Hour 2: Bills-Broncos Catch/INT Controversy, plus NFL Insider Tom Pelissero

23:34Tom Pelissero:Sean won 106 games over nine seasons, if you include playoffs. He won at least one playoff game in like six consecutive years. So this was a team that was always competing to be there at the end. But again, much like John Harbaugh, much like Mike Tomlin, who, of course, stepped down in Pittsburgh six days ago, which feels like an eternity because of all the wheels and things that keep turning on a daily basis. Right now, there's times where owners simply feel like it's time. And I know that I said this on the show a couple of weeks ago, when one owner makes a move and then a second owner makes the move, there are other owners that are looking at this and going, well, hold on.

24:11Tom Pelissero:If they're saying that's not good enough, why are we going to stand pat? Certainly with Sean McDermott, There were some frustrations that he had, and you saw it in terms of certain players who were inactive on game days, kind of a revolving door wide receiver and whatnot. But ultimately, Terry Pagula not only decided to pick essentially Brandon Bean over Sean McDermott, he promoted Brandon Bean. He gave him a larger title. Brandon Bean is now going to lead the search for a new head coach. And also the coaching staff is now going to report to Bean. Every team's reporting structure is different.

24:46Tom Pelissero:There are some that have the sort of two-pronged horizontal structure, in some cases three-pronged. Everyone talks to the owner. That's what the Bills have had in recent years. Now they have the classic vertical structure where it's coaching reports to the GM who reports to the owner. They are doing some things differently here. They want to be unified as an organization. Obviously, Terry Pagula didn't feel like that was the case down the stretch of the season. You know, if they don't turn the football over five times, if they don't have several borderline calls that people are still talking about go against them, do they go into the AFC Championship game?

25:22Tom Pelissero:Does that save Sean McDermott? Is this what Steve Bishotti said and that just would have saved him for one more week? I don't know. I don't have those answers at this time right now. What we do know is the Bills, now one of 10 teams making a head coaching change in this cycle. There are eight jobs currently available. This is a cycle that we went into knowing there weren't necessarily the Ben Johnson, Mike Vrabel, the shoe-in types of candidates. The ones who are getting jobs are the ones who just got fired. It's John Harbaugh going to the Giants. It's Stefanski going to the Falcons. And now McDermott coming out there, he's not going to be the top candidate for every job.

25:59Tom Pelissero:But certainly there are teams this morning, many of them in in-person interviews who are monitoring this and having to recalibrate again as a highly accomplished NFL coach, at least in terms of his winning percentage and consistency, suddenly becomes available.

26:13Rich Eisen:So is there any sort of inner workings underneath the the ocean iceberg pieces about the Bean McDermott relationship that you can lend potentially to answer? There are no doubt some Bills fans questions as to why, if we're constantly talking about the weaponry around Josh Allen, that it's the coach that is departing and it is the man who's in charge of the roster getting promoted.

26:45Tom Pelissero:Well, here's what I'd say. Based upon their prior reporting structure, Sean McDermott also had significant say in terms of personnel. They were on a vertical or a horizontal plane in terms of both reporting directly to Terry Pagula. But, you know, Sean McDermott knew Brandon from Carolina. That was a part of the driving force was the alignment that they had. But again, in recent weeks, it became apparent, even just by Sean McDermott's own words publicly, that he had certain levels of frustration, you know, whether it's a Keon Coleman who just wasn't able to be active on game day, whether it was, you know, defensively and some back and forth in terms of who's calling the plays and, you know, whether or not they had the weaponry on that side.

27:26Tom Pelissero:What we do know is this was a team that was good enough to be there at the end every single year. I have a hard time putting that loss to Denver on Sean McDermott because he didn't give the ball away five times. He didn't make those calls that he then vigorously defended at his post-game press conference. But at the same time, there have been other examples in recent years in terms of whether there were game management issues, whether there were other things that would fall in the bucket of coaching. Listen, he's made a lot of coordinator changes over the years. He's moved on from his defensive coordinator, his offensive coordinator.

