Hour 1: Broncos/Raiders Snoozefest Reactions, plus NFL Insider Tom Pelissero

21:04Tom Pelissero:Who would you move? And Mugi's answer more or less was anybody on the teams available for a price. At that time, Mugi was focused on moving Michael Carter, who was a slot who was making a lot of money, eventually traded him to the Eagles. The Colts didn't need a slot. They got Kenny Moore. They needed an outside corner. And so that night, Chris Ballard, the Colts GM, called Mugi back and was like, hey, what would you think about moving sauce? And so there was a little back and forth. Then last week, they kind of reconnected. And at that point, Chris Ballard knew that the price was going to be really high to get Sauce Gardner.

21:40Tom Pelissero:And he was still kind of on the fence about whether or not he was willing to go there. Then from what I was told, the Colts and Ballard kind of did some research on the history of these in-season trades. And there's like no precedent for a 24-year-old all-pro corner who is cost controlled on a fresh extension that was signed like three or four months ago to move teams. It just never happens. In other words, this was not just like a lot of these trade deadline deals, a guy in a contract here, Jalen Phillips, Jacoby Myers at the end of his deal where it's kind of like, hey, we're going for it right now.

22:16Tom Pelissero:They viewed this as both the short and long-term type of a fix. And so by the time we got to this past Sunday, just a few days ago, So they kind of concluded, like, we might have an opportunity to do something really interesting here. So Monday morning, they talked again. Then Chris Ballard basically said, hey, I got to go to my owner. That's Carly Ursa-Gordon, who everyone knows has been really involved, taking notes on the sidelines. She has been training for this for years, understanding every different aspect of roster building and of the organization, including how the scouting process works.

22:52Tom Pelissero:And so they had conversations with Chris Ballard, Shane Steik, and Carly Ersay Gordon on Monday. And essentially, it got to a point where I was told Carly said something to the effect of like, all right, why don't we just go get the best guy? And so by Monday night, Chris Ballard was coming back and saying, all right, we will do the two ones. Darren Mugi said, hey, I got to talk to Woody Johnson. He's over in London. Tuesday morning, Mugi calls back for, as a lot of these big trades go, one more ask. How about you throw in A.D. Mitchell, a talented young wide receiver who the Colts have been shopping him.

23:26Tom Pelissero:They had some different offers for kind of low-level compensation. Would you throw him into the deal? So Ballard went back. He talked again with Carly and with Shane. And they decided, OK, let's do this thing. One of the timing complications was most of the Jets organization was at Nick Mangold's funeral at that time. So they had to keep it quiet for a few more hours. then once you know the Jets brass was able to leave and not have their their phones lighting up during the funeral that's when Sauce was called in and told he was being traded to the Colts which then led to again something that is very very rare in this day and age which is Sauce Gardner breaking the trade of sorts by putting on social media like basically thanks for everything New York I'm out which then set off the frenzy of phone calls Ian Rappaport a couple minutes later puts out Sauce has been traded to the Colts.

24:19Tom Pelissero:It was as much as we kind of had anticipated and knew that there was a lot going on surrounding Quinton Williams there was not really a whiff of this with Sauce Gardner. It's doable because rather than doing a lump sum signing bonus when they extended him back in July they put a lot of the money into a 20 million dollar option bonus in 2026. The Colts now are responsible for that. The Jets get the opportunity to really remake some things and have a ton of draft capital plus a flyer on a young player that they like and the colts get a guy who's already locked in on a pre-negotiated contract that brought instant energy i was told to the building after the trade and we'll get our first look at him sunday morning

24:59Rich Eisen:in brazil against the falcons all right so uh three things uh to follow up on first one real quick boy you really had the opportunity there and feel free to to use this moving forward when you have these conversations you had the opportunity to say that the colts flipped ag ad mitchell to the jets but you you you didn't do that number two um if they did they would do it

25:23Tom Pelissero:at the appropriate time after crossing the goal line of the trade but it turns out see i was trying

25:30Rich Eisen:to be subtle and then you came in you didn't have to hit the nail on the head and i just leave leave the subtlety to me listen um let's you you miss 100 of the shots you don't take totally get it but was there anything going on rumor wise that that sauce could be had to lead the cults to say what about sauce i mean he said he didn't ask for a trade but as you point out i mean 24 year olds under contract you know control freshly under contract control were as good as this kid they're not they're not available or for any price why did why did ballard ask other than just

26:10Tom Pelissero:was there something there is there something there this is why rich it's the colts were calling everybody in the nfl and trying to find a corner there was just not a lot out there they had another trade that if this had fallen through maybe they would have gone through with it but my understanding was their thinking is even if they made a trade for one of these other guys you could get for, let's say, a mid-round draft pick. It wasn't going to be that much different than what they had already. In order to get a true upgrade, not just for the rest of this year, but for the long haul, you needed to do something really big and bold.

