How panel shows really work and is WWE high drama?

0:28Think your lashes have hit their limit? Another discovery. Your headphones haven't been connected this whole time. Awkward. Discover top brands at unexpectedly low prices. Sierra, let's get moving. Does it ever feel like you're a marketing professional just speaking into the void? But with LinkedIn ads, you can know you're reaching the right decision makers, a network of 130 million of them, in fact. You can even target buyers by job title, industry, company, seniority, skills, and did I say job title? See how you can avoid the void and reach the right buyers with LinkedIn ads. Spend$250 on your first campaign and get a free$250 credit for the next one.

1:06Get started at linkedin.com slash campaign. Terms and conditions apply.

1:13Hello and welcome to another episode of The Rest is Entertainment with me, Marina Hyde. And me, Richard Osmond. Happy Boxing Day, everyone. Have you survived it? I hope you have. People are savvy enough, aren't they, to know that we're not actually recording this on Boxing Day. People know enough about the business. We recorded it a day before, didn't we, sir? We recorded it on Christmas Day. Yes, we're sitting here with our mulled wine, realising, though, that Boxing Day is the best day of Christmas. Of course it is. And therefore, it's perfect that the show should drop on that day. Now, what we're doing on this occasion is the first ever edition where the questions have come from you.

1:49And I have to say that the questions that came in were so good. It's been very difficult to pick the ones we're going to answer, but please keep them coming. The rest is entertainment at gmail.com or on any of the socials, because we might do a bit more of this as time goes on. Yeah, I think so, because some of the questions are great. And if we don't cover yours today, we might cover yours in another episode. But we will be doing more of this. Well, listen, we might be terrible. We might be monosyllabic and the answers are a bit, you know, I mean, literally. We know nothing. Nobody knows anything and we know even less.

2:19So we will try to answer them, but, you know, bear with us. But essentially we're sitting here with a bottle of Baileys and some pigs in blankets and here we go. Here is one that a number of people have asked, which is what is your favourite celebrity story of the year? For me, there is no contest. It is the Gwyneth Paltrow ski massacre trial. Oh, yeah. If you remember, this was the situation where either Gwyneth Paltrow skied into a retired ophthalmologist in Utah or a retired ophthalmologist skied into Gwyneth Paltrow. I've you've heard of sort of low stakes drama. This I like because it was a no stakes drama.

2:57I mean, I don't know quite why the ophthalmologist brought the case, but it was essentially you couldn't really care about either of the parties. It happened in this, I mean, aesthetically hideous orange Utah courtroom into which Gwyneth wafted in incredible outfits every day and gave a sort of hilarious performance on the witness stand. her majesty herself, saying things like, when they said to her, you know, what have you really lost? And she said, well, I lost half a day skiing. It ended up, I'm afraid, with the ophthalmologist, in my view, quite rightly losing the case and the$300 ,000 claim he'd bought against her.

3:34As far as I understand it from the American legal system, any claim should just automatically be$300 million. So I'm not quite sure why he lowballed her so completely, but she lowballed him even further by seeking a$1 in exemplary damages, which I think she got. Did she? That's classy. But did you enjoy that story? Because it was, I mean, I think Sky actually televised the court case. I kind of loved it. I assume someone's doing a drama. No, that's the annoying thing, is that someone has already done a documentary, which I think is coming out now. It's called Gwyneth versus whatever his name is.

4:04I'm afraid we've forgotten. That would be a great title, Gwyneth versus whatever his name is. I'm afraid we've forgotten. That's a strand, Richard. You could come back how many times with that one? Yeah, couldn't you just? Did I like that story? I'm not sure I care all that much about what Gwyneth Paltrow gets up to. It's funny, of course, that it was a court case where nothing bad had happened to anybody. I quite like that. And that the guy himself was such an obvious dad of one of your friends character, who was clearly not telling the truth. And Gwyneth Paltrow, just like Prince Harry, was not going to give up.

4:39and she went in there and, you know, brought justice to the world. And a number of luxurious knits. See, that's the thing I can't get involved with, what people are wearing. You don't like the witness works being used as a catwalk? I don't like the catwalk being used as a catwalk. You know, if I'm watching Strictly or something, people are going, oh my God, look at those dresses. I'm not, oh, what? I just want to see the scores. Just give me the numbers. That's all I care about. So yeah, I'm not interested in what Gwyneth is wearing. I'm not sure what she'd have to do in 2024 to really pique my interest.

