Jaxson Dart's Knee Injury Sinks Giants, and Overreactions from Week 2

21:30Maybe DeAndre Swift doesn't fumble at the goal line. But I think that Brian Flores probably plays this thing a lot the same. Meanwhile, other quarterback injury, Jaden Day, and as you mentioned that one, Sheel, he's still getting more tests. I don't know that we're going to know anything until more toward the end of the week about how long he's going to be out. at this point, my understanding is it's not a given that he's going to go on IR. He missed four games last year with the dislocated left elbow. He didn't actually go on IR in that time. And I don't know that he's necessarily going to have surgery.

22:02There's a lot of questions. I mean, it's the same injury again. He keeps hurting the left elbow. And that play yesterday, like, I don't know what you thought, Shield, but like, that's not one where I go, your elbow is going to come out of place. Like that was, he had stepped on and like braces himself, but it's not His whole body weight is getting crushed. Clearly, there's something that they have to figure out, whether that's wear a brace, whether it is to get surgery. You just can't have your franchise quarterback unavailable for as long as Jaden has with an injury that just seems like it could pop up on any play.

22:34Although what you're saying is good news because I watched that and Tom Brady's reaction to that, by the way, I was like... Brady's got to pay now. He's got to pay the FCC now. All right. So I was thinking this, okay. They have all these alternative broadcasts now. You know, you got the man, you got, this is the big thing in media. You don't have to watch the main broadcast. You're going to watch other people watching the game. I feel like maybe that's Tom Brady's calling because when he just reacted naturally there and let a little bad word slip by, I was like, oh, this is authentic Tom Brady.

23:08And I was looking at Daniel's legs. I'm looking at his knees and I'm like, why is he so upset? I don't see anything that crazy there. And then my wife comes in the office and she's like, no, look at his elbow. And I'm like, oh my, okay. All right. That, that doesn't look good there. But yeah, Brady had a couple moments like that, Billy. I don't know. I know he likes the Fox gig doing the main broadcast, but I thought that was a little, you know, hey, Tom Brady can say anything here. Maybe he's having a couple beers while he's watching the game and he's just letting it rip. Maybe that's what his calling is going to be eventually.

23:38Sheil Kapadia:I was going to suggest that maybe, you know, we have another broadcaster out there, a quarterback, who, by the way, in that game alone, his record for franchise touchdowns was surpassed by Dak Prescott, and that's Tony Romo. He's still floating out there. Maybe he does an alternative broadcast too. And then he started throwing in the alcohol, and I was like, maybe we stay away from that one with Tony a little bit there. Yeah, but, I mean, Tom was letting it loose. There were some people that were very outraged by his use of the S-word and piss missile, which he used. Well, there's people on the internet.

24:06Sheil Kapadia:the people there, Tom, they were out there. They were tweeting. They said, you know what? This man is an atrocity. This is so offensive. My family was watching this. I can't believe that he just said shit on a broadcast. This is horrific. We're not all on Spotify now, Tom. Tom, I've heard you on with Bill. Sometimes you let it fly there. I heard an F word an episode or so ago. I am just trying to fit in on that show. I go one F for everyone from Bill. Okay. I was wondering the ratio. You're going to finish that. I go one for every three. I won't start it. Or one for every five. But I'll finish it.

24:41Okay. Listen, it is exciting. If you're someone who's watching with kids, it can be a very exciting moment when someone says a bad word and your kid hears it. And they're like, Oh my God! That's kind of a nice bonding experience between you and your kids. So don't get too upset about it. They're going to hear those words at school, on the bus, whatever. It'll be okay.

25:01Sheil Kapadia:They'll survive. He also was a great passer. He could put the ball exactly where he wanted. He dropped those curses in. And if you weren't paying very close attention, you'd miss it. If he didn't say like, oh, excuse me, right after he said the S word, it's like, oh, I wouldn't have even picked it up. There was so much going on. And then when he said piss, he just kept flying right by that one, which I guess isn't that bad. But I don't know, because when we were back on local radio, that was one of the words you couldn't say for whatever reason is piss. It was very strange, the words that were the yeses and the noes on language.

25:32But you're not even using it in like a dirty context, a piss missile. Like you're not actually thinking of a bodily function at that point. Now that I'm thinking about it more, I'm kind of thinking. Yeah, but no. Not in the moment, I wasn't thinking of a bodily function. The only thing I could think of, because immediately I was like, you know, laughing about Tom saying it. But I also was thinking like, what happens right when he says it? Because he corrected himself. As you said, Billy, like, excuse me. was like a half a second later. Does he get like the slap on the thigh from Burkhart? Is there a producer in his ear going, Tom?

26:08Or is it just like, he's like, oh my God, what have I done?

26:12Sheil Kapadia:I don't think it's that. I don't think Tom ever has an, oh my God, what have I done? Because, well, you know what? I don't know. Because I've often thought about Tom Brady. He signs this massive, like 10 year, 300, whatever million dollar broadcasting deal on Fox. And then he's like at every fanatics thing ever. And he's there and he's signing all these autographs and he's doing all these things. And it gets to a point with him where it's like, did you not make enough? Like, have you not made enough money in your lifetime? Can you not just take a weekend off? You have like six kids, like go enjoy the weekend with them.

26:42Sheil Kapadia:Why are we flying to these appearances and doing all this stuff? So I would think that he should be relaxed because he doesn't need the money, but he does so many things that he's getting paid for. It's like, maybe he does need this money for whatever reason. I guess it's hard. Like when you make that much money to keep up with this lifestyle, once you're done, even though he's made more after his career than he made during his career. I think I saw him pitching an air fryer or something on Instagram. Did you guys see that one? That was like yesterday. And I was like, he doesn't say no. But if you were being offered what he's surely being offered, like an air fryer?

27:16Yeah, sure. I only eat green foods myself. But hey, I'll go ahead and pitch this. And he had a subway deal at one point too. There's a lot of different things he's done where you're like, I don't know if he's eating that, but it's a million dollars.

