#153: Sarah Perl: Manifested Millions With One Belief Shift

29:41And I think that's why so many people struggle with it, especially people who come from hardship, because our immediate reaction is control. Control feels safe, right? Control, masculinity, like operating from a place of masculine energy feels safe because it's in your hands. But it's also very limited. It's very limited what you can accomplish purely through your own hard work. And I think that's what people don't understand until they, you know, try manifestation because I like genuinely so much of what I have in my life was right time and place, luck. It was a lot of this, a lot of something outside of hard work right i think that's something it's you know same with feminine energy it's like feminine energy is receiving being receptive trusting surrendering and if you can't do that then like there's so much on the other side you're missing out on yeah i think one of the cool unlocks here is is the is the idea that the the feminine energy of the surrender and of the deep trust and kind of just like removing yourself from the steering wheel for a second and just going like, no, like there is a great plan going on here.

30:59And I feel so convicted and I know so strongly that it's going to happen. And if it doesn't happen, something greater will. Every time. If that's the knowing, then you can show up with discernment and tap into that masculine energy of like doing in a more clear way. I feel like maybe, and that's even another hard thing for people wanting to surrender to universe or God or something as a man as well, because we do have more masculine energy. It's a very feminine thing to do. Yeah. And so we kind of put it off and we just want to go, no, I want to control. Like I want to like take control of all of this.

31:43but then there's like this freeing nature of of letting go of that um and i think that's been interesting for you i'm fascinated to know like going through the childhood of more so scarce having to rewire your brain to to really start attracting it you want in your life what did those initial steps look like like how do you how did you get to that point where you went okay i'm going to start breaking out of this and yeah what was the kind of the turning points for me i think i was just i started off like extremely in the victim mindset of the world is happening to me everything's out to get me everything you know is going wrong um i hated money i hated the concept of money i felt like i had no positive association with money the only emotion i felt an emotion in manifestation is often tied to the frequency by which we attract, right?

32:42The emotion I just felt constantly was fear, pain, you know, anger, resentment. And I continued to attract more of that. Like I just, things were not getting better and I kept blaming the world. And when I went to college, I was like, this was the first time in my life I was around wealthy people, which I'd never been really around before. And I was like, they think so differently. And I don't know that I can like think that way from a place of like actual tangible evidence in my life. But what if I delude myself into thinking like that? I'm like, what would happen? Right. And so for, you know, a bit of time, I was almost like role playing.

33:28I had this like alter ego where I was like, Like, I'm going to play this alter ego. I'm going to think like a rich person and I'm going to see what happens. And I'm also just going to think I'm the luckiest person alive. I'm so abundant. Money is everywhere. Money is constantly finding me. It loves me. I just like, I literally was completely delusional. Like any person would be like, this bitch is crazy. and it was immediate like the minute I started to tell myself you know the every penny I spend returns to me tenfold I get paid to exist money is finding me everywhere it was immediate and it didn't come from directions that I ever would have expected which is what I mean by you have to surrender and you have to be willing to let go of the how because when I started manifesting this TikTok didn't exist at the time the app that literally made everything possible to me didn't even exist.

34:17So if I was so focused on how, I probably would have taken some other direction. I probably would have done something else. I probably would have ended up at the same destination, but who knows how much longer and how much less abundant, right? And so when I let go of the how and I was just like, universe, be my sugar daddy. Like show me how abundant this world is and show it to me fast. And I'm just going to be like, you know, play hot girl energy, like just like feminine energy like universe give it to me and when I let go it was like immediately like TikTok came out as an app I felt again intuition divine intelligence I felt this intuitive calling to post on TikTok as like a joke first video I posted went viral within a week I was already getting you know people asking me for coaching and and all that and it was just immediate it was immediate.

35:04And so, you know, brand deals and TikTok creator. And I was just like, oh, my God, overnight, my whole life changed because I wasn't not only did I reprogram my brain, but I let every path of infinite possibility, every possibility exists in the future. The rich version of you, the poor version of you, the billionaire version of you, you know, not the billionaire version of you. Every version of you exists in the future. And a certain step or a certain set of actions will lead you to that version of yourself, are you willing to decide that reality and then let the universe show you the way there?

35:40That's all it takes, right? And so when I let go of that how, it's like it was immediate for me. And I just like, it's been one thing after the next of just, and now I have too much evidence to deny it. I also was never really spiritual, to be honest. I was not woo but I was so, you know, honestly I was so desperate that I was like I'll try anything. I was like let's do this little manifesting, you know and it just worked and then I was like I can't deny it. Like it's just, it's here. It works. It's so cool. I have a little bit of an unlock from what you've been sharing because you said that the catalyst was you got into an environment of people that were more wealthy than you.

36:29Yes. And you went, what's going on here? And so if we actually unpack it, this is really interesting for me anyway. I like to just dive deep when I have little discoveries. So earlier I said that the subconscious is ruled by your identity. Now, your identity is made up from the stories that you tell yourself about your life. The stories that you tell yourself about your life dictate the actions that you take in your life. And then the actions that you take dictate your environment and the life you live, the things you have, all of this, right? Now, in order to reprogram that and become aware that something's wrong, oftentimes we need to break free from that environment into a new environment that has a different life.

