The Steven Bartlett Podcast Pile-On

27:55Yeah, that's right. We're excited too. See you soon.

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28:33Welcome back, everybody. Now, I would like to offer you, Richard, a field guide to celebrity destination weddings. Yes, please. Because we've just had a very big one. Both of them are celebrities, Dua Lipa and Callum Town, who've just got married. Huge congratulations. I love both of these people. And they've just got married in Sicily in Palermo. Now, first of all, destination weddings, a lot of people have a view on them. Yes, I do. Yeah, yeah, I'm sure. And it's, you know, in civilian life, you know, you can end up having conversations like, sorry, they're getting married in Mexico. And for some reason, the Henrik and his Mykonos, unacceptable, right?

29:10This is totally unacceptable. I've got nine weddings this summer. Okay, but these are not our ways. Okay, we're talking about celebrities here. Right, so let me explain to you what you have to do. This is the exact playbook, right? Before you go to the destination, the week before, you get married in either Chelsea Old Town Hall registry office or Marylebone Town Hall registry office. Both of them are in London. These are the only two options. Yeah. They did Marylebone. There are only three outfit options for the bride. Vivian Westwood put a mini dress, a white trouser suit, or a pretty much exact replica of Bianca Jaggers when she married Mick.

29:52What does that look like? It's like a cream suit, but skirt suit, midi skirt, with a big white hat. Probably Yves Saint Laurent, but don't quote me. Yes. Wait, hold on. I'm just going to bring up a newspaper and quote you. Yeah, no, Marina said, yeah, she said that Bianca Jaggers... She said it was Yves Saint Laurent. Yves Saint Laurent yeah from Marina Hyde yeah exactly bombshell yeah I know I won't quote you anyhow those are the only three outfit choices okay Dua Lipa chose option three the Bianca Jagger did she? I believe that's Yves Saint Laurent right I'm told yeah for the man there's only one choice no one cares about the man's right just don't bother like a dark suit no one's in well Mick was in a light suit of course was he?

30:34three piece but was Callum in the OG I don't know. I literally couldn't care less what the man wears to the registry office. Don't draw focus, right? No, don't. Yeah, exactly. Even if he is going to be James Bond. And I think the civilians, well, we'll get to that. Civilians only for that, because you don't want, you know, you're not going to have Elton hanging around on the Marylebone Road chucking some dried rose petals. Oh, so for the registry office bit. For the registry office bit. Anyway, then you have to decide where your destination will be. Italy is currently very popular. You know, you've got Lake Como, Tuscany, Sicily, Venice.

31:06There's an awful lot of tax dodgers living there. Yeah, yeah. And then, so it's going to be very expensive, right? So it's better if you picked your venue off the telly so that people can say, and this one people keep saying where Julie and Callum Turner got married, they keep saying, oh, it's in the credits of the White Lotus season two. Okay, it's not. But misreporting is also a very important feature of celebrity destination weddings. So which is good. It needs a balcony. It needs a balcony where you can emerge for the hypoloid to merge and give something to the paparazzi, a wave as if to say, you know, obviously you can't come in, but I know I have a huge fandom.

31:44So we saw Dua Lipa on her balcony. And you also need to have a balcony where you can emerge the next morning so people can say after you've been partying until 6 a.m. This is all very important that they can get a long lens of you. Now, the build-up, the local media, which we picked up over here, the local media both loves and hates you. It's not a celebrity destination if the local media doesn't both love and hate you, if I had some road clothes, whatever. This is quite a new thing. When George Clooney and Amal got married in Venice and they sort of took over the whole thing, no one really cared.

32:15Obviously, when Lauren Sanchez, friend of the podcast, and Jeff Bezos were there. Hi, Lauren. Hey, Jeff. People cared more. So you get a lot of these kind of boring articles about, you know, oh, you're turning it into a theme park and something to do with the climate and so on like that. I don't know. I don't know. This is all part of it. Something to do with the climate. Something to do with the climate. All right, Stephen Bartlett. You start asking for a toaster for your wedding because you're setting up a house. Now, unless you're judged to have temporarily ruined a 17th century city-state, be it Palermo, be it Venice, you haven't really had a proper celebrity destination wedding.

