Lucy Hale Opens Up: Getting Sober, Mental Health & Manifestation

45:00I think I thought if you spoke up, you were not kind, but it's just not true. Like there's a way to do it. I think the most powerful human in the world is someone who can courageously share their opinions and create boundaries in a kind and conscious way. 100%. Not screaming and reacting and like, get away from me. But actually like, you know what you just did? Like that doesn't work for me. And I want to let you know, maybe I'm misinterpreting something, but I need to have distance from you for a while or I need to create this boundary but like actually having the courage yeah to disappoint someone yes and have someone not like you yeah in order to create safety within you yeah it's one of the hardest things to do the courage to be disliked like that is powerful but guess what you're actually doing things right if people don't like you because living in your truth and be I have found that when I've been and it's kind of what we're talking about earlier when I have felt the most aligned, been speaking my truth, like emanating my inner light.

46:02It triggers a lot of people. Oh, yeah. Oh, it triggers. I've had the amount of people it's like are like there's a couple of people online that were like, I don't believe her. Phony. But it doesn't faze me because I know who I am. So actually, if you're pissing people off or people don't like you, you're doing you're doing something right. Because there has to be duality to everything. Not everyone's going to love you. You know, everyone's going to adore you. 100%. And it actually took the pressure off of me because I felt like I had to do that. And I'm like, it's too tiring. You don't need everyone to like you anymore.

46:35No. Yeah. And you can just be yourself. Yeah. It doesn't mean you want to like try to piss everyone off. No, no. And I'm like, please love me. Please love me. Please love me. No, it's a good balance. That's great. Another quote you have talking about this whole journey. This was on, I think, a three-year anniversary post after getting sober. You wrote this on Instagram. that said, I began my journey in remembering who I am. Since then, I've experienced moments that can only be described as pure miracles and magic. Yeah. What are a few of those moments in the last three years since being sober that have been miracles and magic for you?

47:10I think for me, I struggled a lot with being present in every sense of the word. I think that's why I like being an actor is because I'm forced to be very present. And I connected those dots. I was like, oh my God, that's why I gravitated towards it as a child because it took me out of my head and I could just focus on whatever I was doing. But my life, there's so much stillness in my life the last couple of years. And I'll just have these moments where it's not anything profound. I'm just like sitting, drinking my coffee with my dogs and I'll just be so moved to tears by how great I feel. It's almost like I can't believe I'm so comfortable in my own skin.

47:59I felt really afraid of myself for a long time. I was afraid of my choices. I felt like, you know, I felt like a wild card. And so to just be really, no, it was. Really? You just didn't know any day you could be doing something wild or crazy? Yeah, I mean, sober me, I was, but I was a people pleaser. And so I just never, I felt like I was trying on all of these different masks and none of them really felt like me. And so now I just like what I meant by that, that quote about miracles and magic is I feel so connected to myself and I feel connected to my, I call them my team, my, my, my, my guide team up there.

48:42And I just am in awe of what I've been able to do. I'm in awe of other people. I feel like I have so much empathy for people and what everyone's fighting silent battles we know nothing about. I mean, I'm like the perfect example of that for 10 years. And there were so many people who I don't have resentment towards them, but like they just didn't know what I was going through. And that's why it's so vital to be kind, to always be kind. And I don't think I would have garnered that amount of understanding or empathy had I not gone through what I've gone through. And I don't think and I don't mean like enable people.

49:31Right. But like we don't understand anyone else's point of view or what people are going through. So just be patient. Do you feel like you were kind and patient with others?

49:45um at moments yeah and then i would get mad that people wouldn't show up for me and so so then i'm like oh was i only doing those things to get something in return because that's not actually giving if i'm giving my time or my energy just because i want them to show up for me that's selfish that's people pleasing and so that was a big wake-up call for me to be like oh my god am i not as good of a person as I thought I was because people pleasing is actually selfish like you can still be a good person but it comes from a world yeah and and if I act this way then I'll be accepted and loved and adored that was most of my life it was like trying to fit in or trying to make people happy especially in intimacy yeah it was like I was I felt whenever I was single I was so joyful and I felt like I could be my authentic self yeah and then six months after getting into relationship for nine months for whatever reason I would choose people out of a wound I'm not making these people wrong I would choose them out of a wound where they never accepted who I fully was and they wanted me to change to make them feel safer or more comfortable or whatever and then I would change to please them and then I resent myself I resent them I resent the relationship but I was like I'm going to try to do whatever it takes to make it work and then I couldn't get out of the relationship because I was like I invested all this time and there was like a cycle and you were like attracting the same type of same person this is what I mean about the lesson will keep repeating until you until it got really painful and then I was just like I almost had a similar wake-up call where it's just like I can't live like this this I've repeated this five six seven times now over like 15 years or something and I've got to look within yeah I've got to do some healing work I've got to create boundaries in a conscious way I've got to learn how to say no I've got to learn to not people-please, all these things.

51:31So it was about four and a half years ago when I started the healing journey for myself in a different level. I started healing 12 years ago around sexual abuse, but then four and a half years ago around intimacy and relationship, around the people-pleasing. And that's when everything started to change for me. Talk about miracles and magic. I mean, it's like I would not be able to create a sense of peace inside of me without doing that healing work. And I know you talked about healing the inner child for, for about a year during my healing journey, I had a photo on my phone of my, you know, like eight year old self.

