Starting Businesses With Friends, Why We’re So Divided, and the Danger of Keeping Score in Relationships

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1:40Welcome to Office Hours with Prop G. This is the part of the show where we answer your questions about business, big tech, entrepreneurship, and whatever else is on your mind. If you'd like to submit a question for next time, you can send a voice recording to OfficeHoursWithPropGMedia.com. Again, that's OfficeHoursWithPropGMedia.com. or post your question on the Scott Galloway subreddit and we just might feature it in our next episode. First question. Our first question comes from SillyEMU8312 on Reddit. They say, Everyone always says, don't start a business with family and friends. What's your realistic opinion on this?

2:11For context, I own some multifamily real estate with one of my oldest friends and it's gone smoothly for over four years.

2:16Scott Galloway:Yeah, they say don't start businesses with the friends. I have always started businesses with friends. Although some of the businesses I've started, I've ended up becoming friends with the senior people in the company. But I have started businesses with friends. I started my first business with a good friend from business school. I started my business profit with my friendly Lotus. So I violated that rule. And so I think it's situational. I think family is a different ball of wax. I'm not sure I'd ever want to work with my wife or my family because if things don't go well, it kind of ruins Thanksgiving.

2:47That's a lot of eggs in one basket. I know Michael and Cass Lazaro started coming to go buddy media. And I'm like, a married couple who works together? Jesus Christ. That's, God, I can't imagine that. But I think starting a business with friends,

2:59Scott Galloway:I err on the side of, I think it's a good idea because one of the keys to partnerships is being generous. At some point, you're going to add more value to the business than your partner. And at some point, they're going to add more value than you. The problem is you tend to inflate your own contribution and diminish theirs. And if you aren't generous with that person, you start complaining or bitching that you should be getting more and it creates tension. And you want to see a thriving small business go down the tubes really fast. That's when the partners start fighting. And sometimes people get therapists, or coaches to help them negotiate stuff, which I think is a good idea.

3:24Scott Galloway:So I have a bias towards starting a business with a friend because you're naturally going to be, I think, a little bit more generous with each other. It makes the breakup harder because there's more emotion involved. But also at the outset, a general best practice is to outline what happens if this doesn't work with us. Can one person buy the other out? Like kind of come up with a framework for, well, what happens if this isn't working? If one person wants to leave, if one person isn't happy with the other one. Like what are we going to have a board of advisors to help us make decisions or a board of directors, but sort of say, what do we do maybe up front if things get dicey or spicy with us?

3:57Scott Galloway:I don't think that's a bad idea. Having said that, I never did that. I just always kind of let the chips fall where they might. The same bias I have towards working with friends is working, is not working with family. And granted, I've never done that. Now, the reason most people work with family is because they inherited an amazing business. I don't think Arthur Sulzberger, or the CEO of the New York Times or the publisher wanted to work with family. But the thing is, he wouldn't have gotten anywhere near the fucking New York Times because he wasn't that talented a business person had he not been the nephew or the son or whatever it is.

4:26Scott Galloway:So occasionally, a family business oftentimes just gets you to letter L economically faster than working your ass off and going through A, B, C, D, et cetera. So sometimes second-generation families involved with their business because it's, quite frankly, just a much better opportunity. And it's unfortunately, I think, really can be really stressful for some of the people. I always think it's a good idea if you're going to go into the family business to go to work for an outside corporation and prove yourself there. And you have more respect when you go into the family business and you have better perspective, if you will, and also better life experience.

4:55Scott Galloway:I would just be worried to be in a business with my sister or I wouldn't have been in business with my dad. He was unemployed by the time he was 55 and my mom was a secretary, so I can't really relate to it. But I would just hate to have a bad day at work and not be dealing with my partners and then have to go home and like eat with them or like see them at Thanksgiving. I think that would be especially tough. But again, it's all situational. Set up an agreement or general parameters around what happens if it's not working. Maybe get a coach to help you work out problems if they pop up. Try and be really generous with one another.

5:25Scott Galloway:I have a bias against working with family and a bias towards working with friends. But again, it's all situational. Very much appreciate the question. Question number two. Question number two comes from Wadi on Reddit. They say, we're becoming increasingly polarized as a society, especially when it comes to social and political matters. as a communicator on some of the largest stages in the world, both physical and digital. What is the most important thing you think regular people can do to try to facilitate better conversations on these and other topics? We're going to need a bigger boat. So a lot of our polarization is a function.

