Bills Survive, 49ers Stun Eagles, and How We Talk About Justin Herbert

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1:07Welcome to the Ringer NFL Show. I'm your host, Shiel Kapadia. Three more wildcard games in the book Sunday. Bills beat the Jaguars, 49ers upset the Eagles, and then Patriots take care of business against the Chargers. on Sunday night. We're going to talk about all those games. What's the grace period for Nick Sirianni in Philadelphia? How should 49ers fans be feeling? What about Justin Herbert? A big loss once again. And can the Buffalo Bills finally break through and get to the Super Bowl with Josh Allen? To talk about all that, we've got my friend from the Ringer, Billy Gill. Let's take a break and we'll come back with Billy.

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2:36All right, we are back here on the Ringer NFL show after three games on Sunday. Two very good games. Night game wasn't spectacular, but we're going to get to all of it with Billy Gill. Billy, let's just go in order. Let's start with Bill's Jaguars because it might have been the best game of the day, probably the best game of the day, one of the best games of the weekend. The Bills go up 27-24. Trevor Lawrence and the Jaguars can't come back. The Bills are moving on. So my question to you, because Josh Allen, I mean, what was it, foot injury, hit his finger, got tested for a concussion. There was a knee thing.

3:12Can he survive a playoff run? Do you feel differently about this Bills team now than maybe you did at the beginning of the day? Do you think this is the year that they can now actually make a Super Bowl run?

3:23Sheil Kapadia:Wow. Okay. A lot to unpack here, Shio. Do I think he's going to survive a playoff run? I feel like it depends on how long they go, right, in this playoff run. Because he really was banged up. He was punching his teammates' helmets, hurting his hand. He had the knee thing. He was getting banged up. And he has that streak, and we talked about it last year or last week on the show, where he has like 135 straight games or whatever that he's snapped the ball. And then they do the cheating thing where he goes in for play or whatever. But we didn't believe in the Bills last week, I don't feel like. We thought that the Jaguars were kind of, this was their time.

3:56Sheil Kapadia:They were going to come. They were going to dethrone the Bills. This was going to be Josh Allen's chance with all the good quarterbacks out. And no, it's the first time. He was 0-4 headed into this week in road playoff games. He didn't have, during the playoffs, a game-winning drive. So he did those two things, and now they've advanced. And now it seems like he has a decent path to make it to the Super Bowl. Yeah, I think they have a chance. You said we. Listen, I am the Bills defender. I will just defend them against everyone. They're fine. Don't worry about them. And every year I'm wrong because every year then they lose in the playoffs.

4:33And I said, well, all right, they got unlucky here. It wasn't their year, but they're such a weird team because this is not the best version of the Bills. We saw this game was much like most of their games this year where it's like, oh, the run game is pretty good. Josh Allen is still maybe the best player in football. So he's going to make some plays. And the last two drives, he was incredible. And then they get on defense and it's like, oh, another 18 yard run, another 25 yard run. And that happened again in this game. So I just feel like they're going to play a bunch of coin flip games here.

5:02and that's been the story with them in the playoffs. Even those losses to the Chiefs and the other games they had in previous years, it's like, these are coin flip games and they always come out on the wrong end of those. And today they came out on the right end of them, Billy, but I'll tell you, there was a point in this game, the end of this game, I thought it was maybe the most interesting strategy thing in the NFL this weekend. And I need your thought on it because it's the end of this game. They had the ball, you know, they did that tush push, which goes 10 yards, which that had to be just like an all-time high, right?

5:33I've never seen a tush push go that far. So they get the tush push and then they're at the Jaguars one yard line with 104 laps, Billy. They're down 24 to 20. Now this is when all the, you know, all we're armchair quarterbacks, we're sitting in our cozy recliners at home. And we're saying, here's what you should do because maybe here's what I would do in Madden, or here's what I would do if I was just kind of thinking about this in my head, it's that you shouldn't score right away. You know, there is a thought that rather than scoring right away, like the bills did again, with one Oh four left, they're at the one yard line that should they have just taken a knee there because here's the thought, Hey, you think it's crazy, but Mike Rabel did this earlier in the season.

6:15So it's not that crazy. If you, if you take a knee, but it's gotta be a good knee. It's not a, take a step back, take a knee. It's sort of go forward or stand right where you're standing and taking the, if you do that, you can knock 40 seconds off the clock. The Jaguars don't have any timeouts. You call timeout with, let's say a 24 seconds left, whatever it might be. And now guess what? You have three chances from still the one yard line to score a touchdown. And now when they get the ball back, the Jaguars, they're going to have under 20 seconds, no timeouts. I actually think they should have done that billing.