52:07Right. And so every moment I looked at my phone, I was reminded to reclaim the boy inside of me and to say, you know what? I'm like, he was screaming at me through eczema or through chest palpitations, through like pain in my chest through feeling like someone was choking me it's like the boy inside of me was saying take care of me yeah trying to get your attention stop neglecting me and recreate that integrated healing of oneness of all the parts of me and it wasn't until i started to really heal the little boy in me and turn around and face myself yeah and the darkness and the wounds and start integrating that's when the pain left my body it's that's so powerful the way you just worded that and i did talk therapy for many years and we did a lot of inner child work um a lot of inner child work a lot of like meditations where i visualize myself as a little kid even for my it's an it's interesting to do for other people too because if you're angry at someone if you do a meditation or you can even journal about it envision their inner child powerful you can't be mad it just like so you see a little girl little boy who's hurt or sad everyone's wounded we're all wounded okay the thing i just posted today says the irony is that your light grows brighter the more you embrace your darkness isn't that crazy the only way out is through it's so so true and um what did you learn about little lucy when you started doing inner child healing what did you learn about what she needed most that you were neglecting for her to receive i think as a kid and still sometimes now i think definitely as a child i didn't feel like i had emotional safety or i felt like i was i was a very emotional child very complex um didn't know what to do with these big feelings like i'm talking like really questioning some big stuff as a small kid and i think question like purpose of life like i felt i remember telling my mom when i was very small i was like i feel like i'm gonna die really i feel like i'm gonna die young i'm talking like three four years old crazy stuff and so there was a darkness there there was a desire to um to know and i was curious about a lot and i and i and i never really felt like I had a lot of people to connect to and I'm sure like seeing a kid with like that kind of energy probably freaked people out you know as an adult it's cool as hell like I love it I love that about me but as a as a little kid you know you didn't feel emotionally safe no I felt like in if if I were to express what I was truly feeling um there wasn't always an outlet to go to like I I I spent a lot of time in my room crying because like that is where I felt safe to like actually be myself and I think that's also why I spent a lot of time alone I also want to say my parents are amazing by the way I'm not saying it was just I don't feel like it was very different than a lot of other kids I knew and um and that's why I think music came into my life because I think it became this like safe space for me.

55:33But I but I also think if I were to be sitting next to little Lucy, I think she just wanted to be understood and seen and able to cry if she wants to, able to laugh if she wants to, like just free. I think I just wanted freedom. Why did you not feel free? I think without going too deep, I, um, how do I word this? I think a part of me was really scared of what I was feeling. My intensity, I still get scared of my intensity sometimes, but also I, um, my parents were divorced when I was young. And so I think when something like that happens for a kid around like four or five. I didn't understand what was happening, but of course, I'm absorbing the energy of that.

56:29And I wanted to make my dad and my mom happy. And so I was like a shapeshifter. I could do whatever I needed to do. I realized early on, if I acted this way, that made certain people happy. If I acted this way, it made certain people not happy. So I'm not going to do that. So I'm just going to be this person. And so I maybe took on some emotional burdens really young. Once again, no anger or resentment towards that at all anymore. I've sorted through that, but also I think... Even before I moved to LA, I was growing up quickly. and this is a lot of people's story right like I'm sure as parents I'm not a parent yet I'm sure when you're a parent you're gonna screw up you're gonna mess up they were doing the best they could um and I have been really lucky that they've been very my sweet mom she's been so patient with me over the years and um I've always been very supported by both my parents um I think at times maybe not understood by them.

57:32I think we're all different people, but I have a really good relationship with my mom and a good relationship with my dad too. I see my parts of them in me. I definitely know what I've gotten from my dad and what I get from my mom. And it's such a nice place to have forgiven. This is what I mean about not blaming. How many people do you know are like, well, my so-and-so did this and that's why I'm this way. It's like, okay, keep telling yourself that and you're going to keep being miserable. Right. So I was like, I'm going to stop blaming all the characters in my life. When did you start, stop blaming everyone?

58:09The last couple of years. Really? Yeah. I mean, this is new. I, and how does it feel? I mean, cause almost when you're blaming others, you're a victim to what they did. This is what I mean about the victim mentality. It was, that's what it was like. Oh, well I came from, I'm a child of divorce. It's like, yeah, Lucy. So it was like 90 % of America, you know, like get over it, deal with it. Don't, don't don't don't wallow in it anymore okay that's the cards you've been dealt what did it teach you everything's a learning experience everything that happens to you good bad ugly pretty whatever is there to teach you if you choose to take that route and i do it's exhausting sometimes sometimes i'm like ah ignorance is worse but once as you know once you're on that path There's no looking back.

58:56You don't stop. You don't just say now. I'm good here. No Keep climbing keep going. Yeah, it's tough because once you I guess Started to heal and get out of and really take full responsibility for everything and Create meaning from the past pain not saying it's okay what things happen to you But say okay, this did happen and I can either be a victim to it or I can take create meaning from it and see how I can be empowered from it. Exactly. Once I do that, not excuse people's behaviors or whatever, or actions, but once I take meaning. That's what I was going to say. Like with your experience, of course you didn't deserve that.

59:35Of course people don't deserve for those things to happen to you. Absolutely not condoning that. But it's like you, I'm sure you've had to say, okay, this is what happened. I didn't deserve it. And you've obviously taken such a beautiful path with it. Yeah. And you can get, well, I can either stay in victimhood and let that anger fuel me, which I did for a long time. And it created results out of anger and out of frustration and resentment and feeling abused and taken advantage of. So I was driven to prove people wrong and it got results. The anger is probably the second most powerful fuel in the world.

1:00:14It will get you what you want, but you won't feel the way you want to feel once you get the results. You're not going to feel love. You're not going to feel peace. You're not going to feel alignment because you did everything out of anger, revenge, proving, you know, I'm going to show them, I'm going to do something as opposed to I'm going to show up for the greatest version of me and live an empowered life to serve and inspire people around me. And really step into the version of me that I'm most excited about that wants me to become something greater. And I think when we can step into that energy of like, this is a goal and a dream because it's going to help and serve others in the pursuit of this dream, it's just a fuel that is more renewable and it feels more peaceful.

1:00:59Yeah. So wait, so it's anger. Because I agree with you that anger is not necessarily bad, but I also believe there's like a spectrum of emotions, right? And like, you can't go from shame, depression, all the way to like bliss. You have to like work up the ladder, right? You've got to learn through the ladder. You've got to learn through the ladder is better yeah but i do agree because you can only live in anger for so long like it's not sustainable well an anger causes so many disease and cancer and frustration and hurts and you react in the different ways that you're you know you're like i wish i didn't say that yeah you have to repair a lot more from anger it's so true you're so much more reactive and you're kind of like blowing and blowing through relationships and burning bridges you're just like ah you know yeah and so you can get results but is it going to be a rewarding life it's so true and i think the true reward comes from healing and feeling whole while you create it doesn't mean you can't tap into the darkness or tap into the memories of the pain but i think living in that space is very painful what do they call it emotional alchemy yeah it's like transmuting it transforming it transmuting it yeah that's power yeah it doesn't mean i'm like gonna be perfect every day I'm going to have frustration and anger but it's like how can I get back to a place of love and peace and calm yeah really alignment that's so true and I think that you know when people haven't seen me in a while they're like oh my god you're just you're doing great and I'm like I am doing great but it doesn't just because you make certain choices doesn't mean that every day is just no glowing glittery sunshine I mean there are days where I'm like I feel like I'm on drugs because I'm so excited about life or passionate.