32:53So we saw a lot of people saying about Dua Lipa and Callum, you know, Palermo is not someone's living room. What? But anyway, you just need to get a few locals to say things like that. Ruining a city is your uncle being sick in a font of modern weddings. Yeah. Yes. Yes. It's absolutely essential. Now, you need a series of dresses. Nobody has just one. And I saw that we don't know what dress Dua Lipa wore. No way. Yeah, but we will find out. Yeah, we better. We will do. But Donatella Versace was there. That's the other thing. The designer comes to the wedding. Oh, no. I know. Funny enough, actually, Kieran was once...

33:31In case there's any sewing needs doing? Well, I think you didn't know. You know, it's like you split it or something. You just invite them. It's sort of, it's full. Okay, so I don't know. I'm guessing that it was a Versace dress because otherwise... Why is she there? Donatella's a bit of a random attendant. She'd be gutted if she turns up and it's George Asda. Yeah, I know. It's almost rude. Okay. Now, somebody famous has to do a song. Obviously, it goes without saying that Elton is the pinnacle. Yeah. But if not, Robbie will do it. Yes. Now, Elton did do the song. Did he? Yes, yes. I think it's almost always your song.

34:01Yeah, yeah. A lot of people have been able to tell everybody that this is their song. That's ironic, isn't it? Yeah. And the guest list is kind of a bit shady here because we don't yet know. And they're very, very good. It's exclusive if your guests are the sort of people who know they're not allowed to put anything anywhere near social media or anything like that. So there's all kind of rumours. Maybe Robbie that was there, maybe he would have to step into the breach if Elton can't do it for one reason or another. Yeah. Anyhow, I feel like we should discover at some point that Eva Longoria attended.

34:31Don't ask me why. She's the zealot of all celebrity weddings. She was there when Victoria danced on Brooklyn. Was she? Yeah, very much there. Serena Williams. I know she just presented some humanitarian award to Lauren Sanchez 15 minutes before. Did she? I bet Serena Williams is a celebrity wedding I'd quite like to go to. I bet that would be fun. You would have got quite a lot of good people there. I think Katy Perry and Justin Trudeau, she's becoming a bit of a zelig. Really? Those two, I think they might be the new Longoria of guests. He's loving his life, Justin Trudeau. Do you know who reminds me more of day after day?

35:07Who? Portillo. Because it's like he did the political thing and now he's like, oh, I can just go like, you know, he's like, I can just hang out with Katy Perry and go around the world. In the same way that Portillo goes, oh, I can just do train rides now forever and ever and people like me. Yeah. I can live without Justin Trudeau's train rides program. Okay. But the logistics, you've got a lot of private jets. So then we have to have a lot of articles about how do they all, same which we had for the Bezos wedding. It's a small airport, is it? We don't even know. But you're made to think that Palermo is like this absolutely tiny kind of thing.

35:44It's not, by the way, it's not. It's like a major international hub. And the private jets are arriving. By the way, I read this really interesting article last week about this guy. He built a private jet tracker of basically Silicon Valley private jets because he thought that if there is an apocalypse, it's an apocalypse tractor, that they'll know first. And by the way, in my view, they'll have caused it. But that's how they'll know first. Yeah, and you'll know because it's a bit like the great noise of the private jets. A bit like in the ancient world when there was thundering, they thought the gods were displeased.

36:19We all think, oh, right, there's so many private jets suddenly. They're all heading to Alaska. Yeah, or New Zealand where they've got their bunkers. That's what my brother's new book is about. I know. You've told me this before. I'm dying for this. It's really good. Yeah. It's really good. It's really interesting. That whole world is very, very interesting. That whole world is mental. Yeah. But it's absolutely right. The second five of them go to Alaska or New Zealand at the same time. You're like, oh, great. Yeah. It's over and you're not going to be able to get out. Anyway, the other thing with celebrity destination weddings is, could it help with work projects?

36:51Look, I'm just saying, for Callum Turner, is him being bathed in Sicilian light in a white dinner jacket at this stage, in a certain audition process, the worst thing? That's interesting. Is it going to give him the edge over Jacob? I don't know. I don't know whether it is. But for me, it's going to be between those two. And as I said before, I thought they were leaning in one direction, but we don't know. And you don't know who says yes. That's a lucky side effect, though, isn't it? Yeah. They're not going to Palermo because of Bond. They're going to Palermo for all the other many, many reasons that you're talking about.

