The Real TV Rich List - REVEALED

23:00I don't know what he's on. I suspect it's more than you think Amal Rajan is on and less than Anton Decker on. But he's doing 200 of them. And, again, he brings an audience in a way that other people don't. People love Bradley Walsh. They love to watch him. And you launch a show with Bradley, you've got more chance of it working than if you launch a show with someone else. And you have to say that what you've just listed is a huge amount of work. He works a lot. Oh, yeah, he works. But, you know, he absolutely, he doesn't, so do lots of people, we understand that. I know, I get you, but compared to lots of the other presenters who are not doing so much.

23:31His year is busy. Yeah, it's packed full, yeah. Number three, Addison Hammond. I think because she has a combination of Bake Off, which is a huge franchise now, and the budget for which has gone crazy in recent years since it went to Channel 4. And, of course, she does This Morning as well, and she does For the Love of Dogs, all sorts of different things as well. So I think that, again, this is definitively not a real list. This is just from all of us talking together, trying to work out who fits where. And she came on at number three. Alison, if you're number four, I apologize. If you're number two, I apologize.

24:07Whichever you'd rather be. So we've got her at number three. At number four, we've got Jimmy Carr. Because Jimmy, he does a lot of formats for commercial television. So he does, you know, I literally just told you on Channel 4, he does Cats does Countdown still for four. And of course now he does Last One Laughing, which is an enormous hit and is going to remain an enormous hit for a number of series. So you're counting streamers in this. I find it so hard to, it's hard. I think you have to because there's so few entertainment shows on streamers. You simply have to. And because you can't, if you are ever, for example, if someone wants to book you on a panel show for Sky, they pay you 10 times as much.

24:48Yes, exactly. And so you have, which is why you will see big names doing those things. So I think it's crazy not to, and there's another couple of names down here who definitely benefit from that. So I'm going to say Jimmy Carr, Lee Mack. Yeah. Lee Mack, simply because, and again, not from what I lied to you, but just because 1 % Club has been such an enormous, like, juggernaut of a hit. And so you can sort of name his price because those are the sort of hits that advertisers come to channels for. and that's been absolutely... He doesn't have to name his price, I should also say, because he's represented by someone we could just do a little quick sidebar and he's represented by Avalon, who perhaps are our listeners.

25:27Avalon, who are like a talent management and production company, they are, I mean, maybe, I think it'd be hard to argue with the idea that they're Britain's most successful indie, almost, because of what they do, but they are famously, what's the euphemism? Drive a hard bargain? I drive a hard bargain. I think there's so many euphemisms. I can only speak in euphemisms about it. As everyone, actually people in the industry, when they're not doing a podcast, do not speak in euphemisms about them. But they've always, always driven a hard bargain. Yeah, I think also, were they to express a preference, and I wouldn't say that they would, I think their preference, they might express the preference that they'd rather keep their talent on Avalon shows than put them on other people's shows.

26:07So you can, which is sort of a double bubble. They might argue with that. They might, yeah. They wouldn't argue with that. But people don't leave. And also, if they do leave, then often they own the formats that they're in. And so this is why you can't see them on your television anymore. Yes, exactly. This is why you can't see TV Burp anymore. Well, number six, I'm going to go joint Claudia and Michael McIntyre. Only because they've both got huge shows on the BBC and shows that sort of run and run and run. And they've both got two huge shows that are almost on season, off season. And, you know, Traitors now because it's celebrity and it's regular.

26:40and you've got Strictly, which runs and runs and runs and runs. I think that probably puts Claudia on the list. And also because she does ITV shows as well. She does The Piano. She does that One Question as well, which she'll be remunerated for, I suspect. And Michael McIntyre, yes, again, because he does those huge shows, there's The Wheel and The Big Show. And also because that is somebody who literally, he could be getting 75 grand a night just doing a gig. you sort of that's the thing that people who commission and whatever say that comedians are really really hard to price because they're already in general quite rich very rich really and you've got a show that you want to spend a million quid an hour on and then you think well I mean you know Greg Davis might want 150k to do it I mean you're not necessarily going to give it to them but they can make such a lot of money touring and they do make such a lot of money touring but you do need people to be on the front of your shows and they can't always be a particular type you know you want comedians to be on lots of them because for obvious reasons.

