Hour 1: Guest Host Suzy Shuster, plus ESPN’s Vincent Goodwill Talks NBA Playoffs

0:00We are live from Fetty's house. Guests are gathering around the TV, even with a big storm outside. Are we worried about the feet? Nope, they have Xfinity Wi-Fi. Get reliable fiber-powered gig Wi-Fi with Peacock included to stream the beautiful game this summer. Xfinity, imagine that. Restrictions apply. New gig internet customers only. Actual speeds vary. Offer for Peacock Premium with ads currently at$10.99 a month value and limited to Xfinity internet members with newer upgraded gig speed or faster service. Activation required to access content. Peacock must be activated within first 90 days.

0:24Management of existing subscriptions may be required to avoid multiple subscriptions and duplicate charges. Third-party built subscriptions continue until canceled. so good so good so good everything you want for summer is at nordstrom rack stores now and up to 60 off stock up and save on the brands you love like vince sam edelman frame and free people join the nordic club to unlock exclusive discounts shop new arrivals first and more plus buy online and pick up at your favorite rack store for free great brands great prices that's why you Wreck. This is the Rich Eisen Show. Hey, everybody. Can't get enough of the Rich Eisen Show?

1:03You're in luck. You can find us everywhere. Watch us weekdays on Disney Plus from noon to 3 Eastern. Miss the show? We've got a podcast so you can listen anytime. But here's the best part. Our YouTube channel. Subscribe at youtube.com slash Rich Eisen Show and you'll never miss a moment. Now, on with the show. Ladies and gentlemen, this is the Rich Eisen Show. With guest host, Suzy Schuster. Suzy, you're ten times better than your husband. From the Rich Eisen Show studio in Los Angeles. Today's guests, ESPN senior NBA writer, Vincent Goodwill. WWE superstar, Cody Rhodes. World Cup analyst, Maurice Adu.

1:50Basketball Hall of Famer, Chris Webber. And now, sitting in for Rich, it's Suzy Schuster. Well, hello, everybody. Suzy Schuster back from my Vegas residency as Rich Eisen makes his way back across the country. Great to be with you. Happy to be with you, T.J. Jefferson. We're going to do the same thing as yesterday. I'm going to go the opposite way to keep you on your feet. How are you, T.J.? I'm great. Your Vegas residency? Were you at the spear and I didn't know this? Yeah, two days here. Okay. It's kind of like Shea Gilgissel Alexander at the line with his line residency. So I thought maybe I would take up a Vegas one while he makes himself at home at the free throw line.

2:27Well, how'd it go, more importantly? I mean, he was 16 or 17 from the line. I don't care about him. I'm talking about your residency. Yeah, I'm doing great. I'm doing great. Thanks so much. Spirit was all cracked up. Champagne is flowing. Which it's not because you didn't bring it. I know. I know. Busy. I got a life. I got a life, TJ. TJ, you're so busy. I got a life. You just couldn't get champagne. Yeah. Well, I never bring champagne, Chris. She brings the champagne. I bring the orange juice. That's how this works. Chris Brockman, how are you, sir? I usually bring the champagne. No champagne, no candle.

2:55Because I'm bougie like that. I know. Yeah, I'm hanging in there. I feel like, you know, Ron Harper Jr., Dylan Harper with the elbow to the neck that I. . . Do you mean the one that he didn't get the call for in the first half? And then Jared McCain got the call second later, that one? You know, I'm just trying to enjoy the games. Right. I'm just feeling like. . . I'm just feeling a little bitter after Rich didn't win last night. We love Ernie Johnson. He's just the greatest and what a wonderful man. But, you know, I'm kind of carrying that resentment as the wife of the next day. Let some other people win.

3:25You know what I mean? No. Nope. Nope. Nope. Although I do get to have the mantle of the Emmy winner for another year or so. But let's face it, Rich does deserve that. Hi, Feli. How are you? Good morning. Good to see you. Del Tufo won. No one cares about Del Tufo. If he was here, he'd be saying it. He would be. He's part of like an 80-person team. Yeah. That doesn't count. Congrats on the group. You know what it is? You know what? Del Tufo winning an Emmy is like a combined no-hitter. Also doesn't count, and no one cares. So when are we drinking? Oh, we can start any moment. I poured a double tequila last night after that.

