Michael Sheen: Handing Back My OBE + Accidentally Stalking My Hero

26:27Michael Sheen:I'm more comfortable with that. But the risk you take, the leap that you take when you do a real person. Like I say, there's nothing like going from, can I get you a coffee, Michael? No, I'm okay. Just a little bit of makeup, right? Okay, and we're going to go for a take then. Okay, and action. Whatever the fucking thing is. It's not like doing anything else. So it's a massive leap and such a risk. So I really do feel nervous about that. But you've just, yeah, you've got to do the swan thing where, you know, the legs are underneath. How much is it, if it's a real life person, which you've done a fair bit of, how much is it of you trying to physically and you know physically look and act and sound like them and how much of it is trying to get like when you were researching clough for example you're obviously watching how he sounded and he's you know he had a distinctive way of everything yeah how much and then how much are you trying to get under his skin in terms of what his motivations were and where he came from well that's that that's the difference i think if you're doing an impersonation yeah someone usually i mean you think back to mike yarwood when i was growing up or you know whoever it might be rory bremner or whatever but um it's usually for a sketch you know it's maybe you're doing it for a couple of minutes if that's usually much shorter um and there's a couple of gags written in there but you're not asking people to go on a journey with you no i mean you you want to get people to focus on the external stuff you want because you want them to go wow he really sounds like you're just trying to sell the thing you're selling it whereas what I'm doing is you know essentially trying to tell a story so you want people to go on that journey with you so you need I found what you need to do is for me anyway you need to do enough to get people comfortable with the idea that okay I accept that you're Brian Clough yeah and that's you know that's hard yeah but if you can get them to do that then you go beyond that you want to be you want to make an audience think about you know what yeah the motivation what's driving this person because I guess what you don't want is people to watch it the whole way through going Michael Sheen's doing a great Brian Clough but what was that about?

28:35Michael Sheen:Well I haven't learned anything exactly, you don't want people in every scene going oh he's really liking that, oh he's not you want to let go of that so in the process of the preparation for it you have to sort of reflect that in the preparation, in the temptation from the very beginning when you first start working on it in researching and preparing, the temptation is to get an impersonation under your belt as quickly as possible because then that makes you go oh I can do it you know but you i have to resist that i have to really resist that and i try for as long as possible to not even try and do a voice or anything like that i just watch stuff and i and i read stuff and i just kind of try and immerse myself in this in the life of this person and just let other things start to come to like start to notice where they might seem a bit vulnerable or you know just little quirky things about them that give you a little insight into what's going on underneath and start with that and then slowly start to, you know, maybe a couple of weeks in I'll try and do a little voice or maybe there's a word or usually there's a phrase.

29:38Michael Sheen:And so slowly you kind of build it up. And then eventually, you know, when you're getting closer, you just got to go, right, I've just got to. You've got to commit to that. I've got to commit to this now and I've got to really go for it. But hopefully it's informed by all that other stuff. Yeah, all of that stuff. You haven't actively. That's the foundation. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Got you. Yeah. So there's layers there. So then when you do go in front of the camera, or on the stage, yes, hopefully you've done enough to kind of satisfy people that you sound and look like the person, but it's really like the bedrock of it is actually what's going on underneath, and that's hopefully what comes through then when you're doing it.

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31:30Ben, could you... This is actually Ben's daughter. Right. Do you want to give this a bit of context, Ben, or do you want to just play it straight in? She's a massive fan of your book. It's something we read literally every night. Spark the Dragon? Yeah. Oh! And, in fact, I had to read it in front of the whole class. You had to read it in front of the whole class? I went in, they have a secret reader thing that my wife organises. Right. and I went in to do it. First of all, it's your daughter and your wife organises it. The idea that you've been forced into this situation because the story's falling apart.

32:03I actually read two books. I read that and I want my hat back. Ah, look at that. This is a big day for you, isn't it, Ben, having both of us here. I know it is. So this is, she's six. Yeah. So just go easy. It's quite sweary. Yeah, okay. Hi, Michael. are you going to make a new book about Sparks the Dragon in his home with his new friends?

