short-sighted and will not get you anywhere.

1:08:15And realizing that it comes with great trust. You need to have trust to be able to do that. And you have confidence in yourself that no matter the outcome of what you're about to do, you're going to be okay. But I think when we can obtain that and feel that and have the courage to like dip into those lows, it's just going to make everything else in our life far greater. Yeah, I agree. And I also want to be clear, we're not telling anybody to go and bear their heart to everybody that they come in contact with or become friends with. There's a trust that needs to be built prior to those things happening without a doubt, but just like I love the I love the phrase a joy shared is a joy doubled and a burden shared is a burden halved when you can have someone else in your life to do that and I think a lot of times we feel like a burden when we share our burdens or the things that burden us and the truth is all if all we want if the ultimate source of fulfillment like we said earlier is serving people then people coming to us with their grievances feeling like they can the sense of importance and belonging that that gives us.

1:09:24Say, oh, you view me as someone that can hold space for you on a topic like this? I'm honored. And use your discernment on who you do that with. But you're actually depriving people from their purpose and their ability to serve others and their source of fulfillment when you say, I just don't want to trouble anybody with my problems. It's like, well, you're not meant to carry them alone. That's why we're tribal creatures. That's why we exist in communities. That's why we have family and friends and romantic partners. That's the whole point is to share our wins and our suffering together. It's critical to human life and human purpose.

1:09:54And yet we're so selfish, it goes back to that selfish frame. What about me? What am I going to do when we don't do that? What about framing it in this way? Nothing's actually a problem. Maybe when you share the problem, you realize it's actually not a problem. You've made up all the stuff in your head and perceived it to be a problem when really it's actually not. And the only thing dictating you changing the narrative on it is you getting it out of your head and saying it to somebody. Yeah, because then you realize it, and it's not just a thought, it comes to life and comes to the surface. And then we can then choose, okay, is that something that is actually bad and bogging us down?

1:10:29Or is that literally just some mental frame and imaginary ceiling that's boxing us in to this negative frame that's controlling our life? I think the more risk that I take, the more I understand the lack of risk there actually is in my decision-making. What I mean by that is the more risk that I take in my life, in my business, in friendships, relationships, travel, you know, packing up all of my stuff to move across the country nomadic with no real plan, a risk to some people, the more I realize if I'm not gonna die and my immediate safety is not at risk, truly my physical safety and health, what am I afraid of?

1:11:09What is actually gonna happen to me that is so terrifying that I can't do the thing that I feel compelled or called or convicted to do. But I think it's a byproduct of taking more and more risk, of doing more and more things that people say is crazy or could fail or go wrong. You realize it never really does, at least not as bad as we think it does. You know, the ocean of fear is a mile wide and an inch deep, right? If we could actually embody that, we can understand that none of the things we fear in our mind are actually that bad in reality. A way to reinforce that as well is just look at all of the low times in your life.

1:11:45Just look. Look back at all of the toughest times. Now think about how positive they impacted you. Think about all of the good things that came from the bad thing. And for me personally, maybe it comes with agency. Maybe if you don't take any agency and ownership in your life, the bad thing actually remains a bad thing. But for me, if I look at all of the bad things, I mean, I don't even like labeling things as good as bad and bad. I think it just is. But if we look at all of the bad things and we look back, for the most part, they actually turned out quite good. Actually, it actually shaped me into someone that I'm proud of.

1:12:34So when that is the pattern, then you're presented with them and you can go through them easier. And so maybe if you don't feel that, you either haven't spent enough time, you haven't expanded the time horizon, the wound is too fresh, or you haven't taken agency and ownership of your life. Because maybe you've been hit with a bad thing, you've opted for victimhood, so then you've just kept reinforcing the bad thing and you've projected it on someone else saying it's their problem, their fault, and you're the victim of that. And you just keep getting stuck in it. So every time you look back at the bad things, they were bad things because you've never actually seek to understand the lesson from the bad thing, or you just haven't spent enough time and the wounds fresh, like bad shit happens.

1:13:23You've experienced some pretty gnarly shit happen this year. Right. And, um, and the reality is, is time does really heal a lot of the time with some things like that. And so maybe it's a combination of ownership, agency, and time. And if you zoom the time horizon out enough with the intent of agency and ownership, no problems are actually real problems. They actually ended up being blessings. When you say zoom the time horizon out, for someone who doesn't know what that means, what do you mean by that? I mean, you are being too short-sighted and maybe you haven't zoomed out what your life will look like from that thing happening.

