#339 Christian Craighead - The Uncensored Story of the Nairobi DusitD2 Attack

29:19The future happens. Kenya happens. Do with that. And then November 2019, I'm in Brooklyn in New York, and I get a phone call. It's a commanding officer, and he says, hey, just so you know, you've been awarded the conspicuous garantly cross for your actions in kenya all right colonel thanks a lot bye that's kind of that i then go back to kenya wrap up in kenya and then go back home and i'm in hereford and i'm looking and and the cross is there and i look at it and something this is the other weird thing something makes makes me look at the date so then look at the date so i turn it around 14th of november look at my phone and i'm like so on the 20 years to the day that's when i was awarded the the gallantry cross for my actions in in kenya so what's also strange is that what something made me look at the day some said like look at look at the day look at the day and uh so that's a kind of that's is it coincidence i don't know i don't think so and make May God always guide you.

30:40And he did on that day, too. Yeah. What were you doing in Kenya? I was a liaison officer to the Kenyan military. So the main role of it, there's lots of little tasks, but the main role of it, in essence, was to train Kenyan military units out there. Is it one man? I mean, you were the only... So typically there's one operator and there's support elements, but there's one SES guy. How long were you down there? It was supposed to be a two-year job, but I arrived in December 2018. So when the terrorist attack happened, it happened exactly a month after I'd been there. So I hadn't been there long.

31:32And then with Christmas in between, I hadn't get a real feel of things because, yeah, basically from the, I got there on 18th of December, then everyone stood down for Christmas and New Year, so I hadn't really got the feel for anything and meet many people or even know my way around and know how things work.

31:55Do you want to talk about before the incident, but the day of? we covered a little bit of this the last time I interviewed you, but I'd like to get a refresher because what happened right before is...

32:15Yeah. Being guided by God. Yeah. So that morning, I got up at 0430. And the reason why I got that up that early is I wanted to do some shooting and check in on some training. because the traffic in Nairobi is super bad. I got up that early to drive into the countryside to a training camp. And then I just do my own shooting, my own drills and things, and then pop in to see the guys who I was training or overseeing the training and introduce myself because I never met them. From then on, I'm driving back to my home. I pull out onto, it's rough going, and pull out on what we call the main, but it's really a dirt track.

33:01And as I pull onto this dirt track, I see a guy on the road, and what's unusual about him is he's dressed in a beige safari, like a business suit, highly polished shoes. When you ever see anyone on this main, they're either Maasai tribesmen or maybe workers working on the Chinese rail track that was being built across the country. So it's like, wow. But not only is it like he looks out of place, but I break all procedures and reel down the window and say, hey, buddy, do you want a lift? Something compelled me to ask him if he wanted a lift. Completely breaking. I don't pick up hitchhiking. He wasn't hitchhiking, but I don't pick up strangers, especially when I'm in another country on a military presence.

33:55But something compelled me, gets in the car, With only one month on the ground, you're not even that familiar. It could have been really embarrassing. It could have been more than embarrassing. But something compelled me just to ask him if he wants to live. He starts talking and stuff, and then he goes through some... He goes, what's your name? Chris. He said, oh, I'm Simon. And he said, how old are you? I'm 43 at the time. I'm 43. He goes, I'm 43. When were you born? I'm like, September. I was born in September. What day were you born? It's like, 15th. It's like, I don't know what day I was born in September, but this is a good sign.

34:36That means in September 1975, Simon and Chris were born. And then he, like, chuckles. Drive along a bit. He says some other things. And then he reaches into his pocket and pulls out a dagger. Again, my spider sense doesn't flash red. I'm cool with it. And I just smile and go, you're not going to try and kill me with that, are you this this blade um so we'll we'll clear some things up here so it was a curved blade with a double point now i i now learned it's called a chris the knife and it's and um well known now because of the film dune because that's kind of what they've got the uh um uh the good guys and that.

35:24And it's double point. And my belief is that the double point was maybe because the tip was broken and it's just been filed into or adjusted to a double point. Who knows? But it's very similar to St. Michael's. When you see the imagery of St. Michael, that's what it looks like. So it's kind of the blades about so long. This is a local guy? Yes. So he's like a round black guy.

35:52And he pronounces, Chris, Chris, Missa Chris. Is he sitting behind you? No, next to me. Next to you. And I said, oh, you're not going to try and kill me with that. And he goes, no, no, I carry this in case I come across any demons or evil spirits along this road. And then he chuckles to himself and puts it away. so I then I turn to him and say hey judging by how you're dressed I take it you're going into the city and he's like no no please drop me off at the the first spot you come to outside of this village remember this is an African village so it's like I'm like this one coming up he's like yeah yeah so as I stop he um he opens the door and then when his foot hits the ground everything changes and in in um his voice it's like a bit like if i upset you if i said something insulting to you you got like your face turned serious his first face turned serious and it's like chris and his voice although quiet filled everywhere felt like it was coming from every direction said chris may god bless you many times this day and then snaps out of it oh thank you Thank you, Mr.

37:09Chris. Thank you, thank you. And then get out of the car and then I drive off. As I get about 100 yards or so down the road, I look in the mirror, I can't see him. I know if he's run left or right or whatever. But at the time I was like, oh, that's a bit... I could feel it 30 hours later, after the most remarkable day of my life, before I'd even, as I was walking out of the compound or the complex, I could hear that, may God bless you many times this day, ringing in my ears. Did you think anything of it? Not then, I just thought, oh, okay. But when you talk about his voice filling the entire car.

37:52Yeah, it was just like, you know, when you think, did I imagine that? Did I just, did that just happen? And it was just like, and then, but straight after that, I'm walking out of the complex and that's what I'm thinking of. I'm like, man, as if to say, remember this, look at the date, that same thing. You're never going to be here. You're never going to visit this place again. Look at the date. May God bless you. There's like these pokes and prods. You know, one wonders throughout your life of how many times you meet, you get a message in some way, shape or form. And you just don't, you might pick up on one or two.

38:37Maybe they're happening to us every day, every other day, all the time. But we just don't say it. Do you think they are? Yeah, I think we are. Maybe one time you'll get shown all of these things of, you know, I tried to tell you. Whatever the message is, you should have known. And some of it is your gut, you know, when you think, you know, your gut feeling. And a lot of people dismiss it. Sometimes they don't, but most of the time you do. And it's like, how many times is even a stranger, someone close to you even, says something to you and you just didn't get it. You didn't pick it up. But all the way through your life, you're being guided or you're getting messages or you're getting even just kind of like a notional slap on the back.

39:23You're doing the right thing. And this was like a complete attitude change in this guy. Like from what you know of him, out of character, out of tone. I mean, just like something came over him. Yeah. Hey, Chris, may God bless you many times this day. And then back to like... It wasn't like how you said it. It was like, I can't imitate it. But it's like me talking to you, having a good time. And we were just talking like this. This is our volume level. All's good. And I was like, Sean. And you're like, Sean, may God bless you many times this day. Anyway, mate, I've got to go. Catch you later on, all right?

39:59So that's kind of the level. He'd be like, as if he was like, pay attention to this. This will, and true, in classic style, it's like, yeah, I heard it. OK, that was a bit weird. Didn't dwell on it. A breaking pattern. But then later on, it's so profound that later on, your mind is saying, you have to remember this. Jeez. I mean, looking back, you obviously think about it a lot. Yeah. This is my thing. I think he was, I think he's a real human being, but I think he was given a message from God. And it's not something I'm willing to share on the interview, but I know about, I kind of experienced this before.

40:53Sorry, I experienced it after where he's probably thinking, where did that come from? he might go on I remember saying it I said it but where did that come from okay and it's like so I think I think he was delivering a message from an angel someone God again it's all open to everyone someone can look at this and go oh it's a bit that's a bit like pretentious thinking it was from God and whatever but it's like a message from God or like do you do you Do you feel like you are more open to perceiving those kind of things now than you were? I think so. Do you see them more often than you used to? It's a bit like conspiracy theories.