37:22Let's think about synergies, Richard, because I can assure you their agents are. You've got to have synergies. Yeah. So that sort of covers your celebrity wedding. The next one, which obviously we're going to have to go big on on this podcast, is Taylor and Travis. These reports that are so nuts that I cannot believe they're true, but there have been a number of reports in recent days saying that Taylor Swift and Travis Kelsey are getting married at Madison Square Garden. We know they're getting married in New York, but they're getting married at Madison Square Garden. Wow, in the ring. Like the Moonies.

37:55I mean, also you work there. It's like me renewing my vows here. She works there. Sometimes, not always, but sometimes she works there. I just, anyway, if this is true. They'd really have to dress it up. Yeah. Because it's supposed to be, it's not going to look like an Oxfordshire church, is it? No, it's not going to. Or a Grand Palazzo. No, it's, I mean, you could sell tickets to it. I don't know. This can't be true, can it? Oh, yeah. I wonder if she'll get fans to go. Oh, of course. Yeah, maybe there'll be something of that. I don't know. But what's your general opinion on a destination wedding, though?

38:33Do you have to, is my general opinion. Yeah. Yes. Why don't you have your honeymoon then? And then it's on you. Yeah. And then, and if you do do one, if you're actually telling me that you're going to also have a destination, stag or hen weekend you are now taking the piss yeah a stag or hen i think is fine because that's yeah you know you can you can make an excuse and not go to a stag or hen if you if you if you can't afford it or whatever whatever it is you can kind of say you know like oh that's so annoying i can't come out to um budapest but for a way you can't say no to a wedding and you've got family and you've got old friends and you you know everyone's got different income levels i think it's no it's just a no but i i mean if you are marrying someone greek yes by all means because that's where all of their family are from so if you're trying to find a halfway point and you're you know you're marrying someone australian and they're you know fine i get it there's definitely excuses for having it yeah in general yeah if you're from haywards heath and you're getting married in faderaki and then everyone's flying back to haywards heath yeah come on come on especially if you're of the age where everyone's getting married at the same time it's so expensive yeah it's so unbelievably expensive it's expensive anyway living in the UK do celebrities pay for their guests to go out there?

39:42it's not clear is it? I would have thought that if you thought for one second that they took lots and lots of rooms and I think you put all your family members and your friends who and just say we've got a room for you and then you know Adele you sort yourself out for obvious reasons the best person to be in that situation is like Callum Turner's aunt but who's like just sort of you know just an absolutely regular person who is beyond delighted that her nephew is getting married, has always wanted to see it. To the lovely Dua Lipa. And now it's like, oh, my God. You will not hear people say a bad word about people who really like her.

40:15Oh, that's really, really nice. But, yeah, so she's going there and Elton John's playing. She goes, I mean, I often hear your song at weddings, but I've never seen it. Oh, my God, not this one again. Yeah. But that must be amazing. Well, many congratulations to them. Yes, exactly. They'll probably release a couple of pictures just so we saw what they actually looked like. Yeah. But yes, so that was a happy one. But Taylor and Travis next. I mean, watch this space if they do it at Madison Square Garden. I can't believe it's true. Yeah, that's nuts. Okay. Shall we turn to a more traditional wrestlers entertainment subject?

40:50Yeah, I mean, I suppose it's drama. Yes, it really is. We're going to talk about 60 Minutes, which is the biggest current affairs show in America, which is having an unbelievable couple of weeks. We'll talk about why. Meltdown. Meltdown is exactly that. There was an incredible meeting between the new guys coming in to run it and some of the people who currently work for it, which has been reported everywhere. I thought it would be a fun thing to give some context to. It's on CBS. It's on every Sunday night at 9 o 'clock. But it's investigative reporting. It's like sort of Panorama, but it's not.

41:24It's like if Panorama was massive. It's basically at 60 minutes. It's actually sort of part of the global cultural conversation. And, yeah, they tend to have 15-minute investigations. They have these correspondents who've worked there forever and ever and ever. And they take incredible pains over every single thing they report. So it's a really blue chip show. It has been for years and years and years. A huge brand in the States. There is not a direct equivalent here. But let's imagine it is something like the News at 10. This would be where your Trevor McDonald's and John Snow's and, you know, the kind that has all the big hitters.