1:14:05Yeah. So, like, a bad thing happens to me in January. I'm thinking about the effects that's going to have on February and March. But then I'm not thinking about what my life would look like in December or a year from now or five years from now or ten years from now. Sometimes the suffering in the short term actually results in quite a flourishing, amazing life in the long term. We just haven't zoomed out long enough. And so the way you can be reinforced of that belief and be reminded of that belief, if you look at a bad thing that happened in your life five years ago, and then you look at your life now, is your life better off now because of that bad thing happening?

1:14:48And a lot of the times it's a yes. So maybe if you're thinking it's a bad thing, you haven't zoomed out long enough. And so if you just zoom it out and you realize, oh, wow, that actually really shaped me. There is this, this, this, and this that I have in my life now that I would not have had if that bad thing didn't happen. Take my last heartbreak, for example, where my ex-girlfriend broke up with me. That sucked badly. I was like a mess. I was a soppy mess. like I'm sitting in my car. I have just lost this person that I thought was perfect. I had no career, no money, no vision, no mission, nothing.

1:15:40In that moment, I could perceive that as a bad thing. But now if we fast forward a few years, she's the very reason I started posting content. And she's the very reason that I seek to understand about relationships and what I did wrong within that thing. So now I can be more secure and show up better for other women in my life right now. I can be in a position now where I am a lot more of an attractive male. So I can have a bit more choice and invest my time in someone that I know is worthy of the person that I've become. and I feel worthy of obtaining that person that is valuable in my life, could be the mother to my children.

1:16:19And without that heartbreak, would have I had any of that? I don't know. And so I zoom out long enough and I realize that that thing that was so bad is actually so great. And you flip this negative bias to actually appreciation and you go, I am so grateful for the bad time. And so if that's your pattern, every single low time that you look at is the most life-changing. Then you get put in it another low time and your default switches from being, this is horrible to this is great. And that's the most liberating feeling. If you can get presented with a challenge and straight away, you can say, we will look back and laugh at this moment.

1:17:02So why not I just laugh now? It's the most freeing thing. You feel unstoppable. You literally feel unstoppable. You feel like nothing can stop you. And it's the most empowering feeling ever. I love that. I love that. We're going to look back on this and laugh. So why don't we just laugh now? That's amazing. You can. It's literally a choice. It's a choice. Easier said than done. Sure. But you literally can. I have a piece of, I guess you could call it attempt to reprogramming myself that I Say habitually when I endure something difficult or i'm in a difficult situation In my mind or out loud i'll say what a gift What a gift what a gift that person dumped you what a gift What are you going to do with that gift person said something about you?

1:17:50You don't like what you know is a little bit true. What a gift you just identified an opportunity to improve Those things are a gift and everything you're saying the bad bad, perceived bad, can actually be turned into a good long-term. Do you remember that piece of scripture I told you about the last time we did the podcast, James 1, 2, 4? Count it all joy when you face trials of many kinds. Joy, the opposite of hard. Literally find joy in your suffering or struggle because most of the time, maybe all of the time, there can be good that comes out of it. Like almost every time I took the worst thing that ever happened to me and have helped create one of the best things that has ever happened to me in the death of my dad and helping people get through those times, serving others, the ultimate source of fulfillment.

1:18:37So I took the worst thing that ever happened to me so far, God willing, this is bad as it gets. If not, I'll count it all joy. And I'm using it for the good of others, for the glorification of God and to help people. So most of the time we can take the worst thing that ever happened to us, and deliver people from the same thing. That's something I wish I knew his name. I want to credit him. He said, I'll never forget this video because this is the big question people struggle with. He said, if you struggle to find your purpose, watch this video and you'll never struggle with it again. He said, our purpose on this life or on this earth is to take the worst thing that God delivered us from and turn around and help people be delivered from the same thing.

1:19:20Worst thing I ever encountered, death of a best friend, grief, deep, deep pain. And now I can talk about how I managed it, how I got through it to help people do the same. That's purpose. That's impact. And that's what everybody's chasing every time. Do you know one word that sums that up perfectly? You become useful. Yeah. You become useful because now you've gone from A to B and you You can help people go from A to B. You become useful because you've overcome something that is actually not unique. Millions of people all around the world are going through the same thing, and you've just overcome that thing that people are struggling with right now.

