‘The Pitt’ Season 2, Episode 7: The Night Shift Starts Early

4:37Jo:It's just like everything that the pit can be for me, which is in particular juggling wave after wave of chaos, like rippling through the ED as we have a holiday with a heat wave stacked on top of it with all these diversions stacked on top of it and now like an incoming blackout that I'm sure will cause even more chaos. And then counterpoint, this like incredibly still, incredibly delicate, incredibly painful portrayal of what comes next for a sexual assault survivor.

5:06Rob:I think we were curious. I'm still curious about some of the characters and what their plot lines are going to be. We got maybe an indication that Mel King's, that Mel's sister, you know, if she's not feeling well, odds are she's probably going to wind up in the hospital at some point in the season. Hopefully something very mild, but like, but I mean, I don't think they have that phone call if she's not going to show up at some point at the hospital this season.

5:31Jo:What if it's just to end the season with both of them watching fireworks and eating ice cream? Couldn't it be that?

5:36Rob:With their headphones on. I love that for them. But we were, we were wondering about Dana and sort of like what sort of, you know, other than instructing Emma, which is like very important and being a boss bitch, which is very important. Like what, what is going to be one of her bigger storylines this season? And I thought this episode, we'll talk about that storyline probably at the end of our discussion today because we don't want it sort of like in proximity to talking about microwaving vegetables or whatever the case may be. But I thought that was really, really good. Really, really handled really, really well.

6:06Rob:And I think everyone had something interesting to do in this episode. The furry force, we mentioned furries in last week's episode. We did. It went out on social media, broke a little bit of containment, I would say, on social media as well. Anthrocon being the event of the season in Pittsburgh. We got a lot of emails from folks in Pittsburgh about this thing, and they're like, oh, you have no idea how big of a deal this is. Melissa said that the con brings in$20 million to the city every year. Wow. That's incredible.

6:37Jo:If we know one thing about furries, like, those suits are not cheap. These are people who are willing to spend for their hobby, and we support it.

6:43Rob:They know how to spend. Melissa said the businesses surrounding the Westin-Pittsburgh Hotel often have posted furry specials, and it's not unusual to see giant animals out and about in restaurants, at Pirates games, and just hanging out at the karaoke bar. Tremendous. This sounds really fun. Should we go to Pittsburgh in July next year?

6:57Jo:I think we're obligated to. Okay, research. Maybe season finale for this season of The Pit.

7:02Rob:Okay, well, it'll still be happening in July. Great point. It'll feel that way a little bit.

7:07Jo:It might.

7:08Rob:Spotify sent us to FurryCon. Also, our listener, Matt, sent us a really harrowing story about the bed bug epidemic during AnthroCon. Oh, no. just because like bed bugs are an issue, but like especially so when you're walking around with a fursuit. And he said, quote, you have to kill bed bugs with high heat, like the highest setting on your dryer for at least half an hour. Something very difficult to do with fursuits and especially the heads. So what do you do? He didn't have any solutions. He just presented problems. Oh boy. So, you know, something to think. Well, Matt did volunteer to send us tips and tricks on how to avoid bed bugs when we stay at hotels.

7:46Rob:So maybe he'll follow up. I'll take that. Yeah. On the sort of cross-contamination front, our listener in Marina wrote in to say her partner is a paramedic, and his biggest glove pet peeve on the pit is when the providers cross their arms and hold their bicep area with the gloves on. This is the Dr. Robbie special. Yes. She said doctors side bangs McKay, Robbie, and being the most common offenders. I can, like, see Robbie doing it. They're constantly on the fleece, constantly. That is true. Cross-contamination. How do you feel about that? I mean, I don't think it's as bad as the poop glove on the curtain, which was the inciting incident for this.

8:23Rob:That one's a problem. Yeah.

8:24Jo:I think most of the time, look, it's in the preliminary stages of the examination. It's not a contamination issue so much as like they're putting on gloves to protect themselves from whatever they're about to touch. Like from that perspective, hands on biceps doesn't seem as bad. But yeah, if you're taking a sample that needs to be tested in any way, we've got huge problems. especially Robbie is doing it mostly I think just as part of his like rumpled persona.

8:47Rob:Yeah, his like paternal vibe sort of thing. Dr.

8:50Jo:Bangs, I mean a little more sass to be honest with you sometimes. I'll be on the lookout for it. I think it's a critical part of her energy. It's just hard to put a finger on exactly which part of it it is.

9:01Rob:A fun fact, we did get clarification on what condiment hoarding is. Do you feel like you understand it based on the emails?

9:07Jo:Well, we got many different potential explanations. But a common one. The most convincing one, and what I'm certainly guilty of, is when you receive condiments through takeout or something else, putting it in your fridge, putting it in a bin, putting it in some collection or container, and then you just amass all these packets that you probably will never use, but how could I throw away a packet of Chick-fil-A buffalo sauce?

9:29Rob:Okay, is it a drawer situation? Do you have a drawer of soy sauce, hot sauce, et cetera, et cetera?

9:34Jo:I don't, but there is a section of my fridge that has been kind of sub-designated for it now. Okay. Because the OCD in me won't allow them to run free and also won't allow me to throw them away. But also I lack the follow through to actually use them.

9:47Rob:Follow question. Is this is it is it like a Tupperware container? Is it like a where are we putting the package? Yeah, yeah.

9:53Jo:I just bought a bigger bin. Yeah. Refrigerator bin from the container store. One of my favorite places on Earth.

9:58Rob:I knew this about you. I know this about you.

10:01Jo:And just used it to contain butter, yogurt, other things. And at the front, there's just like a little portion section for here's where the sauces go.

10:08Rob:Okay, so it's like a general dairy sort of situation. Plus sauce. Plus packets. That I will never use. Okay, great.

10:15Jo:Are you not guilty of this? Do you not hoard sauces? I don't. I mean, it must be nice to be perfect.

10:22Rob:I just think that like, they just like sauces, napkins, utensils or whatever, the accoutrement that come in takeout, they just sort of accumulate in the drawer. And then like, I'll hold on to the napkins. The napkins, because they can always have a use. Sure. But other things, they have to go. Use them or lose them. That's how I feel about it.

10:41Jo:It's very wise of you. I wish I had that level of, I guess, restraint in not keeping them in the first place, but I am who I am.

10:48Rob:Would you say your multi-use container store situation in your fridge is the oddest piece of storage you have in your fridge, or would you care to explain anything? Like, do you have one of those things that, like, where you put your various LaCroix cans, like a dispenser sort of situation?

11:05Jo:Most of those I find pretty useless. Even like, you know, you can buy plastic bins for your eggs. It's like, why are we taking the eggs out of the carton and putting them into a bin?

11:13Rob:I'll tell you what I do.

11:14Jo:Please.

11:15Rob:I take them out of the carton and I put them in a bowl. Why? Because then you can just reach into the fridge and grab the eggs you need rather than having to open the thing every time.

11:23Jo:But they could also break more easily, potentially.

11:26Rob:But they never have. Yet. All right.

11:30Jo:So you refuse to lift one flap to get an egg.

11:33Rob:Yeah.

11:34Jo:All right.

11:35Rob:There's no need to do it every time.

11:37Jo:I gotta say, this is even more incomprehensible than putting them in an egg bin of some kind. Just a loose bowl? Like they're a bunch of lemons?

11:44Rob:Yeah, it's like kind of an aesthetic thing, too. I mean, that it is. It's like fetching, you know? And maybe French.

11:49Jo:Are you like a farmhouse-style person?

11:52Rob:Well, I don't know. Farmhouse is a bad rep these days. It's very live, laugh, love. And I don't think I'm like that kind of thing.

11:57Jo:Not trying to put you in that egg bucket, but you know.

11:59Rob:Yeah, exactly. All right, Dr. Sarah was talking about, We were talking about Dr. Mohan and her patient last week who was, again, sort of like looking for her this week, the elderly patient. Right. Who she runs the D-dimer test for, you know, every few months or something like that or once a month, whatever it was. And I was – we were talking about how this idea to like manage anxiety. But our listener, Sarah, who is a doctor, said, actually, we try to discourage patients from coming in and getting needless tests because it actually ratchets up their anxiety. And we try to manage it in a different way.