1:02:40Like, no, it's just like learning, oh, I'm having a really bad day and I'm going to let myself have a bad day and then I'm going to let it go and have a better day tomorrow. And not stay in victimhood for too long. Oh yeah, because it's easy. Oh God, it's so easy to latch onto it. Yeah. Yeah. Now, how do you navigate? I mean, we don't have to talk about this if we don't want to, but how do you navigate? Is it about dating? I was like - Relationships in general. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It doesn't have to be about intimacy, But when you start to heal, knowing what I've gone through in my past relationship journey of getting into relationships out of a wound versus getting into or being open to relationships out of wholeness or the journey of wholeness.

1:03:23How have you reflected on that when you think about previous relationships? And I don't know your dating history. That's not what this is about. Well, how long do you have? I mean, it's not really about who you're dating or who you're not or whatever. It's like, how do you navigate your vision for a relationship that you want and creating that in your mind, daydreaming again in your mind about the type of relationship you want intimately or personally or professionally and creating from that space. of vision around values and around a person who's also on a healing journey or who's got growth mindset, not victimhood or not being attracted to people who have shiny objects about them, but more attractive to their spiritual alignment.

1:04:10Have you thought about that in terms of working relationships, but also intimate relationships? I think about it in every type of friendships, family dynamics, romantic relationships, even people that I'm hanging out with just you know for a little bit definitely working relationships I think all of those have changed astronomically when I started putting myself first because what happens yeah let's go but I think it's it's the type of people I was attracting in my past were people who were of a similar wound or were going to trigger my wound I was like caught in that cycle and that's how the universe works that's i'm not a scientist but like they're billy carson can tell me how that works right i i also was attracting you know some relationships without getting too specific that weren't for my highest good um but now oh i think about this every day but but it's almost like i don't even need to worry about who's coming into my life as long as i'm true to me because if i'm embodying the person I want to be with.

1:05:19If I'm living from a place of love, of integrity, of value, of passion, whatever, I can only attract people who are that. A mirror of that. No one else can even break through that barrier. And if they do, I recognize it very quickly and I'm sorry, but they got to go. Yes. Because like I said, my, where I'm at in my life, work too hard. I have a zero tolerance for people who aren't going to elevate my life. Yes. I'm not pulling people up. I can connect, I can support, I can be there, but especially in intimate relationships, like we have to be of the same mindset. There has to be like a similar outlook in the world.

1:05:57Like spirituality is very important to me. Um, but yeah, I feel like I'm very clear on the type of, um, people I want to spend time with. Definitely. What are those values you look for then with someone that could be an intimate partner or a professional relationship? What are the values that they need to embody for you to feel like this is alignment of just being in a relationship with you i feel like transparency is super super important to me um and i feel like when i have that everything else is okay because if you're being honest and transparent with me like i can believe your word i've been in so many dynamics where you know especially in la people are like oh you yeah you know they'll tell you one thing and you never hear from them um and i mean it's more of i don't know if it's exact values but i'm seeking out people who are on a similar path as me who are actively working towards um getting to know themselves more um connecting with other people um but yeah i i don't know how you feel but when you're on this path like it's not that i don't want to say it's hard because that is a limiting belief that it's hard it's just um it's i feel like i'm in a phase of my life where it's weeding out the things that are not supposed to be a part of my life anymore so cleaning it up cleaning out cleaning house it's interesting when i transparency is so is so key and i really think it's just pure honesty Like everything you say is an honest thing.

1:07:29Yeah. And you're being authentic to the moment. Yeah. And when I started, you know, when Martha and I, my wife started dating, she was asking me like very, you know, just honest, real questions from the beginning. And I go, are you sure you want to hear the answers? Because people usually don't like certain answers of past stuff I've been through or whatever it might be. Yeah. And she goes, yeah, I always want to hear the truth. I go, okay, well, I'm going to tell you the truth about everything you asked me then. So be ready. Yeah. But we'll see how you react. If you react where you're like hurt or upset or like angry about something in my past, then it doesn't work for me.

1:08:07Like you have to be willing to receive and accept all of me in my past. It doesn't mean that's like what I'm doing now, but it's like you got to understand all the complexities of me. And so from the beginning, I was just like, you sure you want the answer? She was like, yes. And I would tell her the answer to any question. and she was really great at not reacting with like negative or positive just like thank you for being honest even if it was like hard for her to hear something she was like thank you and she didn't scream or react or run away or anything and I think when you can be fully transparent with one another you your word becomes powerful and you can trust the person right but when you're not transparent and you're hiding even little lies here and there yeah it adds up it adds up and And then you're living like two different lives.

1:08:53Yeah. You know the truth inside of you, but you know you're not sharing that fully with the person in front of you. Right. And I think, you know, this ties back to what little Lucy needed. Like, I'm desiring emotional safety. Yes. And for someone to look at me, look at all parts of me, everything I've done, the woman I'm becoming, the woman I am today, and say, I freaking love this woman. Like, I accept all parts of you. And just feeling really safe. And I think that that for me, like, I'm not going to go into my astrological chart, but like emotional safety is so important. Yes. And to feel seen in that way is like.

1:09:32What are the things you do for yourself on a daily basis to create emotional safety for you? So I know my I hate this word, but I know my triggers. So overused, but I know my like fault lines. I know what's gonna take me. So it's really important for me to start my day with like pure energy. So I do my best to wake up. I'm not reaching for my phone. Like social media, I wish I could be one of those people where, you know, I look at social media for three minutes and I don't think about it, but it's not. It like, my brain goes, I'm going to grasp onto, you know, I'll just spiral. So I try to you know I stay off my phone it's important for me to have a really intentional morning and by that I mean whether that's meditating or outside walking with the dogs or just time where I can I mean I call it prayer time but you can call it whatever talking to the universe talking to yourself and I get really clear on what my soul wants me to do that day I literally ask what do you need from me today and so sometimes I'll like journal out just like stream of consciousness writing and sometimes I hear really specific things like go do go drive this way to get coffee or go to this coffee shop or sometimes I hear nothing and that's okay but I've been really leaning into learning to trust my intuition and really just getting comfortable with that and getting familiar familiar with what my higher self is trying to to tell me to do but But, you know, I'm also really intentional about the places I go, the people I see.