37:15Here are some of the five people that you hang around. 100%. You break into a new environment. It then exposes you to maybe the problems that you've had in your old environment. So then what you do is you then assess the actions that you're taking that are different to the one that they have. And then those actions then make you question the stories you're telling yourself about your life. then your life and the actions that you're taking and the stories that you're telling yourself about your life is then reprogramming your identity and then you fully reprogram your subconscious mind and then basically because you do all of that all of it changes and then your environment changes then you meet those people where they're at and then you've got to kind of meet a new person that exposes you to another new identity and then you kind of go again because i think when you share this right and and if that makes no sense to people then please i'm weird but when when you share this i go okay like the thing you said was that i met new people in college and i went wow they think differently and then you went i'm gonna try and think like them but maybe it was subconscious or conscious maybe you didn't do that weird thing i just explained but really you kind of did get down to the bottom somehow and the way you would have accessed that but would be by asking yourself a series of whys, then you reprogrammed the bottom and then went, okay, how do they show up?

38:38What should I do? And then you just started doing all of that. And then TikTok came out and then you started posting the content that you tried this thing and then your whole life changed. And so I guess this part of me that's going in order to create a new life, we need to be exposed to what else is out there. And then through that, be self-aware and look within and then grow. And through that, we then meet that life where it's at by the actions that we're taking. Yes. Is that confusing? No. Okay, cool. I mean, but like, that really, yes. Because at its core, if you, like, all it takes is, first of all, I think it's insane when I look back how much of my life is simply due to the fact that I met someone who made me realize it's possible.

39:25Like if someone else has done it, you can do it too. And every milestone that I've hit in my businesses or what have you, it's always come as the result of like me meeting someone who has done it and me realizing it was possible. And so all you have to do to attract anything is believe and know it is yours. And so the question you should be asking yourself is, what can I do to know this is possible, to know this is inevitable? That's the only question you have to ask yourself. And then it becomes clear, like, I need to be around people who have done it. I need to surround myself, you know, with examples or what have you, right?

40:06Because when you're around people who have done it, it becomes like, it's just osmosis. Like, you're like, of course, this is going to happen for me too. And I mean, really what it comes down to is like, can you adopt the identity of who you want to become? Can you close the gap? Because that's all I did is I was like, okay, they have it and they have this identity that is so different than my current operating system. If I can just operate like them, what's going to change in my physical reality? And it's crazy. It is crazy. and it's really cool i think there's there's so many different leaps that you've had in your journey that at least i've seen from afar and i'm sure there's so many more that i haven't seen but i just kind of see these leaps where i go okay you you're in college you get exposed to new people try new things on this tiktok thing you start making all this money you then launch your coaching and then you start making even more and more and more money and then And, you know, then you launch the app and then it kind of goes beyond and beyond here.

41:08I guess like for you, was there any point in this journey where you went, oh, wow, this is getting really real. Like I've kind of reached a level I didn't really even know was possible. Yes. There were so many points where I felt like that. I would say for me, it's not that I ever thought like I never thought this was possible. because by the time I got there, it was so normal to me. And it has to feel normal to you for you to attract it. But when I look in hindsight, and I think from the version of me that started all this, I don't think she ever would have thought we'd end up here.

41:50I think the version of myself that exists right now is the most surprising. I genuinely am like, wow, this is very, very real because, you know, manifestation is kind of like a muscle. And in order to get to the next manifestation, you kind of have to get to this step first, right? Because you create enough belief and certainty here that you're like, okay, now I can do the next thing. And from the vantage point of where I'm at now, I really believe that anything is possible. Like anything, especially when it comes to business and it comes to, yeah mostly business to be honest like it's partially the people I'm around right but I think I just have this I this like unlock recently where I was like literally I actually can create anything and like everything is possible and also something I was going to say earlier is like do you even give yourself permission to desire the greatest things that exist on this earth like when you go touring apartments are you only touring apartments in your budget or are you like letting yourself even desire something better.

42:57And I think everything I have in life that is fantastic is like the result of me going a little above budget and being like, wait, what if I do want to desire the thing that feels slightly unattainable right now? Right? Like what happens if I let my mind go there? What happens? Like what could I conceptualize? Like every possibility exists. And so why am I limiting myself to only what I've experienced so far? Like truly every, there does exist a version of you where you're a billionaire. There exists a version of you where you have the hottest woman. Every version of you exists. Why are you not desiring it?

43:34What part of you feels unworthy? What part of you feels it is impossible? What is stopping you? And I think when I unlocked that, I was like, I actually can desire anything. And what happens when I do? Do I give myself permission to desire things that weren't promised to me in this life? Right. That was the big unlock for me. Yeah. I think this is really great. And especially like the outside of your budget thing, because even if we tie it into the burning of the boats thing, when you experience something that you desire so much more, it's very hard to go back. So you're kind of metaphorically burning the boats because you go, I'm not going to be satisfied with anything else.

44:20Yes. So then you go, oh, I need to figure out how to make this work. Yes. And then you need to do this. And if you don't, then it's like, oh, well, I can't really function well here. And desire is, or I always say excitement isn't random and desire is destiny. And so if you wanted it, you only want it because a future version of you already has it. And like I was saying earlier, like there is this, you know, something within us that exists that is activated so rarely in life where it's just like, I will do anything, but that doesn't have to come from a state of fight or flight. And I think so often in my life, that energy of like, I will give this everything or I will die trying has always come from a place of I have to in order to survive.

45:04And now in my life, it comes from a place of I have to because this is my destiny and I'm owed this and I want this. And that's such a different approach, but it's the same fuel. Right. And it's so powerful when you're like, this is happening and there's no other option. It's insane. I'm going to show you one concern that I feel when it comes to this ideology, because I resonate with it quite a lot. And I think a lot of high achievers actually do that have achieved a lot of stuff as well, because they have had enough points where they've been gifted faith and gifted confidence because of the experiences and the challenges that they've had.

