Hour 2: Todd McShay Breaks Down His New NFL Mock Draft, plus a Horrible ABS Challenge and an Epic Coach Rant

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1:30Todd McShay:We are back, baby.

1:31Rich Eisen:We are back. Live from the Rich Eisen Show studio in Los Angeles. We are back. We are back. This is the Rich Eisen Show. And it's over. The Harden's win. Earlier on the show. 2026 NFL Draft prospect, Carnell Tate. Coming up. The Ringer NFL Draft analyst, Todd McShay. Actor and comedian, David Spade. And now, it's Rich Eisen. Here on Disney +, the ESPN app, ESPN Radio, Sirius XM Channel 80. David Spade in studio hour number three. Great chat with Carnell Tate moments ago. But let's hit the Zoom right now, everybody, from the McShay Show, courtesy of The Ringer. Our friend Todd McShay is back here.

2:19Rich Eisen:Good to see you, Todd. How are you, brother?

2:21Todd McShay:What's up, guys? How are we doing? Hey, Todd. Good to see you, bro. Good to see you. It's my crew right there, Rich. Yes, everybody. Yes.

2:30Rich Eisen:And you'll be here Monday in person, which we're excited to have you here to kick off our draft week next week. Let's get to it, man. Saints are known for trading up. But Saints are known for trading up. They've done it eight times in the first round since the 2010 draft. So they do that. And your latest mock draft, 4.0, that came out on this very day has Arvel Reese going to the Saints third overall because you believe what I think is becoming a lot more conventionally wise here for the draft. Mendoza and Bailey going one, two to the Raiders and Jets, respectively. I'll give you the floor on your thought process here, sir.

3:10Todd McShay:Yeah, I'll be honest. Of the three trades I have in the top 10, this is the one that I'm not certain of. I'm not certain about it. I'd say the least certain of. But I'm the most certain that Arizona is the team that's trying probably the hardest to get out of that third pick. Here's the dilemma you're in if you're Monty Austin for it, the GM for the Cardinals. You've got the best player in the draft by a lot of people's accounts is Jeremiah Love, running back. They brought in Tyler Algier, certainly could still use a star like Jeremiah Love, and that's a possibility at three. The player that you'd really like to get, but at better value, is Francis Maui Noah or even a Spencer Fano to kind of complete that offensive line overhaul.

3:56Todd McShay:But then you're sitting there now if Bailey goes to and looking at, you know, Arvel Reese and saying, yeah, we could use that too. But again, wouldn't it be great to be able to move back? We might want to move up and back into the first round to get Ty Simpson later and we can get to that. wouldn't it be nice to get some some ammunition mickey loomis you talked about the history of it i talked to him at the senior bowl and he was like you know most most teams are getting away from trade up let's get more compensation let's take more hacks at this thing because we'll admittedly say like we're going to miss on some players he's got no problem i was talking to mickey and and jeff ireland who kind of runs the personnel department sitting there kind of nodding like we like a guy we're going to go up and get him and so i i think about brandon staley and his defenses.

4:43Todd McShay:There's two things that jump out. One is at cornerback, you better have smart guys who can play man and zone. And Mansour Delane's going to be sitting there at eight probably, and so they could take him there. They need a weapon for Tyler Shuck. So whether it's Carnell Tate or Jordan Tyson, that's an option at eight as well. But this defense is driven by those explosive edge rushers. They come in different shapes, sizes, and 40 times, from Bosa to Tooley to Khalil Mack. to, you know, last year we saw Chase Young throw Floyd in there. He's had a lot of different guys, but the tie that binds all of them is this explosive takeoff.

5:22Todd McShay:Well, you see that with Reese on tape and you see it in the 10 yard split, a 158, which is exceptional. That's a Bill Poley in line for the 10 yard split pass rushers rushers is 160. So you have 160 or faster. That's elite. And so I'm intrigued by that. I don't know necessarily that the Saints want to do that. Are they going to trade away a second round pick in order to go up and get that guy? But it's a possibility and there's been a little bit of buzz about it.

5:50Rich Eisen:Well, and then should this happen, it makes sense that the Titans would then go and take Jeremiah Love with Bailey and Reese gone, right? Like, let's take the arguably best football player, most impactful player in this draft and bring him to Tennessee and put right next to Cam Ward for the next decade. Knock on wood with the health gods. The Giants going for their offensive line instead of anybody not named Reese from the Ohio State. Why do you have them taking Mount Miller fifth here?

6:22Todd McShay:Let's go back to four for a second. Please. Go.