41:59We're talking about it because it's become the battleground of a fight over editorial independence, corporate ownership, Trump, ego. Yes, exactly. So David Edison, who is the child of a billionaire, who has bought CBS amongst many other things, including CNN and all sorts of things, he decided to overhaul 60 Minutes. Can I say something first before we say this? It actually started before then, all of this, because there was a Trump lawsuit, Trump bought a lawsuit against CBS for some, what he felt was some kind of selective editing of a Kamala Harris interview. This was in CBS, owned by Paramount, was still owned by the Redstone family.

42:42But Shari Redstone was trying to sell it. And a lot of people thought this case would eventually get thrown out because it was perfectly reasonable sort of First Amendment defense to it. But in the end, because they needed regulatory approval to be able to sell the whole of Paramount to Skydance, to David Ellison's company, they settled with Trump for$16 million. And a lot of people within 60 minutes were very, very angry that this has happened and said this is the editorial independence being sacrificed for corporate interest, for Trump interests. Scott Pelley, who is a veteran correspondent, was very vocal about that.

43:20But anyway, the deal went through. They got their regulatory approval and they clearly regarded that as a price to pay. But we've then seen other things happen. Stephen Colbert, we know that Stephen Colbert's show is finishing on CBS. So there's definitely a thing about CBS that, you know, is it vulnerable to the editorial independence being interfered with by corporate entities? And the stuff that's happened this week is crazy. So there's a woman called Bari Weiss who ran a media organization called the Free Press that David Everson bought for$150 million. Right-leaning, I think it's fair to say.

43:55Trump-leaning, I think it's fair to say as well. And he bought Bari Weiss in free thinking. Yeah. Might be the thing we say these days. The sister story was that she was brought into the New York Times between 2017 and 2020, which was a sort of particular kind of the height of, to some degree, kind of peak woke. And she was brought into sort of, she covered culture and politics to kind of act as a counterweight to what, you know, seen as leaning to Democrat or whatever it was. She was quite reactionary. She said things like, you know, the idea of cultural appropriation is stupid. Intersectionality is a flawed idea.

44:35These were regarded as complete sort of blasphemies at the time. And in the end, she resigned because she said that effectively Twitter had become the New York Times' silent editor because people were so scared of cancellation or backlash that they kind of cleaved to quite a narrow point of view. and I have some sympathy with that and there are lots of places that needed some kind of correction, I think. I will not say that I've agreed with everything she's done since then and lots of people totally loathe her but she was installed, having never run a newsroom of any meaningful size before and certainly not a TV newsroom, as editor-in-chief of CBS News by David Ellison.

45:22Well, that's the thing. David Ellison buys her company for a lot of money and then sets her in charge of CBS News and 60 Minutes. So the situation you have is, as you say, someone who is an iconoclast versus a very traditional, very long-standing, fairly liberal newsroom and this incredible franchise which is 60 Minutes, which has been going forever and ever and ever. And a lot of the correspondents are in their 70s and 80s and have been there forever. And suddenly she's a new broom sweeping through it. Now CBS News, which she's in charge of, the ratings are down and down and down. And now we have a situation with 60 Minutes, which is the absolute jewel in the crown.

46:03And it should be said, profitable. Yeah. You know, good ratings, profitable. Vice brought in a new kind of chief editor called Nick Bilton, who is not from particularly from a news background. He used to write for Vanity Fair, a screenwriter, all sorts of things like that. He used to be a tech correspondent at New York Times. Yeah. So, you know, he's from that world. And they had a meeting last week where he came in for the first time. And a lot of the big correspondents have left already. Anson Cooper, who was probably the biggest dog of all at 60 Minutes, he has left. So many have been made redundant.

46:40And lots and lots of executive staff, correspondent, everyone has been made redundant. They talk about it as Black Thursday or Black Friday or whatever. So Nick Bilton comes in, has his first meeting with his team to try and say, look, this is who I am. This is where I want 60 minutes to go. And Scott Pelley, who we were talking about. One of the correspondents, senior, very senior correspondents. He had something to say in that meeting, did he not? Yeah, he seems, and by the way, the audio of this meeting was, of course, recorded and given to the New York Times. I mean, literally within two minutes of the meeting ending.