45:49the the challenge and the and the problem i see that can be faced is that what you have right now is never enough and that you constantly have to climb a ladder and you get to the top of a mountain and it lasts seconds because you're already looking up another peak and going i need to get there and while the manifesting and the confidence and the faith will give you the belief that it's possible, I do really think it's important to understand the sacrifice that comes with the action that you're going to need to take. Because a big, big part of manifesting is the action, right? So just being aware of what sacrifice you need to take in order to make those actions and then determine if it's worth it to get to the top of another mountaintop and is the feeling you're going to get at the top of that or the fulfillment you're going to get at the top of that mountain, the thing that actually is going to solve all of your problems?

46:47Probably not. And I do think that there is a fundamental issue, and I don't want to say issue or problem. I don't really like that energy or language that comes with that. But I do see that there is a fascinating thing that people get stuck in where they're on a goose chase that actually never ends. They are constantly chasing the next thing and they're never happy where they are right now. And, you know, I do feel this quite strongly when it comes to money, because the more you obtain money, the less utility it has. Like once you start solving all of your problems and money doesn't really change your life anymore, the more you make, the less you're going to feel.

47:28So if your primary goal in manifesting and achieving this life is making more money, the more shekels you make, the less valuable they're going to feel per shekel. So then it's going to feel very hollow. If your pursuit and your value and your meaning comes from something that diminishes in value, the more you obtain, it's a very slippery pursuit. And I think there's a lot of pillars in life that we constantly chase things for the sake of chasing them, not realizing that maybe the prize isn't something that we actually want or will change our life. Do you see that there's some challenge or some difficulty with a high achieving mind and an abundant mind that makes you feel like you constantly need more just because you can and you're capable of it and you're deserving of it and all of the things?

48:18A hundred percent. You know, the most depressed I had ever felt, there were like two occasions. One of them was actually when I crossed like a massive milestone in my business. And it was like, I mean, for me growing up with nothing, I was like, this is a sign that I made it. And like, this is everything I've been working towards. And I accomplished it at such a young age. And I remember waking up and I was like, what is the meaning of life? Like, I've gotten here and like, what am I supposed to do? like this is what I've been chasing all this time and like it's here and I don't know what's next and I realized that you know the basically what we're always desiring and chasing and manifesting it isn't so much a physical thing as it is the feeling like we're chasing a feeling right and I wanted this feeling of security for so long and I had to realize like now that I have security I have to pursue something else.

49:13And so then it became purpose. Like that's the new mountain I'm going to climb. And it's like the myth of Sisyphus, you know, but I do believe as high achievers, it's like we do always have to grow or else we're dying. Like if there is no growth, then why am I here? And I think it's anti-human a little bit, in my opinion, to not create, you know, like why am I here? Someone else could be here creating. And if I'm not creating, you know, and it doesn't have to come from this place of like, I have to hustle and I have to have money. That's very ego driven. But to create something that like truly changes the world that impacts people to me is now the fuel that, you know, motivates everything.

49:56Like what was motivating me then is not what is motivating me now. And it doesn't even work anymore. Like I just I don't care. Like I wish there was once a time where this was the most motivating thing in the world was to make more money. And now I'm just turning things, you know, it's just not motivational enough. And so, you know, there's that piece. And I think, you know, on the flip side of it, I also think that I see this from the top, how this can become a problem, but I see from the bottom too, how this is something that people aren't ever given permission. Like I, I remember so clearly in my life, you know, I was looking in, this is such a dumb example, but I'd be in college and I'd see these kids wearing like Canada goose jackets.

50:37And I was like, wow, it's like a thousand dollar jacket. And I never I like hated them for it. And I hated the concept. But deeply, I think I desired it. I was wearing like this shitty coat. I was freezing in the Boston winter. I was like, why didn't I allow myself to want this? Because deep down, I didn't believe I could ever attain it. And so like I created this mental distance to not make myself sad. I was like, oh, you know, I can't have it. And, you know, you're creating all these excuses. And so I think from the bottom, like there's all these different, you know, stages of life when you're in a place where you don't want to be like, where are you denying yourself more?

51:17I didn't even think the like genuinely, I did not think the life I have today was physically possible in this lifetime to attain. I would have never woken up and been like, I want this and therefore I'm going to go after it. Right. And I think that's so sad because so often people are existing in a state of contentment, not knowing something better can exist. And they're deluding themselves and lying and believing this is all I can ever have. And so there is that one piece. And then there is also the piece of like, what is actually fueling you? You know, what is deeply fueling you and what is the feeling you actually want in this life?

51:56And yeah, I mean, that has changed a lot. So it's interesting. Yeah, I think maybe what it comes down to then is awareness of why and what you're doing. Because when you're starting out, use that fuel and build something, right? And then I think ultimately, right, like I like to look at billionaires and old people a lot. Yeah. I like to look at billionaires because they've achieved what a lot of us are chasing. It doesn't mean billionaire status, but they have 10 cars and a jet and all the things. Yeah. And then also old people because they want what we have, which is time. And so old people you learn a lot from, at least I learn a lot from, because they get to look back at their life and think about all the things they wish they did.

52:50And you also get to look at old people and see how they spend their days. because if you see old people how they spend their days they don't care about what other people are thinking they don't care about all of this stuff that we consume ourselves with they they're actually quite present and um and i i just find joy in that because you know they've exhausted a lot of the desires in both those parties because the billionaires have achieved everything and they realize it's not the thing that's going to make them happy or fulfilled or whatever it is and the old people have gotten to late in their life.

