In short
Pluribus episode “The Gap” follows two parallel journeys: Carol’s month of isolation and Manusos’s trek from Paraguay toward New Mexico to reach her, with the “gap” widening between them emotionally and philosophically. The episode emphasizes near-silent character work, visual storytelling, and human desperation versus the hive mind’s God-like control.
Guests (podcast)
Joanna Robinson and Rob Mahoney (hosts). No other guests are introduced in the transcript.
Guest backgrounds
Robinson and Mahoney are Press News TV podcast hosts; the episode also references production credits (writer Jen Carroll; director Adam Bernstein; actor Vesca as Manusos; Patrick Fabian as Carol’s voicemail voice; editor Chris McCaleb).
Key claims
The episode is described as a masterpiece with minimal dialogue; it deconstructs “two most human characters” under hive-mind pressure. Carol’s loneliness drives her to collapse back into Zoja’s arms; Manusos’s journey ends in injury and rescue.
Notable examples
Carol goes to a Georgia O’Keeffe museum and takes the painting “Belladonna”; she golfs, dines out, and sings to herself. Manusos learns English, siphons gasoline, sleeps in a church, and ultimately reaches for help from “the heavens.”
Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.
Chapters
Tap a time to open that second in VOExploring 'The Gap' Episode Themes
0:45 to 3:19
Discussion on the meaning of 'The Gap' and character dynamics.
“I mean, look, definitely kind of gap styled at times.”
The Director's Craft and Visual Storytelling
3:19 to 6:19
Analysis of Adam Bernstein's directorial choices and visual storytelling.
“Something that, you know, I like to do, obviously, as you know, is sort of scrub through the official pod.”
The Emotional Journey of Manusos
6:19 to 8:03
Deep dive into Manusos' emotional and physical challenges.
“So like the incredible work that he did putting together and the great work he does on that podcast.”
Contrasting Characters: Manusos and Carol
8:03 to 12:20
Discussion on the contrasting experiences of Manusos and Carol.
“Is that like, do you think that's something that's like within their realm of experience to collectively grasp?”
Listener Emails and The Hive Mind Debate
12:59 to 14:03
Engagement with listener emails discussing themes of the show.
“Like we mentioned, we got a lot of emails about cannibalism and the dairy and gap.”
Exploring Hive Mind Consent
14:03 to 16:43
Discussion on the concept of hive mind and the implications of consent.
“still stands but there are some moments where they can deny yeah someone something i think The catch for that for me is those people never opted to be in the hive mind to begin with.”
Carol's Activities and Character Analysis
16:44 to 19:21
Analysis of Carol's character and her activities within the episode.
“This goes into something else I want to talk about, which is the do no harm question.”
Do No Harm Debate and Insect Issues
19:22 to 21:46
Discussion about the do no harm principle and humorous insect encounters.
“As someone who drives from Northern California to Southern California on the five quite frequently my grill is just like plastered.”
Cannibalism Emails and Biological Implications
21:47 to 23:58
Exploration of emails about cannibalism and the biological reasons against it.
“It's almost like the universe is telling us something.”
Frequency Theory and Hive Mind Communication
23:59 to 27:30
Discussion on the theory of frequency and its relation to hive mind communication.
“Like you can request to be called by something other than potentially your given name.”
Show all 24 chapters
Character Transformations in the Narrative
27:31 to 28:05
Analysis of character transformations and themes in the current episode.
“I just want to point this out as watching Carol collapse into Zojo's arms or watching Minusos have to get rescued out of the jungle.”
Carol's Emotional Journey in Isolation
28:05 to 29:50
Exploring Carol's descent into isolation and her struggle with loneliness.
“In Better Call Saul, we watch Jimmy McGill become Saul.”
Carol's Emotional Journey in Isolation
31:23 to 31:46
Exploring Carol's descent into isolation and her struggle with loneliness.
“You think you know a browser, but Gemini and Chrome?”
Carol's Activities and Connections
31:47 to 37:50
Discussing Carol's attempts to find joy and connection through various activities.
“Carol's best day is sort of how the writers talked about how they wanted to to lay this out.”
Contrast Between Carol and Manusos
37:51 to 42:01
Examining the contrasting journeys of Carol and Manusos in the series.
“I mean, I don't know about the coursing specifically.”
Exploring Will Forte's Character
42:01 to 43:09
Discussion on the character's isolation and coping mechanisms.
“Like I'm living in pretty much some version of abject filth.”
Vanity License Plates in the Episode
43:10 to 44:09
Analysis of the significance of vanity license plates featured in the episode.
“The Rolls Royce that Carol picks up, the license plate is Ace Baby.”
Personal Reflections on Vanity Plates
44:10 to 45:57
Discussion on personal views about vanity license plates and identity.
“If you have other thoughts, lickingthedonit at gmail.com.”
The Chunga Tree and Cultural Significance
45:58 to 48:36
Exploration of the Chunga tree and its implications in the episode.
“It is, I am pleased to tell you, in some places referred to as Chumbawamba.”
Isolation and Psychological Impact
48:37 to 50:29
Discussion on the effects of isolation as portrayed in the episode.
“But ultimately could be quite stable under the right circumstances.”
Listener Engagement and Questions
50:30 to 52:26
Promoting listener interaction and discussing vanity plate ideas.
“I could actually see that making it kind of worse.”
American Patriotism and Performative Acts
52:27 to 56:00
Analyzing themes of patriotism and their portrayal in the episode.
“But it's not just like what you think encompasses.”
Reflections on a Vulnerable Moment
56:00 to 57:02
The hosts discuss a character's low point and the implications of their choices.
“You're out of patience, out of time, out of hope.”
Holiday Wishes and Final Thoughts
57:02 to 57:24
The hosts share holiday wishes and tease upcoming content.
Transcript
Automatic transcript. May contain errors.0:18Joanna Robinson:Hello, welcome back to the Press News TV podcast feed. I'm Joanna Robinson. I'm Rob Mahoney. We're here in person to talk about episode seven, The Gap. What is The Gap? Yeah, Rob, What could that episode title mean, do you think? I don't know. I feel like it could refer to a great many things. I like to think of it as, you know, maybe the gap between all of us as we isolate ourselves and certainly as these two characters are kind of drifting further apart philosophically. You don't think Carol in her new sort of like embrace materialism phase went to the gap? Oh, she definitely might have. I mean, look, definitely kind of gap styled at times.
0:50Yeah.
0:50Joanna Robinson:Could it have anything to do with the thing we got one million emails about last week, the Darian gap? judging by our inbox, it is possible. It does seem like that could be a consideration that may be dealt with in this episode. Okay, so we're here to talk about Pluribus Episode 7, The Gap, written by Jen Carroll, directed by Adam Bernstein, in which we check in on Carroll over the scope of a month, and then presumably Manusos on a month-long journey up from Paraguay to New Mexico. Guys, you cannot drive there directly. So we have learned. So we have learned. this is an educational process for us thank you for all your emails about the Darien Gap some of them were very polite some of them were rude but that's okay we appreciate all of that but if we didn't know about the Darien Gap before we'd certainly know about it now I just want to say really quickly we did get one email about the TV show Long Way Up which is the Ewan McGregor TV show where he and his friend Charlie took motorcycles from the tip of South America up to Los Angeles did I watch that show?