26:46Tom Pelissero:I mean, they still were asking those questions until last week. I got certain calls from people there as well to say, are there any corners? And there really wasn't anything in the marketplace. So, no, this was the classic anytime you've got a team that, like the Jets, I mean, a few weeks ago, they were winless. They finally got their first win before the bye. Were you calling? You're just like, all right, what will you listen on? It was the same thing with the Dolphins last week, where, in essence, they told everybody, you know, we're willing to listen to anybody on the roster. Ultimately, you know, the one move they made was trading Jalen Phillips to the Eagles, but there was a price point at which Jalen Waddell would have been moved.

27:23Tom Pelissero:There were price points at which their other pass rushers, like Bradley Chubb, would have been moved. Brandon Bean, the Bills GM, said it well in his press conference a couple days ago. which is 99 % of the players in the league are available at a price. There's all kinds of things that go into it in terms of how would you use those draft picks, the cash and cap that goes into it. There were really not, other than Jalen Phillips, there were none of these trades that were predicated on being paid down. Kyle Duggar was, but that was the previous week. There was no buying of draft picks outside of a little bit of Miami, but even that was like$5 million.

27:58Tom Pelissero:bucks with sauce he was not somebody that they were actively pushing he was not unhappy there if you look at all the advanced metrics sauce has been one of the best corners in the NFL this season but for the Jets I think it's always important to look at it this way you know they were as these cocks were going they were going 0-6 0-7 they were not a sauce gardener away from winning it all the combination of things that they got out of these trades they now have two first round picks in 2026 they have three first round picks in 2027 plus extra second round picks maybe the most fascinating thing rich that came out of all these trades was uh that initially dallas had a 2026 first rounder as part of the deal along with a lower pick i was told a fourth rounder in 2027 it ends up with a second round pick in 2026 and a first round pick in 2027 a lot of people would look at that and say well you're downgrading that first round pick well a they get a better the additional pick ends up being a higher pick the second rounder but b the jets actively wanted the extra pick in 2027 why would that be 2027 based upon all the scouts and gms i've talked to is generally regarded as a better draft as a whole and quite possibly with all the questions about the quarterbacks in this year's class, 2027 might end up being the stronger class for QBs at a time that the Jets are a little further in their program.

29:28Tom Pelissero:Their 2027 first round pick, their own, might not be as high as their 2026 pick is. Now all of a sudden you've got an extra 2026 pick to move up if you find that QB, but you've also got three picks in 2027 where if your own pick is in the middle of the first round, bundling all those together gives you a lot of leverage to try to go up and get the quarterback if you're still needing one in

29:51Rich Eisen:2027 and the final follow-up on this subject matter is the two ones that the colts were willing to part with and again i i just love you know uh carly ursa gordon just saying why aren't we doing the biggest boldest most surefire thing possible and just damning those first round torpedoes. But does that indicate they found their quarterback for not just now, but the future, that this is Daniel Jones' gig now for the Colts?

30:20Tom Pelissero:We'll see how it plays out through the course of the season. You would have said for most of last season, Rich, that Sam Darnold was playing like the Vikings quarterback of the future. And as much as we don't want to reduce Sam Darnold's season, which was brilliant last year, to a game or two, he was terrible in week 18 against Detroit. the whole team wasn't very good in the wildcard game against the Rams. If those games go differently and the Vikings make a run, maybe they are extending Sam Darnold. Maybe they are pushing off the J.J. McCarthy debut. I think that makes sense for everyone as much as, yes, Daniel Jones is playing at a really high level, particularly for a guy who's only making like$17 million this season.