4:02You can clip this off and send it to Mike. Guys, so. Sorry I said anything. I'm on no sleep. I'm fired up. You're really a little pissy today. You know, I got up at 3 o 'clock. Why? You know, just some stuff going on. What do you mean? What do you mean by that? Just, you know, internally. Yeah, Lamar Jackson, DK Metcalf situation. Right, right, right, right. And couldn't get back to sleep, so I'm like, I'm hot today. Great. All right, we'll leave that stuff. Can't wait to do a show with you. Really looking forward to it. That'd be great. Do you mind if we talk about sports now? Sure. I'm just curious.

4:40I didn't know what you asked. I was just, you know, explaining what happened. I mean, I'm a mom, but do I have to take care of him too? All right, so guys, on Women's Sports Now, we talk a lot about freedom of movement, which is this new rule that came into the WNBA this year because the physicality was so great in the W that we felt that the refs felt that they wanted to give room for the women to do as Cheryl Reeve called it, the beautiful game of basketball, and to explore the studio space, if you will, to make the game of basketball free from injuries. injuries and you know the women's game is very physical that said games are taking 15 000 hours because there's so many whistles and i was saying on women's sports now which you can see on the espn app on disney plus hulu espn news espn 2 wherever you want to find women's sports now i was saying god you know you can't let refs get in the way of a good game because it started to take forever, right?

5:38I hate to see an NBA playoff game in which the next day everyone's talking about the refs. Are we really doing this again? And it just felt like another game with egregious calls. We were just talking about this a second ago, Chris, before the show started about, and I'm going to call him Ron Harper because I can't help him. Dylan Harper. who, by the way, when he looked angry last night, looked just like his dad. And he, Jared McCain's taking the ball up the court. He gives Dylan Harper a nice elbow right in the neck. It wasn't a flop. This was not an acting job. No, it was a straight up elbow to the neck.

6:19Like the kid basically almost went to the hospital on it. And then a second later, did push in the back. There goes the call. And then like, you know, does the whole dribble stop and then backs into him and then gets the call. and Harper's just like, what do I got to do? What do I have to do? Mitch Johnson, what does he have to do to call for a little reason here? Well, that is one of the most bogus things I've ever heard. Clear goaltending, TJ, and then he's trying to challenge and the referee straight up says, no. Tries to call a challenge, but so egregious that if you're watching the game at home, you see the ref go right in front as he's signaling and then also NBC had a great cutaway the whole team is calling for a challenge nope and and they don't get it so you know again and I make the equivalence because you want to have a physical game let the guys play ball just play on I think Reggie Miller said last night that should have been a play on call play on play the game and stop letting refs get too ticky tack yeah is that asking too much not at all we're in the playoffs Can the men play the game?

7:30It bothers me that day after day, we're talking about Shea Gildas-Alexander and flopping. We saw in this game him get a call when he went to the ground and then a minute later not get a call when he stayed on his feet. Why would he possibly stay on his feet? He's not stupid. He is a very, very smart MVP. And oh, by the way, congratulations. The Oscar's coming to you soon. why wouldn't he continue to do as he does? That's been my point. He gets the calls. I saw the numbers. I was looking at. Thank you, TJ, for bringing over the numbers because God knows I wouldn't know how to print it out. If Jared McCain and he both shoot 719 from the field, one ends up with 20, one ends up with 32.

8:16You do the math. He's taking up a Vegas residency at the line, and why shouldn't he? Champagne for free on the house afterwards. Yeah, it's part and parcel with another Oklahoma City win. The conversation of the next day is how they play and how they get to 120. Now, look, did San Antonio play great defense last night? No. Was Wemby pretty bad? Yeah. It seems like, you know, he's kind of exhausted. The game's playing every other day. Seemingly has cost Wemby his legs. And, you know, it's funny. The best game of this series, we thought we were going to get an epic seven-game series where every game is like game one.

