How to Stop Reacting and Start Winning with Difficult People | Ryan Leak

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27:09I have so much on my plate. if I'm sitting around thinking about what this it's like no I'm I'm gonna be distracted from the room that I'm actually in because I'm thinking about this other person and so I wouldn't say it's not that I don't get angry when I think about that person or or that transaction if you will but again I I have been on the receiving end of people who gave with strings attached and I'm like, you didn't, then you didn't give it.

27:44Lewis Howes:Unless it was like, okay, there's a, I'm going to deliver something. You're going to, it's a business deal. I'm going to speak on stage. You're giving me a check to deliver a service because we have an agreement. That's different. Totally. This is not, hey, I'm just going to give you five grand to help you out. But then later, oh, you owe me the, you know, or something else. Or, you know, something happens to you. You're like, hey, Ryan, I need to borrow a hundred grand. I say, hey, man, I'm going to give you a hundred grand. If I bring that up over dinner two years later, then I didn't give it.

28:14It's not even like. Unless there was an agreement you're going to pay this back. There's something. There has to be an agreement. But I just, the giving, I grew up around some generous people. What's this generous means? They were generous, but they always brought it up. They always hung it over my head. I always buy dinner. Well, then stop buying dinner. Right. It's like if you're going to bring it up, then it's not generous anymore. Does that make sense? There is a string attached. And so for my wife and I, when we give, we really try to like walk away. It's yours. And now I'm not like watching you.

28:58It's like, no, if God told us to give it, then we have to let it go. And so I just, I never want to give and be looking over somebody's shoulder.

29:10Lewis Howes:How do you know when to give or who to give to? Yeah. So for us, we have several, and being a speaker, it's kind of nice because you get to meet so many different kinds of people doing all sorts of different things. and if it's a cause, there's somebody on our team. She helps raise money for single moms. And I was like, that's so awesome. And she had just joined our team. And so I looked at my wife, I said, hey, what do you think about this organization? Hey, could you send me the website? We send the website. And we just give. Scripture talks about not letting the left hand know what the right hand's doing when it comes to generosity.

29:50Like the more you're involved in it, the more your ego can get involved. In fact, in Jewish culture, we're getting deep into generosity. There was eight levels of generosity. Really? Yeah, eight levels. The first level was where you give, but you give with a grudge.

30:12Lewis Howes:Begrudgingly. Yeah, you can have it. Frustrated. Yeah, but it goes all the way to, each level has a different level of ego attached to it. Sometimes you can give with a smile on your face, but you don't give enough. You need a hundred. I go, Hey, here's 50, but I smile. I got you. But then there were actually like rabbis that would walk around towns and they would keep coins on the back of their robes. So people would, the poor could actually grab money off of their robes, but they didn't actually know who it was. They kept moving. Wow. Interesting. And then there were other times, different levels of generosity where they would actually put coins in poor people's like mailboxes back then, if you will.

30:53So they knew who the receiver was, but the receiver didn't know. Interesting. So you don't know that it's me. Then there's like anonymous giving. It's like, you know, so we like to do anonymous giving where our friends get supported. Like, man, you won't believe what happened. I'm like, I do believe what happened, you know? But it's like, the more you're involved, the more ego that is there, the highest level of generosity is actually not giving them money. It's putting them in a position to make money themselves. those. That's the highest level of generosity is not giving them fish. It's teaching them how to search.

31:27Lewis Howes:Sometimes people don't want to learn how to fish. No. They say they want to, but really the work and time and energy that takes to invest in generating fish, generating money. Totally. They want the easy relief now. Yes. That's the hard thing though. It's like, how do you know if someone in your life or people aren't willing to learn how to fish for themselves and they're always coming back for more, how do you navigate that from being an enabler to someone who's empowering? Totally. You know, for me, I'm always, I mean, again, it goes back to peace or pause. There's people that we've given to on one month and then the next month they ask, but just say, hey, no, not this time.

32:09And that's just peace or pause for us. Sometimes I'll tell a friend, you don't need my money, you need my mind. If I gave you an hour of my time, the money you're asking for, you're asking the wrong question to the wrong person. If you have somebody like Mai's phone number in attention, you should be asking me for 30 minutes.

32:31Lewis Howes:not this does that make but that goes back to them they may they even if they took it they may not act on it you know what i mean they may not act on the wisdom they have to be ready for that you know they have to one and seek it out that's what my friend calls an ask hole an ask hole is somebody that asks the same questions over and over again doesn't but doesn't do it yeah yeah I got some assholes in my life. But man, I just, I think where my posture towards humanity and other people, the chill nature of that, I think comes from the fact that, man, so many people in my life gave me a shot when they shouldn't have.

33:15They gave me a pass. And so it's hard for me to hold people to the letter of the law. It's not that I don't get mad or I don't get bothered. It's just that I know that there was somebody that should have been mad at me and wasn't. And talked to me in a tone that was respectful and showed me a lot of grace. So it's hard for me to hold people to the letter of the law when I've been given so much. I could go on forever telling you stories about when my dad had a stroke. I was at that private school we were getting ready to leave that private school because we couldn't afford to be there anymore and there was a freshman English teacher named Mrs.