1:20:02You become useful. The most common thing in suicide notes, I feel useless and worthless. By going through the hard time and making out the other side, you obtain the one thing that people lack when they kill themselves. A sense of belonging. Yeah. A sense of meaning and usefulness in this earth. People don't feel like they have a place. And as stoic as it gets, right? It's like the obstacle is the way. You don't have meaning. Go through more shit. You'll probably find some meaning. It's cliche because it works. It's cliche because it works. I guess the theme of this conversation that I keep coming back to and what we keep talking about through different scenarios is the key to the life that we want is selflessness, independent of a font.

1:21:00And I mean, stop looking for the thing to be useful within and just start being useful. Start helping people. If you have the gift of financial abundance, give it away. like give it away give your money away be philanthropic that's how you serve you have the gift of emotional openness or softness you know i've i've had a joke i say i feel like sometimes i have trauma dump on me written on my forehead because people just feel like they can open up to me that's a gift i love that i love that i can feel useful through that and people like i need the thing to find purpose within no you don't it's everywhere just stop fucking looking so hard You'll find it.

1:21:43You know why people feel like they can dump their traumas on you, though? Please tell me. Because you're you. And there's authenticity. Through authenticity, people gain trust. Because you're not trying to please anyone else. So if you think about how people feel like they know you, so that's why they can share. so through long form conversations like this you have a podcast massive people listen to you at length and if you are unique and authentic and you're showing up in the version of yourself and people get exposed to that enough times they'll feel like they know you if you're not authentic and people see that they'll probably do questioning like my favorite DM I ever get is, Chris, I love all your stuff, but I didn't like this.

1:22:42And the reason I love that text and that message is because it reminds me that I'm staying true to myself. I can't be the same as you. Every single belief that I have is not going to be the same as you. No one listening to this is going to believe everything that I say. Somebody's for sure already triggered by something you've said. Hell yeah. And for that, I say good because they're still listening this long into a podcast because it means that they like a lot of what I say. I'm not trying to please you with everything that I say. If anything, something doesn't please you, that's a good sign that I'm on the right path.

1:23:19I'm showing up as me. I'm not trying to be someone else. I'm not trying to please someone else. I'm sharing what's on my mind and I'm sharing what I feel, what my soul's called to share. and with that you're not going to please everyone with everything that you say but what they will know for certain is that you are being you and authenticity is the greatest superpower and by you feeling like you have trauma dump on your forehead that's a representation that people feel like they know you and the way that you do that is by being authentic yeah i appreciate you saying that oliver imberton said you're not pissing anybody off you're probably not doing anything very important.

1:24:00And if you aren't pissing anybody off, if you're seeking the agreement of all, I will say you will never do anything important. You cannot build something, be something, or create something of impact and meaning and align with everybody on the face of the earth. I love what you just said about people disagreeing with you being a benchmark for progress in the right direction. I firmly agree. I get DMs around videos where, hey, I love your stuff, but I don't like what you're saying here. That's perfect. I love that you said that. I haven't, honestly, that's a great reframe for me because I struggle sometimes with that.

1:24:36The key though there is I love what you post. Yeah. Because you can be a dickhead on the internet and post the most ridiculous stuff in search of views and validation. Yeah. Oh, I thought you were saying I could be a dickhead on the internet. I was like, yeah, for sure. No, there's dickheads on the internet. Yeah. Bad intent, not being themselves, creating a facade, a character. and I don't think that serves anyone. And I think a good bullshit reader is if you agree with everything that someone says or you disagree with everything that someone says, something's up. Disagree with everything that they said, people are just trying to trigger people.

1:25:13Agree with everything that someone says, they are not sharing everything that's on their mind. They're lying. They are blatantly lying to your face. It's a good bullshit reader. talk to me about coming into this season of the year it's the first holiday season without your dad how you feeling going into that and spending time with family and being in the festive season i appreciate you asking that man it's i can sense a heaviness getting closer but i'm open to it not being there. You know, one of the most powerful lessons I've learned recently with everything that I've been through in the last 24 months, really, I've been through a lot, not just my dad, but I've been through a lot.

