DJ Moore Trade! Trent McDuffie Trade! And What Are the Raiders Doing?

19:25Billy Gil:So if you're wondering, why did the Bears make this move? I think that probably has something to do with it. But I love this. I actually really like this for the Bears because they have kind of a well-rounded offense where they've got Roma Dunze, they've got Colston Loveland, they drafted Luther Burden last year. And now they get off this contract that's 24 million per year for a player who wasn't like a defining player for them last year. And to get a second round pick, I mean, if you would have told me a week ago, DJ Moore's being traded, I would not have said he's getting a second round pick unless like the Bears were eating part of that salary.

20:00Billy Gil:So that's a nice job, I think, by the Chicago Bears.

20:03Sheil Kapadia:Well, like to all of your points, Colton Loveland led them in receiving last year. So he - As a rookie, yeah. As a rookie. And they have Roma Dunze who put up essentially the same numbers that DJ Moore did at like one fourth, one fifth, not even more than that, like one 10th of the price because he's still on his rookie deal. At a certain point, you're going to have to make a decision on him and you can't be paying him what wide receivers are getting paid if you're paying DJ more. So do you get rid of the younger guy? Do you get rid of the older guy? They made what seems to have been the wise decision there.

20:37Sheil Kapadia:Can we go back to QB school for a second? Yeah, sure. Because I have a question. So is QB school kind of like your model now that you're getting into the sports NFL influencing game?

20:46Billy Gil:Oh, no, I can't get to that level. No, and that's long. That's kind of long form. Like he'll do half an hour, hour. I'm trying to reach the kids, Billy. Yeah, I got you. Not under two minutes. Now, the one I did on the Trent McDuffie trade, that was hard to get it to three minutes, a little too long. Again, I think the younger generation probably tuned out of that bad boy, but we're going to work harder. What do you think? Two minutes, 90 seconds. Are you a scroller? How do I get your attention? If you're my audience, what do I need to do?

21:15Sheil Kapadia:I am a scroller, but I come from an AM radio background where time spent listening. TSL was like a very big metric back in the day. So you have to kind of keep it like entertaining. So if you're going to go long, you're going to have to. I know if your daughter seems to be your social media manager. Yeah, she is. Maybe your daughter can kind of throw in some graphics that pop in here or there, some flashes, something to kind of keep the eyes moving around and keep me intrigued. Oh, what's you going to do next? What's happening next?

21:44Billy Gil:You know what I was thinking? Like this one, I just did sitting in my chair in my office. Like I said, I thought maybe, remember you and I talked smoothies a few weeks ago? Yeah. I thought maybe, you know, Sheil making his breakfast smoothie while giving you some NFL analysis, that may have a chance to go viral. Okay.

22:02Sheil Kapadia:How about this? How about this? Sheil daily, or you try every couple of days at the beginning, eventually it'll become daily, right? Okay. But you just become like the smoothie guy, right? where you're there and it's like focused in on the blender, the camera, like it starts with you, but then we focus in on the blender and then you're throwing in the ingredients that make this a good story. So like you'll throw in like some kale or banana or whatever it is into your smoothie. But like, yeah, but the spinach is actually represented by information for the story of why it makes it an interesting story.

22:36Sheil Kapadia:So you're just in there and then you blend and then you take a sip and like, that's a good story. Okay. You can keep that. You can use that. All right. I was trying to picture it.

22:49Billy Gil:I think there's something there. I don't know that we've nailed it, but I do think maybe we got to a place where let's brains, let's get created. I don't want to be afraid to fail.

22:58Sheil Kapadia:Yeah. No, you got to take a lot of big risk in the influencing game. That's what I've learned. Big risk, big rewards. Also, if I learned anything from Mr. Beast, it's that you're going to put up 100, 200, 300 videos out there before you really start gaining the traction. So don't be afraid to fail and know that it's going to take a minute. Like you're going to have a lot of those. It has to become a passion project for you. And you have to understand that you're not going to get the following that you want right away. But eventually one day will come, one video will come and that'll be your breakthrough.

23:30Sheil Kapadia:And then it'll all take off and change your life.

23:33Billy Gil:Okay, so be a volume shooter. Yeah, yeah. You got, you just,

23:36Sheil Kapadia:consistency is key. Lots of volume. Okay. Lots of consistency. People know exactly where and when to get the videos. Can I ask you a question? Because I sense you want to move on, but I want you to teach me something as the resident nerd here. So what was it? Yards per route run was the metric. So is there like, as players get older, do their yards per route run typically get more concise or fall off? Because I would think that as you're getting older, if you want your value to remain the same, you'd have to get more precise with your route running. And with experience, I would think that you'd get sharper with route running.

24:13Sheil Kapadia:Or as players get older, does it fall off or is there no correlation there?

24:17Billy Gil:I think wide receiver play in general, and again, yards per route run is an efficiency thing. I think it generally declines as you get older. Like we were having this conversation with Austin Gale earlier this season where I said, the closer you are to the ball, the less worried I am about your age. So like a guard who's 32, that's cool. You can still be a guard at your 32. When you're a wide receiver and you're 32, typically in the NFL, the decline has already started or the decline is coming. And route running in general, I don't know that guys get better at that when they're 29 years old. I feel like DJ Moore's had a lot of time in the NFL with different coaches.