33:59Holstead who came to my mom and she says hey me and my husband see your boy's potential we'll pay for their tuition wow so again it's like they didn't know me they they're just they're just rolling the dice and and I actually talked to Mrs. Holstead about a month ago unbelievable unbelievable conversation what happened well because she's just I said hey I don't know if you know this but I talk about you a lot in corporate marriage slash all over the world you know she said you do? I'm like yeah I'm thinking you should be a little bit more excited that I'm like you know telling the story about you and she's like yeah you know Ryan that was just me being faithful to what God asked me.

34:37Wow like it's not like a show for her and I said where does your spirit of generosity come from? She said in this world there are givers and takers my mom was a taker and my dad was a giver and she said i love my mom but i wanted to be like my dad and so not super wealthy but very very generous and there's a massive difference so so man i i could that i could go on and on of so many people in my life that just helped me stay in college. I didn't have a scholarship at a D3-ish school. No scholarship coming in, man. Yeah. So it's, so, so many people helped me out along the journey when I wasn't who I am today.

35:28You know, they were just looking at potential. And so sometimes I want to hold people to the letter of the law and go, why won't you just get your act together? Why won't you just listen to me? Why won't you just take my advice? If you would just listen to me, your life would be so much better. But it's like, dude, I've been hardheaded. I've not listened before. I've received advice that I didn't practice and yet people didn't cut me off. They stayed in relationship with me. And so for me, I wouldn't say it's easy, but when you've been given a lot of grace, it's hard to withhold it from other people.

36:02Lewis Howes:But there's a lot of difficult people out there. There's a lot of difficult people out there. And you talk about this in your book. And I'm curious, I think most people aren't clear on what they're supposed to do with difficult people. Maybe they've tried a lot of different strategies. Maybe they've tried to avoid them or confront them or just power through. But what are people actually doing wrong when dealing with difficult people? Well, number one, I think people are reacting to difficult people. All of us are at our worst when we're reacting. Every single one of us. I don't know one great reactor.

36:34I don't know anybody that's like, you know what? I'm really good when I'm reacting. Like who has good reacting skills? Who's writing a book on how to react well? It's like, no, you're reacting. And so if you're reacting, you're never going to be the kind of person you actually want to be. And so what we talk about in books and in seminars and in keynotes is like, you've got to be a proactive person, which means you have to prepare for difficult people ahead of time. What's funny about people that are navigating difficult individuals is they're always surprised by them. Always. In fact, in our research, we kept hearing this phrase over and over again.

37:10I can't believe. Can you believe they said this? Can you believe they left this comment? Can you believe they hit reply all? Can you believe that they would say that in front of my boss? Can you believe that they would bring up my past? Can you believe that they ghosted me? I can't believe. I can't believe. I can't believe. And we're like, I actually think you should believe them. Like you've known this person for a very, very long time and you're letting this person catch you off guard and you're reacting, be proactive. Proactive means you're going, all right, if I've known this person for a long time, history tells me that Monday they could act a fool.

37:45And historically, my plan has been when they act a fool, I act foolisher. I act more of a fool. I explode even more. You know, it's like, so I'm going to match act a fool for act a fool. It's like, well, that's not a good plan. And so if you know this person has act-a-full potential on a Monday morning, why don't you on Monday morning go, you know what? What if I prepared for act-a-full? What if I called act-a-full on the way to work and said, hey, can I get you a cup of coffee? What do you mean? Hey, I'm pulling in a Starbucks. Can I get you a cup of coffee? I knew you were going to have an attitude, but I'm prepared for it.

38:25But I'm not going to let your bad attitude create a bad attitude in me. In the process of working with people that we don't like, we can become people we don't like. That's what this book is all about. It's about going, everybody wants me to come in and go, so can you fix them for me? I'm like, yeah, but I can't work on them until we talk about us. Because this is what you can actually control. So if I can prepare for complicated people, if I can prepare for difficult people, well, my energy is different walking in the room because I'm actually expecting it. So a lot of it comes down to expectations that are often unspoken.

39:10I don't know what the data is, but I would say most of our expectations are unspoken for humanity around us. And when somebody doesn't live up to the expectations that we have internally. that we think others are going to be like us right which most people aren't they aren't and which would be a terrible world if everybody else is just like us but that's what most people's plan is though like whenever they get a difficult person they go if i can just change them especially marriage if i could just get in there and change it it's like yeah but that quietly communicates to the world around us that the world would be a better place if everybody else is just like us.

39:49That's just not true. So if that's the case, then I think we have to be the kinds of people who step back and just go, all right, how can I prepare for this? Knowing that this person is coming, knowing that this person is coming over for Thanksgiving, knowing that I'm going to be in a meeting with them on a Tuesday, knowing that I'm going to see them on Friday night, knowing that they're going to try and sit next to me at my kid's soccer game. It's like, we just act so surprised. And so we just try to help people to go, stop being surprised. They're coming. They have packed their bags. It's on a flight.

40:20It's coming. The question is, how are you going to show up when they do? Don't react, be proactive.