53:28And when I observe the two, there's actually another common denominator in the both of them. Have you ever had grandparents, you see what they do? They just give to their kids and their grandkids. They just serve. That's all they care about. And then you look at billionaires, you look at Tony Robbins, who's made all the money in the world, and now all he wants to do is just feed people and give. when you've exhausted all of the desires that society places on us of all of the external material things and you exhaust those desires the only thing that makes you feel greater than that is like service and impact and so then I look at this and I just go I think when you're starting out like build a life for yourself it's great like I truly think like money does make your life fundamentally far greater i hate these people that say it's it's fucking awesome um but but if you can just have awareness on why you're doing it because if you're just making money for money saying can you're going from 20 million to 80 million or whatever it is right for the sake of it and in the pursuit of doing that you're just sacrificing your presence your enjoyment your the the peace in the journey and everything then i feel like there's something deeper driving that and it's actually not what you actually want.

54:48And I learned that through old people and rich people because I find that they seem to be focusing on completely different things than what we are. I don't know if that's better or worse, but I do find inspiration from looking at those people. I really view it like this is the game of life. I think I stopped viewing things as like I want this and I want that and just like I want a fully experienced life. I want to experience love and I want to experience heartbreak I want to experience poverty and richness and like it's just like that is the whole meaning is like to experience every like everything and um I think that's what that's what you realize on the other side and it's so sad because sometimes it really just takes like you have to make all the money to realize you never wanted it and then you have to like you know get the hot girl to realize you didn't want her and like you know sometimes you can only see things in hindsight but I agree and I think we really are the other realization I've had in life is like we already are what we want like you want to be wealthy but you are wealthy like look at everything you have in life look at the people in your life look at the fact that like everything's perspective and everything is relative like to a person you know in another country you are the wealthiest person on earth and when you the only way that you can actually attract anything in life is through the understanding that you already have what you want.

56:10When you operate from the frequency of abundance and the frequency of wealth, you will attract more wealth. When you operate from a place of love is when you're going to attract more love. And that's why so often people don't get what they want is because they operate from lack, but you already have it. And that's why when you're at the top, it doesn't feel satisfying because you don't realize you've had it all along. You've had it all along. It's not something new. Do you feel like there's a challenge being a woman in business? I've heard just talk a lot about you think the future of tech and silicon valley and businesses is women um is there a challenge and maybe let's flip it from being an external challenge of like people not respecting you or not being able to get investors respect whatever it is and and maybe let's flip it to like an internal challenge is there any challenge internally by being a woman in business and do you ever feel pulled in different directions on what you should focus on and what your life is all about?

57:09Yeah, there's a lot of challenges. Where do I begin? And this is something like I'm actively like working through, you know? Which is great. I mean, the first I would say is, you know, inherently what gives women so much value is our feminine energy, right? In relation to men and in relation to the world is like operating from feminine energy. And yet to attract everything I've had up until this point, it's been both, but it's been a lot of masculine energy. And so I've resonated with the safety of masculine energy. And it's really hard when you as a woman operate from masculine energy to to not only find a partner whose masculine energy is greater than yours, whose vision is bigger than yours, who can hold space for you, but someone who can bring that feminine side out of you and to trust it to come out.

58:08Because for so long, everything we've gotten didn't come from that, right? I would say that's the hardest thing is knowing how to trust feminine energy has been the hardest thing. Even though so much of what I have in business has actually come from that. So it's like reminding myself it wasn't only masculine energy that got me there. I'd say that's a big thing. And also dating, like just dating in general is really hard. And having to like rewire these beliefs I have around for you. And for so long, I had this belief, the limiting belief that like, you know, the chances of me finding the one are so much smaller because if I want a man who's more successful than me, a bigger visionary than me and all these things, it's like that is a very small pool of people.

58:56And so that I've always had is like a limiting belief. And yet at the same time, like I only want one. And so the odds are still massive. And so everything is perspective. So it's been a lot of having to, you know, work on that. And I think, you know, another piece of this that I've personally been struggling with is like feeling of like, like, yeah, like, I guess like truthfully, like I've and this is something I'm working through literally in therapy right now. and like let's see what the spiritual coach too is like how to not like hate men I guess like on a very deep subconscious level because I think so much of everything I have is was operated at least initially purely because of like a lack of a father figure in my life and so it's like you know everything that gave me security and happiness in my life came from you know out of a place of almost giving myself justice for the lack of masculine energy.

1:00:00And so how do I trust masculine energy when everything I have was because I was that role? So that's something I think I've been struggling with. Yeah, I appreciate you sharing. I feel that's going to be the most profound thing people resonate with women listening to this show. Are you able to unpack that a bit more about some of the stuff you've been working through and the challenge of that, like that genuine feeling of how do I not hate men, frankly? Yeah, it's so hard. It's so hard because the truth is, not to get super, I mean, we're here, so I'm going to get philosophical. I'm very aware of my thoughts, right?

1:00:53And so I think so often, so much of the work we do in like psychotherapy or even spirituality is like, how do we become aware of what's running the show? But no one really tells you how to change it and how to actually fix your life, right? And so what I've become aware of is like, for example, love, right? Love in the same way actually now I'm realizing business, it requires so much faith. It requires so much trust and surrender knowing this person can hurt you. that's just what you're signing up for. This person can ruin your life. They can hurt you. All these things can happen in the same way that as running a business, you could go bankrupt.