12:33Rob:She said this case seems kind of isolated and consistent and the guy goes on his merry way and he's fine. So she's not critiquing Samira in this case. But this is what she said as part of a larger email. I think a really important role in medicine, and Dr. Sarah says not to toot my own horn, but for primary care in particular, is just to be there for the patient, acknowledge that they are suffering, validate their symptoms without necessarily pulling the trigger on an evaluation we know is going to be useless. And I just wanted to say to Dr. Sarah and all of the primary care physicians out there or whoever, in my early 20s, I went through, I don't know if I ever told you this, that I like, I thought I had some sort of like heart condition and I didn't.

13:15Rob:But I went to, you know, urgent care a couple times and like asked them to, because I was like, something was going on. I was like, not able to sleep. It was this whole thing. And I think like the third or fourth time I went in, this like kindly country doctor sat me down and he was like, has anyone ever talked to you about the way anxiety manifests in the body? He was so nice about it. But he was just like, you're in your early 20s. You don't have a heart problem. Let's talk about this. And then I never had that problem again. I just needed someone to like listen to me. That's incredible. Validate my like physical experience and then just be like, but this is a mental condition.

13:51Rob:And I was like, ah, also. So, you know.

13:54Jo:This is the reason you and I are not doctors, because when we were talking about this, it seemed reasonable to us to like, oh, alleviate this man's anxiety with this test. Dr. Sarah Reilly points out, what if you didn't treat the symptoms and instead treated the root cause? Exactly. Or at least like tried to prevent the exacerbation of it. But I'm with you that ultimately, if you could just have a kindly country doctor in your life who can sit you down and talk to you about anxiety, that seems like the best case solution for everybody.

14:17Rob:That guy was my favorite. He was the best. He's like, you remind me of my daughters. And I was like, great. Okay, tell me more. Speaking of sort of how you would want to be treated, our listener Blair asked, in an email where Blair was a bit defending Ogilvy, not my favorite thing that anyone's ever done, that's fine. But Blair was asking who we would most want to treat us were we admitted at the pit.

14:39Jo:Great question. Do you have an answer? Do you have a go-to?

14:42Rob:I think I would want Mel King. I think that's a kind of energy I would really respond to in that situation because Mel is like friendly, but also just like incredibly analytical and a very calming presence, I think. So that would be my pick, I think.

14:56Jo:I think I might pick Samir Mohan for the same reason.

14:59Rob:Yeah.

14:59Jo:I think once you get up into, for one, if you get into the attendings, they're just constantly being pulled away from you at all times. So you want someone who's a little lower down, who can actually spend time listening to what you need. And a lot of the characters that I love on this show, like I love Santos. Her bedside manner isn't always the best. That's why I find her to be a compelling character.

15:19Rob:What if she sings to you, Rob? Well.

15:22Jo:I've mixed feelings about a show tune, but I can be serenaded. I know. I'm willing.

15:26Rob:This is why we'll never be best friends, but that's okay. Jeff, who works on this show, allegedly, I did look his name up. I went through a whole thing. I believe that Jeff is on the up and up that he works on this show.

15:38Jo:His credentials are legit.

15:40Rob:I couldn't quite find him on IMDb, but there was a Jeff Windsor on IMDb who also worked on Everything Everywhere all at once, and this is also hot dog related, so I choose to believe it's the same guy. He said, Thanks. This is to you. Thanks for the hot dog vomit shout out. If only you knew how many tests and how many hot dogs and buns I had to break up. Yes, we use real hot dogs. It was tedious. And then Jeff defends LaCroix berry flavor. And that's tough. Look for Jeff. But anyway, great work, Jeff, on the hot dog vomit. Completely. And thanks for writing in.

16:10Jo:It really was beautiful in its way. Like a very specific hue of pink tan that can only be replicated by hot dogs. So the authenticity matters, I think, in this particular case. Cinema Verite is what we're doing here at The Pit.

16:23Rob:We love it. Last but not least, Nicholas had a response about our question about Mel King's screen time. And I confess I'm not entirely convinced by his answer here, but he did send this deadline link that was about sort of the pay scale structure on The Pit. Did you see this? Yeah, I did. Okay, so basically this is—it's a bit unusual how they did this. But basically when they put out the casting call for the show, they basically put out the roles at various tiers per episode, which is an unusual way to get paid. And so it's like Noah Wiley makes whatever Noah Wiley makes. Yeah. A bajillion. Who knows?

17:00Rob:And then it's like 50K per episode for some and 35K an episode for someone else or something like that. And given the high number of episodes, that's a low rate. Not for you and me, but for actors in Hollywood. And it's kind of a low rate. But given how many episodes of The Pit there are every season, it adds up. But you can decide. I don't know what that means in terms of like, do you get paid a flat 50K if you're, let's say, Mel King and you're predominantly featured in the episode or you're Mel King and you're just like background in an episode? Are those rates different? I don't know if it's per episode.

17:36Rob:It seems like SAG rules shouldn't be different. They shouldn't. So then that doesn't really explain to me why Mel is like so background this season.

17:45Jo:Yeah, there must be just, I mean, I would think there's such a clearly articulated line between like regular and extra or on screen presence and extra or like background player. But I think this episode is a great example for Mel's case where she has kind of like two moments, I think, overall, like this call with her sister and an exchange with Robbie. Did she pop up anywhere in the episode in like a really present way?

18:06Rob:I would say in the scene. So after Langdon. Oh, this is true. She is in with Langdon. She's in with Langdon when he's like really floundering in front of Robbie and she's kind of trying to save his ass a bit. Hand holding him out of that thing.

18:17Jo:You're right. So she has a little more present in this episode than I gave her credit for. But the deposition is coming. And I would think that might be a clear out for Mel kind of like third of the episode kind of plot line when it does come.

18:29Rob:Yeah. I mean, it'll depend again if we're going like wherever the deposition is being held because presumably it's not in like trauma room five. So like.

18:36Jo:What if it is? Okay. What if it's just over a comatose patient or like over mid-surgery, you know?

18:43Rob:All right. So let's get into the episodes. Episode seven. To set the scene, it's boiling hot in chairs. People are fanning themselves with patient passports. There's a cooling room set up. That's Langdon's idea. Robbie has to begrudgingly give him credit for that. Great. He hates to do it. It's boiling hot, Rob Mahoney. Do you know why it's boiling hot? Why is that? Because Dr. Jack Abbott has arrived. Yeah. Fan yourself with that patient passport, buddy. every ounce of ACAB left my body when this when this sequence starts Abbott comes in with his pals I I it took me like the third time watching through the captions to understand that his like the guy that they're working on his name is Hero not that he's calling him Hero Hero with an I Hero with an I and a capital H and I was like because when he was calling him Hero with a low case H I was like okay even for this show

19:34Jo:that's a lie I know

19:37Rob:you should see me as a flight attendant yep great line they do this transected trachea neonatal thing all of that happens

19:44Jo:the burbling trachea yeah is really a visual really something I didn't know that I needed to see but I guess I did

19:51Rob:I usually prefer it when it's like a brook that's burbling and not someone's trachea but we do what we must at the pit so

19:57Jo:do you think it's soothing all the same like if you just played the sound of the trachea as like your white noise sleep sounds that's a great question

20:04Rob:but I think burbling on a tracheal matter also involves wheezing. Like you can't just have one without the other. There's gotta be a gasp. Yeah. And the wheezing is not soothing at all.

20:13Jo:Agreed.

20:14Rob:Here's the most important thing though. We get this scene with Samira. We certainly do. Robbie has a like built for gif only. I was about to say.

20:22Jo:Let's just trim it right now.

20:24Rob:Button hook on our little secret moment when she is attending to him shirtless. Here's, I don't know. You let me know about the Huckle Robbie thing and I should let you know that I got served my first organic bit of huckle-rabi content, and it was like an animation, and it was elaborate, and it was shocking to me. So that's great, and I support it. I support the internet.

20:47Jo:I'm wondering what was animated, but I don't want to know, I don't think.