40:26Lewis Howes:But what if you can't, you don't, you weren't expecting it. Let's say you weren't proactive. You didn't know they were going to show up and they showed up unexpectedly. Sure. You know, it's some new person that shows up that you weren't even aware of and they show up in a way that's causing chaos in your inner world or your environment. How do you prepare for the unexpected? Some people will literally trigger your nervous system. It's a thing. Yes. Do you get triggered? Yes. Your nervous system get triggered? I mean, I don't know if I would go that deep, but it could. You seem like a pretty relaxed, calm guy.

40:59For the most part.

41:00Lewis Howes:For the most part. But how do you handle it when your nervous system gets triggered then? Literally, I have to have a conversation with God internally to go, okay, I know I want to react right now, but let me try to think about what's going on with this person that I cannot see. So I believe that every difficult person that you deal with has a difficult behind the scenes that they've not told you about. And if you could see that, you would understand the behavior and the words that are coming out of their mouth that most of the time don't have anything to do with you at all. Well, good. And so if my kid has an outburst, if a colleague is saying something just wild, I have to go.

41:55hey are you okay hey what something feels off and then I try to move towards the mess and have a real conversation and say hey there's a because we can talk about what you just said but I think I think we would be missing the forest for the trees if we went there so it seems like there's something underneath the surface that's happening here. Can we talk? Can we dial it down just a little bit? Part of it is being the adult in the room. Also, when I say expect complicated, I also have a job where I go to a place every couple of days where the angriest people in the world go every single day, the airport.

42:42Okay. Listen, people be mad all the time. And they'd be getting mad at stuff that's completely outside of their control. They're mad at the airlines, I'm mad at gate agents, I'm mad at TSA. I have just, I just started going, you know what? There could be delays. And if there is, well, then I guess I'm just going to have a good day at the airport. I've made up my mind. I call it pre-decisions. I think you need to make good decisions. I think you need to make better pre-decisions. Pre-decision is saying, hey, I've already decided what kind of week I'm going to have. I've already decided what kind of day I'm going to, I've already decided how I'm going to show up to that.

43:19I've already decided how I'm going to show up to that line. I have, that decision is already made. I have already made a decision to forgive people in the future who have yet to hurt me. I've already made that decision so that when it comes, I'm not like, well, what should I do? Not sure. It's like, no, I already made this decision that I'm going to be a forgiving person. I've already made that decision. And so if I've already made that decision, you could say something crazy today. And it doesn't mean it doesn't hurt my feelings, but I've already made a decision that says, you know what? I don't know everything that's going on in Lewis's day, but perhaps something happened to him that would make him say something to me and I can't see it all.

44:04And all I know is this, is if I said something crazy to Lewis, what would I want him to do for me? I want him to forgive so in light of that i'm gonna let it go and the other alternative is this i can get angry hold on the bitterness and carry that to the airport why would i do that if i have a choice which i believe people have choices yeah it's so i'm always like man they're like choose joy what do you mean choose joy i'm like okay you tell me your choice choose bitterness choose anger you want to heart like if we if we get to make choices and peace is on the table joy is on the table i'm grabbing peace what are you gonna grab and so but it is it's i've i've made a decision about my future and so it it allows me to enter into spaces that can be toxic that could be chaotic and i don't have to become chaotic in the midst of chaos i've made a decision i can't tell you how many times an event planner is freaking out.

45:08Oh my gosh. Hey, how are you? She's like, you just have such a calming presence. I go, I know, but I've been expecting you all month. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I knew you were coming. So I pre-decided that I wasn't going to freak out with you because I knew you were going to freak out. So somewhere in your world, you can't always get it perfect. But again, when you've made several pre-decisions about how you're going to show up in a room, another pre-decision, completely different. I've pre-decided that I won't walk in a room and prove myself to anybody. Pre-decision. Improve yourself. Prove myself. What does that look like?

45:53Because man, I - What does that not look like, I guess? and that used to be like my whole internal world was I got to impress you. I got to impress people. It's how to build a brand. You're a speaker. You got to prove yourself. And one day I just made a decision that says, actually, I don't have to do that. And it was so freeing. Oh, it was so freeing. And here's what's crazy is when I stop trying to prove myself, you make a much better impression because you're just way calmer. You're just you. You're way more yourself than when you're trying to like prove something to somebody. So when you're building something great, the people around you matter from day one.

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48:06Lewis Howes:Culture. I mean, wanting to be successful. Growing up broke. You know, it's, this is the way of the world. This is just how it works. And you've first impressions are everything, everything that you hear, you know, as an adolescent and in college, you know, you've got to, you've got to make a good impression. I mean, in fact, like I still do interviews as weird as that sounds for gigs. Like I still get interviewed for jobs all the time. Where they're like, Hey, we're interested in you speaking here, but we wanted to get on a call first. Yes. And I lose it all the time. Really? All the time. He's not our guy.