5:16Oh, she'll find something. There'll be a product. There's always a product. Maybe she'll sue Ronnie O'Sullivan or something. Then I'm interested. She might do. You know, she might bump into him. She might do. At the Crucible. She's in a play. He's training for the old world championships. They bump into each other. She trips. Wow. Now, you've... Injures her elbow. Hold that movie pitch before you let go of all the gold because I think you should roll that one out to certainly one of the streamers. My favourite celebrity story of the year just happened. It's the fact that they've finally done a celebrity escape to the country where they took big ins round to try and find a house.

5:54They've taken Jenny Ryan from the chase round to find a house. It's lovely watching celebrities not buying houses in exactly the same way that normal human beings don't buy houses on those shows. How am I not seeing this? I need to get onto this immediately. That's a perfect Boxing Day fair, isn't it? Well, and in fact, it relates to one of our other questions. This one comes from Shane Rooney, and he says, I've always wondered why people go on shows like Location, Location, Location, Escape to the Country, etc. Surely they could just pop down to an estate agent and get their help. Well, I mean, they could do, but they wouldn't be on television.

6:25That's the point, isn't it? It's like you can do a pub quiz, but, you know, it's kind of more exciting to go and point this or something, isn't it? And go to a studio and have makeup and have cameras around. I think it's just the fun of it. There's no real advantage other than, I think there's a thing, you see on Bargain Hunt, you see all sorts of things where people are slightly more willing to give you a deal because there's a camera pointing at them. So on Bargain Hunt, you can get a plate worth£50 and they give it to you for£40 because there's a camera in their face. And it's possible that a homeowner from Wiltshire will give you a£350 ,000 cottage for£330 ,000 because they've got a camera in their face.

7:03That's bizarre. So I would have thought that people would, you think the sport being a good sport overrides being sort of be seen to be canny. I would have thought that people would want to drive an even harder bargain because the camera's on them. But that's really interesting. That's quite heartwarming, really. They're outside of their comfort zone. You see, that's the point. And they don't know how they're expected to behave. Everyone's, we've watched so much television in our life. So we sort of feel like we know what it is. And suddenly there's a camera pointed at you and someone's offering you some money for something.

7:33It's like a policeman talking to you. That's brilliant. So you adopt the marais and the conventions of the medium rather than the world you know very well, which is, I don't know, being an auctioneer or selling houses. How fascinating. Exactly. I mean, we did Celebrity Antiques Road Trip, and, yeah, we got a lot of bargains until the auction, which they held in Staffordshire, and the auctioneer was like, oh, what have we got now? Here's a plate. Okay,£10, anyone, I don't mind. Oh, my God, we were fuming because we brought some nice things. But again, every time you say to somebody, they'll say£90, and you go, how about£70?

8:07Come on. And there's a camera pointing at them. There's two things they can do. They can say no, which everyone in Britain knows is bad television. They've seen that show. They know that in that show, I suggest some money, and they go, yeah, all right, go on then. Or they say, how about£75? They know that's what happens, and so that's what everybody did. So we thought we were going to make money. We both lost a lot of money. my short answer is I think it's fun to be on TV I think you get someone to do your negotiating for you and you know if you're selling your house and you've got two people making an offer and one of them is just you know a couple from Daventry and one of them's got a TV crew with them you go oh it might be a bit of fun and it just to sell it to the TV people I mean not that anyone ever makes an offer on those shows really and if they do it's always to the Mystery House the Mystery House always wins Yeah, it might as well be called, and finally, the good house.

9:01Finally, we haven't put it all in Act One. Yeah, exactly. But by and large, no one's going on that show really to buy a house. They're going on that show to be on television because it's really, really good fun. Well, I think that was a very good answer. It's a really good question as well. None of it came from me. Thank you, Shane. And Shane Rooney is a great name. It's like a League Two footballer. Yes, I love it. This is a question from John Johnston. Merry Christmas, John. Who is genuinely the loveliest person in showbiz? Some of the most popular presenters. Someone like Claudia Winkleman, who's absolutely lovely and people love, she's completely authentic and she works as a presenter because she's just like that in real life.

9:36There's absolutely no difference between what you see on the screen and how she'll be when she's with you. And there's a degree, I think you probably could, in light entertainment back in the 70s, as we can see, but now it's quite hard to fake those kind of really good connections with audiences. Yeah, I think so. It's hard, isn't it, because I've worked with so many millions of people and they'll all be furious. so I'm just trying to pick a name out of left field I would say I'll tell you who's lovely Clive Myrie is a very very lovely man and very talented The next one is from Simon Donnell and he says I'm curious to know to what extent if at all panel shows such as Have I Got News For You, Mock The Week, League Of Their Own etc are scripted beyond the presenter and what the panellists know in advance of filming That's such a good question Well I'll tell you Have I Got News For You is an interesting sort of that's sort of in the middle somewhere which is obviously the chairperson's script is written, so everything that's done down the camera is written.