1:11:15I love what I do, so I love being busy with work. But, yeah, I'm just very intentional about what I'm going to step into. And if I do have to go somewhere where I know it's going to be overwhelming or maybe not somewhere I'd necessarily go, just protect myself with that white light. And I go. And then I always, you know what I do every day when I get home from, like, being around a lot of people? I shower, just get all that energy off. And I just literally imagine it going down the drain. So I do like a lot of cleansing stuff. That's cool. I do sound healing, meditation, all the things, energy work, Reiki.

1:11:49I'm obsessed, obsessed with astrology right now. And for me, it's important to remain curious and playful. I think I, I think we're all like, as we get, obviously when we get older, we lose that like childlike curiosity. curiosity and I find that I'm happiest when I'm you know researching about some very niche topic so I try to stay curious yeah what about I mean I think that's beautiful and playfulness is I think the key to staying young yes it's being playful and you hear a lot of actors who are like it doesn't seem like they age and I feel like it's because you get to play all day you're like playing character and you're playing fun and you're the role playing and it's just like a yes and mentality It's not a block.

1:12:31It's more of like, let me keep trying. Let me keep exploring. It's make-believe. It is make-believe. What is, you know, I keep hearing you talk about, you know, your spiritual practice. Do you hear messages from God? What is, what does God speak to you on a consistent basis? What are you hearing God say? I mean, it's more of, sometimes it's not like specific words, but it's more of a feeling of just, have you ever experienced this where you're just so overcome with gratitude that you have no doubt in your mind that you're in the exact right place in your life and that's more what I feel these days like when I when I was going to do the podcast and then saw you at the gym it's like moments like that like that is God God orchestrates things in your life to let you know you're on the right path yes the synchronicities the signs are always there um so it's more of just feelings i get goosebumps all the time like that is how i know i'm in alignment is it's usually only my left side it's really interesting um what happens if you get goosebumps on the right side i'm screwed it's a bad day i'm screwed um but i do hear um you know sometimes in meditations i've heard some interesting things like i've heard do i go here Yes.

1:13:52Okay, I heard yes. So I've heard like names. I really have. I heard a name in a meditation and I had no idea what this name was, but I heard it very loudly and I was like, I don't know a Doris. Who is Doris? So I called my mom, like put it in my notes app and I called her the next day. I was like, Mom, do we have a Doris or a family? She was like, yeah, honey, that's your great grandmother. Wow. Yeah. So I feel really connected to people who have passed. and I feel like it's hard for me to be still it's hard for me to quiet my mind but when I do the stuff that comes through is really yeah now people are gonna be like Lucy talks to dead people I wish when was the so you moved here when you were 15 yeah when did you feel like you started going off alignment off the rails yeah kind of just like all right so maybe it was small to start but then it was like what age do you feel like okay i wasn't in that pure light consciousness just much anymore i was starting to like be more in the material world not the spiritual world or going to the dark side a little bit more internally yeah probably like 18.

1:15:02okay i think that was around when i was living on my own and i started making and i'm not saying that living on your own and making money and success equals bad but for me um yeah it was around that time i was living on my own and my career is taking off and um if you don't have the right influences or environment around you you could easily sway into other influences yeah but it's also like if you're a teenager right we were all doing that for a while everyone was wiling out everyone was staying up all night um and so i would say around like 18 19 20 i had the moments of my behavior is a little different than everyone else's and oh I'm seeing some videos of myself and that seems really scary or like the desire to want to continue the party and I don't even like calling it partying because that makes it sound like it was enjoyable but like to continue to I guess like the benders started because I was you know was this just alcohol or drugs and alcohol or just mainly alcohol but towards the end it was also drugs yeah yeah and there was there any like eating behaviors or oh well so yes so that was actually my first kind of addictive behavior was I like undiagnosed but I definitely had issues with it I had a from like 13 to mid-20s and I actually think it was the eating disorder that fueled the drinking really but one of the reasons because I obsessed so much about my weight and you know the amount of calories or how much I was working out that when I drink I'd eat whatever I wanted and I didn't think about anything and I thought I looked decent enough to go you know it was it just like really you know it gave my mind a break from all of that and so I think it was a reprieve from interesting that turmoil yeah and so it's like two extremes yeah like during the week I'm counting calories and obsessing about what I'm eating and then on the weekend I'm drinking whatever and eating whatever yeah as a kind of a release yeah and that's pretty common for people with addictive behaviors that you'll channel it into something different so um so the like the 15 years where I was on and off sober I did have long periods of sobriety but the eating disorder would kick up and then you know so it was constantly being fueled one addiction to the next Yes.

1:17:27And that's really common. So a lot of people that get sober will fall back into ED territory or. Or smoking or something else. A lot of people, you know, I got addicted to sugar. I'm still kind of addicted to sugar. But a lot of people like early sobriety will just candy, candy, caffeine, caffeine. You know what I never picked up though? Smoking. It's probably a good thing. It's a good thing. Shocking. I don't know. I was like, I'm in my mid thirties. I can't start now. There was a moment where I was like, should I? No. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Maybe you're 21. It's different. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Interesting.