48:46Oh, wow. Like, I still live in that. Like, even as successful as I am now, it's like I still can feel that pressure of, like, I got to do this song and dance for you. And sometimes I'll just give a vibe like, actually, I don't sing and I don't dance. And so... If you want me to take me, if not. If you want me, great. And sometimes, but I used to be like, oh my gosh, what do you want me to do? Just tell me. And you want me to sing? Okay, so I'll sing. Or you want me to tap dance? And then one day I'm like, I'm exhausted trying to be everything for everybody else. And so again, I just made a pre-decision that says, hey, I'm happy to share with you what I can do to add value to your organization.

49:38but I don't have the posture of, oh, I gotta, I gotta prove it.

49:43Lewis Howes:But how old were you when that started to like transform from proving to being at peace with who you were? All right. So I'm 39 right now. When did that happen? 38? Six months ago. 39. I mean, now, I mean, it's, I did, I'm, I'm always a work in progress. You know, there, there is a, there's a lot that can be thrown at you, especially you throw a lot of money into the mix and you can feel the like to pay you a lot of money you know the amount of times somebody has told me hey i you you're very expensive and uh you know i signed the contract and the ceo doesn't know it so no pressure i'm right you're like uh well i didn't tell you to do it like but now it's like there's pressure so it there's it's taken a lot of inner God dialogue to get to a place where I just show up and kind of say, hey, I'm going to get my best.

50:42And I think this is going to go well. I think I'm pretty good at what I do. I've put in the hours. I love my craft. I work on my craft every single day. I lock in for every single client I have. Sometimes you miss. Sometimes you miss, man.

50:59Lewis Howes:That's why we didn't go D1. I feel like there's a lot of lies that people tell themselves. You're around people all the time from the corporate world to sports to everyday people. What do you think is the biggest lie people believe? The biggest lie people believe starts with I can't. they have more I can'ts than they have I can'ts and so those I can'ts really can steer people's lives a lot and I think that's a big lie that people believe that they will always fall short of their potential because of their I can'ts and we can fill in the blank on what the I can't is You know, I think another big lie that I see with a lot of people is they have this, like, if it's never been done before, then how could it ever be possible with me?

52:05I mean, how many people have sat on this very podcast that were the first? Yeah. Yeah, for sure. And so most people believe that they have to be second. It's a big lie. It's never been done before. Most people want tried and true, but for something to be tried and true, somebody's got to try.

52:24Lewis Howes:That's right, man. So that's why they pay me the big bucks. Because I'm there to get you to try. I'm there to get, oh, you go first. No, no, we're going to wait for somebody else to jump in the pool. I'm like, somebody's got to test the pool. Why not you? Why not me? What's the biggest lie you believe about yourself right now? Biggest lie that I believe about myself right now is that I'm just a speaker. That that is the only value that I bring to the world is with a microphone. What is on the other side of that lie? I don't know. Working through that. I don't know. I mean, it's like you spend so much of your career trying to be good at this thing.

53:10And then you get good enough, if you will. And then one day you wake up and you go, am I supposed to be doing more than this? Less than this. More or less. Something different. Something, yeah, you know. And then you get the everybody's got a plan for your life. So does God sort of thing. And then, yeah, so you can believe a lot of lies in there. If just you are, the only value you're bringing is what you can do on a stage or what you can do for somebody's phone on social media. You know, you can easily fall for the trap of believing like those things are your identity. So for me, I think it's a daily fight to go.

53:54I'm not, I'm not only what you see on your phone. I'm not only what you see on a stage. And, um, so yes, I think trying to answer that question of like, who are you and what do you bring to the world? Um, is, is, uh, is an interesting dance for sure.

54:16Lewis Howes:What was the biggest limiting belief you had growing up that you had to overcome? Man, there's probably so many narratives around race really oh yeah just being black and what that means and what you know you you hear so many things about what it means to be a black man in america and most days i'm just like i'm just emailing like crazy and it's not like i don't sign my email ryan link the black guy you're like Like, let's go. Let's move on to the next thing. And so then it's like, well, as a, and again, sometimes it's like a limiting belief that is partially true in some ways. And so I spoke for a Fortune 100 company.

55:05I was the first black speaker that they've ever had for their executive retreat. And there is one black guy on their board and he told me, he came to me after and he He goes, no, it can't even be before. He goes, you're the first black guy. Don't be the last.

55:21Lewis Howes:Oh my gosh. All right. Prevoid speech, no pressure. Yeah. And then he goes, and then I finished and he goes, because you were first, you won't be the last. He goes, you crushed it. He goes, you are the perfect first. And I'm like, thanks. You know, it's like, I don't, you don't really know what, like, are you limiting what I can do from your vantage point? because I don't plan on limiting myself. And so - That's good. I think another limiting belief that permeates every day is that. So it's different. So I do 120 events a year. 100 of those events are corporate America events all over the place.

56:02And then 20 of those are in megachurches. And so what I have been told is that you can't do both. You have to pick one. You either have to pick a pastoral life We have to pick a keynote speaker life, but you cannot mix the two. You cannot speak in churches and speak at these top companies. You can't do that on your social media. I've been told by plenty of people, you have to stop posting faith content. You can't do that.