1:50Joanna Robinson:yes did I not finish that show? correct episode 8 is when they encounter the Darien Gap and I did not get there. Should have done your due diligence. How do you feel about us doing a travelogue show, Jo? Can it be wine-based? It can be wine-based. It can be Darien Gap-based if you like. I don't like. It seemed a little perilous for my taste. And certainly we couldn't be driving through it, but maybe that's a hiking not bottle episode, but a little side quest. Alright, how are your machete skills? Not great at carterizing. That part I'm not looking forward to. Everything we learned from our lovely listeners about cannibalism and the Darien Gap aside.
2:29Joanna Robinson:How did you like this episode? I fucking loved it. I thought this was just like one of the most beautiful episodes of TV I've seen this year. Yeah. And hit a lot of boxes for me. I know everyone is coming to Plurvis for something very different. And I'm sure a viewer of the show is like, I just want to find out the next steps with the virus, with the aliens, hypothetically, with whatever is happening in this show. So this is like the deconstruction of our two most human characters, early central human characters. And it's shot in a way where I'm just like, good Lord, like the Chilean coastline.
3:02Good Lord. These like the beautiful kind of like scenescapes of an apocalypse effectively and using those to advantage to indicate the isolation of these characters, but also the beauty and the natural wonder of these spaces. And like it kind of is laying out the argument for and against humanity at the same time just by how beautiful this episode is.
3:20Joanna Robinson:Oh, I love that. Something that, you know, I like to do, obviously, as you know, is sort of scrub through the official pod. Sometimes those tidbits are just extra, you know, cherry on the cake of our discussion. But in this case, I think Adam Bernstein, who's the director of this episode, who was a frequent Breaking Bad director, Better Call Saul director. He directed our Hooked episode for Breaking Bad. Correct. Yeah. And is a music video director as well. And so his history directing like the Love Shack music video for the B-52s, Hey Ladies for the Beastie Boys, Baby Got Back for Sir Mix-a-Lot.
3:54Joanna Robinson:Oh my God. Like this is a guy. But like his - So he's directed a lot of different kinds of landscapes as you're alluding to with Baby Got Back. But I think his use of sort of visual storytelling, quick edits, musicality, all of that really works inside of this episode. Also, hearing how they shot it over time, some of it in Spain, some of it across different states, somewhat out of order. So for the actors to have to, you know, for Vesca, who plays Menousos, for him to get into the right emotional space based on where he's driving at what point in the timeline. there's just so much effort that went into making this incredible episode and something that i thought that was so interesting that adam bernsey talked about having worked with vince's crew through breaking bad through better call saul is that they have this kind of unofficial motto in the writer's room which is can we do this scene with no dialogue yeah like that they'll they'll write a scene and i'll be like but can we do it with no dialogue and this episode is a real testament to that approach because I really feel like with Manusos especially who we spent less time with we are on such and we just have to be with him emotionally through this largely silent trek that he takes and then when he does speak which we'll talk about when we get there it's so powerful it's really amazing what they've already done with this character in as you said very limited screen time certainly very limited dialogue time actual human beings muttering to himself in a rainforest a little bit more.
5:24Joanna Robinson:The cat is gray. The cat is gray. But also, I think it's just a testament to Vince Gilligan and his casting directors in particular, Sharon Bialy and Sherry Thomas. Like they this feels like Ray Sehorne on Better Call Saul. It feels like the emergence of a fascinating, like naturalistic actor who is never boring. Every time he's on screen, I just like I'm transfixed by whatever he is reacting to in that moment. And it never feels like too much or too little. It's like, I am just like so fully in this thing. And that's a product of great filmmaking. It's a great product of great editing. Absolutely.
5:56But you can't do it if you can't hold the screen. Right. And for Vesca to be doing that with, frankly, like very little on the page to read. I think it's just remarkable acting work from him so far.
6:06Joanna Robinson:I want to shout out to other people on the production side to Yese and Yoon say that Jen Carroll, who wrote this episode, this is her first like written by credit that she's ever had. So what a cool episode to have that on. And then Chris McCaleb, who hosts the official podcast, is an editor on the show. And he edited this episode. So like the incredible work that he did putting together and the great work he does on that podcast. So I just want to shout out Chris as well. But this is I mean, I just thought this was like a masterpiece of of television. Really, really good stuff. And I think it based on how you're reacting.
6:38Joanna Robinson:I mean, I didn't listen to the watch, but I know that Chris and Andy were divided on this episode because Chris told me that they were. And he didn't really respond to it. And I know that like some people aren't responding to the show as a whole or this episode. But for me, it really hit what I really like about this Anna Gilligan show in particular, where you are forced to really marinate in the emotional journey. So when we get to the point of Manusos' journey where he is injured bodily, where he can't go on anymore, I am devastated in a way that I would not be if I hadn't, you know, watched him sort of suck all that gasoline out of cars and like do all the other things that he did along the way.
7:23Joanna Robinson:Do you know what I mean? Completely. I mean, it's taking these two characters to their absolute breaking points. and in doing so like something very human right like I think that kind of the kind of growth we're seeing from any character like that's something the hive mind can't do like they are a static entity working to complete optimization in a lot of different ways but like one thing I was wondering when watching this is like can the hive mind even comprehend the contempt that Minusos has to set his own beloved car on fire just to prove a point is that like a thing that the hive mind understands hands of like, you're saying you understand that this is an important car to me.
7:57Right. I hate you saying that so much that I'm going to set it and the Virgin Mary on fire to spite you. Is that like, do you think that's something that's like within their realm of experience to collectively grasp?
8:09Joanna Robinson:Are you saying that for Manusos, the car is Helen? Oh my God. I didn't even think about it. The audacity of you to say you understand my grief. But there is some I think there is something specifically to that of look in many ways as human beings, we are desperately yearning to be known. Yeah. And then when somebody is like overly familiar with you who doesn't actually know you, it triggers this reflexive anger in all of us that like the hive mind would not really have. Nothing on this planet is yours. You cannot give me anything because all that you have is stolen. you lighter click don't belong here sick like very deeply sick very very good stuff from Manusos in this episode I thought that was incredible um I mean another benefit as you mentioned Jobe just like having such a quiet episode is when a character like Manusos does speak up to other people everything stops like this is what I mean by his naturalistic acting style I could have stayed in that moment of him lighting his lighter and just ready to torch his car in flames.
9:11I could have stayed like suspended in that moment for an hour because of just like him holding that scene, him holding that moment, the break in the dialogue, like the pacing of everything he's delivering. I think it's just really remarkable.