27:31Sheil Kapadia:I mean, I told you before, I did parabolic mic work for$10 at a football game. So who am I to say turn down jobs that are paying, you know? Who are you to judge? Exactly. A lot of other games on Sundays. Some interesting trends. Some teams that have kind of come out of nowhere. Some really disappointing teams. What are we overreacting to? What are we underreacting to? Sheil's got some ideas after this. The Ringer NFL Show is brought to you by FanDuel Thursday night football just got even better with FanDuel With early win, a fast start could be all you need to win big For Falcons versus Packers, just bet the money line Then if your team jumps out to a 7-point lead At any point in the game, you'll win instantly So whether your team scores on the opening drive Or builds an early touchdown lead You could be celebrating before the game's even over Check out FanDuel's early win for Falcons versus Packers in the FanDuel app.

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29:17This shake has all your recovery needs in one bottle. Available in 26 gram and 42 gram protein options. Visit corepower.com to learn more. So week two now, fully in the books. Sheil, I'm going to turn this over to you because we talked about week one, right? Where it can be just a complete aberration. Things are weird and there's schematic things that come up that you're not expecting. It's a big adjustment game. And then sometimes that can be a total outlier in your season. Now we're in week two. Still a small sample size, but you're maybe starting to get a little bit more of a vibe about the teams here.

29:55Tell me, what are we overreacting to? What are we underreacting to? What do you want to talk about around the NFL here? Yeah. And just a little caveat there. I don't like though it's only two weeks patrol. Okay. It's like, we're not just going to take a vacation for the first half of the season and come back in week 10 and be like, are we allowed to talk about what's happening now? We're talking about what's happening at this moment in time. We're not saying it's conclusive. Everybody just settle down, go throw some pizza, throw some fries in your air fryer, have a nice meal, listen to the podcast.

30:25It's going to be okay. I got to find that ad. Yeah. There you go. All right, so here's the game. Here's the game. These are things that I personally actually think at this moment in time. They could be very stupid. Six weeks from now, you guys have to tell me, am I overreacting? Am I underreacting? Or is it just right? I've got three things. Billy, I know sometimes we got to go over the directions a couple of times with you. Do you get it here?

30:48Sheil Kapadia:Just one quick question. So you're giving your reaction and then we're reacting to your reaction or are you just making a statement and then we react to it? No, I'm going to give you my statement, my explanation why, and then you're going to say, Sheil, you're overreacting her. Sheil, that's not a strong enough reaction or Sheil. I agree with you. You leave these off, Billy. I think you got the rules all down now. Okay, so hold on a second though, Sheil. I know it wasn't part of the game, but I will say proper reaction to you saying, hey, weeks one and two, we don't dismiss. They count the same as week 17 and 18, these games.

31:23Sheil Kapadia:So people are saying, oh, this is just weeks one and two. It doesn't matter. I mean, those two weeks at the end of the year are gonna be very meaningful. We can't dismiss those. So why would we dismiss these? So proper reaction out of you. Okay, so you're with me on that one. Let's see what you think about this one. All right, first one. The Los Angeles Chargers are cooked. I don't wanna hear it's only two weeks. I know there's a case. say, everyone take a deep breath, chill. They're going to be okay. It's an offense with a new offensive coordinator, Jim Harbaugh. He's never had a losing record.

31:53He's won 11 games in five of six NFL seasons. The quarterback still got a lot of talent. It's never as bad as you think in the NFL. You can make that case. I thought about, you know what? Do I actually feel that way? Should I zag and go that way? And then I thought, no, I actually don't feel that way because I watched that game and the offense looked terrible. And Mike McDaniel came in with so much hype. You know, I would say he's never had a quarterback as talented as Justin Herbert. And you know what it looks like? It looks like they didn't practice all summer. Like if Tom broke a story tomorrow and was like, you know, no one was at these training camp practices.

32:26There was some kind of, you know, event at the facility and the chargers actually didn't practice all summer. I'd be like, good news break, Tom. That's kind of what it looked like the first two weeks of the season. I mean, that's what it looks like. Did you see the play? The play clock's winding down. They're trying to bring a wide receiver in motion. He comes in motion. The center's like, I have to snap the ball or we're getting a delay of game. It hits the wide receiver. I think it's Trey Harris. And then they fumble it. This is a third in inches in like a three-point game in the second half.

32:54So you have that. You have Justin Herbert looking lost. Fourth quarter alone. He's got multiple fumbles. He's got an interception. They had five or six fumbles in the football game. But then here are the two big things why I feel like I'm not overreacting. One is their upcoming schedule. At Buffalo, at Seattle, home against the Broncos, at the Chiefs, at the Rams, Texans at home, at the Ravens. That is a brutal stretch. They came into the season with one of the hardest schedules in the NFL. And you're thinking, all right, win the first two games. And then if you lose some of those games, you're going to be okay.

33:29But look at that schedule. That's why I think they're cooked. And then the last thing here, I'll leave you with. You know, Tom told us previously that Jim Harbaugh is not like a hands-off type coach. You know, when things get rough, he's not going to be like, all right, you guys got this. You know, I'll come into the office at 11 a.m. I trust you guys. Especially he's never worked with Mike McDaniel before. So now I'm thinking, what's that relationship going to be like now that he's feeling the heat? Everyone else is feeling the tension. I think there's a chance this gets really, really ugly. I think this season is curtains for the Los Angeles Chargers.

34:07Billy, what do you think?

34:09Sheil Kapadia:I think that that's an underreaction by you. I think that it might be worse because we, I mean, I was listening to some shows, hearing things going on and, you know, Jim is known to kind of flight in the whole fight or flight situation when things get tough. So you kind of wonder if this thing really starts getting going. I think Bill pointed it out. It's like, is Jim even going to be around himself? Like forget McDaniels, Jim going to decide, let me bounce from here. Getting paid a lot of money though. You know, you don't want to leave that money on the table. That is true. And he can't really go back to college for a little bit because he has a bit of a band there for some time.

34:46Sheil Kapadia:So, I mean, I think there's a lot of things that look bad right now for them. McDaniel and Herbert do not seem to be on the same page when McDaniel was down here. And, you know, the Dolphins weren't really, they were about a 500 team. they're more hype than they were reality in a lot of the situation with the dolphins. And then it was like, well, to a, you know, isn't really that talented imagine. And down here, they would say it all the time. Imagine if the dolphins had drafted Justin Herbert instead of Tua, what this team would look like. And now we're seeing what Mike McDaniel does with Justin Herbert.