56:29Lewis Howes:So it's almost like the religious people have limited you. And the ones in the setting have kind of said, hey, you got to kind of pick and choose. Or is it the corporate people have said that? Both. Really? Both sides. Both sides have said, I've heard it from both sides. But the corporate people keep booking you, and you're doing it, and not holding you back. Yes. But even when I first got in, it was like, hey, dude, you got to delete your faith stuff. Literally was told that. Other speakers right now would be like, how is Ryan getting away with that? Because the mantra is, if you continue to talk about your faith this much, corporate America won't trust you because they'll think you're coming in to preach or I don't know what they think is going to convert to something.

57:15But it's only grown the more that I, so yeah, some people will put that limiting belief on you of going, if you're going to be effective in the church, then you can't be effective in business. And it's like, or you could just do a good job in both. It's kind of my mind.

57:30Lewis Howes:Exactly. Blend the two. Cause it sounds like you're, you've learned now how to not be a people pleaser. Yeah. That's what I'm hearing you say in the last six months. Yeah. No, literally. Because you've had to figure out, okay, I want to make corporate people happy and faith-based people happy and make sure that I'm not doing the wrong things. But it sounds like you're just being you. Yeah. Do you think someone can truly reach their potential if they're being a people pleaser to others? No, absolutely not. I think that if you do the hard work of being yourself, which is a lot of work, man. Or it could be the easy work.

58:07Lewis Howes:Just be yourself and stop pleasing everyone else. Either how you look at, you know, it's hard for me. It's been hard for me for a long time, but the more you practice it and you're just like, oh, I'm just going to be me. And I have my five core friends around me and I don't need everyone else to like me. Hopefully they respect me or they like me, but I don't need to care what they think about me. because I have my wife and my kids and my five friends that I play pickleball with, you know, whatever. I'm good. But it's so, I grew up where it was so hard where I wanted everyone to like me, right?

58:40Lewis Howes:I didn't want people to not like me. That was based on wounds and traumas and different things that I've learned how to heal. And it was exhausting trying to get everyone to be okay with who I was and the shape-shifting or changing to please someone else or the song and dance. Yeah. It was exhausting. Oh, yeah. And it's like, I'm going to imagine what I could have done with the energy I had that I lost by trying to please other people. Yeah. I think sometimes, you know, I mean, you're a high performer. You have a lot going on. You know, it's, you're what I would call not normal. and then you have people in your world who would really benefit from you being normal oh yeah like just come to the barbecue they'd feel more comfortable like they would and so that like what do you mean you can't come you're like well you I don't know if you know I got it I got this commitment over here I got this dream I got this thing yeah yeah I kind of got this Olympic thing going I don't know if you it's like you you are you're doing like you're trying to make an Olympic team?

59:51Yeah, a little bit. Yeah. I got it. Yeah. It's like, I got, I got, I got work to do. And so not everybody's going to understand that. And so that, that, that is the piece, especially over the last three years for me, where people did, I had to get really okay using a phrase with acquaintances that they were very uncomfortable with, because there are people who we were acquaintances in, I don't know, 2015. I don't know, maybe we played basketball together. And then they see whatever proverbial success they believe I have now, they'll be like telling their friends, yeah, yeah, yeah, Ryan's my boy.

1:00:35We're friends. And then they kind of like want to cash in on our friendship or whatnot. And I've just, I've just, I've had to say this to a few people over the last year. So, hey, I love you, but we're not friends.

1:00:52Lewis Howes:When you're building something great, the people around you matter from day one. And I know how easy it is to get pulled away from the work that actually moves the mission forward. That is where JustWorks comes in. It's an HR platform built for small businesses that care about growth and their people. Payroll, benefits, compliance, hiring, all handled in one place so you can stay focused on what matters most. Go to JustWorks.com to learn more. They do your human resources right, so you can do right by your people. JustWorks. For your people. The School of Greatness is proudly sponsored by Amica Insurance.

1:01:28Lewis Howes:It feels good to be understood. Amica goes above and beyond to customize the right coverage for you by taking the time to really understand your needs. because creating peace of mind is at the heart of Amica's mission. And whether you're at home or on the road, Amica knows it's not just about where you're going, but who you go with. Go with the insurer that truly understands you. As a mutual company, Amica puts its customers' needs first. Visit amica.com and get a quote today. Oh, man. Gosh, I've done that in the last few years. Without the I-love-you part, but just we're not friends. We're not.

1:02:02Lewis Howes:I haven't spoken to you in years. you want something from me and acting like we're friends we're not friends it was probably the scariest thing the scariest thing to do to say that the first time we're not friends but then afterwards it just felt so free oh my god the free dude i was like when i said it i was like i can't believe i'm saying this yeah because i all i wanted when i was a kid was friends this is whatever you just want to be alone right yeah but it's like comes a time where you just can't fake it anymore you know what i'm saying dude like i the more i started saying it they'd be like i'm gonna call it six months from ryan lewis we're not like i would i would just say like and they would be so hurt hearing that really and then i would just say what are my kids names oh yeah oh like what day yeah what's my wife's name like what Tell me something that's going on in my actual life that you don't see on social media.

