‘Obsession’ With Bill Simmons, Chris Ryan, and Joanna Robinson

12:44Bill Simmons:She's behind the cash register just staring at them as they're talking and she doesn't move for three minutes. Yeah. Just eyeing them down. Corey Barker. Curry. Curry Barker. I have it. I said Corey. Who's Corey Barker? Did he play for Orlando? Gators with Chandler Parsons. Corey Barker. Corey Barker. Corey Booker. Corey Booker. Corey Booker.

13:05Joanna Robinson:Yeah. Corey Booker is what I was thinking you were.

13:08Bill Simmons:This was, I wrote down his sixth sense. Just a tremendous idea.

13:13Joanna Robinson:Yeah.

13:14Bill Simmons:Like, and then Shyamalan had that sixth sense. It's like, oh, spoiler. It's 27 years old.

13:21Joanna Robinson:Give him enough time to X out of the Netflix app. You know what?

13:25Bill Simmons:I'm not going to spoil it. Wow. Yeah.

13:27Joanna Robinson:The restraint. M.

13:28Bill Simmons:Night Shyamalan had a good idea and he made it. M. Night Shyamalan had a really good twist idea. Yeah. And he did it and he wrote it to 27 years of movies. One Wish Willow is right up there. It's just a great idea. And he's borrowing it from these other movies where somebody made a wish and it backfired. Yeah. Not like this.

13:46Joanna Robinson:The Wish Gone Wrong movie. Where are you on the Wishmaster franchise?

13:50Bill Simmons:not really there. I like wish gone wrong, but to me, like big, that's what I grew up with was like, oh, he wish he could be big and now he is. He's got to get out of this. Home Alone is that too, right? Right. You know, he's like, I wish my family would just disappear. And weird sounds too. The labyrinth is. It's true. It's true. But this kid's clearly, what's he, 26? Yeah, something like that. Maybe a little young. No, Kaine Parsons is younger. Have you hit the age yet where you start seeing people like this and you're like, what the fuck, man? A little bit. He's 26. Yeah, I'm 31. He's 26. Kane Parsons is the one that really pissed me off.

14:20He was 19 when he made Backrooms. I was like, all right, fuck off.

14:24Bill Simmons:Unbelievable. But he's going to have, I think, there's a lot of good stuff in this movie. Did you watch any of his YouTube stuff? I didn't. Should I have? I think you'd enjoy it. It sounds like some of it's going to get adapted as features, so you could also just hold on. But his sensibility is very distinctive, I think. It's got, there's some like, Japanese horror influence, but then there's also like, obviously sketch comedy and sketch comedy has been this huge platform for people to go from like Craigor went from sketch comedy to horror Jordan Peele sketch comedy to horror now Curry even like Bill Hader now is making a horror film you did sketch comedy at the ringer why can't this be you I know what the hell well isn't your

15:03Joanna Robinson:current existence a horror movie that's true

15:06Bill Simmons:so if we're pulling ideas from YouTube and turning them into movies does this mean Coach Nick I mean you and I B-Ball breakdown that would be an incredible last actor you're behind the music where it's like, then Bill got really into cocaine and spent$50 million on a coach. Coach Nick made a horror movie. All right, let's do it. Bear as the villain.

15:26Joanna Robinson:Yeah. So. Full stop. Listen. End of sentence. You know. Oh, in defense of Bear? Is that what's happening right now?

15:35Bill Simmons:The opposite.

15:36Joanna Robinson:Okay.

15:36Bill Simmons:How is this even an argument or a debate where people are like, you know who's actually the villain? Bear. I mean, is. That's the premise of the movie.

15:45Joanna Robinson:Right. I think...

15:46Bill Simmons:Bear was clearly the villain, a socially awkward weirdo, drinks pina coladas, like, right there. It's like, what are you doing?

15:53Joanna Robinson:That's the bar.

15:55Bill Simmons:Has cats, likes them, but won't mourn his dead cat. He's like, yeah, I'll go out for drinks. Practices telling a girl that he loves her to some fucking random waitress. Completely chokes when he has the chance and then uses the one-wish willow to try to win her over. This guy's the loser of losers, then realizes that it worked, and then basically keeps her captive for months. Yeah. Weeks. How long is this?

16:19Joanna Robinson:You got there in the end. I feel like you hit a few road marks like Pina Colada or has cats or whatever. There's that one likable moment from this guy

16:26Bill Simmons:for two hours on top of how terrible the outcome of this was.

16:30Joanna Robinson:But he's a type that we are supposed to recognize from that 500 Days of Summer era of Manic Pixie Dream Girl storytelling.

16:40Bill Simmons:So he's Zach Braff in Garden State. Yeah, he's Garden State.

16:42Joanna Robinson:He's Joseph Gordon-Ledd. You know, he's like, it's Elizabethtown. It's like all these other things are these, these like nermy yearning guys that we're supposed to be rooting for.

16:51Bill Simmons:And it's just like, how many times have we actually rooted for the right guy in these movies? In these movies are just like a yearning. I kind of like Garden State. I'll defend that guy. Sometimes do drive-bys on guys like this. Like, you know, you don't like Troy and Reality Bites. Do you like Grover and Kicking and Screaming? I do. Okay. Just making sure.

17:09Joanna Robinson:Remember when we did Can't Hardly Wait? This movie is exactly can't hardly wait. Yeah, I know. This movie is exactly can't hardly wait if it was a horror movie. Where he's like obsessed from afar. And what it like, if Ethan Embry and Can't Hardly Wait, if Jenna Elfman gave him one wish willow, he would have been like, I wish Amanda loved me more than anyone else in the world. You're absolutely right. I hate this guy.

17:29Bill Simmons:Does one wish willow. Nikki has no choice from the moment he breaks it.

17:34Joanna Robinson:That's, yes.

17:36Bill Simmons:That night he has a decent idea it might have worked. Googles it.

17:39Joanna Robinson:Yeah.

17:40Bill Simmons:And then he's like, doesn't go. It's not even. Fuck it. I'm going to roll the dice. Cause how else would I have dated this girl? She's like, maybe she was on Molly. Yeah. Next day digs up the cat. He's like, yeah, well, I'll still give this a few more days. Keeps it going and going. Keeps having sex with her. And that, that's like one of the most disturbing scenes in the movie. Cause you know, um, not freaked out by the duct tape door at all. Duct tape door should have been like the, the last, like I got to get this girl some help. I can get the police about it.

18:07Joanna Robinson:He's definitely freaked out. He went to work. Yeah. Yeah, but his face was like staring in shock at that door. Do you think duct tape door is the... I'm just going through all the beats. It's not dead cat. I'm just going through all the beats.

18:19Bill Simmons:Never gets the second One Wish Willow to nullify the first one, which would have been the easiest move. It's like, man, this one wrong. I'm going to just get a second one. You're the Picasso of the trade machine. You would have thought of that immediately. Just get a second one. Yeah. Nikki says, Nikki's asleep. Wish Nikki's asleep. Yeah. And captive Nikki is going, just kill me.

18:37Joanna Robinson:Yeah, she's like, shoot me. Just kill me.

18:38Bill Simmons:and he goes, what would be so bad about being with me? And then he goes and meets another woman. Yeah. Yeah, that night.

18:45Joanna Robinson:He's not like, I should probably do suicide watch here. He takes off. When he starts like making eyes at Sarah, I was ready to punch.

18:51Bill Simmons:But here's my question. This guy is a pathetic, weak loser. Can you be a true villain when you're a pathetic, weak loser who drinks pina colettas and doesn't mourn your dead cat?

19:02Joanna Robinson:Yes.

19:02Bill Simmons:Okay.

19:03Joanna Robinson:Because the sort of like, because he's a capital N, capital G nice guy. Like that's Bear's whole thing, right? It's like he thinks he's a nice guy. He thinks he's entitled to, you know, this relationship. And we are like we often I root for like the nice guys. But this is the cautionary tale of the nice guy, which is just sort of like when he doesn't see you as a person, he has no idea who you are. And he doesn't really care who you are. Yes. There are two reasons, I think, why, at least in my first viewing, I was a little like, okay, so how do I feel about this guy? One is that young love can be reality-altering, right?

19:44Like, the first time you really fall in love with your young person, you can, like, wish for things beyond what you're going to be able to get. and like it can sometimes distort like you know I know she said she doesn't really want to go out on a date with me and she just wants to be friends but maybe like she didn't mean what she said like you can make things up in your head but that's really dangerous as we can see from this movie second of all they shoot this movie entirely from his POV so the audience is corrupted in what happens and you're kind of like just from the audience to screen relationship I think there is like an inherent like am I also guilt culpable in this because I'm watching him do it.

20:23And because I've watched so many of these movies, do I want him to get the girl? And what does that mean? So I think that's why people are almost thrown off a little bit.

20:30Joanna Robinson:He's get the girl. You know what I mean? I think it's interesting too that Curry Barker and Indian already have talked about how they intentionally had those first few scenes when it's actually Nikki. They intentionally played it sort of both ways constantly.

20:44Bill Simmons:They had her, she likes him in one scene but didn't like him the next time they do a cut.

20:48Joanna Robinson:And so you at the audience are not, I mean, she says things like, ew, when he says, I got you a gift. I think that's pretty clear. But, you know, there are some moments like Indy never already has said in the moment where she asks Bear, do you like me? You know, and he chokes. And then she said, I played it as sort of disappointed. Like that was a choice we made. So they're just trying to maintain this ambiguity for the audience, at least, to keep the audience unsure. Yeah, and I love, like, even the detail of the setup that she's about to leave that job. Yeah. And that their sort of, like, work romance thing is going to be over.

21:25Like, even though it's Chase, but, like, their flirtation at work part of their life is going to be over. So, like, if he ever wants to shoot his shot, he's got to do it now and he can't manage to get it up. Like, that's a great little detail that she's leaving that job. And she says that, I mean, she kind of confides in him about her interest in writing and, like, the story she wants to tell. and she's like, you're the only person I can talk to about that. Which is very classic. The guy likes the girl. She's open to you. You so clearly know you're stuck in the friend zone, but you don't want to disrupt it because you're like, this girl is actually confiding in me, something that she wouldn't do with anyone else.

21:59So they do a good job of setting it up where he's like, I clearly have something with her. Right, but it's not romantic.

22:03Joanna Robinson:I just really love that she was like, you know, Ian, his friend who has another agenda, says you have nothing but time. But she says we're running out of time when she says she's giving it her two weeks notice. And the message of that is, once we don't work together all the time anymore, we're not, this is not, this is not transcend that we were in high school together and then we worked retail together and our friendship is not strong enough to go beyond that. And we did the High Fidelity podcast together. Like, retail is also a reality distorting field where you're like, this is like my best friend.

22:32I stand next to a register with him for eight hours a day and then like, you leave for another job and you never see that person again. Same with school, sitting next to somebody in class.

22:40Bill Simmons:There's a lot of good tropes in this movie that Curry Barker... is clearly like I grew up watching movies and I've seen a million of these, but it has like, obviously Sarah likes him. That's the one he should have gone after and doesn't realize it. Like that's out of the fucking eighties. How many eighties movies were like that? It's like, Oh, I loved her, but I didn't realize the one who liked me was right next door.

23:01Joanna Robinson:She was a brunette and there was a blonde over there, man. Yeah. Right.

23:04Bill Simmons:And then the four people working together, the dickhead friend. Yes. Who seems like he's on your side, but he's really not, you know, it hits a bunch of them. Michael Johnston is the guy who plays Bear.

23:16Joanna Robinson:Yeah. I can tell by the categories you picked how you felt about this performance. I think it's a... It is a great performance, but the reason it's great is because you do not like him. Yeah. And I don't think it would work if it was like... Who would you... Why don't you just tell me who you think should play this role? Yeah, tell us who you want in there.

23:38Bill Simmons:Well, let me... So the movie is$750 ,000. Uh-huh. Yeah. Right? They're not getting... they luck out with Indy Navarrete who's like the all time jackpot for a movie like this right? So I'll give you the scale of one to Dante from Clerks of like fuck if we had had a better actor here Is Dante from Clerks the highest high here? The highest high of fuck how did we not get a better actor? Oh okay He was terrible There's a reason we can't do Clerks in the rewatchables because people ask it for it sometimes. And I'm like, I just, it would just be two hours of just shitting on Dante. I don't want to do it.

24:18Joanna Robinson:Sometimes you got to cast your friend, you know? Yeah, it's really tough.

24:20Bill Simmons:I still have a lot of time for quirks. Even with Dante? Yeah, of course. All right, so one to Dante. Where is this guy as an actor where we might have been able to get a better one? Dante being the worst. Yeah.

24:30Joanna Robinson:Dante's a 10 and 10 is bad. 10 is bad. And one is, this guy was, I think this guy is a three. Yeah. I think he does a very good job. Three, four. I think there's a thing, there's only one other thing you could have done if you had had a little bit of budget which is the thing that Promising Young Woman did which is cast a bunch of nice guys you know it's like Bo Burnham and like Chris Lowell and like all the guys who are in Promising Young Woman and you're like used to rooting for them you're like oh Adam Brody's here and then you're like oh these guys are pieces of shit so if there was like a nice guy lowercase n lowercase g that we could root for in that role and then be betrayed by

25:09Bill Simmons:well and you're not ready career-changing breakout role. She was in one film called Wander Darkly in 2020. See it? I have not seen that. She was in 13 Reasons Why.

