Hour 2: Overreaction Tuesday, ESPN MLB Insider Jeff Passan, plus NBA Tanking

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22:28Rich Eisen:Real-time updates only in iOS mobile app, only available with TurboTax full-service experts. I give you the floor on the story of the day. Jeff, what's going on with that? Tony Clark, the executive director of the MLB Players Association, is resigning today. And this is something, Rich, that I think a lot of people in the game have been expecting for some time after Don Van Out and I broke the story back in May of last year that the federal government and the Eastern District of New York, which has been in the news plenty, whether it's for the NBA gambling or for Emmanuel Classe and Luis Ortiz, they are looking into both financial improprieties that have been alleged, as well as potential obstruction as well.

23:18And I think it just got to the point now that this is a seminal year for Major League Baseball and especially for the players association. You've got owners who want to implement a salary cap and what you need if you are the players and you're opposed to the salary cap is strong leadership. And with this hanging over Tony Clark as long as it has, the feeling was it was just going to be a matter of time until he got forced out or resigned. There is no succession plan. At this point, players are meeting at 4.30 on a Zoom call from the various camps and the player leaders, the 30 for each team, as well as the eight man executive subcommittee are going to talk about what the future looks like.

23:59And they might elect an interim executive director today. They may punt that for a couple of days down the road. But I think what the players realize is that this is a mess. it's a mess that they need to clean up a lot sooner than later because you know the days are ticking down until december 1st and that collective bargaining agreement is going to expire the likelihood is that major league baseball is going to lock out players and once that happens it's going to become a staring contest and the question of who blinks first it might be a question that

24:30Rich Eisen:comes down to who is strongest and most united so your best guess because you know battle stations are, as you just pointed out, around the corner here. Best guess how baseball writ large is hearing this news. Are they quietly fist pumping, fist pounding under their desk? Or they're like, damn it, we need a partner to talk about or talk to here. How do you think it's being received on the other side of the table, Jeff? I think it depends on who ascends into that role. The favorite at this point is Bruce Meyer. He's the deputy executive director. He's the lead negotiator for collective bargaining.

25:10And he's the guy who it would be easiest to just say because of his time at the union, because of his history, because of his knowledge on the subject, let's put him in place. There's potential, though, for players to say that we need to clean house. And the fact that this is happening in February as opposed to June or July or even later on in the calendar gives us the time to go out and do a proper search. I don't believe that's going to be the approach that they have. Brent Suter, who's one of the members of the executive subcommittee, said to reporters earlier today that we are going to name an interim executive director.

25:45And everyone presumes that that's going to come from the ranks of those at the Players Association right now. But there's been a number of things over the past year that Don and I have reported on, whether it's one team partners, the group licensing firm that the MLBPA started back in 2019 with the NFLPA and which grew to like a two billion dollar business. That's part of the investigation. They're looking into Players' Way, which was a youth baseball initiative that the MLBPA started that they spent at least$4 million on and really didn't hold all that many events. All of this goes back, Rich, to a whistleblower complaint that was filed in November of 2024 with the Department of Labor that alleged all sorts of improprieties by Tony Clark.

26:32And the investigation stemmed out of that. And now it ends in his resignation. All right.

26:37Rich Eisen:since labor talk usually glazes the fans eyes over, let's just wrap this part of our conversation up this way. Why should fans care about this? And how real is this? What's the timeline of the clouds forming? What should we look for? I know I just gave you five questions, but just tell me what fans should know, Jeff. Yeah, maybe your producer should have told you to ask better questions rather than not wear a suit. But that being said. wow rich rich here here is why this matters because collective bargaining is the story of 2026 and it's going to be the thing that either allows for games to be played in 2027 or keeps major league baseball off field then that's a scary proposition the game's in a good place right now for the most part but there are issues with the game you know the fact that the Dodgers are spending as much as they are and teams toward the bottom are spending as little as they are and there's that giant disparity, it has alienated fans.