1:26:00That's been emotionally taxing and part of why I think my spirit is so tired and my heart just like needs to heal from certain things is not having a preconceived notion about how I'm going to feel about a thing and being open to feeling totally different and not letting my programming creep in of, well, this is sad, so I should be sad. Maybe it's not sad. Maybe I'm elated to be able to show up for my mom this holiday season because I know she's struggling already. Maybe I'm excited to be a cornerstone for the family. You know, my dad was such a pillar of the holidays, right? Thanksgiving, he handled the turkey.

1:26:36That's my job this year. And that's funny or whatever, but like, I'll think of him when I'm doing it. You know, last year he was, he was so weak, but he was sitting in the kitchen on the stool talking me through what I was doing to the bird to make sure I didn't screw it up. And he said, you know, we had that moment where he was like, you're going to need to remember this next year. And I knew what he meant. I knew what he meant by that. But is it possible that I'll have moments where I'm really missing him? Yeah. I mean, I can feel a little bit of emotion coming up just talking about it because this was also the time when he really started to turn.

1:27:10I mean he was I think we were talking like he died January 19th so this was the last 60 days of his life this is when he got really really ill and I've seen some I use Snapchat only for memories I store my videos there so I know I can come back to it because if I take a photo of something I might not be reminded that I did so but I solely keep that app so that I can open it and it'll say one year ago today this is where I was and I'll do it with random stuff like even I'll talk to myself and say here's what you're thinking right now I'll remember this in a year. And there's been some videos that I've seen of my dad, just like remembering how frail he was, like seeing videos of him, how small, I mean, his, his leg was literally the size of my arm.

1:27:52And that's a grown man. And it was really jarring. I had forgotten a little bit. And so, yeah, I'm, I'm open to the idea that I'm going to experience some sadness and heaviness and I will not try to manage it. I will not try to suppress it. I need to go off and give myself some space to cry or be sad. That's what I'm going to do. because after I do that, I'll be able to show up better for the family. I'll be able to be a positive light and not try to hide or mask anything. So it's complicated. It's complex. I'm open to some feelings of loneliness, but I'm also open to some feelings of excitement and a new chapter.

1:28:21In 45 days, I'm packing up my entire life and going nomadic with no real plan of what's next. And I'm excited because it's the opposite of everything I've ever known or done. And I think it's going to really stretch my capacity for my nervous system's ability to find okayness and peace and solace. Just something I feel like I've been missing on a little bit lately, to be honest with you. And so I think it's gonna be a lot, but it could be a lot of good. It could be a lot of sad. It could be a lot of both. I'm open. And I want people who are going into holiday seasons right now with the same experience, because this is a tough time of year for a lot of people.

1:29:00Families are split up maybe through divorce. Parents are gone. Siblings are gone, passed away in other states or countries. don't give yourself the assumption, the negative assumption that it's going to be hard. Just say, I'm open to whatever comes up. I'm open to the opportunity that this could be a really fantastic holiday, even though it's the first one without my pops. And you might surprise yourself at what comes up. What do you think are some of the expectations you've onboarded now that he's not here? What do you feel like you need to do to show up to your family? you know man I think the most powerful thing I can do to show up for my family is not feel like I need to be anything or do anything it's not my weight to carry I'm not supposed to hold some burden for the entire family I think I need to relieve myself of that responsibility because it's the noble thing to do no it's not it's not my job he never asked me to do that he actually encouraged the opposite he got sick he was like go out and live your life go what you do what you need to do you can't be here for a while okay go you're on a different path from everybody else it's okay he would want me to do what I feel inspired to do and my mom does too she's been open about that and I love her for it so I think the best way I can show up is by telling myself actually the opposite I have no expectations to be anything to my family other than just be there and be present and be whatever I need to be because the biggest disservice I can do to myself and anybody around me is show up inauthentically.