32:29Michael Sheen:Oh. Are you? Yes, I hope so. Sorry. I'm just in love with your daughter. Yeah. She's all right. That's the best of her. Yes, I mean, I hope so. So I'm hoping that there'll be a series of books. But I mean, you know, it's not up to me. but hopefully this first one will do well enough that we can do more. We've worked out the second story already. I know what that's going to be, and I'm really excited about it. Each book I want to be, each story I want to be about a different, you know, quite difficult subject to talk about. So the first one is about homelessness. But, you know, it's about a little dragon who's lost his home and is staying with different characters and eventually finds a new home.

33:15Michael Sheen:So for young readers like your daughter, hopefully it provides a kind of a context to have conversations about stuff that might be a bit difficult otherwise. So the second one, the idea is that it would be about young carers. But, you know, it won't seem like that. It'll be about, you know, the story will be the story. But it'd be great to be able to do like more and more of these. That's not what Poppy wants it to be about. Right. What does Poppy want it to be about? She wants it to be about their home with all the family and all the animals living together. Yeah, we got that from the question, but you can't steer the author into what the next book's going to be based on what one six-year-old wants to spend.

33:56As much as charming as your daughter is, I can't believe you just battered it back to him.

34:02Michael Sheen:This is good news. I think my mind has been changed, and yes, she can. She can do that, having listened to her message. no all the characters would be there they'd all be there don't worry so that's Ben's connection with you his daughter loves your book Will also has a connection with you this is quite random it's not as awesome yeah you've seen his dad's arse hang on hang on hang on hang on let's not unpack that just yet and let's think about see if I can work out who your dad is I think this well I think you're going to find it really tough because that's really it's your only i say interaction it's the the only time you see there was no that was there a conversation of the no i don't believe so well i mean it's not like i'm constantly seeing men's ass no that's a good point that is a good point i mean if i go through my life if you go for your ass roller decks your mental ass roller deck um oh god is your is your right okay is your dad an actor no no no no no no or famous or anything.

35:08Michael Sheen:Right, okay. So, but he's shown me his arse. Or have I accidentally, was I one of many who saw his arse? You were the only one to see his arse. The only one. But it was an accident. It was an accident. It was an accident? How did someone accidentally show you their arse? Well, that's the question. When Will told us his story, we asked a lot of these questions you're asking. How does that happen by accident? Can you illuminate it? It was Soccer Aid. Right. It was at a hotel. In a room. Yes. No, he was in the changing rooms of the sauna and it was just you two in there. And he was getting changed and he was completely nude when you came in.

35:45So he quickly turned around, showing his arse right at you. And that is now all he thinks about any time he sees you in there. Not all the time. Not all the time.

35:57Michael Sheen:I mean, please let him know it's all I have ever thought about since as well. It's all I think about. That's going to be what the third spark book's going to be about. for a moment for a moment yeah i thought what you were gonna say i was i once went i was staying in a hotel room in london and i went to some awards do nearby and i walked back to the hotel and um and i went up in the lift got off on my floor went to my room got my key card opened the door and there was a naked man sitting on my sofa and i thought for a moment you're gonna say that was your dad oh my god turns out i got off on the wrong floor and key cards open lots of doors in hotels yeah apparently i was on the wrong floor but the key card had opened the door and he wasn't in my room i had just walked into his room and there was a man there naked going why is tony blair just walking to my room because it was around that time and i and for a moment there i thought you're gonna say my dad was naked yeah sitting in his room and you walked in thank god it wasn't.

37:03Just walk in and go, I'm so sorry, the government are shutting this hotel down.