41:39Once you see, you can't unsee, and you start seeing more and more patterns, or conspiracy theories, or conspiracies really nowadays, where once you open your eyes and you see it, you see more and more of it, and it starts, well, man, it's everywhere. I think it's similar with all sorts of things.

42:03What happened after you dropped them off? Where did you go? I went and got my hair cut. So I went to a barbershop, got my hair cut, and then I went for lunch. I had Moroccan beef and a dower, which is the Kenyan cocktail. I still find it hard to believe that you can't get dowers I've never seen one in London or anywhere in America and I think again people would clean up in the drinking world with these dowers it's such a delicious cocktail and easy to make but someone's probably listening I don't know any people who own bars and things there you go you're welcome and had a dower

42:51which is vodka, lime juice and honey. And you have a dower stick and you mix it up and it's very refreshing and hot weather. But anyway, so I had a drink and then I went home, drove home. And that was it for the day. I was just going to try and, because I'm still finding my feet still moving in, maybe do some slight bits of work on the computer and then buy some supplies and things for the house. Just a normal Tuesday afternoon. You live them by yourself? Mm-hmm, yeah.

43:30And right at that moment from when, you could say from when he says, may God bless you many times this day, the clock was ticking. Five Al-Shabaab terrorists were now set or getting set to launch their attack on the Ducid D2 hotel complex in Nairobi. And the clock was ticking. What time did that happen? Well, the attack. The suicide detonation was at 3.17 PM. 3.17 PM. How much time had passed? And again, I shouldn't do this, but I overthink things what people think. Anyone who's watching going, oh, well, I saw the videos and the times are different on the video footage. For your information, all of the security cameras in the DUSA area, all the times are out of sync.

44:24So don't, so I'm telling you what time happened. 17 minutes past three.

44:33Do you want to know another strange coincidence? What room was Maylee in? She was in 3.16.

44:49But that's not the coincidence. What is it? So 10 years before, do you remember the landing on the Hudson?

45:01So when the aircraft taking out of New York had the bird strike, and then the Sully, the pilot, did some amazing flying and landed on the Hudson.

45:16So that's the story. This is going all over the place, but after Kenya happens, I'm back home just recently. So it's happened, this is the weekend after, because I'm getting my hearing things checked. So we're going to be in the Monday or Tuesday now. I decide to watch the movie directed by Clint Eastwood with Tom Hanks. It's about that incident, and I'm watching it. And there's a bit in the movie where he's done the landing and everyone's talking to him saying, you've done a great job. And part of me was like, man, this is so, like, it's so familiar to me. It was like me back on camp, what people are saying to him, you are the man for the job, blah, blah, blah, you did a great job.

46:01And I was like, so I took an interest in the incident. And I look at it, and I'm like, damn, It happened on the 15th of January 2009, 10 years to the day. So I'll buy the book about the incident, get it the next day from Amazon, and read it. It's a really good book by the pilot. And at the end of the book, there's the annex, and it's the flight recording log. And I'm looking through it, and that's when I'm like... And I think it's mentioned, I can't exactly remember, it might be mentioned in the book, but I confirmed it with the flight log. Bird strike, 3.17pm. So exactly this, I know we're on the other sides of the world, but at 3.17pm on the 15th of January, the aircraft that landed on the Hudson had the bird strike.

46:59And 3.17 on the 15th of January, 10 years later, was the suicide detonation in Kenya. And what's strange about the pilot Sully, his story, is that everything in his life was taking him to that moment. The experience he gained in the Air Force and other things. Whereas any other pilot would have maybe catastrophically tried to land at a different airport or done something else. But through everything in his life had taken him to that moment, And he was like, no, got to land on the river. And it's a strange sort of coincidence, or you could say. Do you think everything in your life prepared you for that moment?

47:49Yeah. And I'm very grateful for this, is that because most people live their whole life not to get this opportunity to look back and go, this is why everything happened. everything that I should be angry about I'm kind of thankful for in some things even and it's like because that shaped me I was training for this day in Kenya from the moment I was born my training started day one that's when it all started and everything shaped me and pushed me bad things good things whatever everything to that point and and even just from a very shallow point of view and things when career things didn't go you well you know I should have got that job I should have done that, that's when you're like, well, if I hadn't, I wouldn't have been in Kenya, let alone all the personal things where it's like abuse or shitty relationships or anything.

48:44It's like that's shaping me into the person I need to be at that moment. And it's the same for everyone. And it's the same for people who think, oh, well, why is this happening to me? I know it sounds patronizing sometimes when you think, oh, and it's saying it's part of the system. And even to the point when, if someone's there going, I haven't done anything in my life or whatever, you don't know. And hopefully one day you get to see that. Because even remember that someone does an amazing thing, but it wasn't just you. It's like everything that your parents did, their parents, their grandparents, all of that leads up to that point and then and and it moves on and everything you do for the future generations from what you have whether it be whether it be children that you have or some something you just say to one person that that changes the whole the whole world it's something to think about of when people were looking at the thinking about their value and like oh i'm a nobody i hear when i really hate it when someone says, I'm a nobody.

49:56Yeah, me too. It's like, nobody's a nobody. Yeah. You know, I know I want to talk about this at the end, but I don't want to lose the thought. You know, we were talking at the beginning and last, you know, it sounds like you found your purpose, but the last time you were really struggling with it. And so, I mean, what you did on that day, you know, in Nairobi, and you just said it yourself, you think everything in life led up to that point and, and shaped you and who you, into who you needed to be that day. After that happened, did you feel a,

50:43I mean, it's such a significant thing what happened that day and, and, and what you did and how many people are alive because of you. And so when you think that, you know, everything that you've been through in life, military service, childhood abuse, all of it, you know what I mean, was to essentially rescue over 700 people in a 22-hour period,

51:14what left is there in life? Did you have that thought? Did you have like, I've completed my life's purpose? What else is there? Well, that's on the last interview, I said, that was one of the things I was struggling with. It was maybe I'm a tool that was made for that job. Now you use a specialized tool, it's useless and should be discarded. That was like my mindset that day when I was talking to you. It was like, maybe that's it, now I'm useless. They made me into this tool that is useless for everything else other than that one thing. And now what I've come to realise was that that day in Kenya is another...

51:59That's just part of the plan. Because without that day in Kenya, now I can't go on to do all the other things I'm doing now. So that was the thing I needed to do to help with whatever it is I do in the future, whether it be leading people to God, supporting President Trump, whatever, whatever the things could be in the future, that's, without Kenya, there's no, that's the, it was a gateway moment of moving on to the next things. That's kind of what I think. I mean, it, I hate to say it this way. I don't, but I do. But, you know, it shaped you into a role model. You know, you did something that nobody experiences ever.

52:59Generations, you know. I mean, there's nobody that experiences that. And then, you know, I still remember the day that I always wondered who it was. You know what I mean? And I remember, I don't remember exactly what it said, but I remember the post that came. I believe it was an Instagram account. And you had kind of said, like, I never wanted my identity to get out, but here I am. Yeah. You know, it was something along those lines. And with that comes a tremendous amount of influence. and you had just mentioned you know after our last interview the thousands of messages that you received that you couldn't even keep up and and you know maybe you didn't need to keep up i mean it all pointed to one thing and it sounds like the majority of them listened and and they wouldn't have if it was if it wasn't for you you know and so you led thousands and you'll never even be able to count them all you know people to uh uh to christ to a better way of living to really the only thing that's important and you continue to do that and we just talked about also at the beginning that people are scared to they hide it you know and so you're becoming a role model for them to not hide it and then uh you just have to face the repercussion the repercussions if there are any.

54:32And a lot of times, you know, they don't see them. Well, they don't happen. It's not as bad as I thought it was going to be. And so I just wanted to say that. But let's take a break, and when we come back, we'll get into 317. Okay.