27:41I always used to say years ago, whenever you book a comedian, they should do it for free because you're selling their tickets for them. And by the way, I was right. But it didn't catch on with agents or with comedians. But if you had said, okay, no comedians ever getting paid again to come on these shows, you'd still get a steady stream of people coming on, you know, because they know what they're doing. You know, so much telly now is a lost leader. And, you know, if you do something like Mr. Beast going to Amazon Prime, now he did not make a penny out of that show. I mean, quite the opposite.

28:13It probably cost him somewhere around$60 million just to make that show. At seven, I'm going to say Romesh Ranganathan. Because Romesh, well, firstly, he does a radio show, but, you know, he'll do things like Weakest Link, but mainly because he does lots for Sky. And he'll do, you know, League of Their Own, and he'll do Robin Romesh, and all of those things. So he has lots of different income streams. The most important ones will be the Sky income streams. He'll be on an awful lot of money for that. He might be further up that list, but I've demurred. And then Clarkson is definitely there because of who wants to be a millionaire and because of Clarkson's Farm.

28:49And again, he's doing that Mr. Beast thing of, you know, not that fussed what you pay me for Clarkson's Farm because this is a commercial enterprise and there's lots of different ways for me to monetize this and to get this in front of people's idols. But for Clarkson's Farm, the thing about those shows is that we know about what happens on Prime shows is that people get paid just beyond money because it's a rounding error for the Everything Corporation. They want you to buy stuff and they have a market map and each of those shows really carefully addresses. And Mr. Beast was one of them. What they paid him was extraordinary.

29:22He happened to have spent it all because of the extraordinary nature of the show. But Clarkson's Farm is somewhat cheaper to make. Yes. Yeah. I wouldn't say it's not super cheap, but it's somewhat cheaper. It's no Beast Games. Although it has lots of beasts. So he will be on an absolute 40. By the way, some of these can be moving up and down this top 10. So if anyone's listening, I would love people on this list to just message us and say, I should have been lower or I should have been higher. I'm interested in the personality types of people. All you have to do is do it on the record. If you do it on the record, just ring in and we'll read you out loud exactly what you said.

29:57So Jeremy, if you think you're higher than eight, do please let us know. And then the bottom of the list is slightly bottom of the list. I mean, these are the 10 highest paid people. But lots of different names came through on the bottom of the list. I'll go through some of them. Joel Domit, who I suspect might be there because he does Masked Singer and he does National Television Awards. And he has, you know, an aesthetic and he has a youthfulness and he does an ITB game show now as well. It feels like Send for Joel. Yeah, he's an investment presenter. And also such a deeply lovely man. He used to do warm-up for Pointless.

30:30Did he actually? In the early days, yeah. Oh, that's fun. So in the first three series of Pointless, there's Joel being paid 250 quid a show, me being paid nothing because I was the creative director, so I always said, don't pay me. And Zander on 90 ,000 a show. No. Notice I haven't put Zander on the show, even though he does 200 shows a year. That's because it's the BBC. So maybe Joel Domit, maybe someone like Susanna Reid or Lorraine, just because they're doing 200, 250 shows a year. but actually Lorraine does fewer these days. And because they have shows that bring in a regular audience and that, you know, and they have...

31:05Yeah, no, I don't think they'd quite make it just on the basis of... I don't think they would. I mean, listen, they might not be making as much as Lineker, but they're certainly making more than Zoe Ball, who was second on the list at 500 ,000. Oh, yeah, I mean, as we said, the original list is just a nonsense. Jeremy Vine, I'm going to say now, because he's already on the BBC list at something like... He's already on the BBC list at 310 ,000 on Channel 5, where it's literally the Jeremy Vine channel. He does the Jeremy Vine show. He did Eggheads. You know, there's Jeremy Vine's House of Games, their new series.