25:21Joanna Robinson:I did watch.

25:22Bill Simmons:The show I did watch because my daughter watched it. It was during COVID. And Superman and Lois, apparently. Yeah. I'm going to give this the Bam out of Bio 83-point game award for where the fuck did this performance come from? This is unbelievable. Malachi Flynn scoring 50 in that one game a few years ago. You're like, who, what? But it feels sustainable because she's so good in this. Like, clearly, she's going to be in our lives now for the next 30 years. 100%. Starting with Heat 2.

25:48Joanna Robinson:And then just from there.

25:49Bill Simmons:So, career change and breakout role. I'm going to go even further, though. Because I was thinking, like, how many iconic, great, horror movie actress performances have there been? Where you're like, oh. So, three I came up with. Kathy Bates of Misery. Toni Collette in Hereditary. and CeCe Spacek and Carrie.

26:12Joanna Robinson:You have no space for Jamie Lee Curtis. Obviously, I mean, I love Halloween.

26:19Bill Simmons:I wouldn't say she's Meryl Streep in that movie, but she's really good. Sure. I'm talking about a whole other level of acting. You like more of an aggressor, yeah. It's pretty rare. These movies are usually like you have the drag me from hell lady. It was Alison Lohman. Yeah. And it's like, oh yeah, she was good. But you don't have like, Like, she's probably going to be the Oscar favorite.

26:40Joanna Robinson:I would love that. That would be such a good narrative. I think she will get nominated. Yeah, she will definitely get nominated.

26:45Bill Simmons:Our friend Lasker texted me this whole thing on the internet today about, it was like the early odds and it's a weak season and she's the favorite. And there's rumors that the Odyssey, they're already trying to figure out. Oh, Hathaway's going to duck her? Do we want it? Is Hathaway going to duck her and go to supporting actress?

27:00Joanna Robinson:I already thought Hathaway was running and supporting. Like, I thought that was already the narrative. I'm going to say no.

27:05Bill Simmons:I think she's going to win Best Actress. I don't think anybody's gonna beat her and I think she deserves it I think everybody loves her in this movie and it's gonna carry it the narrative the story I think she's gonna win it and she deserves it I thought she was unbelievable

27:16Joanna Robinson:I think after after the Amy Madigan win for weapons and the Mikey Madison win for Enora like that's those two narratives sort of combined I can definitely see that happening

27:26Bill Simmons:what do you think Sierra? it seems like you think it's unrealistic you know what I just I just get we're gonna get beaten down by like six months of like oh Cate Blanchett's never been better you know you know and like or Renata Rimes but why not a third nom in a row you know it's like but she's cool but like I think this is like one of those because one of the things with this Joanna is like I always think about degree of difficulty with the part as part of the Oscars thing degree of difficulty of this movie is like a 10 out of 10 like she's got to do 19 things in this movie if she's bad I start looking at my phone in the middle of this movie if she's not great in this movie this movie makes 20 million dollars it just doesn't work

28:04Joanna Robinson:and I think you know increasingly it feels like the Oscars wants to award box office in addition to sort of prestige but they want relevancy and this would be a very relevant win.

28:15Bill Simmons:Yeah. My advice to her now is not a lot of interviews.

28:19Joanna Robinson:Yeah, you have to go away for a minute.

28:20Bill Simmons:Just keep some mystery. She's cool as shit though. Have you seen her? No, I know she is. But she, I think she'll have the lead. Like just do the Michael B. Jordan. Yeah, go away for a minute. Just smile. Do a couple generic interviews. Stay out of it and cash in after because this will be hers to lose. Hathaway might duck her. She might run to the supporting actress category.

28:41Joanna Robinson:I definitely think she's going to do that.

28:42Bill Simmons:Hathaway's ring chasing?

28:44Joanna Robinson:Yeah, she's ring chasing it. She's going to go play with the B. I think you could make a real case for either category. That's not such abject category fraud as some other duckings have been. Penelope in the Odyssey.

29:00Bill Simmons:It's right in the... I never know what to think anymore. Some of these stuff.

29:04Joanna Robinson:the leading female role in that movie. She's the number two person

29:08Bill Simmons:in the movie. It's hard to think she's a supporting actress.

29:11Joanna Robinson:Is she the number two person? Tom Holland's the number two person in that movie.

29:15Bill Simmons:True.

29:15Joanna Robinson:You know? And then like, Hamesh Patel has more screen time. But it's messed up. We didn't rehearse that. Tiny Tom. I wonder if Samantha Morton might get the like... No, I think Samantha Morton is going to be in... Supporting actress. And I'm like, it's messed up that Hathaway isn't like, I'm ducking Navarrete. so I'm coming down and I'm going to blot out Samantha Morton because Samantha Morton could have an incredible like coronation of like she's been so great for so long you know it would thrill me to my core if Indy that's a standing O win if she wins if Indy Navarrete and Samantha Morton won I think that's like incredible sorry Anne Hathaway but you already have an Oscar so it's okay

29:54Bill Simmons:it's going to happen it's weird because she's also like I mean she's a couple years older than my daughter but she's this whole footprint that you have when you're a kid before you're a famous person now. This is this whole generation where if you like her, you can go and find, you know, 10 years of Instagram and all that kind of other stuff. This is just kind of how it's going to be now. But she's like playing like, like Last of Us on YouTube. She's like, you know, she's just like a regular person.

30:21Joanna Robinson:She's going to win. Maybe Anne Hathaway will win for Verity. What do you think? That would be great. What if Anne Hathaway gets nominated for like four roles? Yeah, Double Wars, Prada 2, and Verity, yeah.

30:30Bill Simmons:I have a really interesting list for you. it's the crazy lady movies by decade and what they said about each decade oh okay

30:38Joanna Robinson:great now you

30:40Bill Simmons:I'm gonna land the plane on this you're gonna like this okay

30:45Joanna Robinson:I'm actually really glad I'm here I love this you're gonna like this all like horror movies

30:50Bill Simmons:but each one in a decade it's funny

30:53Joanna Robinson:because I have a list of nice guy nice guy horror movies you could do that too that'd be great

30:58Bill Simmons:play Misty for me with Clint Eastwood uh-huh That's the movie that set up Fatal Attraction. Really interesting look at the Bay. Have you seen that one, Craig? No. Yeah. He's a radio host. And a caller becomes obsessed with him and starts terrorizing him. And he basically has to go dirty hairy to get out of it. And that's how we did in the 70s. Then we had Fatal Attraction in the 80s. It's like Michael Douglas. Oh, he just had an affair. Can't a guy just make a mistake for a weekend? And now he's getting tormented. And all of it's told through the guy. you get to the 90s disclosure now it's getting a little more ambiguous it's like stuff that happened that Demi Moore is still the quote unquote villain in that but Michael Douglas is not blameless either and there's it's when we did this on Rewatchables it's about you know the workplace dynamics which was a big thing that was in dialogue back then

31:52Joanna Robinson:yes

31:53Bill Simmons:now we get in the 2000s unfaithful more thoughtful versions of What happens if somebody's happily married, but they just make a mistake? And then the husband finds out. And now, so basically Richard Gere is kind of the villain in that movie, I think.

32:10Joanna Robinson:I don't think Diane Lane's the villain in that movie. She's not. So we've moved toward the Richard Gere side.

32:15Bill Simmons:Get out. Uh-huh. 2016. Allison.

32:19Joanna Robinson:Oh, yeah.

32:20Bill Simmons:Allison Williams. Yeah. It's the villain, right? But now we're bringing all of like race politics and all of these. And the whole family. Awesome. The family and the South, all this stuff. and now we have the obsession where it flips it seems like a crazy lady movie but actually Bear is the villain sure so it took us see I landed the plane it took us six decades to get here

32:39Joanna Robinson:I liked it

32:40Bill Simmons:you're still dubious

32:40Joanna Robinson:I liked it more than I thought I would here's my like 21st century nice guy TM movies right

32:48Bill Simmons:I can't wait

32:49Joanna Robinson:like you have the eternal sunshine of the spotless mind 500 days of summer Ruby Sparks I was thinking about Ruby Sparks a lot the Paul Dano's O 'Kazan movie where he like types her into existence and then she just has to do whatever. He's a writer and he just like writes what she does. And that's very much on my mind when I'm watching this. Can I throw an honorable mention on that one? Lars and the Real Girl? Oh yeah. Yes, of course, of course. That movie is...

33:16Bill Simmons:Yeah, that's a weird one, that movie.

33:17Joanna Robinson:Then you have your like tech era because you've got like her and Ex Machina and recently Companion. This sort of like, can I build a girl and just have her do whatever I want her to do.

33:27Bill Simmons:Which is weird because we made these movies in the 80s too, not knowing how to actually build something like this. Also, Don't Worry Darling kind of on there. Oh, yeah, that's on my list. Yeah.

33:34Joanna Robinson:Sure, 100%. Promising a Woman and Gone Girl are a really interesting moment of just sort of like, because Gone Girl is...

33:43Bill Simmons:Getting dark.

33:43Joanna Robinson:These are all sort of like waves of backlash of the Manic Pixie Dream Girl idea. And it's just sort of like, that happens at the turn of the century, which makes me feel really old to say. But that happens in the Manic Pixie Dream Girl era happens. And then it's sort of like grappling with it. And there are these like light sort of indie cutesy movies of just sort of like. I can fix her. Yeah, yeah. Sort of thing. And then it's like the tech phobia. I'm afraid of tech and I'm afraid of women. And I'm just going to put that together in Ex Machina. And that's something to think about. And then there's like, to your point in terms of when things flip, Gone Girl is engaging with that sort of cool girl idea, right?

34:21Joanna Robinson:Amy is like, you know, the cool girl.

34:23Bill Simmons:and an awesome flip halfway through if you don't know the book

34:26Joanna Robinson:and it's just sort of like it's an incredible moment don't worry darling

34:30Bill Simmons:Nick's kind of a dirtbag though in that movie Ben Affleck's character well absolutely

34:33Joanna Robinson:but it's just sort of like you've made these girls quirky little dolls that just exist I do like Garden State because I was the exact right age for it but also objectively like Natalie Portman's character is just absolutely repulsive to a certain degree and so how we've grappled with that narrative. Mostly male filmmakers actually on this list, but grappling with this idea of just sort of like, oh, are women whole people? And do I need to consider their existence and their thoughts and their ideas? And am I maybe putting like my own narrative bullshit on this real person? But I'm like, you know, you would love me if you knew the real me.

35:18And it's like, I know the real you. I don't love you. It's okay.

35:20Joanna Robinson:I think the moment in 500 Days of Summer that I was thinking about a lot, and I was talking to Van about this when he called me. He was like, do you think Bear's the bad guy in this movie? There's a sequence in 500 Days of Summer where Joseph Gordon-Levitt, like, Zooey Deschanel and Joseph Gordon-Levitt have broken up. And then they meet up again, and she invites him to a party. And the screen splits. And it's what Tom thinks was going to happen and what actually happens. And what he thinks is going to happen is she's going to warmly greet him, and they're going to get back together. And instead, it's just sort of like, she's got someone new.

35:54Joanna Robinson:She doesn't really care. Like the reality versus his imagination. And I just sort of feel like that's what Bear is in this movie. He's just existing in the fantasy version of that party. And then he just has this horrible power to make it a reality. And yeah, nice guy.

36:11Bill Simmons:Well, that's why we like kicking and screaming. Sure. He's in love, but he just keeps listening to the answer machine over and over again. But then ultimately, nothing happens. and that's just the end of the movie. I think that they are, both of those characters in that movie are writers and they, like, I think Jane, the character in that movie is like, I'm not a character, you know? Like, I'm actually like a person and I can't fit into a story of like, your disinterest and your interest in me wavering because it's like narratively pleasing to you. CR, how many times have you been one wish Willow in love?

36:45Like, hardcore out of control love? Just, just AJ Brown?

36:53I actually, my wish came true with AJ. Yeah, that's true. Ruin your team. You know, it's honestly, it's more of like a fleeting thing. It's like, you'll be at like a party or at dancing one night and you're like, this is my fucking soulmate. Not now. No, like when I was a kid. Like when I was like 17. Sorry. But like when I'm like 17 and I'd be at a party or if you, you know, and you'd be like, this person, like, I think that we're going to like, run away together. And sometimes drugs help in those situations. And you're just like, Maya, like, you're like, this is really happening. And then you're like, oh, no, it's not happening at all.

37:29Bill Simmons:Yeah. What did I call that one, Ram? Have you ever had that experience? Everybody has. Yeah. I think that movie, this movie taps into that where he kind of deep down knows this girl's too, too much, too much firepower for him. He can't handle it. He's not, not capable of actually like having a successful relationship. with her, which leads to the one wish Willow. That's his only chance. And then he gets it.