5:55Scott Galloway:It's multidimensional. One, gerrymandering. They must love their job so much that they're willing to pass all these Byzantine laws that gerrymander every district. So if you look at all the congressional districts, they've been, they're like a fucking jigsaw puzzle. So what we end up with is an electoral system where the election isn't the general election, it's the primary. And in every primary, the people that turn out on the left are unions and crazy fucking hippies from the 60s. And the people that turn out on the right are MAGA or people who believe that, you know, vaccines are terrible and that, you know, everyone should be able to carry an AR-15 to their third grade class.

6:28Scott Galloway:So we just keep sending more crazier and crazier extremists to Washington who don't represent the three middle quintiles, which is, you know, 60 % of America. So we're divided politically. More than anything, though, I don't think we're as divided personally as the people who are trying to divide us, specifically technology that sees a profit incentive in polarizing us. Why? Because as soon as we figure out your politics and you far left, far right, and then make you more sensitive and inspired and tickle your sensors when, you know, AOC destroys Ted Cruz. But if you're someone else, Ted Cruz destroys AOC, creates more comments, keeps you engaged.

7:01Scott Galloway:Enragement equals engagement, which equals more Nissan ads, which equals more shareholder value. So these algorithms have a vested interest in dividing us and elevating content. It's divisive because it gets the most engagement. And also, I think generally speaking, people are anxious. They feel more economically anxious and more likely to be angry at one another. So we're divided politically. We're divided technologically online where we're spending more and more time in an environment that divides us. If you go out in the real world, and this is the shame about AI, if AI were crawling the real world, it'd be a much better place because people in general are lovely.

7:31I live or did live in Delray Beach, which was kind of a purple district.

7:34Scott Galloway:and I had a lot of friends that were Republicans. Isn't that big of me? Isn't that big? Smell me. I have friends who are Republicans. What a progressive, like, new age man. Anyway, you got to separate the person from the politics, in my view. And they're generally, most people find are generally good people, just getting up, love their kids, want to make a good living and like their country. But the problem is, online has convinced us that our neighbor is the problem. And also, we've taken on ideology as identity. What do I mean by that? This is actually from George Carlin, and that is the danger of taking on a religion or political philosophy as your ideology is it becomes your identity.

8:10Scott Galloway:Or when you let it become your identity and you start judging other people on it, it's because you personally feel affronted or offended when someone questions your ideology because it's not questioning your ideology. It's questioning you. It's not saying, oh, no, you are wrong about this. It's saying you're wrong. So I just think it's dangerous to attach your political ideology to yourself as an identity. So I quote unquote identify as a center left. I'm a right of center left Democrat, but it's not my identity and I don't want it to be. And I don't want to, I'm trying really hard not to immediately kind of check up and think someone's an idiot because they start with their Republican talking points.

8:49Scott Galloway:And I have found it has unlocked a lot of relationships for me. I just have an easier time and I don't want to be that judgmental. So we're divided technologically, we're divided electorally, and we're also, I think, anxious and looking for people to blame, especially young people who get radicalized online and then are served up content that says, you're not to blame. Immigrants are to blame for your economic problems and women are to blame for your romantic problems. So I think there's a lot of factors at play dividing us. Some solutions. One, turn down the heat. Personally, just be trying to show more grace.

9:18Scott Galloway:Don't engage in online. I don't respond to comments anymore. I just don't. I don't get in people's face. I try to give them the benefit of the doubt. I'm a fucking old man now. I can show a little bit more grace and just be occasionally take some hit. If someone says something stupid or mean about me, I just let it go. It's okay. I'm going to be fine. Turn down the heat. When you see something you like or someone says something you like, try and show more grace, put more good vibes out there, compliment people, be nice to them, vote for moderates, just sort of take down the heat, vote for antitrust to break up big tech.

9:47Also, mandatory national service, I think, would go a long way. I think that we need to raise a generation of young people that love America more than they love their Republican or Democratic Party and see that people from different ethnic income, sexual orientation, backgrounds, different communities are wonderful and that they share more in common than their differences and that they find they have an easier time identifying with the flag than identifying with a political party. Israel and Singapore, lowest levels of young adult depression, and they both have national service. Singapore, the most religiously diverse nation in the world, and the leader there appreciantly saw the opportunity or the danger of ethnic violence.

10:24So he said, everyone's got to serve in the army together and see what wonderful people live here in Singapore, regardless of their

10:29Scott Galloway:ethnicity or their religion. Thanks so much for the question. We'll be right back after a quick break.

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13:31Welcome back. On to our final question, which also comes from Reddit. Aria 1010 asks, Hello, I've heard you mention keeping scorecards in relationships, friendships. My question is how and why you decided to stop keeping scorecards and what helped change your mindset. Especially in modern times, we tend to default to approaching relationships with a more transactional mindset. and I really want to break out of this. So curious to hear more about your journey.