37:08Michael Sheen:Those balls are nicked. He was naked on the sofa. He was naked on the sofa. Do you think that's acceptable? Well, actually, he had a sort of dressing going on. It was undone. Yeah. And he was sitting legs astride on a sofa. Was it ball to sofa? It was ball to sofa. Watching TV. I mean, come on. Haven't we all done it? You know what the problem is? Watching below deck with your no but the the the thing is it's like then now it makes me i'm already funny about going to hotel rooms do you know what i mean and thinking about what someone could accidentally yeah but not any of that but like then you're sitting on the sofa somebody's balls have been on it oh come on what you think that hasn't happened i'm sure now you're worried about i don't want to engage with those things imagine what has gone on in your room i mean imagine if you could have one of the you know like after a some terrible crime scene the black light and they've got the thing and they can see where the semen and the blood is and like imagine shall i get one of those for christmas for you and you can every hotel room you can go in you can just give it a quick scan and go my god this is a wash with body there just must be so even after a deep clean there must be so much jizz right just i mean just part of the room everywhere it must be I mean in my room anyway yeah yeah certainly certainly after I've stayed if it's a two night stay it's forming part of the structural integrity of the room yeah oh my god right we've got a little game for you after two days you call it a refurbishment I thought whilst I was here I'd just do it up for you yeah yeah you won't need to do that plastering anymore I filled that crack in yeah I've pebbled dashed the entire bathroom

38:58thank me later yeah yeah now that grouting sorted actually right now we've got we've got three quotes here for you yeah that are either something you've said or something we've made up alright okay but there's no numbers to this so they could all be true they could all be and I just want you to decipher which ones you think you've said okay what I would say is I don't think this format point worked right okay it's good okay it's good have faith in it but it's not worked once yet do you know what I mean who's writing the made up ones one of these two but they do stuff like oh I'm Batman do you know what I mean there's too much specific detail you've got to step

39:36Michael Sheen:your game up I'm assuming it's better they're not doing it feel free to step in and write one yourself I'm going to this is the last time I'm using but let's just see there's too much family trauma with Will so it's got to be that Will was like he went to write it then he started crying and he said can I have a moment all I can see is my father's arse But every time they watch him in anything, he thinks about that. That's all he thinks about. Yeah. Okay, this is the first one. Yeah.

40:05It's misquoted. My rule of thumb is that I want to do things I'd like to go and see myself. Yes, that's me. Yeah, that is you. Because I believe that. Yes. Have you ever done something that you... I'm not going to name anything.

40:18Michael Sheen:Yeah. But I have been in stuff. that I thought, I don't know why I'm doing this because I wouldn't watch this. Yeah, I wouldn't watch this. Have you managed to stick to that role? Yeah, no, I've pretty much stuck to that role. I mean, you know, a lot of that is, you know, your good fortune. I mean, you know, a lot of actors, certainly early on, are not having much choice over what they're doing. They're doing whatever you get. And there are periods of time when that happens. So I've been very, very fortunate that I've had sort of choice a lot for most of my career. So it's not a gold star for me.

40:56Michael Sheen:It's just because I've had choice. But there was one time where sort of early on and I had a tax bill to pay. And it wasn't a particularly big tax bill, but I just didn't have the money. So it's too big a tax bill if you don't got the money, isn't it? It doesn't matter what it is. and a friend of mine called me up literally as I'm sitting there going, what am I going to do? How am I going to do this? And a friend called up and said, someone sort of dropped out of something. Would you do it? And they told me how much I would make and it was exactly the amount that I needed to pay the tax bill. So I was like, yep, I'll do it.

41:35Michael Sheen:And it's not necessarily that it was terrible. It wasn't terrible, but I wasn't doing it for the reasons I would normally do it. You got it, yeah. So it's not necessarily a reflection on the thing itself. But it was the only time I was like, I have to do this. How aware are you of how shit hot you are acting? Where does your ability sit for you mentally? Do you? I feel like I'm not as good as I would like to be. Right. And I'm a hair's breadth away from being shit at any moment. Right, okay. Like, you know, it's like a high wire act. I can just about do stuff that can keep me working. Yeah, got you.