31:41And so they're paying him. They're not paying him what ITV would pay him or what Channel 4 would pay him even, but they are paying him. And you add in the BBC thing as well. And I suspect he'd be right up there. Dermot, of course, because of this morning and because he's done a few streaming shows as well. So he won't be skipping a meal anytime soon. So that would be roughly our top 10. I'm sort of, you know, at the bottom of that list. I'm spreading it out a bit because none of us could agree. But I think it sort of shows you what the market is. And you can argue whether that market's good or bad.

32:16But, you know, a lot of these people have another way of making money and, you know, provably bringing an audience. but it also I hope shows you how dwarfed those BBC salaries are I know they sound absurd and ridiculous most of the people at the top of that is because they're doing you know 300 shows and they're doing lots of different things and you know it kind of all adds up but it's uh it's it's a lucrative business entertainment you know like sport is a lucrative business and music is a lucrative business but I just having looked at that BBC list and it's hard because how do you compete and you know and get those people to come on the BBC um so you do have to pay but it is you do pay an awful lot less but it's still you know what we should say and what they do say when they are trying to get people to compete is you don't get exposure like that almost anywhere else more people are going to watch you here yeah than anywhere else more people will watch you as you say they'll send your tickets they'll do whatever it is you'll get more corporates whatever it may be yeah all the sort of you know subsidiary stuff um but that's an argument that's very slowly disappearing you know because well because you just don't get a huge amount of exposure sometimes on a even on a bbc show i mean you know there's it's it's just it used to be that you know on a mediocre show five million people would watch you sure i mean i think it's good to have it because all of these people are now so diversified and any that's one thing that we do know you know in the old days used to be a light entertainment presenter and that's it and now we see people with clotheslines and you know lifestyle portals and all sorts of other things and they're brand ambassadors and they're everything else so it's it within that it's good to have a psb show yeah within that because and it almost unless you have that you can't describe something that pays them 400 000 i can't describe it as a loss leader but to some extent you need that in order to have all the other bits yeah oh i forgot to say also we were arguing about for number 10 possibly greg davies only because he does buzzcox for a big um you know streamer and he does taskmaster and that's a mammoth mammoth hit and again a mammoth hit that was bought in from another channel and so is uh is uh is funded at quite a premium yeah like bake-off and so maybe with those two things together he's up there but i i don't think even though bake-off as they've showed by simply taking it to another format and getting rid of half the presenters.

34:34It's the format that people are watching and it's not the presenters. So despite the fact we know that and it's been actually demonstrably proved. Because if you look at some of the most loved British TV presenters out there, look at Stacey Solomon, look at Ryland, look at Alison Hammond, they all started on reality TV shows. They were not comedians, they were not local journalists who sort of worked their way up. They were just people who appeared on screen and people immediately liked them. People immediately went, I want this person to be in my living room. And there are loads of people out there who don't want to be on Big Brother or Pop Idol or Britain's Got Talent who would have that same charm if only there were a way to find them.

35:14The truth is, you would put them on very, very cheaply for the first series. The second that series was a hit, they would be on exactly the same money as all of these people because that's the market. But I'm a great believer that there are generations of people out there who could present television shows. you know oh yeah there's people at the top michael mcintyre anton deck claudia people you just think no okay absolutely get it you know but there is a level at which you think yeah i think we could probably replace you with somebody cheaper my uh radical proposal for these things would be the one thing in telly is always you have a hit and yet the money doesn't go up so you have this massive hit and the you know certainly on the on the bbc usually the money goes down because it has to um the world of podcasts is very very interesting so in the world of podcasts this is my dream always always always and it's what happens in some podcasts no and actually funnily enough the bbc is an exception to this but in the world of podcasts most of the hit podcasts i know people do not get paid you do you do not get an upfront fee what you get is if it's successful you get more money because you get a revenue share of the advertising yeah which to me as a producer was the business i was always in which is so bbc is different that's and that's looking after British creativity and all that stuff.