13:52Scott Galloway:Thanks for the question. Yeah, this was specific or situational or had to do with one relationship and that is the relationship with my father. When I was eight years old, my mom came home. My mom just disappeared for a couple of weeks and my dad didn't tell me why it was the 70s. I remember being on the couch watching the Partridge family. It's like my mom's been gone for two weeks and I just started sobbing and controlling him. My dad's like, what's wrong? I'm like, where's mom? Where's mom? I just like, it dawned on me that mom's not around. And my dad, I remember it was the first time I ever saw my dad like fear in his eyes.

14:18Like he didn't know what to do. and had a handle, an eight-year-old, like, sobbing uncontrollably on his couch. I think that's when he decided that my mom should come get me. And a few days later, my mom showed up and said, pack your stuff, we're leaving. This wasn't exactly Brene Brown, Estera Perel, like, child care. And said, you know, we got to be out of here in 15 minutes. And I'm like, 15 minutes? I can't pack my— It's just like, we need to get out of here. Dad's going to be home soon. I don't know if she was kidnapping me or just wanted to see my dad. I don't know what the fuck was going on.

14:43Anyways, eight years old.

14:45Scott Galloway:And as is often the case, well, because my mom was second care of me, I had a tendency to sanctify her and demonize my dad. And my dad didn't make our lives very nice. He was so extraordinarily cheap that we struggled economically. And that is, as soon as my parents split, my dad went on to be upper middle class. And my mom and I immediately dove to the lower middle class, which was hard. And it wasn't that it was hard on me. Kids don't really need a lot of money. I was able, you know, 35 cents and have a Zababar and a Schwinn bike. And you kind of got everything you need. We didn't have streaming media or iPhones.

15:14Scott Galloway:But it was very hard on my mom. And when you're the only child, especially I think the only boy, That's probably only girls. You just absorb their anxiety. I remember my mom coming home and my mom was on the floor sobbing because the vacuum cleaner broke. And I'm like, well, we can get it fixed. And she's like, we don't have the money to get it fixed. And I was like, you're fucking nine years old. And you're like, okay, what can I do to get a paper route to get the vacuum fixed? So that economic anxiety that was a direct result of my dad being such a bastard, quite frankly, because he could have helped us, made me resent him.

15:44Scott Galloway:And it stuck with me. And as I got older, again, in college, I had no money, constantly stressed, constantly broke. Dad could have helped me. And the bottom line is he didn't. And so I was resented him for that. And now having said that, my dad was a kick in the ass. My dad was a ton of fun, funny, nice, smart. He did love me. He would make an effort. He'd be in town and he would take me to movies and stuff. So he did try. And when my mom passed away, I kind of, I think my resentment towards him grew and I would go months, I think one time a year without speaking to him. And he didn't really know what was going on, but didn't have the presence to try and figure it out.

16:20And then I just sort of decided that I wanted to have my father in my life and that I decided to focus on the good things. And rather than having a scorecard and thinking, okay, he did X amount, he gave me X amount of love. I'm only going to give him X amount of love. I said, well, what kind of son do I want to be? And the reality is I wanted to be a loving, generous son. And I was going to hold myself to that standard and just put away the scorecard. And that was such an enormous unlock for me because I think about what kind of boss do I want to be? If I pay someone more than they're earning, I don't, I used to think younger,

16:47Scott Galloway:that pisses me off. They worked here for a year. I paid them a shit ton of money and they added no fucking value. I hate that person. Now it's like, if you are a boss and people get more out of working for you than maybe you get out of them or you pay them above market, that's a win. That's a victory. If you're a better spouse to your, if it is really hard for your spouse to figure out ways to be as good to you as you are to them, that's a win. That's the whole fucking shooting match. That's what it means to have kids. I hope at some point my kids level up what I've done for them. It's going to take a while.

17:15I've invested a lot of my kids. I always tell them you're negative surplus value. So approaching relationships from the mindset of always wanting to have surplus value and say, okay, what kind of boyfriend do I want to be? What kind of son do I want to be? What kind of employer do I want to be? What kind of investor do I want to be? I used to get mad at CEOs of companies I invest in lost money. Now I'm like, no, I want to be a, I want to be a magnanimous, generous, supportive person. I've been on the board of a lot of companies I'm investing in where they fucked up and lost all my money. And I try to be now like, it's no problem.

17:40You're going to get back up. This is great. I went into this eyes wide open. Well done. Let me help you raise money for your next thing. That's the kind of guy I want to be. And I wasn't always that way. So decide what kind of person in every relationship, what kind of role do you want to play? And then hold yourself to that standard and put away the scorecard because the scorecard is incorrect, it's not accurate, and you'll always be unhappy. Having said that, don't be a doormat. I shed relationships all the time. On a regular basis, I decide I'm just not getting a lot out of this relationship,