1:01:33You could, your business could explode tomorrow. This could have been the biggest regret of my life. And yet I'm still willing to take that risk because not only do I trust myself to succeed at it, but also like, I love it too much to not try, you know, but when it comes to love, like that fear of giving someone the power to hurt me has been really hard. And that's something I'm working through is how do I trust they won't hurt me? And I realized it's not about making them not hurt me. It's about becoming the version of myself that's resilient enough that even if they hurt me, I can bounce back.

1:02:13That my life is so full that even if this person screws me over, like, I am me. And like, that is everything I need, you know, and them being in or out of my life is a beautiful compliment to my life, but it isn't my life. Right. And I think you have to believe that in order to love, right? Like, I'm not doing business just so that I can have a billion dollar exit. I would love to. I'm doing it because I'm in love with the game that I wake up every day, and I'm obsessed with what I do. I love this journey. And I feel like love should feel the same way where it's like every, you're not, you know, love isn't made up by the day, you know, he gets down on one knee and you have a ring on your finger.

1:02:53It's made up of, do you wake up every day and you feel love? Like, do you feel love every day? And if you don't, then like, you shouldn't be there. You know, just for the sake of like, whatever. But like, if you do, then whether or not that person hurts you, you felt the feeling you were seeking in life. I also think, you know, pain can be poetry. Like so much of all my work came as a result of heartbreak and struggle and all these things. Like it's so poetic and beautiful. And as I was saying, like, this is the game of life. Like I want to feel every extreme. I don't want to exist in this middle and like be safe, but not experience this one life that we get to experience.

1:03:38But it is hard. It is very hard. Yeah. I feel that challenge for women. It just like, I feel for them. And obviously the men as well, struggling to feel a place. I feel like there's a lot of alone men as well. But I feel the interesting thing that I just, from observing that, because I've been deep diving into love and really trying to understand what that actually looks like. Like, and one of the things that I've been realizing recently that maybe combats a little bit of the thoughts you were just sharing is the fact that love is less of a feeling and more of an action. Because it's a bit unrealistic to feel like you're going to feel loved by your partner every single day that you wake up.

1:04:28Mm-hmm. And we're human. We have bad days. We have challenges. Sometimes people just grind our gears and we want to stomp on their toe. We do. And there's a part of me that goes, I feel like it's a bit unrealistic to feel loved every day by your partner. And I think this is why a massive thing with God is so strong, because if you have such a deep connection to God and you feel so much love from God, then even on the days you don't feel love from your partner, you can still feel the strength of God. And that still allows you to still fill up other people's cups and still give and still show and act in a state of love to your partner.

1:05:16And so that's the first thing that I found that's been super fascinating is I've discovered recently. The other thing that I think is interesting is just like your business could land flat on its face with the app store shutting down or Apple going out of business or TikTok being deleted or whatever it is, right? Just like you could have challenges or a competitor comes in and does something or you get sued here. Just because of the fact that there is so much pressure and there is so much risk with business makes you so much more invested in it. And if there was no risk of being heartbroken, would you truly feel love?

1:06:01because if there was no risk and you knew that I can be fully full with myself and everyone else is a bonus would you feel the connection and and feel the need to show up and act in a state of love for them so that they don't leave you because the fact that if you don't they will leave you and you'll feel heartbroken. So I wonder the fascinating piece around love, because I think it's truly the greatest thing in our life is the love from platonically, romantically, and truly feeling that. But equally, just like every other area of our life, the risk that comes with it is what makes it so great.

1:06:46And then feeling that and knowing that allows you to show up in that way of going, huh, the fact that I actually feel dependent on this person right now is the very thing that makes it so great. And that's been a hard one for me to swallow because for the longest time I've been like, I just want to, this table has four legs and I don't want my partner being a leg of that. I want it to be a plate on the table so that then if the plate breaks, the table still stays strong. Right. And I always thought this, like, because if they were a leg of the table and then they left me and they broke me, then not only will the table break, but it'll tilt and every plate on top will come crumbling down.

1:07:31And I would live in this lens of going like, I can never let them be a leg of the table. They need to be a bonus. They need to be a plate on the table. But then I wonder if I can fully feel love if they're just a plate, because I know that if they break, I'm good. and um and you know i think the thing that i just truly feel and and i feel so passionately about speak to and i don't know the answers and i don't know what's right or wrong what the better thing is but the challenge that i feel with this rise with women creating so much wealth yet still wanting people that are up into the right is the fact that a lot of the men that are up into the right of these successful women want a feminine woman which is what you said like they really thrive in that feminine energy and the feminine woman has that level of surrender and that level of like unity and that level of like support and and there's just something in me that just goes like if we are just trying to be so independent not only are we going to struggle to find someone But it's also going to be really hard to keep that person around.

1:08:42And yeah, it gives me goosebumps thinking about it because I don't know the answers, but it is something that I feel so deeply about. That is very deep that you spoke to my soul because I'm going to be honest, like for most of my life, you're right. Like I just wanted the plate on the table and like disposable. Like, you know, like it's like you can't hurt me if I don't invest myself in you. Right. But the truth is, like everything that's good in my life, like did come from deep surrender, trust and full investment of everything I have, you know. And I think the hard part is like with love is it's very it feels so outside of our control.

1:09:27You know, with business, there's metrics and that doesn't determine everything, but it just feels so much safer. Yeah. Whereas with love, it's like you can't control another person, you know. And so that has been really hard for me. Like it really has. And then the struggle of like, you know, everything I have and I love in my life was created through this masculine energy. But yet the men that I want, maybe don't want that side of me is like deeply painful to admit to myself. and do I want to be in a relationship where I'm that kind of person no right I do want to be with someone where I that feminine side of me completely can come out but that does require like trusting that person and you know and not being so in control all the time and that's hard it's very hard to do but but so much of the work that I have been doing that has helped me is again not about trying to contort this person to never hurt me, right?