20:50Rob:But Samira, Mohan, and Abbott has been one of the key fandom ships since season one. I went back and watched some, like there are many helpful edits of all of their five minutes of interaction in season one.

21:03Jo:I think I need one because we got some emails to this effect earlier in the season wondering if Abbott was going to come back and specifically to interact with Samira.

21:09Rob:Yeah.

21:10Jo:I think I just kind of like missed this or got lost in the sauce of like all of the pit fest trauma and didn't quite clock their relationship. At least the fan edited version of it.

21:21Rob:Here's why I will I will give you the download. Here's a key piece of information. Sean Haddesey, I think between seasons, dropped the lore on Dr. Jack Abbott that he is a widower. So this is information that we have now that we didn't have before. And guys, this is the most important part of the pit. So we're going to take some time on it. Towards the end of season one, when he comes in, and remember when the Pit Fest stuff kicks off, Abbott has all of his sort of like battlefield sort of like tricks and tips and equipment. And Samira says, what else you got in your go bag? And he says, oh, just wait and see.

22:00Rob:That is like a definitely flirty exchange they have. And then they do this whole thing. They do this whole procedure, an experimental procedure, that the surgical resident who is even in a worse mood than Garcia, if you recall her at the end of season one, is very – so she's just like yelling at them that they're being irresponsible. Yes. Dr. Abbott is coaching Samira through, and he's being very supportive and very like, you got this solid work, all this sort of stuff. And then at the very end, he's like, plus it was too risky of a procedure for me to do. So I'm glad that you did it. So it's like supportive, but also covering his ass.

22:38Rob:Anyway, those crumbs were enough for the fandom. I mean, they always are. You know, brought up on Grey's Anatomy. And they're like, if we're not in a hospital, fucking what are we doing?

22:46Jo:Did these doctors talk to each other? Well, but I'm sorry, Rob. I mean, this is more than that.

22:54Rob:This is the hottest thing a doctor on the pit has done. And it's not him taking off his shirt. Thanks, Sean Haddesey, Gen X icon for Take Happy Shirt. Great. Love that for you. It is when Samira is talking about her patient who is gone. Yeah. And he's like, get it, get it, Uber the supplies over. And then he just mutters while not even looking at her. I'll pay for it. I'll pay for it. I was watching the people. We literally screamed and rewound it. And I would like to now give you, Rob Mahoney, the power ranking of the top five hottest moments that have happened thus far on the pit.

23:30Jo:I need them.

23:30Rob:Okay. Number five. Season one, episode 15, human Utah himself, Mateo, our guy Mateo, who we are missing and we're waiting for, hands Victoria Giavati a beer and he says, we won't tell your mom and gives her like a real sneaky smile. That's number five. Mateo being number five, you feel like that's low for Mateo and I agree, but I need him to come back to like sort of give me a refresher on what's going on.

23:56Jo:I just feel like between number five and Abbott, I'm just learning a lot about you, Joe. I'm learning a lot about like the quiet moment of offhand reassurance. You know, it's doing a lot for you.

24:08Rob:But also a bit of violence. Number four, season one, episode nine, Dana breaks up a fight in chairs. Yes. That's a hot boss bitch move. For sure. It's very, very good. Number three, season two, episode six, just last week, Dr. Robbie snapping off the gloves, grabbing the cell phone, threatening that woman's boss on the phone before slashing her leg open. Well, I was like two weeks ago. Anyway, Dr. Robbie snapping off the gloves, grabbing the phone. That's number three. Number two, also in this episode, Dr. Ellis guns out, blows an air kiss to Dana. Number two hottest thing that has happened on the pit.

24:46Rob:Really good stuff.

24:47Jo:I'm so thrilled that Ellis is back.

24:49Rob:Oh my God. Delightful.

24:51Jo:And she mentions that like she's back on shift at 1.30. We don't really see her for the rest of the episode. We're just going to need her constantly through the rest of the season.

24:58Rob:We're just hopeful. And like, you know, does she want to wear sleeveless scrubs? I don't know if that's hygienic, but I think I would support it. You know, I'm just saying. I think the patients would respond to it.

25:10Jo:This has been an unusually horny season from a patient perspective. Everyone is like winking, hitting on, like we see in this episode. It's 4th of July, buddy. I mean, maybe it's that.

25:19Rob:It's 4th of July. Everyone's drinking before they get there. They're ready to go. But even this high school kid

25:22Jo:is like taking a pass at Joy just for the hell of it, I guess.

25:25Rob:And she's like, was your not my type, do you feel like Joy is queer? Is that what she's saying? I don't know,

25:31Jo:but also he's a teenager. So maybe also that. Fun fact.

25:35Rob:Fun fact. Number one with Bullet, Dr. Jack Abbott, shirtless, but that's not the point, muttering, I'll pay for it.

25:40Jo:He will pay for it.

25:41Rob:I mean, incredibly good shit.

25:42Jo:Well, that's very good.

25:43Rob:Honorable mention, and this is the most revealing thing about me, I will say anyone speaking any other language. So princess always.

25:49Jo:Yes, and Perla.

25:51Rob:In this episode, Samira speaking Tamil on the phone. Dr. Al-Hashimi saying Doctors Without Borders in French.

25:58Jo:Yeah.

25:59Rob:And Santos singing Tagalog. Like, it's all really good shit to me.

26:03Jo:It is very good. And here's the thing about specifically Samira and Jack Abbott. Like, they do just have, as performers, a pretty easy chemistry. So I see why they would lean into it, at least to the point of having Robbie walk by and gawk and, you know, really show up for us.

26:19Rob:I'm pretty sure this is like, because remember there was like an earlier scene this season where Noah Wiley's like, oh, I wasn't supposed to be in that scene. But I was like, what if Robbie just walks by? I'm pretty sure he's like, what if Robbie just walks by?

26:29Jo:To be fair, could have closed the door.

26:32Rob:Well, he was behind a curtain. She pulls the curtain back. It's true. So Samira could have closed the door. But then that almost makes it seem like more, you know, if you like pull the curtain and close the door. It's a great point.

26:43Jo:I do need more of them together, but I also just need more of Abbott with basically everybody. His approval rating in the ED is through the roof at this point.

26:51Rob:Abbott showing up, like what he does with Samir here is for the fans and for me apparently. For the world. For us, for all of us. But him showing up and like taking a shine to Dr. Al Hashimi right away, I think is really, we've been sort of trying, and I want to talk about Dr. Al Hashimi next. We've been kind of trying to track like, how are you supposed to feel about this character? Yeah. And one of our best barometers is the person she interacts with the most, which is Robbie. And so we're trying to parse how we're supposed to feel about her through the lens of how Robbie feels about her. And we're like, is that an accurate lens to you, this person, or not?

27:30Rob:So I think it matters that Abbott comes in and he's like, I mean, she's pretty dope, actually.

27:35Jo:It is possible, in fact, to have a normal, non-adversarial relationship with your fellow attending.

27:41Rob:It seems like it.

27:41Jo:It does seem like it, but I think Abbott has this easy way about him. And this is what makes him such a great counterpoint to Robbie, because they are both sad boys. They do both end up on the roof at the end of the day. But Abbott is at least in therapy enough to take up interesting new hobbies with the SWAT team. He's like trying to work on himself in a slightly different way than I'm just going to motorcycle off into the wilderness.

28:02Rob:Here's what I'll say. Yeah. Dr. Abbott knows that you can get DoorDash up to the roof. So, you know, when he goes up to the roof, he's like enjoying his time up there as well.

28:10Jo:I don't mean to make this into like the mental health Olympics, because if that is the case, no one in the pit is meddling. Everyone here is in a bad way.

28:17Rob:It's true. It's true.

28:18Jo:But he is in a similar position to Robbie in so many ways. They clearly like are birds of a feather. They have a lot that they bond over. But their relationships, especially with Dr. Al Shimi, are just so wildly different. And I think we've seen Robbie in his way kind of begrudgingly come to accept and understand Dr. Al a little bit more over the course of the season. I'm interested to see how that's tested by her kind of getting called up to consult about this like shutdown situation, which even in her reaction shot, seems like she didn't necessarily sign up for and is kind of getting flagged with.

