Game of the Year! Seahawks' Stunner Over Rams Flips NFC Playoff Race

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1:07Welcome to the Ringer NFL Show. I'm Shiel Kapadia. What a game between the Seahawks and the Rams. Game of the year. The narratives had all been written when we were early in the fourth quarter about Sam Darnold, about Sean McVay, about the Rams, about the NFC. And then chaos ensued with the Seahawks coming back for a 38-37 victory. What else do you think we're going to talk about today? We're going to talk about that game. We've got on my friend Jackson Bevins from the Cigar Thoughts pod. We're going to try to be coherent about what we saw, but there were about a million things that happened in that game.

1:44Let's take a break. We come back with Jackson. This episode of the Ringer NFL show is presented by State Farm. Having insurance isn't the same as having State Farm. It's like expecting the leadership of a team captain on the football field, but getting a sea captain? Sure, they're both captains, but who is going to run your offense? You wouldn't settle for just anything for your team, so don't settle for just any insurance. When it comes to getting the help you need, State Farm is the real deal. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there.

2:29All right, we are back here on the Ringer NFL show with Jackson Bevins from Cigar Thoughts. This is just minutes after that game ended, Jackson. Game of the year, I remember after week one, I said game of the year, Bills-Ravens. I think we have a new game of the year. How are we going to digest what we just saw? Yeah, well, it lived up to the billing because I was, I thought on paper, this was game of the year. I think this was the two best teams in the NFL. They're in the same division. The difference in path for the winner and the loser of this game was so massive, despite such a small difference in talent between the two of them.

3:06But so many times you hype these games up and they don't deliver. This delivered and then some. it delivered and then some art here. We have so many things to get to here, but I want to start with Sam Darnold, Jackson, because you are a Seahawks fans. You're probably on a bunch of group chats. I got my notes here. I'm getting with, with nine minutes left. The things I'm writing down here, Sam Darnold, it's happening again. Sean McVay, best coach in the NFL Rams, best team in the NFL. And then Sam Darnold gets a chance in overtime with their backs against the, they need a touchdown. and they need a two-point conversion to win the game.

3:46He makes a throw to JSN on the sideline. Toe tap. He makes an incredible throw, probably his best throw of the game to Cooper Cup for 21 yards, then the touchdown to JSN, and then the two-point conversion to Eric Saubert. The two-point conversion. So here's my question to you. You have just gone through a rollercoaster of emotions with your quarterback over the last three to four hours. How do you digest this? How do you feel about your quarterback now as we go into the final two weeks of the regular season and the playoffs? Did he exercise some demons with this performance? Man, rollercoaster over the last three, four hours, try the last three, four months, man.

4:27Trying to make sense of this decision to bring in Sam Darnold looks so good for so long. And let's be honest, man. I mean, I had come around, I was skeptical of this move, but I had come around. And then since the last time he faced the Rams, he hasn't been that good. The team has. he hasn't and for two and a half three quarters of this game he wasn't very good that interception down two scores in the red zone just felt like okay he he bumped into the ceiling like this this is it for sam darnold and now i gotta eat a couple spoonfuls of crow for tweets that i fired off during this game because when i'm tweeting during the game and i'm in those group chats it's in the moment.

5:08It's how I'm feeling. And it really did feel like Seattle was going to be limited. A very, very good team with elite defense going to be limited by this quarterback. And you said it, man, down the stretch. And then in overtime, that was elite hero shit. And I, I feel so much better moving forward because now I've seen it. And that is what we hadn't seen yet. So you do feel differently when this team lines up to play their first playoff game, you will feel differently about your quarterback and how far he can take you because of what happened in the last real. I mean, honestly, it's almost like the overtime drive.

5:43Cause even during some of the stretches of this game, when it was close, when they're scoring, you're like, they're trying to hide Sam Darnold in this football game. They're trying to make sure Sam Darnold doesn't lose this football game. And even with playing that style, he's still through two interceptions. He's still taking four sacks. He's still holding on to the football, but that drive changed the way you think you're going to feel about him in January. It does. And, and because I think it's going to change the way he feels about him in January. And that's the most important thing because you're right.