1:10:29And to be so hypervigilant, because that's something that I always had was like, I've just been hurt in my life so many times that I just became hypervigilant. And I existed in a state of fight or flight in a relationship more than ever experiencing love. It was more of like just a battlefield. Love was just this war zone. And it wasn't this majestic, whatever, paradise. And it's like, why am I here? you know what am I doing and the realization was like um you know not everything has to be a checklist like it doesn't have to be like I have to pick this guy because he checks this off and and because he does this he'll never hurt me it's like what what are we doing you know like what are we doing is this Amazon is this a shopping list like it's like so much more poetic and deep and beautiful and artistic than that.

1:11:18And I'm allowed to, I'm allowed to feel pleasure. Like that was a big, back to the whole, like, do you give yourself permission to desire what you want in this life? Like, I was like, I'm allowed to be in love and I'm allowed to fully surrender and I'm allowed to be, just feel good. You know, even on like a sexual level, like I think so many hyper-masculine women struggle in their sexuality and that no one talks about it. It's like, maybe the reason do you have problems because you don't even like to as a female like in order to have good sex like you have to surrender and trust or else your body's in fight or flight won't do what it needs to do and so you know like I have had to do so much work in believing the feminine energy is powerful because on a deep level I believed for so long and I'm still working on this the feminine energy is deeply weak because it did not save me when I needed saving.

1:12:16And so I'm really working now on how can I believe that feminine energy is insanely powerful? How can I view, for example, a big limiting belief I have is that pregnancy is horrible. I'm like, I wish I could be a father, not a mother. How beautiful would it be to be a dad? Why do I have to be a mom? I would love to be a father. You get to have a child and you didn't have to give up nine months of your life, sacrifice your career. You could walk away at any point. That sounds like a dream. I was like, I wish I could be a dad. And I can't simply because I was born a woman. And that has been like a deep.

1:12:52And I mean, if you go back into my psychology, it all makes sense. But it's like, I've had to reprogram that because I felt like pregnant women, you know, like lose like you're losing by being a mom. Like it's you're like the martyr. Like and I'm like, no, I have it all wrong. It's like I have the privilege that I'll be able to carry a human being and love it more than a man. Biologically, I will create this from my body. Every hair on its body, every cell, its teeth will be created by me. That's crazy. Like, I'm one with God because I'm a woman. I am more connected to God than a man. And that is a privilege.

1:13:30And I think I just had it all backwards because, I mean, truthfully, like, society makes us believe that men have all this power. But maybe men had to obtain all this material power to, you know, I don't know, feel like they can be as powerful as what feminine energy is without doing anything.

1:13:50That's profound. Yeah. Yeah. One therapy session. Men have had to achieve all of this material stuff to try and get to the power of what a feminine woman has without doing anything.

1:14:16That's a bar. That is a bar. Oh my goodness. It's so real. That is the realest thing I've heard all week. Oh my goodness. Because I think the thing I'm lighting up about, that is great. That is so good. You spat there. That was phenomenal. So I passionately agree. In fact, I think women are God's greatest gift. It even says in the Bible, in Genesis, at the start of the New Testament, where it literally talks about before women, God created plants, created trees, created animals. And then Adam was like, well, the animals weren't really good helpers. They weren't really good helpers. And so then God, while Adam was sleeping, pulled the rib cage out of Adam and created woman to be a helper for Adam, created Eve from Adam, and whether the story feels too superficial or random, whatever, it's the message I'm trying to share here.

1:15:32Created woman for Adam, God's greatest gift, so that Adam had a valuable helper in his life. Women are God's greatest gift from life. they have the portal of life yeah when the sink ships we take care of women and children men sacrificial lamb no one cares about them when a little kid is growing up as a little boy he's like go make something of yourself they don't say that for women because the men don't have what the women already do and i think there's something so powerful in that and it's not about women not making money and not achieving all this stuff but but i i truly believe that there's this feeling of when it's passion led and and like desire led not survival and need led it's like the most amazing feminine energy that comes out and if you could do it in a really manifesting way where you believe that it's possible and you believe that you can do it and you love it and it excites you, not drains you, it makes you feel happy, not scared, I think that's really powerful.

1:16:45And I would just love to share one experience for me that gave me a lot of insight on women I want to stay with and not leave because I think it's super powerful.

1:17:02I'm in a relationship right now with this woman. She's amazing. I want to marry her. She's awesome. And when I met her, I was on the back of being an absolute dick. I was on a podcast tour. Things were doing well. I was sleeping around. I was meeting girls out. I was flirting. I was responding to the DMs I was getting. I was da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da. And I remember having like a week of just straight sin. And it wasn't good. And I don't drink. I don't do drugs. And really, I literally, like, my bad vice was women. And anyway, I was filming a solo podcast. And at the very end of the pod, I was sitting in the Malibu Mountains as the sun was setting.

1:17:52At the very end of the pod, I just was, and you've seen me today, I just ponder and I think about stuff. I'm weird. I was like, so what's next for me? And I said, I really would love someone in my life. I'm sick of doing this alone. I don't want to keep doing this alone. And I want someone. And then I left Malibu and I went to Austin to do a production. And we were doing this massive production, this horse barn, everything. Anyway, I was walking back to my Airbnb. I had five hours of deep work to do at home. I just met my assistant who was down at the lake. And I was walking back to my Airbnb.