1:17:59Okay, so 13 is when the eating disorder started. Around, yeah. That's when I remember having abnormal thinking. What do you think that is? Is that more of just like trying to fit in in school or is that more the stress from home life? Control. I think I felt emotionally out of control. I saw things happening in my environment that were really uncomfortable. and so I don't want to speak for everyone but a lot of people I know who who have struggled with disordered eating um it gives them a false sense of control of their life and it's like the one thing that's theirs when everything else feels like it's wow out of control and it got really the eating disorder got really heightened when I moved to LA I mean shocker because then it was not only the control thing it was also I want to be an actress in LA and I felt like I needed to look a certain way and the truth is I didn't the truth is those stories we tell ourselves are not true I mean maybe a different time in the industry but I'm sure I would have been accepted and loved had I not been doing that but but what's crazy is that I had the eating disorder booked all the job so I was like well it worked and so then it like further fuels these negative behaviors it's kind of like the thing you're saying anger will get you places it's kind of the same mentality because I you know I was drinking and doing all the stuff had the eating disorder but I was still getting results the prize but it didn't feel as good as I thought it would it's a false reward yes and then you still don't feel like you still have the shame inside of you you still have the unworthiness the not lovable or you don't love yourself aligned you're getting things out of alignment god it's it's so this is so interesting i talk about this in my book actually where it's like money doesn't solve all your problems or neither does fame or all these different things they don't solve they might solve money problems yeah they didn't solve self-worth problems made them worse actually it almost here's the thing it does when i was broke on my sister's couch for a year and a half and then I started to make some money after building a business and it took a number of years I started to make some money I was eventually on my own and I saved enough money where I was financially free for a couple years right I could live and not work for a couple years and I had enough money I wasn't like balling for life yeah but I could live like under my means and be fine for a couple years and I'd worked so hard to create this financial freedom, but I still didn't feel emotionally free.

1:20:33And so I remember it was almost worse than being broke and emotionally broken because you think the job or the followers or the money is going to make you feel more free or more lovable or more enough. And it almost expands your level of unworthiness. It's such a hopeless feeling. I know this feeling so deeply in my soul. And it was always like, I have these benchmarkers where I'm like okay if I just book a job yes then then I'm gonna be happy and then I'd get the job and I'd be like yeah well it needs to be bigger yeah yeah and it's and it's like when does it end it doesn't end there is nothing outside of you does money make life easier yeah does a great job make you happier yeah is it gonna fix the broken parts of you no never not ever the only thing that can do that is you and your connection to something bigger than you the only thing that's going to make you happy is already within you you don't need to seek search make spin but then the great news is the byproduct of of doing that work and getting aligned is then you get the jobs then you get the money then you get the people that actually are in alignment with your truest self and you can actually celebrate those moments yes and it feels and it feels good finally i've never celebrated my success wow like when i would accomplish my goals after like 10 years of going for it, I'd be like, okay, what's next?

1:21:56Like we got to go bigger. It was never, I can, let's take a moment. This is something I love about my wife. She's all about celebrating the moment. Like any little or big like success. She's like, we got to go to dinner. We got to have a weekend celebrate. Let's take a trip. And it's, I have to get used to celebrating. I'm like you, but I think that celebration energy is good because it allows you to reflect on how hard you worked, whether it was three months on a project or three years. It's like, man, look how far you've come. We can celebrate a small win and a big win with equal amount of reflection.

1:22:28It doesn't need to throw yourself a massive party, but you can go out and have dinner or go on a trip or whatever it might be and just say, man, I did it or we did it or let's talk about all the memories from what we created together. She's really great at creating that. I mean, she's Mexican and Mexicans celebrate every birthday party. It's like, everything's a celebration. So, um, I really relate to that though. I, because, but also like your mentality is why you're so successful because you're like, okay, cool. Now what? And it's, it's, it's good. It's drive. It's passion. And I really respect that.

1:23:03And I feel like I'm that way too. But remember how I was talking about being really present. I'm trying to really take a moment, whatever it is each day where I'm like, that was cool. Oh, I liked that interaction or whatever it is. It's so important to be grateful because the more you're grateful the more you find things to be grateful for and then the more you find more things to be grateful for and so gratitude to me is the secret sauce of life if you could go back 20 years to lucy okay that was had this dream that made it to la yeah and then booked the gig and then all these things start happening if you could go back 20 years and you could sit across from lucy of 15 what piece of advice would you give her knowing all the emotional uncertainty that you were experiencing in that time the lack of emotional safety that you had the maybe the the stresses you had at home whatever was going through we don't think we don't have to talk about but what advice would you give yourself 20 years ago before you started to break into the industry and have the success and fame that you had what would you say to her oh i'm just tearing up because i you know i wouldn't have changed anything i wouldn't have because i i love who i am today i really do but i what i would tell her

1:24:29how deserving do i say me or she i would tell her that she's deserving of good things good people healthy love. I'm worthy of everything that's coming my way. And just to never lose sight of that. I think that that is what so many people struggle with is this like not feeling worthy. And I don't know why we all kind of have that little binkling, but we really are. And I wish without changing anything, just to remind that version of me, how powerful my mind is, and that at any second I can tap, I could, you know, like we were saying earlier, like that connection to something bigger than me never went away.

1:25:15And that all I needed to do was just like brush off the dust, you know, shine it a little, but that connection's always there. But yeah, I think that version of me just needed a big hug and needed some support and needed,

1:25:33yeah just needed that emotional foundation I think but I got through it yeah I got through it and not only did I get through it I got through it I think maybe even more than my soul intended to I think my soul's like okay okay you can calm down but I'm just I I love this path I'm on I literally wake up and I'm like I'm obsessed with my life yeah it's beautiful to be in yes and it doesn't mean I'm not... I still have things I'm working on. I will always be doing that. I don't know. I'm in a good place and it's not just because of me. I've also been very blessed with unbelievable resources and true guardian angels and friends and just pillars of strength and people who have been guiding lights and loved me when I literally felt unlovable and that I do not take for granted at all.

1:26:33And what if Lucy again, this hypothetical scenario, you're having this conversation with your 15 year old self, what if she looked back at you when you said this to her and she said to you, but how do I feel worthy? I hear you saying you're deserving and worthy but I don't feel it. Yeah. How do I believe I'm worthy? I mean, I don't think we as people, I mean, I don't know how I would explain this to her, but as people, we don't have to earn our worthiness. That is our birthright. That is what we are on this planet. We are, that is unlimited, you know? And I, that's such a tough question. Cause like, how do you get through to someone who's like, how do you convince yourself?

1:27:17But this is why I think things happen exactly how they should, because I've only been able to understand that I'm worthy through experience, through trial and error, through falling on my face, literally and figuratively, and realizing that I've always just had this voice that was like, no, you deserve more. Try again. Try again. Try again. And I realize that not everyone has that. But that is such a hard question. How do you tell someone that? Especially your younger self. How do you tell her? I don't know. What is she just like, I don't believe you. I don't believe you because I don't feel it.