6:24Rich Eisen:Yeah, sure.

6:26Todd McShay:I've got this mental image in my head of like a fly on the wall inside the Titans draft room, right? And on one hand, you've got Brian Dable, former head coach, talking. You know, he wanted so badly to get Cam Ward that he offered just about anything that they could offer to try to go up with Mike Borgonzi, the current general manager who drafted Cam Ward. They couldn't get him because Borgonzi wouldn't move off of that number one pick a year ago. It winds up with Jackson Dart, who we absolutely love, but not quite as much as Cam Ward. And so you've got, these are not meek personalities with Robert Sala and Mike Borgonzi and Brian Dable.

7:05Todd McShay:And so you're sitting in this room and you've got Dable saying, we've got a young quarterback. We've got a running back who's the best player on the board. We've got a running back who averaged over 10 yards per catch in Jeremiah Love. Let's give him some easy pitching catches, pick up 6, 8, 12 yards, whatever it is. This is the guy that we need. Then on the other hand, you got Salah saying, you want to take a running back at four, make him one of the top 10 page running backs in the league. And then Dayball is going, you want to take an edge? Who's like, if Arvel Reese is still sitting there, the conversion player, or you want to take Sonny Stiles and off ball linebacker, what's the, what's the difference, you know, and going back and forth.

7:44Todd McShay:And then Dayball finally with the Trump card coming in is Borgazzi sitting back and taking all this information and saying, yo, we both got fired from the New York market because we couldn't get our offenses going. We're going to do this again. You just, you just spent all of our resources on the defensive side in the off season. Like, let's get an offensive weapon. So that's a fascinating pick. Now to five, I'll be honest with you. I had to finish this on Monday. The editors, you know, go through and edit it, get it up on the site for this morning. It's sitting here on Wednesday now. And since then, And it's almost like a flashbang that you throw into the barracks, like try to smoke people out.

8:23Todd McShay:You send out a mock 4.0, and all of a sudden the techs start coming in. And I had heard from one executive that I really trust and has dialed in, like Giants are going defense with that pick. But I actually reached out to two people who worked with John Harbaugh and had been in draft rooms with him for years. And they kept saying, like, yeah, he'll love downs. He's going to love styles. But there's something about finishing that offensive line, And first pick of, so they were leaning towards Maui Noah. I went Maui Noah. Since like, if I had to redo this right now, I'm being honest with you, Rich, total transparency here.

8:57Todd McShay:I'd go styles with that pick and it would just be slightly ahead of downs. I think it's going to be one of two players. So not saying rip up this whole thing. Everything else I feel good about, as good as you can about a mock draft, you know, eight days away from the draft. but I think that could be styles which makes it really interesting because I've got the Cowboys trading up for styles would they do the same thing moving up to six if it's for downs or if downs goes at five I think the Cowboys are even more motivated to move up to number six I keep hearing the Browns want to move out of six just like the Cardinals both of those teams want to move out of their spots because they know they can get an offensive tackle probably Maui Noah if Arizona moves back a little bit.

9:39Todd McShay:Probably Caden Proctor's the name that I heard Cleveland really likes. 390 pounds during the season at Alabama. Got down in the 350 range. Was 352 at the Combine. If you're assured he's going to be in that range, he's a really good player, but the tape is up and down. But the analytics are driven. They drive the bus more than any other organization. And offensive tackle's a trait's position. So I think Cleveland wants to get out of six. six i know arizona wants to get out of three the same and i know dallas is the team lurking but they'd like to move up to six because it may not require that pick 20 where they could sit back and take a keldrick fox from auburn which there's a lot of links there and get your edge rusher at 20 if you move up and get a sunny styles at number six or maybe even a caleb downs at number six

10:26Rich Eisen:brother if there's if this scenario happens where the cowboys trade up for a player sparked by a development born out of who the Giants didn't take would be something to monitor.

10:44Todd McShay:And by the way, get the player that the commanders in the same division would want to take one pick later.

10:52Rich Eisen:Honestly, it's such NFC East intrigue to see how it would play out in years to come as to which player does best. I mean, Mau and Noah better prove out if that happens, if Sonny Stiles with the star on the side of his helmet balls out like we saw him ball out at at Columbus I mean you know with the Buckeyes on the side of his helmet I mean that would be

11:18Todd McShay:something and so here's what's yeah go ahead go ahead no no what's fascinating to me is it's almost cyclical right like around the combine when I was wrapping up some of the tape on these top guys in my mind it was there's not a bunch of elite players here take mendoza out of it whether you call him in that elite class or a notch below i would have him below a jayden daniels caleb williams uh drake may i'd have him right around the same grade as cam ward a year ago okay but take the quarterback out the best players in this draft are almost all at non-premium positions And the best players in this draft are the running back, Jeremiah Love, the off-ball linebacker, Sonny Stiles, conversion guy, Arvel Reese.