1:03:01Zing. Yeah, what are my kids' names? We're not friends. You see my highlights on the internet. That's it.

1:03:11Lewis Howes:You don't know anything. And we played pickup basketball 10 years ago. Yeah, I don't even play anymore. That's how much you were not friends is the fact that you still think that you wouldn't even know that. And sometimes I've had to tell people, we don't have a bad relationship. We don't have one. Right. We're just not friends. We're not friends. That's not a problem. That's okay. I respect you. Yeah. I wish you the best. Yeah, I do. I wish you the best. There's no ill will here. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But why am I pretending that we're closer than we really are? And conversely, I don't know your kids' names.

1:03:48Yeah. I don't know what's going on in your lives. Some people will say, you never call me. I'll go, my phone works. You haven't called me either. Why is the onus all on me? It's like, we're not friends. Yeah, we're not friends. And I started doing that at 38. Six months ago. Is it crazy? I mean, it's, and there is something. So when I was turning 30, the last day of my 20s, I was speaking for somebody. And I was talking about a documentary that I had done. and this lady, she says, I was literally, I was 20. I had one day left in my twenties. And she goes, do you want to know why we booked you to speak?

1:04:31I said, why? She goes, it's not because you're a good speaker. She said, your documentary. Well, my daughter's dating this guy and he's, he's kind of a druggie and he lives on the floor of a crack house, but he does love basketball. Your documentary is about basketball. So I actually had him over to the house and we watched your documentary. And because of your documentary, he called 73 junior colleges and asked them if he could come and play basketball. And he's going to be playing college basketball this fall. He called his mom who he had not spoken to in five years. She said, you're not a good speaker.

1:05:10She said, you pulled a young man's life off the floor. and that day I said, how do I want to spend my 30s? And at the time I was on an executive team at a big church and I just thought, man, I love this church, but somebody else can be on the executive team. And I quit. Wow. And I said, I want to spend my 30s pulling people's lives off the floor. If I have that ability, I want to do everything in my power to make that happen. That's pretty cool. So now that I'm entering into my 40s, I'm asking myself that question too of going, how do I want to spend my 40s? And part of that is, is as I'm filling in the blank, as I'm inching towards August 20th, when I turn 40, I'm going, I don't want to be juggling these random relationships that I really don't have when I could just be honest with that person and just go, man, I respect you, hope things are well, but like, we're not, we're not friends stop putting me in group chats connecting me with people that we're not even good I don't want to get connected to yeah I don't it's it's sort of to be able to have some of those conversations I wasn't willing to do that even six seven months ago it's scary man but but yeah as as you enter into your 40s you go man I really I really want to enjoy my 40s and I really want to be surrounded by the people that are actually my friends instead of using a bunch of little energy for a lot of small relationships that really are superficial and whatnot.

1:06:46So it's, again, it's a daily journey for me. I wish that was all polished and put together, but that's just not

1:06:52Lewis Howes:the truth. In the next six months, text me how many times you tell that to someone and I'll let you know we'll hold each other accountable we're not friends yeah we'll get in their own group chat group that we're not friends chat yep here's the person bro if i sent you some screenshots of people that were like come on man we go way back i'm like way back where where do we go way back to you know something i heard you say before is why having a backup plan actually is the thing that's killing most people's dreams why is that yeah you know i i think whenever there is a, this idea of here's my parachute, you, you don't, you don't go all in.

1:07:35You don't give it your best because you have that fallback plan. So it's not about a wisdom side of things. It's about putting yourself in the prime position to move towards your goals. And, you know, the famous scene that the dark night rises, how did he make the jump without rope? Mm-hmm. It's the only way you can make it down. So good. It was just an iconic scene. And as soon as he said, without rope, everyone in the theater went, Or you die. You're either making it or you're dead. But when you know you don't have rope, you jump a little higher. Oh, yeah. And that is, it's like, Ryan, what can I do to jump a little higher?

1:08:14Run a little faster. Lose the rope. It's the only way that you, it's like, do I train harder? It's just like, I mean, that'll help. but when you don't have that rope and it's your only thing, you're, you're going to go further than your competition. What is the rope you're holding onto in your life right now that you need to let go of? I don't know the exact answer to that question, to be honest. You know, I, you know, we were talking before, it's like, do I start doing my own event? Don't do it unless you feel called, man. I mean, but that again, that that's the, like, so sometimes I'm like, Oh, I'm holding on to just like, like one of my friends, he calls it he goes you got a corporate couch man he said you're you're just right you're cruising i'm like it's kind of cruising but at the same time like it's like dude i gotta lock in like but you're in the flow too with it yeah it's like i enjoy it yeah but it's it's a how long can you do that and then it's like okay i'm gonna keep writing a book every let's say you let's go

1:09:12Lewis Howes:your your few months before you're 50 let's go 10 years in the future man and let's say you you You lock in for the next decade doing the exact same things to the maximum. You're 120, 150 days on the road speaking. You've maxed the revenue generation. You've maxed your level of giving. You're giving 49.5 % to go even more than your friend every year. You are writing a book a year. Maybe you do an event, a smaller event in Dallas once a year. and you maximize for a decade the exact same path, just better. Yeah. How do you think you'll feel at 49 and a half, looking back at the last decade? Do you feel like you dropped the rope and went for it?