37:55Joanna Robinson:I think there's also like both Ian, you know, his his shitty best friend and Bear are constantly saying in the beginning of the movie, she would hate this. Nikki would hate that. They like keep sort of saying like what she would want or what how she would react to something. And I'm just watching. I'm like, you have no I feel like you have no idea or when who this person is or when the needle drop happened when she like borrows a 20 to go give it to a guy and the needle drop happens and he's just sort of like heart eyes staring at her and i'm just sort of like you've just like you've just like written a complete story in your head that has nothing to do with who this woman it's also you know it's kind of uh a play on a lot of these kinds of stories are they they basically rely on like romantic gestures like if you think of jerry mcguire and you think of him writing back from phoenix middle of the night interrupt book club you know you complete me.

38:47Bear doesn't even have the courage to do something like that. When Bear is offered an opportunity to say I like you too, he chickens out. He just takes the most demonic way possible to do it. You know why? Because Bear sucks.

39:00Joanna Robinson:And you knew it from the first Pina Colada.

39:03Bill Simmons:I knew it from the opening scene. He was practicing a speech to a fucking waitress. Which was, there's some good swerves the first time you see this movie and that's one of them, right? Because you feel like, oh, he's pouring his heart out to somebody. then it's like, no, that's some random waitress. Can we talk about the 2020s really quick?

39:22Joanna Robinson:Please.

39:24Bill Simmons:So you think like Euphoria? Mm-hmm. Pretty demented show.

39:30Joanna Robinson:Sure.

39:32Bill Simmons:The effect of online on people, fake friendship, some crazy sexual stuff. Tell Me Lies, another very popular show that shows another completely demented show that we all... You're basically going down your daughter's watch list. Yeah, I was about to say, these sound like...

39:50Joanna Robinson:You know what I'm going down? I think this is for...

39:52Bill Simmons:I'm going down. These are some of the most popular program we've had the last couple of years. Yeah. And then Obsession, which makes$500 million. Yeah. What is that saying about this decade?

40:02Joanna Robinson:The kids aren't all right. I don't know. Even though, you know, these characters are not kids.

40:10Bill Simmons:Well, can we talk about some of the reasons for that? Because I think about this all the time. Because I have a 21-year-old and an 18-year-old. social media this is the social media generation they grew up with it all the potential damage from that um online porn revenge porn the covid lockdown underrated sneaky um really terrible way if you're anywhere basically under 25 and you're still forming how to connect with people and you're just on the shelf for however many months um their covid bubble was like these for these people it probably wasn't great for bear because yeah like where do you think this takes place right like do we ever get like like north hollywood i was gonna say ohio oh i was gonna say pacific northwest that's interesting but i think i associated it a little bit with river's edge for some reason uh our friend wesley i was i was talking about this movie and we were talking because he's he thinks there's this whole he has this whole theory about young people don't want to fuck it's like his whole he's gonna write about it at some point and he was talking about like spoilers so well he's he he loved this movie because he was like this movie is really about how afraid young people are to just like communicate and and connect that way and um and this guy has to like resort to the one wish willow over actually whatever and i do feel like this is a generational movie to some degree because i do think these are things people think about all the time you're home all the time you're online all the time versus like being out connecting with people trying to meet people.

41:38There's not a lot of like sitting on the phone on this, on this, in this movie. There's like a little bit of like light, not Googling, but Googling going on. But there isn't like a ton of like, I'm obsessively looking at my phone and texting and stuff. Right. Which is refreshing.

41:53Joanna Robinson:He was just on her Instagram before she called him to go. They at least had a party

41:57Bill Simmons:where there was like the boys night. Mm-hmm. Which sadly, Nikki kind of ruined it a little bit. There you go. By doing a Hansel and Gretel poem and then smashing a beer bottle against her head.

42:07Joanna Robinson:Or improved it. First of all, I love live theater, so I don't know. Hey, how was Boyce that? Ah! It's a little off the rails. I thought we were going to do a 2021 redraft.

42:20Bill Simmons:Anyway, this movie is on pace to make 500 times as much as the budget of the movie. Which is insane. It has surpassed Enter the Dragon as the highest grossing movie ever with a budget under$1 million. And because it kept growing in its third weekend, it made$27.4 million. making it the first movie since E.T., the extraterrestrial, to increase its box office for three weeks in a row. It was the biggest focus features movie ever. As we talk about the resurgence of movies, horror movies are leading the forefront here. Horror movies

42:56Joanna Robinson:and event movies like The Odyssey.

43:00Bill Simmons:Like IMAX stuff.

43:01Joanna Robinson:Like large format. Dune.

43:02Bill Simmons:Comedies, no. No. It's all drifted to the horror and it's all drifted to like the big director IPs. What else works, Craig? If you're programming a studio, would you just do directors and own horror? Animated kids movies do really well. Toy Story 5 is the number.

43:19Joanna Robinson:Kids movies always do well. Super Mario Galaxy. Those are like the top two movies. Yeah. I don't even know if I would say that horror is taking off in a way that's new because I feel like horror has been... Horror is like unassailable. For like the last 20 years, horror are even longer. I almost think everything else has lowered, but horror has remained. Well, horror also is the only thing that seems cost-controlled somehow. You don't need stars, typically. The store is the horror. Patrick Wilson and Vera Farmiga can lead the biggest horror franchise of the last 20 years. You don't need stars.

43:48It's inherently theatrical. It's budget-friendly. C.R. and I have seen every horror movie ever.

43:53Bill Simmons:Or at least everyone from the last 54 years. And you and I will also see any horror movie. I'm not kidding. I've watched all of them. There was a drought in the late 90s when the sequels... we've talked about this on previous pods the sequels and just kind of ran out of ideas and it was like how many times it was like

44:11Joanna Robinson:Dimension Films teen like Jesse Eisenberg

44:15Bill Simmons:werewolf movie oh yeah yeah and then Scream kind of revived the movies that we all but then the 2000s just brought a once we started figuring out that there's something wrong with the house you're still scared of Ring I want to do the Ring and you won't do it Saw then we had like the Grizzly kind of Hostile yeah we had like that gross era paranormal activity another one huge one yeah yeah yeah i just think it's funny i um interviewed jason blum years ago where i was talking it was like after i think after the hereditary sort of

44:48Joanna Robinson:moment and i was asking him about this idea of elevated horror which is what everyone was sort of calling it at the moment and he was just like i hate that he's like i actually really hate that term he was like i hate every time people try to reclassify like you know or or try to make you feel less embarrassed for watching horror or something like that. He's just like, horror is just, horror is just eternal. You know what I mean? And you don't have to slap a label on it. You can just go and experience this thing with other people in the theater. But I do have a question about why that's not working for comedy because like, that communal, we laugh together, we scream together, sort of we go to the cinema together to feel.

45:24Joanna Robinson:Why that's not working for comedy, I don't know. This heartbreak feels good in a place like this. It does. People have been trained to think that you can watch a comedy at home. I think that's part of it but I honestly think

45:36Bill Simmons:the bigger reason is we don't have stars anymore for comedy but like so many comedies I don't know like think about the ones that you love like did American Pie have huge stars Superbad wasn't huge stars but they became huge stars sure American Pie was one of the only ones where the gimmick of the movie became the star but when you think back to the Appetitur all those people became really famous but they were

45:58Joanna Robinson:I mean like Steve Carell was not when you made 40 year old virgin true Steve Carell and Seth Rogen had been in Freaks and Geeks, but wasn't a star. When the Apatowverse started, it was a star-making thing, which is what you were just saying about horror, that it can be a star-making moment.

46:14Bill Simmons:And SNL used to find these people, too, and just has not lately. Well, and it's fascinating that all these comedians are making horror films and not comedies. Yeah. Or The Invite. I mean, this movie's funny, though.

46:25Joanna Robinson:It is funny. Sure. The Invite's an interesting case where I wonder if they had shot—I mean, do you feel like that was shot as a comedy?

46:33Bill Simmons:no but I finally saw it on Friday and it was it's really funny like there were parts where the whole theater was really laughing into it and I wasn't prepared for that because it's such an unsettling movie this movie has a couple funny things too quick backstory so Cory Barker wrote, edited, directed Curry or Curry who's that so Cory Booker yeah Curry Barker who are the other famous Currys? Steph and Ed and Steph Curry Barker I'm going to get this right. Dell. The food. Curry. Yeah. A producer liked his short film, The Chair. Wanted to make a movie and Barker pitched Obsession, which was partly inspired by the Simpsons episode Treehouse of Horror 2.

47:17Joanna Robinson:Remember this? A monkey's paw sort of segment in that episode.

47:21Bill Simmons:So they offered him a million. They offered him two million if Bear could be the hero at the end. And he said, no, he did the sliced alone. I will play Rocky. he's like Bear will not be the hero of this and did the one million and does it premieres a tiff it crushes Focus buys it for 15 million

47:40Joanna Robinson:but also didn't do the Rocky because they said he could play Bear because he wants to he's been an actor as well as a director and in his YouTube stuff he plays some creepers so it's not like he's like but I think if Curry Barker played this part you would be like that's the fucking bad guy the second he walked on screen he doesn't even have to order a pina colada I mean that affectionately for his skills as an actor. But if you watch Milk and Serial, which is one of his YouTube movies, you're like, this is one of the creepiest dudes out there. But I just like, I really like that restraint because he's wanted to be an actor as well as a director sort of his whole life.

48:13Joanna Robinson:And he had this opportunity to put himself in there and he was just sort of like, no, for the betterment of the movie, I'm going to restrain myself and I'll just be the director. Everything that's good about this movie is because it didn't get fucked with. Yeah. And maybe he got notes from different people and maybe he got, you know, mentorship. but the reason why I think horror has been working so well at the kind of level that it's at right now, like this backrooms obsession level, is that they're like, at this price point, I won't mess with you. Yeah, let her rip. Go for it. And then when it gets to, it costs 50, 60,$70 million, it's like, I'm going to need Ethan Hawke in this and he's going to have to be the good guy at the end.

48:49Somehow he's going to have to save the day or something like that. You know, like there starts to become more like, we need to have Bear try to find the one wish Willow Company and it's like a road trip with him and Sarah. There would just be extra shit. I would have watched that.

49:06Joanna Robinson:I was going to say sequel, but I love Sarah.

49:09Bill Simmons:More Sarah in this movie would have been good. We'd have to do a prequel, yeah. One of the funny things about this movie is so we're in this cycle now and a movie's not going to they don't think it's going to make that much money. We've really ramped up the VOD and then popping on the streaming. yeah so in this one it had it all set up like all right it'll be out and four weeks later it'll be on vod and they had to delay everything because it was like a money machine and the vod i think got delayed by but five six weeks it went on peacock last friday um last friday but it going on peacock was like another pot for it no question um but what's interesting is all that tells me is they still didn't know even as they're getting to like when the movie was coming out that this was going to happen.

49:53Bill Simmons:The big thing with this one was the second week, right?

49:55Joanna Robinson:Yeah. Like, it was like, it did well. It did 16, 17. I can't remember what it did the first week. And then it was like... It did like 20, then 25, then 28. Yeah, it's like... It's like... Leggy. And the whole narrative became around the horrible Star Wars movie that came out at the same time. But... It's a terrible movie. But, CR, I re-listened to your big pick episode with Sean talking about it to prepare for this. and it's just a very sweet time castle because you guys are like, this is a pretty good movie. I really hope some people will go see it. Oh, seriously? Yeah. I really hope people give Obsession a chance.

50:30There's this weird thing that happened with the success of this movie is A, I think it got way more scrutiny than any horror movie usually gets where everybody's like, are we sure it's really that good? But then it's also like before it got big, me and Sean were like, cool movie. Yeah, let's champion it. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

50:46Joanna Robinson:It was really sweet.

50:47Bill Simmons:This was a tough internet movie. This really... All the things we don't like about the internet were percolating the moment this movie started to do well. Sadly, no Roger Ebert. No review from him. Did you ask any? No, you told me not to do that anymore. Thanks for listening to me. And I co-sign.

51:04Joanna Robinson:Yeah. I love this.

51:04Bill Simmons:You know what I did do though? I asked Claude, if Bill Simmons was still writing, what would the first paragraph of his review of Obsession be? And this is what Claude said. Claude Simmons? Claude writing in my voice. Real talk. I almost skipped Obsession because the title sounded like a Lifetime movie that got confused about what network it was on. Then I actually watched it. And this is a full Simmons reversal. It's the best horror movie of the year. And it's about something.

51:33Joanna Robinson:You think you would ever say -

51:35Bill Simmons:It sounded like me. I kind of wanted to die after I read that.

51:37Joanna Robinson:Full Simmons reversal. Is that something you would say? Yeah. I think I would have made the Lifetime movie joke.

51:42Bill Simmons:Yeah, the Lifetime movie.

51:43Joanna Robinson:How do you feel about making yourself redundant on this podcast?

51:47Bill Simmons:Which one?

51:47Joanna Robinson:With AI. You just -

51:49Bill Simmons:I just did it.

51:50Joanna Robinson:You market corrected yourself with AI. How does that feel?