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57:17Well, that was an interesting break. talk about synchronicities huh yeah so we're over here talking about spiritual battles things are going to get in the way from keeping you to do shit yeah we walk out of here you check your email and the UK files an injunction and wants to serve you here in the US yeah on the break yeah but look man i uh you know i kind of said it out there but um you're good yeah because i've been through a lot of shit on this podcast and the attorney tim parlatori one of my best friends and my attorney there is nobody better for this shit and that dude will fuck these people up.

58:13He's had my back more times than I can count on this show. Cansoft tried to mess with us, told us all this shit was classified. Shit that they put in Ballistic Magazine with Dallas Alexander. He was on the sniper team that got the world's longest sniper shot, the world record. It was like 2.1 miles. he fucked them up like fucked them up went all over the press and then they ran away like cowards a congressman out of texas tried to sue me dan crenshaw destroyed their people canna cook tried to sue me came came after me they sent me a cease and desist or gave me a threat or i'd got to do a public apology he fucking destroyed them so you know the fact that that and you know what's ironic is you get the email right before we're supposed to right before we walk in the door here to cover the actual incident the thing the main thing that we're here for to get your story out and talk about what's happening to you and you happen to get the email Not before we start the show.

59:28Before we start that specific segment. And we're in here talking about synchronicities. Isn't that crazy? Yeah. I mean, it stings. I knew this would come, but it still stings. I mean, as people who have been involved with legal before, how they word the letters is very like a bullying tactic and such. So it still hurts and makes it real. But I knew this. and this is too big to this is this this whole story and what they're trying to stop and everything is i should add it doesn't break the official secrets act it's just they just don't want me to tell the story we'll get into why later on um but it's it's a story that most of the world saw it was on all the newspapers it like i said this does not break the official secrets act and they're just desperate for me not to tell the story.

1:00:21Why? Why? It's becoming bigger than the incident. Myself is the reasons why. Why would you want to try and stop this? Well, I just want to let you know that, like I said, you are in... This is what you're supposed to be doing. And to me, what just happened out there proved it. The timing of it proves it. and like i know what it's like man every time i see a fedex truck around here i'm like oh shit here comes another one but uh but like i said um there is nobody better for you than tim parlatory that man is a force to be reckoned with so i i just i hope that puts you at ease a little bit And that dude is not going to let anybody fuck with you.

1:01:15I guarantee it. So anyways, I'm sorry that happened, man. But it is, we're doing what we're supposed to be doing. And that email proves it, that it came in right then. And that you checked it right then, right before we walk in the door after the break. so man wild wild i can't believe that i can't believe i'm saying i can't believe but you know what i mean it's just it's just yeah synchronicities but well christian we're getting ready to get into the incident yeah and i know this is going to be heavy and um but i got you another present before it gets heavy all right all right

1:02:17Man. Have you seen one of these? Yes, I have, yeah. Well, you know, I... I haven't had hands-on with one, but I... Well, it's the SIG MCX Spear 6.8 version. And it's going to come with the optic. And, you know, you were talking about all the tinnitus and the hearing loss from the grenades. and uh so silencer shop sent a suppressor to put on there too all right and uh you know just like you're saying you weren't a shill i've been carrying sig for eight years yeah and uh and i carried it one in the seal teams too and um they wound up luckily becoming a partner of mine and we've done some amazing stuff together.

1:03:09We actually did an episode on roadblocks, which is a bunch of horrific stuff that's happening to kids on there. And one of the things they did was they recreated all the active shooter events that have happened here in the U.S., probably more. Maybe Nairobi's even on there. but uh but um what they did is that they even you so you reenacted and they even put the kids names up top as you murder them on the game and they were using sig weapons in the game sig sig sig rifles sig pistols and um so i told my friend jason over at sig about it yeah they got their legal involved and told robux get their shit off that platform immediately um they've also donated all the there's a county right next to where we live and they donated brand new rifles to the entire SWAT team and suppressors and optics and flashlights so it's a good company you know what i mean it's a good company they make great stuff i've got buddies over at silencer shop too they um They just won.

1:04:21I don't know the court case or anything, but they won up against the federal government, and they won. So now you don't have to do the typical paperwork for suppressors. And I thought there's not a chance at hell they're going to win that, and they won it. And we called them up, and I was like, Isn't this kind of counterproductive with what you guys do as a company? Like, aren't you kind of... You're kind of screwing yourselves here. And they're like, hey, they're like, yeah, we are. You're right. But that's how much we believe in this fight. And if it destroys our company, then it destroys our company.

1:05:03And so they're going to fight the federal government knowing it might significantly damage their business. so anyways this is the uh mcx 6.8 spear with a sig suppressor from silencer shop

1:05:31yeah it's got like all the it's i mean great gun and everything you know it's good with it i like I hope. True North Concepts are a good unity on the light. And then, yeah. Well, thanks, man. I'm waiting to run this out. We'll run this out in a little bit, I suppose. Yeah. Maybe next break we'll run out and shoot some stuff. I'll test the styro. You can test that. Freedom. Freedom. Freedom. Freedom. Freedom. No king but Jesus. That's right, man. um no thank you you're welcome

1:06:16and you got something that you wore that day on right yes um well you brought a couple things well this is the oh yeah i misunderstood your question so yeah we'll get what you we'll do first do we do this first since i've got it out yeah i was like i went i uh i went rogue so this is uh this was in on the rear pouch of my uh belt system which had the black bead flag on there was my med kit and also this bible really and as i said earlier when the i went to the padre um after one of our first meetings he gave me this camouflage uh new testament and he said oh this is It's an American issue at the time.

1:07:02Who gave that to you? The Padre, who I, when I first knocked on his door in 1999, and he gave me this. And then from that moment on, I carried this in my equipment, in my belt kit, for the rest of my career. And so it's done over 1 ,000 high-risk missions... Wow. ...across the world, and it's got a... Yeah, so it's been through. And that was the... That's it. Yeah. I still got the one you gave me the first time you were on the show right here. Yeah, it's the armor upgrade. And then the other thing is this watch, Garmin watch. So this is the watch and strap that I wore on that day. And I thought it's kind of, we'll wear it for this.

1:07:48I haven't really worn it. So I turned it on the other day to charge up. It's the first time since 2019. I think I wore it and then because something to consider and how things evolve and develop. I was wearing this, I mean, they're great watches and handy and I was wearing it. But when I went into the incident, as things moved on and into the nighttime, I was looking at my watch and everyone knows how it ends now. But at the time, I didn't know if this was going to go on for days and days and days. the battery lives on these are phenomenal but I didn't go in with it fully charged so part of my sort of thinking was man I hope this watch doesn't run out of power in in two or three days time because or however long it's going to go on for so you never know how long it's going to be so from from that moment on even when I was still involved with the incident when I came out it was like yeah I was back onto my old saying everything comes around in a circle where I'm wearing an automatic watch everything I do after this point because I mean people don't understand how valuable a watch and time is so I am a big big fan of automatic watches from for combat for everything because when you run out that door who knows when you're gonna be the next time you're gonna be how long you're gonna be away for especially if it's an end of world scenario you know so why did you pick that watch uh that's just the watch i was wearing all the time anyway it's handy it's got the compass it's got everything lots of military guys use these uh and but it's strange how you know how thinking changes tactics change mentality changes and it's like man i need to go back to how it was in the 90s where hey use automatic watch do you have does that have a gps yes yeah is the coordinates and all that stuff still loaded on there uh i didn't i didn't you didn't i didn't use it to its full potential either it would have been good to monitor your heart rate and things like that all the way through it but it but if you start the more you use it it's kind of obvious but the more you use it the more that it degrades the battery life so but yeah i mean i mean battery life on the on these watches are really good but like I say you don't know how long it's going to be is it going to be two hours two days in some you know how the world works now two months before you get to charge you or get to the resupply or whatever again um but it but it was a legitimate um thought of mine is I don't know if this watch is going to last the duration remember I didn't know when it was going to end.