1:27:52Like, how would you get through to yourself 20 years ago to believe you were worthy of all of this? But I think I always did know. I think there was like, I'm not, it's, that's, that's such a hard, what would you say? That's such a hard question to answer. That's why I'm asking you the question. I know. I'm like, wow. I think it would, I, you know, I literally just thought of this in the moment. No, it's a great it's a great question because well here's here's what i would say i'll answer that in a second but imagine there's a you know 18 23 year old 28 year old watching who is like just been driving and maybe they've had some emotional challenges in their life and they are like hooked on the edge of their seat listening to this or watching this because they can truly relate to what you've gone through and they really look up to you and see the career you've had and now they can relate to you and say, oh, but she's actually been through a lot that I can relate to personally.

1:28:48What would you say to that 18, 23, 28-year-old watching or listening who doesn't believe they're worthy? How would you try to get through to them? I mean, I think it's like, we shouldn't fake it through life. Like, don't say things you don't mean. Like, I feel like if I were to tell my younger self, be worthy, I'd be like, but I don't. it's it's a slow burn you know you don't have to say like you can't go from feeling depressed or sad or struggling to automatic bliss and life is amazing it really is to me it's like this is a two-parter to me it's like the more you focus on what is going right in your life you're gonna keep finding more things that are going right and you're gonna keep finding more things to be grateful for as much as you possibly can focus on what is going right and the things that are going wrong will dissipate i literally promise yeah and i understand people are in different circumstances and scenarios but as much as you can try to see find the good thing write them down wake up every day and say some days it might just be you know look at that ray of sunshine or you know these sheets feel nice but some days it'll be wow i met the love of my life or it will grow and grow and And so I think that like finding ways to be grateful.

1:30:08I know people used to tell me this all the time and I wanted to tell them to shut up. But it works. It really, really works. And also, I think a lot of people feel lost, don't know their identity, don't know where their place is in the world, feel so misunderstood. A lot of people are living in shame. I relate to all of those things. and I think however you can find out what makes you uniquely you I like we always forget that how incredible it is there's 8 million people on the planet and there's only one of each of us I firmly believe we all have a purpose I firmly believe we all chose the vessel we're in I firmly believe our our soul wants us wants great things for all of us um and so i think it's just like living and finding your truest passion and not letting choose yourself every day and don't let anything get in the way of that always choose you i don't care what anyone says let them call you selfish put you first always get alignment in alignment with yourself first everything else will fall into place yeah and i would as i'm hearing you say this i'm thinking about what would i say to myself yeah Did you come up with a great answer?

1:31:27I feel like you did. Yeah. From all these, I mean, because I lived in a lot of shame. I lived in a lot of insecurity. And again, my parents got divorced when I was, I don't know, 15 or 16, but they probably should have been divorced when I was five because it was like chaos. It was emotionally unsafe at home. Yeah. I left home at 13 to go to a private boarding school that I found and begged my parents to send me away for months. They did not want me to leave. So I left the 13 to create a sense of safety, essentially to run away. yeah because i didn't feel emotionally safe i knew my parents loved me but they didn't love each other yeah and so there was always dis ease within them yeah and therefore that i felt the energy of their stress right and that caused a lot of emotional instability inside of me and so when you have you know parents dynamics sibling dynamics that are whatever friend dynamics bullying at school, whatever it might be, it's hard because you're in an environment where you don't feel lovable.

1:32:27You don't feel seen. You feel taken advantage of or neglected or abused or whatever it might be. And I felt like I needed to get out of that environment to create a sense of freshness, newness, safety. But I still have the traumas that I carried with me into a new environment. But everything you were talking about makes sense to me. And it's probably what I would say to myself is one, if you want to feel worthy, you have to do, you have to live in full integrity every day. Integrity is everything. And you have to be willing to disappoint people with your integrity. Meaning you're going to be honest with people and they may not want to be friends with you.

1:33:06Yeah. And they may speak bad about you behind your back. They may gossip about you. They may do mean things to you. And so you're going to, you may cause frustration or, or emotional instability outside of you, but it's never worth doing that inside of you to create peace externally. There is another quote. Here I go. It says something like disappoint as many people as possible as it takes to avoid disappointing yourself. And I was like, that's a heavy hitter. I can't take credit. Whoever wrote that on Instagram. Yes. And I was the opposite. I I disappointed myself first in order to try to not disappoint everyone around me.

1:33:42People clicking 101. And it caused so much pain inside of me and resentment and anger and frustration. Because I felt like other people weren't showing up for me the way I was for them, like you said. Yeah. And I just think if I could have learned to be alone and be happy with myself, I could have been fine with a couple friends not trying to have everyone like me. Yeah. I also feel like, because I'm a person that needs an action sometimes. I'm like, I can't just sit. So, you know, like sit and like expect the answers to come. But I feel like what I'd recommend to people is like literally having the awareness of wanting something different or wanting more.

1:34:23That is a beautiful seed planted. And ask, pray. If you don't, if it's not prayer, talk to the wall. I don't care. talk to yourself write it down if you desire to want to find the answers in your life I swear to you they'll show up yeah and it's all there the answers are all there they've always been there but your awareness might not have been able to to find them and I think prayer is something you've said two or three times I think I think I would have told myself to stay in prayer even if I'm not getting the answers because I think I would lean towards pleasure to try to remove pain from my life.

1:35:01So I would seek pleasures to feel better and try to numb certain pains. And I think sticking with prayer, even just a few minutes a day, even if I don't get the answers I need, or I'm looking for, or if it takes longer to find the answers, stay consistent with prayer, stay in high integrity with myself, even if it means disappointing people around me, especially my parents, doing those things. That's scary though when you're younger. You don't want disappoint your parents so it's learning how to it's a challenge it really is and also being patient like sometimes we don't know best sometimes there's a bigger plan for your life so that's true keep at it consistency is key for sure a couple final questions for you this has been powerful thanks for opening up this has been you know what happens is when i'm in these conversations i'll leave and not have any memory of what i've said well luckily it's recorded so You can watch it back.

1:35:56It's a good place to be in, but yeah. A couple of other questions. What is a limiting belief? Let me go. Let me, let me think about this. Okay. Okay. If you go 10 years in the future, we already had a conversation with your 15, 16 year old self. Yeah. 20 years back. If you could think 10 years in the future of the woman you're going to become over the next 10 years and all the lessons, the growth, the awareness you're bringing into yourself and into the world. What is the one piece of advice your 10 year old self in the future will give you in this moment that will help you overcome any limiting belief you might have right now?