6:14I'm, I was actually going to ask you if you thought they were trying tied Sam Darnold, because I'm glad you said he threw the ball six times in the first half. And even the comeback was sparked by a special teams play. Their only score before that was a long run. Their only big play before that was a screen pass. I mean, it really wasn't Sam Darnold that was keeping this team in the game. It was the team keeping Sam Darnold in the game. And then he paid them back in a huge way down the stretch. And that overtime drive was maybe the best possession of Sam Darnold's career. It couldn't have come in a bigger moment.

6:48So, yeah, it would be dishonest for me to sit here and say that that doesn't change how I feel how far this quarterback can take this team. You know what? You're right. That was the most meaningful possession of Sam Darnold's NFL career. There's no doubt in my mind now that you think about it. I mean, if they don't come through there, if he throws an interception, all we are talking about right now is what you said. They have a ceiling. Yeah, they got to overtime, but how'd they get to overtime? With Rashid Shahid and Kenneth Walker and the defense coming through in the fourth quarter, not because of Sam Darnold.

7:21And that was the moment where at that point in the game, Mike McDonald doesn't have a choice. Clint Kubiak doesn't have a choice. You need to go score a touchdown. There's nothing else. There's not another possession. There's nothing else. The Rams just went up and down the field, and he found a way to do it. And I think you're right about just from his mindset. Because, man, there were some shots of Sam Darnold on the sideline in this game where you're like, oh, man, he's feeling what we're all feeling watching this, where it's like, oh, my, if this continues, how is he going to be confident enough?

7:53He looked like a cornered animal for a lot of the game. wild eyes wild eyes wild eyes you know sad there's there yes yeah there is such a tectonic shift that takes place based on what happened on that final drive because look all we are as people are the collection of stories that people tell about us and that we tell ourselves about us and the stories that we're about to be told about this sam donald can't get past the rams mike McDonald can't get past the Rams. All of a sudden, these things creep into the overall feeling surrounding a game. And even the most mentally strong coaches and athletes who are blocking it out, they're still going to get asked about it every single time.

8:39Because make no mistake, there's a very good chance these two teams meet again in the playoffs. And if the Seahawks had lost this game, it's going to be about how Sam Darnold can't beat the Rams, how Mike McDonald can't beat the Rams, how the Seahawks as a franchise haven't been able to beat the Rams. since Matthew Stafford showed up. All of that changes now. It is wild when you think about it. And then you think to yourself, well, should I really be changing my opinions on so many things because of OneDrive? But guess what? That's how sports works. Big moments matter. How you perform in big moments matter.

9:11We can debate as clutch a thing as... But like you said, we're telling a different story about Sam Darnold if he doesn't do what he does on that drive in overtime. So I think it's a big win for his confidence. And if you're a Seahawks fan, man, I'm telling you, 90 minutes ago, you're going, oh man, you know, it's a nice season. It was a fun story, but we're not going to the Superbowl with this guy. And now all of a sudden, not only does he have more confidence, but you are in the mix for the one seed. Now it's wide open. Niners are in it for the one seed. Rams are in it for the one seed. Seahawks are in it for the one seed.

9:45Last thing on that drive. And then we'll get to the Ram side of this. But did you think as they had the ball, they are definitely going for two if they score a touchdown here? I am so glad you asked. Yes. So I am just just me personally. I'm a big go for two in the wind every time guy. Like I don't give a shit. I just go do that. Send that message. Lose that way. But I think in modern overtime, you also have just narrowing it down to game theory for this particular game. You also have the thing there's only three minutes left. Your defense has nothing left. Even if you're lucky enough to keep the Rams from scoring again, which I don't think they would have been able to do, you're not going to have enough time to get the ball back anyway.

10:30So playing for the tie is putting yourself in a disadvantageous position anyway. The other thing is you already lost to the Rams. this year. So if you kick and you tie, let's say you hold the Rams and you get the tie, you lose the tiebreaker to the Rams. So from a game theory standpoint, looking at the entire season, to me, it was a no-brainer. So I was thinking go for two the entire time and it didn't look like McDonald hesitated either. Yeah, I'm sure. You know what? I bet, and we're recording this right after, so we don't know in his press conference. I actually bet that's something they talked about during the week.