27:59Tom Pelissero:They've not yet been able to get over the hump into the Super Bowl. And when you've got, as one coaching candidate put it to me this morning, the best player on the planet, not only does that make now this vacancy really attractive, but it also speaks to, as you're beginning to see, how quickly windows can close in the NFL. Nine years was apparently long enough that Terry Pagula felt like he needed to leave that window open.

28:21Rich Eisen:Tom Pelissero here on the Rich Eisen Show. What's the first blush list of candidates? I mean, we already know who's already out there interviewing for jobs, Tom. But what about this one?

28:33Tom Pelissero:Well, what I would tell you, Rich, is the people involved in making those decisions have been in closed door meetings all morning. Every GM in the league has a list that they keep just in the event that something ends up changing here. I would say in talking to people this morning around the NFL, other coaches and front office people and coaching agents who are watching the situation, there is a sense that the Bills may go on the offensive side of the ball with this hire, even though that offense has been really good, whether it was under Brian Dable or it was under Ken Dorsey or Joe Brady at various points.

29:06Tom Pelissero:But having somebody who's kind of on the same page with Josh Allen and can grow that side together, that may be something alluring because he's never truly had that. I think that Joe Brady is a candidate. I don't know that he is the candidate for the job, though he certainly has a close relationship with Josh. I would watch Davis Webb as a potential candidate for that position, a backup quarterback for several seasons in Buffalo who is really close with Josh Allen. There's multiple teams that are waiting for Davis Webb to be available to interview again in a week. That's how close he is, even though he's not even the offensive coordinator in Denver.

29:42Tom Pelissero:He's a quarterback's coach. He's going to have multiple opportunities for second interviews, depending if those jobs get filled before he's eligible to continue the interview process. So I think that that name potentially could come up. If you're looking at some of the other popular names that are out on the circuit right now, I think Mike McDaniel is interviewed for practically every head coaching job and offensive coordinator job in the league. But given he was in Miami, they struggled to get past Buffalo. That one's probably a pretty hard sell. I do know this, Rich. Everybody is going to be lining up for this job.

30:14Tom Pelissero:Anyone who is a coaching candidate who has an opportunity to go and interview in Buffalo is going to race. They will fly themselves in. They will pay for their own per diem. There's no question whatsoever. This is now the job. And the fact that several times we've had to redo that, you know because Pittsburgh is also a great job Baltimore is potentially if you believe in Lamar Jackson that you can get him healthy and get him playing like Lamar again those are three rare rare jobs two places with former MVPs plus a place in Pittsburgh that has so much consistency that also speaks Rich I think to you know if we talk about where could Sean McDermott potentially land next it doesn't make a ton of sense for him to go into a total rebuild He's 51 years old.

30:57Tom Pelissero:He's been there every year, been in the playoffs every season here in recent years. I don't really see him going to, I'm going to go to Arizona or I'm going to go to Las Vegas. I think the teams to watch for Sean McDermott, potentially the Steelers, though that would be outside of their normal bucket in terms of who they look to hire. Baltimore is certainly one that I could see making a lot of sense for Sean McDermott. And the other one would be Tennessee. We know the Titans have pursued John Harbaugh. They wanted to speak to Kevin Stefanski again before he took Atlanta. They want to speak to Jeff Halfley again, although I believe Halfley's in the building with Miami right now, and I'm not sure he leaves without getting that job.

31:37Tom Pelissero:Matt Nagy and Robert Suller are in Tennessee today, but given the aggressiveness of Tennessee, they've got a quarterback, great place to live, new stadium opening. There are aspects of that job, Rich, that I would just say, don't count them out as a potential option for Sean McDermott.

31:54Rich Eisen:There's one more, Tom. Let me hit this with you. Because, again, the Ravens, he was not going to go there. Ravens weren't going to hire him either, even though they have an MVP quarterback and everyone would want to coach an MVP quarterback. But now there's another MVP quarterback that's open. Is there any shot, Mike Tomlin? It's just like, okay, hey, Mike, listen. let's kick a tire here and see what's up. You want to coach Josh Allen? And again, I understand the idea would be to potentially not go another CEO head coach, but it would be let's get a play caller. The next voice to be heard in Josh Allen's ear is going to be potentially your head coach and a familiar voice at that in your ear.