27:41And collective bargaining is the way to solve that. Now, is the salary cap the right way? You ask players and they will say definitively no. So I'm not sure it's necessarily going to lead to that. But for the union, it's pretty simple. Can they come out of this rejecting strength? Or is this going to be the sort of thing that weakens them to the point where I don't think they're going to capitulate on a cap, but for Major League Baseball, you know, something like this, owners look at it like it's positive for the league side. It'll be interesting to see what the fallout is because, you know, as anti-cap as Tony Clark was, Bruce Meyer is even more vehemently.

28:20So I just, I have trouble seeing a scenario where Major League Baseball players agree to that. And if they don't, how far our owner is going to be willing to push for it and how long could this lock out that's likely to

28:33Rich Eisen:start on december 1st last yeah mets owner steve cohen who is definitely not bobby axelrod from billions um said just uh i think it was yesterday or over the weekend you know how the dodgers have put a great team together they can spend and he makes you decide saying you know i can spend too um which is true it just seems that everybody's taking the dodgers money what why is that they're offering the 401k or it's just like why wouldn't you want to be teammates uh with sholay otani and managed by dave roberts and winning two two in a row when they could win a third in a row is that what it is yeah how about how about you get to go play on the best team in baseball and get to play with the best player in history sounds pretty good to me and and and what the and what the dodgers have to offer beyond that rich is the advantage that they have and that they have goo gobs of cash.

29:22And, you know, they're owned by Guggenheim Partners, which is a money manager that has more than$350 billion under management at this point. And, you know, Steve Cohen is one of the richest men in the world. And then you have a bunch of owners who, would they like to win? Sure. But what cost? Is it deficit spending? Is it otherwise? How do they do it? And I think people who are observers of baseball right now feel like the on-field product is pretty darn good at this point. You've got stars like Otani and like Aaron Judge, you know, like legitimately generational guy. But does the rest of the game feel fair?

30:02And if not, what can they do to go and solve that? And figuring out, I think, if there is a happy medium between what the owners want in a salary cap and what the players want and essentially a status quo system is going to be the rub of this whole thing and they do that they're going to be creative and open-minded enough people to go out and try and strike a deal rather than run this thing off the cliff have we seen all the

30:26Rich Eisen:movement pre-season are we done with it or or is there just going to be another team to screw it you know the dodgers get kyle tucker we're just going to load up and we're going to make a trade and we're going to find somebody that's sitting on their current team that makes a gajillion dollars and screw it we're going to go into luxury tax and we're going to go for it is there anything like that in the ether, Jeff? It could happen, but there's nothing really percolating at this point. There are a few free agents left out there, but all the big names, you know, Lucas Gilito is the biggest now, and he's a very good pitcher, and he's going to do well in free agency, but beyond that, there's really not a whole lot.

31:03We've got the teams where we are right now, and the greatest hope, Rich, is not going to be out talenting the Dodgers, because there's not a team that can out talent the Dodgers. This is going to be more about the randomness of baseball. And let's not forget, you know, three years ago, the Arizona Diamondbacks absolutely woodshedded the Dodgers in the postseason and wound up making a World Series run themselves. So the nature of baseball makes it possible. But the talent of the Dodgers is so overwhelming that they are the distinct and I would argue more than any of the, you know, almost 25 years I've been covering this game.

31:40They're going to be the overwhelming favorites going into the 2026 season.

31:44Rich Eisen:Well, not to drag you into the conversations I have with my now 15-year-old son, who's a diehard baseball fan, plays MLB the show every two seconds he can, and I did imbue him with the, well, he loves Boog Shambi. And so, I know, right? I imbued him with a love of the pinstripes. He's like showing me all sorts of crazy, you know, rumors about, you know, one involved Bryce Harper. And I basically said the Yanks need somebody like Stephen Kwan at the top of the lineup. You know what I mean? They need – find their Ernie Clement. And the reason why I bring that up is what you just said, that even though we're talking about the Dodgers being some massive juggernaut fueled by gajillions of dollars, they damn near lost the World Series to a bunch of guys who could put the ball in play, catch the ball, pitch it, you know, throw split finger after split finger, and damn near pulled it off, right?