9:21Joanna Robinson:I think what's also incredible and, you know, obviously we'll talk about what Carol's going through in this episode, but I think what's also incredible is the great tragedy of this episode, not just his failure, you know, basically like, I don't know, Christopher Nolan take notes. This is an odyssey like there's the failure that he experiences and then also the tragedy of carol holding out for so long i know and then collapsing back into the arms of the hive mind before he has a chance to get there and the questions we're asking yourself like will you know he's going to be perhaps airlifted to her doorstep we don't know what the hive mind's going to do against his wishes but that might happen and then is he going to be like oh you are just like one of them yeah do you know and that's devastating because she held out by herself feeling like she's all alone in the world for so long here comes someone who wants to be on your team and the timing is just just not right you know i joke about the gap but like it is there and it's widening between them despite the fact that you know minussos was so inspired by carol's tapes and was like has been him making the effort to go through the gap you're right is an odyssey is incredible to watch is devastating in the end of him finally reaching for the drone heavens for help yeah uh like him having to make that concession is like gut level painful in the same way that carol collapsing into zoja's arms is gut level painful i guess you would love to see a world in which these characters can hold out the appropriate amount of time to be just successful and valiant enough but that's like just not what pluribus is right now that's not what humanity often is bad news for all of us I think that also the to have both of them have these sort of like eye in the sky moments like we've had these drone bits of comedy throughout.
11:05Joanna Robinson:But this idea that Carol has to write a message that, you know, the gods can see. And Minusos has to sort of reach up to the heavens. And we have all that, you know, there's like a shot of Carol with the clouds behind her back lit. Very Knives Out, very Wake Up Dead Man, right? We need that for our set deck. Can we get some steepling light through the window, please? Yeah, some natural lighting inside of the studio, please. And then, you know, and Minuso's having to, like, look up to the heavens, the Virgin Mary iconography, him sleeping in a church. There's just very much, like, the hive mind as God.
11:39Joanna Robinson:Yes. Underlined bold italics inside of this episode. Which, I mean, isn't it? You know, like, at the point where you can snap your fingers and a red Gatorade descends from the heavens. Like, it is a God-like figure or feature. It's not ice cold. It is not ice cold. you know what even God is a little flawed sometimes doesn't quite deliver in the ways you might want but in the ways you might need it's better to drink a tepid drink than an ice cold drink if you're that parched but his resentment of you know when they're saying like you're going to New Mexico right to see Carol you know and he was just like his resentment of like how dare you I haven't spoken to any of you I know how dare you know my plans and how dare you reveal to me that you know my plans it was just like really good stuff this episode is brought to buy Whole Foods Market.
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12:58Joanna Robinson:Let's go through some email stuff. Like we mentioned, we got a lot of emails about cannibalism and the dairy and gap. We'll talk about some of it. And pigeons, which apparently do eat their own young sometimes. So I'm just throwing that out. The anti-pigeon contingent really showed up for you, Rob, and I like that for you. Showed up for all of us. We're a nation divided. All right. uh here's some questions sort of generally posed by the inbox will one of uh the unlicked opt to get licked as it were has Lakshmi already joined her son in the hive mind I mean narratively speaking Lakshmi would be the only one who would make sense like we just haven't revisited any of those other characters right and she I think she has the pull with her son I think she's shown that she's someone who might at least consider that i i think that's a real possibility okay um in in terms of that conversation we had about consent some of our listeners pointed out that like the hive mind does opt to leave vegas even though uh kumbas like please stay why won't you stay so there are decisions that they can make that are counter i mean i think our larger conversation still stands but there are some moments where they can deny yeah someone something i think The catch for that for me is those people never opted to be in the hive mind to begin with.
14:14Right. If you sign up to be a part of the cult and then later want to backtrack on what the cult activities are, that's kind of one thing. But like if you're not signing up for it, that initial wave of consent is just obliterated.
14:25Joanna Robinson:We are still getting some troubling pro hive mind emails from our listeners. A lot of them. OK. I will say the most convincing for me. Yeah. in terms of pro hive mind emails we've been receiving are of the variety of like everything is fundamentally fucked in the world right now right our access to resources our access to health care people like starving and suffering all over the world that there is a bit of hubris in saying like our model is the best model absolutely it's not working for a lot of people and emails being like hey consider your cushy podcaster job is not the job that most people have, et cetera, et cetera.
15:01Joanna Robinson:Fair point. Privilege check. Genuinely fair. The point with that for me is not that those things aren't true and that what we have is the best model. To me, it's just the only human model is like the the only way we can really operate is not with the fundamental constraints of like those societal concerns, but some of the fundamental restraints that would be surrendered to a hive mind mentality. To your point is like if there were an opt in option, that's different. Yeah. Where we're told, hey, if you do this, there will be peace on earth and totally, you know, equality and all that sort of stuff like you and I is.
15:35Joanna Robinson:Never mind. Let's not get into politics. OK. Also a little credulous. Also, if your hive mind utopia has a 10 year expiration date. I don't know. Maybe it's not a utopia. That was so funny. Some of our hive mind apologists were like, oh, just kidding. If it's only going to be 10 years, I don't want it. OK. We need a 15 year plan. That's what I'm saying. Here's a really important question I have. Is the actor Patrick Fabian getting royalties for every episode where they use the complete voicemail recording for carol one can only hope i hope it's in his contract yep um and then i just wanted to point out that carol in this episode is doing a lot of things our listeners wrote in about she went to the museum almost like to a checklist golfing fine dining like this is what everyone wanted to do i loved it we need to hear from the golfers again i will say you know going back to when we were our coverage of fargo there was such a very clear example of a man who had never held a golf club before pretending to be a semi-professional golfer did not work.
16:24Ray C. Horn, I am not a golfer, but very clearly knows how to swing a club. Very clearly has at least spent some time on a driving range before. Did she Daniel Day-Lewis that shit and just like prepare that for this role? I would believe it. Yeah. But I would also believe it if you told me she's been golfing like every other Sunday for years.
16:39Joanna Robinson:We did have some questions from the golfers earlier about how quickly. Well, this goes here. This goes into something else I want to talk about, which is the do no harm question. We got a lot of questions about this. the particulars of the narrative corner that the writers have written themselves into with this do no harm idea because does mowing grass count? If mowing grass, if you can't pick a piece of fruit off the tree, can you cut a blade of grass? Can you cut a blade of grass? And if so, if you can't cut a blade of grass, can you maintain a golf course? We see some weeds growing up. There's like a little bunny here.
17:12Somehow we're getting into like a federalism argument. It's like an author's intent kind of thing happening here, an originalism. Like, I think by the letter of the rule, the answer would be no. Is that how this is going to work? Frankly, we haven't seen the post-time jump golf course yet. That's true. Maybe this is part of the reason why Carol has moved to the, you know, downtown Albuquerque as her driving range is like.
17:33Joanna Robinson:Shagging balls off the. It's in disrepair over there at the country club. Fair enough. Okay. Especially since everyone's, no one's there. No. To Moe Sedgrass. Just two more do no harm questions we got from our listeners. Okay. How does the hive deal with bugs while driving? Gotcha Vince Gilligan. And that's from Hank. And I really, really liked that email. That's a great question. Can I share a recent bug exploit with you? Oh, please. Recently, before I was about to go to bed, I was like, oh, that's a sizable spider on the wall. No big deal. I'm going to take care of it. You know, like I try to escort them out if they're below a certain threshold.