10:31There's a team of really great joke writers, Sean Pye, Christine Rose, other people, who write great jokes, and that week's host does those jokes. There's also, of course, a lot of other business that the host does, which is not scripted. It's just questions on cards, and they can be off the cuff. In terms of panellists, if I go on, have I got news for you? So I was on a couple of weeks ago, and I knew the Boris and the inquiry where the COVID inquiry would come up and a new Rwanda would come up. So you can have a little think. And in the old days, I would make sure I had a couple of jokes just so I felt safe.

11:03And now I'll just go in with one thing. So you can predict roughly what's going to happen in the first round. Second round, third round, you don't know what's going to happen. And having produced those shows as well, the key thing is you don't want someone to come in with jokes written down because they try and crowbar them in and it breaks up the show. So Have I Got News for a lovely show? If I know I've got one thing under my belt, so I'm not going to panic in front of an audience. All the funny stuff is the off-the-cuff stuff. All the funny stuff is the running jokes from the start of the show, reacting to the other players.

11:33So Have I Got News for You is quite unscripted. One thing they give you is that final round, you know, the missing words. Yeah. When you turn up about an hour before recording. Over dinner they give you that just so you can have a little think about it. And pictures, anything like that. Might you see that in advance? You might see that, but not very long in advance. No. But by and large, in a kind of 27-minute show, other than the host, almost all of it is made up on the spot. And how long does the show take to record? A long time, two hours probably. Wow. It's a fun show to see because there's no recording breaks or anything like that.

12:04So it's literally like a two-hour version of Have I Got News For You? And Paul and Ian don't prep, if you know what I mean. I mean, they read the news, but they haven't got jokes worked out. So it's a fun show to watch that. A show like Mock the Week is very, very written because that's the format of the thing. You're asked certain questions. and however witty you are, there are certain things you can't all immediately think of a clever answer to lines you'd never hear in a TV advert. But equally, Dara on that show isn't really scripted and in the later series of it, he's very good with some of the younger comics and they chat and they're getting running jokes.

12:38So the really funny stuff, people know when something's not scripted, when someone says something they couldn't have possibly prepared. The show where there's no prep, there's no script, there's no nothing, and it's the most fun show to do is Would I Lie to You? So Would I Lie to You, which is just a dream. I think it's the best show on TV. So in that show, you'll do an interview with a researcher a few weeks before where you'll tell stories from your life. But after that, you know nothing until you sit there, you turn over a card, and it's either one of the stories you've told them or it's a lie that's just completely been made up and you have not seen it.

13:14No one has seen it. Rob hasn't seen it. Lee hasn't seen it. David hasn't. No one's seen it. and so that's completely unscripted which I think was why people love that because I worked uh with the team behind that the producers that might be the funniest man in the world um Peter Holmes whenever I go on it they give me the worst like they just give me I went on and they said um they said you turn over this card so you're literally sitting there Lee opposite you I'm sitting next to Tom Courtney or something you turn over this card and it just says when I was a child I invented a superhero called Snooker Table Boy who had three special powers and one arch enemy.

13:50Boom. And then Lee's straight on you. Okay, go on then. What were the powers? And you have zero time to prep. And that's why it's such a fun show because it is the fun, the panic of the thing and because the three of them are such good mates. League of Their Own, fairly scripted because there's people there who aren't comics and it's produced in such a way. But most shows, they have a certain structure, a certain spine, but every producer knows that the fun stuff, the good stuff is the stuff that comes off the back of that it's the stuff where people are extemporising there's such an, the immediacy of it and people know that it's just been come up with and there's a real rush to that even as the audience watching where you think there's no possible way they thought of that so you're much better disposed to jokes that are off the cuff I think as an audience always much much funnier if you know for a fact it couldn't have been written because the circumstances that led to it were so unusual the fastest guy at that the guy who can literally so buying it quite often in an edit, if there's like a few second pause and someone does a line, you might take a bit of air out of that.

14:48You might take a second out of it. Lee Mack is so fast, occasionally you have to put in a breath of air in between the set up and him coming back with an answer because you think there's absolutely no way he came up with that that quickly. So occasionally you genuinely have to put in an extra half second just so you believe that Lee came up with it. But his brain is so super fast. That's a good question. Now you never go on those shows. I presume they ask you. I have been asked very many times over the years. I suppose for a long time, I thought, for many, many years, I thought it was sort of quite sexist and it was, sometimes there would be one woman, but often there would be no women.