1:30:33One of the questions we got in the podcast poll this morning was, do you feel pressured to show up a certain way because you guys are in the spotlight per se? And I think if we pressure ourselves to always be on, always be in the brand, like always be promoting the higher up wellness stuff that I talk about and never actually be myself, or you always be the host of the pocket and not just be Chris, a guy who's going through some shit sometimes that's actually a disservice to people around us because it it puts us in this like inhuman unrelatable category and that I struggle with that sometimes feeling like oh I gotta be on I got if people meet me I gotta be chipper and like super grateful and stoked to meet them but what if I'm having a really shit day and just say thanks I can't talk I gotta go I'm out rather than just faking it so to answer your question I'm challenging myself to show up how I feel authentically inspired to show up and if that's a bundle of joy and positivity fuck yeah so be it and if that's a little bit lower so I can eventually go higher in that energy I'll do that too even if it feels uncomfortable yeah they say the comparison is the thief of all joy but maybe expectations the thief of all joy as well because Because when your expectations are met, when your expectations aren't met, the gap between that's disappointment.

1:31:54Like you expect up here and you don't quite hit it, like you're disappointed. So expecting how you're going to feel, expecting how people are going to treat you, expecting how you feel like you need to be in order to please other people is only going to result in less happiness. because you're going to feel this extra pressure. If we talk about athletes for a second, the best athletes are the ones that can tap into the flow state and the way they can tap into the flow state is being present with who they are right now. Knowing their competency, knowing that, hey, I've shot a thousand free throws in the last week.

1:32:39I think I can do this one now. So knowing that all of the experience that we've had has equipped us with the skill sets that we have right now that we've worked so hard to obtain the way we access that is by being ourself and by being present and by having no expectation because when we have that expectation we have this pressure we can't be in a flow state because we're not even here the best impact we can make is when we are ourself and removing expectation from that and this need to do something will allow us to be able to show up in our best self and then a byproduct of that is everyone else in our life and the people around us start to flourish and get the best version of us, which is going to make them better as well.

1:33:30That's huge. When you show up authentically, no matter what it looks like and no matter how uncomfortable it feels because you're anchored in truth and self, everybody around you levels up as well. When I had Peter Crone on my show, his whole thing what he coaches people through is breaking free from suffering what you just discussed the gap between expectation and authenticity is that gap you said disappointment i could also call it suffering because the absence of happiness would say some would say is suffering and peter says where you are versus where you think you should be that delta between that is suffering when in reality stepping into being where you are and radically accepting it is breaking free from all suffering.

1:34:11People think, well, I'm sad, but I should be happy. So I'm suffering. What if you should just be sad and shut up about it? Because the only way to actually be happy and not fake it is to go all the way into the sadness. But you think, oh, I should be grateful because I have all these things happening around me that are so wonderful. And that means I shouldn't be upset about this thing going on over here that's objectively challenging my mind and my heart. No, no, that's not how this works. That is why you are miserable is because you're not giving yourself permission to feel the other end of the spectrum because you think you're not owed that degree of negative emotion, if you will.

1:34:45And that's really hard to do. Like what we're saying, all of this conversation we're having, in a way for me, it's to remind myself that I need to do those things because I'm still a human. I still slip into those areas of not being grateful when I should be or just allowing myself to be ungrateful for a moment. Oh, excuse me. So that I can be fully in the state of gratitude and acceptance. So the delta between where you are and where you think you should be is for many people suffering. I think it's powerful. It's very powerful. We don't like this idea of suffering, but we actually put ourselves in suffering all fucking day.

1:35:28By not liking the idea of suffering. By not liking the idea of suffering. It's so paradoxical. We're so stupid. We're such simple little creatures. We're so funny. Like, we actually are self-inflicting the suffering by pushing off all of the things. Like, no, we can't feel the pain. By saying that, we're going to feel more pain. Maybe it's subconscious. Maybe you're like pushing it away so it'll just come up somewhere else. I don't know. Yeah. But I think there's something in that. Just talk to me. You're going into this season, the holiday season. There will be some challenges naturally with your dad not being there this year.

1:36:16As a friend, how can I help show up for you? And how do you, I know you're going to say there's no way you can do this, but if you actually think about what you would love to receive from friends during periods like this, what would it be? Thanks for asking that. It's kind.

1:36:36uh, just check in, say what's up. You know, I've been, I've been working on with my friends when I feel like just even a tinge of an inspiration to reach out. I do. Even if it seems like inconvenient at the time, I called my, my best friend, Will on the ride to CVS. I really only had 15. I went to go get cough drops for anyone listening. Cause of my, my cough here before the show. And I had like 15 minutes of downtime and I just called him to check in. Cause he had a big thing happen yesterday for him. And I just wanted to talk and we ended up having a really cool conversation about some of the scripture that I've referenced in this conversation.