28:48Rob:She's very pissed that she was like put in the middle of this. And I think her pissed off face was almost like just when I was kind of making some ground with him, right? Because she's like, your debrief was lovely at the beginning of this episode about how he sent Louis off at the end of last week. She's being a bit more supportive to Santos you know inside of this episode we hear her say good work a couple times but i did want to check in with you on this neuro development right she calls her doctor dr fairgraves at the pittsburgh neuroscience group and this seems to be it seems to be that she's having uh episodes i guess i would say and i think that explains that weird cliffhanger we had at the beginning of the season when she was with baby jake doe and she like sort of stared off into space and we didn't really understand why.

29:34Rob:Yeah. Um, I was talking to our beloved Christopher Ryan. And I just want to say that they're like, I know I mentioned CR a bunch on our industry pod this week, basically after talk the thrones, Chris and I have like a mini the watch prestige pod, like crossover episode, film it, release it, but people need it at the barista bar. Anyway. So we were talking about, um, we were talking about this neuro development and Chris brought up that like someone like one of their listeners was asking if we had seen Dr. Al-Hashimi use her hands this season in any sort of, she's often observing. She often walks in actually with her hands behind her back.

30:12Rob:And I sort of took it as like her, this is her authoritarian like stance, but is there something going on with her hands? We do see her examine Alana, the sexual assault survivor, sort of like, you know, very sort of roughly, but we haven't seen her do any, like, I think any sort of fine work, surgical work with her hands. I'd be curious if that's incorrect. Dr. Cybanks at gmail.com or press htv at spotify.com if we missed something. But if that's the case, like, I don't know if this sort of like neurological development is meant to soften us to her or deepen our understanding of her. But if she is hiding something that impairs her ability to practice medicine, I will have a hard time understanding that as an approach.

31:01Jo:I would have a hard time understanding it too, but it does, like that idea, that impulse is so obviously human. And it would do some interesting things in terms of the character dynamics, right? Like her relationship with Langdon, for example. Like she, as somebody who is hiding something and concealing something that, as you say, would impair her ability to be a good doctor, like maybe she would be increasingly empathetic to what Langdon has been through.

31:22Rob:Or her interest in dictation software.

31:24Jo:Absolutely.

31:25Rob:If there's something going, I mean, like, again, I haven't, we haven't seen like tremors or anything like that that I can see. And there's a ton of different ways that neurological problems can manifest. So I'm not a neurologist. I'm not trying to diagnose anything. But like, if there is something that she can't do finer work, like, can she still practice medicine if AI dictation like actually works, you know? And that could keep her doing the thing that she loves to do and helping people. I don't know. it's an interesting question that we obviously don't know the answers to and this is a thing that Pitt loves to do which is sort of give us a twist and a turn on a character we've been kind of waiting for what the twist and turn on her is we don't have enough information right now but I was sort of interested to hear how you thought about it

32:05Jo:yeah I mean I think the show overall has done a good job of giving a lot of cover to that idea and some of it is not just as you say her wandering into a room and having her hands behind her back but even just the nature of her and Robbie's relationship he's kind of constantly sending her out Right. Like she comes in offering to help. And I don't even think this was pointed at her so much. But when he's kind of putting Langdon under the gun. Yeah, that was about Langdon. I think that was so much more about like, I don't want you to have any like any help whatsoever inside this room. I'm going to grill you on what we should do here.

32:34Jo:But he's been doing some version of that all season when Dr. Lashimi wanders in and wants to help and wants to get involved. And so we haven't seen it. And we think it's because of that emotional reaction that Robbie is having and him just kind of being a large man baby on the ed floor on a regular basis but if it's also helping to conceal this other plot line that feels very tv to me that does feel like exactly the kind of

32:55Rob:thing the pit would do and we do get this like sort of um not parallel plot but in terms of uh jackson davis his sister jada and his parents showing up inside of this episode this idea of like hiding medical information from people yes like this which is associated you know we've talked about this before, this idea of like shame and mental health on the pit and the way in which they're trying to examine that via Robbie or via whoever else. But this idea that the Davis family has hidden a part of their medical history from their kids, vital information that their kids should have out of shame or failing to understand what happened with Uncle Ken, who died by drinking himself to death, but also had seemingly an undiagnosed psychological issue, perhaps the schizophrenia that Jackson seems to be presenting with.

33:48Rob:And so that's like an interesting sort of secondary note underneath what is happening with Al Hashimi here.

33:55Jo:And you have to have those secondary notes in these cases, I think, just with the volume of them that come through the pit, the educational bent of the show overall and wanting to tackle these like very serious, very specific kinds of medical issues and just like topics that come up. The fact that it's not just about here are these later developing symptoms of a psychiatric disorder in a college student or a law student. It's also about how we talk about mental illness. It's also about family history. And if that is where Dr. Alashimi's plot line goes, again, we don't have any idea what's actually going on with her medically, just that she is not doctors, but she is urgently trying to call her doctor.

34:28Jo:And I do want to point out, like, I just love how Sepi de Moafi is playing this. And like, she's been someone who, even though she hasn't been very hands-on as we've been talking about with Patience, the intensity of her conversational style, I think makes it so clear these moments where she sort of like blips out and she kind of dissociates or she like her attention shifts ever so slightly. Like this moment where Javadi is talking to Jackson's parents and she kind of urges Javadi to usher them to the family room. Like, yeah, you have the musical cue, but in terms of performance, it really is just the smallest, subtlest little thing.

35:00Jo:And I think she's really nailed that element of this character so for.

35:03Rob:Yeah, I'll be really curious. This podcast is brought to you by Carvana. Selling your car

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36:54Rob:See how that develops going forward. In addition to the Davis family, we have Roxy's kids show up. And Paul spends much of the episode sort of saying, do I need to, do we really need to do what she says when she's on a bunch of drugs? And can't I just take her home? And this is where Robbie does a, it was like a very classic season one, Robbie, like, let me come in and talk to the family members about the, like frank realities of the situation here. Let me talk to Roxy about like how disruptive it will be for you to stay here with us, especially on this day of days that we are experiencing. But also to Paul, when Paul's like, you know, Robbie almost from like across the hallway is like, this is when we most need to listen to your wife actually.

37:42Rob:And I really like how, I mean, I don't like it because it is very upsetting, but I really, I love the way that this Paul character is being shaped. The kids coming in, the older kid who's 15 and is just sort of like, can we not talk about ghosts? And is also sort of already kind of parenting his younger brother when his younger brother is talking about like having a gun and his older brother's like, come on guy. So, you know, already having because his dad is full-time caretaking his mom or not full-time, but like part-time caretaking his mom, how this 15-year-old kid has had to step up and be another parent inside of this whole entire dynamic.

38:20Rob:I thought was like really, again, we've accused the pit of being unsubtle. I think this is a bit more subtly done. And I think it's just like really unusual as far as my exposure to medical shows kind of storyline to follow, you know?

38:36Jo:I think especially just that kind of comprehensive view of what it means to listen to somebody in pain. And in this case, it's because I think it's so important that, as you talked about, Joe, Robbie's default setting is this is a bad idea for you to stay here. Like, this is not good for your treatment, for your health, for your rest. Like, it will be disruptive, to borrow your word, if you stay in the hospital. And yet, as soon as she says, like, I still want to do it, it's like, well, that's what we're going to do. And I think that's one of those areas where, if only reality were quite so simple in all cases in terms of medical care.

39:07Jo:But the fact that Robbie flips from, I feel very strongly this is a bad idea, to this is what my patient wants and now I am advocating for them to her husband who's already having a really hard time. Like, that's why we love Dr. Robbie, right? Like, that's why this character is so easy to latch onto even though he can be self-destructive, even though he's jumping down people's throats. It's like this side of him is in a lot of ways the most appealing and endearing side of him.

39:30Rob:I really agree. Like, and this is a good, a really good Robbie episode, I thought.