42:21Michael Sheen:And, you know, and be seen as being good and work that I can be proud of and all the rest of it. But I could easily drop into a vat of acting shite. I mean, literally at any moment. It could all fall apart. Yeah. And even where I am is not where I would like, you know, what I would like to be. That's exciting though. I think that's what's exciting about stand-up is that you could drop into a vat of shit at any moment. that's what keeps me doing it and I've swam in it and it's a TV format that's just waiting to be done celebrity shit it has got ITV2 written all over it here's the next one hosted by Romesh more than likely I was once described as a cross between a Shakespearean villain and a startled librarian which I took as a compliment I wish I'd said that but I don't think I did I wish I had that's very good That's you, isn't it, Ben?

43:12Michael Sheen:That's you. I said that. No. No, you didn't. That would have been amazing. That's a very good... I mean, it's something I could have said. Yeah. That's very close. I mean, you were putting Ben's work down. Work down, yeah. That's good. I can't do that one. Was that me? I can't remember. I actually can't remember. No, I think... That's good. Well, say it again. I suppose Shakespeare's a Shakespeare villain. Let me just tell you what I think's happened over there, by the way. I think Will knows he wrote it. But we sort of talked about Ben doing it, and now Will's nervous about taking the credit away from Ben.

43:40Right. We've been sharing them. Right, okay. There's a whole power dynamic going on there. I was once... I mean, this is... These guys have got their eyes on a spin-off. Do you know what I mean? Eventually, there'll be a camera here, and the interview will be happening in the background, and they're just sort of doing some sort of...

43:58Michael Sheen:The only thing that's not working about this format is the whole... Absolutely. As far as they're concerned. Yeah, I was once described as a cross between a Shakespearean villain and a starter librarian, which I'll take as a compliment. It's good. It's very good. It's very good. I mean, in a way, the character I play in Good Omens is sort of a startled librarian. I mean, he is sort of that. And, of course, I've played Shakespeare villains, I suppose. Yeah. So, yeah. Well done, Will or Ben. Very good. Just before we get into the last one, when you're acting, I did stage with you. I don't know if you remember.

44:29Yes. Yeah. Yes. So I was playing a host of like a COVID-y show.

44:35Michael Sheen:I feel like you've been in my house because I filmed that in my house. Right, right, right. I remember doing it. And I also remember I probably had the biggest beard I've ever had in my life. I looked like a member of the band. Yeah, it was great though. Yeah, that's the best I've ever looked at. But I was very intimidated because you two are very good at what you do. How aware are you of... You're not a judgy person, I don't feel like, but do you... What do you think of other... Are you analysing other actors? are you too busy thinking about what you're doing? Have you ever been in something where you thought, this person's shit?

45:10Yeah. Right, okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

45:12Michael Sheen:It's more that you're aware that the scene isn't working right or something's not right. It's not necessarily thinking, oh, that person's terrible. But you're just like, oh, this isn't quite working right. And that's part of why I love working with David Tennant because when we work together, you just feel like everything works. Yeah, yeah. And so it's not, you know, you're not necessarily thinking about what each of you is doing, but you just go, oh, there's no like bumps here. There's no any of the things that can happen sometimes to do with the personality or the way someone approaches the work or the way they act or whatever it is, the way you, what you're doing in the scene.

45:48Michael Sheen:There's just none of that. You're just in the pocket. You just, yeah, there's no ego. There's no nothing. It's just, and so sometimes it's not even necessarily that someone's not being very good, but just something is a bit bumpy. You know what I mean? now this is so quotable okay if I weren't an actor I'd be a frustrated actor

46:13Michael Sheen:oh I hope that's me because that's good it is you is it me oh well done Michael well done Uncle Michael I've got a niece when she was very little used to occasionally say well done Uncle Michael and so I sort of boost myself with that sometimes so that's very well done. I think it's a nice thing to say to yourself. Is that true? Yeah, oh definitely. You would have pursued this route to rack and ruin I cannot see any other path of me. Got you. That's good stuff. Yeah. That's up there with the Shakespeare librarian. I think it's beyond that. Yeah, sorry. It's better than. Sorry, yeah, sorry. God Christ.