1:10:41So in my mind, this could go on for days and days. Man, that's cool that you have those two things, especially the Bible, man. That's a sentimental guy. I have a rosary in my pocket as well. I wear my rosary these days, but I had a rosary all the way through that as well, but I don't have that rosary anymore. But we need all the help you can get these days. That's right. That's right. We just found that out. Yeah. But, you know, even the fact that, you know, it's a Friday mid-afternoon after lunchtime going into a long weekend, and just the fact that he answered the first phone call, you know what I mean, the first time we called, I mean, it's just, you're good, man.

1:11:29You're good. So let's go into it. 3.17 p.m. Yeah. So let's just go. So at 3.17 p.m., there's a suicide detonation. So prior to that, minutes prior, the terrorists, the Islamic terrorists, set themselves up. So on the spur road leading to the hotel, stationary, at the start of the road, there were four terrorists armed with automatic AK-47-style rifles, hand grenades and hand grenades. They were in position. Inside the complex was another terrorist in a smart business suit with a suicide vest underneath the suit. He then moved to position, which was outside the Secret Garden Cafe, which was a popular meeting place for diplomats, businessmen, high-powered people, if you like, or people of influence, they'd meet in this open-air cafe, and he positioned himself just outside it.

1:12:43Seconds before it all started, he was on the phone, and he said, are you ready? Are you set? And then at 3.17, the suicide detonation happened which was the which was the go signal to initiate the attack so the suicide detonation happens kills everyone who's in the cafe instantly and the and the car the Toyota starts motoring it towards the gatehouse with the terrorists firing their automatic weapons out of the out of through the windows at anyone fleeing the detonation at the hook that the secret garden cafe that killed an American, a British guy, an Australian, and two Kenyans. And sadly, the American who lost his life that day was at the Twin Towers on 9-11, and helped help survivors from the rubble on that day, only to be killed by Islamic terrorists years later.

1:13:49And all the people in that cafe were there to make a difference, to support Somalia, to support people in need. They were all there on a humanitarian sort of nature, and they were all killed in this cowardly act of terrorism. So the four guys in the Toyota coming down the road, shooting at people, they lost control of the car somehow and went into a ditch. They then got out of the car and then moved at state. speed into the complex again firing anyone flaying and then throwing hand grenades once they got into the complex they walked straight past the security office by the main entrance walked straight past that and then split into two two-man teams splitting off at an angle and their mo as is the way of um al-shabab was just to kill and maim or kill or sorry let's not say kill murder as many people as possible whenever they came across and the one of the teams as they went one past the first entrance there was a guy crouched down in there and they just went up and executed him immediately and so they split up into the into the complex at about that time I just I just got out the shower and I lived around about three miles ish from the from this hotel and just put my jeans on and got a phone call from a friend again thinking about like something i wasn't going to answer the call i was like i'll i'll get dressed and then i'll call him back but something really pulled at me and say answer the phone so i answered the phone and he was like chris oh sorry the first thing he said was jen so jen in in royal marines and royal Navy speak is like if you say Jen it means it's it's not a lie so you can say oh there's if you say Jen an alien spaceship landed outside that means hey I'm telling the truth it also means pay attention because the way he said it was like Jen and then he went Chris there's a complex attack happening you need to get I haven't got I'm laying low I haven't got a weapon I'm laying low you need to get down here with your boys right now and I was like okay I'm on my way and he was an ex-marine who'd got the nation's highest award for gallantry a few years earlier in Kenya he was retired but yeah he called me so him and so he said the word complex attack which means a multi-dimensional attack using one or more weapon system typically explosive device and then gunfire so i was like okay and i just said yeah i'm on my way and i said it like that but my heart kind of feels like it feels like now after getting a legal notice it's like it's pumping pumping away and uh and i'm like okay let's go so i changed i was going to put a t-shirt on but now i put a a grey, like, outdoor shirt, put my approach shoes on, and grabbed my gear.

1:17:12My gear was ready. And when I mean ready, it was ready. So some people might say, oh, yeah, my gear's good to go. Is it really? Can you just grab your bag and throw it into your truck and go? Or do you go, oh, I just need to grab this or this? I had no, there was no intelligence to suggest that this was going to happen. But something, again, when I turned up in country, kind of made me think it could happen. I don't know why. I just said, I want to be ready if it does. Because I know that every second counts when dealing with terrorists. So everything was good to go. So I was just, yeah, grabbed my bag, threw it into my pickup truck, grabbed my weapons case, put it on the back seat, and put 14 Riverside drive into Google Maps.

1:18:04That's telling me 30-odd minutes, which is never going to be the case in Kenya. And then I go into the bathroom, look in the mirror, and just kind of throw cold water on my face. I was like, right, let's fucking do this. I go outside as well. There was a crucifix by my doorway. And I knelt down, said it, Hail Mary, and got in the truck. and um and then as i was leaving there was on the like we had a group there was a group chat for the people who lived in the area and it said oh there's a bank robbery happening in uh in the area but i knew that not to be true i didn't reply and as i was going out of the complex where i lived um like i said on google maps it said something like 38 minutes or so and um i've done i've done that same route afterwards just out of interest on a Tuesday afternoon at exactly the same time just to see how long it would take me and it took me uh well over an hour to do it on a normal Tuesday but now what you're gonna remember is there's been a major there's a major terrorist attack happening and Nairobi is coming to a standstill so as I pull out of the complex I say it's like the the traffic is just stationary and I'm like And I'm just thinking, you just got to go.

1:19:30Got to go for it. This is your rate. It's me. So I pull onto the oncoming traffic, and just start caning it down. I'm flashing my horn. Sorry, flashing my lights, using my horn, going into the spaces where, so I'm in and out, onto the sidewalk, doing the work where I could. Holy shit. just trying to get there as quickly as possible. So I'm like... Like, and strangely, there was not... Like I said, I didn't have blue lights or anything, but maybe people picked up when I needed to be there, and where normally people wouldn't give me the space or let me in, a lot of people were being... let me go.

1:20:14But also what I'm doing is, so I'm driving there. Because you're counter-flowing traffic. Yeah, on, like, sometimes with the floor on the right side, but then there was more, the traffic, because the traffic was heading to that instance, or that's why it was more solid. Leaving, if you imagine being stopped everywhere, leaving was pretty much free. So I was going, sometimes onto incoming traffic. It's some James Bond shit. It was like, yeah, have you ever seen The French Connection? No. There's a, well, it's a movie with Gene Hackman, and there's a famous driving scene like that, but this is, this is the French Connection driving scene times 10.

1:20:52It was bad. But also, I'm driving. Remember, I haven't been here long. This is a brand new truck, so I don't know my way around it, which will come apparent in a little bit. But what am I there for? I am a liaison officer. So part of me is like, I'm getting to the incident, but part of me is thinking as well, I'm not going to get stuck in. I don't think whatever happens is going to happen. I'm thinking, well, I'll get there and do my job as a liaison officer, first and foremost. so I think right well I need to I need to let people know what's going on so I call the UK to the ops room and it rings and this never happens in the movies but remember this is round about 3 30 on a Tuesday afternoon in in Kenya that means it's 12 30 in UK so most of people in the office room were at lunch so i'm phoning and then this guy answers like hello he he was a new guy um probably a comms guy or something like that where it was so new he didn't know that the the uh receiver had a push to talk button so when he's saying stuff i can't hear him because he's not pushing the push to talk so i can't hear anything i'm like hey it's chris there's a terrorist attack happening in Kenya in Nairobi I'm on route hello I can't hear anything so I'm trying to turn the volume and everything I'm like god so I went yep sending blind that means if you say sending blind it means I'm saying it I don't know if anyone can hear me but if they are here goes I'm saying terrorist attack happening at 14 Riverside Drive I'm on route hang up that's that