51:52Bill Simmons:It made me feel really bad about all the stuff I wrote over the years that somebody could just be like, here we go. Most rewatchable scene. The opening diner scene we mentioned has to be mentioned just because it very perfectly establishes bears or schmuck in four minutes. Barker's Pub, really good bar talk scene. Good camaraderie with the four. Some interesting dynamics. Ian, just a guy who lives for bar trivia. Relatable.

52:16Joanna Robinson:But they need a better bar trivia name.

52:18Bill Simmons:But we learn... cock blocker. Yeah. For a reason. For a reason. They go to go get the shots and he's going to have this moment and he goes crashing in. It's like, yeah, I don't trust this guy. Yeah, his whole behavior makes sense once you get to the end of the movie. Once you know, yeah. Bear and Nikki in front of her place is the next scene. Amazing. Do you like me? Ooh. Ooh.

52:43Joanna Robinson:Shared at half a pina colada. That's your Ethan Embry impression. Perfectly.

52:48Bill Simmons:And it's one wish will out time. I wish Nikki would love me more than anyone in the fucking world. Boom. She's on the steps acting weird all of a sudden. And we're off. Next scene.

53:02Joanna Robinson:Bear has never seen a movie with like a genie. Like never. In the two of these horror movies though.

53:08Bill Simmons:One of the trivia questions is Aladdin.

53:10Joanna Robinson:It was Aladdin. Never thought I should word this carefully. You know,

53:15Bill Simmons:this is every movie where there's something wrong with the house and nobody has ever watched any horror movie where there's something wrong with the house. I'm like, huh, the attic. It's getting weird up there. Hmm. Should we go Google? Can I ask a question about the wish? Yeah. Is he wishing that she loves him more than she loves anyone else in the world? Or is he wishing that she loves him more than anyone has loved anyone in the world? Well, I think that's where you get into the fine print of the one wish willow. So the exact -

53:40Joanna Robinson:I thought it was the first one, but -

53:41Bill Simmons:The exact quote is, I wish Nikki would love me more than anyone in the fucking world. I think he means Nikki, but One Wish Willow got confused. But grammar loopholes. This is going to be number one. Yeah. Should have said it better.

53:52Joanna Robinson:Need an editor.

53:53Bill Simmons:We have the cat memorial in the kitchen followed by a bear telling Ian everything that happened last night as she's staring them down. This is the OK Motherfucker Award. Right? Yeah. We're like, OK Motherfucker, we're off.

54:06Joanna Robinson:Her just staring in the background?

54:08Bill Simmons:Just the cat combined with that. And it's like, man, we have flipped the switch.

54:11Joanna Robinson:That's not mine.

54:12Bill Simmons:No, I'm just giving you scenes. No, I know. The wear and love rom-com montage where it's like, she's the perfect girlfriend. Yeah. They're having a great time. And then the booth and the date, when she does the Betty Gabriel and get out. That's okay, motherfucker. No, no, no, no, no. Thought we're having a nice date. Next scene, she's in the corner in the bedroom.

54:32Joanna Robinson:That's my okay, motherfucker. When she starts moving like humans don't move. Yeah.

54:37Bill Simmons:Backwards.

54:38Joanna Robinson:That's when I was like, oh no.

54:39Bill Simmons:Has Liz ever done that, Craig? Not to my knowledge.

54:43Joanna Robinson:Okay, good. It's not even the backwards. is when she's doing sort of the like pink panther creep out of the shadow. That's because you're too locked in on your 11th fantasy league. You're like, why don't you love

54:52Bill Simmons:me? Then puts the flower over her face. Then we get the duct tape door scene, frozen smile. She pees on the rug, makes him a dead cat sandwich. We've gone off. These next two scenes, one of these two would be my two. Nikki freaking out that she didn't get him better to Boys Night, followed by Boys Night. Yeah. Boys Night, this scene is fucking bonkers. We get the Hansel and Gretel incest monologue.

55:18Joanna Robinson:With the accent work.

55:19Bill Simmons:Want to break that down later or no?

55:20Joanna Robinson:I have the whole thing here.

55:21Bill Simmons:Okay. Want to do it now?

55:23Joanna Robinson:Sure.

55:23Bill Simmons:Okay, go ahead.

55:25Joanna Robinson:Do you want me to read it? Yeah. Can you read it in like a live ad read voice? This episode brought to you by incest. Hansel, come lie with me like the old woman taught us when we were children, I said. He closed the door and leaned against it. You're not my wife. Oh, he said, I'm more your wife than I'm your sister. Hansel flinched and reached for the door handle. I knew he would not leave this place. He would relent and choose to be inside me like he had many nights before. If not, I would have filleted his meaty forearm, rolled it like a stick of licorice, and inserted his flesh between my legs.

56:04Joanna Robinson:Hansel is my soul, my cud. Brother, you will be inside me tonight. I went to him at the wall and reached for his sharp shoulders. His eyes were on the door, but his hands grabbed my hips. That's one of the original screenplay might be slightly different in the finished product, but I do think... It's just a book I'm working on. I do think her accent work is my favorite part of all. Yeah. When she just decided to go for the accent, which was Indy's choice, and I just love it.

56:27Bill Simmons:I don't even know which part of the Oscar clip when she's nominated do they use from this scene, but just the crazy smile, the overlap. She does the poem.

56:37Joanna Robinson:I think when she pops up and she's really excited to read it. That was sort of my favorite part.

56:41Bill Simmons:When she's just like, guys, I'm joking.

56:43Joanna Robinson:No, I'm not. Deal with it.

56:46Bill Simmons:And then he pulls out the next thing and it's kiss the person near left and it cuts her and she makes the single craziest face of the movie and one of the craziest ever and then pulls the chair out. The sound in this movie is really good too. Yeah. Like right as she pulls the chair out, it does this jump scare sound, pulls the chair back and just the reaction of everybody else in the room where they're just like, what the fuck is going on? All time. All time Michael Jordan-esque performance by her in that scene. And then we get what is now becoming a pretty prominent trope in modern horror movies, which is blasting your own head.

57:23It happened in Hereditary. It happened in Talk to Me. It happened in Bring Her Back. And now we got this one. Yeah, I wonder who was the Jonas Salk of Hit Yourself in the Head. I think Talk to Me was the one where I was like, holy shit. But I guess Hereditary. would create that.

57:41Bill Simmons:Well, then the next one I have is Bear sneaking out to see Sarah. Your fan. This is my number one. Really good scene. You know Nikki's going to show up. Yes. But then the way they do that, and she's like, Luther, and she's like, oh, I was the one sitting there. And you just kind of forget about Nikki for a second, and then all of a sudden the window breaks, and it's the most violent, awful horror movie scene. It's just great.

58:06Joanna Robinson:Did you see the behind the scenes where they put literally like a bike helmet on her and then a wig on top of the bike helmet. And that's like, that's how this movie cost less than a million dollars.

58:14Bill Simmons:They had, I wrote it was cast of her head too, right? Yeah, this was when Harry met Sally crossed with the shining. They made two dummies of her and just smashed.

58:25Joanna Robinson:Oh, of Sarah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

58:26Bill Simmons:Just smashed the head over and over again. CR, one of the best kill scenes in a long time. Yeah, I mean, it's the testament to the way they did it that you can see it coming literally from a hundred yards away because if you're watching, you're just like, that's Mickey. Here she comes. You know, like, and it's just, it's just incredible. It's hit every single time I've watched it this week. Two more. Ian making the one wish willow. I wish for a billion dollars. Perfect wish, man. And then, the ending of this movie is great and I didn't even pick up the first time that she broke the one wish willow.

58:57Bill Simmons:Yeah. After he was overdosing. I just thought he overdosed and he dreamed the rest of it and then, because I'm an idiot, the second time I was like, oh, that was the one wish willow oh I and it was just

59:08Joanna Robinson:my favorite part of that is bear chickening out and trying to vomit up the pills and that was a Michael Johnston idea he was like loser this guy's coward what do you have for most rewatchable Sierra no no no dinner yeah oh yeah that's mine too really that's the phone call about that she's lying about her dad although Ian's very specific research he's done I know he's like his dad has been to work every day I'm like how the fuck do you know yeah but you know Ian has spies everywhere I like the two scenes where he wakes up in the middle of the night and she's got the flower pot her in the corner when he's sleeping and she's awake I'm fucking locked in terrifying

59:48Bill Simmons:what's the most 2026 thing about this movie I would say the internet dialogue about it

59:55Joanna Robinson:isn't it just like too close to know I'm really glad that we're doing this rewatchable of like a current movie but like

1:00:01Bill Simmons:we do it once a year what did we do we did Top Gun Maverick we did Get Out

1:00:04Joanna Robinson:Sinners we did Sinners

1:00:07Bill Simmons:we've done what else have we done same year I feel like we've done one a year I don't remember the other ones but it's hard to know what once upon a time in Hollywood you did yeah once upon a time in Hollywood

1:00:16Joanna Robinson:yeah but it's hard to know like what is 2026 when you're still in 2026 I think it's probably a director coming from YouTube yeah which could be more of this era but as a story that's good what do you have

1:00:28Bill Simmons:for the Floyd Gondelli butter in my ass award for something you just enjoy post high school teens bumming around a small town really hard to turn me off of that like if they were playing pickup basketball I'd be fine you know like I dig it I dig people like being like we have this stupid job we go out to a bar at night you would have had some cigarettes outside Barker's Pub I have some stuff to say about smoking later yeah what do you have Joanna

1:00:50Joanna Robinson:um I like to your point I like a movie that just um you think you're watching one movie and you're watching a different one that's what happened to you I love that that happened to you because you you avoid promo can I give you the least 20 2026 thing about this movie? That four people plus a manager work in a tiny music store every day at the same shift. There's not that many people working at a CVS right now. You can find four people in a Best Buy maybe. Now. Like four people having the same shift in that store. I went into a state. Well, they're all like favor hires, right? Because it's her dad's store and then all of her friends.

1:01:26Joanna Robinson:All working. Yeah. Like how many customers

1:01:28Bill Simmons:do you get a day? I think that's where Andy Richter was going to end up after Conan's show got canceled Running Castle's music. mine is cross famous movie locations oh Castle's Music also the location of Wayne's World the guitar that he always wanted when he does a it will be mine I like when a cool location is in two kind of iconic movies

1:01:53Joanna Robinson:that's amazing

1:01:54Bill Simmons:that was where he wanted the 1964 Fender Stratocaster Castle's Music closed they filmed this and then like six months later it shut down it's in San Fernando it's done

1:02:05Joanna Robinson:the house that they filmed the party in burned down on the altitude of fires

1:02:09Bill Simmons:right so yeah what's age the best really hard to say because this movie came out two months ago but I'm going to offer you an old school Memorial Day box office weekend where we had Michael the Michael Jackson movie still killing it we had Devil Wears Prada 2 coming out and Obsession it's the kind of movies we grew up with CR it's a little bit 1989 for sure a couple bangers the no no no no no no no was an obvious get out montage which I said but I like that get out has now been long enough that you can reclaim it eight hours later and be like oh this is clearly an homage I have for what's age the best Ian just as a bad friend stuff you pick up on the second viewing but that that's like a particular one where it's like oh this guy's actually a bad bad actor in the friend

1:03:00Joanna Robinson:sense I think for me it's the more I learn about how bare bones this production was, the more impressed I am with the movie. You know what I mean? Like if you just watch these like two people on a table dumping the like rubber money on top of Bear and like all the behind the scenes stuff where it's just sort of like, let's put on a show in our backyard essentially. And it looks great and it made a gajillion dollars. That's a great story. What do you have? A couple of details. I mean, first of all, Navarretti and the way that she switches between obsessed Nikki and normal Nikki or, you know, and I think there's like little moments like Nikki turning off the shower when Bear tells her it's boys' night and she's behind the door.

1:03:43You just hear the shower go, errr.

1:03:44Joanna Robinson:You hear the pipe, the water in the pipes. Which I don't think I caught necessarily first time around that were really good. And I also love Bear dies just like his cat.

1:03:54Bill Simmons:Oh, that's a really good one, CR. That's a great one. That's why this is the year of CR.

1:04:00Joanna Robinson:Have you seen the theory that people think she's possessed with the spirit of the cat? Yeah.

1:04:04Bill Simmons:I had that in Unanswerables. My daughter thinks that's true.

1:04:07Joanna Robinson:Yeah.

1:04:08Bill Simmons:She thinks she became the cat.

1:04:09Joanna Robinson:Yeah.

1:04:11Bill Simmons:I had the Easter egg stuff in this movie as what saves the best, just that you can go deep diving it, which I did. in the one wish willow store we get the wide shot and there's a magic eye and there's a voodoo doll or the other two things you could buy people think that's going to be the obsession universe that we'll get a magic eye movie

1:04:30Joanna Robinson:people buying shit we'll get a voodoo doll we'll have the same guy who's like don't bring that energy in here man I love these I love both of the people who worked in the crystal shop yeah the woman on her earpods yeah

1:04:42Bill Simmons:another one is Nikki is reading the art of seduction in bed but it's upside down

1:04:46Joanna Robinson:Yeah.