24:56Billy Gil:I don't know that that's something he's going to all of a sudden be great at but again I don't think it needs to be because I think there are things he does well that fit Josh Allen fit the bills and that even though what we're saying that I wouldn't have done this trade it sounds like you wouldn't have done this trade I still think DJ Moore can be a good player for them next year and that they can contend for a Super Bowl

25:17Sheil Kapadia:if I was the Bears I would have done this trade in a second I agree with that what's that like send that over right now like we're good Yeah.

25:24Billy Gil:I'm with you. All right, let's take a break. We come back. We got another trade to get to, the Trent McDuffie trade. When you want your spring break to feel like, and your kid's pool day to feel like, and your hotel bed to feel like, ooh, and room service to feel like, because at Hilton, hospitality feels like,

25:49Sheil Kapadia:your cabana's ready. Would you like fresh towels?

25:51Billy Gil:It matters where you stay. Book now at Hilton.com. Hilton, for this day. All right, we're back here on the Ringer NFL Show. All right, so let's continue this theme of nerds versus, not even versus every man, but nerd and every man, let's say. You know, we're not going against each other. So the Chiefs trade Trent McDuffie to the Rams for a 2026 first round pick, number 29 overall, a fifth, a sixth, and a 2027 third. And Billy, the nerds really liked this trade for the Chiefs because they said, you know what? They got a haul. They got a lot of draft picks. They're going to be able to fill all these holes on their roster.

26:39Billy Gil:This is a nice move for the Chiefs. Do you agree? Do you like this for the Chiefs? Do you like this for the Rams? What was your initial take when you saw this trade go down?

26:49Sheil Kapadia:I think the everyman opinion that's out there is they also like this for the Chiefs because they're crediting Brett Veach with doing it, saying this is a guy that's done this before. He knows when to get rid of people too early versus too late. If you can get a haul and you have someone that's out there willing to pay you a ton for someone, you make the move. I mean, it's a situation where I think Trent McDuffie has, what, a year left on his deal, so he may end up leaving anyway. So here it is. You're getting a bunch of picks for him. Maybe you can rebuild. The Chiefs are in a weird spot. Everybody's comparing this to the Tyreek Hill trade a couple years ago, which is also interesting because I believe the Chiefs' official position on Tyreek Hill, if I'm not misremembering it, was they were monitoring that situation or monitoring him or something like that.

27:33Sheil Kapadia:Oh, this offseason, you're saying? Yeah, this offseason.

27:36Billy Gil:Yeah, it felt like Andy Reid didn't want to say there's no way he's coming back here, but he didn't want to come out and just say that. So he was like, yeah, we're checking it out, but nothing happening right now.

27:45Sheil Kapadia:Which is a weird like, yeah, we're monitoring the Tyreek Hill. It's like, okay, cool. Like, whatever. Like, we don't need an official stance on this. It's fine. You can just say, like, we're looking into everyone. But everybody credited the Chiefs with that. They got rid of Tyreek Hill. A lot of people said, wow, Tyreek Hill is gone. He was like the heartbeat of this offense. What is Patrick Mahomes going to look like without Tyreek Hill? How are they still going to have this high-power offense? And their offense somewhat, like, fell off a little bit in the latter portion, like the last two years in particular without Tyreek Hill.

28:15Sheil Kapadia:but we saw they were able to just kind of build out their defense was able to lead them to Super Bowl. So they were able to figure it out. So I guess you have to give them the benefit of the doubt in this one too, right? You would assume we don't, we still don't have like an official Travis Kelsey decision yet. Right. Unless I don't think so.

28:34Billy Gil:I think the buzz is it sounds like he's going to come back, but I don't think there's anything official.

28:38Sheil Kapadia:Well, I did see, and I don't know if you're aware of this. I did see that an official wedding date was released for Travis Kelsey and Taylor Swift's wedding this off season. Are you aware of that? I was not aware of that.

28:51Billy Gil:What do we have? When are they getting married?

28:53Sheil Kapadia:I believe it is mid-June. June 13th, I believe, is the official date for Travis Kelsey and Taylor Swift's wedding at the Ocean House Resort in Rhode Island. So I don't know if you already had.

29:07Billy Gil:The venue is out there too, huh? Do you think we'll be invited? I don't think we'll be invited.

29:14Sheil Kapadia:I do wonder if there were people that had reservations at this, if this is indeed the location of the wedding. I wonder if there are people that just coincidentally had reservations there. They're like, oh my gosh, like we're, we're going to, we're going to like, do I sneak a peek? Like I had a balcony. Do I stand out on the balcony and try to see what's going on? Like, what do I do here?

29:35Billy Gil:I would think that gets shut down to anybody who's not a guest. I don't think there's random people staying there, right?