39:33Jo:How do you feel about your guy Langdon speed running the 12 steps continued? We should say he has now taken Louis' time in the ED as an opportunity to get his own stuff off his chest, unburdened himself to Dana mid-shift, despite the fact that he knows what she's got going on and everyone's got going on, and taking his moment with Robbie to talk over a helicopter landing, bringing in a trauma patient, who I believe that's the guy who's just been cut to shreds by the boat, right?

40:00Rob:Right, the Jaws scenario.

40:02Jo:It's like, this is my moment to have a deep emotional conversation that I've been waiting to have and no one else wants to have right now.

40:07Rob:I think everything you're saying is really reasonable critique of Langdon, but we did get a really good email about this. Okay, I'm eager to hear it. So this is from Dan, who has gone through the 12 steps and says, although every recovery journey is different, most programs and sponsors encourage program participants to work as quickly as possible through the first nine steps to maintain the momentum and prevent backslide. Steps 10 through 12 are ongoing maintenance steps. A common framework many sponsors start with is 90 days to make it through the steps. In addition, step nine, making direct amends where possible, is essential for addicts to let go of long-held resentments and other toxic emotions that help perpetuate the cycle of addiction.

40:46Rob:As my former sponsor said, quote, take your time in a hurry. Circling back to Dr. Langdon, he has been in recovery for 10 months, which is a very long time to have major uncompleted amends hanging over him. Any sponsor I know would be insisting that their sponsee reach out to those coworkers well before they were cleared to return to work. Furthermore, one of the biggest amends, this is written obviously before this person saw the episode, but furthermore, one of the biggest amends Langdon needs to make is with Dr. Robbie. And given his planned sabbatical, Langdon should be doing everything he can short of tackling Dr.

41:17Rob:Robbie and holding him down to make it happen. Ideally, though, he wouldn't step foot back in that hospital until he's had this step nine conversation with every former coworker on his list. So I think you're right that this should not be happening this way, but Dan's point is it should have happened before Langdon got called in at all.

41:37Jo:And the reason it is happening now is because drama.

41:40Rob:Because of television. Because television. Because television. Because the pit, it takes place in one day. It certainly does. So that's why. But I, no, Langdon's shouting it over. This is like, this is not your moment, buddy. But to be fair.

41:52Jo:This was a head in my hands moment on my, I'm like, you cannot be doing this right now.

41:56Rob:To be fair, am I in the bag for Langdon? But to be fair, he has tried to get Robbie on like calmer and calmer moments. and he's like, this might be my only opportunity. Could have picked that elevator ride. Could have picked the elevator. Any other moment. I feel like the only reason they wound up in the elevator is because Princess is on scheduling duty and she just didn't occur to her. No. The way that Dana is doing four-dimensional chess to not put Robbie and Langdon in an elevator together. That's a real Princess move. Mistakes are being made, unfortunately. Princess is a bad bitch and I love her.

42:31Rob:She doesn't want this job. When they walk into the elevator, I was like, this is going to be good. He asked about Jake. I do want to say, when we were talking about Robbie and various long-term relationships or no, we did neglect to give him credit for Jake, who is a person he has kept in his life after his relationship with Jake's mom ended. But we don't exactly know what's going on with Jake and Robbie. We did not leave the last season on good terms. He seems informed about Jake, but how is his relationship with Jake? We don't know. But yeah, Langdon doing his I'm sorry's underneath the helicopter is just so funny.

43:07Rob:And then Robbie having to shout, I'm really glad you got the help that you need, but I don't know if I want you working in my ER. And then Langdon just floundering for the rest of the episode. He is in a flop sweat. Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

43:20Jo:The entire next segment of the episode and who knows even beyond this point. But yeah, this has been the subtext of the season, right? It's like, does Langdon actually have a place in the pit anymore on Robbie's watch? And so to put it front and center, I think is just like good for storytelling purposes and very clearly sets up like over the back part, Langdon has a lot to prove to Robbie as far as whether he should be staying here or whether he should earn Robbie's trust back or whatever that looks like. But also, yeah, the pressure cooker it now puts Langdon in, I think it's just very interesting for that character.

43:49Rob:The pin is that, you know, they brought back every character except for one from season one, Dr. Collins is not here. But it's so interesting to think about, as we've been alluding to, the idea of turnover inside of an ED and how it's impossible to have all of these characters back next season. But I couldn't tell you right now who I wouldn't want to see back in the ER or the ED next season. I know.

44:16Jo:There have already been some who have suggested they might not be. Like Joy, for example, doesn't see herself as being long for this space. So we'll have to see kind of where the next season would even be set.

44:24Rob:Joy getting one over on Ogilvy this episode? I mean, that's just like a straight lob

44:28Jo:from Samira to just dunk all over him and it was phenomenal.

44:34Rob:Maybe season three should be July 5th. And everyone's still here. Everyone's still here. Robbie did not go to the medical. Oh, he didn't. He canceled his trip. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

44:44Jo:Definitely could be.

44:44Rob:Dr. Al is occasionally here, but mostly upstairs in neurology getting that handled. And for some reason, Dr. Jack Abbott is still here. They have set themselves up, unfortunately, given the structure of the hospital, We can't have Dr. Jack Abbott here on like hour one of the day because like he and Robbie, you know, are at the same level. But the show really feels better when Sean Haddesey is here.

45:12Jo:So as a buddy act, it really works. And I think Robbie needs that Abbott energy in his face.

45:19Rob:Like he needs it.

45:20Jo:It's a pressure release for that character and for the show in a lot of ways to have Abbott there.

45:26Rob:um and dr ellis is here and again we we didn't see much beyond one scene but it was an it was all i need to see honestly and i i can't wait to see more uh the air kiss the eye mask yeah i'm in a real eye mask era myself yeah are you an eye mask absolutely oh my god i love knowing that joe come on but here's the problem once you start you can't stop there's no going back so like don't start unless you're ready for it to be a lifelong sort of i'm just getting into like a sensory

45:50Jo:deprivation tank era of sleep.

45:52Rob:I know.

45:53Jo:You know? Totally. It's just, I do need some kind of sound supplement or we talked about previously like having the TV on. I need eye noise. Wait, but how does this work?

45:59Rob:When you fall asleep to the TV, is the eye mask like ready to go? I wish I were that diligent.

46:05Jo:No, it's a multi-stage process.

46:08Rob:It's a multi-stage process. All right. But anyway, Dr. Ellis, eye mask or not, please come back to us. Fucking legend. Love her. When Dr. John Shen wants to come back, anytime. Yeah, Duncan's on me, baby. I'm ready. Harlow. We did get some feedback from listeners on the legality slash feasibility of the pen and paper approach that we were sort of clamoring for. That being said, Santos wrote her a note inside of this episode.

46:32Jo:Yes, she did.

46:34Rob:Could she not have waited to get a response? Okay, again, a lot of our listeners were like, not everyone who uses ASL writes or reads in English. It's not a given. Yeah, it's not a given, right.

46:47Jo:See, that would be a storyline I would like to see explored.

46:50Rob:But that does not seem to be the case here.

46:52Jo:That's not the case.

46:52Rob:So I don't know what we're doing.

46:55Jo:This is just Santos looking bad, to be honest with you.

46:59Rob:Well, no, because she's checked in with a bunch of people. So like anyone else in the ER could have been like, hey, have you tried using pen and paper? So I actually think it's more the pit doing what I called earlier, living out and just being like, hey, man, resources are fucked up. Doesn't this suck? For people who have these other needs, you know?

47:16Jo:I agree with the general state of things. I think my problem with Santos is less, did she not consult the right person or get the right solution. It's once she does go to pen and paper, she can't, like, you can see Harlow is so clearly confused and upset. And Santos is like getting out of the room as fast as humanly possible. And I get it. The zoom in translator is buffering and frustrating. And have you tried turning it off and back on again? Because, you know, Richard Ayoade on the phone. Like, I don't know what the move is here for her other than pen and paper. And she does go to it, but then she can't even commit to it.