35:18Sheil Kapadia:And I saw, you know, a chart where it compared the first two starts of Tua and Herbert and Tua had, you know, better passing yards, more touchdowns, fewer turnovers. Like Tua was doing a lot better than McDaniel through two games. And granted, it's only two games, but this week, Herbert did not even get 200 passing yards. Week before, he had 209 passing yards against the Cardinals. Herbert has not looked good. You mentioned the fumbles. They had six fumbles in this game, three fumbles alone by Herbert. They only lost one of them. Had they lost half of them, right, this game would have looked a lot uglier than it was.

35:53Sheil Kapadia:This isn't a team that we thought was going to be good right now in the Raiders. The Raiders have been a surprising team so far this season. But, I mean, the first week was against the Dolphins. I knew the Dolphins were going to be bad. And now the Chargers may be a bad team. So we don't really know how good the Raiders actually are. We saw what happened with the Cardinals this week. So the Cardinals weren't actually a great team that beat up on this Chargers team. So you're starting to get a better idea of who the Chargers are because it's not just the losses, it's who they lost to. And now everyone, I feel like we were ahead on this curve.

36:23Sheil Kapadia:It wasn't an original thing. we were just looking ahead because Tom, me, you, Sheil, we have certain foresight where we were talking last week about this Chargers schedule. And we were like, man, things are going to get rough for them if they don't win this week. And now that they did lose this week, everyone's kind of looking at the schedule like, this one's going to get away from them really quick. So you know what, Sheil? You said that it's curtains on the season? Underreaction. This may be a thing where, you know, I heard on the interwebs, I heard on the podcast, I heard people saying, is Herbert the guy or do we like try to see if someone wants him we trade him to a team that's looking for a quarterback and we just start over because this experiment isn't working this could be a whole reset of the franchise if they don't turn it around here I think that's an overreaction I just don't know what you I don't know what you do at that point yeah you may be able to trade Justin Herbert and get a couple of first round picks back but now what now you've got a coach who's in his, what, mid-60s and is getting paid among the highest-paid coaches in the NFL, and you're going to draft one?

37:27And are you hiring a new offensive coordinator? Where do you go? I think it's an overreaction that the season is over. It's still two games. In year three, slow starts are a red flag. I go back to the Texans last year. They started 0-3. They also had a new offensive coordinator, and they had a growth process with their quarterback, who didn't look very good, and the defense wasn't playing great. Now, they switched the defensive play caller, but all of a sudden, the offense started to find some rhythm. The defense got a lot better. They ended up in the playoffs. That's entirely possible with the Chargers.

38:01The schedule, though, is just so brutal. Like, where do you find the win for this team? Like, are we really to expect right now, even if the Chargers were 2-0, would you be sitting there going, that team is going to go into Buffalo and beat the Bills the way that Josh Allen looks right now. That's hard to believe. Following week is at Seattle, one of the toughest places in the NFL to play against the Seahawks team. It looks very much the part of the defending Super Bowl champs. If the Chargers were 2-0, I don't think we'd be sitting there saying they're going into Seattle and winning. If you're 0-4, now you're getting into the danger zone here.

38:41They need to figure it out, and they need to figure it out fast. We talked about this before the season when I brought up pressure on Jim Harbaugh, and it was within the context of getting paid this much money not to get in the playoffs and be one and done, like to make a Super Bowl run. And the bullet that he had to fire, he fired the offensive coordinator and the offensive line coach, and he brought in Mike McDaniel. I always had doubts just going in about how compatible they are, and maybe they find ways here to put this thing together. But if 0-2 becomes 0-3 becomes 0-4, then all this other stuff that we're talking about comes into play because there's not an easy off-ramp on any of this stuff.

39:21And there's not a lot of changes you can make unless you fire the offensive coordinator again.

39:26Sheil Kapadia:The problem with their schedule too, sorry, the problem with their schedule too is it's not just at the Bills, at the Seahawks. You have Broncos, Chiefs, and then you have an early bye. So it's not even like, okay, wow, they'll get this early bye. This will break things up. They'll be fine. No, because they come off of that bye and they're at the Rams. And at that point, the Rams are going to be healthy. And then you have to play out the rest of the season. Right after the Rams, you have Texas Ravens. So even in like scheduled wins almost when you're coming off of a bye, they're going to play arguably the best team in the league.

39:55Sheil Kapadia:So it's not going to be that much of a reprieve for them. And it's going to be a healthy team by that point. They're underdogs. They'll be underdogs in every game you just mentioned, I think. I mean, that's what we're talking about here. Like they're not expected. They will not be expected to win. I think any of the next one, two, three, four, five, six, seven games on the schedule. Now guys can get injured. And obviously we don't know who's going to play in those games. And maybe they'll all start to play better and maybe they'll figure it out. And we'll replay this clip and we'll all laugh at me.

40:23I don't think that's the most likely case. Now I did get this text. Now this, this was just from a friend on a group chat today. So this is not a source or anything like that. But when Tom said, where would the chargers go from here? here was the question that was posted to me in the group chat. Who says no? Vikings received Justin Herbert. Chargers received two firsts. A second, Jordan Addison and JJ McCarthy. Who says no? I said the Chargers would say no. Yeah, I agree. But Billy, you were a little intrigued there. I saw your face. Listen, I like a trade. I like a trade.

41:01Sheil Kapadia:I like a who says no. But I mean, if you're the Vikings, you're getting Kyler back, right, Tom? Like you reported that Kyler should be back this week. So you're going to, I mean, if the trade is right now, maybe the Vikings say no. Cause like, well, I don't know. Let's see. I don't know how, I don't know so much about this, you know, Herbert character. Let's see what we have in Kyler still. They did call. They did try to trade for Justin Herbert two years ago. Oh, that's before he was damaged goods. When Jim Harbaugh first got there and, hey, you want to have J.G. McCarthy? You can bring him. We'll take Herbert.

41:34It was a flat no at that time. And Jim Herbert has spent the past two and a half years telling us Justin Herbert is the greatest player, if not person, to ever walk the face of the earth. So the idea of Jim bailing on this, I just, I don't foresee it. I think there's a lot of unanswered questions. We're still early in this thing, and maybe they turn it around. But you lost to two teams that had top three picks in last year's draft. They got different coaches. Obviously, the Raiders are riding a wave right now with Clinton. They look like they got a ton of juice, and that's a home game for them when they go to L.A.