29:40Sheil Kapadia:That can't be the case. I'm with you. I feel like they have enough power where you like get, you get some sort of email, like, you know, a week or two before the, the, this news came out and it's like, oh, we regret to inform you. Like we have to cancel your booking, you know, maintenance or, you know, pipers, whatever. And like, oh, wow. Like, thank goodness. We're not going where they're going to have all this renovation. And then you turn on the news. You're like, what? Like we had our vacation to Rhode Island was canceled because of Travis Kelsey and Taylor Swift. Like this isn't what I was.

30:10Sheil Kapadia:So anyways, we've gotten way off topic. So the Chiefs are in a position where, you know, Patrick got injured at the end of last season. We'll see if he comes back and he's himself this season, right? But Travis is aging. The team is not looking like the juggernaut that they look like. If you have someone who's going to give you a first, fifth, and a sixth, and a third rounder next year for a guy that you seemingly might only have one year left with him on your roster like yeah he's great but you can also fast forward this mini rebuild if you will by getting rid of him knowing you know maybe our original window is closing but that doesn't mean that a new one can't open up next season or two seasons from now so why delay the inevitable instead of just embracing it getting rid of a name getting all of these picks and then we can kind of accelerate when the next window starts to open.

31:07Billy Gil:Yeah, I think their window is always open with Mahomes. Like, you know, we're never going to go into a season where he's the quarterback, I don't think, and be like, they got no shot this year, the Chiefs. You know, you're kind of never going to say that. So you laid it out well. I think that is the thought process that we have some holes on the roster. We got to rebuild them with younger players on rookie contracts. But I sort of feel like they're overthinking it. I think it's different than Tyreek Hill. Tyreek Hill was like 29 years old. He's got a heinous off-field track record. It's a very different situation.

31:41Billy Gil:Trent McDuffie's only 25 years old. And I feel like most NFL teams, this has been true for decades, is the whole basis of building a team is you draft, develop, and retain the players. And that's number one. That's the foundation of your team. Draft, develop, retain. And I don't think the Chiefs have a lot of great players. And so when I look at a cornerback who's 25 years old, who has played, you know, has had all pro seasons for them, I look at it and say, why don't you just extend him? You know, and I don't want to hear that like, oh, we can't pay him salary cap. It's like, I really don't think that's true.

32:18Billy Gil:I think they choose not to, not to pay Trent McDuffie. And so they got something for him. I get it. It could work out. But I also, I just feel like the whole point of the draft is to get players like Trent McDuffie, who are all pro caliber players at premium positions and don't have a lot of holes. And that's Trent McDuffie. And again, he's not old. He's still in his prime. His best football could be ahead of him in the next three or four years. So I don't love it from their perspective. And I actually love it from the Rams perspective, Billy. I really like it because I think everyone's looking at it going, Matthew Stafford's in his late thirties.

32:54Billy Gil:This is an all in win now move. And that's kind of true. Like they were bad at cornerback last year and he's going to help them out right away. And I think they have a chance to win a Superbowl this year, but it's not just a win now move. Cause what I said, he's only 25 years old. Like even if Matthew Stafford retires after next season, they've got a number one cornerback for at least the next three or four years, who's going to be able to play at a really high level. So I like it from that perspective. And then, you know, less need. Remember the F them picks thing? Was it the parade he wore the shirt?

33:24Billy Gil:Yeah. So there was always that with the first round picks where he's like, we are going to trade all our first round picks and get players. That's what we're going to do. But then he would always in the later rounds or the middle rounds, get more picks. Like he would move back or he would. So it didn't end up like, oh my gosh, the Rams only drafted four players. They would actually end up drafting a lot of players. And I think he'll be able to do that here where he can maneuver in the draft and get some of that draft capital back. So this is one of those where I say, I would have done this if I were the Rams.

33:55Billy Gil:I would have said, let's be aggressive and go for it. And if I'm the Chiefs, I would have said, Brett, listen, my friend, I understand what you're trying to do here. I don't think we should do this. I understand what you're doing. But if I'm voting, I'm a no on this trade.

34:09Sheil Kapadia:Well, that kind of is the question too, is when do you eventually miss on one of these moves? You know, like when is it that you have hit so many times? Like I could just recreate this every time. Like I'm just the smartest person out there and I can take Trent McDuffie at 21st overall pick and I'll trade him for a 29th overall pick and a fifth round and a sixth round and a third round next year. And I can, I'm just always going to hit. Like I'm never going to miss on these. At what point does it like, are you no longer like, stop being cute. Like we hit on one. let's not get rid of our hits when we have other holes that we need to fill to your point.

34:46Sheil Kapadia:And let's try to build around our hits instead of selling off our hits and hoping we just keep hitting again and again.

34:52Billy Gil:Especially when you look at what they got, like I felt like people were going overboard with what they got because, you know, on like an Adam Schefter tweet, it's four different picks and now, oh my gosh, they got four picks, but like a fifth and a sixth rounder. I mean, the chances of hitting on that are very low. I'm not saying it's not good to have those picks. It's good to have those, but like you're probably not going to hit on a starting caliber player in the fifth or sixth round. And then it's the 29th overall pick in the first round where I feel like we always do this with, oh, it's a first round pick.