47:46Rob:Have you ever fallen asleep to the IT crowd? Is that a good I think it's a good one It's the right zone Yeah Familiar rhythms of comedy As bad as she looks In this Harlow situation We do get this Santos singing To Baby Jane Doe Moment

48:02Jo:The Baby Whisperer

48:04Rob:This is Again This is television This is a TV show Knowing that Issa Briones Is a Broadway singer Yep Was in Hamilton Touring Hamilton Was on Broadway In Hadestown Like is Comes from Musical theater royalty. John Tombrionis is her father. She's a Broadway Nepo baby. Like, we love to hear it.

48:23Jo:My favorite bit of social media engagement of the pit from this season is a clip from one of her Broadway performances with the caption, anything but doing her charts. Yeah, I saw that.

48:30Rob:I saw that. It's really good. But here she is singing a tagalog lullaby to baby Jane Doe. I thought it was absolutely beautiful. The little, like, the little baby hand, like, grabbing her finger. Her tough exterior. Donnie being like, I don't even hear babies crying anymore. Like all that stuff was really good. And it made me think about some of the great plot lines in season one. When we get information about Trinity and how she grew up. We see these scars on her thigh when she's getting up from going to the bathroom.

49:05Jo:And is your read on that, like it looks like consistent with like a self-harm kind of scar to me? Is that your read?

49:10Rob:Those look like cutting scars to me, but not fresh cutting scars. No, no. Yeah, yeah. But that is like part of her history, right?

49:15Jo:And we know like her history of abuse growing up. Is it abuse?

49:18Rob:And like talking about being not just like abused and going through the system and like and being a child and all of that sort of stuff. So like her tenderness, thinking about like how was she with other children that she went through the system with? And like, is this something she's used to? Like has she sung this lullaby before to other kids that she was sort of like going through these various systems that let her down? and like a much needed dimensionality to this character who's been having a tough season when it comes to like empathy. It's true. Yeah.

49:49Jo:But I still just find Santos overall, if you take like her two season story to this point, to be one of the most interesting and well-rounded characters on the show for exactly this reason. Like I don't always agree with the choices she's making, but there's always something about her that's like that fine tension between the sort of like brashness and overconfidence and tenderness that she has like clearly underneath. like there is an empathy to her buried somewhere. Yeah. But because of who she is and how she grew up and everything she's experienced, it's like a little tougher to access for her than some of the other characters.

50:20Jo:And so when it does come out, it feels very rewarding. And I thought within this episode, you see so many sides of her, right? You see her with baby Jane Doe. We see her with Robbie. And like, I mean, they have amazing chemistry and just don't get enough time together.

50:32Rob:It's almost like a screwball comedy like patter.

50:36Jo:I mean, the little orphan Annie, widow Amy. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Let's take the show on the road, frankly, as far as the two of them. I agree. They're great together. She also gets Santos, like, her moment kind of with the A-team, with this, you know, this cop who's been brought in or this SWAT officer who's been brought in, right? Because in that moment, it's Robbie, it's Abbott, Alashimi comes in, Garcia's in there, and Santos is, like, the one who's been brought in basically from, you know, the next generation of the pit and acclimates herself well and gets her, like, congratulations for her performance in that moment.

51:04Jo:And so we see all of these different elements, including her, in some ways, kind of blowing it in terms of Harlow's immediate treatment. And it's like that exact mixture.

51:12Rob:Yeah.

51:13Jo:I find to be really compelling.

51:14Rob:And we love like we've talked constantly about how much we love on the pit when they show the successes and failures. So for Samira, not just because it gave me the hottest moment that has ever happened on the pit, but for Samira's patient, like diabetes patient to walk out Orlando Diaz and like we spent multiple episodes with him and she's worked so hard to try to get the system to work for him. And then he walks out anyway. It reminded me of a season one plot line when Dana and McKay were trying to talk to the young woman who they think is being trafficked. And they're doing everything they can to try to get through to her.

51:49Rob:And then she walks out anyway. And they're like, well, she took a pen. So maybe, you know, maybe there's a hope there. Right. And so maybe Dr. Jack Abbott will pay for an Uber to take the supplies to Orlando. That's still not the level of care that he needs or deserves. And for Samira to have worked so hard and then failed, failed.

52:07Jo:Yes.

52:08Rob:Anyway, if you're not watching this podcast, there were air quotes around failed. I'm not being judgmental of her, but like we need these wins and these losses for all of these characters to keep them interesting.

52:17Jo:And that one I think was so critical in terms of Samir and Abbott for two reasons. One, like.

52:21Rob:Because it was so hot.

52:22Jo:I mean, one, sorry, three reasons. One, it was so hot. Two, she, like her reaction to feeling that she has failed Orlando Diaz or that he has walked out and she wasn't able to get it. she's been putting everything aside, working tirelessly to get these supplies together so he can go home with them, so he can just have a chance to get through the day without crashing again. And he's already out the door. And you can see in her in that moment, it's like, that's like a breaking point when she walks into the room and realizes he's not there. And Abbott's gesture, in addition to being hot, it's just like, it's like wind in her sails again, right?

52:54Jo:It just kind of picks her up and keeps her going where, you know, another time, another doctor, another room, maybe things don't go so well for her. Yeah. And this is something I'm wondering with that character overall with Samira is we've seen her over the course of these two seasons like really evolve in her capacity as a doctor and really grow. And she's learning things from Robbie and she's learning things from Abbott. Like I assume this is something that she'll take away from their exchanges like a non - His number. Well, we'll see in the episodes to come. But like a non-traditional solution to this like really gutting problem of health care.

53:27Jo:Right. Like she has tried to in her best like official capacity to help Orlando Diaz and he left. And it's like, would Gloria suggest that they Uber him these supplies? No. But it's like, this is a thing you can do.

53:39Rob:Well, yeah, which goes back to Dr. Al Hashimi's point last season where it's just like just because the system is broken doesn't mean you need to sort of roll over and take it. And I think – I'm so sorry I don't have this email in front of me, so I apologize to the listener who wrote it. But we got a really interesting email from someone talking about, okay, so Dr. Collins has been written out of the show. That means they – you know, barring whenever Dr. Ellis like gets back into the mix in earnest, we don't have a black female doctor like on the staff the way that we did last season. and, you know, we do, but Dr.

54:10Rob:Collins was shown as someone who went above and beyond something that Louie says, right? She always helped me out, right, Dr. Collins. And so this listener was sort of examining the idea that like Louie gets this care throughout these episodes from all these white male doctors. But like what would have happened if Dr. Collins had been there? Or Samira, you know, they called Samira out as someone, another person who goes above and beyond. when it comes to like looking really closely and figuring out ways around systems for patients. I thought the email was really interesting because it was like, why call out sort of how important it is to have doctors of color like on staff and their various ways in which to connect with patients and then have a complete absence of it in certain storylines.

55:00Rob:It's true. I don't know that I have an easy answer for that, but I thought that was like an interesting thought too. Definitely. interrogate. We have a couple moments that really remind us that it's the 4th of July. We've got this head of dermatology who's got to go barbecue for 30. I wonder what she's throwing on the grill. I don't know. What do you think? Is she like a...

55:22Jo:For 30? I mean, you've got to be economical. Not even just by price, but like timing, right? You can't do anything too delicate. Feels like a shish kebab situation.

55:30Rob:I was just to say shish kebab, but I feel like swordfish shish kebab, something like that, right?

55:33Jo:I've never had a swordfish shish kebab before.

55:36Rob:But I feel like that's a real head of dermatology thing to do. She's got the swordfish shish kebabs already marinating in the fridge and she's just going to throw them on the massive grill she has, right? So like, and then we get Trent Norris, the big boss. Gloria maybe is not even in this season. I don't know. We haven't seen her. We keep hearing about her. We haven't seen her. Trent Norris in his salmon shorts. I think salmon is generous.

55:59Jo:These are very pink.

56:00Rob:Okay. What shade would you call them?

56:02Jo:I don't know. I mean, we're approaching neon. I think we're closer to neon than salmon.

56:06Rob:Wow. Okay. I feel like, I feel like if you're as rich as the big boss at the head of the pit probably is, and they're on your, on your like lower extremities, they're always salmon.

56:17Jo:Like that's, that's always like, like salmon bonobos.

56:20Rob:Like that's, that's a, that's a classic spiritually true.

56:22Jo:I did learn salmon or pink.