1:04:47Bill Simmons:Oh, wow. Bear's Google search history.

1:04:50Joanna Robinson:Yes.

1:04:50Bill Simmons:Which his last seven days are how to woo a girl, how to impress a girl, how to flirt, and how to know if you've been friend zoned. Once again, Bear, loser.

1:04:59Joanna Robinson:How to play Green Day's basket case on acoustic guitar is one of his search terms. Yeah. I just really like that detail.

1:05:05Bill Simmons:Yeah, so it's July oxycodone. So this is an internet theory. I think I believe it because the third time I watched it, I looked for it. Sarah is always on Bear's left. and Nikki's always on his right. Every time he's with Sarah, she's on his left. Like in the move, in the stage. And I have no idea if this was completely accidental or whether this was actually... And what does that mean to you? Like devil angel kind of thing? I don't know. Okay. But it seemed relatively intentional. Nikki also never eats unless Bear's eating. Oh. And then, I didn't notice this until maybe the second time, but she's, the tv's on and it looks like they're watching some commercial from the 90s but it's just bear sleeping she has this video but that's what's on the tv oh yeah when there's like something running on the tv it's bear sleep it's bear sleeping that she videotaped obviously there's a lot of good

1:06:00Joanna Robinson:ones in there um did you see that someone broke down the the like rom-com montage and broke it down that it's just two days yeah oh really it looks like it's a month but they let you track the clothing and it's just like two days. It makes sense though because like if they it would be strange if she was like normal for that long, you know. That's a question I have. Oh, interesting. I didn't realize. Do you think the intention though is to make you feel like it's a month? Yeah. Or two days? I think it's to make you feel like, I mean in his mind he's like, oh my god, we're in this like long and it's just been like two days.

1:06:30But do you think Mark wants us to think that it's been a month? I don't think he cares but I think it's more like when he goes back to Ian Ian's like, so you guys are just fucking like living together now? Like it's And it's only been a couple of days. I had this in unanswerable. How many days do you think this was?

1:06:45Joanna Robinson:Because she gives her two weeks and she's still working there when the movie's over.

1:06:49Bill Simmons:I think it's like 11 or 12 days. It just feels longer. A couple more quick.

1:06:53Joanna Robinson:I still do have friend questions.

1:06:55Bill Simmons:Yeah. Semi what's age the best. Barker wrote and filmed an ending inspired by Romeo and Juliet where Nikki kills herself after breaking free from the wish. And they decided not to use that one. Then he said the characters of Obsession are unlikely to appear in another film, which I hope he sticks to. Well, not too many of them left. Yeah. Well, but they could do, I don't know, prequel.

1:07:18Joanna Robinson:An Andy Richter spin-off?

1:07:19Bill Simmons:Maybe.

1:07:20Joanna Robinson:Okay.

1:07:20Bill Simmons:He did say he was thinking about an anthology TV series where each episode explores a new character making a wish. I threw that at my wife and daughter, and both of them were like, and I don't have to sell Joanna who watches Cape Fear and enjoyed it.

1:07:35Joanna Robinson:And enjoyed it is not.

1:07:37Bill Simmons:Prestige episodes every week.

1:07:39Joanna Robinson:is not how I enjoyed the experience. Yeah. But it's not a good show.

1:07:44Bill Simmons:You like Cape Fear. Don't lie to us. Deep down, you like it. You look forward to it. You liked it.

1:07:49Joanna Robinson:No.

1:07:50Bill Simmons:Just admit you liked it. It's like having a canker sore in your mouth there. I kind of wish having that canker sore.

1:07:56Joanna Robinson:Yeah, if you could just stop tonguing it. I have texts from you about how much you are all in on Cape Fear.

1:08:02Bill Simmons:It's the worst show I've ever watched. Yeah, and you can't stop watching. I quit after five. I had to do it. It's really horrible. I punched out. It's wild. There's one other thing that's fun from a What's Age of Best standpoint where right after Nikki turns into Wish Nikki and she comes around the driver's door and then she walks out and she kind of does like this 360 and Bear's like, what are you doing? Like the actress actually got confused where to go and they just kept it in the movie because they thought it was funny. She's also still like kind of glitching out. Like I think it's the fresh possession.

1:08:32She's just like, what is happening? She's like, my cat died. Yeah.

1:08:35Joanna Robinson:And she's like, wait, sorry. Your cat died. My dad's dying. cancer.

1:08:38Bill Simmons:Last one. Christopher Nolan, big fan of the movie. Yeah. He said, when you go see a film like Obsession, that's an amazing idea. That movie works like a motherfucker. I'm telling Anne Hathaway to go Best Supporting right now.

1:08:52Joanna Robinson:You have me in the first half.

1:08:53Bill Simmons:We need her to get a W. Great shot, Gorda Award. Most cinematic shots, CR? I had a couple, but the one I like the most is when Bear is on the phone in the restaurant and in the background of the shot, but still clear, you can see Nikki emerge as Ian's telling Bear about the cancer diagnosis and you can see her like staring at Bear. I thought that was like a great, and there's not a lot of shots in very broad lit rooms. That was one of them. But there's obviously some iconic ones in this.

1:09:22Joanna Robinson:I would say her showing up in the red dress where her face is just completely in shadow and her eyes are gleaming. That's part of the whole she's actually a cat theory. But yeah. Oh, there you go. Yeah, because that's what cat Sandy, you're back. But I just love, I love all the times that her face is just completely in shadow inside of this movie.

1:09:39Bill Simmons:They kind of debunked that. They said they had so bare bones, no money at all, that she had to kind of do her own makeup and made it darker. And however she did it with the lighting that they didn't have great lighting for either, made her eyes kind of crazy in a good way that helped the movie. Yeah. So I have Nikki in the bedroom corner for Great Shot Gordo.

1:10:00Joanna Robinson:I mean.

1:10:00Bill Simmons:Where I like, it's always fun in a movie where it's like is there somebody back and then you realize there is like the famous one is Halloween and Halloween 1 where she comes out after she sees her three friends butchered and it's like oh no Myers is probably still in the house and then he kind of comes out of the you just kind of see his white face come out of the back.

1:10:21Joanna Robinson:Hereditary has an all timer but yeah like the way that the camera is just in that corner and it's not moving so you're like okay she's there somewhere but I can't see her where is she. That was my experience anyway.

1:10:31Bill Simmons:Kid Cudi Award for Best Needle Drop. You mentioned it before, Nikki feeding the homeless guy and the music kicks in and bears googly anger. What do you have for Chess Rockwell Brock Lehner's Award for Best Character Name? Baron Bear Bailey. Baron Bear? Yeah.

1:10:45Joanna Robinson:I think that's undeniably the answer, but the fact that her last name is Freeman, Nikki Freeman, is giving me real Matt Damon plays Dr. Hugh Man in Interstellar vibes.

1:10:56Bill Simmons:He's a free man. Yeah. Do you think... But she's not free, man, you know? Do you think Donald and Melania called Baron... Bear? Bear? I hope not. Do you think anyone will be called Bear again after this movie?

1:11:10Joanna Robinson:Do you think Donald and Melania talk to Baron?

1:11:13Bill Simmons:I do. I think they've talked to him. Do you think Donald Trump has seen obsession? No, he wouldn't like it. Okay. I don't think he would be able to hang in on that one.

1:11:21Joanna Robinson:Baron loved it, though. Yeah, Baron.

1:11:23Bill Simmons:Big Kahuna Burger were best use of food and drink. Obviously the cat sandwich. The cat sandwich. The dead cat sandwich. One of the worst orders you can make at a diner.

1:11:32Joanna Robinson:The way that Sarah from afar was like, it smells weird. And I'm like, Bear just tore into that thing. Like, what did it smell like?

1:11:39Bill Simmons:I'm not eating anything this lady had made after the way she's behaved for the last five days. Like, oh, you made me a sandwich? Thank you.

1:11:45Joanna Robinson:That's right after she duct taped the entire door. Like, let's dig in. My award for when I would have died. The cat sandwich. Yeah, I would have just been like, it's time to drink a whole can of Clorox. Yeah, pack it up, pack it in.

1:11:58Bill Simmons:I had for that probably of a heart attack when she was hiding in the corner watching me sleep. I just would have dropped dead. Did you have one for that one, Jordan? Yeah, it would have been really early because if I were her friend, I would have checked in with her, which none of her friends really seem to be doing.

1:12:15Joanna Robinson:And she would have gotten freaked out and killed me. Yeah. That's what I think would have happened. But they're not asking like Sarah's not asking any hard questions. true you know

1:12:23Bill Simmons:I don't think Sarah likes Nikki

1:12:24Joanna Robinson:no but like

1:12:25Bill Simmons:the friends in this movie don't actually like each other is one of the funny things this is one of my hot takes

1:12:29Joanna Robinson:I'm like does Nikki deserve anything that happens to her obviously not Bear is the bad guy the fact that she doesn't have any friends like good friends that notice that this is happening to her is a question I have yeah

1:12:43Bill Simmons:this is a really good category was there a better title for this movie I had two Make a Wish uh what you get sued what about Darling Nikki little tip of the cap to Prince wow you know what about the bear they couldn't have afforded it the bear yeah

1:13:03Joanna Robinson:is that taken

1:13:04Bill Simmons:why isn't this just called One Wish Willow

1:13:07Joanna Robinson:that sounds so kitschy I think that would be a real turn off for audiences I think it's it's what makes it different than calling it Ouija 2 you know like it's like it's not about the game it's about the the condition what do you think I agree that Obsession I don't know if it's like the absolute perfect choice but I couldn't think of another one yeah

1:13:25Bill Simmons:I feel like Obsession has come out as a title 130 times in the last 50 years I think if you call it

1:13:30Joanna Robinson:One Wish Roll that's like calling a movie Matchbox which they have done yes they sure have

1:13:34Bill Simmons:yeah what about just Wish I think there are lots of movies called Wish what about Bear Sucks what about

1:13:43Joanna Robinson:no pina coladas ever

1:13:46Bill Simmons:CRU flex category the Sean Fentasy Award for stealth homage that gives every movie nerd a criteria orgasm. The way Nikki moves specifically is very reminiscent or an homage to Kaioshi Kurosawa's pulse and the way the characters, the haunted characters move in that movie. Let's see. This is why this is the year of CR. A little Japanese horror. Fucking bringing up Japanese movies. I was just crushing some cursed tape last night. You know? We don't get to give this out that often. The Fortune 3 clap award for most gifable moment is it Nikki's face right after kiss the person to your left yeah that has made the rounds I think it's no no no no no

1:14:28Joanna Robinson:well I mean I think there's a couple options yeah no no no the most memeable image for me which is problematic because of what actually transpires in the movie is Bear turning her head back to the screen and I want to do that for like the first time the Sixers practice like turns her head back and it's just guys doing lamp lines. But yes, I think that there's

1:14:52Bill Simmons:like a ton of really... So you'll do the no, no, no in game 10. Jalen Brown's like, it's hard to get in a rhythm when you don't get a lot of shots. You just put the no, no, no beam right under it. That's right. I think the frown is probably the best one. Butch's girlfriend award for weak link of the film.

1:15:08Joanna Robinson:Know what you think.

1:15:09Bill Simmons:I have another one actually.

1:15:11Joanna Robinson:Okay. I think it's... I do... I feel bad because I think it's fine to cast your friend but Cooper Tomlinson who plays Ian, I think we could have plus that performance a little bit. I had a really hard time with this. I agree with you that he would be kind of an obvious, but I think knowing he's such a dirtbag at the end of the movie, I guess it was just sort of like... I kind of liked him. You like Cooper? I just thought he was supposed to be a dick.

1:15:35Bill Simmons:I had really one that really bothered me and then three times, third time, bothered me the most. So he calls One Wish Willow to not even cancel. he just wants to alter his wish and then he's like maybe I should cancel it but then at some point the guy's like do you want to talk to her and then Nikki's like on the phone just screaming from hell yeah I just would have cut that I didn't think it worked I thought it was awesome really I didn't like it at all

1:16:03Joanna Robinson:that's Curry Barker's voice I loved that scene I like the Curry Barker part I'm not talking about her being

1:16:08Bill Simmons:her being trapped fucking diabolical for what he does but her being trapped so that's just what she's doing for two weeks but where is she trapped? in this demonic purgatory where they send people who have been taken over by the wish.

1:16:21Joanna Robinson:And he can't deny what's happening. He heard her screaming. It's too weird. I love that line. He's like, I think you have like a moral obligation, man. You know? I also just think the way that Curry Barker like delivered all of that was so perfect. Would you like to cancel? You'd like to fill out like a cancel wish form? He's like, yes, yes, I do. He's like, we don't really do that. Board customer service voice.

1:16:41Bill Simmons:But does that scene still work though if we don't hear her screaming? I think it works either way. But I think the screaming,

1:16:46Joanna Robinson:I think the screaming, I think you need the screaming and you need that shot of him like fucking her while her face is like completely checked out. All right.