36:26But on ITV and Channel 4, all I'm doing is giving you something that you can sell to an advertiser. You are then selling that to an advertiser. 15 different people are taking chunks of that money. I tell you, somebody who isn't taking any of that money, me. So as a producer, you get your 10 % fee and then it doesn't matter how well you did with it, you're not going to get more. If one week you get 3 million, the next week you get 4 million you don't suddenly get a 33 uplift in your money and i would love tv to be made like that which is no one gets paid apart from the crew but production all that we don't get paid until the numbers come in and if we get paid more if if the numbers are bigger and bigger then you get paid more and more imagine that imagine that that would never happen yeah yeah i mean you've got to back yourself at some point yeah listen it happens in an informal away because Ant and Dec didn't start on the money they're on, they had a series of hits and so they did it but it's very interesting the podcast thing of people just doing it for nothing and then you know the more successful it is the more money you make, like music the more records you sell the more money you make and TV is one of the few industries where that doesn't quite follow There's that extra layer of friction or skimming off or whatever you want to call it Yeah, I would call it skimming off Also worth noting that every single channel spends all year focus grouping every single presenter they've ever had.

37:49So whenever people go, you've got Greg Waddesk and people go, but he wasn't even a good presenter. People didn't even like him. But I mean, you don't want to hear it, but they did. Right. They loved him. I saw so many people this week saying, why don't they just cancel this tired show? Oh no, I'm so sorry. It's because people really like MasterChef. All this other thing. Cancel the sewing ones and this one. So like, no, no, no. They're all really popular because people like them. Yeah. I guess it's interesting. If you're the main character in your own story, then if you don't like something, then everyone hates it.

38:17But the numbers... We do have some local ratings, which allows us to see that other people do like these things. And those, you know, if you go, oh, God, I don't want to watch Alison Hammond. I tell you, who wants to watch Alison Hammond? Two groups of people, me and most of the British public. And they know that week after week after week because they're constantly asking and people are constantly saying, yep. I like her. We love her. Exactly. And so, you know, if it's ever a mystery to you why someone's on TV, it's probably because other people disagree with you. I mean, listen, there are some...

38:48You've lifted the curtain there. Yeah. Right. I think we must, after that, curtail this because we could spill this tea forever. But shall we go to a break? Yes. Yes. Let's monetize that.

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41:01state law. Not available in all states.

41:14Welcome back, everyone. Welcome back. Now... Plenty of headlines there. This should be a headline. What is growing four times faster than the UK economy and is now worth £30.4 billion to it every single year? Is it Amal Rajan's wage packet? It is the beauty industry and the value of beauty, which is an annual report compiled by Oxford Economics, and it's commissioned by the British Beauty Council. It's fascinating. I mean, this is a sector that, unlike the creative industries, you will, although it is linked, and that's how we're going to get onto it, but you'll never see a cabinet minister out there talking about it.

41:51It employs more people than are in publishing and broadcasting. Put together, its direct contribution to GDP is more than the whole sports and recreation sector. So more than going to football, museum, parks, concerts, all of that. And it makes up over 1 % of the UK's economic output. It's part services, it's part goods. We know all of this. It's like a little beauty spot for British services. Very good. Thank you. Brexit slightly slowed the recovery. But it's interesting. It's something that particularly took off or was accelerated and catalyzed during the pandemic. And a big part of that is because people saw themselves on screen.

42:37So many people saw themselves on screen. I remember that Caroline Hirons, who is someone who is a very significant player in this sort of thing, saying, people just couldn't stand it. They were looking at their faces thinking, and obviously no one really understood the technology so it took them like the whole first lockdown to work out how they didn't have to look at themselves while they were having a meeting with somebody. I still do that. No, so do I. I mean, can be. And you're just thinking, gosh, I mean... If I'm being really professional, I will look at the little lights but it's so difficult to do.

43:02Yeah. And people are just mesmerised by their own flaws or whatever it is. It really took off. And so when we're talking about beauty, I should say we're talking about skincare, makeup, hair care, fragrance, sort of tools and devices and there's obviously a service element to it as well. but it's become huge via screens and sort of beauty attainment as it were is absolutely massive like tiktok is now the fourth biggest beauty retailer in the whole uk isn't retailer yeah in terms of shop window or stuff people are buying well first of all if you go into a boot you will now see which you we've seen for a while in bookshops you know book talk or whatever you'll now see as seen on tiktok in chemists and they have to really be sort of nimble with it because all these trends are happening all the time.