42:11The Cardinals with Michael Fleur, they came out ready to play. The Chargers have not looked like they've been ready to play two straight games, and the quarterback has not played well. You know, Ladd McConkie went out there. I told you guys last Monday night, I didn't think there was any way he was playing. He found a way to get out there. So there are guys that are still competing and want to go win. It's just not happening. It's not clicking. And it's not that I think something has gone wrong with Mike McDaniel. I do think that over time they'll get it going. But I wonder about, again, the compatibility and what influence, if any, Jim Harbaugh has with that offense.

42:45And also just how soon they get it going. Because guess what? If the offense finds their way after the bye, it's too late. You're 1-5 or 0-6 or whatever you are. And you're in a hole in a division that with the Chiefs playing good football and obviously the Broncos being good. And right now the Raiders being undefeated, you know, you're, you're really in a tough spot here. And the other thing is, even if the offense does find itself, is the defense going to be good enough at that point? You know, like the defense played, you know, okay this week, better than they did in week one, but I don't think that's going to be a juggernaut.

43:19So two other, two other little theories I had for you on this topic before I move on to the next one. I know Billy, this is kind of your corner. We did it, you know, a fun show last week, but what if Mike McDaniel's superpower, was like building a Tua Tyreek Hill offense, but he can't do anything else. It's like, you know what? Tua and Tyreek, I can scheme this up. We're throwing in the middle of the field. We're going to have explosive plays. Just make sure it's not too cold. But now when you give me maybe a quarterback who can do more, I'm going to struggle a little bit. What do you think on that one?

43:50Sheil Kapadia:Wow. So you think that he's really good at maximizing limited abilities. Right. When he has unlimited abilities, that's like his Achilles. He can't do it. He can't do it. His mind gets all scrambled. Like this guy, he can do too much. He had speed in Miami when they were good. He had Tyreek. He had Waddle. He got A-chan. Like that was the difference maker. And then you go to the Chargers. They're built differently. Miami was a small team, but they were fast. The Chargers are not the fastest team. They're big. It is a different thing. Now, Ladd McConkie is very quick and not the biggest guy. But they built for years with the big man thing where you want everybody to look like Quentin Johnston.

44:36This is a different type of thing. They built for Greg Roman's offense. Think about what everything that Jim and Greg Roman did through the years. It was like, we're going to just be the big, we're Frank Gore, we're Michael Crabtree. We're just going to out-physical you. That's not really what Mike has dealt with in the past. And again, I don't think it can't be overcome, but it is a different skill set with different personnel. out. And then the last question here was, you know, in the summer, you know, after that John Harbaugh video was released that we're the Giants and I was making fun of him and Billy, we were making it in the spring.

45:08We were, to be fair, we're making fun of him a little bit too. When there were those stories about he's meeting the athletic trainer at like 4am at the Giants practice. So what if when everyone said Harbaugh's washed, they had the wrong brother this summer, you know, what if Jim Harbaugh has lost his fastball and it's like, this guy's had a great career. He's always winning 11 games. He's been to a Super Bowl, but to Tom's point, they haven't looked like a prepared team. They've been outcoached, I would say, both weeks when you're losing as big favorites at home. You have to look at the coaching.

45:38For sure, they had a situation in this game. They're kicking a 58-yard field goal rather than going for it on fourth and three. It's like, I thought you had Mike McDaniel. You can't come up with a play on fourth and three rather than attempting this 58-yard field goal here. So there was some stuff like that that's on my radar. with Jim Parker.

45:55Sheil Kapadia:He's also just generally like a kooky guy. You know what I mean? Like he's a little bit out there. I always have kind of wonder like, how is it that he's relating to like the modern athlete with some of these things that he like starts talking about and gets into? And it wasn't him. His brother is the one that had the dad go out there and give a speech to the team. And it's like, we know you love your dad, but like your dad doesn't have to do the, who has it better than us? Nobody every single year. Like we've gotten that story. We know that whole thing. We don't got to do it every, I get it. you love your dad, but come on.

46:25Sheil Kapadia:What are we doing? And by the way, dad's playing favorites a little bit, huh? Heading over there to the Giants. He's not talking to the Chargers. Maybe they... Actually, you know what? Maybe he knew. Maybe that's what they need to do is they need to bring the dad over and start talking to the Chargers. Maybe sit him down. Billy's not dunking on 85-year-old Jack Harbaugh. No, I would never. I would never do that. Unbelievable. So just for the record, he's defended billionaires. He looks down upon you if you take the$10, you know, He did it once, but he was never doing it again. And by the way, seniors, he's not a fan of you either.

46:58God forbid. A strong father-son relationship.

47:01Sheil Kapadia:No, I will say this, though, about what you were telling us earlier about Jim Harbaugh and the Vikings calling him and trying to trade J.J. McCarthy for Justin Herbert and him saying no, and he talks to him, he says the great things about Herbert, how he's the greatest quarterback ever. He did the same thing with J.J. McCarthy, and he convinced everyone because he had him in Michigan. and like, this is a great quarterback. This is one of the greatest quarterbacks I've ever coached. And everyone's kind of like, this guy's not really that good. He's kind of limited and they didn't really win the national championship because of him.

47:31Sheil Kapadia:But Jim talked him up to the point that he gets drafted high in the draft. And then they're like, hey, you love him. You want him? He's like, nah, we're good. He's not that good. I don't like that about Jim. I don't like that he'd put the old bait and switch. And then when they tried to give him his guy, he's like, nah, I lied about all that stuff. He's not that good. That kind of is a hard bot thing now that I think about it, not to get too far off topic, but John would be like, Lamar Jackson's going to change football. You know, remember he said, he said that back in the day, like we're doing stuff.

47:57No one else in the NFL is doing. So maybe they just like talking up their quarterbacks, which, you know, that isn't necessarily a bad strategy, but you would like your quarterback to be playing better football than Justin Herbert's playing. All right. So I got a, I got an underreaction from Billy. And then Tom had an overreaction to Billy's reaction off of me on that one. If you're keeping track at home, if you got a spreadsheet or something, that you want to share. I think that's where we're at after the first one. All right, second one I've got for you. This is kind of on the other end of it.

48:25I think the Houston Texans are going to be fine here. I'm saying I got no panic at all about the Houston Texans. So they're 0-2. We know what the stats say about 0-2 teams. They only make the playoffs 16 % of the time. But I watched that game against the Bengals, and I don't think it was nearly as bad as the final score indicated. It was one of those games in the course of a 17-game season where all the 50-50 stuff is going against you. You get stopped on fourth and inches. You get stopped on third and one. You get stopped on fourth and one. You have a field goal block. I mean, Jamar Chase just makes a miracle touchdown catch.