1:37:08It was super helpful to this podcast to have that talk with him, but it seemed like I could have very easily said I don't have time to catch up on the phone, but I did it. And so I would just say that the best way you could help me is just if you feel like a tangible, I wonder what Mike's up to, just like shoot me a text, say hello. I would appreciate it because it means you acted on that inclination and do that for anybody else that you feel inspired to do it for as well. because I think those get placed on our heart for a reason. I randomly called a friend I hadn't spoken to in probably three months on the phone.

1:37:40True story, like four days ago, right before you got into town. And we talked for an hour and he just rambled on and rambled on and we laughed and we caught up. It was a very lighthearted conversation. He texted me after the fact that he had just had one of the heaviest conversations he'd ever had in his life with his mom and had just gotten done crying with her and they're going through this big familial struggle and I had no idea about it. And he said, whatever you had on your heart to call me, it was for a reason and I really appreciate it. So just act on that inclination if you get it. It's very cool.

1:38:12Let's read a few questions from the audience to close this out. Let's answer some cool questions that people have asked us and then we'll call it a day. Cool. Do you, and if so, how often do you get imposter syndrome? I used to often, I still do sometimes. That's the short answer. I've found for me and my experience, I don't want to speak for other people, imposter syndrome to be deeply rooted in what I believe to be true about myself and not what was happening around me or to me or for me. It had everything to do with the narrative and story that I told myself, which earlier I alluded to that podcast I did with Peter Krohn.

1:38:55And he coached me through this, actually. this programming, this narrative. And then I had a breakthrough about it with my coach in a session and it allowed me to fully understand the reason imposter syndrome kicks in is because someone at some point in my life, in some facet of my life told me I wasn't good enough. And for me, it was rooted in sports. A lot of my identity was rooted in my athletic ability as a young guy, 14, 15, 16, it was like key developmental years. And when I was cut from a baseball team and just straight up told by the very blunt coach, you're just not good enough to play with us.

1:39:33I let that, I let that crack a piece of my identity. And then we never talked about it. I actually had a conversation with my mom about it, not that long ago. And she said, I remember knowing that that absolutely crushed you because you were just a young kid. I was 14, young. And she apologized. She said, we never talked about it. We just pretended that we should all go on and we never addressed it with you. And she was right. They played a role in me allowing that to form the identity. Not that it's their fault. They just did the best they could. They didn't know if I wanted to talk about it.

1:40:05And I didn't do a good job communicating it because I didn't know how. And I realized that through little instances like that in my life, I had developed this very quiet subconscious filter of I'm just not good enough for that. And that's where my imposter syndrome stemmed from. And so I think that's actually the case for a lot of people. You don't feel you're worthy of receiving it because of a story that you believe about yourself. Why did you emphasize I let that in terms of that terminology? When I was talking to Peter, he said, he first said, did they do that? Or did they just make noises with their throat and mouth and you believed it?

1:40:42and I said I think it's the second one I think that they just said a thing and I let it be true because like Peter so wonderfully says words can only hurt you to the degree that you believe they are true and if you don't believe they are true they cannot hurt you and so I believed what this coach said well he said I'm not good enough so I must must not be good enough to play anywhere what if I just didn't have what that guy needed for the team it's like what if it's not that fucking deep? What if it's not? And it comes back to victim mentality versus personal responsibility. That's the nature of why I say I let that be true.

1:41:18We let people's opinions of us, this also is under the assumption that we're operating in truth, in authenticity, in moral and ethical alignment. We're not being an asshole to everybody we meet. We let people's opinions of us, sometimes rooted in their own projections of themselves, albeit dictate and define a story in some cases for our entire lives, for every decision we make. That was the big breakthrough I had that drove me to tears, honestly, was that I had made so many decisions in my life, almost every big decision through that filter. And I wasn't even realizing it. And it was part of why I was so risk averse until I got into this career field.