43:47I like, by the way, as seen on TikTok because you can literally download anything to TikTok. You know, you can have your local garage can go as seen on TikTok because they just overloaded a video. But yes, it's... But it's become such a sort of thing that people are drawn... And so they've made whole breakout, bricks and mortar areas of their shops. And it's interesting because, I mean, I suppose in the old days, you know, that whole idea of shopping as entertainment. I used to be mesmerized by shopping channels. I remember when they first came to the UK, I'd be like, this is so cool. You know, I love that novel, Cellavision, that Augustin Burroughs novel about kind of those places.

44:18And I was absolutely gripped by the relationships, as I imagined them, between the hosts, whether they hate each other, whether they liked each other. I love to see washed up celebrities doing infomercials. OK, all of that has gone on its head now. Nobody washed up does infomercials. I mean, you look at brands like Selena Gomez's brand Rare Beauty, which is on sale in the biggest retailer in the world, really, for this sort of thing is Sephora. Hayley Bieber, who's got her brand Rode. Selena Gomez's brand is valued at$2 billion. Hayley Bieber's is just valued at$1 billion. She basically started what used to be called a direct consumer marketing thing.

44:54She had about eight products. It's now worth a billion. It's going into Sephora. And it's really, it's a little bit like that Gore Vidal quote. You know, it's not enough for Hayley to succeed. Selena must fail. So they're already being sort of pitied against each other in terms of what it will do to your shelf real estate in these places. Oh, I just think fair play to you for both being billionaires. I mean, it's unbelievable. But it's unbelievable. You couldn't have done this before. And people couldn't do this. They have these celebrities via screens of all different types, via different types of social media, and with very, very few products, have leveraged their brands into these huge businesses that are sort of unrivaled by people who are in those businesses to start with.

45:36And I think it's very interesting. Shoppable entertainment is, you know, as I say, what was once a sort of niche thing that I, as a young person who wasn't going out anywhere, might watch. Or, you know, we imagined bored Floridian housewives were sitting there buying, you know, diamond rings or whatever they were buying off QVC. Shoppable entertainment is everything now. Well, I remember, you know, even 15 years ago, you'd sit in production meetings and, you know, people would say, oh, we could get some product placement on this. And everyone would go, oh, I don't know, I don't know about that.

46:04And now you think it's not like, oh, I've got a, you know, can of Diet Coke here, let's get some money. It's literally, you can make programs about your own things. Yeah. You know, and people consume it. They watch your advert as entertainment, then go out and buy your product afterwards. They watch a Get Ready With Me video. You know, they would rather watch that than whatever is on ITV at that time, or BBC, or whatever it is. Every time I see one, I really, really, really see the appeal. So do I. Yeah. That's sort of mesmerizing. They look amazing. Yeah. And, you know, when I watch it, I get that there's a commercial thing, and, you know, people are selling.

46:34I'm slightly mesmerized when I see it. I love the... Well, you get that it's an authentic presenter and that it's essentially a format, right? Yes, and that they're doing something they're good at and they care about. Yeah. Is what I sense whenever I see those things. Yes, I mean, you can literally see the views happening and then you can see the click through. And it's really interesting. The UK, this is another thing that's come out recently. The UK is TikTok's most advanced e-commerce market outside of Asia. Yes, number one. So we're, you know, we're leading the way on this stuff, Richard. Whether we're leading the way to a good place, I don't know.

47:05But it's really interesting because it's really interesting how brands themselves have had to adapt to this being entertainment. As we know in entertainment, you know, you want a new episode and you want something different. So brands that used to just be like, okay, well, we'll bring out three lipsticks this year and we'll leave it at that. Now you constantly need drops and all of the, and they've had to completely adapt. Other brands that didn't start like this, didn't start as kind of a person on TikTok, just kind of, and suddenly building up a billion dollar business. They've had to adapt to this kind of thing and they've had to become much more nimble.