32:39Rich Eisen:So in a World Series that will live for the rest of our lives is one of the best ever, Jeff. You know? Yeah. And I think if you're a Yankees fan, what you can look at is the same way the Dodgers look at things. The Dodgers just signed Evan Phillips for six and a half million. Evan Phillips is coming off of Tommy John surgery as a one inning reliever and is not going to be back until about. So that shows you the Dodgers are planning for October. That's what they have their eye on. And if you look at October right now, and if Garrett Cole comes back healthy and Carlos Redon comes back healthy and Cam Schlittler, you get a full season of him.

33:15And of course, Max Freed at the top of the rotation. That's the kind of rotation that can shut down a team like the Dodgers. So I think the fear of the Yankees and the Phillies have the same thing going on, frankly, is that this team looks a lot like last year's team. And neither of those teams last year made it to the World Series. And, you know, are they running it back? Yeah, pretty much. They are running it back. But those were also two of the winningest teams during the regular season. So you can rationalize, if you're them, the reasons behind it. The offseasons didn't necessarily go the way either team was hoping.

33:49But I'm not looking at the Yankees and the Phillies right now as dead in the water. It's just the same. And in sports, we've been conditioned to expect something a little bit different when what happened the year before didn't end with champion.

34:02Rich Eisen:Yeah, because the Dodgers do that every year, right? Yeah, they do. I mean, the Dodgers have won two in a row, and they went out and gave Kyle Tucker$240 million for four years, and Edwin Diaz a three-year$69 million deal. So they added the best free agent in Major League Baseball this winter, and they added the best closer on the market, and probably one of the three best closers in the game right now. And when you factor in all those things, I think it's fair to ask the question of all the teams out there. Do you want to win as much as the Dodgers? Is this important to you? And if so, how are you showing it?

34:38What are you doing to tell your fan base? And I think a lot of these organizations, and I get why, they say we can't do this. We can't do it like the Dodgers. And they could. The rules are in place for them to do so. It would just take an enormous amount of spending to do so. And that's just something that team owners have not shown themselves willing to do. And yes, the Dodgers have enormous advantages, Richard, and so do the Mets. But those advantages are really made clear by the system that's in place right now. And that's ultimately what we're talking about today. What does the system look like?

35:15And how are there levers that can be pulled so that the Dodgers and the Mets don't separate themselves into a completely different stratosphere than where the rest of the teams in Major League Baseball are?

35:24Rich Eisen:All right. Last one for you. ABS, which is again allowing players in Major League Baseball to challenge a ball and a strike using the Hawkeye system that we've seen for tennis and now for first down yard marks for the NFL. Is it true, Jeff, that this system is going to change the way we as fans watch a game with a strike zone box on the screen because baseball doesn't want a live game cast to be utilized in real time by a team, whether to challenge or not. Is that happening, Jeff? The sense that I've gotten is that there will be some changes to it. I believe that it's just going to be more that the graphic that comes off on the screen is not going to indicate whether it's in the supposed strike zone or the strike zone that's marked on TV.

36:15I think SNY, the Mets broadcaster actually did it this way where it was just a hollow circle in the area that showed where it was but it didn't say that's a strike or that's a ball the the truth is though rich like this is such a major league baseball response what happened with the houston astros and the cheating scandal there like they they want to be above board on absolutely everything that they can and in this situation it's pretty simple like players are supposed to challenge within a second or two of that pitch being called. And you see it right there. All they got to do is tap on their heads.