1:22:36so then I think right well I'll speak to the Kenyans the Kenyan military so I start at the top of the commanding officer and then work my way down because I phone up and most of the phones are either turned off or just ring out the majority of them are turned off so I'm not getting going down all the list of people who have got on the phone book nothing this does not faze me because in my mind I'm thinking well there's a major terrorist attack happening in Nairobi so all of these people are probably involved or dealing with the situation so I just need to get there so right now I haven't spoke to anyone and as I didn't know the car somehow in all of this messing around trying to turn the volume up trying to do stuff all of a sudden I'm trying to stay alive driving all of a sudden my playlist because I've got a classical music playlist on my phone starts playing Vivaldi's Four Seasons and it's like like not just loud and I don't want to turn it down because I'm I'm trying to at this point I'm trying not to die so I'm just like driving in and out and we've got all these cascading violins and like and it's kind of like although I had the classical music playlist to try and calm myself when driving and dealing with other drivers especially in africa but this is just like and i'm actually start laughing because it's the i'm thinking in my mind this is like i'm watching my own movie this is a movie scene doing this driving with the or like i say this classic vivaldi summer playing when i'm driving i'm kind of laughing at the how absurd it is but and there's a moment where there's two like we'll call them my tattoos are like small buses and there's just just passed around a roundabout turning circle and they're coming together and i'm like driving i'm like okay i'm gonna floor it and i'm like oh and i'm committed now i'm like and it's so tight that even when i go between the two buses as they're closing i like kind of like breathe in to try and make not just me smaller but the whole vehicle smaller and it must it just misses three about i was committed and hitting bursts of about 80 miles an hour in this thing and when you do advanced driving advanced driving isn't just about driving fast it's about knowing when to make the moves and when not to because what they teach you on day one is when you're responding to an incident yeah you gotta get there fast but getting there slower is better than not getting there at all and if you kill someone on the way there or die or crash your car therefore can't achieve your mission then there's no point so I was very thankful for the people who taught me that in passed then anyway so then get to a certain point on the road and it's complete gridlocked luckily i had a four by four in a truck and the opposite side the the dual carriageway on the other side is free so i just go over the over the median and scream straight up to the top and and at that point there's a there's a cop directing traffic and he runs out like stop Again, I don't know why I said it, but I did.

1:25:45I put the window down and I said, with a lot of conviction, I'm here on orders of the president. And he's like, oh, okay, go through. Like, thanks. And then just pull through here. And as I pull through up here, it's alerting me that I've got to my destination. I'm like, all right, I'm here now. So all of that phase there, not just from the erratic driving, but because I need to be there. I am nervous. But now I get there or get to that spur road where the terrorists started their attack, I'm kind of chill because I've got here now. So it's like, okay, I'm here now. And I actually become much more relaxed because now I've just got to worry about what's going on.

1:26:28As I slowly drive down, I don't know where I'm going. I've never been here before. And I see burning cars along the road. And I'm, okay, I'll use those burning cars as a demarcation line. and those cars had been set on fire when the terrorists had thrown hand grenades that caused these three cars to catch fire. So they were burning. So I stopped the truck and now I'm going to get out. And as I get out, I can hear gunfire and explosions, but I'm completely chill with this. The reason being, I think those gunfire and explosions is the Kenyan military or security forces dealing with the incident.

1:27:07for some reason i think i think i'm late to the party i think everyone's here now and they're just dealing with it so i get out the truck and and and and i look down the road where i can see police officer not many but a lot of people milling around or walking not many people really advancing towards the area but from my from right i know it's down there i can hear the gunfire explosion so that's where i need to go and i decide to put so i gotta go down there now i could just walk down kind of like this but also thought i don't want to just turn up and go hey you know i'm here i want to kind of look official so that's why i put my i put my assaulter's belt on put on my body armor and put a balaclava on my over to cover my face knowing that the media are likely to be here as well to hide my identity and i'll take my and the only reason why I do this is to look kind of official.

1:28:05In that bag, my ready bag, that wasn't all my gear. I had in a helmet, ear protection, eye protection, my vision goggles, my full uniform, other bits and pieces. Because in my mind, if we'd been doing this as a simulation or an exercise, typically what would have happened? Would have went down, would have went into a planning cycle. They would have got permission if they needed me. I would have got permission in that time gap I probably would have went back to my car put all my uniform on, got on my gear then we would have went into a planning cycle and then we would have dealt with the terrorists that's typically how it would work or how people say if you can war game this scenario what's going to happen so I think so I leave all that gear in the bag because I think I'm going to come back and have a chance to grab it so I take a counter down the road I tried to call the ops room and things again.

1:28:59Can't get through to anyone. And as I turn up to the threshold, if you like, which is the gatehouse and the gateway, I see the press are already here. They're on the left-hand side, and they've got the body armor on. They've got the cameras. They've got helmets on. So they got there before me. I don't know how, but they did. and so they're set up therefore and I'm looking around and there's the gatehouse or some people suggest the gatehouse I open up and inside there's eight to twelve guys and they're hiding and they're not stood around they're hiding they're under tables and chairs are keeping low and I look down at one of them say what's going I said British SES what's going on or special forces SES what's going on they're like al shabab al shabab i'm like i know that and then he more grenade gunfire and i'm like kenyan special forces in there kenyan police in there um again there's there's multiple people in there and someone says no holy shit no one's in there yet at the same time i hear a woman scream and i hear automatic gunfire cut the scream off it fires on the screen and i realize that woman has just been murdered.

1:30:22So right there, I look at them and say, right, I'm going in. Are you guys coming with me? And then one guy looks up and goes, no boss. And then I leave the office and then commit into the hotel.

1:30:49what would it be? For me, it's unplugging from work. When you love what you do, the switch never really flips off. There's always another episode, another guest, another idea at two in the morning, but getting better at actually shutting it down for a day, I'm working on it. That's the kind of thing that therapy is for, and BetterHelp makes it simple to start. It's entirely online. You fill out a short questionnaire, get matched with a licensed therapist, and you can switch therapists at any time at no extra cost until it's the right fit. Better is a feeling defined by you. And for BetterHelp, it's a BetterHelp therapist who really gets you.

1:31:25It's a focus on global emotional well-being with thousands of therapists and millions of members in over 100 countries. It's progress. And it's getting better at unplugging to focus on the things that make life great. Sign up and get 10 % off at BetterHelp.com. slash srs that's better h e l p dot com slash srs before we move on i'm just when you got the call from the ex-marine i mean you've you've had how much services you had up to this point i mean we covered a lot of it in in your other yeah not a lot of it but a different incidents so where i'm going with this is this could be could be considered uh just another day with a lot of the places that you've been afghanistan iraq i don't know everywhere you've been but i've been in multiple places where it's you know a hospital blew up a school blew up shopping mall blew up convenience store blew up gas station blew up terrorist attack at the market murder and tons of innocent i mean this this is it's a it's a weekly occurrence it's a day sometimes it's a daily occurrence you know depending on where you're at and what time frame you were there and in yemen iraq afghanistan packing like this stuff happens you know on a on a it's almost routine and so i'm sure you've been at those places when that has happened and not felt a responsibility to respond.

1:33:09I think the difference with this one was because Kenya is a beautiful country. It's very developed.

1:33:22It has happened in the past in Kenya, but it's not a daily occurrence. and so when it happens it's big and that's and it's so it's not like like say it's not a war zone and people uh go on holiday and um it's very popular tourist destination everything so when it happens is that that that was highlighted the gravity of it because these don't things happen often but when they do they're normally pretty pretty serious and pretty big um um but But it was just, yeah, I'll go. But it was, and again, I didn't know it was, in my thing, in my mind, I think people are there before me, responding, doing stuff, whatever.

1:34:03So it's... But you still had the sense of urgency, and it wasn't, it's not, I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, but they're not your people. They're not your comrades. They're not your friends. They're not your family. They're not your loved ones. They're not even your countrymen. Remember, I'm also going there to be, at this point, I'm going there to be like the liaison officer. So I'll get in my mind, they'll be dealing with it. The security forces are dealing with it. I'll be there to report, help if possible, or if they want my support. So from finding out it's happened and then to getting to that gatehouse, that's why I said I was kind of chill when I got there was because, well, the Kenyans are going to be dealing with it and I'll do my job as a liaison officer and help if I need to and blah, blah, and all that.