35:24Billy Gil:Like the 13th pick is very different than the 29th pick, you know, and then it's a 20, 27 third. So now they have these charts where you can add up all the draft capital and be like, what's it actually worth? And I think the one I was looking at, it's like, it's one mid-round, mid-first round pick is really what this entire package amounts to. And you look at Sauce Gardner, I mean, the Jets got two first round picks, including one that's what, the 13th pick in this year's draft. And next year, that could be a top half of the first round type pick. So to me, I know Sauce Gardner is a better player than Trent McDuffie, but I feel like the Jets got way more for Sauce Gardner than the Chiefs ended up getting here for Trent McDuffie.

36:07Sheil Kapadia:I'm worried about the Colts and Chris Ballard, if I'm going to be honest with you.

36:10Billy Gil:I'm not even worried. I just know this is going to go bad.

36:14Sheil Kapadia:Yeah, yeah. Speaking of windows, last year, they should have capitalized on that. Obviously, you can't control Daniel Jones getting injured, but that might have been your best shot with this situation.

36:28Billy Gil:Yeah, I think it probably was. Now they're out two first-round picks. Now they're transition tagging Daniel Jones. Now Alec Pierce is out there saying, I'm going to test free agency, and if they possibly lose him, that's kind of a disastrous run.

36:42Sheil Kapadia:And Sauce did nothing for them. The Sauce trade was a total disaster of the trade.

36:47Billy Gil:Yeah, I guess small sample. If you're a Colts fan, you're saying he'll be good next year. But yeah, it certainly didn't make that much of a deal. You know what I forgot to ask you about with the DJ Moore thing is this Brandon Bean run. Bill, like this is kind of a very interesting. Most of the time, NFL GMs are pretty boring. He's been on this run where last offseason, he yells at the radio host for saying he needs a wide receiver. Yeah. Then they have their season. He's looking for a wide receiver at the trade deadline. Can't find one. They lose in the playoffs. Sean McDermott's delivering little jabs in his press conferences.

37:20Billy Gil:is like, oh, the Jaguars got Jacoby Myers. Would have been nice to have that. Then he wins the power struggle over Sean McDermott. He gets promoted after their season ends in disappointment. His owner's coming out saying, I'm sticking up for Brandon Bean. He didn't want Keon Coleman. Then he does the Sean Payton thing where he's like, he's like, what did he say? He's like, oh, Sean Payton's not calling the place anymore. He does it at the combine. And now he's probably going to get ripped for this pick for DJ Moore. What a calendar year for Brandon Bean.

37:50Sheil Kapadia:A little too much Brandon Bean. Brandon, buddy, we want less of you. You know what I mean? If we're talking about you, that's a problem because things probably aren't... If we're not focusing on the players and we're focused on you, things are not going the way they should, in theory, be going if everything's working according to plan.

38:06Billy Gil:Yeah, you're right. He should kind of go into hiding, probably, a little bit.

38:11Sheil Kapadia:You know who he needs to be more like? Vince Carter. You know Vince Carter's a minority owner for the Buffalo Bills? Is that true? Yeah. Yeah. You know, no, I had no idea. You know how I know that? Because on hard knocks, the Buffalo bills last season, they were just kind of like, they were showing everything and the bills go to like this little college where they kind of like all are there for camp.

38:35Billy Gil:John's Fisher or something, whatever it is.

38:37Sheil Kapadia:And they kind of like take over this college, which is probably like a huge inconvenience for the residents of that area in the college. But like, then they were going, I think it was like before a preseason game or something. and Vince Carter is there and he's talking to someone and he was, I don't remember exactly the context, but I feel like he was talking about how like Josh throws the ball or something. It was like something like technical on the offensive end and Vince Carter is walking someone through it. And I was looking, I was like, is that Vince Carter? And it was. And then it said like at the bottom screen, Vince Carter, minority owner, Buffalo Bills.

39:11Sheil Kapadia:I was like, wait, what's happening now?

39:14Billy Gil:I had no idea. Yeah. Is it not that hard to become a minority owner of a professional sports franchise? Like if you and I really wanted to do it, do you think we could do it?

39:23Sheil Kapadia:No, because, well, you may be one day. If these videos take off for you and you become the influencer, maybe. Because I don't know if it's still the case, but there was a time that the Williams sisters were minority owners and the Dolphins.

39:38Billy Gil:I think that's still true. I think they are too.

39:40Sheil Kapadia:And I think Mark Anthony, the musician, was. And I think Jimmy Buffett may have had some sort of stake in the Dolphins. He had some sort of arrangement with his beer company in the Dolphins. So like, if you're famous, there's always going to be an ownership group that's like, yeah, we'll cut you off like a little 1 % here, like a 0.5 % ownership in exchange for, we just want to hang out with you a little bit. Like, give us like$3 million or whatever. And we'll give you like something worth way more than that, just so that you can hang out with us and we can be friends with you. But I don't know about commoners like you and I, if we ever will be.