1:09:58Lewis Howes:Or do you feel like you were holding on to something that was comfortable, that you were great at, that was familiar? Do you feel like you served at the greatest level or you served what was great for you and easy for you because you could just do it on autopilot. What do you think 49-year-old you will say in a decade? And I think it also, before you even answer it, I think it's also a question for everyone to answer, to reflect on because you don't have to let go of the rope of every moment to create something incredible or go for something. You don't have to do that also. You don't have to strive and achieve everything.

1:10:39Lewis Howes:You can live a beautiful, fulfilling life in the pocket. Totally. So one of the questions that guided my 30s was what would you do if you knew you couldn't fail? Okay. So that was a big part of what I talk about in getting people to try things and whatnot. When I first answered that question, it was, oh, I'd be in the NBA documentary. You do that whole deal. Great. This next question, I don't know if I'm going to make it public facing. I don't know if I'm going to do something with this question, but it has been something I've been wrestling with, which is what would you do if you never needed another dollar in your life?

1:11:16What if you were set for life? What would you do with all of your time if you were post-economic? We have some friends who are post-economic, right? They don't need money anymore. They make an interest what we all dream of making someday, right? but yet they still work which is interesting yeah why yeah it's like what because they love it because they need it you need purpose is it purpose you know but i i've i've begun to think like okay if i didn't need a dollar would i do every event that i'm doing this year no i wouldn't i wouldn't i wouldn't do every event i do i do a lot of them but i wouldn't do every single one of and so when I think about 10 years from now I think man would I start saying no even more to create margin for a fun project that don't need to make money that don't need to make money

1:12:17Lewis Howes:that's what my event was you know but it was it a fun project that made no money no dollars no cents but it brought a lot of joy and fulfillment and impact in dude i think and it had its season in its place and and 100 but but i when i think about that i think about like okay five years from now i say no more and i've got margin and i and i call lewis because we're friends now right we're real friends i go hey lewis hey man i got some extra time we should just do an event together and like let's see how many of people like us would be willing to just all donate our time to do something to make LA a better city.

1:12:58And let's see, let's see how much money we could raise for the Boys and Girls Club of LA. And hey, it's going to be a light lift. Oh, hey, guess what? I found a production company to donate all of the gear and all of their hours for. So it's a light lift. None of us are selling anything, but hey, matter of fact, we're going to do a tour and just like, we're going to call it the make a difference to her and we're just going to you pick the cities you want to be in if you want to come great but we just we kind of just like great potluck of giving you know like i just had a little dream session with you in three minutes right i don't have that space right now because every day is planned for the next year and a half i mean there's there's there's just with kids and sports and whatever it's like but i would hope that 10 years from now that i wouldn't be holding onto that rope so tightly and it's not like i need to do every single event but i am running a business i have employees and the number one product is me getting on a stage you know and it's just like okay well we get books and we can get workbooks and we do all of these other things and we can do courses and whatever but it's just like that's not making the money like you on stage it's like and so it's like anytime i do get a speaking contract i'm always looking at the calendar i'm going what else am i gonna be doing on the day golfing you know it's like i like golf but it's like I actually could speak and go go up in the same day.

1:14:18It takes an hour. It's so, and so in the future, I would love to, and there's been times where I have been,

1:14:31where I've had opportunities to work with organizations that I just want to work with that, and I'd love to spend a few days with them. I don't have a few days. You don't have that time. Yeah, I don't have. And so I would, maybe when my kids graduate high school and I have a little bit more margin in that space. Yeah. How old are they? Eight and 12? They are, good question, six and 11, about to be seven and 12. Okay, cool.

1:14:59Lewis Howes:So you've got, you know, six, seven years until it starts to happen. So good questions to think about. Very much so. I'd love to hear what everyone's answer is in the comments below. Yeah. The next 10 years is the rope that you need to let go of to step in who you truly want to become. For sure. This has been powerful, man. I appreciate you showing up, Ryan, and sharing this wisdom. I've got a couple of final questions for you. Before we get to it, I want to make sure people follow you. RyanLeak.com. Ryan Leak on social media as well. Yeah. You got some great content on there. So if people want more on how to navigate communication strategies, dealing with complicated people, you can get the book, How to Work with Complicated People, and all the other content that you have is on your website, ryanleaf.com.

1:15:45Lewis Howes:They want to book you for speaking, they can go there as well. That's right. Check you out, man. That's right. This is a question I ask everyone at the end. It's called The Three Truths. We've already gone 10 years in the future. Let's go to the end of life. Imagine you get to create and accomplish anything you want for the rest of your life. Yeah. You had all that margin to do all the cool projects. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You gave 49.5 % every year. All these things happen. Yeah. But for whatever reason, at the end of the day, you have to take all of your work with you, all your content, books, everything's gone.