1:41:56And I started breaking through that programming with my risk tolerance and increasing my capacity to make these. And I use air quotes when I say risk, because I don't really believe in risk in many aspects, especially in this, in this world we're in. So that's why I say, I let that be true. It doesn't mean it was. What about you? Someone said to me once, and it hit me, if you're not experiencing imposter syndrome every 18 months, you're not taking enough risk. That's good. If you're not feeling like an imposter, you are not growing. The only way you feel like an imposter is because you're doing something that's not comfortable and that you're not competent at doing.

1:42:37That whole thing around stacking evidence that you are who you say you are. You don't really feel like an imposter when you're confident with what you're doing. So if you're not feeling imposter syndrome, it means you're not growing because you haven't stepped into a new level that is making you feel like an imposter.

1:42:58I think it's an important reminder because if we are feeling like an imposter, it's a sign that we're on the right track because we're stepping outside our comfort zone.

1:43:10Think about all of the things that are the most fulfilling in our life, all of the things that bring us the most joy. They are something that's new, that we've conquered. They're not the thing that we've done every single day for the past eight years. that doesn't fulfill us. What fulfills us is having something on our heart and our soul, acting on it, even though it was uncomfortable and making it out the other side. And maybe a couple of steps in that process is imposter syndrome and feeling like an imposter. And for that, I say good. And the only way to overcome the imposter syndrome is by doing the thing.

1:43:49Because when you speak in front of a thousand people, the first time you might feel like a little bit of an imposter then you do it time and time and time again the less of an imposter you feel because it becomes comfortable so is imposter syndrome a bad thing or is that just a sign that you're growing yeah of course i feel imposter syndrome dude the first time i built this one of these sets by myself do you think the dialogue was that positive what the fuck am i doing? Why am I here? This is shit. This is stupid. Now I'm like, okay, this is the norm. Was there imposter syndrome on the way? Hell yeah.

1:44:38Is that the whole point? Hell yeah. It's like a benchmark for you that you're headed in the right direction. I really like that. Yeah. I don't think the imposter syndrome is supposed to go away. That'll lead to less fulfillment because there's no progress. That's good. As Americans would say progress. Nope. I like progress better. I think I'm going to adopt that one and really throw people for a loop. Yeah. Let's go to the next question. So this question, I want you to answer this first. I gave everything in a relationship and it didn't work out. How do I cope with that? You cope with that. But how, Chris?

1:45:19Please, please hold my hand. Enlighten me. tell me what to do.

1:45:25The first question I'd be asking, did I give everything? Because it is a bit of a victim response. I gave it everything and it still didn't work. I gave her everything and she still treated me like shit. Well, maybe you're just a dick, did like respectfully because if you gave her everything that she needed do you think she would have left you

1:45:57why would she if everything was truly covered yeah and maybe you gave everything that you wanted to give but maybe that wasn't everything that she needed I'm assuming it's a dude it's a dude that's a good guess yeah um I think there's an important note here of realizing that you may have given everything that you thought that she needed, but the reality is if it ended, it wasn't everything that she needed.

1:46:32Coping with it? Cope with it. Good. Like, we said it earlier. that time can make or break you and the best part about it is it is up to you

1:46:52we love these moments because they sharpen us they teach us more about what we like what we don't like who we are and who we're not the person that we need to become to attract the person that wants to stay we without that we won't grow because in our head we've done everything when no you haven't thank you you haven't done everything yeah and if you did she wouldn't have left you and you can apply that to your whole life because we can be short-sighted with it did you do everything? Are you jacked? Like, do you look after your body? When you feel like being a pig and eating like shit for a whole week straight, did you do it or did you say no?

1:47:59Because that would be everything. Because if you got to the end of the week and you said no to bad vices, you respected the people around you, you worked on yourself, you did things that you know were better for yourself, but more importantly, the people around you. Do you think that then, that point on, you can say that you've done everything? And my guess would be that if you truly did everything, you're respectful, you were calm, you've been through enough pain so that the storms don't really phase you enough. You know, you're fit and healthy. You looked in the mirror, you're proud of who looked back.

1:48:38You showed up in the best way possible in service of others. My guess would be that if you did everything and you were that person, if they left you or not, you would be okay. Yeah. Because you know that you have actually given it your all. There's no doubt. There's no like, what if it's all on the table. i would say that there is an imaginary ceiling that comes with saying you gave it your all because i really doubt you gave it your all i don't think i give it my all every time i think we're human and so it's quite limiting to even think that um but feel the grief and use that as fuel to slingshot you forward not just drown in in the sorrow agreed i think the only thing i'd add to that and it might challenge your take a bit but that is i would generally agree with you, but I think where I would challenge it is, yes, it's rare that people actually give it their all because if all was covered, all was fulfilled and met, then there would be no reason for the person's absence.