15:25And I always felt like, oh, it's just not necessarily my particular brand of humour. And also, you know, the chance to completely fuck your career in one night for a relatively small appearance fee never felt that appealing. So I always thought, and I also do have a slight thing, which I'm really keeping a lid on this podcast, which I often want to say the least appropriate thing in the situation. Listen, you must. It's Christmas. You must. To see what will happen. Marina, have another Bailey's. No, but I really, I was never sure that I could control it. When I was doing interviews for my book, actually, to some extent you were doing so many of them in a row and it becomes quite repetitive, as you know far better than me.

16:05But I, and I would always really have to stop myself from saying something just completely wild and inappropriate, just to see what would happen. And I always felt that there was that tendency within me. But also, but mainly I just felt like I just don't think, I think it's sort of set up for the hosts and the resident panellists and not necessarily for guests. Yeah, that's interesting. I would say Would I Lie to You is not like that. Actually, Hervon Watt News is not particularly like that. They're quite generous, Paul and Ian. Would you ever do Would I Lie to You, though? I suppose they could ask me.

16:38I don't feel I'm a front of camera person at all. I have no desire to do it. I'm a backstage person. I'm writing or chatting in front of a microphone like this. Yeah, so was I, though. I know. And look at me now. Look at you now. You love it. Exactly. Well, listen, I'm going to put a word in. Okay. You've got this hit podcast now. Listen, what I like to use is going to come call it. It'll be Taskmaster next. Oh, my God. I mean, do you wish – that's what I really wanted to ask you. Sorry, this isn't an audience question. do you wish you had come up with Taskmaster I know you've been on it and you are amazing on it do you wish no I'll tell you what though it was very helpful with House of Games so House of Games BBC once Pointless was going and I wanted to do something for BBC2 I said I want to do a show where it's the same contestants all week that's the thing I want to do I want to do like a sort of a quiz league and get a bit of the soap opera of the same contestants and they all went oh no I think yeah I think with our shows it needs to be different people I think probably and I was like I sort of thought I think it would be great to do it and then taskmaster came out and was a huge hit on dave and the next time i went in and said i wonder if we could do this quiz where it's the same contestants uh you know every day and they went you mean like taskmaster i went yeah like taskmaster they went yeah that sounds great it's a shame how much tv commissioning is like that but there we go in your slipstream you created something absolutely brilliant so uh yeah taskmaster did house of games a lot of favors that's a terrifying show i'll talk about my experiences on taskmaster at some point i Absolutely love Taskmaster.

18:06We're going to take a little Boxing Day break now. But straight after this break, I have a question for you, Marina, from Bob Bright that I want to hear the answer to as well. Bob, thanks for asking this. Have you, Marina, ever bumped into someone you have been less than kind to in the past? Reviews, etc., says Bob. And how do you deal with it? Have a little think over this break. This episode is brought to you by 20th Century Studios' new film, Springsteen, Deliver Me From Nowhere. starring Golden Globe winner Jeremy Allen White and Academy Award nominee Jeremy Strong. Scott Cooper, the director of the Academy Award-winning movie Crazy Heart, brings you the story of the most pivotal chapter in the life of an icon.

18:48Springsteen, deliver me from nowhere. Only in theaters October 24th. Get your tickets now. Eczema isn't always obvious, but it's real. And so is the relief from EBCLIS. After an initial dosing phase, about 4 in 10 people taking EBCLIS achieved itch relief and clear or almost clear skin at 16 weeks. And most of those people maintain skin that's still more clear at one year with monthly dosing. EBCLIS, LibriKizumab, LBKZ, a 250 milligram per two milliliter injection, is a prescription medicine used to treat adults and children 12 years of age and older who weigh at least 88 pounds or 40 kilograms with moderate to severe eczema.

19:25Also called atopic dermatitis that is not well controlled with prescription therapies used on the skin or topicals or who cannot use topical therapies. EBCLIS can be used with or without topical corticosteroids. Don't use if you're allergic to EBCLIS. Allergic reactions can occur that can be severe. Eye problems can occur. Tell your doctor if you have new or worsening eye problems. You should not receive a live vaccine when treated with EBCLIS. Before starting EBCLIS, tell your doctor if you have a parasitic infection. Searching for real relief? Ask your doctor about EBCLIS and visit ebglis.lily.com or call 1-800-LILY-RX or 1-800-545-5979.

19:55I'm Christian McCaffrey, pro running back, and Abercrombie is an official fashion partner of the NFL. I'm not kidding when I say NFL by Abercrombie broke the internet last year. And I think this season's lineup is even cooler. And so does my wife who keeps stealing all my hoodies. Stay fit for the season and Abercrombie's newest arrivals. Shop NFL by Abercrombie in the app, online and in store.