46:48Okay, last question. Yeah. You've got a choice. You've got two options here. So basically the team would like to have some sort of viral moment from you. Right. So some sort of exclusive or something that you've never said before. Is it a sort of arse-based viral moment? Doesn't have to be. Doesn't have to be. Doesn't have to be. But in keeping with the show. Yeah, that'd be great. Yeah, we've sort of horribly stumbled onto a theme. Or, you can answer this question. Is there any real-life character you've been asked to play that you said no to because you just didn't want to play them? So it's up to you.

47:19You can do either of those or neither, actually, because the truth is you've done us a solid by coming on here and we're not in any position to force you to do anything.

47:27Michael Sheen:I mean, I wish I had something interesting enough that could be a viral moment. Having said that, the last time we were together... We need to talk about this. We need to talk about it. Oh, my God. I was supposed to ask you about this. I feel a sort of connection to everyone who was on that panel. Yes, yes. And yet we've never talked about it or spoken about it. So this is where we asked you to deliver a rousing... On a league of their own. On a league of their own. We asked you to deliver this sort of rousing speech to the Welsh team. We're about to go to the World Cup. Yes. So it was just like a thing in the moment.

48:03And what then happened? Talk me through what was going on in your head as this was happening. Can I tell you completely honestly? Yeah. I genuinely thought you were going to say something like you'd been hired to do a cameo. We just go, Wales, good luck. Hope you smash them up. One love, Mikey Sheen. Yeah. You know, I thought it was going to be that. Yeah.

48:26Michael Sheen:What you did. So on the night, we're sitting there, and you do ask me that. Yes. And then I start speaking. I hear the voices singing. Speed your journey, boys, boys. One nation singing with one voice. A song of hope, a song of courage, a victory song. At what point did you think, what the fuck is he doing? What is going on? This is the worst thing I've ever seen in my life. No, at no point did I. It must have been really embarrassing to begin with, wasn't it? No, no, no. No, the truth is, I think maybe a couple of words, maybe like three, four words in, I thought this is going to be something special.

49:16And then it just continued building to the point where, honestly, I think I said it on the night, I wish I was Welsh. like I wish this was in some way addressed to me but then but so then everybody afterwards I don't because we I think you got we gave you a standing ovation the audience went on the audience completely yeah went on their got on their feet went nuts right the production team are just walking around like dogs with two dicks you know just absolutely like losing their shit about it did you know it was going to go you can't have known it was going to go like that did you think it would go well you I thought it was going to go well.

49:52Michael Sheen:So a lot of people say to me, had you worked out what you were going to do beforehand? And I was like, well, I'd had a few ideas and I thought about it a bit. And then as we're sitting there on the day, I'm thinking, well, you know, you might not even ask me. So there's no point in... And as the show was going on, I was thinking, oh, I really hope you don't ask me. Because I was like going, the vibe is not right. It's not the vibe. We're in England. It's a completely English audience. Everyone on this panel is English. It's just not the vibe. And then you asked me, and then I thought, oh, fuck right, if I am going to do this, I'm going to have to do 150%.

50:30Michael Sheen:The only way to make this work is to really go for it. And so I just threw everything at it. You sons of speed, as they fall around us, we're still here!

50:46I think it's one of the most viral clips you've ever had on a league of their own. I've realised now that if I'm lucky enough when I die

50:55Michael Sheen:to have an actual bit on the news, that's what they'll show. It doesn't matter any of these things that we've talked about, but that's what they'll show. I hope they keep my bit in.

51:09If you've enjoyed this episode of the Romesh Ranganathan Show, make sure you follow wherever you get your podcasts, Apple, Spotify, YouTube, all the big ones, and you can enjoy more great content like this. And in fact, I'd go further to say, even if you didn't enjoy this episode, just follow anyway for shits and giggles. And if you've got an interesting story or a question for my mum and I, or even like a family dilemma you'd like us to help you with, please do get in touch via our email address podcast at rangaby.com or you can voice note or text on this number 07731 623355. I'm Ramesh Ranganathan and this has been the Ramesh Ranganathan Show.

51:45What a narcissist. See you next time. Oh, shut up, Ramesh.

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