49:03So all those things happen. I'm not telling you it was perfect. They still couldn't run the ball, but that's just been the case for the Houston Texans for like four years now. I thought CJ Stroud played pretty well. I thought the defense played well. they're just giving up some explosive plays to great quarterbacks. And that hasn't been the case in the past, but I don't think that's going to be the case every week where you face Josh Allen and you face Joe Burrow. I think by the end of this season, I'm still going to look at them as a top five defense. So I'm looking at that division. If you look at the AFC South right now, the division is one in seven.

49:36The Jaguars have a week one win against the Browns and they don't have any other wins this season. So I think the Texans still have time to turn this around. Tom alluded to it earlier. They were in this spot last year. They figured it out. I still like the talent. I think the Houston Texans are on the other end of the spectrum from the Chargers where they're going to be perfectly fine this season.

49:58Sheil Kapadia:I think it's a proper reaction. I want to say underreaction. I think it's a proper reaction. I don't think it's an overreaction. I will tell you this. I was going around today and I was finding some Texans podcasts that are on there and it was overreaction Monday. Yeah, so they are not happy with the team right now. This is what I'll say. You make good points in that there's only one win in their division right now, right? So the Colts are 0-2, the Titans are 0-2. They're doing them favors because they're sticking in it. Tom made the point earlier. Last year, they actually started the season 0-3 and they still made the playoffs.

50:33Sheil Kapadia:So at that point, they're not really overreacting or reacting. The level or the area of concern is kind of what you pointed out, which is also bad luck, which shouldn't always happen, which is 0-4 of fourth downs. Three of those were in the red zone. So there was a fourth and four at the 16, fourth and one at the 18, a fourth and 17 at the 19, but they had to go for it at the end of the game. So those, eventually you'll get those fourth and one, those fourth and two. So that's not going to be the case always. One thing that is concerning, and it has been the case for two years now, is their offensive coordinator, Nick Cayley.

51:08Sheil Kapadia:So they bring him over from the Rams. In 2023 and 2024, the Rams are struggling in the red zone. They hire him over. They bring him over. He implements a similar system here. And last year, the Texans struggled greatly in the red zone. This year, they're struggling in the red zone to the point that last year, or last week, they had 374 yards of offense. They are 374 this week, 381 last week. They're getting plenty of yards. They're just not ending drives with points, and they're not ending drives with touchdowns. So coming into the season, there was some talk of, well, is Nick Kaley going to make adjustments to what the red zone offense was last year?

51:46Sheil Kapadia:And so far, I mean, this week in particular, they struggled in the red zone. Last week, they fumbled the ball at the end of the game in the red zone. But people were saying they were kind of tipping what they were doing last year based on the number of wide receivers that were on the field. You knew, is this going to be a run play? Is this going to be a pass play? Because on pass plays, they had more than three wide receivers. On run plays, like 68 % of the time or something, they had less than three wide receivers. So within the red zone, it was becoming predictable. It would seem that the adjustment hasn't been made yet, but it is something that can be fixed.

52:17Sheil Kapadia:And the 0-4 and 4th downs will turn around. You won't have that every week. Six points is not good enough, no matter who you're going against or what you're doing in the NFL. My concern right now, at least short term, is what's the status of Nico Collins? He hurt his hamstring last week. I think it was either out of the game, but we didn't know about it or it happened early in the week in practice, didn't play this past week. Is he going to be playing anytime soon? He's got a history of hamstring injuries or soft tissue injuries. That guy is a difference maker. He might be the most underrated wide receiver in the entire NFL.

52:50When he's not out there, it makes a huge impact on everything else that they're doing. He's one of the most trusted targets for CJ Stroud's shield. So to me, that's the biggest, I think it's the just right. Wasn't that the option? Just right for your reaction. I think they'll be fine. But without Nico Collins, even this week going to Indy and facing the 0-2 Colts, if you don't have Nico, the biggest issue the Colts defense has had is being able just to stop the pass anywhere other than where Sauce Gardner is. They've not been able to do it. If you don't have Nico Collins, it makes it a lot easier for them to not give up those chunk plays.

53:28It's been a big problem for Indy. Yeah, that's another reason why I looked at Stroud and I was like, this isn't a bad performance by CJ Strait. He doesn't have Nico Collins. And like Billy was given yardage numbers there, they were still moving the football. They can't run the ball at all. And the offensive line is still an issue. It's just like Groundhog Day sometimes with the Texans where they try different combinations and they change personnel. And it's just like, it's still not good enough. It feels like upfront for the Texans. But again, I think they've been there before. Their upcoming schedule is not nearly as daunting as a team like the Chargers.

54:00I think they're going to be able to stay in it. and I think they're going to be okay for the long run there. All right. Ready for the third one. Here's my last one. Bring it. I think it's panic time for Aaron Rodgers, Mike McCarthy, 2.0. Panic time after just two weeks. She'll settle down. They're one and one. I know what you're saying, but there are a couple things here. That was a very ugly performance in New England. And I know the weather wasn't great and the Patriots might have a good defense, but you kind of had that hopeless feeling. where like when something good happened for the Steelers offense, it almost felt like an accident or a surprise.

54:37I mean, they had 12 possessions and they had one field goal in that game. And then I was looking at all the offensive performances this season. So there's been 32 games. There's been 64 offensive performances. If you look at the nerd stats, the Steelers two games ranked 60th and 63rd out of 64. Their week one game stunk on offense, but they won because they were facing the Falcons and they didn't have to have a great offensive game. So I have some concerns there. DK Metcalf, I think, is at a horrible start to the season. And I was reading, listening. I don't know if I was as far as Billy. Billy, I am interested in your media diet on Mondays.

55:15Like some of the things you're referencing here, maybe we can get to that in a minute. Just how you're consuming various team podcasts and you're digging up numbers. I think you're going to hit us with cover six, but I was just reading some of the coverage on the Steelers, listening to Mike McCarthy and Aaron Rodgers and Mike McCarthy gets up there and he's being accountable. Veteran head coach, he says, it starts with me pointing the finger at himself. I got to do better. And then they get to Aaron Rodgers. And I know sometimes, I didn't watch the entire Aaron Rodgers press conference, but this is in The Athletic, a reputable publication.