1:16:54Bill Simmons:I got outvoted two to one on the screaming. So I have to go to Craig. I liked it. God damn it. I just lose. All right. I put in the Ted Levine Award for a performance so good and distinct it may have ruined the actor's career. Just for Indie Navarrete. I hope there's other things where we're like,

1:17:12Joanna Robinson:I think she's good. I think she has a long, giant, awesome career. It's going to be tough next time Bear is like, I'm a nice dude who works in a bookstore in this Nancy Meyers movie. And people are going to be like, fuck you! Get out!

1:17:23Bill Simmons:See, I'm going to have the next time I see her just in a normal scene in a movie, I'm going to have to shake obsession. But I also watched it three times. What's age the worst? I love Blumhouse. They victory lap being involved in this movie and they just kind of put their slogan on it at the end. I thought that was just weird. I didn't like that. The only other one I could find was the, was an NC-17 rating was in the mix because the car, the brick scene with Sarah was so violent that they were like, this can't be our, we have to go up a level to NC-17. Kind of similar to the scene in Once Upon a Time in Hollywood with Mikey Madison getting her face slammed against the telephone.

1:18:07Another great head trauma of the 21st century. so curry don't call me cory barker had to um remove six head smashes to get the r rating

1:18:19Joanna Robinson:okay okay what's what's the number of head smashes that that tip you over i just i didn't like any

1:18:25Bill Simmons:of this first of all it's a violent scene like we could have kept a couple more head smashes and all all been okay but i i just think i i don't understand when they do stuff like that we're like you can keep eight head smashes, but 14 is too excessive. Like, what are we doing? Yeah. I was just like, what would like, fuck off. Is it worse than the light pole in hereditary? I mean.

1:18:47Joanna Robinson:So your answer is the MPAA. That's what's aged the worst. Fuck off. Yeah. I agree. Good one. Eternally.

1:18:53Bill Simmons:Here comes the telephone pole. Bang!

1:18:58Bill Simmons:Ruffalo, Hannah Rubinick, Partridge overacting word.

1:19:01Joanna Robinson:Can I give what's aged the worst?

1:19:02Bill Simmons:Yeah. What do you got?

1:19:03Joanna Robinson:Vans Twitter feed.

1:19:09Bill Simmons:evergreen did you did you fight with him at comic-con about this no he called like the day

1:19:14Joanna Robinson:that he was getting like raked over the coals he called me and was like hey who do you think in in this movie is and then talked to me for like an hour about it who did he think the villain was no he was no he was just sort of like the villain is existence itself yeah was sort of his argument but yeah I don't think I swayed him but I guess eventually he heard I think he heard through the pipeline from like the filmmakers and he was like oh I guess Bears the villain yeah he got enough I don't know that it came from like Curry but it came

1:19:45Bill Simmons:it came from Corey though yeah it came from Corey

1:19:48Joanna Robinson:his twin brother Corey Barker

1:19:50Bill Simmons:I missed all of this but he did text me about had I seen Obsession I was like this will be a three hour rabbit hole I was on the phone with him

1:19:58Joanna Robinson:when you texted me and you told me you're on the phone with him and I was like

1:20:01Bill Simmons:I'm staying at this don't you think the reason why this movie works is it is slightly nuanced at least for the first bit of the movie yeah like you can make the case in the first half once like it starts to flip and you're like okay this guy's horrible but like you can make the case that he's like did this wish actually work this is some fucking stupid stick maybe she did she does like me and then once he's in he's like well maybe I can make it real like you can buy into perhaps what he was thinking about like maybe I'll get her to like me for real and then it obviously switches and he becomes like totally screwed up but for the first half of the movie I feel like the point is that it's like if this were you if this were Mike from Swingers he would have done the same fucking thing

1:20:41Joanna Robinson:I don't think it's half the movie but I think it's plenty of the movie

1:20:45Bill Simmons:once he says why won't you what does he say to him would it be so bad would it be so bad to be with me or whatever he says that's like alright this guy's lost this fucking marbles he's done a lot of really bad shit up until then and then the fact that he says that she's like kill me he goes would it be so bad to be with me then then he's like I'm gonna go hang out with Sarah like I think before that when he's having sex

1:21:10Joanna Robinson:with her and she's just like not actually there after the no no no scene yeah very like knowingly like

1:21:17Bill Simmons:consent wise yeah what do you have for a flex category oh

1:21:21Joanna Robinson:um things things you can smell just by looking at them um oh my god

1:21:28Bill Simmons:did you make one up You made a flex cat a wrap? Wow.

1:21:32Joanna Robinson:That house.

1:21:33Bill Simmons:Oh, my gosh.

1:21:34Joanna Robinson:That's his dead grandma's house that a dead cat died in, and then she, like— And he doesn't seem like a big cleaner. Exactly. Like, that house already was musty as hell.

1:21:43Bill Simmons:So this could be the Borat Award for rancid body odor, but for the whole house. The obsession house for— Yeah, this is good. I like this. She soils herself.

1:21:51Joanna Robinson:And then she soils herself, and then the, like, foley on the squelching on the carpet. It's just like that house reeks.

1:21:56Bill Simmons:I hesitate to ask, but what was that on the carpet? that looked like her human waist? I think it was shit. Yeah, it looked like poop, right? Yeah. Yeah.

1:22:06Bill Simmons:I was hoping it was throw up.

1:22:10Joanna Robinson:You're like, come on, vomit. Come on, vomit.

1:22:13Bill Simmons:Doesn't that tie into the cat theory, though?

1:22:16Joanna Robinson:That she shat on the carpet?

1:22:17Bill Simmons:Oh, because the cat's just going anywhere it was.

1:22:20Joanna Robinson:I think it's better than the, you know, Sarah's always on his left theory, which, like, I don't know. But is she actually a cat?

1:22:29Bill Simmons:The obsession house for what the hell did that place smell like? That's definitely a category. We finally got a category of this. All right. The CR thinks Luke Wilson could have been Harrison Ford. How does take a word? I've already said this. I'm going to say it again. If Chalamet plays Bear, this is the greatest horror movie of all time. You know? With the firepower of that Indian Everett performance with Chalamet, sky's the limit. Would you accept Chalamet as a piece of shit? would you that's a great move for him can I offer you how many times can you be making Dune Jesus Christ can I offer you Dune 7 oh bad we're back

1:23:05Joanna Robinson:can I offer you the original Chalamet B-side Lucas Hedges instead

1:23:11Bill Simmons:what's happened to Lucas Hedges I don't know

1:23:13Joanna Robinson:but should he be in this movie dude I just saw I watched the I can't beat it scene from Manchester by the Sea came up on YouTube the other day and I was like this fucking guy he's great and sorry sorry baby he was really good in that movie but like I love that you just watched that right away

1:23:26Bill Simmons:you're just cracking that weren't you in a good mood from the LeBron signing you're like I'm gonna bring myself down I was like nothing can bring me down let's test it

1:23:32Joanna Robinson:I mean I have to believe you're constantly watching Manchester it's just the algorithmically

1:23:36Bill Simmons:got served to be yeah it is unbelievable what do you have for how to stay

1:23:41Joanna Robinson:is Nikki a good person because this is my question why does she not have anyone in her life who's like what the fuck is going on with you like where is her friend network like Like, where's her mom still alive, right? Where's Richter? Or did her mom die? Well, her dad's alive. I don't know if her mom's alive. Like, yeah.

1:24:01Bill Simmons:It's like an Aaron Rodgers thing. We don't know what her relationship is.

1:24:04Joanna Robinson:No one knows this girl enough to, like, see what's going on here. That's my spicy take. Does she deserve what happens? No.

1:24:13Bill Simmons:But... Sarah clearly doesn't like her. Yeah. Ian just hooks up with her every once in a while. Well, Sarah's probably, like, this girl is secretly hooking up with Ian and has Bear on a string. And is now having sex with my crush.

1:24:25Joanna Robinson:like I understand Sarah's resentment but I'm just sort of like if you're in your mid-twenties and you don't have one friend who can like intervene here like what's happening none of them have any friends like because they're not long-time friends they all met at this place right? they went to school together they all went to college together? no high school high school they're all like waiting to try and get into art school because Bear keeps going like remember when we were in this class together and then that was right right

1:24:47Bill Simmons:yet another reason Bear sucks people talking about what we were all doing in high school like shut up dude

1:24:52Joanna Robinson:and again that is like that is like basically ripped out of Can't Hardly Wait, of Ethan Embry's character being like, first day of school, she walked in, she was eating a Pop-Tart. That's the speech he gives.

1:25:07Bill Simmons:I had a picky nit, actually, but I'll just do it now because you just dove into that whole world about Sarah. Sarah definitely tells Bear that Ian and Nikki hook up occasionally. Way before that. She likes Bear. Yeah, way before that. If she likes Bear, that's a preemptive... There's a couple of real like this was done. Like Sarah needing to tell Bear about art school in the middle of the night. At four in the morning? Yeah. It was like, we can find a better time. But she's like, she doesn't like Nikki anyway. She's throwing Nikki under the bus.

1:25:38Joanna Robinson:I'll see you at work tomorrow. Yeah, exactly.

1:25:40Bill Simmons:Because once she tells Bear that, he's not going to like Nikki anymore because Ian will have been, you know. What do you have for how to stay? It's a little bit of a question. It's a little bit of a statement. But Bear never really loved Nikki. Correct. Which you can tell because when she cracks the wish, that's when he falls in love with her. Now, you could say he was off-put by her, just, you know, like, you know, like revolted by the fact that she liked him. But I think that the irony of this movie is that this guy never actually wanted the person that he damned to hell in the first place. And I really love that that moment is included in the film.

1:26:17When he comes out and he's doing the kind of rom-com, like, hey, here we are. just a couple of crazy kids like to fucking make things honest. And it's like, here we are stuffed to the gills with Oxy. Yeah.

1:26:30Joanna Robinson:You know, but it's a great moment because you realize like this guy is never actually emotionally committed to this person, even after damning her. I just also think he has no idea who she is and he doesn't, it doesn't matter to him who she is. She's just like this hot sort of status. Like if I can attain her, then I am worthy.

1:26:48Bill Simmons:Maybe there's not a ton there. A Nikki's part or Bear's part? Maybe Nikki's just, cute and good hang, but not like the...

1:26:54Joanna Robinson:Have you read her Hansel and Gretel incest poetry? She's got depth. She's a writer.

1:27:02Bill Simmons:Yeah, that's true. He wants to be a food critic.

1:27:04Joanna Robinson:What is this? Three Bite Bailey?

1:27:06Bill Simmons:Yeah. Three Bite Bailey. That's like when I wanted to do... I wanted Sean to do One Blurb. Yes. Where he just came out of movie theater. One blurb. The Odyssey. Excellent. Lived up to it. Casting What Ifs. You mentioned Barker.

1:27:22Joanna Robinson:Yeah.

1:27:22Bill Simmons:initially wanted to cast himself as Bear and talked himself out of it. And then they had Tomlinson as Bear during some set-up scenes, but then got somebody else. Best that guy. Everyone in the movie. But I guess Andy Richter, even though he's Andy Richter.

1:27:36Joanna Robinson:Andy Richter.

1:27:36Bill Simmons:It's about as close as we can get. Even though most people... You know who Andy Richter is, right? I feel like he's Andy Richter, but we don't have any other choices. The funny thing is, Cooper or Curry Barker's been on things. It's Always Sunny. These guys have actually been on TV and stuff. And just the two of them, their sketch comedy is pretty popular online. I used to see their stuff all the time. Dan Waiters, pick somebody who works in the Crystal Shop. You could have the male or the female. The man, the Harry, the guy at the end. I'm going with the female. I like the lady. I thought she was funny.

1:28:06Bill Simmons:What did you do? He's like, I may wish for her to love me. He's like, oh! I thought you did something really bad. Recasting Couch Director City. Well, you've already done Chalamet. No, I have another angle for this. Okay, let's hear it. is this way better as a Boston movie?

1:28:24Joanna Robinson:What? Bear is like Casey Affleck

1:28:28Bill Simmons:and Good Will Hunting era, Casey Affleck. Okay. Young Casey Affleck. And then Nikki's basically Blake Latley's character in the town. I knew you were going to say that. Yeah. She's Chris. She's like, Bear, what's up with Chris? She's fucking acting crazy. What the fuck's wrong with her? She banged a beer bottle. What are you talking about? It's boys night. I can't cut my left to socks. Would you have anything for this?

1:28:54Joanna Robinson:I think you should just call that category thinly veiled excuse to do the Boston accent category. What about Austin Abrams as Bear?

1:29:04Bill Simmons:Could have been really good.

1:29:05Joanna Robinson:In his nice guy euphoria mode.