1:18:32And I thought, I'm just going to stop in at the smoothie shop with Sun Life. I'm just going to grab a quick Alexa from the fridge. Not even a smoothie. I was in and out. Walked in as I walked out. This was a week after I just said I would really love someone in my life. I'm walking out with my stuff, very quick stop, and this lady stands up and goes and compliments my shoes. This is the girl that I'm with right now. Anyway. Oh, my God. After this happened and we started getting really close, I found myself changing. I stopped responding to the girl's texts. I stopped flirting. I stopped doing things with other women because I genuinely, genuinely could not bear to hurt this girl.

1:19:20I could not comprehend it. I fully changed. And I sat there and I went, what's going on? And one of the things that I drew it back to was I knew that she values herself and she won't tolerate me doing that stuff. So if I want to be with her, I've got to clean up my act or she's just going to leave because whether she's with me or not, she's going to have an amazing life. She's going to have a great life. She is the most desired, like any man would snatch her up in a heartbeat. So when I knew that she was valuable and she had this feminine energy that made me feel so calm, she wanted me to, she made me feel calm, but at the same time wanted me to conquer.

1:20:07She was the only thing in my life that wanted me to not work. The only thing. She was, she was a space that made my house a home. And I literally felt this thing of, if I mess this up, I'm the one losing because she's going to have a great life. She's going to find an amazing man. And so when I actually assess it and I go, okay, what does a man want? Well, just like Adam wanted, he wanted a helper. He wanted someone that made him a better man. My life got fundamentally better in every single way when I met this woman. which means that I can't comprehend losing her. So when I can't comprehend losing her, all I want to do is do her right because I know she won't tolerate anything else.

1:21:03I think when a woman respects herself, her true self, not like the external thing she's achieved, not like all this stuff, her value in this earth, when she respects that, a high value man and a high achieving man will see that and just be absorbed by it, like fully absorbed by it to the point where it's like the only thing that matters. And you kind of go, holy shit, I've been doing all of this work. And now I can actually be a man and look after this person. I could actually open a door for her and I can actually do all these nice things. And I can actually care for her. I can actually hold her a little bit longer.

1:21:44when she's having a stressful day. Like I can do all of this and I get to, it's the greatest gift ever. And I think the challenge that I find with when a woman gets too masculine is she wants to do all of that herself and it doesn't make the man feel like a better man. And that's actually what we just want. And that's from back in the day when God created Eve, it was the exact same thing. Like he needed a helper. He needed someone to make him better. and it's not about saying that the women are less than it's about saying that when like two become one and your strengths are a heightened like magic happens and um and yeah that was profound for me and it's really shaped a lot of like the drive and the value i feel i have in this earth now which is kind of weird that is beautiful that was deeply healing for me to hear also because i feel like it's so rare not that it's rare but it's like when you do hear stories like that you realize that like i think first of all like men just deeply desire to feel valuable and to be of value in the world right um especially to a woman and then that like the right man will he will give you what you need as a woman.

1:23:06And as a woman, you'll be able to fully just, you know, let go. And that's deeply, deeply healing. What do you think? I'm curious from you, like, what do you think? Because I think like the core of it is like, these women, you know, they, yeah, it's like, they've learned to just be so in their masculine. But what, as a man, like, what do you find let's say attractive or like you gravitate towards in a woman like how does it display itself you know I can only speak for my experience but me is passion I think when a woman's passionate then I get so excited and I don't really care what it is I just want to see like your eyes light up with excitement and I think that's really cool I think I think uh I think passion is a very just feminine, amazing, bubbly thing.

1:24:07And excitement. Yeah. And I just think that men can go through war and go through building these buildings and breaking bones and going through all this stuff. And I'm not saying that that's not valuable for a woman as well, but like when a man goes through that, like they find great value and worth from, from that transformation. Like they find great, they, they, they become more useful. And, um, and I think for me, like when I see a woman that like can make me just feel so calm and just excited, like, like with her passion and with her kindness and her, and her care and her love, um, it just, yeah.

1:25:04For me, my biggest wake up was, holy shit. I just spent five hours on a couch and didn't think about work once. And I don't remember the last time I've had that ever, ever. Wow. And so like, I, I was like, there's something in that. And so, and so, yeah, I'm fascinated to know from, from you, when you are a woman in business and you start achieving stuff, do you just, like you said earlier around, uh, you know, not um like not can't comprehend being a mother but like you can be a father and like when you're in that state i do genuinely i genuinely have a deep thought of i don't want kids i don't want a family i can just do this alone or is that kind of like a front and there's a little thought of I would want to or is it genuinely like I don't want it so I do want kids yeah I do want to be a mom I think it'll be the most rewarding thing I'll ever do you know because it's like it's a part of me and it's like I get to like fully like the thing I love is I love to give like fundamentally like you were saying like people at the end of their life and and people were you know have everything it's like I just love giving and so to be able to give everything of what I have to something I created, I think will be the most rewarding thing I ever do.

1:26:33I think it's never been a question of like, if I don't want children, I think it's more been this like defense and everything I think with women of like why they are the way they are so often. And just in general, with anything we do in the world, like people who never become wealthy, right? Not in every case, but in a lot of cases, it's a defense mechanism of it doesn't feel safe to trust whatever this is, right? It just feels deeply, deeply dangerous. And the subconscious, going back to our first thing, the subconscious doesn't care what you want. It just cares to keep you safe. And so it'll literally like manipulate your brain into believing things that aren't even real just to keep you safe from what it's been proven to see over time.