11:08because remember last week he was on it with the way he handled the end of that game against the Colts with the game management. It was obviously, they were well-prepared. They knew what to do. And I bet it was the same case here where they're just like, a tie does us no good. We're trying to win the one seed. If we tie this game, the Rams already beat us once we lose the tie break. There's literally, this is the no-brainer situation to go for two. So I'm sure they had that in the back of their minds as they're driving there on that final possession. And then they get it. I mean, incredible that that was their play to go for two.

11:41And Saubert comes through wide open. Saubert earned that contract extension he got last week in one play. He doesn't have to do anything ever again. And he has earned that contract extension. Absolutely incredible. What a wild game from the Seahawks perspective here. Let's take a break. We come back. I want to talk about how do the Los Angeles Rams digest this loss? This episode is brought to you by Amazon Prime. The holidays move quickly like a blitz to save the game. That's where Prime comes in with fast, free delivery. You know, my kids put together these presentations for what they want for Christmas, and they put the Amazon Prime link right in there.

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13:02Tremphaya is administered as injections under the skin or infusions through a vein every four weeks, followed by injections under the skin every four or eight weeks. If your doctor decides that you can self-inject Tremphaya, proper training is required. Tremphaya is a prescription medicine used to treat adults with moderately to severely active Crohn's disease and adults with moderately to severely active ulcerative colitis. Serious allergic reactions, increased risk of infections or lower ability to fight them, and liver problems may occur. Before treatment, get checked for infections and tuberculosis.

13:34Tell your doctor if you have an infection, flu-like symptoms, or need a vaccine. Explore what's possible. Ask your doctor about Trimphia today. Call 1-800-526-7736 to learn more or visit trimphiaradio.com. All right, we are back here on the Ringer NFL show. So the things that had to happen, Jackson, for the Rams to lose this game. I mean, again, nine minutes left, eight minutes left. They are up 30 to 14. Like you mentioned, they even got the interception in the red zone against Sam Darnold. They're dropping Kobe Turner into coverage. I'm ready to say like, hey, should Chris Shula be like the number one head coaching candidate?

14:15I mean, these are he is manifesting interceptions and takeaways for his defense against Sam Darnold. And then the things that happen after that. Rashid Shahid with the punt return for the touchdown there. The two point, we have to talk about the two point conversion. I mean, when did you realize that, wait a minute, what are they reviewing here? What's going on here? Did it actually go backwards? Because my eyes are always lying to me in those situations. You know, whenever they're like, did it go backwards or not? I'm like, it always looks to me like it went backwards. And sometimes it did, sometimes it doesn't.

14:50Zach Charbonnet, you know, they're giving him a crowd, hustling into the end. So he kind of just like was chilling in the end zone. There's a ball in the ground. I'm going to pick it up. And that ends up being a play that allows them to tie the game, to force overtime, to win the game, to now potentially give them the number one seed. What was happening there? Okay. So the too long, didn't read version is I think the Rams got screwed. And I don't think the Rams got, and I say that as Seahawks fan, I don't think the Rams got screwed because it was a forward pass. I think it was a backwards pass.

15:23I think they got screwed because nobody on the field thought that it was a backwards pass and the whistle blew, which meant the whistle blow. Cause that's what I was saying on the broadcast. Okay. I thought that it did. I saw a replay, which it's always tough to tell audio with the replay. I thought the whistle blew. If it didn't, well then, okay. Maybe the Rams weren't as, as screwed. But the fact that no one was hustling after the ball. I mean, if I can geek out for a sec, it's like in Lord of the Rings, when Tom Bombadil happens upon the one ring and, you know, it just consumes everybody else in Middle Earth.