55:48They've got the quote from Rodgers and it was like, he's trying to say the right thing. He's saying, we have to keep taking the ownership in a game like today. There wasn't a lot of flow to it. We need to be better. And it starts with me, but then he continues. at making sure Mike knows what's working, what's not working, making sure our coaches know so we can call stuff that we feel like has a better chance. Now, listen, I try to put myself in other people's shoes. If I'm Mike McCarthy, I'd be like, all right, you're taking a shot at me. I'm not calling the right things. And then I'm zooming out and I'm just like, what's the history of a quarterback like Aaron Rodgers, or a quarterback at this age being good in the NFL?

56:29And it's just like this century, we have literally one example and it's Tom Brady. There's no other quarterback who was even starting games at age 42 this century. So I look at all those things and I have a lot of concerns about what that offense specifically is going to look like the rest of the way. Billy, what do you think?

56:50Sheil Kapadia:I still don't understand why they hired Mike McCarthy and why they thought that pairing the two of them together was going to work 10 years after the two of them were together. Because at the end, they didn't seem to like each other. So when Aaron came back and he was like, I love Mike, I'm only coming back because of Mike. I was like, that's not how I remember that one ending exactly. And you're talking about the press conference and it's like, that's not surprising at all. But that's how that went. You know, Aaron Rodgers at one time was the greatest quarterback in the NFL. And that was a while ago.

57:28Sheil Kapadia:and I'm sure like anyone, it's hard to kind of accept that you're not like at your peak anymore and a lot of players have passed you by and he also doesn't always take full accountability for things, which is exactly what's happening in that thing, which is not going to go well. And the people that they went on and they got him, like Rico Dowdle hasn't really done anything so far. Pittman hasn't really been a huge playmaker for him. DK Metcalf hasn't really worked out. Like, I don't exactly remember where you were on the, where we should be with the Steelers, but it's not looking good long-term for the Steelers here.

58:04I'm in panic mode. I'm saying it's okay to be in panic mode after two weeks.

58:08Sheil Kapadia:I think that that is accurate, not just for this season, but for the near future. Like, what does this look like next season? Mike McCarthy is still going to be here and you're now going to bring in a new quarterback. You're going to draft a quarterback. They might be good enough to not get you a good quarterback. When you hire Mike McCarthy, it's kind of like, well, we're cool with the Tomlin 9-8 situation, right? Because do you think Mike McCarthy is going to come in and he's going to win you 11 games, 12 games? No, you're probably going to hover right around and maybe get in the playoffs and maybe not.

58:39Sheil Kapadia:So I don't really know what their goal is here because they haven't looked good. They won last week against the Falcons. This week, they got blown up by the Patriots. And there's big questions about Drake May, I think, after two weeks still as to whether or not he's regressed back to his rookie season. So I agree with you. I think it's panic time right now for the Steelers. Billy, I'm going to give you an assignment here while I start. Because I can do an hour on this, but I'll keep it to a lot less than that. Look at Mike McCarthy's history and count up for me in his, I believe, 18 years as an NFL head coach, how many times he's had a top 10 offense.

59:20So start with that. I want to get the number right. So let's check it. They didn't hire Mike McCarthy to bring back Aaron Rodgers. And this is, you know, we're going for it one more time. That was sort of a unintended benefit was that Aaron would come back in a year where it was not a very good quarterback draft, where they did not have a high enough pick even if they wanted to draft a quarterback. And they've got an extremely veteran roster that they felt like can, in many ways, win right now. The defense is pretty good. They had a couple of takeaways in that Patriots game. They obviously dominated the Cooper Rush Falcons in week one.

1:00:00They can do a lot of things on that side of the ball to keep them in games. Let's remember that they are one and one. Offensively, DK Metcalf's not playing like himself right now. That much is obvious. Michael Pittman was out last week, had a foot issue, didn't play in the game, don't think that's going to be anything that's long-term for them. And Aaron Rodgers got the shit beat out of him. It's a 42-year-old quarterback who was getting hit the whole game. That's obviously not good enough. But if you can keep Aaron clean, if you can let him function, he can do enough to keep you in games. In the big picture, if we're talking about years down the line, because Billy asked why they hired Mike McCarthy, because Mike's got a history of quarterback development.

1:00:43Because at some point, and it's after this year, you're going to be developing a quarterback. It's really happening right now. I don't know if Will Howard's the guy. I don't know if Drew Aller's the guy. I don't know if it's going to be one of those players that takes over as the starter. Maybe you're drafting somebody. Maybe you're, you know, whatever this year's equivalent of Sam Darnold is, who becomes available. Maybe you're signing that guy. But like, Mike has elevated every quarterback he's been around. Brett Favre, end of his career. He was in a downward turn, got him back, that went to the answer championship game in Mike's second year.

1:01:13Dak Prescott was playing at a pretty high level. Mike took him to the best statistically he's ever been. and Aaron was a backup who a lot of people thought was a failed first round pick in Green Bay until Mike began to completely overhaul his mechanics and got him playing at a really high level. So this was a hiring that was much more about we need to do things differently in Pittsburgh. They've had defensive coaches for half a century. Mike's own record, which is how many top 10 offenses in his time as head coach, Billy? 12. 12 out of 18 years, he's had a top 10 offense. It takes some time. Maybe it's not year one, maybe it's year two.

1:01:51But he's got a consistent track record of that. The Steelers offense, I believe eight years in a row, ranked in the bottom quarter of the league. They didn't rank in the top 20 in offense, Mike Tomlin's like, last eight years in a row. That's the definition of mediocrity. They want somebody in here who's going to be able to build this thing a little bit differently. Nine and eight, yeah, maybe that is the target. Maybe that is where they're going this year. But the idea is to re-envision what they need to win. develop the quarterback, and be a lot better beyond that. They're going to be competitive.

1:02:21They're going to be in it. But it's not settling. It's not mediocrity. It's part of the vision that the Steelers have. So I'm going to say overreaction that it's already too soon. That was under an hour, I think. Well, no, that was good. That was good background there. I do still like the defense. I'm with you there. The Steelers offense gave up a touchdown yesterday, and the Patriots scored 20 points. So the defense only gave up 13 points the entire game. So I do still believe in that defense. And I think you are right that if this is a competitive team, and I think I had them around eight, nine this season in the summer that I do think it's going to be led by the defense.