47:35But it's so interesting that it's all a form of shoppable entertainment. And also that the money goes from, you know, if you are a skincare brand or even if you're boots, the money that you would spend on filmed adverts that you then placed on television programs, which would have been through the roof huge. You now go, we're going to take all that money. It's like we were talking about podcasts in the previous thing. We're going to take that money. We're going to give it directly to someone who speaks to our audience and get them to make something that doesn't cost very much. Put it in a get ready with me video.

48:05And, you know, the person making it is getting more money. The brand is having to spend less money. And the result is 10 times bigger than it would have been. And it's so much less of a gamble than, like, everyone hates your Christmas advert or whatever it is. All of those things are starting to feel sort of... One of my favorite side things in entertainment these days is because everyone, you know, there's not a marketing department in the country that doesn't try and do these things. I love seeing failed versions of these. I love it when people try and get something trending, or they try and get a hashtag going, or they try and get some sort of signature move going, and it doesn't work.

48:38And you see, you can just sort of see the desperation. What an old, like almost like a legacy brand tries to create one of those organic online moments. I see. Yeah, okay. There was even like a few years ago, they even, there was that sort of very brief interregnum where big brands were kind of going, oh, let's do an advert. But like, it's like an influencer, and they're doing this thing. and we'll shoot it like it's an influencer doing like a kind of online video and that would be great. You go, why don't you just get an influencer to do the online video? Because, you know, people already like them.

49:06They always had to feel, they had to put some inverted commas around it. And in fact, it's all been blown away. But as we've talked about before, people are, and social media to some extent, as people have always said, you're just participating in something in which the product is you and you're giving companies your data. But that line between advertorial and entertainment which used to be, as you say, either sort of morally frowned upon or just regarded as really naff, like QVC and infomercials, the sort of naff. But that has completely gone. It's definitely not something you do when you're washed up anymore.

49:39It's something that, you know, hot and talented young 28-year-old women do and then become billionaires. Well, and also, you know, you never ever meet any presenter of any stripe at all who wasn't kind of going, what can I do? What can I do that, you know, because they sort of see now that rather than someone just paying you to present a TV show out of money that comes from advertisers. For example, me. I mean, there is not a brand in the world that would increase its share if I advertised it, right? I don't believe that. No, but there isn't. What about your voice? And if it was something, it would not be something that has a high market capitalization.

50:11I get that. It would be snookables or something. That's not for me. But, you know, all sorts of presenters, they're all kind of, what can I do? What is it that I can do? Where can I, how can I monetize this? And as you say, 10, 15 years ago, that everyone would have turned their noses up at it. Everyone would go, no, I'm not going to do this. I'm not going to, you know, hawk that. And now they kind of go, what can I hawk? What have you got? I remember when we first started doing this podcast before, and you and I were talking about it, and you said, I don't care about things like the adverts because, as I will say to anyone, unless you work on the BBC, you've been in an advertiser-funded medium forever.

50:42So what is the difference? You're just holding your hanky to your nose like some pretentious thing. If you think that if you're on a channel for an ITV show, the thing that happens in the commercial breaks is nothing to do with it. People say sometimes, I've never advertised that. You go, listen, here's the news. You've been advertising it for many, many, many years. Exactly. You have. You can't have it both ways. Either it's okay or it's not okay. But that's why all those people make so much money, all those middlemen, because they go between you and the advertisers. So you never have to meet them.

51:07They're still paying you. We're talking about skimming off again, aren't we? We are talking about skimming off. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But the great skimmers off are in retreat now. Yeah, they've faded away. And now they've all become Instagram influencer managers, which is I think the biggest growing industry in the UK. Is that the growth sector? Yeah, you look at the latest census. I think there are now more Instagram influencer managers than there are miners. And people who believe in the Jedi. Yeah. Where does it go next, do you think, this sort of thing? Because it feels like it feels so enormous and so ubiquitous.