18:03If they're of a certain size, I'm sorry. It's just I don't have the hive mind mentality. It's smashing time. You got to go. Yeah, clobbering time. I had enough concerning features. I'm like, I better Google this. Turns out as a brown widow, not ideal for my home living situation. But one spider I can deal with. Unfortunately, in looking at the Google images of brown widows, there are a lot of very conspicuous egg sacks lurking behind them in these photos. And sure enough, Joe, I look up and there is just a plump little egg sack right there hovering in its web. Yeah, my night plans were scrambled.
18:35I turned into, I mean, this egg sack is like.
18:38Joanna Robinson:You're John Goodman in arachnophobia. It's like in a skylight 12 feet off the ground. And I'm like excavating it with chopsticks with the most careful precision. How else am I supposed to get it that delicately? Because you can't let it burst. I mean, that was my nightmare. It's like, I'm going to squeeze too hard. And literally 150 spiders are going to pour out of this thing. I'm happy to report I successfully removed the egg sack. And to date, we have not seen any more brown widows. But, you know, it was a harrowing experience. I empathize with certainly if you have a spider or bug in your car and absolutely you know we didn't even see the spiders in the gap that Manusos was warned about you know all the bugs and snakes that could also be a danger to him there but uh you know sometimes nature comes for us all.
19:22Joanna Robinson:As someone who drives from Northern California to Southern California on the five quite frequently my grill is just like plastered. you are doing lots of harm i am doing lots of harm and then the last but not least emma was like for hive that can't harm anything they sure use fossil fuels recklessly read so many flights with just a few one to a few people so really taylor swifting their way through this uh but if the only person taylor swifting was one person are you really dealing damage to the environment that way you know like one private jet i think is probably incredibly sustainable if you cut off 90 % of all of the world's corporate level pollution.
19:59If you shut down all the factories that aren't making
20:03Joanna Robinson:cannibalistic smoothies. And this is why I think you're slowly becoming pro-hive mind. I'm not becoming pro-hive mind. I'm just saying that's not my concern. The concern is there's not enough food to sustain the people. And if you need to jet set around, maybe there's a safe way to do it. So here's Rob just collapsing into the arms of the hive mind. Here's me just slicing and dicing my way through the jungle, standing strong. Okay. Unbelievable, Joe. In terms of like the incredible emails we get from experts in the show across many TV shows that we've covered. One of our listeners, Oscar, pointed out that in a way our email network is a bit of a hive mind.
20:36Joanna Robinson:Wow. That we get these like expert insights from people. So we already are the hive mind. He says feels like emailing. How's your high road feel now, Joe? Now that you're already part of it with me. Feels like emailing licking the donut is how we can funnel our knowledge into a hive mind of sorts. Maybe you guys can do a live open heart surgery for the finale guided only by listener emails. Food for thought. So something to consider. If we get a sponsor. OK. Sponsored by The Pit. HBO. You know where to reach us. Rob, do you have a favorite fun fact you learned about cannibalism this week from our listeners?
21:07There were a great many. Fun fact. Lots of people are still pro. Lots of people have lots of defenses of it. On practical grounds. On philosophical grounds sometimes. on lots of just like people and animals have been doing this for a long time in various capacities and therefore it must be okay question mark grounds the science community felt a little differently they certainly did uh it will kill you basically depending on how you prepare well it was the first time i had ever heard the phrase folded protein yeah we got a lot of folded protein
21:34Joanna Robinson:so prion disease which is something that you can get from uh eating i believe the nerve tissue sorry this is this is the world we're living we got so many cannibalism emails so just so you know presumably the hdp is like heavily processed enough that they figured out how to not do this but this is what like mad cow disease came from feeding cattle cow nerve tissue and that's how that spread yeah um and with humans a reason a reason to not be a cannibal is the way in which if you eat nerve tissue i believe uh you know we heard from evolutionary biologists medical writers etc etc that this is not something you want to do it's almost like we are biologically wired in the propagation and continuation of our species that we should not do this.
22:18It's almost like the universe is telling us something.
22:20Joanna Robinson:Interesting, interesting. I did like this email we got from Dan, who's an evolutionary biologist, who says, there are some ideas programmed into our brains as species. We call these, quote, innate behaviors, or more commonly, instincts. As an example, newborn baby chicks instinctively hide from shadows of predators flying overhead. Monarch butterflies migrate something like 4 ,000 miles and do it without social learning. So there's a lot of examples. And then he said with with cannibalism, with incest, which can also sort of these like societal taboos are often linked to these biological contrary to the biological imperative, I guess, ideas.
Read the full transcript
22:54I think there's like a feedback loop thing happening there too, right? There's the biological imperative that like take incest, for example, like higher risks of like development of various like diseases and deformities and health complications as a result. And then that kind of furthers the social taboo, which then like it's all kind of tangled in a way where I don't know how you could separate one from the other. And I'm sure there's cases where the social taboo kind of started first and then we evolved to a point where our bodies could no longer do that thing anymore. So it's all kind of in one big stew.
23:25Joanna Robinson:Did you think we were going to be talking about this today? I just kind of take it as par for the course, given the way the inbox is going right now. Anything you want to share about we learned about storing avocados? No, we're good. OK. Avocados are safe. They're mostly ripe. Sometimes they're frustrating. I don't know what to tell you. Sometimes we put them in the fridge. We do, in fact, know how to put an avocado in the refrigerator or on the counter. But, you know, it doesn't always work. All right. I want to hit you with this frequency theory is what I'm calling it. We got a couple emails about this.
23:52Joanna Robinson:A listener who has requested to be referred to as Ray Scotch Colton. Do we allow that? I do. I mean, yeah. Like you can request to be called by something other than potentially your given name. I think some people try to like don't want their name on a pod, even if their first name is just John. And they're just like worried that people will know that it was them that wrote in. So requesting a in quotes nickname, though, is new. And, you know, in this instance, I decided to go for it. I think you have to defer to us if we want to call you Lorelei. If you leave yourself anonymous like that is our that's our right.
24:26Joanna Robinson:But this is Ray Ray laid this out really beautifully. Right. When Carol spoke to Davis Taffler in the pilot, he said the cell service is down right but as as is outlaid here the joint have kept several other modes of long distance communication powered and functional landlines of course but also communication satellites which is how carol called manuses from a plane yep zoom calls are in effect right because because the unliked are hopping on the zoom without carol uh on a bi-weekly basis so why no cell phones based on all the above I think cell towers interfere with whatever psychic frequency the joined used to communicate taking it one step further I think the mystery frequency Manuso's found was the basic was basic the frequency all the joined are tuned to so to speak and I wonder if whenever Carol Manuso's meet they'll put those two facts together and try to hatch a plan to slow the joined down a lot of people pointed out that the the frequency that Manusa's found having gone through every single option is very similar to, uh, or maybe the same as the pulsing sound that plays over the credits at the beginning of the episode, that this is like the sound of the joint.
25:46Which we've never really talked about, but I find like really bracing and kind of beautiful and also a little terrifying.