1:02:58I thought that the offensive infrastructure was maybe a little bit better than it's shown through the first two weeks. Cause you're right. Aaron Rodgers is getting killed in that game. I mean, he was, he was just taking an absolute beating where I thought, you know what, this offensive line could be pretty good. DK Metcalf, Michael Pittman Jr., Pat Friermuth, They ran the ball pretty well last year. I'm like, maybe there's some stuff here where they can be a mediocre offense. My issue is that McCarthy has had a lot of success with offenses. We could look back and be like, this is the worst quarterback situation.

1:03:29I know he's had backups in some of those six seasons that he didn't make it, but those 12 seasons, I mean, you got Favre, you had Aaron Rodgers, you had Dak Prescott, and now it's just like this version of Rodgers with this infrastructure based on what I've seen in the first two weeks panicking. but maybe it's an overreaction. It's the point of the exercise. So Tom's saying overreaction.

1:03:50Sheil Kapadia:But is it fair to wonder if like with McCarthy, it's a chicken and an egg situation, right? It's like, well, you had three Hall of Fame quarterbacks along the line too. Like, were they going to be Hall of Fame quarterbacks and you got them or did you make them Hall of Fame quarterbacks or is it a little bit of both, right? Favre was a Hall of Famer before Mike got there. But Favre in 05, 06 was Mike's first year. Like he didn't play great. you know he was in the year-to-year I might retire dance I mean that went on people forget it wasn't just the three times that he came back it was all the years before that where he'd start talking about hey this might be it for me 2007 he was the MVP runner-up behind Peyton Manning went to the NCAA championship game and he's won interception to Corey Webster away from going to the Super Bowl at third at age 37 at that point you know Aaron was again he was this you know juco kid from Cal who like carried the ball up top like a waiter with a plate and like Mike totally overhauled him I'm not saying Mike is like you know he's got some magic dust here but he does have a really good knack for offense he's got a proven track record and he's a good quarterback developer you know for three decades now so all I'm saying is give him some time there's nothing there's nothing about 42 year old Aaron Rodgers needs to develop okay I'll say that square away, but like maybe Will Howard start next year.

1:05:08Maybe Drew Aller, who's got all the talent and just never put it together at Penn State. Maybe he gets something out of him or maybe it's somebody else. I don't know who the quarterback is in 2027. Maybe it's Justin Herbert. Maybe it's a trade. Maybe he's what Justin Herbert's been missing this whole time. Omar Khan loves the big trades. Who knows what it is? But they're setting this up and I still believe, I believe they're a playoff team and I believe that they're going to be competitive right down to the end in large part because of that defense that's looked really good so far. All right. I think successful debut for overreaction, underreaction are just right.

1:05:40I thought that was nice. Hit on a few topics, gets a little spicy, we disagree a little bit. I don't know. You guys don't seem as enthused. No, that was fantastic. I got one more. Overreaction. I got one more on the other side of this break, too, that we need to get into, which is the way that Instant Replay is being used. There was a long review, somewhat controversial, would have been all anybody talked about today. If the Chiefs had not won that game, is it too much? Are we comfortable with this level of replay use? Talk about it next. This episode is brought to you by Nationwide. A football team is so much more than a set of players.

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1:06:59That's why Chevy Silverado is number one in manufacturer loyalty, so they can go where others won't, make their own way there, and always get it done. And as long as Chevy people keep showing up, we'll keep building trucks that do the same. Chevrolet, together, let's drive. Visit chevy.com slash trucks to explore the lineup. So we all sat with bated breath on Sunday night and sat some more. It was several minutes while Laquan Treadwell, who, yes, is still in the NFL, first-round pick in, I believe, 2016 by the Vikings. He is now on the Colts. The biggest catch he's had probably in his entire career.

1:07:45The arc of that play for Laquan Treadwell, from biggest catch of his life to, oh, my God, he blew it, and he's holding his head in his hands, to the three-minute review to he's down by contact, giving the Colts a fresh gasp. That was unbelievable in itself. But I came back to this, Sheil, and I was watching this the entire time and thinking about it, which was they show all the different angles. And you could see various pieces of it. And of course, they got the Hawkeye system. They're piecing everything together. It's supposed to be clear and obvious, right? That's what the standard from the 1990s, Mike Holmgren had the term of like 50 drunks in a bar.

1:08:2750 drunks agree, you overturn it. If it's not, you don't. Are we good with this is how replay is being used, Sheil? Are you good with it? I'm good with it. I didn't think there was anything wrong with that process. You know, me watching it just on my couch, looking at it, I felt like he was down. Now, you are right that the whole, hey, it has to be clear and obvious thing, it feels like they sometimes choose when to use that. I don't know that that would pass the 50 drunk guys test right there. but earlier in the day, you had a Tyler Shug, you know, QB sneak. Now he got his face mask, like, you know, just grabbed on the play.

1:09:05They didn't call it. They didn't call it. So I think that was one of those like, all right, well, we can't reverse this because they're grabbing his face. That's not fair to the Saints. So I think there has to be some level of common sense where it's like, all right, this is the rule, but at the same time, let's judge this in the right way. And I think more often than not, not all the time, but more often than not, they do end up getting to the right outcome there. So I do like the expedited review when they can do that. I don't like just sitting around and watching. But I mean, that's a key play in the game.

1:09:36I mean, that's almost the game right there at that point. So I think if you want to look at it a bunch of times and get your experts together and make sure you get it right, I think ultimately they did get it right. So yeah, I'm fine with it. I don't have an issue with it.

1:09:52Sheil Kapadia:I'm wondering what you thought, Tom, in terms of the reversal of the call because I was watching it and I thought that they got it wrong. Because originally they said, okay, that's a fumble. That would have been the end of the game. So they said, well, let's review this because we can't have the game end on the wrong call. And I didn't, like, I think we need to outlaw and ban because this whole thing of like, let's wear the same gloves as the other team's uniform. So you can either wear the jersey color so you can get away with the holding or you can wear the pants color, which is what happened there.

1:10:20Sheil Kapadia:We had white on white situation, but you'll see teams that's like, oh we're playing a red team we're gonna wear red gloves this day then we can get away with holds you can't see it i feel like we need to go to like neon gloves or something so we can very clearly see like this is when this person touched this person here this is exactly when it stopped happening there's no confusion we don't know because i didn't think that he was down i thought that he he was off of him he hadn't touched him before he had full possession of the ball which is a whole nother thing is because like well if the ball's here but it's slightly moving that was It's not full.