12:02Todd McShay:There is an edge rusher in there, David Bailey. But ahead of those two edge guys, I would put Caleb Downs. And there's no 40 time. He doesn't have the length of an Eman Worry or a Hamilton, but he's just one of the best four or five football players. I'd also throw in there Venga Iwane, but he's a guard and he's not going to go in the top 10. those are the best football players and now as we squeeze close to the draft where's all the attention it's on Sonny Stiles it's on Caleb Downs it's on Jeremiah Love I think they're all going to go there's a really good chance they all go in the top seven right and and then Carnell Tate's kind of in that next batch and Jordan Tyson's moving up but those those four names I just mentioned even though they're not premium position guys I think that they're going to go

12:51Rich Eisen:off the board really quickly brother if i was an owner of an nfl team in the top 10 in this draft first of all you'd be here because i'd have sent a private jet for you uh that's number one but number two i would tell all my evaluators i would tell all the scouts i would tell the general manager and their staff i would say whatever you need to take a shot of novocaine you know a couple of advil or whatever whatever you got to take to get the notion of positional value out of your head you must do it i do not care that you know in this draft this year this time around i'm sorry man i don't care safety off the ball linebacker running back you got to be kidding me you got to

13:40Todd McShay:go you got to take them it doesn't matter in this draft and rich what's fascinating to me rich is we talked to, I mean, I think we interviewed like six or seven, not interviewed, we sat down and kind of just talked ball with six or seven different general managers, and I've been talking to them for 20 plus years. The comments are almost identical from one GM to the next. We had like Bargonzi and Wolf and Poles and Ortiz and like all these different GMs on and everyone to a T is like, yeah, just take the best player or it's you don't pass on a don't pass on a hall of famer then as you get closer to the draft it's like man i need an edge i like a quarterback no i know what the needs are

14:26Rich Eisen:if they're not there don't force it you know what i mean like i think that's what we're seeing but

14:31Todd McShay:that's what we're seeing right rich we're seeing all the reports are arizona wants out they want to get their tackle because it's a premium position they want to solidify their offensive You can't get one in free agency of high, high quality. And so I've got to draft one. There's seven offensive tackles that are going to be drafted in this first round. And they're going to go pretty fast, right? Once they start going, it's going to be pew, pew, pew, pew. And so, but you've got Arizona and you've got Cleveland. They're sitting there at three and six and they want offensive tackles. But man, can we just move back a little bit and get one?

15:04Todd McShay:And so teams are looking at it and saying, all right, do I move up? not only am i going to take a player at a running back or safety or off-ball linebacker am i going to actually move up and give away more compensation to go do it you know and that but that's what's happening because i think that people have come to realize especially in this draft like like you're saying throw out the positional value stuff and let's just get the best football players

15:27Rich Eisen:heck yeah heck yeah two more of your um trade predictions uh from your mock draft 4.0 todd mcshay of the ringer here host of the mcshay show uh right here on the rich eisen show eight days before the draft um my guy daniel jami on the sports center i hosted on sunday night just like jets are going to move up to seven for carnell tate all it would take is uh their second second that dallas gave them for quinn and williams and a fourth rounder and obviously the 16th overall pick to go pair um with garrett wilson and get ready for whoever the quarterback of the future is going to be um why do you like this as well here's what i know from talking to people in the league there's