1:34:49So driving there, I didn't think it was like, Although it's like, I've got to get there because it's my job. There's no sense of like, oh, it's all up to me. I'm kind of saying it's me to get there because of pride even, just because of pride. And maybe this is the highest form of FOMO of like, I've got to get there. But it all changes when they're like, just the look of the guy looking up to me saying, no one's in there, no one's here yet. And then hearing no one scream. It's like, okay, it's all on me now. Yeah. And it wasn't, from him saying that to me saying, all right, I'm going in, it's probably less than two seconds reply.

1:35:36It wasn't, I didn't dwell on it and all that. Maybe, again, that's maybe my fault. Maybe I should have thought about it. I went, all right, maybe I need to assess the situation and phone in and get permission, do all these things like you would do on maybe a simulation. but then it was like go let's let's go so i'm going you can either come with me like saying are you coming with me no boss okay and you didn't try to persuade them didn't do anything it was like right well i'm going because if i'm not going to do it no one else is and someone's just been murdered and and that's what you know I would expect other people to think the same way I know I now know that that's maybe not the case but and then I commit into the into the hotel and here's the thing what people forget like

1:36:35people might see a different side on me in this interview because what I'm trying not to be is too humble and and and the the book which you can get now if you're watching this is um is it is very forgiving if i could read it like again i want it to be that way when i when i wrote it and finished it in the united states um is that you know it's i should have been a bit more harsher but you know it's good um but i'm i'm committed in when i'm once i'm committed in remember i don't i've never been here before i do not know this hotel complex at all i don't know how many terrorists there but i do know i can hear multiple gunfire shots i can hear grenades going off i don't know what they look like so so now i'm gone into neutralized terrorists and like I say, I don't know what they look like.

1:37:36So I now have got to do split-second thinking when I see people because they could be the terrorists, but they also could be a police officer if there's any in there. They could be a security guard. They could be a civilian. They could be an emergency worker. They could be anything. And I've got to make that split-second decision when I see them whether they shoot or not shoot. the terrorists on the other hand who've got automatic weapons and grenades they don't have to think about who they shoot they're they're killing everyone so they so but but as i said i didn't think i was at a disadvantage though because i was an ses commando going through that way i've been trained i'd luckily had an extremely unusual career leading up to this so i had a lot of experience and I'm going in there as a member of the Britain's top unit no one else comes close no one is the SAS and I'm in there so people will go oh well you're not scared I'm like no because these are just shahed Islamic terrorists and now they now they've met a threat and I feel ready for it and I feel ready to bring it on.

1:39:01So I'm in there. That's a level of confidence that nobody has.

1:39:12So moving to the complex, my mindset is search and destroy. Kill, not capture. I want to neutralize these terrorists. but I have no idea where I'm going so I have a look around I see an open doorway which was the an entrance into the storeroom of the cafe I found out later on I move into there clear it clear through it no one in there there's another door which I now know leads into the kitchen of the secret garden cafe where the suicide detonation was and as I move closer to the door I can hear moaning, crying, groaning behind the door. So again, if it was a simulation, I would breach through the door and clear the room.

1:40:01But now I'm thinking on my feet, which is a thing that separates the highest level of operators to average operators. It's like, yeah, you can do everything you've been trained to do. Now you're working outside of your comfort zone and outside of the box. because you've got to think on your feet. So my level of thought straight away is, well, I know there's injured people in here. What does that tell me? One, it's unlikely that there's a terrorist in there. It's never not possible, but it's unlikely. But who else could be in there? Well, maybe there's a guy like me who's been wounded who's got a weapon.

1:40:38So if I burst through the door with a balaclava on and a rifle, I could get lit up. And I don't want to... So I just bang on the door and say, hey security forces um i'm coming in so i announced my arrival arrival to try and mitigate against anyone shooting me because i don't know what the situation is yet uh breach into the into this room still clear it and but what i can see is lots of blood and gold in the room a lot of visibly injured people so straight i look around and then i'm like okay so two seconds ago it was killing capture now i'm going to make this quick assessment right now it's hostage rescue because my thought was i could just go right then terrace on here i'm going to move and try and find them that's one way of looking at it but remember it's as far as i know right now it's only me And at that point, it is only me.

1:41:36But if I leave these wounded people, one, they need medical assistance, some of them urgently. And two, I don't know if the terrorists are going to come back into this room and then execute everyone. So my duty now is to... My priority is saving their lives. I know you can argue this. Again, it's this battle of killing the terrorists saves their lives. But it's like, what can I do? Right, it's the here and now. Right, I can save these people here right now. So it's like right I'm gonna get you out. So I grab one person. They don't want to leave. Look I'm gonna get you out But before I start dragging them out.

1:42:09I'm like What have you seen? What have you seen? I'm truck straight away trying to gather Intelligence of how many attackers there are some people say two some people say four some people say six And so I'm trying to get a grip of the situation and then I start Evacuating the people pulling them towards the gatehouse as i'm getting to the gatehouse this entry point which is only about 40 yards away 30 40 yards away there's more and more police authorities turning up and i'm pulling them towards the gatehouse i'm like hey come and help me come and help me and no one does so at certain points and then i for the first few i just or first couple i like leave them in sight and so someone can come and grab them and then i run back in and i'm dragging people back after about uh four people then armed civilians come start helping me and in the book and all previous briefings i call these people free radicals so it's so it's an armed civilian now the thing about a free radical is you do know what you do not know what you're going to get Yes, it's someone in civilian clothes with a weapon.

1:43:25So you could argue me. I'm a free radical, but I'm a member of the SAS, and I've got over 1 ,000 high-risk missions under my belt, and I was the lead CQB instructor for the SAS. So that's me. Right at the other end, you could have just a guy who's got a gun who may be fired at once with no training. So there's that. Then you've got playing course police officers. Then you've got security contractors. All have varying levels. So some could be benefits, but more likely liabilities. But what I am thankful for is these guys stepped forward. They didn't have body armor. They only had pistols. They didn't have body armor like me.

1:44:14They stepped into harm's way to start evacuating people. and so they start helping helping evacuate people once we get everyone everyone out or then there's about again i think it's like six six to eight guys um uh and we're in the storeroom and i'm like guys do you know this area and these all of these people knew this hotel well and I'm also getting the measure of people through him. So there's one guy in particular, a Norwegian, I believe, super, yeah, happy with you. Another guy, Kenyan, bald-haired, sorry, like of Indian heritage. Yeah, all talk, blah, blah, blah, blah. And I was just like, a firearms instructor.

1:45:08incidentally this guy is also a liar because he went on to fabricate stories afterwards um so in my opinion a bit of a piece of shit but um anyway but i'm thankful that he's helping at this point anyway so and i'm like hey we need to keep the pressure on we need to keep going at the same time at that that moment i'm like look into the secret garden cafe i can see the You can see the dead bodies. But I take a photograph. So I take it. And the reason I'm taking a photograph of it is straight away. Again, it's operating at the highest level. I'm there. I'm going to take a photograph because people are going to want to see this.

1:45:48As in, it's all part of reporting and filling in the intelligence gaps. So I take a photograph. At that same time, my phone rings. I answer it. It's the ops room back in the UK. And the guy on the other end of the phone was a long-term friend of mine. he's like Chris do you know there's a terrorist attack going on in Kenya and I'm like yeah mate I'm there I'm there right now evacuating people and there's a long pause a very long pause apparently at that same time I started coming up on all the screens in the ops room because I was on Sky News and stuff and all the world media was showing me and someone shouted apparently he knows there's an incident going on because he's on the fucking TV and people started laughing but there's a long pause and he's like okay mate keep your head down keep going and keep us informed and that was it so now I know that the UK knows I'm there

1:46:49what I don't know is that the UK is not happy that I'm there but immediately yeah

1:46:59and that's not that's not focused on the command of the SAS. This is focused on the higher levels. It's the government. The government, the foreign office, certain elements. Obviously, some people are overjoyed on there. But the powerful majority are going, what is he doing there without permission, with all that hardware, running around, saving people's lives? I mean, it might have been different. I was running around just firing at windows and indiscriminate or whatever, I could get it then. But the only information they can see of me now is me pulling out wounded people out of a hotel and they're not happy about that, which we'll come on to later on when we're talking about the book.