6:52Sheil Kapadia:Yeah. Well, I mean, Trevor did them a favor by throwing an interception first time he threw the ball after he got the ball back. How did we feel about Trevor's game today? Did you feel like it was okay? I thought for two and a half quarters he was not great and then I thought he started playing well there in the second half and he did bring them back and they did score a touchdown and they went up 24-20. I don't know. I thought it was a little up and down I would say. Back to your initial question though. So you would take a knee right there. I thought you just ignored it. I'm like, why are you asking me about Trevor Lawrence?

7:22Sheil Kapadia:I just asked you. I'm on the edge of my seat waiting to see what your answer is going to be to this. And you're like, how did Trevor Lawrence do? All right, go ahead. Now you're going to tell me. So you take a knee on the one-yard line. The thing is, I'm trying to remember, how many timeouts, they had like two timeouts left, right? The Bills, or are they out of timeouts? Yeah, the Bills had, I think, two or even three timeouts left. So then they could do, they'd have two more runs, three more runs, I guess, in theory, right? And then, you know, but you hope that they don't fumble the ball. I mean, that's kind of the situation.

7:55You hope you don't get a penalty or something. I know that's I couldn't decide if it's getting too cute or not. But I actually think it probably gives you the better chance to win the game. I mean, if the Jaguars go down the field and kick a field goal, that's all anyone's talking about today. It's how the Bills handled the end of that game. If they end up losing in overtime.

8:12Sheil Kapadia:Did you like the review with the old tennis match graphics that came up to see the spotting of the ball where they did the spotting and it goes and then it showed the yellow line and then everybody saw it. And they're like, oh, first down because it's like a bad spot earlier in the game. I do like the drama of that. Now, I have no idea when they use it. It's not spotting the ball like that. It's like the refs spot the ball and then they show you the graphic. But when it does reveal itself, I do find it to be quite exciting. I do like the buildup. like the one or two seconds where you're waiting for it to like, actually like go exactly where it is.

8:45Sheil Kapadia:And then you figure it out. Yeah. Let's finish with the Jaguars on this game. So we feel better about the bills. Let's see how they look next week. The Jaguars, are you in full like, Hey, this was an encouraging season and they're going to build on this and they're going to be a force to reckon with. Or are you kind of like pump the brakes? It might not quite go that way. I kind of want to see what they do next year. Cause I feel like we were here with the Jaguars, like two or three seasons ago where they had that big comeback against the Chargers in the playoffs, right? And we're like, oh, wow, they won, I think, five straight games to make it to the playoffs.

9:16Sheil Kapadia:Like, wow, Trevor Lawrence, this is going to be a thing now. He's going to be a force. And then the next season they lost five straight games to miss the playoffs. So let's see how it goes. Like, Liam Cohen did a great job, obviously, taking over this team, getting them to the playoffs, getting them to, you know, a situation where they were, they should have won that game, right? And they were the higher seed. So they had a good year, but let's see what they did or what they do, I guess, next year. Also, I have a question for you. I don't know if you caught this about the Jaguars. So vibes seem to be good in Duval.

9:46Sheil Kapadia:Even though they lost, it seemed like things were very positive. People were just happy with the fact that there's a season. What you're asking me, do I think that this team is ready to turn it around? They seem to think so in Jacksonville, right? So much so that in Liam Cohen's post-game press conference, we had a reporter who just started by giving him a pep talk and just essentially saying, we're so proud of you. Keep your head up. You're doing great. We made the right decision by hiring you. Like, good job, kid. And it's kind of like everybody was putting out the clip. I'm like, oh, this is so nice.

10:19Sheil Kapadia:This is so great. I'm wondering from your perspective how you received that because you've been in those situations. They're only out there for like 10 minutes. Not everybody gets all of their questions answered. And in that position where you're credentialed, how did you feel about that? All right. See, now I have to walk the line between not being uppity reporter guy. You know, this is a disgrace. When you get the credential, you know, you're there to be objective. So I don't want to go too far with it. But also, I haven't seen anything like that where a reporter just at a press conference is like, keep your head up.

10:57You're doing great. Now, I do believe you got to humanize the coaches and the athletes and build relationships with them. And maybe you're having a conversation on the side. and maybe you're having some conversation. But in a press conference setting, I did find it to be a little odd. And I was actually, when I saw that, I was trying to think, would I ever be in a situation where I would be like telling the coach, keep your head up? And I had a hard time thinking of what, Billy. What did you think? What did you think about it as a astute media observer?

11:28Sheil Kapadia:So I used to intern at a local TV station. So I would have to go and we'd have to do those things. And sometimes I'd have to go into the locker room because we were the channel that was like the official channel of the team. So we had like more access to some of the other channels. So I've been in those and I've never seen anyone do that because it's usually like the, you know, the gruff, like former player who looks for like, works for the local station now. And he's asking the questions and he's kind of like, when I was on this team, we didn't put up with any of this stuff. We wouldn't have gone out like that.