40:13Billy Gil:I feel like you've really helped me plan out the next maybe 20 to 25 years of my life here. Hit on the videos, you know, take a lot of shots. Then they start blowing up. Then the money starts trickling in. And then I'm kind of hosting like it's like a bidding war for my services to be a minority owner for your professional sports franchise. And I'm going to bring you along. I want you to know I'm not going to forget about you. I appreciate that.

40:39Sheil Kapadia:Do you have your eyes on anyone or just your, your for sale? Anyone that becomes available?

40:44Billy Gil:Yeah. I was just thinking about that. No, I don't, I don't know that I would have a top five right now at, uh, at this point. I mean, the Phillies would be nice. Cause I do like going to Phillies games. Okay.

40:55Sheil Kapadia:I mean, but maybe, maybe you play it, you know, like Tom Brady, where he just wants to get into ownership and then the Raiders become an option and say, you know what? Like, let's go to Las Vegas. I can do the Raiders, I suppose. because when am I, if not, when am I getting a chance? Look, look at Alex Rodriguez. I mean, now we're all over the place in different sports, but Alex Rodriguez wanted to get into baseball ownership forever. And he just couldn't get with a group that ever landed a team. He tried down here in Miami, Jeter outbid him. And then what does he do? He ends up with the Minnesota Timberwolves.

41:25Sheil Kapadia:So now he's up there and like, he seems to have a home in Minnesota. He's spending time there. Speaking of influencers, he'll do videos where it's like, he seemingly is spending a lot of time in Minnesota. He goes to these games. And now look, he's in a great spot. Team ownership, Minnesota Timberwolves, probably not on his top five when he was getting into the ownership game, but that's what became available to him. I think that's what we need to do. We need to just, whoever becomes available to us, like we're down to contribute in any way possible.

41:53Billy Gil:I was just gonna say, if you are part of an ownership group and you would like our services, you know how to reach us here on the Ringer NFL show. And you know what, Billy just mentioned Tom Brady. Great tease. We're going to take a break. We're going to come back because there are some things happening with the Las Vegas Raiders that we got to talk about. All right, we're back here on the Ringer NFL show. All right, another story in the NFL this week, Billy. This is from Michael Silver of The Athletic. It says, Max Crosby is ready to leave Las Vegas. And so before we get to the Raiders aspect of this, to your point earlier about this whole thing's a puzzle, the Bears seem to be getting some buzz about, oh, they traded DJ Moore.

42:36Billy Gil:They got the additional second round pick. They opened up some cap space. Could they potentially be the Max Crosby team? That would be interesting to me if they were able to land. Okay. He's closing his eyes. He's picturing the uniform. It's a cold day at Soldier Field or whatever their new stadium is going to be in Indiana, whatever that's called. And Max Crosby's out there saying, I dreamt about playing in Indiana my entire career. And now I'm here playing for the Chicago Bears. Could you picture that, Billy, when you closed your eyes?

43:06Sheil Kapadia:I could picture him at Soldier Field. In Indiana, I'm having a little more trouble. That's a crime. I agree. How is this happening? How is this allowed? At what point is an adult going to step in and say, hey, we need to fix this situation. We cannot have the Bears move to Indiana. We can't allow this, Sheel.

43:29Billy Gil:Well, you know, when that news broke, I had PTI on later that day. And Will Bond's just like, this isn't going to happen. He's like, they're not going to, this is all, you know, conjecture and politics and they're not moving to Indiana. So I'm like, all right, I hope he's right. And they end up just staying in Chicago. I think he's wrong though. You do? You actually think they're going to go to Indiana?

43:48Sheil Kapadia:I can't see it, but I also, I guess, can see it. Follow the money. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, if Chicago's not going to give them what they want and they find Indiana and it's not too far away, you can talk yourself into it. But where's the loyalty? How are you taking this team out of Chicago? Imagine the Cubs leaving Chicago. You can't have that.

44:13Billy Gil:During my beat writer days, that was one of my favorite trips was to Chicago because it's downtown. You can walk from various hotels downtown to the stadium. It's right on the water. I thought it was awesome going to Soldier Field. I loved going to games there. So we'll see.

44:28Sheil Kapadia:I like Soldier Field too. I like how you still have the, you know, the facade of the old stadium around it and you have it built inside and then, you know, you've upgraded the suites or whatever. But I mean, if it's going to be an outdoor stadium, if you're going to put a dome, it takes away the charm of Soldier Field. If it's going to be an outdoor stadium, keep it at Soldier Field. I don't like this. I don't like this one bit, Shield. We'll see. For someone who doesn't have, you know, So a horse in this race, I still don't like this very much.

44:57Billy Gil:Yeah, I'm with you. For me, as someone who knows nothing about politics and city planning and what goes into building a new stadium, I also don't like it because I liked walking from a hotel to Soldier Field. So let's see what happens with that throughout the rest of the offseason. We'll see if Max Crosby ends up on the Chicago Bears. The reports, Billy, are that the Raiders still want two firsts and a player for Max Crosby, the Micah Parsons deal. But you know what? I read you the headline and it was about Max Crosby. But then the most interesting part I thought about the reporting there from Michael Silver had nothing to do with Crosby and was more about Alex Guerrero, a name from our past with Tom Brady.