30:57Tom Pelissero:If they're able to get something done with Daniel Jones, it is going to be a big money type of a contract. They can't lean on that. But I think the important thing to understand here is This is not just a, all right, we are going for it right now. You know, get rid of the picks because of anything. It's also, this was getting a 24-year-old all-pro player that they have under contract for a certain amount for years to come. They still got seven picks, by the way, in the 2026 draft. So the Colts didn't give up like their entire class to do it. Certainly gives you less ammunition to go and find another quarterback.

31:29Tom Pelissero:But even if somehow things don't work out with Daniel Jones, I think the Colts have already shown. And this was part of the idea with this of going with Daniel Jones over Anthony Richardson coming into the season, which was the Colts feel like they've built a really strong roster. You can plug in different quarterbacks there as long as they can get the ball to your playmakers. Let that defense coordinated by Lou Anarumo do its thing. They're going to have an opportunity with a bunch of different types of quarterbacks here. Though certainly Daniel Jones is putting himself in position to get a huge contract.

31:58Tom Pelissero:And the Colts will certainly be centerpiece of that plan.

32:02Rich Eisen:A few minutes left with Tom Pelissero. A few quicker hitters, although this one's a little bit in-depth. Kyler Murray, we last saw him on a week five snap against the Titans. The snap goes off of his face mask. There's a fumble on the ground. It looked innocent, to be honest with you, in terms of the injury. It seems that he suffered trying to corral that football. We haven't seen him since. Jacoby Preset has played well. It seemed Murray was close last week. the reporting we heard might have been even from you is that, hey, he can run. He can be himself when he's throwing it, but when he has to run it, he's not looking like himself.

32:40Rich Eisen:And now, boom, Jacoby Brissett, Monday Night Football winner over the Cowboys later, he's now on IR. So is there anything other than just him trying to get healthy at a foot, if you will?

32:55Tom Pelissero:Well, let's start out with what the injury is. It's a mid-foot sprain, which is in the Liz Frank area. And if he comes back sooner than when he's 100%, even going out there and practicing, there's some level of risk. If you go out there and play a game and it's not fully healed, you're at a greater risk of a setback. So the reason he was practicing in recent weeks was to keep his arm live, just to see if he could be able to take those steps forward. Then what Jonathan Gannon said publicly, I believe it was on Monday, reflected the same thing that he had told Kyler Murray privately, which was, hey, we're going to go with Jacoby right now.

33:30Tom Pelissero:We're going to ride the hot hand. Well, at that point, does it make any sense for Kyler Murray at less than 100 % and presumably not getting any reps during the week to try to just push himself forward at less than 100 % and go suit up as the backup and then maybe get thrown into a situation where he can't run, he can't move the way that he's supposed to, and isn't getting any reps, and then looks bad or, even worse, hurts himself. Once that happened and there were some other pieces of this that kind of played into it, it just made sense to put Kyler on IR and allow him to get fully healthy. You know, we'll see.

34:03Tom Pelissero:These next four games now that he's going to be on IR, they could go 3-1 if they are. They may still well ride with Jacoby Brissett and maybe Kyler is dressed as the backup. If they go 1-3, they're going to have decisions to make about exactly what they do with Kyler returning and if it even makes sense to put Kyler on the field at that point. What we do know, Rich, is Kyler is due$40 million fully guaranteed in 2026. Another$20 million in 2027 converts to a full guarantee if and when he's on the roster the fifth day of the league year in March. In other words, they are tied to Kyler Murray with fully guaranteed money into next year and then potentially into 2027.

34:43Tom Pelissero:It's TBD on the futures. There's not been in-depth discussions about this at this point. I think it's fair to say that his future with the Cardinals is in some doubt at this point, but we'll see how these next couple of months go before all the options sort of crystallize for exactly what direction this heads.

35:00Rich Eisen:Tom Pellicero, a few minutes left with him here prior to the rest of Week 10. The assumption, and we all know what that risks, is that Bucky Irving would be back after the bye for the Bucs, and it looks like he's not, nor is Chris Godwin for this big game against the Patriots. What's up with Bucky Irving, Tom?