20:29We are back. Should I repeat the question from Bob Wright? Go on then. Marina, he asked, have you ever bumped into someone you've been less than kind to in the past and how do you deal with it? Okay, I should say that Steve Covington used to do a character called Paul Calf, which is a brilliant character. and in one of the earlier video diaries, the actor John Hanna actually says to him, do I know you from somewhere? And he goes, you threatened to hit me at the Cinetech a year ago? And he says, yeah, I mean, so many faces. And obviously given my output, in some ways, so many faces. I often can't remember the things, almost certainly can't remember the things I've written.

21:06And sometimes, I mean, there was one time I saw an actor and the look he gave me, I thought, yeah, I mean, I've obviously written something about you. Let me just Google your name and mine. And then I had a thought of like, ah, yes, okay. Now, Boris Johnson used to do this all the time. I didn't feel bad about anything I'd written by him. But if he saw me, he would glower really sort of performatively and kind of stare at me, which I always found so odd. I mean, Prime Minister, you're being very uncool. Just pretend you haven't read it. And I've told this story before, but I am going to tell it again because it's relevant to the material.

21:37Orson Welles, the great film director, actor, genius of Hollywood. Oh, what did you say about him? No, he had someone who used to write about him all the time, really nasty stuff in the sort of, you know, just a gossip columnist in the New York Daily News. And Orson Welles said, I always used to be, every time I saw him, I greeted him like an old friend, just so he'd never think I'd read a single word that he'd written. And this is the way to do it. Now, I have got one other, which, do you remember Gok Wan? Do I remember Gok Wan? Yeah, well, OK, fine. He's stood around. Yes, I know he is, but it's perhaps not as dominant as it was.

22:12And he'd done something, I can't remember, He'd herded a lot of women into a disused swimming pool and sort of power-hosed them. Was this for TV? Yes, it was. Yeah, okay. But does that entirely excuse you? I never quite got on board with the idea that he completely raised and uplifted women. Anyway, I wrote a really sarcastic, but it was sort of in praise of Gotwan. In my view, very, very sledgehammer sarcastic all the way through. And sort of, you know, resisted, it is your peril, all this sort of thing. but I thought it was a real like clobbering around the head with what I was actually saying.

22:47Anyway, afterwards, I got a card saying thank you from Gok Wan. And so I always thought, first of all, brilliant. Either he just totally didn't get it, in which case, well done, Marina. You've really cocked out the writing of that one. Or he did, but was pretending he didn't and had sent me a card. Either way, well played, Gok Wan. You got me. I love the fact that everybody is now Googling Marina Hyde Gok Wan so they can read the article. Do you remember what you wrote about me? Oh, the look of terror on your face. You never wrote about me. Oh, my God. Merry Christmas, Marina. Can you imagine?

23:22I just say to people, look, I'm just a complete arsehole. Just ignore me. Ignore me. But actually, often I have been right. God, that gave me an absolutely whitey, Richard. I'm so sorry. As I say, so many faces. The next is a question from George McMenemy, and it's slightly edited just for length. And he says, I wonder how much either of you have considered pro wrestling as a form of entertainment and your views on it. He mentions that people are quite snobbish about wrestling and because the predetermined nature. But I mean, lots of stories are predetermined. And he says you both seem more open in your philosophies of entertainment, even if it's not something you've considered before.

23:57So I would like to say that, yes, I really think of wrestling and entertainment. I think it's totally fascinating. I've read a great book actually about Vince McMahon, the great impresario of the WWE called Sex, Lies and Headlocks which I recommend as a sort of brilliant, not very long but really good fun sort of primer on the whole world of it all and I think that wrestling's taught us so much about how to look at the world and look at those types of stories and actually things like kayfabe, that kind of weird thing about what's artifice and what isn't people wrote really interesting things about Donald Trump and how he was best viewed through the lens of wrestling.

24:33You saw Trump turn up at a lot of wrestling before he became the person who was running for president. What about you? What do you think, Richard? Yeah, I love it. I always have loved it. And it's that snobbery is, yeah, but it's made up. You think, yeah, the people watching it know it's made up. Yeah. That's like me saying to you, you know, that succession is made up. Yes. You know that Jesse and they write, they know what's going to happen in the end. But it's made up brilliantly. And that's the point. And you know, you have these multi-generational storylines. By the way, talking about Vince McMahon book, there is an amazing book about 60s and 70s and 80s British wrestling.