45:40Billy Gil:Did you catch that part of the article?

45:42Sheil Kapadia:I did see that part of it. There's two interesting parts. One for me was Max Crosby related. The other was Alex Guerrero. We could go back to Max after. the Alex Guerrero of it how is this still a thing like how is he his whole thing was he was like Tom's like fitness guru TB12 he got him in shape when he was you know in New England and then Tom kind of like maybe I don't want to use this in an accusatory fashion but maybe involved some of his you know teammates in this do we want to call it like a multi-level marketing situation where he brings in a couple players and they bring in a couple players.

46:25Sheil Kapadia:Who's to say? I don't know the exact arrangement. Did it seem like maybe there was some sort of potentially, some might say, not me, I would never. Some might say some sort of scam going on there with Alex Guerrero. Again, not me. I would never say that. Might some say that? They might. They might say that that's what was going on with him, but he was his health guru. Tom, while he may still want to be healthy for his own life and longevity and possibly vanity purposes, there's no need, I don't think, for his dietician or health guru to be involved in the everyday dealings of the Las Vegas Raiders.

47:07Sheil Kapadia:And seemingly, according to this article, unless I completely misunderstood it, Tom's just hanging out in Florida in his very fancy house in Florida. And then he's flying around to do his stuff for Fox. I guess occasionally he'll pop in at Vegas and he'll do stuff, but Alex Guerrero seems to be his boots on the ground guy in Las Vegas and is firmly implanted with the Raiders. He's doing something with strength and conditioning, maybe, but he's also walking around like he owns the place. And he's telling people, hey, you might not have a job sometimes. And it's like, whoa, like I sell tickets here.

47:39Sheil Kapadia:Like, what do you have to do with me at all? But he's just going around doing whatever he wants there and kind of rubbing some people the wrong way. And I can't believe he's still around.

47:49Billy Gil:As you were describing it, I was like, this actually is an even crazier story and a bigger story than I think it's even getting headlines for. Like, this is outrageous, it sounds like, what's happening. Let me read the details, Billy, for people who haven't read the articles. It says, like many players and coaches, Crosby was frustrated by the presence of Alex Guerrero, a staunch Brady ally whose official title is wellness coordinator. That's another one you and I could get on that. I think we can be minority owners. And I feel like now that we have that information from Chris Long that we got during the Super Bowl, I think we could be wellness coordinators too, perhaps.

48:28Sheil Kapadia:Well, you also, I feel like if you throw in the word wellness, people are a little bit hesitant to push back on that in any way, right? Because like wellness is this mental wellness. Like, I don't want to question anyone's mental wellness. I'm sure this is something that he's doing that's very important. Is it health wellness? Like, again, I don't want to question that. So as soon as you throw wellness in his title, I feel like that somewhat disarms a certain group of people who would normally say like, hey, we need to like, let's push back on this a little bit. It's like, well, I mean, Tom is a minority owner here.

49:01Sheil Kapadia:And, you know, it seems as though he's Mark Davis is letting him do whatever he wants. And he's only owns a small portion of the team. Mark's like, hey, Tom, do whatever you want. Like Chip Kelly. Yeah, we'll sign him for, you know, a ton of money and then fire him. And then when we all we have to pay four coaches at the same time, like, OK, Tom, if you want Alex Guerrero. Yeah. Like whatever. At what point did Mark Davis stop caring? I guess when they got to Las Vegas, he's like, I won. Like, we're good here. I'm just going to kind of ride this out and I'll sell eventually or I won't. But either way, like I'm set now.

49:30Sheil Kapadia:I don't have to worry about the Coliseum. I don't have to worry about the finances. Like we're good.

49:34Billy Gil:Yeah. He was like, I'm going to hand the keys over to Brady. And then to your point, Brady hands the keys over to Guerrero because it says Guerrero, who regularly attends practices and meetings, purports to possess significant organizational power, informing players of impending transactions and even indicating to staff members who don't follow his instructions that their jobs may be at risk. It says Guerrero is perceived to have a direct pipeline to Brady, who lives in Florida and serves as Fox's lead NFL analyst, limiting his in-person presence. Suffice it to say that there are trust issues permeating the Raiders training facility in Henderson, Nevada.

50:15Billy Gil:Because I was thinking about this, Billy. Max Crosby lasted through, you know, Josh McDaniels and Antonio Pierce and Besaccia. And I think he was there for Gruden still as well. like all these different regimes and the team's never really successful. And what was, it was just consistent. Crosby's like, I want to be a Raider. I want to be here when we get good. And like Guerrero is the guy. It sounds like not just, maybe not just Guerrero, you know, they asked Crosby to go home last year at the end of the year so that they could tank. But it sounds like Guerrero is part of the reason where Crosby's now is like, no, I'm good.

50:50Billy Gil:I want to be out of here. Have you read Guerrero's Wikipedia page? It's one of the wildest things I've ever seen. Can I read you one passage here?

50:58Sheil Kapadia:Please do.