25:51Joanna Robinson:Um, maybe that's why you're being seduced to the hive mind. We, we, we do not skip through the opening credits on a TV show. So, um, And then our listener Jay wrote in to say, if the radio signal is part of how the hive mind communicates, would Manusos and Carol be able to block it on sort of like a limited basis, like a 10 mile radius can block the signal and therefore like basically unlicking a segment of the hive mind? Can they liberate just like a few people in a geographical location? Will those people, if they can no longer hear the frequency, will they then revert to who they were before?
26:30Joanna Robinson:Or will Zoja be Zoja but no longer sort of hive mind dependent? Yes. Do you know? And if they are, what memory would they retain from this time where they're part of the hive mind? Have they been trapped in their own bodies during this stretch? Or are they kind of willing participants in what's happening? Like all I'm very curious for our first glimpses of someone who has been like deprogrammed for exactly this reason. Like what is that revelation of where have they been in a consciousness sense? Yeah, exactly. Last but not least. And I and I I love this frequent this frequency plus cell phone service.
27:05It checks. I mean, it checks all the boxes in terms of what's been happening in the show and what Pluribus is signaling to us is kind of important.
27:12Joanna Robinson:And plus it was like right in front of our faces the whole time of the opening credits is a very Vince Gilligan thing to do. I don't know if people like were in the Better Call Saul soup when he spelled out the return of a character via the episode titles of a season like that was just diabolical work from Vince Gilligan. So last but not least, before we get into the episode, this very lengthy mailbag section. This is not a mailbag thing. I just want to point this out as watching Carol collapse into Zojo's arms or watching Minusos have to get rescued out of the jungle. I was thinking about the theme of Breaking Bad, Better Call Saul and Pluribus, which is about in Better Call Saul and Breaking Bad.
27:52Joanna Robinson:It's this like slow seduction of a main character into the less a lesser version of them. Yes, I guess is what I will say. In Better Call Saul, we watch Jimmy McGill become Saul. in Breaking Bad we watch Walt become Heisenberg you know what I mean and so Carol as much as we're saying this is like a slow down version watching Carol go from as independent as someone who demands their spirits is restocked by a bunch of people to utter collapse to inside of this episode taking a more sort of Kumba approach to everything right she's like I'll get the Rolls Royce I'll you know I'll have the fancy meal I'll do all these things and And then into Zosia's arms is actually an accelerated version of that sort of abandoning your principles for something.
28:46I think the difference in those two journeys is in your Better Call Saul's and your Breaking Bad. Some of the question at the end is like, if you make that transition into Heisenberg, what is left of Walter White? Right. Like, is he still in there or is it been completely papered over? Right. I don't think we worry about that so much with Carol because it's been like 30 days of concentrated isolation, basically have just broken her will. And she's like so upsettingly lonely. And just like, and I think the diminishing returns of all these things that she tried to kumbify to make her life somewhat meaningful.
29:19Like she's just looking at the same George O 'Keefe painting on her wall. It's like, this isn't doing it for me like it did a month ago. Carol's still in there. She's just like deeply upset and deeply alone and so desperate that she would make the one call she basically never wanted to make, which was like, can someone please come back here even though that someone doesn't exist in the form that would be recognizable to her.
29:39Joanna Robinson:And she couldn't even say it. No. She had to go to the supply store, get the paint and the roller and sort of write it because she couldn't bring herself to get on the phone and say, come back. Did you know about one in three people with plaque psoriasis may also develop psoriatic arthritis, which causes joint pain, stiffness and swelling? Does this sound like you? Listen to what it sounds like to be a million miles away.
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31:45Joanna Robinson:Let's talk about Carol's Carol Act One. Carol's best day is sort of how the writers talked about how they wanted to to lay this out. right Carol's going to the hot springs she's going to the golf course she's getting a new car she's getting dressed up she's going to the Georgia O 'Keeffe museum the singing to herself I was very like interested in this and they said that this is based on there's a TV show that they love called Alone that's on the History Channel where they basically drop airdrop survivalist competition shows yeah and they're all alone I guess except for the camera crew or do they have like GoPros mounted on them I think it's more GoPros mounted and they're given cameras to kind of Turn on and.
32:24OK, so they are like. Testimonial.
32:25Joanna Robinson:Blair witching their way. Pretty much. OK. So that often times those people on those shows start singing because they can't handle the silence. That this is like a human instinct thing to do is to start to sing to yourself to break the silence. Carol, I guess, can't listen to podcasts or audio books. I had that thought, too. I don't know if she has the Internet. Zoom is working for the Unlicked, but she doesn't have the Internet. But she at least has some mix CDs, it seems. Right. So she can't, you know, catch up on her backlog of the Prestige TV podcast. So she has to sing to herself. How did all of this work for you?
33:00Well, we haven't finished the season yet. Like maybe she will get to episode nine. And she'll be like, what happened in the pit?
33:05Joanna Robinson:Yeah. What mid-season check-in, you know? I'm like I'm real into the severance theories. I do think, you know, it's so funny watching kind of the parallel journeys with Carol and Manusos. Because Manusos is like trying to figure out ways to basically connect with Carol, right? Like he's trying to learn English. Like he's going through his lines. Like he is making this incredible journey and drive to connect with her and meet with her. And Carol's like trying to figure out how to be alone. Yeah. She's trying to figure out how do I do this and not go insane. And it's singing to herself in the car.
33:35It's doing all the things you said. It's going to the museum. It's really following all the listener suggestions that had been in our inbox in terms of the things they would do. But just them being in such different places, which makes sense given their circumstances. Yeah. But I thought the singing was especially evocative of that. Like I need to hear a human voice even if it's mine. And it cannot be the answering machine that I'm calling every time I need a Gatorade.
33:54Joanna Robinson:But I do think that's why, you know, we did get a lot of listener emails saying, like, please, for the love of God, can she ask them to shorten the voicemail? I don't need to hear it every time. But I think Carol needs to hear it every time. Even though she puts the phone on speaker and, like, goes off to do something. Like, she does like, who doesn't like listening to Patrick Fabian's voice, honestly? But, like, she does like listening to it. They purposely contrast the procurement of gasoline, right? Carol does his very indulgent like bring me an ice cold Gatorade turn on this pump sort of thing her very classic like stock my sprouts versus Minusos eating dog food and siphoning gas out of the very and leaving money behind as he does it you know and refusing the bottle of water.
34:35Joanna Robinson:Right, right. I mean, I think that's one of the other contrast points between them. It's like Minusos is, he's almost like trying to live in a society without a society. Yeah. Everyone is gone, but if he takes the gas, he's going to leave the money. When it comes time to like take refuge, he's going to sleep in one of the few places that would actually give him refuge, which is on the floor of a church. He's just like bunking up in the nearest mansion. Right. And Carol's not exactly taking advantage of like every luxurious exploit she could, but she's going to take the painting off the wall and take it home with her.
35:01Joanna Robinson:And I'm not critiquing Carol because she has like in contrast to the other unliked, she has been a real holdout. But then you can contrast her. And we talked about this earlier. The sprouts versus the dog food that like Munusos kicking over the like, you know, cooked meal and all that sort of stuff like that. That this was just an extreme more extreme level of what Carol thinks she's holding out. And Munusos is really holding out. But this did feel like a letting go episode for Carol. She did the investigative journalism. She presented her findings to Kumba. And it's like, no one cares about what I care about.