1:47:45But anyway, it was good to hear a friendly voice on the phone and he's like, good words as well from him, cool as a cucumber.

1:47:55Okay, mate, good effort. Keep your head down, keep going, keep us informed. but I'm saying to these three radicals, right, we've got to push on. We've got to push on. I know that momentum is key. So we all say, oh, the hotel's down that way. They point out to me because I don't know where I'm going. We then step out from the doorway we entered towards where the hotel is. At that point, as we've moved about 10 yards, there's a long burst of automatic fire from an elevated position that hits the ground just to our left and arcs up, and it arcs up into the Secret Garden Cafe, hitting the glass panels or the panels.

1:48:38It does two things. So the first thing it does is it lets me know roughly where the threat could be. So to me, it's somewhere up there. The other thing it does, it pushes all of these free radicals back into that storeroom, because it's like what Tony Soprano says. Everyone wants to be a gangster until it's time to do gangster shit. So they're not playing anymore. So I take cover by the corner of the building. I then look back towards where the gatehouse is. I can see more and more armed personnel turning up. So I quickly run back to the hotel. this all this element here where this sits is kind of vague in my memory but I've tried to piece this together as back but there's video evidence to back this next bit up I then go back to the this bit is all on there's all video evidence of this um I go to the um gatehouse and I'm talking to the scooters I'm like hey I think I know where the shooters are I think I know where they are just give me four men and then I think we can neutralize it and they're like no we can't go in without permission we have not get permission to go in there which in some ways it's it's fair enough these are kenyan's police officers and if they break the rules yeah they might do but this this job is extremely precious to them and their family so they're going no so i'm like okay so then i run off and like all this there's all this is footage you can see you see me run off back into the complex by myself what you can't hear is when i run off i shout go fuck yourselves and then and then I run to the entrance of what was the hair salon as I get outside a proper flash bang which is like a distraction grenade throw that in and start clearing into this hair salon which there seems to be no people in there I'm in this hair salon I cleared through it's quite a large area inside but there's there's doesn't seem to be anyone there not long after I make entry and clear it, two Kenyan police officers, the GSU, General Service Unit, come in and they come in armed with AK-47s.

1:50:52And they're like, it's clear, it's clear. I went, it's not clear. They're calling the entire situation. No, no, this room, it's clear, let's go. I went, it's not clear. And then it's clear. At that point, I changed my way and I put it down on them like, it is clear, I'm in charge, I'm in charge here, blah, blah, blah, I am a major, and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, like, this is the, it's clear. Sorry, it's not clear, we need to clear this. And they're like, oh, okay. So I move around and I go at the first door and I try it and it's locked, it's like a storeroom. And then I can hear whispering behind it.

1:51:30So I bang on the door and I'm like, hey, and I've got my gun up ready to rock if I need to. And I'm like, security forces, hey, if there's anyone here, come out with your hands up, come out. No answer. You can hear talking and I'm like, okay. I know there's people in there, come out. And this is the difference between being trained and untrained. Can you imagine being an erratic, untrained person? Could have just unloaded into that thing, thinking there may be a terrorist. But even then, I'm thinking about protection of the civilians, because I'm thinking, as then say to them, if I know there's someone in there, if you're by the door, step back because I'm about to kick it in.

1:52:10Same thing again, it's threat assessment. If I can hear whispering and talking, it's unlikely that it's a terrorist. I don't think it's going to be the terrorists themselves. It could be, it could have been, but I don't think so. So then kick the door in, donkey kick, swing round, gun up. Everyone get your hands up. Get your fucking hands up. hands up and then as they come out i'm searching each i'm like passing them to the police but giving them a pat down then what am i doing asking them questions where how many terrorists where are they have you seen them trying to build up this picture i then go around and then the the police officers try to go to evacuate them straight away and i'm like no stop do not put them out there because what i don't want remember i've just taken heavy gunfire from outside so what the worst case would be to put the civilians tell them to go out and then they get gunned down so i look around there's like a large open area and like like a room uh it's like open plan i say everyone who comes out put them in there so it's like a holding pen and then i go through every and everyone was hiding in like whether it be bathrooms storerooms there's about 150 people in this hair salon and that's not because there was 150 people in this hair salon when it was attacked, it was because if you think about it, suicide detonation happens, people start making their way to the front gate, then they hear the gunfire.

1:53:34So this kind of was one of the last places where they could have taken refuge. Yeah, this is where they all ran to. So they've all went to. That's why there's so many people. So now we've got all these people. So you're sorting through 150 people. Round about that. So then we've got to evacuate them. So then say to the Kenyan police officers, as a whole were great throughout this whole incident. It's like, right, this is what we're going to do. You, and I say to this to everyone, a police officer is going to grab you, take you out and then run you to the gate. Once you see the gate, you'll let your goal and then you run, we'll come back and get one.

1:54:16Firstly, I will step out and cover the high ground, cover where that gunfire came from. I've got the training, I've got the better weapon system and I will cover it. Everyone happy? Okay. So I get to the doorway. They've got two people. Ready, set, go. Step out. Kenyan police officers have run out. At some point, a woman pushes past and tries to run towards the hotel. I then grab her and then run her to the gatehouse. And there's a picture of me. And actually, on one of the pictures, you see me holding it. You can see the three radicals. They're still in the doorway. So I'm running past the three radicals.

1:54:55I haven't quite got to them, but I'm going to run past them. And they're looking up to where that gunfire was, just in case anyone decides that I'm not telling the truth. And then I run into the gay house. I run back in, and we do it one more time. And then I realise that this is going to take forever. And I'm always thinking, momentum, it's all about pace and momentum. We've got to keep going, keep the pace going. so Kenyan police officers come back after evacuating another two, I'm like alright hold it there everyone listen to me this is what we're going to do now is I will go outside and I will count you out, I will throw you out and you'll go get in the line and just follow the person in front, at a certain point I will stop it and then you just hold there we will get you out because now I need to get as many people out as possible follow the person in front and when you see the gate run for your life happy happy so ready set go boom out quickly then one two three four five six seven eight like eight was probably the maximum uh get them out there that that's not and we start doing that and that starts working really well again every now and again someone would run turn the opposite direction just pure panic whatever and i grab and sometimes accompany them back and just push on.

1:56:20We'd done it a few times and we're getting near the end of it. I think we had roughly two more groups. The Free Radicals who were with me earlier then decided to turn up. But when they come into the room, they start screaming and shouting, everyone get out, get out. This time their tone is different. I'm like, shut the fuck up. We're dealing with it. You can help. This is what we're doing. And again, I'm grateful for them to start helping. and again we only do our two more groups after that get back into them and then we form again with the free radicals and again the same i don't know why i did like again i'm just conscious that they know the way around here so i'm like okay what we're going to do do you know and i said oh we'll go we can go around there's like an alleyway there we'll go through there okay so we're going through as so we set off the two they pretty much dismissed the two kenyan police officers who did a amazing job and we set off uh on so there's a group of like i don't know what right six six to eight i can't and then we're moving down all the way along this idiot who i mentioned earlier is barking asinine errors and he apparently has said i was leading christian craighead now if you mean shouting asinine orders and saying stuff about covering areas well yeah that's it It's only a few minutes.