51:39And as you say, you've got people making billions out of this. There comes a point, surely, where that market becomes saturated. I mean, obviously, there's huge money to be made in very natural makeup and all of those things. Don't bet against making women feel crap about themselves. I mean, that's the thing, isn't it? Don't have a bet against that. I mean, the nice thing is now they're trying to do it to men as well. Because they're thinking, hold on a minute. But it's working. It's like Philip Morris, tobacco. They're going, hold on, we forgot China. Why don't we... Oh my gosh, why haven't we killed millions of people there?

52:07And the whole beauty industry thinking, hold on a minute. Men are feeling pretty good about themselves. Well, this report was very interesting. because they were saying that more young men in the sort of, I think it was 18 to 23, had had Botox than women in that. Yeah, this looks maxing, this whole big online trend is absolutely huge. I didn't know what the fillers were particularly, but whenever Ingrid sees a young person with fillers, she's like, now I recognise them. Now I see a filler. You've become filler literate. I've become filler literate. And it's all like youngsters. They look the same as the 40-year-old women.

52:39It's just a sort of homogenized face that is incredibly linked and defined by the platforms. You know, the idea that someone can talk about Instagram face, the aesthetic is, I don't want to say decreed by Mark Zuckerberg, but it's effectively handed down, you know, via his medium. We are literally becoming our own uncanny valley. Yes. People who look almost like a human being. But they don't in real life look like human beings at all, actually. where they look like human beings and where they look of a piece with what they're looking at is on the platforms. So on screen, people actually used to say this about celebrities.

53:16Oh, it was quite shocking when I saw her. You know, I happened to see so-and-so on a wherever it was. And I was shocked by what she looked like. First of all, she was tiny, much, you know, they're always much thinner than you possibly think. This is, I'm talking about, this is going back 20, 30 years. People would say that. They look very odd off camera, but everyone now is on camera all the time. And so everyone has a sort of camera face. Yeah, hello to our YouTube viewers, by the way. This is, we're both all natural. Part of my highlights. Which are delightful, by the way. Thank you. We're done on Tuesday.

53:47Who is that, by the way? Who does this? My hair. Yeah. Someone called Josh. Josh Wood, who is wonderful. Josh Wood. Yeah, he's wonderful. Ching, ching, ching, ching, ching, ching. He's a listener to this podcast, by the way. Is he? He is very, very good to me. Let me just put it that way. He's a wonderful person. Pauline does my hair. Thank you, Pauline. Yeah, she was my pointless makeup artist, if you know what I mean. And yeah, now she's my Josh Wood. So that's beauty. Yeah, that's beauty. We've done beauty. All the way from Hayley Bieber to Josh Wood. We are now going to conclude this episode of the podcast by me saying to you, have you got any recommendations?

54:22I do. I have a very strong recommendation this week. I think we have a new proper, proper massive hit on our hands, which is bookish, the Mark Gatiss detective drama, which is on you and Alibi. You can see it on Now TV as well. It's so great. He's incredible. I literally, I mean, he is a national treasure beyond all doubt. He plays Book, who is a bookseller. Please stay with us. But it's sort of set just after the war in London. And he's sort of a detective, sort of a bookseller. It's so cool. Surrounded by a brilliantly cast and brilliantly acted sort of gang as well. I was watching it, fingers crossed, thinking, if this is as good as the people involved, then this is going to be amazing.

55:01And it really, really, really is. Honestly, I thought it was terrific. you know when you watch something you just think oh this is going to be on for years this is my recommendation too I absolutely loved it I love him I think pure joy from start to finish yeah and just every every actor in it absolutely doing a terrific job but we've watched the first two and I'll literally be going home you're now in that rationing stage where it's that good that you want it's one of those shows you like to ration 100 % that it's exactly that on that note we will be back on Thursday with our question and answers episode yep we have another bonus episode concerning British sitcoms don't forget to try and count down the greatest British sitcoms of all time please members vote and if you want to join the club it's at therestosentertainment.com and you get ad-free listening and various other things besides that felt like a long podcast that was a long podcast I mean to be fair it's the first time we've ever done a tight half hour on Amal Rajan you know and so I guess if you're doing that it tends to spread out right I think it does right we'll be back for a properly timed questions and answers edition on Thursday.

56:04See you then. Bye-bye.

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