35:19Tom Pelissero:Well, as we all know, Brockman certainly does. I can never give gambling advice. But if I did, I would say in the future, if you were, let's say, betting in a manner of speaking on a foot injury and how soon a guy's going to be back, bet the over. Bucky Irving was a, hey, if he's out of the boot on Friday, he's going to be back without missing a game. Kyler Murray was, hey, questionable game-time decision. Both those guys were a month-plus later, and they haven't made it back. foot injuries just are really really tricky um i don't i'm not a doctor so i can't compare the two but it sounds like it's the same type of thing which is there's a healing process there's a risk factor clearly he's not yet gotten um out of that phase for bucky irving to be able to come back there's not a proclamation that he's not going to be back you know the rest of the regular season or anything like that we'll monitor that we'll monitor chris godwin too who hasn't practiced in quite some time because of another unrelated fibula injury here.

36:14Tom Pelissero:So the Bucs continue to be the team that find ways to, you know, kind of patch this thing together regardless of who's on the field. And they're going to be, it seems, doing that for at least another week here.

36:24Rich Eisen:And the team, obviously, we did a deep dive on the Jets trading and the Cowboys acquiring and the Colts acquiring. The team that everybody reached out to you throughout this entire week's process of trades or trades that didn't go down that everybody was curious about. What's that team, Tom?

36:43Tom Pelissero:I would say that the things that stood out to people within the league were the relative inactivity by certain teams. The Titans clearly made a couple of trades. They traded Draymond Jones. It seemed like they got good value out of that trade. They'd previously traded Jarvis Brownlee. But they never got anything really. It didn't seem like close with Calvin Ridley, who even though he's 31 for a third-round pick where they would have paid down the money, I personally just thought that more might happen there. So like those big trades with like their, you know, the running backs or the receivers, they never had anything.

37:14Tom Pelissero:Trey Hendrickson, you know, with the Bengals, clearly they're in a mode of, hey, our defense is terrible, but also it was even more terrible without Trey Hendrickson the past couple of weeks. We're still scoring 40 points a game. We feel like getting him back and we'll see because he's been hurt, you know, that that's going to allow us to take steps forward. You know, the Saints obviously moved Rashid Shahid to the Seahawks. They kind of came off their price a little bit. It ended up being a fourth and fifth round pick. I think that that, for what Seattle needs, and the fact that he has experience in Clint Kubiak's offense, it's a great move.

37:44Tom Pelissero:But the Saints, with one of the older, more expensive rosters in the league, with one win to not trade more guys, that definitely jumped out at some people. And then the Raiders are in another tough spot here because this was not supposed to be a terrible season in Las Vegas. They traded Jacoby Myers because the Jaguars ultimately stepped up with fourth and sixth round picks. but this was not slash and burn. I told you a couple weeks ago they'd come to Max Crosby and said, whatever the rumors are, this is not happening. Nothing ever progressed on that front. There's some of those teams that decided to just kind of stand pat with where they were.

38:19Tom Pelissero:It'll be interesting to see, you know, in hindsight now, how did some of those decisions play out? Are some of those core players that they didn't move on from still a member of those teams as we get to 2026? In the case of Trey Hendrickson, he's, you know, in the last year of his deal, They could tag him, but it would be close to$40 million in order to do that. Will they look back and regret not taking, let's say, a third-round pick for Trey Hendrickson? Time will tell, but the Bengals, as they often do, are still very much playing for 2025.

38:46Rich Eisen:But in the 90 seconds I have left, what about the other side of it? People calling you up saying, I can't believe these teams that are in contention did not make a move. There's a bunch of other teams at the top that the Eagles typically, as we saw, went ahead and made the moves. and other teams did not. Anybody stand out there, Tom?

39:06Tom Pelissero:I'd go back to, again, what Brandon Bean talked about yesterday with the Bills. I can tell you that they were very active. They were making a lot of calls, whether it was to fortify the defense, whether it was to find another wide receiver. It's just sometimes you get outbid on guys, and sometimes the prices are just too high out there in the marketplace. But certainly that was not for a lack of trying on their part. The Packers had already shot their bullet with Micah Parsons in that trade. I didn't anticipate that they were going to go out and make big swing moves. Even the Steelers, they were one of the most rumored teams.

39:41Tom Pelissero:They had multiple deals that I thought had a possibility of getting done on wide receivers. It just didn't work out whether teams decided to keep those players or traded them to somebody else. In a lot of cases, it was not so much team standing pat as much as it was the prices were too high or they got outbid. That happens a lot, Rich, even when some of these deals, even on Quinn and Williams, I can tell you there were multiple other contenders that were involved in the Quinn and Williams trade. The Cowboys were the one that stepped up with a first and a second-round pick, as well as a player in Mozzie Smith who could help them, potentially another flyer, get them through this season and maybe develops as a former first-round pick into a good player.