1:36:38Trust the timing of your life. That is simply it. Sometimes I try to play God and I'm like, well, I know best and it needs to work out this way. And if it doesn't work out this way, then it's wrong. No, no. I firmly believe when you surrender to the timing of your life, magic unfolds. Magic happens. I have seen it. When I've released the reins, when I've said, okay, I'm co-captain. I'm still on the ship, but you've got a better plan than me, higher self, God, like take over. And there's such a relief in that. And I've really been trying to embrace that. And I really believe the next 10 years of my life is because I'm in alignment.

1:37:16I'm doing all the right things. I know it. I'm doing my best every day, trying to. And when I don't, you know, I apologize and I try better next time. But now I think the next phase of my life is really trust the timing of my life and I'm really going to try to challenge myself more, do more things that scare me and really be okay being more visible. and and by that i mean not being afraid of world perception or what people think of me i feel like that is not what's tying me down i just feel like there's gonna be so much freedom and just being like okay i did this let's see what happens um does that mean expressing yourself or like using your voice or doing certain projects that maybe aren't populated or whatever yeah i think all of it just living risking risking be a bit bit more of a risk taker but yeah trusting the timing okay Yeah.

1:38:08What would you say? What would you say to your? 10 years in the future, I would say.

1:38:20For whatever reason, for me, it's like I don't want to regret not going for my dreams. Like when I'm older, I don't want to regret saying you could have gone for it, but you're afraid you played it safe. Yeah. Now, I don't want to neglect responsibilities in my life as well. So it's like, can I fully go for my dreams and show up for my wife and, you know, my future family and all these different things? But I don't want to be 60 or 70 or 80 and say, gosh, you just, you're afraid. You're afraid to go for it. And it doesn't mean I'm going to accomplish every dream. But I don't want to just look back and think, you didn't even try out of fear.

1:38:58So it's similar to what you're thinking, like, be willing to go for it. And it's, I feel like I'm living that. I'm doing these things that are scary, but I just don't want to live with regret of not going for it. Yeah, I'm with you. Like accomplishing is a different thing, but not going for it I can't live with. Yeah, aligned. So yeah, that's my thought. I don't see that for us. Exactly. Well, you're writing books and changing lives. We're having fun. And everything for me is, you know, it's different. Whereas when I was younger, I wanted to, my dreams were about accomplishing things for me. And now my dreams are about pursuing the things that I feel called to do that may have accomplishment tied to it, but doing it in service of others and the boy in me that has a dream.

1:39:47Isn't that amazing that when you do, because I feel the same way, like when I'm honoring that inner child feeling, but knowing that it impacts others in a positive way, like that's the best. Yes. That's the best feeling. and letting go of the need to be looked at, the accomplishment or the award or the success and being people praising me for that. More of like just being inspired by the journey. And if the results come, great. But it's like making a difference, making an impact and serving people in an empowering way is the ultimate path forward. And however that looks. What is the thing you think your 45 year old self will be most proud of that Lucy did over the next 10 years?

1:40:37Oh, I think she'll, I mean, I think it might be similar to what I was saying. I think, you know, I'm really setting the groundwork for the next phase of my life. Like, I really feel like, you know, I've, I've, I've not only closed a chapter, like I'm in a whole new book and, you know, I, I loved the first book. I hope it's a bestseller, but like we're on to the second part of it. And, um, and I feel like I'm really, uh, I'm really doing the things I feel like are best for me in the longterm. And, and I don't mean like the practical, physical, everyday things. I mean, like I'm getting my mind trained.

1:41:18I'm ready, ready. Like, and it really does take commitment to be like, Oh, I just had a thought that I don't, I don't think it's for my best interest. Let's like divert it this way. and that's like mental tennis you know and you're like rocky in russia the training montage like just doing the reps because i know that i have to do that because i know what i want to achieve and i know where i want to go and i already see see myself there and i feel that and to to be able to already embody that feeling i know what's going to happen and so it's easy for me to put in the work put in the groundwork when i know that i'm that i'm going to be there because you know billy Carson could explain this as well, but like everything exists at the same time anyway.

1:41:59So I'm my little me, I'm my present me, and I'm my future me all at once. So here's a question for you then. Okay. What is the biggest dragon you're going to need to slay in the future? My mind. That your mind is training for now. What is the biggest thing you're going to need to overcome and conquer in the future that your mind has been preparing you for that you're going to say, do I take this call to adventure? Do I take on the dragon? Do I go on this journey or do I stay comfortable at this new place that I'm in this new comfort zone? I love that question. It's very easy for me to be like, no, I like it here.

1:42:37It's really cozy and safe and I'm good. But no, I have this insatiable desire to keep going. I just have this feeling, you know, I'm obviously going to I keep acting and I love what I do, but I have this feeling that in the next decade of my life, something's gonna shift and change, like an element of my career. And I know that I need to be really dialed in and ready for it. I've literally not one clue what it is, I couldn't tell you. I believe it has to do with speaking, connecting with people, service, you know. It really is a passion of mine, connecting with people. And so I need to be ready for that.