15:58He just picks it up and starts playing around with it. It doesn't bother him at all. That was Zach Charbonnet. That football laying in the end zone was the most valuable thing in the NFL universe in that moment. He just saunches over, picks it up, ends up being a huge turning point in the game. I mean, it was an incredible thing to witness. But no, at no point was I like, oh, that's a live ball. Pick it up. It was just, oh, they're reviewing this? I wouldn't that be crazy if they overturned it. I mean, I couldn't believe it. And credit to Terry McCauley on the broadcast. He was all over it. I don't think the, you know, the announcing team probably had no clue, just like the rest of us going, wait, what are they actually looking at here?

16:37It looked very straightforward. Bad, it passed, you know, terrible play call. Yeah. And then he slows it down. No, it is a backwards pass. That is a good question, though. I do wonder, did the whistle blow? Are the Rams going to talk about that or not? but Charbonnet just goes and picks it up. And there is your most unorthodox two point conversion, maybe in NFL history. And that ends up tying the football game at 30. So if you're the, if you're the Rams, if you're Sean McFay, if you're a Rams fan, if you're Matthew Stafford, how do you digest this? Are you just like, man, that was just a game where nothing went our way.

17:15Are you saying we gave that game away in the fourth quarter? We got to be better than that. We wasted an opportunity. Like, I don't even know because it's not, they didn't have like egregious coaching things or anything I felt like, you know, it's not like, oh my gosh, I can't believe they did X, Y, Z to let the Seahawks back into this game. How do you digest it if you're a Rams fan? Yeah, I mean, you let it hurt, right? And you got a long week now to let it hurt, but you got a long week to get healthy and all these things. But I think that once you're able to step back and see this, this doesn't change my perspective of the Rams one iota.

17:52And if I'm Sean McVay or Matthew Stafford or anyone else, I'm not saying, oh, we got exposed in this way or that way. And we need to change. I mean, she'll think about the sequence of events that had to happen for this after the Kobe Turner interception in the red zone up 30 to 14. you needed a stop which hadn't happened in like an hour and a half they got that okay no big deal you get a punt return for a touchdown then it's another stop and they get the two-point conversion that's a coin toss get another stop coin toss score another touchdown it's a coin flip opportunity go for two again get that like all of these things had to happen and then the rams had to miss a field goal and if there is a takeaway if there is a takeaway for the rams it's something that you have to address in the off season and i'm sure they will because mcveigh is a nut about this but the biggest difference between these two teams is that the seahawks are the number one team in the nfl by special teams dvoa and the rams are way near the bottom and that's what cost them it was a punt return for a touchdown it was a missed field goal that was the difference in this game it won't be talked about as much, but if you're the Rams and you're thinking, okay, what is keeping us from reaching our maximum potential?

19:12It's special teams because Seattle, they got that dialed. You're so right about that. And, and, and, you know, they don't have the off season Jackson. They got a quarterback. They have an opportunity in a wide open NFC, a wide open NFL right now to win the Super Bowl for 51 minutes. They looked like the best team in the NFL. They looked like the favorites in the NFC. That's hanging over their head going into the playoffs. They're special teams. I mean, in an era where guys are hitting 60 yarders and 50 say when they miss 57 yarders, we're going, oh man, how'd they miss a 57 yarder? When you're missing from under 50 and you can't count on that guy and you're going to play close games in the playoffs.

19:57I mean, it's not going to surprise either of us. If a month from now, six weeks from now, we're saying the Rams lost in the playoffs. Well, why'd they lose? Oh, special teams. That's why. Which sucks, right? It sucks. It feels unfair, but it's part of the game. A hundred percent. It's like losing a baseball game because you're middle relievers. It's like, oh God, I don't want to think about my middle reliever, but you have to. And so, to bring it back to your original question, if I'm a Rams fan, I still feel very, very good about this team. And I am terrified of my special teams in big moments in the playoffs.

20:34Yeah, it's well said. I mean, it's like all the things they did right. I mean, I thought McVay was in his bag for three quarters of this game. I mean, they're going up and down the field. The Rams, that Shahid punt return for a touchdown, that was the first time the Rams punted in the game against a top three defense. They hadn't punted until then. We hadn't had to see special teams. That's incredible. They scored on six of seven drives, three touchdowns, three field goals. They had the turnover on downs early, but they're producing explosive plays. Puka Nakua is getting wide open. Matthew Stafford is dealing.