1:10:53Sheil Kapadia:Everything in football is confusing. It's true. Every rule is confusing. And you're always going to, you know what I don't like is the rule expert that just tells us like, as stated fact, I know exactly what's going on here. And it's exactly what the official said. It's always the guy that's in camp for the officials and their officials are always right. Because there was a call earlier in that game where there should have been a first down. And they said, no, no, he's short. He was down there, which is like, okay, the Chiefs always get these calls. But this is ridiculous. This is going to go against the Chiefs, which was a surprise because that's the whole theory out there, Tom.

1:11:26Sheil Kapadia:I don't know if you see on the internet webs out there and the podcast and the Reddits out there that there's this theory that they cheat for the Chiefs all the time. The Chiefs always get the calls. So I didn't love that it took so long. They ended up reversing the call and it wasn't as clear as you would think is necessary for them to reverse a call. One way or another, that was a game changing call. Well, had the Colts gone for it and not decided to kick a field goal and give it right back to the Chiefs to have them win the game anyway. Where I get queasy is just, I don't know that there's a lot of people.

1:12:01Listen, the fans of the two teams, right? They're going to be all in for whichever way, right? But like the rest of us, it's millions of people watching. And if they just said call stands, I don't think it would have been anarchy in the streets. I don't think the 50 drunks in a bar would have rioted because, oh my God, that was so obvious. I also understand where the NFL is in a spot where the 50 drunks to bar 20 years ago, like you really look at those YouTube clips of games from like 2006. And it's like the standard definition and like you can barely even make out like you'll be watching, you know, like a guy you remember.

1:12:35Right. It's like, hey, there's Chad Pennington playing. I think that's him. You can barely even read the number, much less the name on his jersey. But now because we have the slow-mo, because we have the 4K cameras, and because you've got social media where everything's being broken down, you're legislating the game toward those things. And you can argue, certainly, that that's the right thing to do. Because if you have access to the technology, why would you not use it? My understanding of what happened with the Treadwell play and the reason it took so long is because there's so many things going on.

1:13:09It's the control. It's when he's down. It's where the defender's hands are. What they saw, they had two different cameras where they could see and they could put it together, control with Treadwell on his right hand, and then a swipe of the defender's left hand on Treadwell's right thigh. And they were able to put that together. And that was clear and obvious. And there's a bunch of people in the room. Mark Butterworth is the VP of replay. He's ultimately got to put his name on it. He's got to make the call. And it's an unenviable position because, again, when it's that tight, you can see it both ways.

1:13:45I just, for me, that looked very close to stands. I would err on the side of stands. And I would say there's a lot of people who, like, at their core as football fans would prefer, hey, if we need three minutes and 20 different camera angles to look at this, maybe it should stand. that's where I don't know what the correct direction is, but obviously the NFL is in a spot where they're going, we got all the cameras, we got all the info shield, so we are going to nail it down. I'm not going to say it's a de novo review. There's been other calls that have stood, but that one was about as close to it's got to stand as you can get while it still gets overturned.

1:14:24It was true. I mean, that was a very tricky play because of what Billy was saying about when did he actually have control of the ball? If it was a clean catch and he had it right away, it would have been a lot easier. So I feel like, I don't know if it's one in a million, but it's a very rare play that's going to take a little bit more time. So that's interesting. So you guys thought differently than I did, which probably proves your point that if you're taking three people who have no rooting interest in it and we're watching it and we disagree, then the call should just stand. That's the whole thing.

1:14:56That's clear and obvious. Yeah. No, that's true. If you take a poll, maybe that's just what they should do. Listen, we're available. Poll. For a fee, of course. We're available for a fee. We're watching these games anyway. Billy will charge you... $10 for my fee. I was going to say. Billy requests$10 per game. And we'll watch. You can ask us and you can get us the camera angles. We're going to be sitting here getting ready to do a podcast anyway. And majority rules... No, not majority rules. All three of us have to say overturn. If all three of us don't say overturn, then the call on the field...

1:15:30To home jury. stance. There you go. We just solved the NFL's officiating.

1:15:33Sheil Kapadia:You know what I would like to see just for entertainment purposes and entertainment value is on plays like that, the replay room, they have a two minute drill. And then we'll put the cameras on them and we'll go live to them. We'll see them switching here. And there's a clock in the corner that's counting down quickly. And it's like, oh, we got to drag this replay out of the thing. So we stopped. What snacks are they eating? Yeah. They just keep it moving. And we see like the pressure getting to them. And if they don't get a decision in under the two minutes, play stands automatically. Like it doesn't matter where they were going.

1:16:06Sheil Kapadia:If they don't get it in time, play stands. But we seem like go back, go back. No, no, no. Rewind, rewind. We have only 30 seconds left. Oh, eight seconds here. We got to get this out quickly, quickly, quickly. That's what we need in those. Time limit would be interesting. Yeah, that would be interesting. Because to Tom's point, if you're taking that long of a time, then it's not obvious. Like if it is obvious, then you should probably be able to get it within, I don't know if it's two minutes, is it three minutes, but you should be able to get it in a short amount of time. If you're still looking, then it's probably not obvious.

1:16:31The number one complaint when replay went away for several years, like late 80s, early 90s was, it takes forever. And anybody who was watching the NFL in that time frame before, in the first iteration of replay, remembers it would be like, the game would just stop. It could be like five minutes. It's like, what's going on? They've got a VHS tape, they're rewinding it and fast-forwarding it. I mean, that's probably essentially what it was. Now they've got all the cameras. it's almost the paralysis by analysis thing. But in the end, the NFL's philosophy is get the call right. I think that's what everybody wants when it's that close.

1:17:09If I woke up today and it was like that call stood and that's how the Colts lost, I would be like, I'm okay with that. I can live with it. But that's also not the world that we're in in 2026. All right, we're back on Wednesday. Another Ringer NFL show coming your way. big week three coming up in the NFL. We'll have plenty more quarterback updates, injury updates, everything else. Appreciate you joining us. As always, thank you to Chris Arjuna, the whole team behind the scenes. For Billy Shield, I'm Tom. See you next time. Thank you. visit mdgamblinghelp.org in Maryland. Hope is here. Visit gamblinghelplinema.org or call 800-327-5050 for 24-7 support in Massachusetts or call 1-877-8HOPE-NY or text HOPE-NY in New York.

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