1:29:08Bill Simmons:Did you hear about Bear? Craig, you have a flex category. A mini quick one. Best racehorse name, One Wish Willow. Yeah, fantastic. I'm going to tweak is it Rick Sassetti? is that how you say it? yeah I'm going to tweak the Rick Sassetti guard meet award for the most memorable death by a security guard or other bystander whom the movie treats as an inconsequential but who probably had a spouse and kids who loved him man poor Andy Richter who is Sarah's dad in this film and the music store owner loses his daughter and all four music store employees in one day

1:29:43Joanna Robinson:that's true that whole business is going to collapse the only person who lives is Sarah's murderer yeah so his daughter's dead his story's fucking ruined is the sequel Andy Richter leads the hunt for um

1:29:55Bill Simmons:or maybe Andy Richter goes to Ian's house and gets a billion and gets a billion dollars grabs the billion dollars and he's like

1:30:01Joanna Robinson:eh or is killed by the actual tonnage that would require to be one billion dollars in one place at any given time yeah it's still coming down yeah it's a lot we should do like as I was just gonna make a joke about he gets the billion dollars and then buys buys a piece of the Portland Trailblazers. We should do like a sports one wish willow pod. Where you think the wish was that got them Tom Dundon kind of thing. That's funny.

1:30:27Bill Simmons:At FesterNet Research, we mentioned most of it. Bear's Home was in Burbank. Location stuff. Cassell's Music, Castle's Music, whatever, San Fernando. The Green Man Crystal Shop. We could go there right now after this podcast. Roguelike Tavern in Burbank was Barker's Pub. You've been there? I feel like Sierra's been there. I'm sure I have. You fit the Burbank scene. Sure.

1:30:52Joanna Robinson:He's never skipped a tavern.

1:30:54Bill Simmons:And then the Pizzeria the Booth scene, that's Little Tony's in North Hollywood, which is now fighting them off.

1:31:03Joanna Robinson:All right.

1:31:04Bill Simmons:Yeah. People going.

1:31:05Joanna Robinson:People going and reenacting. People want to take pictures in the booth.

1:31:07Bill Simmons:Oh, really? Oh, yeah. I got to be honest.

1:31:10Joanna Robinson:Just filming TikToks where they're going, no, no, no, no.

1:31:12Bill Simmons:I wouldn't turn down an invitation. Little Tony's? Yeah, to head down to Little Tony's. And then go to the crystal shop.

1:31:18Joanna Robinson:Yeah. Yeah.

1:31:20Bill Simmons:And then Barker said he learned stuff about how to make movies as he made this movie. Like he did a lot of long takes, but didn't have the experience yet to be like, oh, here's why long takes are really hard. One thing can screw it, and it's hard to cut them together. So he would do that over again. And then they reshot the opening scene. And then we mentioned the lighting. You mentioned the two takes.

1:31:49Joanna Robinson:The original opening is bears watching like a rom-com.

1:31:51Bill Simmons:Yeah.

1:31:52Joanna Robinson:And then the camera pans down and the cat is just dead on the floor at his feet.

1:31:55Bill Simmons:Yeah.

1:31:55Joanna Robinson:And he liked it because it was a mirror of the ending. And then they recut it instead. But I don't know. I just kind of like the idea that the cat just died and like he hasn't noticed. Is that what it's supposed to be? Like Sandy's just dead on the floor. Also, that cat was awfully like stiff for having been freshly dead. I know. So you're wondering whether... Yeah, the cat would be a little more malley. Has he like really checked the kitchen out in a couple of days? Yeah. And would he notice the smell? Because that's just what that house smells like.

1:32:21Bill Simmons:So Nikki, when she vomits on Bear, there was some tube so that would make her throw up. But it almost made her actually throw up. And the actor who plays Bear is actually really afraid because he thinks she's about to be on her. Oh, my God. Yeah. And then they made a cast of Sarah's face and used two separate dummies to annihilate her face in the car scene. Apex Mountain everyone involved in the movie really quickly

1:32:46Joanna Robinson:for Half-Ass Internet Research the fact that Michael because Indy and I was already cast but the fact that he got the role because of their lack of chemistry in their read like that they during their audition Curry Barker was like these two have no chemistry sold and I love that that's such a Hail Mary for that to work that's how we put

1:33:05Bill Simmons:Chris and Andy together for the watch in 2012 Apex Mountain everyone involved in the movie Indie horror movies? I mean, I think Blair Witch and...

1:33:17Joanna Robinson:Constantly. Yeah. It's like a mountain range. It's constantly doing this. This and backrooms, if you call them like indie, have really certainly...

1:33:24Bill Simmons:I think this movie made more money than Blair Witch, though. Yeah. Blair Witch made$250 on a$500K budget. For inflation, it's probably the same. I think this is Apex Mountain. It's made 500 times what they spent on the movie. And probably that's going to keep going up and it's going to... I don't know. This feels like a bigger movie than Blair Witch. Yeah. It's hard though because Blair Witch was so big. Yeah, I don't know. Blair Witch was everything. We're still talking about Blair Witch 30 years later. I don't know if like Obsession in 10 years, we're going to be like, oh yeah, I remember that.

1:33:58That was cool. Also, I think the internet helps spread the word in a way that Blair Witch just couldn't in 1999. The fact that every time you go online, you're just seeing Obsession stuff over and over.

1:34:07Bill Simmons:Would you go Apex Mountain for Make-A-Wish that backfires movies?

1:34:13Joanna Robinson:No. I would do it for Hansel and Gretel erotica.

1:34:17Bill Simmons:Yeah. That's a good one. How about Dead Cats?

1:34:21Joanna Robinson:Yeah, Dead Cats is on my list. I feel like Dead Cats have been popping up a lot in our choices recently.

1:34:26Bill Simmons:Really, like torturing Mallory. Yeah.

1:34:27Joanna Robinson:What about fugly sweaters? For which one? Oh, yeah. All of his sweaters are so ugly. Door cardigans, yeah. Yeah, they're hideous. When he's with Sarah, he's got the Baja sweater over the hoodie. Yeah. Yeah. Apex Mountain for drinking game Jenga. I've played that a couple times. I have also played that. It's really fun. Never done that. Ringer Retreat.

1:34:47Bill Simmons:Are we doing a Ringer Retreat?

1:34:49Joanna Robinson:Yeah, Ringer Retreat.

1:34:50Bill Simmons:Do we invite Van?

1:34:52Joanna Robinson:We'll play Jenga. I'll bring my Hansel and Gretel erotica and we'll have a great time.

1:34:57Bill Simmons:Cruiser Hanks. Hanks. I don't know. What do you mean you don't know? It's a freaking category CR. No, I know, but just when you say it, it's like, I think Hanks. I think it's Hanks. I think Hanks.

1:35:08Joanna Robinson:Splash era Hanks As Bear As Bear Yeah

1:35:13Bill Simmons:New category Just for this pod 1984 Sharon Stone 2004 Scarlett Johansson 2014 Brie Larson Oh Or 2021 Sydney Sweeney If we couldn't get Indie Navarrete I go 04 ScarJo

1:35:27Joanna Robinson:ScarJo That's my name

1:35:28Bill Simmons:I think she would have been great Yeah Like Matchpoint Lost in Translation Right that era I think she would have crushed it I did have best name for a racehorse. I had the same one. One Wish Willow.

1:35:42Joanna Robinson:Not Three Bite Bailey? No.

1:35:44Bill Simmons:Okay. Picky knits. I have a few. All of my picking knits are, you can explain because of the cravenness of the characters at various points, but Bear doesn't insist Nikki get her bottle stab wounds treated at the hospital. He allows her to come home, right? Like, which would have then triggered like all sorts of investigations as to how that had happened. Bear's reaction to the One Wish Willow call is that he's still going to go out with like his boys that night and nobody called the cops at the party. Nobody calls like 911 at the party and Sarah needing to meet in the middle of the night. But like those are all just like...

1:36:19Joanna Robinson:No one at the party intervening and being not just being like, hey, this is weird, but being like, this is fucked up. Let's call the cops.

1:36:28Bill Simmons:Even Sarah afterwards is like, Nikki at that party. It's like, my reaction would have been 20 times bigger than that. Yeah. Like we were at something together on Saturday. Can you imagine if somebody was just hitting themselves on the head in the beer bottle? I had a bunch of cat-related ones. The cat opened a bottle of Oxycontin pills and ate them?

1:36:51Joanna Robinson:The cat didn't heed the don't eat warning on the bottle?

1:36:54Bill Simmons:So was the thing open and the cat knocked it down and was then like, oh, cool pills? I think Bear is just like really loosey-goosey and I bet he's been dipping. He's been dipping. Dead cat Sandy, you could really feel the 700. 50k budget on the dead cat. That looked like they just bought a stuffed animal. But I'm glad they didn't disclose your day where it's like an animated cat, dead cat. Yeah. Okay, fair. Bear accidentally kills the cat. It's his fault. The cat overdoses on Oxy. Yes. His carelessness. Mourns it for a couple hours and then he's just like, I'm going to go out with my buddies and not tell anybody what happened.

1:37:26Bill Simmons:And I'll put the cat in the garbage can.

1:37:27Joanna Robinson:When your crush calls and is like, we're running out of time.

1:37:32Bill Simmons:Terrible cat owner. Trying to think of the worst pet owners. Mallory always said we've decided that Michael Douglas in Fatal Attraction is the worst pet owner of all time.

1:37:42Joanna Robinson:You're putting Bear up there?

1:37:43Bill Simmons:He's gone for two days and then comes home and gives the dog spaghetti and meatballs.

1:37:46Joanna Robinson:I think that was his grandma's cat. I think the cat belonged to his dead grandma so he didn't really care as much.

1:37:54Bill Simmons:I just feel like a dead cat sandwich you're getting incredibly ill. Yeah. I think that's like that could start the next COVID.

1:38:01Joanna Robinson:Doesn't he vomit? He pukes into it but I think it's the idea. of like the idea. I don't think he refrigerated that at all. Like it's not. No. It's just been sitting at room temperature. But like where? Because like he must have put it back. Like how many times did she take it out of the trash or wherever he put the body? Because like. There's a lot of questions about the sandwich. Like how did she get it to look so close to leftover turkey? Like. Yeah. It looks like a nice turkey club. Yeah. It would reek the second he opens it. I know.

1:38:26Bill Simmons:He's an idiot.

1:38:29Joanna Robinson:Again, maybe he can't smell it because that's how bad the house smells all the time.

1:38:32Bill Simmons:Bear calls One Wish Willow not initially to cancel the wish but to alter it. He still doesn't want to cancel the wish at this point?

1:38:41Joanna Robinson:No, he wants us to love him. Because he's a fucking bad guy because he sucks.

1:38:45Bill Simmons:Nikki, I feel like her face is more fucked up from four broken bottles against the head. That's like the Clint Malarczyk injury at that point. There's blood going everywhere. Sarah's dead body. Another example really feeling the 750k budget when she's behind the steering wheel and it just looks like a mannequin. Yeah. And then later when it's in the chair. Yeah. And then, it's a big one for me. What did they do with Sarah's car? There's not a lot of police oversight. The worst impulsion comes in and helps them clean it with Marcellus?

1:39:20Joanna Robinson:I hope so. It also seems like she had time to go to the music store, get the gun out of the safe, because presumably that's where the gun comes from. and then also like recreate Sarah's tattoos in Sharpie and haircut and yeah she got a lot done so I believe in her that would have been great if Winston Wolfe had shown up it's just been like okay Nikki make some coffee

1:39:46Bill Simmons:the biggest nitpick is none of the friends intervening as Nikki completely spirals and becomes synapsed that's insane okay sequel prequel prestige TV all black cast are untouchable So that whole thing about a prestige anthology series where each episode is about a wish. I'm in. I've signed up. Would you ever want the wishes to work out well? I think I don't know what to expect each time I get a wish.

1:40:14Joanna Robinson:One of those Reddit boards, it was like, my mom used to be ugly and now she's gorgeous. So maybe that one worked out. I would want to press like a 1970s set One Wish Willow movie.

1:40:26Bill Simmons:Oh, that's good. period. Yeah. Um, I also can offer you the sequel. Ian now has a billion dollars, but he didn't die. Just, it was like one of those gunshots that went through, but he somehow lived and now he's a billionaire, but all his friends are dead. And then, uh, someone else finds Ian's billion dollars, maybe even Andy Richter. Yeah. And then spends the money. It could be another one. there will be some version we all know

1:40:55Joanna Robinson:of obsession

1:40:56Bill Simmons:there will be an obsession to something there's too much money at stake for it not to happen

1:41:01Joanna Robinson:yeah he's got one movie he's already in the middle of making which is him and Cooper Tomlinson with Aaron Paul Ghost Hunter and then I think he is supposed to make Texas Chainsaw Massacre

1:41:15Bill Simmons:is this movie better with Wayne Jenkins Fergie the Flores, Zane Lowe, Robert Evans Dr. Charles Nichols, Ted Levine, someone else. I've been thinking about this. Yeah. You know, because Concepcion did a good Bernthal. Yeah. Tom Holland does a very good Bernthal. I am hearing footsteps. I also hear, you know, like we should maybe put Bernthal on the bench. Is he overexposed? But let me just offer you this. When he calls up the customer service line, what if King Menelaus picked up the phone? You interested in rumor, huh? Gossip? Who has a story about Freaky Nikki, huh? You? You? You have a story?

1:41:54Some say she's rich. Some say she's poor. Some say she's Paris. Some say she's in prison. What say you?