32:37Rich Eisen:What about kicking a tire on Mike Tomlin saying this is the one shot maybe we have to see if you're interested, and then we'll trade and we'll talk turkey with the Roonies? What do you think, Tom?

32:48Tom Pelissero:Well, there's several things. You mentioned some of them there. Question one is, would the Roonies even trade Mike Tomlin to Buffalo? You'd have to start there. If they are unwilling, that's exactly, that is a drivable. I've done that drive during training camp. That is very close geographically, and it's one of your AFC rivals. They'd have to be willing to do it. Even if they were, do the Bills want to go into the defensive-minded 50-something-year-old coach bucket for a guy who, quite frankly, he hasn't had Josh Allen, but he has not had as much success over the last nine years as Sean McDermott has.

33:26Tom Pelissero:Obviously, Mike won a Super Bowl. That was in his second season. He's been to another Super Bowl, but in recent years, he hasn't won a playoff game in nine years. The nine years that Sean McDermott won eight playoff games and got fired for it is a nine-year stretch in which Mike Tomlin has not won a single playoff game. The third part of it is whether Tomlin is willing to listen. Yes, you would think if there were a place that can contend right away that has the quarterback, that's the type of job that would be interesting to Mike Tomlin. But I mentioned this on game day morning, I think yesterday, Rich, with you, a member of Giants ownership shortly after Mike Tomlin stepped down as the head coach of the Steelers, reached out to Tomlin.

34:04Tom Pelissero:And that person was not alone but Giants ownership reached out to Mike Tomlin said hey would you have any interest in doing this the answer was I do not plan to coach in 2026 at this point I don't believe that Mike Tomlin is in a mental space where he wants to coach in 2026 if that changes this week next week a month from now there's all kinds of different things that could happen but right now albeit with a little bit of a pumping of the brakes in certain places to evaluate the Sean McDermott aspect of this. A lot of these coaching searches right now are full steam ahead. They're going to be moving relatively rapidly here over the next week or two.

34:40Rich Eisen:All right. In the next couple minutes, just to wrap things up, Tom, how did Stefanski land in Atlanta? And walk me through, best you can, the Packers mindset in keeping LeFleur.

34:51Tom Pelissero:I would say with Atlanta, Kevin Stefanski did an initial virtual interview there. Him and Matt Ryan are both from Philadelphia. I was told basically the conversation never stopped. The interview never stopped. The two of them were talking a ton. Stefanski at one point FaceTimed Matt Ryan and Ryan is sitting there watching tape. He's been on the job for a couple of days and he's in there. This is much closer to John Elway than it is to Tom Brady. Matt Ryan is very invested. So you've got that kind of kindred football spirit that Kevin Stefanski was looking for. Tennessee wanted to bring him in on Sunday.

35:24Tom Pelissero:The Falcons got the interview set up on Saturday. It was more of a coronation than an actual interview. Not a surprise that Stefanski lives in Atlanta where you can argue, well, his issue in Cleveland was he didn't have the quarterback. You don't have the quarterback in Atlanta. No, but you got B. John Robinson and Drake London and maybe Kyle Pitts if you tag him or re-sign him. You got a ton of weapons and oh yeah, a quarterback that you could choose to potentially work out a new deal with in Kirk Cousins, who had Kevin Stefanski as his OC the year that Stefanski ended up getting the job. In terms of the Packers and Matt LaFleur, that never really changed.

35:59Tom Pelissero:The mentality was always there they wanted to see how the season played out you know there were there was a comment that ed policy the new president ceo made last offseason about hey i want to see the season that set off bells and whistles with a lot of people of you know is this guy in trouble is matt lafleur is he coaching for his job i never got the sense that any of that was real they never called john harbaugh they weren't considering replacing a 46 year old head coach who also is a top play caller with a 63 year old it just didn't make sense and that's nothing against john harbaugh they just They weren't going to go down that road.