8:57While the best game and seemingly probably will be the best game of this series was game one, every other game has kind of been a blowout and kind of been a ho-hum where there's other storylines that come with it, whether it's officiating rather than the result. And I think it's kind of too bad. We thought we were going to get an epic series, and we're just not. And with Mad Dog yesterday being like, I don't want to rain on the Knicks parade, I don't know if the Knicks can beat that Oklahoma City team that was playing last night, especially if Shea's getting 17 free throws. Well, 17 free throws, but also three-pointers.

9:33So OKC shot 44%. San Antonio shot 29%. You're not going to win that way. Yeah, only made two more. It was 14-12 and three-pointers made, but San Antonio 12-41. I mean, a lot of those misses were probably, I've got to imagine, down the stretch where they're trying to shoot themselves back in the game when they're already down double digits. But it felt like— 29 % obviously isn't going to get it done. But correct me if I'm wrong. It felt like miss, miss, miss, miss. I mean, it really felt like they were trying to get—again, the game was within two after one, and then it was done. And it just—it always felt like, oh, are they going to make a run?

10:11No, they're not going to because OKC kept hitting threes. It really felt like, look, if De 'Aaron Fox is going to shoot 4 of 15 from the field. Yeah, so Wemby also. They were combined 8 for 30, 0 of 9 from 3. You know, Wemby did make all 12 of his free throws. But look, man, like, you can't get the ball and set up and start the offense 25 feet from the basket when you're 7 1⁄2 feet tall, TJ. I mean, he's getting pushed around, but you've got to try to establish something, you know, down low and work inside out with this guy. You've got to get him some easy buckets. 4 of 15, not going to get it done.

10:42Well, they played right, TJ. They played exactly the way we thought they would. They kept him out of the paint. It's the only thing you can do to stop him. But let's be honest, Chris. This is going seven. I don't know about that. Spurs are going to come back. They're going to win game six. And then we're going to have this game seven. Yeah, I don't know. I don't know about that. I was thinking about this. You know, everyone likes to say things are rigged or not on the up and up. So, Bronwyn, do you believe that if those people who say things like that about sports, right, and we always hear the chatter like this is a setup or this isn't on the up and up.

11:19Do you think that if a New York team, which we have, makes it to the finals? Oh, come on. This is going to be the true test of what everyone says. Do you think Shea's going to get those calls against the Knicks? Because if you are someone who believes in that type of talk, then you would assume that the league would really want the Knicks to win, right? uh no he's gonna be the best player on the floor he's the two-time reigning mvp and the champ yeah he's gonna get the calls he's gonna get the call it's just the way he plays it's just the way he plays it's not i don't enjoy watching it i don't enjoy watching oklahoma city play but they have gamed the system uh to their advantage the last couple of seasons and they they've kind of you know broke the matrix a little bit here and you know kudos to them i guess i don't have to i don't have to sit here and say i like watching it i i think it kind of takes away from their greatness because they really do have a they have a great run team top to bottom you know you see all the all the conversations about all the draft capital and all the assets that they have they could trade for yannis if they wanted to and add him to this team they did everything right i I saw something today.

12:30They could possibly trade up and get either Cameron Boozer or Caleb. Could you imagine Caleb Wilson or Cam Boozer on this squad now? They do everything the right way, and then they go out and play basketball in a certain way that's almost disrespectful to the game and the greats that have come before them. And it's just why? Why do you need to or feel the need to play like this? I got some thoughts on Wemby. Before we do that, let's listen to Shea Gilgis-Alexander after the game, who, by the way, never looks happy, never looks satisfied with the way he plays ever. But let's take a listen to what he had to say.

13:04I think we just learned from our mistakes. We learned from what we talked about as a group. And we just applied it tonight. I think that is the most important thing. Like a series, especially against a good team, is like a chess match. Like you go back and forth with adjustments and game plans and switching to things and trying new things. and I think they obviously punched us really good in Game 4. We got better than the team that played Game 4 for Game 5. Somewhat ironic he calls it a chess match because we all know that Wemby is an avid chess player, right? Yeah, right. I thought that was kind of funny.