11:58Sheil Kapadia:Like, it's very like, you know, grumpy almost kind of. And the reporters, you know, when the season ends, in typical situation when the season ends, you're critical of like play calling or, you know, how the players did in the game or whatever. It's not normally like a, hey, you got this. And the funny thing is that Liam seemed confused by it at the beginning of it too, right? Where he was kind of like, where is this going? I thought he liked it. See, I was analyzing his facial expressions. Yeah, I think he was like, thank you. I think at the beginning he's like, I don't quite understand what's going on.

12:28Sheil Kapadia:And then he's like, you know what? I appreciate that. But he's not like a guy that's going to lose his job or anything. So it's a nice gesture, but it didn't seem super necessary. Yeah, I think that's right. Maybe the only time I would have done it, remember the Saints had that interim coach, Darren Rizzi, he clocked the toilet in the morning. I don't remember him clocking the toilet. Yeah, he won a game as an interim coach. And he was like, man, this day started. I thought it was going to be bad because I clocked the toilet before the game. And that's how he started his press conference. And we do the thing for The Ringer where we write about our favorite sports moments of the year.

13:03and sometimes I do moments that touched me, but that year I just did that one because I'll never forget that Darren Rizzi clogged the toilet. So maybe if I was in that Saints press room, I would have been like, don't be embarrassed, you know, proper gut health and it happens to everybody. And if you need, you know, some recommendations on a plunger, keep your head up. You got this, Darren Rizzi. Other than that, I don't know that I would ever do it. You have young kids and we've talked off air about some of the things they think is funny and you could do the jet, The dad jokes. The Jaguars running back, who had a very nice day, some big runs.

13:37Would they think it's funny that his last name is Tootin? Basial Tootin?

13:41Sheil Kapadia:They're big right now. I'm not going to lie. They're big on farts. They're big on the word fart. They think farts hilarious. They listen to, on Spotify, they listen to an artist called Mr. Fart. And it's basically just like royalty-free songs. but it's the whole tune is just fart sounds. Oh, I'm not familiar with his game, but I will be soon. Yeah, you could probably skip this one, but they love fart jokes. So Tudin, I'd have to explain to them that Tudin meant fart, but if I explain to them that Tudin is like, you know, a synonym for fart, they're going to be saying Tudin a lot. And I'm not going to lie.

14:19Sheil Kapadia:I kind of laugh when they say fart too. So it's funny. They're very fart humor centric right now. Okay. Just wanted to make sure I got that in in case, you know, this week. How about you? Yeah. When does the fart jokes go away for children? Well, I don't think I've gotten there yet. Girls are 13 and nine. And yeah, we're still going strong. So you got a lot of time. Don't worry about it. All right. Jaguars, Bills, Jaguars, nice season. We'll talk more about what they can potentially do in the off season to upgrade. But certainly a nice start to the Liam Cohen era there in Jacksonville. and Bill's Super Bowl hopes are still alive.

14:59All right, next game here, Billy. 49ers at Eagles. I thought the Eagles were going to win this game. And I thought, you know, I always, when I talk about coaching, I always say, can you do more with less? You know, or are you actually doing less with more? I thought this game, which is such a great example of that. It's like Kyle Shanahan with just this team that has been decimated by injuries. They're on the road. They lost the one seed to the Seahawks. George Kittle goes down with an Achilles injury and they still find a way to create explosive plays and win the game. And then on the other side of it, you have Nick Sirianni and the offensive coordinator, Kevin Petullo, and they've got 10 of 11 starters on offense available.

15:40And they can't score more than 19 points against this 49ers defense. So I thought great coaching job by Kyle Shanahan. I know we've talked about him before. Now some are saying, hey, is this the best coaching job he's ever had? It might be when you look at all the circumstances. And then the Eagles aspect of this, I wanted to ask you, what's the grace period for a fan base to be like, I don't want this guy to be my coach anymore, even though he just won the Super Bowl the previous year? Do you have to wait two years, three years, five years? Is there zero years? What do you think on this with Sirian?

16:14Sheil Kapadia:Okay, well, with Sirian, I feel like this is like you're asking, like this is a personal question because you're trying to talk this through. I'm on a lot of group chats, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So based on your team alone, it seems like you have three years, right? So Doug Peterson wins the Super Bowl 2018, and then they fire him, I think, January 2021, which is pretty short. He didn't have a very long grace period. Sirianni is interesting, right? Because I feel like, and you would know better than me, I feel like if he didn't win the Super Bowl last year, his job might have been in jeopardy anyway.