36:31Tom Pelissero:This was a negotiation on the financials. They were able over several days to figure that out. There were conversations about how does everybody be the best that they can be between Matt LaFleur and Brian Goodekunst, as well as Russ Ball, who is there as the executive vice president. Once they felt like they were in a good place, the market was pretty well established for what Matt LaFleur is. He ends up staying in Green Bay. And so now with with Sean McDermott out, with Green Bay not making a move, we have eight head coaching vacancies across the NFL. And if I make rich really quick, kind of game this out, I would say the next one to watch is going to be Miami with Jeff Halfley there this afternoon.

37:13Tom Pelissero:He is, as I reported over the weekend, a frontrunner for the position, has a relationship with John Eric Sullivan. I would be surprised if Jeff Halfley is not the coach of the Dolphins, but he does still have teams like the Titans that are tugging at him. The Steelers are interested in Jeff Halfley as well. There are other teams trying to see if they can potentially get him out of there. Tennessee's the other one that could go anytime. Nagy and Sala are there today. Nagy, of course, has the relationship with Mike Borgonzi from their days in Kansas City. the Raiders have seemingly ramped up their process they're actually in Miami to watch Fernando Mendoza play uh in the national championship game tonight well they spent the morning with Mike McDaniel who's a head coaching candidate to potentially work with a Fernando Mendoza they're then they're going to stay down there in Miami Tom Brady lives in the area um and interview a couple more candidates over the next couple of days that one could get moving in terms of the you know the top jobs though Rich the ones that I would say are the ones that everybody is talking about here.

38:10Tom Pelissero:I don't get the sense the Ravens are in a rush. They are setting up second interviews this week. Anthony Weaver, their former player and assistant coach, is one of those who's getting that job. Obviously, Buffalo is just getting off the ground. And then you have Pittsburgh, which is setting up additional interviews this week. They spoke with Adriel Overo, I believe, this morning. They've got Brian Flores coming in tomorrow. And then on Wednesday, what I'm really fascinated in, Mike McCarthy, Pittsburgh native, Super Super Bowl winner, 12 out of 18 seasons. He's gone to the playoffs. He's everything they haven't hired in the past.

38:44Tom Pelissero:Offensive background, been a head coach before, and he's 62 years old. They have very consistently hired 30-something first-time defensive backgrounds. If you're thinking about this from the Steelers' perspective, and there are not a ton of candidates that fall into that bucket right now in terms of what you've always hired, McCarthy has a relationship with the GM, Omar Khan. McCarthy knows how to develop a quarterback, which whether it's Will Howard or somebody they draft, they're going to have to do that eventually. And don't discount that if Aaron Rodgers is ever going to play football again, the one person on the planet besides Mike Tomlin he might consider doing that with is Mike McCarthy.

39:26Rich Eisen:Is that right? Because last we heard in an athletic article a couple of years ago, a Bleach Report article, pardon me, that wasn't the case. but that would be fascinating. You never know, man. Tom, I know you got to go. We appreciate the time. You've got Friday back here on the program. We'll keep unpacking this stuff, and obviously that'll be two days before Jared Siddham gets a start. Thanks for the time, man.

39:51Tom Pelissero:Thank you, Rich. Tom Pellicero, everybody, right here on the Rich Eisen Show. All right, brother.

39:54Rich Eisen:Okay. Wow. I got a few things that he just said I just want to hit on. Let's take a break. We'll come back right here. There's also some injury news outside of, it involves the championship weekend as well. The Seahawks just lost somebody. That's coming up. The Rich Eisen Show. The podcast.

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41:24Rich Eisen:Back here on the Rich Eyes and Chill, one big simulcast. LinkedIn Jobs is stepping things up with their new AI assistant, everybody, so you can feel confident that you're finding top talent and hiring right the first time. Get this. Employees hired through LinkedIn are 30 % more likely to stick around for at least a year compared to those hired through the leading competitor. Get started by posting your job for free at linkedin.com slash eisen. That's linkedin.com slash eisen to post your job for free. Terms and conditions apply. 844-204-RICH. I'll take a phone call in just a split second. Tom Pelissero said a few things that I just want to throw out here.