13:43And I went back and I reread Ramona Shelburne's really great article on Wemby going to Shaolin. And if you haven't read it, you should take a read. It's a very extensive deep dive into the time that he spent with the Chinese monks. And, you know, you see when you read that article and then you watch him play, you really see him breathing his way through free throws. It talks – Ramona did a great job reporting on the time he spent. it's almost like the karate kid meets the NBA about his dribbling through fields and dribbling through forests and what have you and going up heavily laden stone paths and what have you.

14:23He has to take himself back and figure out who that man is in that quiet, in that moment, because he wasn't there last night. And is it because he's tired? Is it because it was too much? Is it because he had an off night? Because everyone has an off night, but to have such a great night and then to have such an off night, this chess match that Shea referred to, sure, that's part of playing professional sports, but how will Wemby respond? What will we see from him? What will be the next parts of that chess match? And that's what's so fascinating to me. Yeah. I mean, he didn't take a lot of shots that he snuck out the back door and didn't speak to the media is very unusual for him.

15:09He's French. He's incredibly polite. I found it kind of telling, though, when he comes out the game, Brockman, when he kind of whispers to be on both. Well, that's the hot conspiracy this morning. And then what happens? You get kind of some hard fouls. So you're saying Wemby ordered the code red? It's kind of obvious, right? I don't know. I don't know what he said to him. Maybe he was recommending where they were going to eat postgame. I don't want to say that Wemby, hey, take this guy out. You know what I mean? I don't know. It kind of looks like it, though. Sometimes you need a little something to get a rally going.

15:41I mean, I'm just saying. Yeah, game is over at that point. Look, I think the Spurs would have to be mad, though, right? Like, you see these guys constantly flopping, as everyone says. So, yeah, let's really put someone on the butt and let them, you know, if we're going to get the foul anyway, let's make sure it's a foul. You know, I think the series is over. I think OKC is going to win game six in San Antonio. I think there's just something about young teams have to go through the gauntlet. We've seen it throughout the history of the NBA, and this is a really young team. Their three best players are all 22 and under, and they've got to build up some battle scars in the NBA playoffs, and this is just probably one of the chapters that will be written in the book.

16:25This team will be great if they stay together. They're winning titles. I fully expect them to win MVPs and titles, and that'll come. But for now, it's OKC's league, and they're the big bad bully on the block. And they've put it to them the last couple of games. And I expect to see OKC and New York in the finals in a week. Let's listen to Mitch Johnson. Because, by the way, if you're going to come back for a game six the way they need to, you've got to have a fired up head coach. and he was that after the game. He's got to take more than 15 shots, even with the free throws. Yeah, he's going to have to score more than 20 points for sure.

17:12So is that his aggression or game plan or a combination of both? Yeah, a combination of both for sure. Okay, so he did a good job. We've got to do a better job. And that's, yeah, probably the easiest in terms of when you just surface level stuff that he'll definitely need to take more shots. But there's a lot of things all over the place where even when we had advantages and we just didn't make simple plays to take advantage of the opportunity in that possession. And in this type of game, you got to be sure of everything you're doing in a very secure, mature way. Okay, he didn't seem that fired up in that one.

17:54He sounded like Doc Rivers, didn't he? He sounded like he'd been screaming the entire time. Get that man a lozenge. Didn't he sound like Doc? When he opened his mouth, I was like, Doc? Yeah, what's he going to do now is the question. How is he going to get Wemby to go back to being Wemby? Because without Wemby being Wemby, there's no Wemby. That's what I learned from the show. If anyone can get him more shots, it would be the coach. So we'll see. He's got to, you know, I remember Kobe, and you would know this better than me, because, you know, you cover Kobe. Didn't he have a quote one day that, like, I would rather go, you know, 0 for 20 than 1, like 0 for 8 or something to that effect?