21:10They're throwing a guys who, if you're not a, you know, so good today. He, cause he was completely stymied in the first matchup. Yes. They, they won. So it doesn't get talked about, but they had half the yards that the Seahawks had in that game. They were averaging like three and a half yards of play in that game. And now they're going over the top of the Seahawks defense, which no one has done since early October. when it was Baker Mayfield and the at the time Red Hot Bucks and the Seahawks were missing four of their top five secondary players. Since then, nobody's gone over the top of them. And they did it like five times in this game.

21:44Yeah. I mean, it was with guys wide open, which you're just not used to seeing against the Seahawks. It's one thing if it's like high degree of difficulty staff. And there was some of that to be fair, but there were also times where guys are just wide open. And so even if you look at this on the whole, because I know during the broadcast and they're right, If the Seahawks defense didn't step up there in the second half, in the fourth quarter specifically, they're not going to have a chance to come back. And the Rams end up going punt, punt, punt, missed field goal, punt. I mean, that's five possessions with no points in the fourth quarter.

22:19And that was a big, big deal. But even with that, Jackson, you look at this, I just looked this up. If you look at EPA per drive for the Rams, this is an 81st percentile game. to have an 81st percentile game offensively against that defense on the road and force two turnovers, three turnovers, without Devontae Adams, and to lose that game, it's unheard. I mean, think of all those things if I would have told you before the game, if I would have told you Matthew Stafford's throwing for 457 yards, no interceptions, no sacks. Puka Nakua is going to have 225 yards. Sam Darnold is going to throw two interceptions.

22:59in this game. The Rams are going to be, what was it? Plus three, right? Plus three on turnovers. No one in the right. You, you, we could have done a three hour podcast and we would have had a hard time coming up with a way that the Rams that game. That's right. And that's why I'm not that discouraged. If I'm a Rams fan, I'm really not like you tip your hat. You, you went toe to toe, hell of a game, probably outplayed the Seahawks and didn't win. And that's okay. Cause you didn't outplay the Seahawks in the first game and you got the win. These two teams are very, very evenly matched. And yeah, it's uphill for us now, if I'm a Rams fan, but this team can win the Superbowl a hundred percent.

23:41They can, but I, you know, they probably would have loved to have that by and get Stafford some rest. He took that big blow to the midsection. I'm looking at that going, all right, you get that by, you know, lock it up early so that this quarterback can get some rest and now you don't know if that's going to you know I the other thing I thought about watching this was just like this is a precursor to what may be one of the wildest playoffs of our lifetimes I mean it is wide open in the NFC it's wide open in the AFC just when you're feeling that's how this season has been just when you're feeling good about one team nope they take a step back the other team comes in just when you feel like you have a handle this team doesn't have it when we're writing our narratives about Sam Donald now they win that game.

24:23This has been the story of the 2025 NFL season. And I felt like this felt like a playoff game. The stakes were pretty as high as you can have for a regular season game. And it delivered one of the wildest games, probably the wildest game of the season. I think the playoffs are going to be filled with these kinds of moments. Oh man, absolutely. I mean, this is as fun. Just, I mean, you and I, we've talked football a lot of times. And one thing you know about me is I am a football fan first and a Seahawks fan second. And as a football fan, this is one of the most fun regular seasons I can ever remember because of that unpredictability.

24:58It doesn't even feel like parody. It feels like unpredictability. And teams are getting to the mountaintop and tumbling halfway back down in the span of like three minutes all the time. It happens every week. It's awesome. I mean, the Bears just a week ago went from the number one seed to number seven. The Rams just went from number one to number five. And it's just, it can happen to anybody at any time. So right now, the Seahawks have a 52 % chance to get the one seed, whereas the Rams and now the 49ers, I mean, I feel like I've never had a season covering the NFL where I've talked about the 49ers less, and here they are with a 20 % chance, pretty much the same as the Rams, to get that one seed.