50:59Billy Gil:In 2005, Guerrero was sanctioned by the U.S. Federal Trade Commission for falsely presenting himself as a doctor and claiming to be able to cure cancer, AIDS, multiple sclerosis, diabetes, arthritis, and Parkinson's disease using a dietary supplement called Supreme Greens. He had made these claims in infomercials on the channel Spike TV and WeTV. I mean, so I was thinking what you were thinking. Like if I'm a Raiders player and it's like, oh, this guy Guerrero who's coming over is like threatening or saying I might get cut. And then I go home and I'm like, I think I've heard this guy's name before.

51:37Billy Gil:You know, you tell your wife, hey, can you Google Alex Guerrero? And then this comes up, like how is this franchise supposed to compete with actually well-functioning franchises with like GMs and proper power structures? Like I always say NFL teams are not well-run organizations, But this is like a step beyond not being a well-run organization.

51:58Sheil Kapadia:So I have a question, I guess, about what the FTC sanctioned him for.

52:03Billy Gil:Yeah.

52:04Sheil Kapadia:I feel like you shouldn't claim that you could cure any of those diseases with a supplement, especially if you can't, right? But much less cure all of those diseases. Like if you cured any one of them, you would be heralded as, you know, like a hero to humanity. Like of our time. Yeah.

52:26Billy Gil:The most important human of our time, probably.

52:29Sheil Kapadia:Exactly right. Like this is, these are diseases that people have been aiming to cure forever. And like, this is a guy that is not just prolonging and improving quality of life for some patients that have them. He's cured them. And then he said, I've cured all of them with this one supplement. And you can buy it on Spike TV. like that is a wild thing to claim and path to go down but i guess if you're gonna if you're gonna claim you can cure cancer i guess why not also claim that you can cure ms right because like yeah why why not go off the deep end stop there is his thinking i suppose can i say something that so there's a one max crosby thing that i took away from the story but also in talking this out with you and like the facts that were revealed in the story unrelated to Max Crosby.

53:16Sheil Kapadia:We were done dirty last season. And I believe we were done dirty last season by ESPN, if I remember the timeline correctly.

53:26Billy Gil:Wow.

53:27Sheil Kapadia:And what I'm saying and what I'm accusing them of doing us dirty on, do you remember the game that the Raiders, I believe, were playing in Monday Night Football? So I don't remember who the opponent was, but I think the Raiders were playing Monday night football. And the story of that game was they continued to show Tom Brady up in the coach's booth. And he continued to have the headset on. And then that's really when last season people really picked up the steam and they were asking players on other teams like, well, hold on, look, he's actively in there and he's coaching the guys and he has a headset on and he's going in there and he's having these meetings with the other players.

54:05Sheil Kapadia:Is it fair? But we never saw it in person because he has the Fox game on Sundays and because of the Raiders, most of the games that they were playing were on Sundays. So we never saw him at an actual Raiders game as a minority owner. So on that Monday night game, we saw him as a Raiders minority owner and he was in the coaching suite. He had the headset on and we're like, whoa, this guy is like very hands-on and very involved. We had never considered it because we never saw it. But this article is completely removing that film and saying like, no, he's never actually there. He's always just like in Florida.

54:39Sheil Kapadia:And Guerrero is the one that's really telling him what's going on. So we were kind of presented a false representation of Tom Brady's involvement, I think.

54:50Billy Gil:I don't know about that because then there was Chip I don't know if you remember this, I think it was Chip Kelly or Geno Smith or one of them was like I talked to Tom Brady multiple times a week to go over game planning and stuff. So I actually don't think, I think he is involved. I think he's very involved. Get out there. Get out there, Tom. Yeah, I think he's pulling all the strings for what happens with the Raiders. I don't think he's in Vegas often. I mean, this lays it out. He's got different people. He's got Guerrero handling business. He needs handling Vegas. He's making calls what he needs to call.

55:24Billy Gil:The funniest part of that story you described is that Tom Brady was giving the Raiders some kind of edge. Like he's a disaster in this. I mean, giving him an edge. He's got Guerrero out there, you know, making decisions on the ground and they look like a horribly run franchise. all due respect to the Las Vegas Raiders.

55:42Sheil Kapadia:Did you see in that article also was made reference, and I'm sure you probably knew this, but for those who were not familiar with it, where Chip Kelly was there and it was making references, like, yeah, Chip Kelly, a lot of times, like at halftime, wouldn't even leave the coaching suite. He'd just stay there and he'd send his assistants to address the team and discuss the second half adjustments. Like, he didn't want to go down, so he just stayed up there in the suite the whole time.

56:04Billy Gil:I'm sticking up for Chip Kelly here, okay? Oh, okay. So, halftime's what, 15 minutes? and he might want to get something to eat, you know? No.

56:15Sheil Kapadia:It's the NFL. You don't get a lunch break. What are we doing?

56:18Billy Gil:He at least has to go to the bathroom, I would imagine. Last thing you want is fourth quarter. You got to call a big third down play, and all you're thinking about is, oh, I got to hold this in. I mean, he's not a young man. You know, that becomes harder with older age. And so maybe he's saying, by the time I get the elevator, go to the bathroom, wash my hands, and then get out, like it would probably be easier. This is why we have these assistant coaches. They're probably in their 20s, early 30s. I can just tell them, hey, go tell, you know, Geno Smith, let's do more of this. Go tell Ashton Gentry, we'll do more of this.