1:42:03Joanna Robinson:Astounding work. Wow.

1:42:04Bill Simmons:Wayne Jenkins retired for king. What's his name? Meloes. Yeah. Temeculous. Yeah. Temeculous? Is he the king of Temeculous? That's a good one, Sierra.

1:42:14Joanna Robinson:That was really good. Can you do what you imagine it was like for Bernthal to spar with Kevin Feige on stage at San Diego Comic-Con? I can't. Okay. It was great.

1:42:26Bill Simmons:Did you get to meet Bernthal?

1:42:27Joanna Robinson:No, but I saw him from afar. He looked great.

1:42:29Bill Simmons:I ironically had Tony Romo written down to do for that section. I'm going to pass on that one because Tony's had some issues this week. Trying to support Tony. Trying to stay classy. Just one Oscar who gets it. Is that ready? Yeah.

1:42:42Joanna Robinson:Yeah.

1:42:45Bill Simmons:the Zewatnail award for what happened the next day yeah what did Nikki's next 10 years look like well there's no police in this town she goes to jail

1:42:54Joanna Robinson:right I mean that's what Curry Barker says right that she's probably going to jail for a long time but I would like to believe that she somehow knows about the billion dollars gets a billion dollars and literally goes to Zewatnail

1:43:06Bill Simmons:that would be cool she deserves probably some small facial reconstructive surgery because she has a giant hole in her forehead.

1:43:13Joanna Robinson:She deserves something nice. She did nothing wrong and she got tormented this whole movie. So she deserves, I mean, Sarah also did not deserve to die. But, you know, she, like, give her the billion dollars. Hit the road. Never come back.

1:43:27Bill Simmons:So the question is, wish Nikki heard about the billion dollars, but did... Oh, it is the consciousness... Captured Nikki. I think the reason she's screaming is because she remembers everything that's just happened.

1:43:39Joanna Robinson:Everything, yeah. That has been said by Curry Barker.

1:43:42Bill Simmons:So if this movie ended with Nikki with a billion dollars in the trunk just driving toward the Pacific like Indy Dufresne.

1:43:50Joanna Robinson:Yeah.

1:43:50Bill Simmons:Better or worse ending versus her whaling crying. Like Jesse in Breaking Bad just like ahhh.

1:43:56Joanna Robinson:I feel like it should be like one of those where like it's just like suitcases stuffed with cash and there's so much cash that it's just like blowing out the like convertible.

1:44:04Bill Simmons:Cars like money coming out of it.

1:44:06Joanna Robinson:Yeah. Unanswerable questions. I have one for this. What's crazier? what is a crazier thing to say? Is it crazier to say, I'll rip my eyes out of my fucking skull and shove the barrel into my pussy? Or, if I was a Bulls fan, I would have no sperm left in my body.

1:44:28The first one.

1:44:31Bill Simmons:My other inensable question is, what would you wish for? I'd be too afraid of this thing.

1:44:39Joanna Robinson:I've just seen too much to know. to like even fuck with something like this. Even jokingly. What would you wish for? Or did you already do it earlier this year?

1:44:47Bill Simmons:Thinking about this, I've already done it. That's how I wound up. You have to say the move is just to wish for money or something that's immediately positive.

1:44:53Joanna Robinson:Well, I mean, this is why in the, you know, prestige text that is Aladdin, you can't bring people back from the dead. You can't make people fall in love with you. You don't fuck with stuff like that. Well, I also wonder how pedantic it is. So it's like if I were to say, I wish heat two to be good, is it only good? do I have to say, I wish Heat 2 was the best movie ever made? with your language. And what would happen if that happened? Would there then be a backlash because people are like, people like fucking Heat 2 too much. You know, like, if that was your one wish,

1:45:22Bill Simmons:that would be really weird.

1:45:23Joanna Robinson:Can you do, I need Heat 2 to be good and then really quickly I say something like, no loopholes, no fucking with like, you know, how quickly do you have When does the wish like narrative end? Like, when do you have to like have a complete wish?

1:45:35Bill Simmons:How weird could your wish be that it actually is conceivable? Like, if you were like, I know exactly what I would wish for. Like, I wish the all would come back. I wish smoking cigarettes was healthy. Oh. It would be so awesome.

1:45:47Joanna Robinson:Not only neutral, but like actually good for you. Yeah, like if it was just like we could all go back to Don Draper style. It's just like as healthy as your sweet green addiction. It would be your cigarette addiction. All right. Greg, what would you wish for? Probably Rodgers to win MVP this year. Yeah. Chargers online to stay healthy. What would you like keep it? Like, you'd have to be specific. Like, what if Rogers was like, trade me to the Niners? Oh, you're right. And then I win MVP, you know?

1:46:16Bill Simmons:Was Nikki possessed by the cat? I think no. Unanswerable.

1:46:21Joanna Robinson:I think no, but I really like it.

1:46:23Bill Simmons:There's a lot of clues. And there's people convinced on the internets.

1:46:27Joanna Robinson:I mean, it's a way stupider movie. And my daughter is also convinced. It's a way stupider movie, if that's true. But it's really fun.

1:46:32Bill Simmons:Well, it makes more sense if it's like a YouTube sketch comedian made a horror movie. and one of his ideas was the lady was actually possessed by the cat, but now he's realizing that would be stupid, so he's just not going to say that.

1:46:42Joanna Robinson:Oh, okay.

1:46:43Bill Simmons:And they stumbled into the better version of the movie.

1:46:44Joanna Robinson:And he's like, actually, it's a commentary on insult culture. Yeah. But really, it's the cat possession movie.

1:46:50Bill Simmons:Next question. Was the sales lady who sold Bear, the one-wish willow, an evil person?

1:46:59Joanna Robinson:I think what she thinks is that if you're dumb enough to do this, you deserve what's coming to you. That's the entire narrative I'm putting on the crystal shop. Yeah. But it does, there are like two scenes in this movie that are a little bit, I bump on a little bit. I mean, there's a fair amount, but one, when we see, when Bear leaves the duct tape house, we stay with Nikki. That's like the one time we break from Bear's POV, really. The other is that when the crystal store people are like, oh yeah, the one wish willow, it totally works and you should have read the fine print. Like that just would have been a bigger deal.

1:47:33it makes more sense if Bear can't get any help on it you know um but yeah like I do think that the people at the Crystal Store are a little bit complicit

1:47:43Bill Simmons:that also could be the prequel or the sequel the store that has these powers that's a great it's a great idea if the anthologies all that stuff has to come out of that store um what happened to all the One Wish Willow buyers the other ones yeah it's unclear it was just crazy shit happening all over the place find out when E2 comes out we mentioned Ian's billion dollars. Yeah. So did Wayne Jenkins and his crew find that? Like, God damn, Ian! And then just started pocketing it. But there is a billion dollars in that house.

1:48:17Joanna Robinson:Yeah. So somebody found it. Waiting for her or waiting for Andy Richter. There's really only two options.

1:48:22Bill Simmons:Coach Finstock Mr. Miyagi Award. Best worst life lesson. You can't pray for someone to fall in love with you. It's bad karma. Yeah, I'd say just sometimes it's okay to be in the friend zone.

1:48:32Joanna Robinson:Yep. Sometimes friendship's fine.

1:48:33Bill Simmons:You can't will somebody to like you. Best double feature choice. I actually had Played Misty for me. Going as far back as possible. And then the complete flip. Obsessive relationships. With this one, yeah. The complete flip of it.

1:48:46Joanna Robinson:I'm going to do The Craft. Because it's classic 90s. And also, there's a similar plot line with... Was it like Skeet Ulrich in that movie? I think. Yeah. Right? Yeah. And she's like, I want him to be in love with him. and then he becomes obsessed with it. Neve Campbell,

1:49:00Bill Simmons:Farooza Bach. Who else is in that? There's one more. Alexis Bedell? Is that not Rhodes, right?

1:49:06Joanna Robinson:No, Robin Tunney. Robin Tunney. Robin Tunney. I have Milk and Cereal, which is Curry's like 50-minute film that's on YouTube. Cereal, not spelled the way you know it. Yeah, S-E-R-I-L. Who won the movie? Indy. Or Curry. Yeah, I guess... Okay, so...

1:49:24Bill Simmons:This is one of the toughest ones we've ever had.

1:49:26Joanna Robinson:I feel like... Like he already has his blank check, you know? Yeah. From this. She might be in Heat 2, but she might not. I don't know.

1:49:36Bill Simmons:Well, we go back to Sixth Sense with M. Night. We would have said, M. Night or Haley Joel Osment, and then Haley Joel. But he was a kid actor.

1:49:44Joanna Robinson:And then it was actually Toni Collette. All along.

1:49:47Bill Simmons:You're probably right that Curry Barker is going to win.

1:49:50Joanna Robinson:It's tough though. It is tough. Yeah.

1:49:52Bill Simmons:It's a weird, I hate doing this because we always say no ties for this award, but I honestly think it's a tie. Well, because it's like, just strictly professionally, who would you rather be? Like, who would you rather bet on going forward? Well, Kurt Barker's going to have a 30-year career now making movies. She's going to have a 30-year career. She's going to be the A-list actress out of this.

1:50:11Joanna Robinson:Maybe, but like, I hope so. Like, he could make two shitty movies and then it's kind of over. She could also pick a bunch of bad movies and it could be over for her. I just think the risk is higher for her.

1:50:22Bill Simmons:For any actor or actress, yeah. Right.

1:50:24Joanna Robinson:that like whatever she does next could make her break. I think he can make a bad next movie and still... And she could be in like Ghost Rider or something. Right. You know, yeah. No shots of Ghost Rider. No, but please no. What do you got? Banger? The hype was so high. I feel like it usually never works when you see a movie post-hype. Like I remember I saw everything ever all at once right when it came out. I loved it. And then the hype got so big and so many people saw it six months after it came out and hated it. Yeah. And so I was kind of fully expecting to go in and be like, all right, this is going to be mediocre.

1:50:58And, you know, just because the hype was so high. And I really thought it delivered it, not as a horror person at all. Like, I thought Indy was incredible. Really, like, her war is like 20 in this movie. I can't believe how good she is. And I do think about what this movie would be if they didn't find her. But, like, the production about this movie is so good. Like, it looks like a studio movie. It's pretty remarkable. The lighting, the blocking, like, all of it is just really well done. and I was trying to think about why this movie stuck and it's like so sticky to young people I don't know I think there's something about how small it is and how it's about just like a relationship between a man and a woman who are young and it's like this morbid curiosity of getting to see this relationship in intimate settings in a house and it never really gets bigger than itself the movie it doesn't go huge it doesn't turn into like the scary monster shows up at the end and I think people I think that like the struggle with relationships now people just really related to that.

1:51:51There's a lot of really cool high concept horror movies that have come out over the last couple of years and they, many of them wind up becoming about a person trying to solve the mystery of what is happening to them. And Bear never does that. Bear knows what's happened.

1:52:06Joanna Robinson:Yeah. And is like, I'm going to pursue it anyway. But like Smile, like the woman in Smile is like, I have to find the original Smiler so I can like reverse what's happening. Or Happy Death Day. Yeah, exactly. Or whatever. totally yeah it's a great idea yeah but this is like what if the guy was just like well we could maybe date still though like you know like consent overrated um I I just um I really appreciate the chutzpah of the movie to not explain so many things you know what I mean like it's just like we don't need to know the full history of all these people we don't need to know they just like all work at a music store and that's fine and they all know each other you don't have to explain the rules of where she is and how she could get out also a great ending I thought like the rare satisfying and terrifying at the same time of ending that's like a real like get you come out speechless like we got to go talk about that

1:52:51Bill Simmons:yeah yeah and i had no problem doing this for rewatchables because i think this movie will have real legs yeah um because it's fucking scary it's got like three or four iconic scenes that when they're on or when somebody's watching you're like oh i want to see this scene coming up and the performance was by indian avareti was like you know that's like when scarlet was in uh Lost in Translation. And you're like, wow, this person's going to be in our lives now. And it doesn't happen that often. Well, the last couple of years, we've had a lot of young actresses. We've now had Mikey Madison, Chase Infinity, and now Indie Navarrete in the last two years.

1:53:26Really pop. Pop, but then like,

1:53:28Joanna Robinson:what's next? You know what I mean? Like with Mikey, like everyone's asking questions now about Mikey. So, but I mean, you're absolutely right. And, uh,

1:53:39Bill Simmons:yeah, well, Chase was, what was the terrible Apple show she was on? Presumed Innocent? That was before Lombard. She's on the Testaments. It's so funny how that flips, though, where I watch her on that show and I was like, this will be a very serious actress who's going to be nominated for Oscars because it was a terrible show. In this one, anyway, really good one. Well, thanks, Craig. Thanks, Gahal. Thanks, Eduardo. Thanks for doing this live with us on Netflix. We beat the runtime of the movie. Nice job. We're coming back next week with another rom-com gone wrong Mr. Miyagi and Daniel-san and Karate Kid 2 that is going to be next week so that's on Netflix if you want to watch that check it out thanks for joining us