47:15Scott Pelley made a big speech saying that Bari Weiss was murdering 60 Minutes. Strangely, he seems to, and various other things besides, he has a big sort of goes kind of toe-to-toe with Nick Bilton. He seems not to have realised, Scott Pelley, that this could potentially get him fired. Yeah. He said to Nick Bilton, you have slender qualifications for the job. You will never be welcome in this newsroom, is essentially what he said. This is his first meeting with his boss being recorded, by the way, and then that recording immediately being released. I'm not saying who recorded it and who released it, but it was recorded and released very soon afterwards.

47:54Anyhow, turns out you can get fired for stuff like that. So Scott Felly did get fired. And he's now on this incredibly emotional round of interviews saying about, you know, the team, the family on 60 Minutes. You know, we travel together, we dine together, we go into literal combat together. there. Or you cover literal combat, but okay. And then he started crying in some of these interviews. He said, it's like your family being murdered. Someone wipes out a large number of your family members. This is talking about the, you know, comings and goings in the CBS newsroom. It's like your spouse being murdered.

48:32I would say that, again, a reminder that American journalism takes itself so preposterously seriously. I mean, British journalism takes itself quite seriously in British newsrooms, but American is like... But please, can you imagine anyone in the BBC saying, this is literally like your spouse being murdered. Okay, let's just take them over here. So there are three major correspondents still on air, by the way, who have said they will go if anything more is done to it. Yes, but they have all agreed for now to stay. The thing was, they were all going to go at some point. But like one of them, Leslie Stahl, I mean, she's 84 years old.

49:03This is like the Democratic establishment. Yeah, but it really is. But she's agreed to stay, Bill Whittaker's agreed to stay in another one, just to sort of see if they can continue the DNA of 60 minutes into this new era. And Nick Bilton has come back fighting quite rightly in some ways. He said in the termination letter, he said that Scott Petty had behaved with remarkable incivility and contempt. And he did, is the truth. Whether he had good reason to do it is another matter. I mean, Nick Bilton sent a memo saying that absolutely he's not going to take any political leads from the ownership of CBS.

49:44I mean, but he would do that if it's true and he would do that if it wasn't true. So it sort of doesn't help. But you know, his email, it ends, I think. And this is where we came in. It ends. It's been a hell of a first week. Let's get to work. Which is like a Will Ferrell comedy. Yeah. So here's the interesting thing about this story is, is this purely Trump and the Trump agenda trying to bring down one of the last great bastions of American news and American news reporting and independent American news reporting? Is it that because every single fact about it makes it look like it is that the people who've been brought in the people who have left the ownership, all of those things?

50:25Or is it and you know, when you hear Nick Bilton talk he said look i genuinely recognize this show gets good ratings and i genuinely recognize it is profitable it will not be either of those things or do either of those things for long he said broadcast news is an ice cube is how he's described it and he said it is it's it's an ice cube is not going to get any bigger i'm just literally it's it's out there it's going to get smaller and smaller and smaller and the world of news now as we um know on this show very very well is a world of younger personalities, of clippable things, of going viral.

51:00It is not one hour on a Sunday night with a huge lead-in from the NFL, which is what 60 Minutes has got. It is not an audience that has grown up with this franchise and believes in it and will follow it blindly. That's all gone. And so there is an argument that this isn't a political intervention. What it actually is is a life-saving intervention of bringing in a whole new generation of people into this brand, this brand which is trusted, and building it out and turning it into something extraordinary. Yeah, I agree with that. I agree, and we can't argue that there has been effectively editorial interference.

51:36Oh, yes, absolutely. Because the mere settling of that suit in order to get there, we can't, yeah, there has been. But I do also think that attempting to have a correction from that era where, I mean, I sort of hate calling it Pete Woke, but you know what, for want of a better phrase, where lots of liberal newsrooms had, in fact, these incredible blow ups about tiny, tiny things and real enormous cancellations of staff members and things like that over really actually relatively minor infringements of some perceived liberal code. And I do think that there has needed to be some kind of correction if you wish to try and keep things mainstream.