16:50Sheil Kapadia:So then if he wins the Super Bowl, how much time do you give him? It can't be this year. They can't fire him this year, right? No, I don't think so. I don't think so. But do you give him one more year? Do you like him? I guess not on a personal level, but do you like the job that he's doing as a coach? I mostly think that, well, it's always hard to argue against Nick Sirianni because then someone just says, look at pro football reference, look at his pro football reference, page. He has the fifth best winning percentage in NFL history. But you know what I was saying last year was that show me where he gives the team an edge.

17:25And people will be like, well, these, the culture CEO coach, like X, Y, and Z. And then they won the Superbowl. So I'm like, all right, I have to shut up because they just won the Superbowl. But now I'm kind of back on that. Show me where he gives the team an edge. Cause it's not what the offense is scheming. I mean, it's the culture. Is it really that great? Or is that just a product of your team wins a lot so that everyone says, hey, the culture is really good and they're really talented. He didn't pick the defensive coordinator and Vic Fangio. Howie Roseman picks all the players. They have an analytics staff already in place.

17:55So there's like all these things that I'm like, I don't know what he's actually responsible for. And just between you and me, like if we're just talking friends here. In my heart of hearts, just my reaction hours after that game, I kind of think this might be the beginning of the end of the Nick Sirianni era. Really? I just don't know that they're going to get back soon enough where he will still be the coach and they'll get back to the Super Bowl. But I could be wrong.

18:22Sheil Kapadia:Can I ask you a question? And I mean this to be connected to Sirianni also and not to change this in a different direction. What's going on with A.J. Brown? Because if the culture is great, A.J. Brown does not seem like he wants to be there. So how great is the culture with A.J. Brown? And also, is it a good culture that he's set up there he has going on around him or is it a good culture because they won the Super Bowl last year great questions we might have to have you on the ringers Philly special because I think these are all valid questions yeah the AJ Brown thing he's been unhappy pretty much the entire season um and you know he got into the little shouting match with Nick Sirianni on the sidelines today I don't know if it's a big deal or not Nick Sirianni was trying to get him off the field but yeah I can't tell you with certainty that AJ Brown's going to be on the Eagles to start the 2026 season He might not be.

19:12You know, they might decide, hey, we don't even throw the football that much. You're unhappy here. Our offense was broken. Maybe we all, we find some trade where we get draft capital in return. You get to go somewhere you like and we all move on after what has been a nice situation here. So yeah, I don't know. Ever since he, you know, he went on with the guy, the Twitch streamer, the guy's name was Janky Rondo. I don't know if you remember that or not. You know, and the guy asked. I missed that one. Yeah, you missed that. That was a big story in Philadelphia. and the guy was asking him, like, how's it going?

19:42He's like, how's it going? Haven't you been paying attention? And that was like the middle of the season. So he was, you know, honest about it. So I don't think the Eagles are going to move on from Sirianni. I think that they're going to make a change at offensive coordinator and basically Howie Roseman and ownership are going to tell Nick Sirianni, here's the guy we're picking to be your offensive coordinator. He's going to take over the offense. It didn't work last year when you picked your guy. And I just don't know who that guy's going to be. You mentioned, is it Mike McDaniel? Is it Cliff Kingsbury?

20:10Is it Todd Munkin? Are other coaches going to get fired? We're all of a sudden like, oh, this guy's available to be an offensive coordinator. He didn't get a head coaching job. So I think that's the thing to watch here with the Eagles in the weeks ahead. All right. Last thing I had to get your opinion on here of this game, Billy. Yeah. Did you see George Kittle, of course, tore his Achilles? Hopefully he has an offseason of recovery and can get back playing for the 49ers. But Diana Rossini tweeted out during the game. She's covering the game. She said a San Francisco 49ers employee just walked into the locker room carrying what appeared to be a bottle of tequila.

20:45Best guess, it's for George Kittle. But then she didn't stop there. She followed up after the game. And she said, here's what I found out. It was Patron Tequila. The bottle was sent from the owner from his suite to Kittle. After Kittle requested it, the bottle is now empty. And so here's what I wanted to ask you, because when I watch these games, I think about, man, these football players are just so different than regular humans. You know, like Josh Allen took, you know, maybe 10 hits in that game, where if I took one of those, I would literally be in the hospital for like at least a year, maybe more than that.

21:25And then I thought of this kiddo thing. And I'm like, I thought the same thing. I was like, if I tore my Achilles and you brought me a glass of tequila and said, here you go, this will cheer you up. And you, by the way, you have to go on a cross country flight in a few hours here because you're going from Philadelphia to Sam. I would think that you're punishing me. Like that is a nightmare at my age to do that if I tear my Achilles. But Billy, maybe you're wrong. What do you think?