56:24Rob:Yeah.

56:25Jo:I don't ever want in my life to be delivering bad news, wearing salmon or pink shorts.

56:28Rob:Well, you got to be careful what you're wearing on the 4th of July.

56:31Jo:Very, very careful. Um, he will not be grilling for his friends. I assure you that He bought a big grill and then hired someone to grill for him.

56:38Rob:Oh, that's a fact. That is a fun fact. Okay. Before we get to Trent, anything you want to say about Javadi, her dad, the head of dermatology? Yeah. Any of that?

56:47Jo:I mean, it's nice to meet her dad. And immediately upon meeting him, I know this couple. Yeah. You know? I agree. The like very overbearing mom swooping and smooth things over dad or vice versa, if you prefer. It depends on the relationship. Makes total sense to me. Yeah. Also makes total sense in terms of what he's pitching, which is Javadi's mom has been like trying to usher her into surgery. Very competitive, but also very intense. Dermatology, as I understand it, and I'm sure many of our friends in healthcare will correct me if I'm wrong about this, but like -

57:15Rob:Cushy.

57:16Jo:Well, cushy, but also like very competitive in terms of getting it, right? Like the threshold I think is very high.

57:21Rob:But I think a cushier, like a more relaxed lifestyle. The fact that she's like, I'm going to go help, you know, someone in the mayor's office, right? And then grill for 30. Like this is her day. like Victoria's mom has never had that day in her life. Right. And so it's just sort of like, do you want, what do you want? Do you want to be at the most hyper competitive? Like you work hard now, you're never going to stop working hard or, and again, I love my dermatologist. I'm not knocking dermatologists. They do incredible work. And it certainly depends on who, which dermatologist you're talking about.

57:54Rob:But I think the avenue like specifically that he's paving for her here is you could be this woman. And I see that this woman has a very nice life. And is brilliant. She makes a ton of money, is brilliant, and seems to have a much more relaxed life than your mother has, you know?

58:10Jo:And I think that's an interesting concept for someone like Javadi, who is like, yes, you are a high achiever, a prodigy, it seems in every respect. But like, you have choices here. And your choices don't have to only be the most intense lifestyle, right? The most demanding possible specialty you could pick. Like, even though it is glamorous and rewarding and would make use of your expertise in all these interesting ways and probably fulfilling ways, you could just do this other thing and that would probably be okay too. At least according to him.

58:37Rob:Have your career in swordfish-ish kebab too. Why not? We can only dream. All right. So Trent Norris, who as we mentioned is not doing his own grilling this 4th of July. Someone else is grilling the steaks and it's definitely steaks at Trent Norris' house I believe for 4th of July. Cyber attack. Princess seemingly won the pool.

58:57Jo:I didn't even notice that.

58:59Rob:Oh, she goes, yes, and looks at Amon when they say cyber attack. So she at least won something, it seems like. I'm excited for her. Actually, that's the person I most wanted to win the pool if I had to pick. Other hospitals have been attacked, so they're shutting down the pit preventatively. This is so aggravating, as it's meant to be. But it's just sort of like, I don't blame Dr. Halashimi. It seems like she was put in a tough position. and Robbie like taunted her on the way out the door. So Robbie, you don't have a lot of ground to stand on here.

59:32Jo:But I'm sure he's going to be pissed all the same to open the next episode.

59:34Rob:But if Trent Norris had given us, we're shutting down in 15 minutes. Get all the information you need. Not any second now. Whitaker, grab a photo of, we heard the shutter go. So Whitaker got a photo. How good that photo is, we'll find out. But take a photo of the big board before it all blacks out. Like give us 15, 20 minutes to prepare at least. if not an hour. Give us an episode. But no, that's not good TV drama. That's not what we got.

1:00:01Jo:It's not unfortunate. I like the quick turn for TV purposes. It's obviously ridiculous for professional ones. I also think maybe the upset of the season is Whitaker being the fastest draw on his phone. Yeah. Joy has been on our phone all season. Oh, I know. Javadi is a TikTok influencer. You're telling me Whitaker of all people.

1:00:16Rob:The farm boy?

1:00:17Jo:But see, maybe it's that. Maybe he's been taking so many pictures of his proxy farm kid. Yeah. But now he's all of a sudden a pro. Maybe it is as simple as that.

1:00:26Rob:Do you think the Huckle Robbie shippers really enjoyed the, but he's our Huckleberry moment? Maybe.

1:00:32Jo:But that whole exchange to me did read as like very interested dad or uncle hearing about the younger person's new girlfriend.

1:00:40Rob:But what I love is he's like, how are you doing? And by you, I mean, how is Whitaker doing?

1:00:45Jo:Couldn't even hide it.

1:00:47Rob:All right. Anything else you want to talk about the cliffhanger before we... Oh, I will say this. We're about to go analog is what he says. We are. Do you ever have like movie quote, like Tourette's almost? Just like someone says something.

1:00:58Jo:You already know that we all do. I know.

1:01:00Rob:We're all sick. This isn't even from a movie I like, but there's a line in Pacific Rim.

1:01:07Jo:You don't like Pacific Rim? I don't. It's okay.

1:01:09Rob:I don't like, it's fine. We'll talk about it. This is the most hurtful thing

1:01:12Jo:you've ever said to me. I'm so sorry.

1:01:14Rob:Well, my poor kaiju heart. Perhaps then you know the line, Gypsy's analog, nuclear.

1:01:21Jo:I actually don't know this line.

1:01:23Rob:I have a couple friends who say it all the time because they love Pacific Rim. And they just always go, gypsy's analog, nuclear. So that's like what my brain did when he said we're about to go analog. And then, of course, Dr. Jack Abbott, who is the most fun at every party. He's like, this is going to be great.

1:01:37Jo:See, I really needed a Dr. Jack Abbott cigarette almost falling out of his mouth. Hold on to your butts. Jurassic Park switch flip moment. But we didn't get it.

1:01:45Rob:No, he's like, we're canceling the apocalypse. Here we go. It's true.

1:01:48Jo:Honestly, Abbott is very happy about it. I mean, this is the adrenaline junkie part of him.

1:01:52Rob:I'm happy about it because he means Abbott's not leaving the ED anytime soon. They need all the help they can get. Suit up, Dr. John Shen. We'll have the iced coffee waiting for you. Okay. Last but not least, again, we wanted to save this for last because I thought it was handled like really beautifully, but Alana Miller comes in. Dana, this is one of those like audience education pieces that the pit does. For sure. Whereas Dana is explained to this character of Emma about all the steps and explaining to Alana in turn sort of to make her feel in control in the room. Here's what I'm going to do next.

1:02:30Rob:Here's what I'm going to do next. We at home are now understanding what it means to be a sexual assault nurse examiner. The fact that she can't leave the room when she started all of the steps. And for her to she's constantly saying and Dana's not like lying, but she's constantly like we're almost done.

1:02:46Jo:Yeah.

1:02:46Rob:But it's the whole episode and we're not even done with this exam. So this is just like the pit is making us sit with how invasive and harrowing, as like gentle as Dana is being, as caring as everyone who's involved with this is being, this is a re-traumatizing experience. Completely. Like, you know, you and I know this and a lot of people at home know this, but like, you know, some people have never watched something like this. And so I think I really loved this. There was something about when they asked Alana to undress and had to have her clothing on these various pads on the ground. There was something about the fact that she was wearing like a red, white and blue bathing suit that like absolutely shattered my heart.

1:03:33Rob:Like this is just like a young woman who like went out to enjoy the 4th of July. And then the breakdown that she had about like he's my friend. He's friends with all my friends. he was drunk, he didn't mean, like all of that was just like incredibly well done. Not to mention Catherine Lanasa's like silent performance when Emma, and I think this is the storyline we were kind of looking for for Emma, like something for Emma to do that's not just like helpless baby eyes. The fact that she's like, we'll go get the good snacks. Like I'm curious to see Emma's ongoing role in this, but when they left and then we were just left with Dana, just who has been sort of moving the process along, having to like have the wave of the emotion of the experience crash over her as we watch.

1:04:20Rob:I just thought this is incredibly good television and incredibly good and important story to tell at the same time.