1:43:15So the dragon that must be slayed is being afraid of visibility i think like it's so interesting you're a public figure you have millions of followers you're on tv your movies you're but that's a person visible but but but a lot of that's a persona it's not your authentic voice well i feel like i do show up as as myself but there is not your words right and i i have had this whole thing my entire life of like look at me look at me and then everyone looks at me and i was like why are you looking at me it's kind of and that that is just me in a nutshell interesting it doesn't make sense to me at all um how both of those things could exist at the same time like desperately wanting to be seen but in a genuine way but also feeling exposed when i end and so i'm really thinking that's why it's like so great to be having these conversations because we're talking about a lot of a lot of exposing vulnerable yes things and um and i and i'm learning no and i and and i'm showing up as me and just like learning to be okay with it and like not second guessing anything i said on my drive home today you know just knowing that whatever i said was the right thing that needed to be said and that's beautiful um yeah so the dragon would be slaying the dragon of fear of being fully seen yes that's and getting like backlash for your true authentic voice or something exactly um this has been powerful i don't want to take too much more time i've got two final questions before i ask them okay uh i know you got a lot of projects going on i think you posted something on netflix or one of these platforms recently yeah well you've got lots of projects happening can you share what you're working on what you're excited about yeah so um i have a movie coming out well we have to finish it first but it's called white mars and it's a sci-fi thriller yeah i see that very fun that will probably come out next year okay miss filling you filming here uh in london we're gonna we filmed part of it in italy last year and so we have a few pickups on you okay um and then the release you're talking about we didn't even know the release was going out but it's a project that's in development at netflix and it it's a book that i i first read five years ago and it was the first it's the first project i've been a part of from the very beginning where i was like i have to make this into something and you know it was a true it's a true story of believing in something and good things take time because it's been you know five years of assembling the right team and you know netflix is obviously a dream like such a dream place for it um then i'm doing a rom-com in ireland this summer wow called princess and then a few other things that i possibly it's a little too early to to say but but I will say I love where my career's at and and when I started putting myself first my career only blossomed as well that's just like a great byproduct of of choosing yourself is other things start to flourish beautiful yeah so all these projects some are coming out soon some coming out later yeah but if we follow you or Lucy Hale on Instagram is that the best place to be up-to-date if you want to see pictures of my dogs like me spilling my coffee me talking about astrology yes that is the best place to find okay cool awesome yeah um this is uh two questions i ask everyone at the end this is called the three truths okay we've already hypothetically gone into the past and into the future but another hypothetical scenario imagine you step into this next book and then many more books you write in your life um and you get to write all the books you want literally and and metaphysically i guess as well but um but at some point you can no longer write any more books and your story ends in this earth many years in the future yeah so imagine you get to live your life accomplish all your dreams learn all the lessons but it's the last day on earth for you far in the future okay and for whatever reason on this last day you have to take all of your work with you every movie every project every podcast interview, anything that's ever been said, written, or produced by you, gone.

1:47:25But on the last day, you get to leave behind three final truths, three lessons that you know to be true from your experiences that you would leave with the world. And that's all we have to remember you by. What would those three truths be for you? Wow, that I've learned. Just your life. What would you want to leave behind? What would you want to leave behind as lessons to the world, things that you would say, here's what I learned and here's what I share as my lessons. I feel like one major thing is we are all so connected in ways that we can't even possibly imagine. I'm talking from the trees to the animals, especially humans.

1:48:02And there is a oneness that I've experienced that once that light bulb goes off for you, so much of the, I don't know I feel like when I discovered that like it just made me have so much empathy for other people just realizing like we all share a consciousness and like your success is my success your pain is my pain you know for better or worse we're all connected and I think that like never losing sight of that is really really important because I think we we grow up in a world that wants to separate us by religion by politics by culture by clothing by whatever it is and that um dividedness causes obviously a lot of pain and chaos but we are all so connected okay um okay that's one um um okay and the other one this is hard this is hard two other truths i would say

1:49:04that, I mean, I already kind of said this, but we are the creator of our own realities. We can take full control. There's no need to, you know, blame anyone else, but we, our minds are so powerful and just like really remembering that innate source energy that we all have, like it's there. And I get so excited when I see people I know tap into it. And then And the third, oh my gosh, I'm having to like go to the depths of my brain. Repeat the question one more time. Three, three lessons you would leave behind. Three lessons. There are no mistakes in life. There are things we could do differently with the knowledge we have, but there are no mistakes.

1:49:50There are no coincidences. I believe everything has a purpose and a place and a lesson and everything is always working for your high school. That's beautiful. Yeah. Uh, Lucy, before I ask the final question, I want to acknowledge you for your journey of getting into alignment for yourself, of working on healing your nervous system. And I know it's a constant journey, but it sounds like it was two decades of a lot of emotional uncertainty with all the success and the fame and the money and the attention you felt, it sounds like inside of you, you were still emotionally out of alignment. Very much so.

1:50:28And so I want to acknowledge you for waking up for yourself and getting into alignment and feeling that sense of peace in your nervous system and healing, because I only know that this next book you write in the world is going to serve people in such an empowering way. So I'm so excited to see what the journey is for you and how you show up in full service to yourself and to others and starting to bring your voice to the world. Thank you so much. I say you putting your voice out more and sharing more of this is going to only help more of your audience or anyone else that doesn't know about you and care more about these things.

1:51:03So I acknowledge you for the journey that you've overcome, the journey you're on, and the journey you're going to be on. And I'm excited to put this out there as well for the world to hear. Thank you so much. Of course. It means a lot. It's important to take those moments. And really, I needed that. Thank you. I really appreciate that. Yeah, of course. Yeah. Final question, Lucy. What's your definition of greatness? Oh. Oh, my definition of greatness is. OK, how do I wear this? I feel like my brain, I see like blocks of thought, but articulating it is so hard. It's OK. My definition of greatness is recognizing that your greatness is going to look different every day.

1:51:44Some days you're 100 percent is going to be 50 percent a different day. And just always knowing that that's OK. like and always knowing that I mean it just goes back to that alignment thing like being in alignment is greatness yes you know and you make up your own definition of what greatness is that's what's great about being human we give meaning to things so like my meaning of greatness is gonna differ from yours it's gonna differ from everyone else's and to me that is greatness like how cool that we can have our own definition of things and perception of things but But I think, yeah, for me, it's recognizing whatever greatness is to me is going to look different on any given day.

1:52:26And today it's good conversation. It's being open, leading with integrity, my favorite word. It's not being afraid of the scary shit, you know, and just showing up as me, like showing up as yourself is the greatest gift you can give the world. That's it. Lucy, thanks for being here. I appreciate you. Oh my God. Dream come true. Powerful. Seriously, dream come true. I hope you enjoyed today's episode and it inspired you on your journey towards greatness. Make sure to check out the show notes in the description for a full rundown of today's episode with all the important links. And if you want weekly exclusive bonus episodes with me personally, as well as ad-free listening, then make sure to subscribe to our Greatness Plus channel exclusively on Apple Podcasts.

1:53:10Share this with a friend on social media and leave us a review on Apple Podcasts as well. Let me know what you enjoyed about this episode in that review. I really love hearing feedback from you and it helps us figure out how we can support and serve you moving forward. And I want to remind you if no one has told you lately that you are loved, you are worthy and you matter. And now it's time to go out there and do something great.

1:53:45Thank you.