36:53The pitcher can do it, the hitter can do it, and the catcher can do it. Could teams theoretically be the thing on the screen and come up with a system to relay it to home plate quickly? I suppose so. But I think over time we're going to see from players that they're not even going to bother looking into the dugout. They're going to trust their eyes and what it tells them. And they're going to challenge based on that. And it's been about a 50 % correct call rate and 50 % overturn in the ABS trials that they've had so far in the minor leagues and in major league spring training as well last year.

37:31So I think it's going to be great. It's not going to be the pitch clock. It's not going to have that demonstrable in effect. But I think it's ultimately going to be a good thing for baseball. And some of those blown calls that we've seen on balls and strikes late in important games, there will be a backstop for them now.

37:48Rich Eisen:Unless the challenge has already been used, right? Just to inform before I let you go, you're only allowed to use it twice in a game. But if you get one of them right or both of them right, you get a third. What's the rule, Jeff? You don't lose your challenge if you get it right. So you could keep using it for the rest of the game. You can keep it going. Okay. Jeff, thanks for the time, man. I appreciate it. Appreciate you joining me and us on a busy day. You're the best. You be well. You should wear a suit, Rich. It would look much more dapper than this. No, I understand, man. I do that on NFL Network.

38:25Rich Eisen:I refer to it as dressed down, Rich. DDR. Where are you going next? What's your schedule? What are we looking like? I got Phillies, I got Blue Jays, I got Yankees, and then I got home. Okay, man. Looking forward to all four. I bet. touch them all before you head home. Thanks again, Jeff. Really appreciate it. Thanks for having me, Rich. You're the best. That's Jeff Passan, truly the best at it, right here on the Rich Eisen Show, joining us from spring training. Listen, the ABS stuff, man, I look forward to it, and I guess, kids, you're going to learn what it was like when we used to watch games where they didn't have a box on the screen and it wasn't immediately letting you know how fast the pitch was and whether it was a ball or a strike by whether it's filled in if it's hit the strike zone or if it's clear and empty if it's a ball.

39:18Rich Eisen:That's the way we used to watch things. I'm used to the other way around, man. I love knowing how fast it is and whether it was a ball or a strike, but they don't want this television feed to be used in a way to influence a decision in real time. And as he pointed out, the reason why they're skittish about it, The Astros used to use the TV feed to steal signs and then start banging on trash cans. That is the way it was used, you know, to cheat. And I guess they don't want it, but I guess, and if you use, if you get a challenge right and you get to keep using it for the rest of the game, as long as you keep getting it right, i i guess i can understand that baseball wants to change the way we're watching games you know i don't know i i'm worried this is we think it's a great idea but this isn't hey man why i felt the same way about the pitch clock and now i love it love it love the pitch clock think it's great don't yeah but you look at it anymore same but we love it because it's 99 of the time we're watching games from home and it makes it as a better tv product when you were at a game yeah it it it goes fast that's great uh it's good it's great if you're up and moving about you miss a lot of the game i i have no problem with the pitch clock and i i was dead set against it now i'm a i just want to see how it works you knew i was also get wanting to get rid of the shift immediately as soon as i was seeing it and that's another great rule that's another one um i'm willing to give this one a try.

41:01Rich Eisen:Well, I better be willing because it's coming. I just, I'm going to miss that square if that's what's going to happen on the screen. 844-204-RICH, number to dial your phone calls when we come back right here on ESPN, our final segment on the Big E, if you will, coming up. The Rich Eisen Show, the podcast.

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43:11Rich Eisen:Number to dial, Ramona Shelburne's going to join us. Top of hour number three to review our weekend of work from the NBA All-Star Game. and set up this show to give you an idea of what to look forward to in the de facto second half of the NBA season. And is the commissioner really thinking of abolishing the draft to teach everyone a lesson about tanking? Mark Cuban thinks that we should embrace tanking. Similar to debate on first tank? Sort of. Corey in Greenwich, New York. 844-204-RICH is what he dialed. What's up, Corey? You there, Corey? Greenwich, New York. Three, two, Corey, are you there?