1:04:27Jo:Very much so. And I think, you know, Dr. Al-Hashimi is not wrong when she tells Alana, like you're in good hands, right? Like there's almost no one you would want more than Dana doing something like this. I think both for the care she clearly has, but also just a level of discretion and information and clarity about like this is exactly what is coming next. This is what you can anticipate. These are the ways you're going to be touched, frankly. And I think you're absolutely right about just the invasiveness and the re-traumatization of that process, which yeah, is one thing to know it and another thing to see it, even in the context that they're going to show on the pit.

1:05:01Jo:And when she's undressing, that was one of those moments that struck it with me too. Like obviously there's the very physical, clear ways that this is going to be an invasive examination. But also like Dana is just like inches from her, like the physical proximity that they have to have basically at all times, even as she's undressing, even as she's, you know, nude behind a gown and has to turn and be blue lit in order to, you know, show whatever like fluids or secretions might be on her. It just, all of that felt so up close and so like so difficult for any character to process in that moment.

1:05:33And this is where like,

1:05:34Jo:I just feel comfortable with the pit exploring these kinds of storylines because I know and trust the care. I think it's because like The Pit is not, look, they're not just telling a story. There are a lot of shows out there that there's a sexual assault plot line, there's a sexual assault survivor, whatever it may be. And it's like, this is a character-driven decision that's part of the plot or mechanics in some way. That's happening with The Pit, but this is also a character we don't know. We're meeting for the first time. And as you talked about, Joe, like this is a show that is invested in the educational part of this experience, in the procedural unpacking of like, what does it mean to be in the room you never want to be in?

1:06:10Jo:Whether that's the room where you find out you have cancer or the room where you say goodbye to a loved one or the room where you relive just hours after the fact, the sexual assault that even in that moment, you're like trying to understand and comprehend and explain away. It's incredibly heavy material for any show, but I do feel like the pit handles it pretty deftly.

1:06:29Rob:That was really beautifully put, Rob. And I think there's a moment, I am never going to like compare anything I've gone through to what this woman is going through here. But to me, this is like exactly what we were asking for the pit to do last week, which is like show us what the nurses can do. Don't tell us what the nurses can do. Right. Right. And so when I had surgery last year, like a few weeks after our like I presume we have the same medical plan. And there was like just a part of our medical plan where a nurse called me several weeks after my procedure just to who was not involved in the procedure at all.

1:07:05Rob:Just to like talk to me about how I was doing. And just like it was just a like and to tell me about all the resources that were available to me. And she just had this like the most comforting demeanor. I didn't know that this call was going to happen. She just called me to talk to me about it. And then she was like, she said something that is very similar to what Dana says here, where she was just like, you've gone through something very traumatic. And that just like flipped something in me where I was like, I had been trying so hard to just be like, this is fine. I'm fine. I can do this. I'm fine.

1:07:34Rob:I'm tough. I'm fine. And when she, there's something about someone just validating when Dana says you've experienced a horrific trauma. There's just something so vital. And someone just like looking at you and saying, you've been through something. and you can be, you know, like Alana is trying to hold something together in all of this. But that validation of just sort of like, however you're feeling or however you're trying not to feel is okay because what has happened to you is hugely significant. And like, again, I'm not comparing my experience to this young woman's experience at all, but it's just sort of like that thing that anyone in the medical profession, But like quite often, I think the nurses like can provide for someone that validation that I see you and trying to offer a safe place for all of those emotions and all of the fear and all of the anger and however you might be feeling.

1:08:32Rob:It's just like there are so many layers to what people inside of any given hospital. But like, you know, we've seen we see a million patients cycle through the pit and all these various things. But it's this psychological element that the pit is can be really good at nailing at the same time. For sure.

1:08:52Jo:And I think Tina Ivlev, who plays Ilana. So good. I mean, just a really wonderful performance with a very, very tricky part. because I think if you're going to be the pit and you're going to embrace these storylines, not just as storylines, but as like informational episodes for the people who are watching at home, the more you know, that demands like a really naturalistic performance. And for her here, like you're asking her to be a stand-in almost for this very fraught subject matter in a way that's going to feel recognizable and familiar, but not like overly showy or overly performative. It's such a line to walk.

1:09:27Jo:and I think she just absolutely nails that like disorientation the like all like kind of borderline denial at times like there's moments where she just kind of like almost like drifting in and out of the room and there's moments where she's overly reactive for the most understandable reasons and it's like hitting kind of all parts of that emotional spectrum I think it's just so hard to do as an actor without coming across as like acting and this just feels like you know obviously it's not true to life it's still performance it's all of that but it feels grounded in the emotion of what they're trying to tell in such a real way and in such an inarguable way on the screen.

1:10:03Rob:I just, I thought this was a tremendous episode of television. Just like had everything we could possibly want from the pit. I don't think I mentioned at the top, but this episode was written by Kristen Pierre Geffman and R. Scott Gamal and directed by Uta Breswitz, who we've talked about before as like this really incredible TV director. And so it's just like a really, you know, everyone on the pit is very talented. This is a really great team that came together for this particular episode. and I'm really, I don't know, excited is not always the word I want to use for the pit because like there's so much heartbreak that's involved in it.

1:10:35Rob:But like I'm really interested to see where the pit goes for the rest of the season. For sure. They've really, you know, this is like the big trauma, I guess, here, which is like the system is down. The expanded cast of characters has already like filtered into the hospital and it's like, here we go. So it's episode seven. We've got 15 episodes, so we're about at the halfway point of the season. And this is like, I guess it's go time for the rest of the season. And I don't think if we continue this kind of momentum going forward, I don't think any of the bumps that we felt in the first half of the season will be something we'll remember too much about season two of The Pit.

1:11:12Jo:It feels a lot like set up in retrospect, right? Like things that you can see facilitating other plot lines that would lead to this bit of character development or that. We've been setting the stage for a couple episodes now. I think what's interesting now is now that the shit is really hitting the fan, everything is going analog, hold on to your butts, et cetera, et cetera. We're going nuclear. Just analog, nuclear. What does that mean for, like, I mean, as you talked about, Joe, like this sexual assault examination is not finished yet. And yet -

1:11:41Rob:Right, Dana can't leave that room.

1:11:42Jo:She can't leave that room.

1:11:44Rob:She's about to hit the fan and Princess is incredibly capable, but Princess is going to be in charge.

1:11:49Jo:Not her usual job. Right. And there's all these little cases on the side that are like, this is a quieter thing that's happening over here. Baby Jane Doe is trying to sleep over here. Yeah. And all of a sudden, people are going to be wheeled into the ER screaming at each other because there's no charts. There's no computer access. There's no emails. There's no way of communicating other than being loud.

1:12:05Rob:And it will be like, you know, it'll be a really fun way for, because when you compare, when you go back and watch ER and you compare the way they did things on ER before they had like tablets or, you know, all these things, it's like we're going to have to do it ER style. and you're going to see a lot more paper charts flying around. You're going to see a lot of other things. So we're going to like, it'll be a fun way for them to be like, hey kids, we used to microwave vegetables in plastic bags and we used to have paper charts for everything.

1:12:34Jo:Come stop by our lending library.

1:12:36Rob:Yeah, exactly. All right, anything else you want to mention?

1:12:38Jo:I think we covered it, Joe. You said it though. This is just a really great episode of TV, of the pit. I think we're really setting up for an exciting back half of the season.

1:12:47Rob:All right, so tune in for us for the rest of the season. Rob has decided we're going to Pittsburgh for the finale. Spotify, are you listening?

1:12:55Jo:And Anthrocon? Is that the one that's in Pittsburgh? Uh-huh. Yeah. Let's do it. Why not?

1:13:00Rob:Will Kai Grady get in a furry suit if we go to Anthrocon? He looks excited.

1:13:06Jo:I will donate an irresponsible amount of money to that GoFundMe. However much it takes to make Kai a furry, I'm willing to chip in.

1:13:13Rob:Thank you to Kai Grady. I'm sorry if that was an HR violation. Thank you to Justin Sales. and we'll be back with more industry and more The Pit. Bye.

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