56:51Billy Gil:You know, next year when we have Ashton Gentry at the Super Bowl, we should revisit this with him, I think.

56:56Sheil Kapadia:You know what I'm wondering, just in you talking now, why is it that we never see Vic Fangio just with like a plate of chips in front of him up in, you know, the suite, like the coaching suite? Because they're up there. Like you can have a bottle of water. Why not a little snack here and there? You know, when your team doesn't have the ball or it's not your side on the field, like why not have a little snack? You mentioned the eating and I said, you know, there's no lunch break on the job, but you know, you made a good point. Why not? Why not? Why can't he be snacking on some cookies? Who cares?

57:24Billy Gil:You know, the executives for the teams, they share the same sort of meal area as the media. So during my, you know, again, my beat writer days, when I'm at a game, sometimes you're in line trying to get a cookie. and I vividly remember being, it was a cookie line. Me and Scott Pioli, you remember him? We're in line and there's a guy up there at the cookie table, like taking forever. Like he can't decide, does he want the chocolate chip? Does he want the macadamia nut? Does he want the oatmeal raisin? Of course not, no one ever picks the oatmeal raisin first, but he's up there taking a long time.

57:57Billy Gil:And Pioli looked at me, I look at him and we're like, what's the deal with this guy? So I don't think I've ever spoken to Scott Pioli, but ever since that day, I felt like we share a connection. So yeah, the executives are up there eating. I think the coaches maybe before the game, sometimes they'll grab something. But once the game starts, you're right. You're probably right. There is no lunch break. It's like we can get through three hours and eat afterwards.

58:18Sheil Kapadia:What did Pioli go with? Which cookie? Do you remember?

58:20Billy Gil:I don't. I would, it's probably the chocolate chip, right? You don't want to overthink things. It's like we were saying with trading Trent McDuffie. You don't need to overthink things. You know what you like. You got something good. You don't need to bring mystery into the equation, I would say.

58:33Sheil Kapadia:Can I tell you my favorite part of the story that we haven't gotten to yet?

58:36Billy Gil:What better way to finish the podcast than this? Yeah, please.

58:39Sheil Kapadia:Max Crosby just disregarded red jerseys and was hitting quarterbacks in practice. And the coaches didn't do anything about it. Like, Max wants to hit the quarterback. He's going to hit the quarterback.

58:50Billy Gil:Yeah, that was funny. That was part of the story. Because what happens is if somebody who's not of Max Crosby stature, and you have a star quarterback, if they get even close to him, never will a coach yell louder or be more irate than when like the guy who's maybe on the fringe to make the roster all of a sudden gets in the way your star quarterback and he kind of stumbles a little bit they're just like all right you're out of here yeah get this guy off my field practice

59:18Sheil Kapadia:squad or you're cut entirely what are you doing hitting the quarterback or touching the quarterback and Max just had coach after coach after coach that just tolerated him going through and making contact with the quarterback in the red jersey.

59:33Billy Gil:Something to keep an eye on. He can't be doing that to Caleb Williams. I don't think Ben Johnson would stand for that, but maybe he would. Maybe he'd say it's, you know.

59:40Sheil Kapadia:Ben seems crazy, if we're going to be honest with you. Yeah, he seems a little crazy. If we're not going to mince words, yeah, Ben seems a little bit, you know, he's missing a couple screws. Yeah.

59:47Billy Gil:In a very entertaining way. I agree with you. All right. That was great. I mean, we had other little stuff we can get to, We got more podcasts to fill this offseason. We don't need to hit on everything now. It's a very newsy time right now in the NFL. So we could be back at any moment. Maybe there's an A.J. Brown trade. Maybe there's a Max Crosby trade. Maybe there's a trade we're not even thinking of right now. And then, of course, everything gets started. Next week, Monday, is the start of the negotiating period. We're going to be doing a bunch of content on the Ringer NFL show next week. And of course, as Billy alluded to, maybe you'll see me making a smoothie on the Ringer NFL show, Instagram, YouTube, TikTok.

1:00:27Billy Gil:Who knows? Who knows what's in store for us in the weeks ahead? His name is Billy Gil. Thank you to Billy. Thank you to Christopher Sutton for producing and Stefano Sanchez on video. My name's Shiel Kapadia. We will be back soon on the Ringer NFL show.

1:00:52Billy Gil:21 plus and present in select states for Kansas in affiliation with Kansas Star Casino or 18 plus and present in DC, Kentucky or Wyoming gambling problem. Call 1-800-GAMBLER or 1-800-MY-RESET. Call 1-888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org slash chat in Connecticut or visit mdgamblinghelp.org in Maryland. Hope is here. Visit gamblinghelplinema.org or call 800-327-5050 for 24-7 support in Massachusetts or call 1-877-8HOPENY or text HOPENY in New York. For Louisiana, call 1-877-770-7867.