35:35Right. And so all I can kind of do is go home and I guess live whatever life I can live.
35:40Joanna Robinson:Well, but part of that is she doesn't have a purpose anymore. Because she had this investigation and she's like, I'm going to figure it out and I'm going to save the world. Yeah. And then was just roundly rejected and John Cena-fied and like set packing. Well, her purpose is being a scratch golfer. It is a lifetime pursuit, as I understand it. Fair enough. But like Manusos has a part. He's like, I got to learn English. It's a great point. Machete my way through the Darien Gap and get to Carol. OK, I want to talk about the painting for a second. This is Bella Donna, Georgia O 'Keeffe painting. Georgia O 'Keeffe, real boss.
36:13Joanna Robinson:There was a great Georgia O 'Keeffe exhibit that I saw at the Chicago Institute of Art last year, and I just think she's incredible. But I love this story about this particular painting. painting so uh she painted this when she was on uh she was in hawaii a trip was sponsored by the dole pineapple company which had commissioned o 'keeffe to paint a pineapple plant for use as an advertisement this three-month trip proved immensely inspiring for o 'keeffe and she returned home with numerous sketches photographs and paintings including this one belladonna none of these paintings however was of a pineapple when o 'keeffe finally painted the requested pineapple it was from a plant the company sent to her in new york following her return from hawaii she's like i'll take your dole money i'll go to hawaii i'll get a lot of inspiration and later i'll do your shitty little pineapple drawing fucking phenomenal she's a boss she's a g so i i wish i had that in me you know we all we all need a little more george o 'keefe in us just to channel from time to time and i will say like i've i don't think we've ever seen carol happier in this show than the first time she goes to the george o 'keefe museum right i mean on the one hand no comment on the other hand like i think it is like her taking the painting is her first kind of acceptance of like this is a thing that i want that i've been kind of like not allowing myself to do yet i've been eating tv dinners i've been doing all this other stuff i've been living kind of within the normal confines of what my life was i would never be able to take this painting home but i'm gonna do it yeah and i love i love that she had the poster of it and she's like oh I just got to replace it.
37:43Joanna Robinson:I'll just have the real thing. Anything you want to say about Carol's dining out? It's cloche city on the table here. She's just got the best of. Yeah. I mean, they look great. Yeah. I mean, I don't know about the coursing specifically. Is that French toast is the first like Martha's Vineyard dish? Yeah. And then there's like a micro green. I love a micro greens bowl, but it just seemed like. Well, it seemed like a mushroom rice with micro greens on top. Sort of situation. Okay. Risotto. But I don't know. It looked a little longer grain to me. Sounds delicious. I mean I'm down for If we do a travel show Rob it's going to have to be a foodie travel show I mean you're not going to hear an argument from me But I support Carolyn Coming out of the cloche is ultimately what I'm saying She's finally allowed herself to do this Okay you could say coming out of the cloche but you could not say Why Carol enjoys a Georgia O 'Keeffe exhibit At the museum I thought it spoke for itself I will say just because my brain is cooked And you know this because we did a West Wing podcast Where I said Westworld like nine times Instead of West Wing I had to be edited out The player piano at the dinner playing I Will Survive Like was giving me real Westworld vibes So I did check to see what else was on offer What else is on the iPad It did hurt me a little bit that she scrolled right on past Robin's dancing on my own on that list Look it's an episode full of like quite on the nose music cues Georgia on my mind, it's getting hot in here You know as one does when they're slowly going insane in isolation But it's like, you know, maybe it would have been a very girls thing to do, but I would have appreciated the dancing on my own interlude.
39:15Joanna Robinson:Do you think this was these were other songs they considered but couldn't get clearance for? So they were like, I did have that question. Like, do you have to pay R.E.M. if you're going to sing seven seconds of the end of the world? As we know, they talked about this in the official pod. They had to clear everything. Had to clear everything. Yeah. Shout out to all these like these artists, these musicians, these bands getting money for Racy Horn's, you know, stirring performance of Hot and Her. thank you for doing here the correct pronunciation that's what it is okay menisos uh siphoning gasoline learning english um oh the so the guy who rolls up to him and is like offering him water and giving him like facts about dehydration like very zoja coded like here are some facts for you that's a stunt guy really who they just like thought was had a very cheerful demeanor so they're like he'll be perfect for this and he was i thought he was really He seems like an amazing hang.
40:05I would have taken the bottle of water, I think.
40:07Joanna Robinson:Yeah, I mean. But this is the difference between me and Manusos. Slippery slope, man. I guess. Slippery slope. He's a very principled man. Slippery slope, not unlike the one he tumbles down straight into the plan. Well, let me ask you this. Now that Manusos has asked for help, right? He reached for the heavens. He got medevaced out of the forest. Last resort, certainly. Do you think there's any part of him that's going to be more open to asking for the Carol level things on the other side of this? Some like the basic, like, can I not eat dog food? Could you bring me some food even if I cook it myself?
40:37Joanna Robinson:I think he's going to be judgmental of her, you know, relenting even as much as she has. I think that part is, I think, if he shows up and Carol is in Zoja's arms, yeah, he's going to have some thoughts. Tough. Veska, when he talked about his performance in the sequence, he said a note that he got again and again was to not look too tired or too stressed and don't cry. Because it's just sort of like this is supposed to be like a hopeful journey for him. That is, you know, we see him trudging and dehydrated at the end. He needs to sort of work up to that. But also just sort of like to make this feel like I'm working towards something.
41:10Joanna Robinson:I'm not just sitting alone in this room, you know, dialing the radio frequencies. I've got something to do for the first time in, you know, a couple weeks. Completely. I mean, and it's beautiful, right? Like the scenery, again, the resilience of that moment and that journey and that character, which is what makes it so heartbreaking when he can't ultimately get where he needs to go. But it's like, again, it's a human like who's trying to prove something that like I don't need to be airlifted to New Mexico. Like I can do this. I don't need you. And as he as he says really directly, everything you would offer me is not yours to give in the first place.
41:43So why would I possibly accept it?
41:45Joanna Robinson:So badass. Question for you. If you were to make this journey. Yeah. Would you bother to shave and trim your hair and do all the other grooming stuff that Manusas decides to do on this journey? Absolutely not. You're on full beard, like getting real beardy. Yeah, I think in this scenario, I am Will Forte in Last Man on Earth. Like I'm living in pretty much some version of abject filth. I'm certainly not as presentable as him. But again, this is part of him like continuing his, like what he sees is like his obligations to the world around him, right? He's a participant in this larger thing. And that means trimming your hair.
42:21That means shaving. That means being a normal human person.
42:23Joanna Robinson:Keeping up appearances of everything. I will leave money on this windshield for a person who is no longer anywhere near this vehicle. No. Just in case society returns to itself. I need to have order and, yeah, this illusion of, you know, similar to back when he was in the storage, you know, facility. And he was just like, sorry for this. Yes. Leaving the notes. I will leave a note. I mean, I would say even to like a maybe OCD degree, right? To an obsessive or maybe coping mechanism degree, right? It's either I'm hanging on to this thread because it's the only thing that's keeping me feeling like the world might come back.