52:17and you know I've talked about it before and talked about it a bit when I did appear before the select committee that we have in the in the UK we have this extraordinary thing that America does not have we have the BBC sitting right at the center of our sort of mainstream and I realize that people have got all sorts of different problems with the BBC but like 60 percent of people check it frequently yeah in America you've got a situation where nothing gets more than 20 percent for anybody and the polarization is almost off the charts like if you like fox news then you absolutely hate new york times and vice versa and they are everybody's that sort of flung out to the outer reaches of these graphs and they don't have anything sitting in the middle and the attempt to and i do think that when a shared mainstream disappears and we see this all over the world you get these big big cultural problems and it and it the lack of a sort of shared mainstream in america and the perception that some things are for some people and some things are for other people and it's very very siloed like that is not great for social cohesion at all and you can see the effects of it so i think the sort of aim of it whether or not you think they're doing it right and whether or not you think that actually is their aim or it's kind of a covert thing for interference.

53:34I think the aim of it is good to try and create something that more than 20 % of people ever are going to think is trustworthy. And it doesn't sort of matter if you have got bigger ratings than you had before, because other things have fallen away. You're still, as you say, the ice cube is not a terrible analogy. Yeah. And one very interesting thing about it is, you know, Trump is sort of obsessed with broadcast media, and he's obsessed with legacy media. And the truth is that's, you know, the steam trains, those things. And he is obsessed, as are most of his generation, as are most of our generation, with these things that are not going to be here in 30 years time, you know, with the stuff that we grew up with, which we still consider to be incredibly important, and which culturally is still incredibly important.

54:19You know, it's still because it's an echo chamber and, you know, legacy media always, you know, what legacy media talks about leads what other legacy media talks about. But that's not going to be the battleground. No, and actually going around in high profile, as Scott Pelley's doing now, going around high profile broadcast slots and literally crying about things is like, oh my God, you are absolutely not helping, even the thing you think you're helping. He actually said at one point, I think the headlines will just be about me crying and people saying I'm a lunatic. Well, you called it. Well, listen, he's a good journalist.

54:5460 Minutes is back on air in September. They are currently scrabbling around to get the sort of – I mean, again, they're saying the stuff we do is incredibly difficult. The kind of journalistic kind of skills you're going to have to do to have to do what we do is almost impossible to find. And you kind of think maybe it's not. Maybe there is a next generation of journalists. I mean, who will want to touch 60 Minutes is another question. But they are currently recruiting to replace an awful lot of the producers and the talent they used to have. But it will be back on air in September. but we'll see what the ratings are like and we'll see what the political bent is like.

55:26But I think it's a more interesting story than it first appears and I think if one thinks it's just about political interference, I think we're missing the bigger picture which is the biggest current affairs show in America, if it wants to stay that, has to find a way of reinventing itself. I agree. Any recommendations this week? Yes, I have. I've got a really good novel which is coming out this week. It's called Experts in a Dying Field. And it's by Patrick Frane. Now, Patrick Frane is a very funny writer for the Irish Times. And this is very good for our entertainment podcast. This is a story about the members of a band, the Heathens, who were active in Dublin about sort of 20 years before the events of this story.

56:09But tragedy struck and they sort of scatter. And then they reconnect. And it's about bands. It's about the music scene. And a lot of it is about Dublin. and it's really annoying. I know it's really annoying when people say, oh, it made me laugh and it made me cry, but it made me laugh a lot out loud and it absolutely made me cry and he's got such humanity, Patrick Frey, and I absolutely loved it. So it's called Experts in a Dying Field. Amazing. I will recommend Disclosure Day, the new Spielberg movie, just because it feels like a great Spielberg movie. We chatted to him about it. You can hear that on Thursday on our Q &A, but yes, it's a proper multiplex movie And, you know, I love, you know, backwimms and all stuff like that.

56:55But it's nice to have both, isn't it? So, yeah, go see Disclosure Day. It's two and a half hours, but it doesn't feel like it. And our bonus episode for our members, which you can join at therestisentertainment.com. I'm talking to James Kanagas for a minute. It's about how a celebrity could make a run for office even within our political system now. and generally about celebrity politicians, what they bring, and how we're going to see much, much more of them in the future. Yeah, hashtag the Martin Lewis question. We will see you all on Thursday. See you on Thursday.

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