18:37Like, he's not just going to, like, take 8 shots. He's going to go out blazing. And I think that's what they got to do. They just got to keep feeding this kid and let him decide the game. He's the captain of the ship. So he's... Kobe wanted the rock in his hands every single game for the whole game. always people would say he's too selfish. It wasn't that he was too selfish. He believed in himself and he wanted to take those shots, but he also there. I've never seen a player in my life. And again, I don't pretend to be the expert of all experts in any way, shape or form. I just know what I saw.

19:13You did see that team. You did see every single day, every single day. You have to want the ball in your hands at the end of a game. You have to want the ball in your hands all the time. Yes, we need assists, players. We need some of the greatest. I talk to Taylor about this all the time of how important an assist is. But you know what you really want? A player who believes in shooting. And that's what Shea Gilgis-Alexander is. And Wemby has to be that player. Kobe was so crazy. He would study great white shark hunting in order to learn how to stalk prey on the court. Like, he couldn't wake up until he had his kids.

19:54He couldn't breathe until he thought about how can I be better on the court. Is that who Embiid is going to be? We don't know yet. Listen, we're just getting to know him, right? It's not like he's a known entity, and so is Mitch Johnson. So it's going to be up to him to decide how to play him. What's his chess match? What's his next move? Good thing we have another game tomorrow. Let's take a break. When we come back, Vincent Goodwill joins us from ESPN. We will ask him his thoughts on the chess match that is ahead. That is Game 6.

20:35The Rich Isis Show Podcast.

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22:54Back here on the Rich Eisen Show. Back here on the Rich Eisen Show with Vincent Goodwill, Susie Schuster in for Rich Eisen. We were talking in the first segment about this chess match that has to go down. We were saying ironically that Shea used chess match, but But what is the chess match? What's the next play for Mitch Johnson regarding Wemby for Game 6? That's a great question. And Mitch Johnson last night, he said we need more from him. Normally, when you see that your best player is a little fatigued, a little tired, a little lethargic, you don't necessarily call him out. You will give him a little bit of grace, especially if it's his first time out.

23:33Victor is 22 years old going through his first playoff experience. and Mitch Johnson, he didn't call him out, but he said, we need more from him. He can't just take 15 shots. To me, that says we need more energy from you. It's not just the type of shots, the number of shots. It is, hey, we need your energy to be better. We need you to have the desire. We need you to hunt shots and not just hunt three-pointers because he can get those because he has the height. He can stand outside from 30 feet, but it's the effect. It's planning himself down there. At this point of a playoff series, No matter if you're old or young, you get to the conference finals in this game six, everybody's tired.

24:10It becomes a battle of wills. You're playing every other day. You've been playing every other day for the past month or month and a half, no matter how much time you've gotten off. And Victor Wiminiama has never played this much basketball in consecutive days in his entire life, I'm willing to bet. He only averaged 29 minutes a game during the regular season. In this series, Susie, he's averaging 38 minutes a game. And that just shows you the taxing demands that are going to be on him. So when you get to a close-up game and you're at home, yeah, you're going to have a lot more energy. Some of your role players are going to play better.

24:43But Victor Wimbidiyama has to set the tone. And I believe he has to set the tone on defense more than offense. The offense will come. You plant himself at the rim. You throw it up high. Only the person that can touch it is God. It's just going to be him and God up there. But if you talk about defense and being able to prevent what Oklahoma City is doing, I think that's where Mitch Johnson is going to get his greatest effect from Victor Wembe Diame tomorrow night. And I think you made a really interesting point. Phil Jackson was the king of using the media to get his messages across to Shaq and Kobe.

25:14And clearly watching Mitch do that last night, I was surprised and wondering why. And obviously we read about I wasn't there. We read about Wembe going out the back door and not talking to the media. But what was your reaction to using that, using that microphone to get to his player? And have we seen him do very much of that with Wemby? We haven't. And that's why I'm fascinated to see what happens tomorrow. Like when you get down to this point, all these little micro small things can have big time effects. And also Mitch Johnson is a young coach himself. Like he's just a year or two into this position.