16:09Todd McShay:two classes of wide receivers in the first round i don't want people to overlook the importance of friday friday is when was when jordan tyson from arizona state works out hamstring has prevented him from um he he started his career at colorado he he had a really bad knee injury i think it was acl mcl pcl tear and came back he kind of missed almost all of 2023 i think it was 2024 he had his best season they make the college football playoff run at arizona state right with scadaboo and leavitt and those guys and but he gets injured with a broken collarbone then and he misses the college football playoff then this past year he's healthy for the majority of the year but he has a hamstring injury at the end of the year kind of shuts it down like all right we'll see him work out at the combine doesn't work out all right we'll see him work out of the pro day doesn't work out and so now there's this all this talk in the league about he might be the most talented receiver in the class and every you hear this like so is he tough is he this is he that i see on tape there's sometimes he catches the ball and it's like yeah let's go down or let's let's get to the sideline but he like the way he attacks the ball the routes he runs he is and it's like written all over him having worked with Heinz Ward the flexibility so there's there's teams now we're talking about maybe eight to the Saints nine to the Chiefs talking top 10 for this wide receiver but he hasn't worked out and he works out on Friday so let's keep an eye on that together right but the classes are broken up into two within the first round at receiver interestingly enough Tate Tyson and Lemon are in that first class then the second class is and if I took a straw poll even though everyone's saying omar cooper is the fourth receiver honestly it would be casey conception is the is the fourth receiver then it would be cooper and and denzel boston from washington so if you're the jets you're sitting there you've got nine picks this year four in the top i've got it here somewhere four in the top um 44 overall what and i've got three first rounders next year and a bunch of picks next year so should i do we give up one of those like maybe the 44th pick to go up and get one of those the top class of wide receivers before this run happens because you sit back at 16 you're going to get a good one but chances are whether it's like i said at um at eight with with the um with the saints nine with the the chiefs 13 with the rams those three receivers could be gone and so i think there's a discussion and a debate within the Jets organization of do we sit back and just take Concepcion or Cooper or do we go a different position or do we get aggressive and use one of the we got a lot of picks this year and next maybe

18:57Rich Eisen:just use one of those to go up and get the guy yeah I mean it makes sense because Tate is that and the biscuit you get the best you know obviously we're gonna have a long debate about Bailey versus Reese you get the best pass rusher and then you get the best receiver and then you sit back and say we'll see you top of friday night we got the first pick of friday night which is the most valuable second night pick and let Arizona go trade up ahead of us and move and that pushes one one other really good player down to us at 33 which which uh you just transitioned me to the last question uh Ty Simpson is in Arizona today um having a private chit chat and I assume work out with the Cardinals.

19:37Rich Eisen:You have them moving from 34th overall, second pick of night two, to the third to last pick of night one and take Ty Simpson. Why?

19:50Todd McShay:It's hard to find a spot for Ty Simpson because so many teams I talk to that have quarterback needs are looking to 20-27. Arizona is sitting in a unique spot because you've got Mike LaFleur coming in. I think Ty Simpson fits what he would want to do. There's also the opportunity, if you can trade out of that third pick and maybe get a second next year or something like that, that you can get some capital so you can be a part of that mix when we're talking about Arch and Dante and Soresby and Levitt and all those guys, Hoover, CJ Carling. I could go on and on. But why not take a hack this year in a guy that we don't have to play right away.

20:33Todd McShay:We can roll out Jacoby Brissett in the beginning of the year when the time's right. We can see where he is and kind of get a feel for is this the guy or not. And then if we have to, we can go draft a guy next year. I don't think that. In fact, I know the process, the the the mental process is they've gone through it for the Jets is very similar. Everything they've done, including the trade they made, I think, for Quinn and Williams when they were offered a one this year and a two next year. They negotiated, no, no, no. We'll take the two this year. We want the one next year. It's to get a quarterback in 2027, okay?

21:08Todd McShay:But if you're sitting there at 33 and you like this quarterback, which I think, I know the Jets like him, but we don't love him enough to go package a pick and go move up and get him, and we're certainly not going to take him at 16. But if he's there at 33, we could take him. Arizona is, I think, a little bit more aggressive with the mindset of we really like him, and we'd really like to bring him in. And what does it cost us to go move up? I think it's fifth in a six-round pick to move up a handful of spots to 30. I don't think they have to trade up ahead of Cleveland or Pittsburgh. Excuse me, I've seen other people say they've got to get ahead of Pittsburgh.

21:46Todd McShay:Pittsburgh's not taking one at 21. Cleveland's not taking one at 24. So you've just got to get ahead of 33, and I'm sure New England would be glad to take that call at 31. Seattle and John Schneider would be glad to take it at 32. and Miami would probably like to move back and continue to add more picks as they overhaul their entire roster. So that one makes sense to me. And I think very similar to the Giants a year ago. Let's take a great player at three or move back or whatever we do. And then let's trade back into the first round towards the end and get the quarterback that we're really intrigued by.

22:20Todd McShay:And maybe he's the perfect fit. Maybe he's the guy we saw those first nine tapes before everything fell apart and the run game wasn't there. Ryan Williams disappeared and the protections weren't there. And our quarterback and Ty Simpson got down to 190 pounds with gastritis. Maybe he's that guy. And if he is awesome and if he's not, it didn't cost us a whole lot to get him and we can take another hack at it in 2027.