43:49Yes. Hello.

43:50Rich Eisen:Yeah, I'm here. Where were you, Corey? Come on. Where were you? I had to turn my Bluetooth off my tractor to get it on regular. All right, Corey, office, Bluetooth, and his tractor. Who do Bluetooth and tractors went together? That's amazing. Okay, what's going on, Corey? I have my Michigan point, but I have two NBA questions for you, if you don't mind. Well, I prefer your Michigan point, whatever it is. Although I shouldn't say that, but what do you got? I give you the floor. My two NBA points is, number one is Giannis' point. I have a bet with my other co-host radio guys, my buddies, and if I win, he has to come milk my cows, and if I lose, I got to bring him farm products, like beef pork.

44:41Okay. So I'm on the boat that Giannis is going to be a Knick by the end of 2026, What do you think?

44:51Rich Eisen:What do you have to give him? Pork. Okay. It's what we would call trafe over dairy. Both are, I don't know if they're, it depends on what day of the week it is to kosher, but I don't know if that's what you're talking about in Greenwich, New York. What's your other point? My other point is I'm a Laker fan, but I don't believe next summer, I don't believe my Lakers will. I don't think LeBron will be a Laker next year, and I believe he'll go to the Knicks because he's playing in Madison Square Garden. I don't think LeBron. You think LeBron's going to finish with the Knicks? It's been 23 years people have been trying to put him on the Knicks.

45:32Rich Eisen:I don't know. I think the Cavs is where he finishes, you know, full circle, don't you think? Chris, doesn't it make the most sense? What's your Michigan point, Corey? This weekend, Michigan versus Duke. Do you think that's a championship preview? Oh, very well. That's fine. Okay, Corey. All right. Thank you for the call. That's fine. I do believe Giannis could end up as a next. I don't particularly care to talk about that right now. Is Michigan versus Duke a national championship game preview? That's what you want to talk about. Oh, you betcha. In the same way I told Adam Ray, Seahawks fan, prior to the game against the San Francisco 49ers in the divisional playoff round, I'm like, you could beat the Niners, then you beat the Rams, then you go to the Super Bowl and beat the Patriots, avenge that loss in the house of the 49ers.

46:24Rich Eisen:it's the greatest path period i would love it if michigan took care of north carolina maybe at some point and then at the end of the day avenge the fab five loss to duke oh my god you know what and then hopefully they beat north carolina at some point you know um using no timeouts in the game don't call timeout once because they beat the crap out of them nice and this michigan team has the ability to do it. Oh my gosh. He's talking about the game against Duke that's coming up this Saturday in Washington, D.C., which I'm already seeing might be the most expensive ticket for basketball in the history of that building.

47:08Rich Eisen:Oh gosh. Two of the three title favorites. Michigan's now the favorite. Arizona's second, Duke's third. Let me tell you this. They got Purdue tonight, which is in Purdue. That is going to require every ounce of their awesomeness to pull off. Then there's the Big Ten tournament. They also got Illinois coming up. They got Michigan State again, just to tell little brother what's up one more time before the Big Ten tournament. Oh, man. I cannot wait. I just love this Michigan basketball team. We'll talk about Giannis the next hour with Ramona. I'm sorry I went down that wormhole there. Well, it's Michigan.

47:47Rich Eisen:We get it. I appreciate you saying that. We understand. Oh, this guy, Dusty May. Fantastic, baby. Ramona Shelburne's coming up. The Ridge Eisen Show Podcast. Monster Energy. Everybody knows White Monster, Zero Ultra. That's the OG. It kicked off this whole Zero Sugar Energy drink thing. But Ultra is a whole lineup now. You've got Strawberry Dreams, Blue Hawaiian, Sunrise, and Vice Guava. And they all bring the Monster Energy punch. So if you've been living in the white can, branch out. Ultra's got a flavor for every vibe, and every single one is zero sugar. Tap the banner to learn more.