1:16:15Lewis Howes:But you get to leave behind three lessons to the world. Yeah. I call it the three truths. What would that be for you? The first truth is every single person that you and I know has an assignment from God. and until they get started on it, life will not make sense. And that could be a song to sing, a book to write, a movie to make, a podcast to record, a family to raise, a student to teach. It could be in the mundane. It doesn't have to be a big dream, but I believe each and every person has been given a God assignment. There is a reason you are on this planet. And if you do not search for that God assignment.

1:16:57Life will never make sense. That's the first truth. That's one. Second truth is that I would leave with the planet because I'm taking all my stuff with me anyway. You can't get access to this conversation. This conversation is gone. It's gone. I would say contentment is true wealth. Contentment is true wealth. The reason I believe that is because if you ask somebody what would make them happy, their number would be more. More, more, more, more, more followers, more money, more houses, more, more, more, more, more. I know some people that got a lot, but they don't have enough. When your number is enough, you move completely different.

1:17:53And in fact, if you can find enough in your life anywhere, I would say you're the richest person I know.

1:17:59Lewis Howes:Wow. So interesting you say that before you get to number three. There was a great interview from Jim Carrey, who I'm a big fan of, a couple of years ago, where he said he was retiring from acting and he was doing an interview promoting a movie. And he was like, and she was, the journalist was like, what are you going to do next? He goes, I think I'm done. I think I'm retiring. I've done enough movies. yeah and she was like no you can't retire like you're so good and this and this and he goes i'm gonna say something that no celebrity in hollywood will ever admit he said i've done enough i have enough i am enough 100 and you know it's easy for saying him in his career he's done all these things but usually a lot of people when they're at the top they feel like they need to keep going for more.

1:18:45Lewis Howes:And I think it's just knowing what to say yes to because you want to, not because you feel like you need to have more or you don't have enough. Right? Kind of like what you said. Oh yeah, man. That enough thing will take you really far. That's when peace enters the chat. Oh yeah. Oh, there's no better feeling than enough. It doesn't create complacency where you say, am I going to do it anymore? It's like, I just get to do it now. I don't have to do it. Yeah. When you have inner peace, that is true abundance. Oh my gosh. Yeah. If you want to be rich, get enough. Get enough. That's good. The third truth.

1:19:27Third truth. If you want to live like no one lives, give like no one gives. If you want to live like no one lives, give like no one gives. what I love about what my wife and I get to do with our two boys is we don't think about generational wealth we think about generational giving interesting the daft that I was telling about earlier our kids will inherit a lot of money that they have to give away that's how it works I don't know if my kids will uh drive a BMW they might they can if they want to let's up to them I don't know what size house they'll have. I don't know where they'll live in the world.

1:20:12I don't know what they're going to do with their life, but they'll be givers. We did an exercise over dinner the other day. I said, hey, if I gave you$100 ,000 right now, what would you do with it? My first son, he says, well, I'd give 20 grand to God. I said, really? It's amazing. And then he said, and then I'd save another 20 grand. I go, wow, Okay, that's great. I said, so you got 60 grand left. What are you going to do with the rest of the 60? He said, I'll probably buy Pokemon cards. I went, okay. Now we're on track. Now we're back at kids. Sounds right. Yeah. And the second kid goes, I go, okay, you get 100 grand.

1:20:49What do you do? He goes, I'd give 40 grand to God.

1:20:54Lewis Howes:Competition, you know, he's like the ego. I'm going to give more. I like this. I like that this is our house.

1:21:04And it's better to give than receive. And that just, it's not about the money. It's about that spirit of generosity. You can feel it. You can feel a taker coming a mile away. But when you're in the presence of a giver, you breathe. You breathe a whole lot deeper. You breathe a whole lot easier. There isn't this what's up the sleeve, what's the agenda. It's like, I'm here to give. I'm here to add value. I don't got any tricks up my sleeve. And so, yeah, I think if you give like nobody gives, then you'll live like nobody lives. Final question, Ryan. Yes. What is your definition of greatness? My definition of greatness is when you can truly discover your potential, your strengths, your influence, and leverage all of that to serve other people.

1:22:01Mm-hmm. Like when you figure out, I am really great at this thing, this is what God put me on the planet to do. And I have locked in on that. And I am unlocking my potential. But I'm doing all of that to help somebody else. Yeah. Like to me, that is, that's the definition of greatness. My man.

1:22:21Lewis Howes:Thanks for being here. Appreciate you, man. Thanks. Powerful, brother. Thanks, man. Thank you. I hope you enjoyed today's episode and it inspired you on your journey towards greatness. Make sure to check out the show notes in the description for a full rundown of today's episode with all the important links. And if you want weekly exclusive bonus episodes with me personally, as well as ad-free listening, then make sure to subscribe to our Greatness Plus channel exclusively on Apple Podcasts. Share this with a friend on social media and leave us a review on Apple Podcasts as well. Let me know what you enjoyed about this episode in that review.

1:22:55Lewis Howes:I really love hearing feedback from you and it helps us figure out how we can support and serve you moving forward. And I want to remind you if no one has told you lately that you are loved, you are worthy, and you matter. And now it's time to go out there and do something great.

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