1:49:41However, there is the facet of this that we meet people at different points in their life and we can only meet people as deeply as they've met themselves. So the question you could ask yourself is maybe this guy did give this person everything and she couldn't hold it. There's that capacity. Maybe there was things she hadn't worked through, things that were brought up in her. Relationships are one of the most powerful mirrors for where we lack in ourselves. And that's all it really comes down to, the unloved self, as to why relationships don't flourish. And so I would say your answer is far more likely of what happened.

1:50:20There is a world where you can give everything per se and the person on the other end of that cannot hold it because they haven't done the work necessary to be the kind of person who can hold that space for another human being. So that is a likely scenario. And if that is the case, again, it's a reason to not be a victim and say, great, I gave all of that to the wrong person. What's it gonna be like when someone can reciprocate and hold it in return? It's gonna be a beautiful, beautiful exchange. And then on top of that, is this the first time it's happened or has it happened multiple times oh now we're going to the least common denominator

1:51:03you could have given it your all is this the first time someone's broken you when you've given it your all or is it the second or is it the third or have you been ghosted five times in the past couple of months even though you gave it your all they might need work sure we all do but really

1:51:29I think it always the puck always lands on you yeah it always does like yeah you might have given it your all but if they haven't done the work to be able to receive it and hold it maybe you were giving them the wrong thing that their body couldn't hold and it's because they didn't want that

1:51:52and i don't know man i just the thing i like about this extreme ownership piece is is you actually can never lose like when you own everything you actually can never never lose it's never actually bad because every single experience we can grow from every single person we can grow from and i like this idea of never taking the power out of my hands. Like, oh, she wasn't, she was damaged and like, could not look after me. It's like, maybe. I think you just changed my mind. Perhaps. I think you just changed my mind. Actually. I'd like to redact my answer from the record, your honor. I think it all, I think it all does come back to us.

1:52:40I'll give you an example. My ex, that's what I said. The poor girl was suffering and she was she's the most amazing person ever she was suffering like she couldn't wake up and sit in her thoughts without crying of course she couldn't look after me yeah yeah if I left it at that would I really grow because I did say that a lot but it wasn't until I went okay but how actually was I like was I was I confident you know like was I was I really what she needed because because maybe if I was would she be able to wake up with a bit more peace and have trust that you know everything actually is going to be okay or maybe I was so fragile that when she woke up next to me it didn't matter if I was there or not I actually didn't compliment her morning.

1:53:43You know, maybe me waiting for her to wake up and cuddle with her in bed, even when she was upset, did more negative than getting up when I woke up two hours earlier, going to the gym, coming back with some coffees, enlightened, and I've just showed up for myself. And then when I hop into bed or give her a little kiss on the forehead and say, good morning, babe, and hand her a coffee, she's like, oh, wow, like, he actually, he's the man that I want. And maybe because I gave her everything, I actually didn't give her what she needed, which was safety and security.

1:54:27And if I left it at she was broken and the girl was battling, I never would have had that profound realization and be able to show up in that way with every other woman that I meet in my life.

1:54:43yes i have nothing to add to that next question i don't know should we close it there or what i feel i feel pretty inspired to close it here let's do it yeah i uh i appreciate you dude i think there's something that that lights up in me when i'm spending time with you and talking with you. And I really, I really hope that people can take away from this and apply that into their own life. Me too, man. I love you far more as a friend than a podcast host, but you're a hell of a podcast host too. And I'm honored to know you. And I think we're going to do this as many times as we possibly can. Yeah.

1:55:23I'm looking forward to the next one, bro. I love you, brother. Appreciate you, man. Leave us a five star review on Spotify if you've made it to the end, please. It really helps the show grow. I don't ask enough for that, but I think it helps us keep getting awesome people like Michael back on the show. Mike, brother, I appreciate you doing your wisdom, and you've impacted a lot of people today, and I'm grateful for you. Likewise, brother. I love you too, man. See you next time. See you later. Bye-bye. Yeah, that was great. Boom!