42:02Rich Eisen:So he said Sean McDermott, he could see him being a candidate for the Ravens job. Age 51, he knows what it takes. He knows how to coach up an MVP quarterback. You get an offensive coordinator that talks to Lamar, off you go. That's it. The guy who, interestingly enough, is let go in part, potentially because the Ravens let go of their guys saying we haven't gone far enough. Let's get the guy who didn't go far enough in Buffalo and put him here in Baltimore saying it's a possible candidate. He also didn't mention one name when he was talking through the possible Buffalo candidates about people who have been in Buffalo and Josh Allen apparently really likes.

42:49Rich Eisen:because if I'm them, I want my next coach to be really liked by Josh Allen. Yeah. That's at the top of the list. Yeah. Who does Josh like? Absolute must. Now, Josh Allen had in his ear, when things were just beginning to ascend, Brian Dable. Now, again, why would you, if you haven't gone far enough, you've hit a ceiling, why do you think the guy that's going to break through that ceiling is the guy who had his ceiling hit in year one in New York where he was coach of the year and everything went south after that. I don't know. Crazier things have happened. If this happens and the Ravens fire John Harbaugh who replaces Brian Dayball, who replaces Sean McDermott, who replaces John Harbaugh, if that happens, then the NFL has reached its latest peak of you can't make this stuff up.

43:50Rich Eisen:If the Ravens and the Giants and the Bills hop on the same coaching carousel and just rotate like it's a volleyball game, that would be insane. Yeah. The Ravens guy goes to the New York metropolitan area. the New York metropolitan area or as I'm sure he would say it's great to be coaching in the one spot that has an NFL team in New York Brian Dayball you know would be throwing out the red meat I'm just a New Jersey guy coming back to New York if he goes up the thruway and hangs a left and then the guy who goes from Buffalo goes down to Baltimore I would say I'm dumb here but I just like being here.

44:42Rich Eisen:We're just getting started. Insane. Let's go to Terzo in Iowa. What's up, Terzo? You hanging in there, buddy?

44:51Tom Pelissero:What's up, guys? You know, I'm just really concerned about the CBA and the WNBA right now. That's your way of saying your football season's done? Is that what you're saying? Yeah. Unfortunately, that was a good ass-whooping right there. I'm not shocked at what Seattle did to us. I'm pretty amazed that we got to this point. They're just so much better than us, and I got to take my hat off to them. Great game by them. Great game plan. It was over once the first kick went off. That's true. Heck of a year. Happy we made it this far. Hopefully we can stay healthy next year.

45:33Rich Eisen:Thanks for the call, Terzo. Hang in there, buddy. Hang in there. The Seahawks, a perfect night, with the exception of Zach Charbonnet getting hurt. And today we found out it's a knee injury that will knock him out for the rest of the playoffs. Another crucial player in the playoffs needing surgery. A significant knee surgery. Yeah, Sheffron followed up. That's an ACL. Oh, no. Yeah, so he's going to maybe miss most of the next season. 12 touchdowns. 12. He was awesome this year. They had such a great one. maybe the best one-two running back in the week. He and Kenneth Walker, the third, right? Yeah.

46:12Rich Eisen:So that's a significant injury. I mean, the run game for the Seattle Seahawks, so crucial. Don't forget, though, the opponent that's coming into the building, it was Sam Darnold and his arm that carried the night against the Rams. Down 30-14, come back, force overtime, win it in overtime, go for two in overtime, end of game. end of the Rams' real best shot at winning the one seed, and that's part and parcel of the reason why this game is in Seattle, folks, is this man's arm right there. But that said, the support of this man's arm, certainly if his oblique isn't all that great, would be a run game that will now be without their leading touchdown maker.

47:00Rich Eisen:So that'll be just another aspect of the championship weekend. The Ridge Eisen Show Podcast.

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