40:20Tom Pelissero:The Cowboys had the high offer. There's a deadline on this thing, and sometimes it's all a matter of who's got that high offer when it comes down to decision time.

40:26Rich Eisen:Tom, thanks for the time. We'll see you on NFL Network, on the Insiders, NFL Network, and NFL Plus, and obviously NFL Game Day in advance of the Berlin game, four glorious windows of football starting on NFL Network on Sunday morning. Good to see you, Tom. Thanks for the time, buddy. Good to see you, Rich. That's Tom Pellicero, everybody. Let's take a quick break. We're back to unpack a little bit of what Tom just said before Jeff Passan joins us to talk a little baseball.

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42:13Rich Eisen:The Rich Eisen Show, the podcast. ESPN Radio is presented by Progressive Insurance, everybody. Progressive Insurance offers 24-7 protection when you bundle home, auto, and motorcycle. Learn more at Progressive.com. Listen, I have some generalities around here, certainly when it comes to the National Football League. They're not cookie cutter, but if I'm hiring a head coach in the NFL, I'm hiring an offensive mind. Yep. Because I want to find the quarterback, connect him to the head coach, and just go to work. That's it. And I understand that sounds ridiculous. Bill Belichick is going to go into the Hall of Fame this year as a clear first ballot guy, right?

43:02Rich Eisen:He was defense and special teams to start out. Obviously, he knows every aspect of the game. But I don't want to hire somebody on the defensive side of the football find the offensive coordinator hand that relationship with the quarterback off to that coach only to lose that coach because they're going to be hired as a head coach somewhere else I just don't want it but I understand it it it is a generality and and it's not always the way to go and that's the way I always feel about going and getting aggressive and making smart choices with a high reward when you've got the high risk of trading away draft choices.

43:50Rich Eisen:I just heard Tom Pelissero say, you know, this team like the Bills or this team like the Steelers or this team, the Niners, right? So on and so forth. I don't know their cap situations. I don't know off the top of my head what their draft choices are for 2026 and 2027. I just don't know it off the top of my head. All I know is if there was a receiver on the table or running back on the table for, say, Kansas City even, why wouldn't they cough up a three for Brees Hall? You know, if that is the truth, why would—and I understand I'm questioning general managers who are championship quality. But, you know, it's like if you got outbid, don't get outbid.

44:39deal with the fact that you're you're you're this close now deal with the now you got the now the

44:45Rich Eisen:now is now the later is eventually later and you'll deal with the later then and trust your staff to find somebody in the third round when you don't have a second round pick fourth round you don't have a third uh you know and again it's it's a risky move for the Colts to flip two ones when their first round draft choice as quarterback a couple years ago in Anthony Richardson is coming back from an orbital injury, some freak injury prior to a game that he's warming up. And if Daniel Jones doesn't work out, you're going to have to go back to him. And clearly you brought in Daniel Jones because you had questions about this guy's ability to play football for you long term.

45:29Rich Eisen:and now you don't have two ones to go get another quarterback and that's a big risk certainly if daniel jones does turn back into a pumpkin and

45:42Rich Eisen:or we're seven and two with daniel jones and you're carly ursay gordon and you're like yeah you know what we should do why would we get a band-aid when we can take care of it long term with the best possible player and win with Daniel Jones now by getting him back on the field because let's just say this weekend when we're in Germany and Drake London coming off of his three touchdown game in New England we just stick sauce on him and hope to erase him and do the same thing with Nico Collins when we see him twice and do the same thing with Calvin Ridley who's still on the Titans and we'll do the same thing with brian thomas jr if he is in fact the number one guy and we'll do the same thing on rashi rice if we play him and we'll do the same thing on dk metcalf i mean just go down the line and it's not perfect ask a jet fan sauce went from all pro to sort of all what's going on but kudos to them damn the first round pick torpedoes go ahead and win with the now you know and try and take a seven and two record and be the one seed and win the super bowl and have somebody for the future at that position jeff passing coming up hour two the rich eisen This episode is brought to you by Google Chrome.

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