42:59Or it's I just have an innate sense of order and I personally need to do these things whether the apocalypse is happening or not.
43:05Joanna Robinson:I have a really important question for you next. Okay. We get two vanity license plates inside of this episode. Yes. The Rolls Royce that Carol picks up, the license plate is Ace Baby. Ace Baby. And the license plate on Manuso's beloved car that he burnt is Elfritz. we talked before we started recording a little bit about what ace baby might mean I think it's tennis related I mean when you're picking up from the country club especially the valet parking at the country club what's the just married car like was the reception at the country club is that why the just married car is there I guess so okay that part does make sense and conspicuously right there in the background during Carol and Zosia's big embrace you know just the just married blinking sign in the background as Carol wears I believe her like you know pluribus blue shirt as is customary at this point.
43:52And Zosia pulls up in her pluribus blue car. You know, the color theory is really popping off this week, Joe.
43:57Joanna Robinson:Okay. El Fritz, a couple options here. First of all, the car is always on the Fritz. Yeah. So that could be a fun nickname for it. Yes. But also Fritz is a German name, abbreviation of Friedrich, which translates to peaceful lord. So just some options. If you have other thoughts, lickingthedonit at gmail.com. Please. What El Fritz could refer to. Rob, really important question. If you were to have a vanity license plate, Oh my God. What would it say? Well, first of all, I just want to say I regard you as a peaceful lord. This is kind of the energy that you put into the world. Luffritz. Vanity license plate.
44:29Honestly, it's so like antithetical to my personality. I don't mean to dismiss your bid, but like I don't think I could bring myself to do it.
44:35Joanna Robinson:Yeah, you just no butted my yes and moment. That's fine. Maybe yes and is the license plate I need. Can I say that I think that I've thought about this for years. I've thought about like am I a vanity license plate person and I've never been able to come up with. I have an idea. I'm not going to say it in case somebody takes it. But like I have one idea that I'm kind of interested in. OK. But more than anything, and this is just like worse than I think it would have any license plate. I want the California plate that's the black with the gold numbers on it. Quite elegant. Right. And so like. Is it black or is it like a deep brewing blue?
45:10Yeah, exactly.
45:10Joanna Robinson:And so it's like I want that aesthetic more than I even need like an actual word on there. I've often wondered. If that makes me more Kuma than anything else, then I'll just embrace my inner, you know. I don't think it's that at all. But I do think there is an overlap between if you're a tattoo person and a vanity license plate person. There's a similar like I want to make a permanent public statement about something regarding me. That thing is like I don't think I mean, I'm ineffable. I don't think there's a word that can encompass when I am. There's never been any doubt. You are ineffable. All right.
45:45Joanna Robinson:I have something really important to tell you. This is actually the most important thing I have to tell you. This has been a very important podcast. The Chunga tree. Yep. Did you look up the Chunga tree? Of course I did. Did you see what an alternate name for the Chunga tree is? I did not. It is, I am pleased to tell you, in some places referred to as Chumbawamba. What? I mean, Minusos did get knocked down and he got up again. Yeah, and they're never going to keep him down. They're never going to. um i could not believe this i have gone my entire life without bothering to figure out what chumba wumba means and it means the chunga tree you're blowing my mind look at the dot gmail.com if if you think that band had something else in mind when they uh i didn't like go when they were yeah yeah uh you know when they're drinking a whiskey drink a lot of drink yeah exactly um the chunga tree though the chunga palm i've seen it referred to too just the the single most not fuck with the tree I've ever seen in my life.
46:43I am staying in a hotel.
46:47Joanna Robinson:I am not a person who usually does this. I screamed a little scream when he fell back and got impaled on the tree. Awful. It was so bad. And Vince Gilligan on the official pod said he watched that edit like 90 times. And every single time he like gasped. It's so bad because there's the shot, of course, where he comes face to face with the tree and he's like, close call. And then he his ankle turns on that rock. he grasps for the vine that can't hold his weight and then it's just like it's that moment in a fall where you know it's gonna happen and you know it's gonna be bad well see I was the opposite in a way because I did know it was gonna be bad I was expecting ankle twist compound fracture like horrible leg injury as often happens if you're hiking in like really unstable terrain and I just thought oh we've moved past the spike trees you know the booby traps we're past it but unfortunately you are never past them I love the way that that was shot as he was sort of navigating around them.
47:41Joanna Robinson:And they, you know, Adam Bernstein, the director, talked about like that they're almost this living menace. Yeah. He has to like, you know, like the T-Rex, if you move too fast, it'll see the motion sort of attitude. But it's a very like Predator Badlands. The forest will kill you. But also Veska talked about how in some cultures that tree is so some people treat that tree as like the scariest, most threatening tree. And for some cultures, that tree is the tree that they use to build all of their buildings. And so it is like a holy tree, a friend tree. And I was sort of thinking about that as like a hive mind idea of sort of like, is the hive mind a friendly tree, the tree that, you know, builds everything for you?
48:25Joanna Robinson:Or is it going to impale you such that you then have to cauterize your own wounds with a red hot machete? See, I was thinking more Carol. It's like a little prickly on the outside. May wound you for life. Right. But ultimately could be quite stable under the right circumstances. The scars that you carry will be worth the journey of spending time with Carol. I mean, we'll have to ask Helen about that. Who's to say? The belt in his mouth, like the whole thing. It was so hard to watch. Really, really hard. Yeah. All right. Anything. Oh, I do. Okay. So on terms of Carol Act 2, I just want to underline something.
48:59Joanna Robinson:We've been talking about the clock. so we get a day count of how long Carol has been alone but from a friend of the pod Matt Mitovich sent me this quote from his Inside Line newsletter from Ray Sehorne where she said the Carol Zoja hug was a tough scene to film we did a lot of takes of varying levels on that one director Adam Bernstein and Vince both were reminding me that the isolation period that she goes through has taken a massive effect and even though I filmed it as one episode for Carol it was in excess of 30 days and she had no idea what the end in sight was. So like excess of 30 days of shagging balls off a parking garage, which may or may not have been a Better Call Saul.
49:40Joanna Robinson:There's a parking garage that used a bunch of Better Call Saul with similar yellow paint on the pillars. So I was wondering if that was the same location. But 30 days of like, how long do you think you could go by yourself? I mean, this is the premise of Alone, as you were saying. And like really the challenge they're putting the competitors through. even the people who have gamified it and prepared for it like you can really see them absolutely snapping at a certain point and i think especially it's one thing if you're fighting for resources like that and so minussos's case is very distinct from carol's if you're living comfortably actually here's my question if you're living comfortably but still isolated would like the like would that combination of factors make it worse you're if you're used if you're thinking I'm roughing it in every possible respect and I'm alone.
50:27But the discord of like, I have all these comforts, but no one to share it with, no one to talk about it with, no one to identify with in any possible way. I could actually see that making it kind of worse. To answer your question, I would last like three days. I would be a mess.