1:27:22And so I know, like I'm very aware of like Like so much of what I believe on this topic that I'm actively like working through and I have been for years is like a manipulation of my own brain. Like I believe that everything will go to shit. I'm going to get hurt. I'm going to this, that and the other. It's like that's all like deeply, you know, distorted stories and everything's perspective too. And I believe this because my brain thinks that if I believe this, I won't do the thing that could hurt me. and so I'll never get hurt but also never get to experience what I deeply want and that's like the cycle that is always perpetuated in our lives I do want this I think like deeply what I fear is abandonment like I would do all of this and sacrifice so much of what has kept me safe and given me so much happiness which is my career and then there's nothing holding that man to stay like he could leave and i don't need child support you know like i'll be fine it's more just like emotionally if he disappears that feels very scary to me um because he's not biologically attached to that child the way i will be forcibly attached to that child and that scares me it's all control everything in the women's psychology and human psychology it all comes down to control and having children is deep release of control.

1:28:47It is maybe the biggest surrender of control that you can, I mean, you're growing something inside of you that like you just, I mean, this is a physically another soul inside of you. There's not a lot of control you have in that, right? And like, it's a very crazy process, but it scares me that I would have to surrender so much control. Wow. It's so profound. It's, you know, see the, see the, there's a, there's a massive desire for women to become men because we control it more. Like, like I interviewed this guy and he's like, yeah, like women are becoming the men that they want. It was so brutal.

1:29:35It was so brutal. And I'm not saying it's wrong. And I really want to rain home that like it's not wrong but but like I really see great power in diving deep to why we're doing something and uh and it's just crazy but like that makes so much sense right like we that we can control the masculine energy but the the feminine one has so much faith and surrender and trust that's out of our control and we don't want to be sitting there going there is nothing I can do right now. You know why too? Because the worst pain is knowing you signed up for this. It's so much easier to not feel grief over something that you couldn't control, but to know that this is something you signed up for and you got played is deeply painful.

1:30:22But that's also like, it's all perspective. And I mean, I've been doing, one big mission I have and my own personal development in life is like anything I do out of a state of lack, from a state of scarcity, from a state of pain, I don't want to do in my life. Like I want to end my life knowing I am operating at the end of my life fully from a place of abundance and pleasure and that I'm making decisions from that state and from not because I had something fucked up happen to me and I'm just reacting. Like life is happening to me, not for me, but that I'm actually like fully like choosing everything and acting from a state of abundance and so what I've had to do is I've had to like go back to the root of like what started all of this like clearly this is not a healthy mechanism of thinking of action reaction something caused my subconscious to believe this that hasn't been healed or isn't there's no safety there yet and you can't until you heal and create safety, it won't, you won't change your reality.

1:31:30And so I've been doing a lot of work on like something, I think one of the most profound realizations I've had in my life is like, who would I be if I had a father that really showed up for me? Like, who would I be right now? How would I love? And you start to think, I wouldn't be doing any of this. Like, I just, like, I've like played that scenario in my head of like, I'm just going to create this alter ego for a day where I like pretend I grew up with this dad who like spoiled me and spoiled my mom and like we were always taken care of. I'd look at the world so differently. I'd be so much more, I don't know, like excited for what's, I just wouldn't be in fear constantly.

1:32:10And it's so sad because it's like everything I see in the world is like from the glasses of like all the pain I've experienced. And like, I have to take those glasses off and see, you know, reality for what it is and what it could be. And what I've had to do is like what I've been doing actually is I listen to, you know, visualizations on my app, Stella. But something really deeply profound for me is I've been listening to visualizations where it's like a visualization of myself as a child, where like I had masculine figures in my life that really showed up for me. Like the, you know, the father who like, you know, came to me and was like, you have such a powerful idea like I hope I will be committed to making this come into fruition like you deserve to be heard you are so capable um like listening to these visualizations of like you were you know my like a father figure saying you're so beautiful I will support this mission for you like I will be there if anything falls through like I'm here for you and like hearing that and then going about my day after that I'm a different person it's the way I can like relax and I could just trust others to show up and support me.

1:33:23It's like, and I think we think that just because we were raised that way or we experienced these painful things, it's like that's hardwired into our brain, but our brain can't tell the difference between a real and imagined experience. And with enough imagination, everything that exists was once imagined. So if you continuously imagine a new reality, you almost go back and revise the past or create enough imaginary evidence of what could exist in the future, it changes your identity and it changes your destiny. And so that's what I've been doing. And it's been very powerful. And like, I'm dating a partner now who I really, really love, who's super ambitious, more successful than me.

1:34:02And it's like very, very healing. And he's extremely supportive. I've dated guys who like, I think their entire mission was to see me fail. Like truly, I think it was like subconsciously, like They wanted to see me shrink and see me fail. And like, I do think as an ambitious woman, there does exist a partnership where you can be feminine and you can also build an empire together. And I think it's interesting how we both are building such massive empires, but we're operating so differently within that. For me to be able to come in and be like, here's how on a mindset level I'm operating this. And he's like, here's the data.

1:34:38And I'm like, we come together and it's like this fucking magical thing. it's crazy wow this has been cool it's been the best thank you so much i uh i just want to commend you for opening up and sharing and it's it's what it's all about i think that's so cool and um and yeah i have goosebumps i just think like there's yeah i've learned a lot today and i've i've uh i just want to commend you for everything that you're doing the stuff you're building the life you're living. It's inspiring. It's very cool and just good on you for everything. And I appreciate you coming on and sharing some of your story and your insights.

1:35:21Thank you, Chris. It's been good. It's been good. I'm going to leave all your details in the show notes so everyone can go check you out, but we're going to sign out. Bye-bye. Bye.