50:40Joanna Robinson:Do you have your DVD collection, though? Oh, you're right. Physical media does save us. No physical media three days with physical media? Eternity, Joe. Yeah, I think so. Would I be happy? No. Would I be talking to a volleyball? Absolutely. but that's what you got to do but would your criterion collection like watch through be complete yes but if you log something on letterboxd and no one can read it does it make a sound eternal question you know like does it really count and no one's impaled does it count i have a couple requests for our listeners uh first of all i we're gonna i want to talk about the very end of this obviously the fireworks and all of that but um we're gonna do an a year end uh we're Basically, we're going to do the pluribus finale.
51:21Joanna Robinson:And then as part of that episode, we're going to do a sort of like year-end mailbag. You've already solicited some emails online. But I just want to make sure that people know. PrestigeTV at Spotify.com or LickingTheDonutAtGmail.com if they have questions, comments, concerns. Or any of our previous emails. We do still get all of them. So if you're a slow horses person, you really want to email ArstTimeThePopeAtGmail.com. We got a pineapple bobbing email this week. I mean, look, people have their allegiances and I support them. Also if you have ideas for what Rob should put on his vanity license plate When he finally gets California plates on his cars Do it out me on this podcast Allegedly You doxed yourself on rewatchables Do you remember that?
51:59No comment on anything that's happening
52:02Joanna Robinson:Lickingthedonutetmail.com if you have an idea for it Pigeon hater with an 8 for the hater It's a lot of letters Like P-G-N-H-8 We'll workshop it But spiritually obviously Okay. Or for me, if you have ideas for what I should get. And we will auction off Joe's actual idea for charity. Absolutely not. We're going to throw that up. We're going to go to the highest bidder. If you want to know what Joanna Robinson will put on her vanity plate, we will sell it to you. What I think encompasses me. Yeah. But it's not just like what you think encompasses. You want people on the road to be like, oh, she is that.
52:34It kind of has to be a bit, you know? It can't be just cut to the core of who you are. It's like, I'm cutting to the core, but in a winking way just for you.
52:41Joanna Robinson:Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, I was going to dox myself with what my bumper sticker says. I'm not going to do that. You know, that's... Coexist. I don't know. Honestly, how dare you?
52:56Joanna Robinson:All right. The Booyah Jams of 2006. We're playing. We're bumping. Yeah. We get the fire. Okay. This is sort of the last big question I have. Before we get to Age of Aquarius in Portuguese, I believe. Close out the episode. what do you make of all the sort of like patriotism that comes from Carolyn? She's singing Star Stripes Forever. She's playing it. She's getting the firecracker. I was like, is it the 4th of July? Is she honoring 4th of July all by herself? Yeah. But it just felt very like performative Americana. Yes. Rugged individualism. As we know, both in the show and one of our favorite things, rugged American individualism.
53:36Joanna Robinson:Is that what my license plate should say? Rugged individualist? Yeah, rugged USA. I think that'll work out. I mean, obviously the American. I think I'll get the exact kind of attention I want. I think so. We're really finding it, Joe. This is what podcasting is all about. We're just here to narrow, narrow, narrow, and we finally landed on the permanent idea. This is how you yes and Rob, not no but a bitch. But this is you yes and yourself from like three bits ago. You know what? And sometimes you got to podcast with yourself. It's absolutely true. The American part is clearly there, clearly textual.
54:05Right. I also think a lot of it, too, is just like the pomp and circumstance, right? It's like if you are one of the last people left on Earth and having no human contact, I think one of the things you would crave is not just having your friends over for dinner. It's like the big communal stuff. It's the holidays. It's celebrating. It's something like fireworks. Who's going to put on fireworks for you other than you unless you ask the hive mind to do it? And that's kind of against the point of wanting it in the first place.
54:31Joanna Robinson:I will say this. having been to several 4th of July events where people have sort of put on their own backyard firework show which I think might be illegal here I never did it but I did watch it even like city by city wildly different regulations a lot of fire hazards here in California etc I would much rather say hey hive mind you don't have to get anywhere near me come back to downtown Albuquerque put on a massive firework show sourcing the hive mind knowledge of fire safety and I want like you you want like the big big show especially and I don't know like what firework shows were like for you growing up but if you ever tried to do the firework show in San Francisco fog cover means that like often you're just getting like colored clown above you very different vibe yeah yeah yeah but I think you're missing some fundamental parts what am I missing I mean one the time on our tradition of getting drunk and lighting fireworks correct which is really what she's after.
55:31Right. The whole comprehensive experience. She's like, I don't need all my fingers. No.
55:33Joanna Robinson:No. And also just lighting stuff on fire. Like that's part of the appeal of setting off the fireworks yourself. Like, yes, it's great to go to the big show and set up your chairs and have fun. But like. By yourself. Also lighting the stuff on fire is part of the appeal. Questionable whether or not this should be in the podcast at all. But I will just ask you, Carol decides to like maybe let a firecracker take her out. Yeah. At one point in this. Stares it down. What would you absolutely not do if you were at the end of the rope? It's been you're burned through your physical media collection. You're out of patience, out of time, out of hope.
56:06Joanna Robinson:What are the things you're not wanting to do? Because a firecracker to the face. This is the thing. Is tough. I think anything fire oriented should really be off the table. I mean, look, a very low moment for Carol. I'm sure like a weak moment where she's just on the brink of a lot of things. I don't think the firecracker is what you want. I don't think anything that is a flame. Right. Is really the answer in those kinds of situations. and really at the end of your life in any way, period. Okay. Well, it's just something I'm thinking about. Death? Okay. Anything else you want to say about this episode of television?
56:41I have not listened to The Watch yet as they discuss this episode, but the good news for Chris Ryan, the hive mind in clearing out the shelves of every store for all of the food, for all the valuable stuff, the cigarettes are still there. The zins are still there. Whatever he would prefer to get him through the long night. this is very important we salute our friend Chris
56:59Joanna Robinson:we do CR we love you okay one dart into the breach at a time alright look at the donut at gmail.com press tcv at spotify.com take care of yourself don't do anything we wouldn't do send us your vanity license plate ideas what a real joy to be with you in person Rob Mahoney I think it's the last time we're going to see each other before the end of the year so happy holidays in person but we'll be back with more pluribus before the year is out just like creepily over zoom And that's it. Bye.
57:55The sun is relentless, but so is our gear. Level up your summer at Columbia.com to spend more time outside and less time slathering on aloe lotion. You're welcome. Columbia. Engineered for whatever.
From the publisher
Jo and Rob traversed the gap to give you their thoughts on the latest episode of Apple TV’s ‘Pluribus’.
(0:00) Intro
(2:24) The odyssey of Episode 7
(12:18) Questions from the inbox
(29:09) Act 1: Carol’s best day
(37:04) Act 2: The Manousos journey
(50:34) Carol’s patriotism
Email us! prestigetv@spotify.com or lickingthedonut@gmail.com
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Hosts: Joanna Robinson and Rob Mahoney
Producer: Donnie Beacham Jr.
Additional Production Support: Justin Sayles
Video Supervision: Jon Jones
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