1:57:39But as we go through this underpass and we're going through, we hear heavy footsteps behind us, and the two Kenyan police officers who were helping me clear come around and they go, Mr. Chris, Mr. Chris, Mr. Chris, Mr. Chris. I'm like, yeah, more people up here. I'm like, okay, I'll come with you. So I just peel off and say to the free radicals, I'm going with them. I'll catch you all later on. They don't acknowledge it and I didn't care anyway, so I then leave them. and that's the last time I see those people. I see one of them later on, have a quick chat, but it's the last time I ever certainly work with them again.

1:58:15But for all of my negativity, not that much of it, I'm still credit to them for putting themselves in the line of fire to help evacuate people. And so I follow the two Kenyans and we go upstairs to where the hair salon owners are just over from it and they're pointing to a room and the door's open, I have a quick clear from the outside and I can hear crying coming from under the table. Again, something comes over me, not a tactic I've ever thought about, nothing I've ever done before or since, but I take a step back from the doorway and then I run into the room and there's a... Remember, I've cleared it from the outside and I can hear the crying, so I think the threat is low.

1:59:01I run into the room, it's got like a fancy marble floor. I then skid on my ass under the table. And as I appear under the table, the women under there scream. And I pull off my balaclava and show my face, go, Jambo, Habari. And they like scream, start crying. Then they start laughing and start crying. I go, come on, I'm going to get you out of here. Let's go. And then, I don't know, it's like one of those things why people say, why did you do that? I'm like, I'm sure everyone's got it in them. It becomes a thing when the whole world's collapsing, but you still have to make a joke up or an inappropriate joke or a joke or something.

1:59:43And maybe it was just me knowing it's got a light and the tension make them more manageable to get out rather than, come on, if I walked in and went, right, get out, get out, get out, get out, they might be like, frozen in fear. So I'm breaking this tension to make them more manageable. And maybe it worked, maybe it didn't make any difference, but it makes for a good story. So get them out, get them evacuated. We then go back through where we were going, and I didn't know this then, but I can see the multi-storey car park, multi-level car park in front of me, and it's attached to the hotel. Now, I look at the...

2:00:21Again, this is where it becomes like being a grown-up. I look at the multi-story car park and think the terrace we took it from an elevated firing position I don't think it was from the top of this car park I mean it was just incidentally it was just next to it but it could have been and someone's got to clear this we're here right now so let's just do it so I could have thought oh let's get into the meeting to the hotel but I'm like no this is my responsibility I can't just it's a route of failure if I just dismiss a thing and assuming there should be nothing in there so again I was like right I'm going to clear the car park so now we start clearing the car park so it's like a spiral like you park out that goes up multi-level like that and in the middle you've got the elevators and um and stair shaft so how we're doing it we go in we only go up one level and when I go up one level, I see a guy, he's coming in and he's got body armour with agent written on it and this guy's a guy called Daniel Pastaro who is a Slovenian security guard and he's got an M4 and a pistol and I look to him and say, I saw Free Radical and I say, hey, do you know CQB?

2:01:41Close quarter combat. He goes, yeah, a little bit. I'm like, come and work with me. And it's a strange thing of just from, you know, when you look at people without them actually doing anything you get a measure of them i was picking it and straight away i've got the measure of this guy was like actually i think this guy's going to be going to be good so he joins with me straight away and um and i said right this is what we're going to do we're going to use it with the two kenyans we're going to go up i'll make entry into the next level onto where the on every floor where the elevate opposite the elevators is three lockers that you can't lock they're just small lockers that you can fit a human being inside and there's three lockers i said we'll get on the floor i'll clear and then um daniel you you cover me as i open each to cover the lockers as i open the door he's like so bam bam bam and then the kenyan and then two kenyan police officers you come up once we've seen clear and then i will then push out into each floor onto where the cars are sweep round sweep low you guys cover the other way and i'll give a call out going hey security forces if you're hiding in your cars come out go to the other floor do the same and then go up so we do that and it's just a made-up drill it's nothing i've been told before nothing but it was just like trying to make it work so we do that for about the first first the the floors i'm working well four floors and this is a this by the way this is a 12-story car park.

2:03:11By the fourth one, I'm like, right, we've got to do this a more efficient way. So then I just say, I say to the two Kenyans, you hold the floor, we're clear, and then Daniel and... Daniel and I will sweep up that way, run up where the cars are parked, and then clear that next level, and then you come up the stairs and join us, happy. So we're just making it more efficient. So we do that. And there's people on nearly every floor hiding their cars, and one or two people will get them out and send them down the stairs. As we get higher, as we're running around, I can see more people. It's got a view of the gate entrance.

2:03:53I can see more and more free radicals and police officers flooding in. So now, again, thinking about the protection of the civilians, I want to make sure these don't get shot. So I'll shout, I shout like friendlies or eagle eagle as it was, not that it made sense to anyone, but I like friendlies, security forces clearing up, civilians coming down, civilians coming down just to let everyone know there's civilians coming. everyone coming out here should be a friendly so they don't get shot over them they move up and it's a good lesson in in this on the we get to the last floor without going on to roof it's the last set of lockers by that time we're getting pretty complacent with these lockers because there's been nothing inside them daniel's not even covering me and i'm not bothered because i'm just opening myself with my my gun under the shoulder like and i get to the last locker on the last floor and i opened the locker and in there dressed completely in back with body like like with the vest on and everything is a female security guard holy shit and she screams as i open it as well and i jumped back fractions away from shooting her in the face and look again it's all that training everything i was just like i'm not gonna lie my safety catch came off was like jump back safety off finger moving down and then luckily up that time to process the target was like yeah safety catch back on and then she screamed and i was like what the fuck you doing and sort of laughing and then she said something in swahili to this police officers who started laughing and then i was like get out of here like and but it's a good lesson to go never let your guard down and if i'd done that as a training serial if i was training law enforcement or military or whatever, and made that scenario, people would have went, that wasn't realistic.

2:05:49You were just trying to get me to shoot a civilian. But it happens. No matter how unusual it might seem or how unlikely, anything can happen in combat. So there's that. And then we go on to what? Are you still hearing the terrorists at this point? How much time has gone by? At this point, this is coming up to nearly an hour. An hour? Just over an hour into it. You can hear sporadic gunfire. There's gunfire going off. What had happened at that point, when I'd made entry, that something had happened, someone may have been given intelligence to the terrorists because once I'd made up, the message would have gone on, oh, special forces have made entry.

2:06:25And the terrorists moved to their, I don't know if there's spoilers yet, moved to their position. So at this point, they weren't roaming free. They'd done as much damage as they can and then went to their fallback positions by this time. Um, so we get to the roof. Again, I was just about going on the roof to do the final. Are you on their trail? No. I mean, you know what I mean? Are you following their path? No. No, because I have no idea. I have no intelligence. I have no support. I don't know. I mean, I didn't know if you could see casualties. No. And this is why it was, that's why I come back to what I said earlier about, I think it's unlikely that they were in this car park, but someone has to clear it.

2:07:05And I'm right here, so it's got to be, so I'll just do it rather than waste. yeah you could you could argue maybe if i'd committed in i would have found the terrorists before they got to the fallback positions and killed them who knows but but it was like me being like from my instructed like being instructed to being uh doing team leader stuff and everything it's just like now this is here clear it it's all about the here and now not assuming that it's cleared assuming that the terrorist might not be there and i knew and i was i was working i was going to be a bit quick it was quick we did it we did it in short order but I thought it might have been a bit quicker um we get to the top spider's fence kicks in and I'm like now we need to something's not right about this and then I hold back the the uh Kenyan police officers who want to go up there and they're like don't touch me and I'm like have to like really rein in on them like no you're not going up there let me go up there and I as I go take gunfire that comes from I assess it came from the Kenyan helicopter.

2:08:09There was a military helicopter in the area, whether they had a dedicated sharpshooter, whether they just had a guy in there with a gun, who knows. But I looked around at the area post-incident and there was no more elevated position, but the rounds definitely came by. I then, which was my worry, I had this threat that we could take up, like I didn't know the lay of the land, but I was concerned of being exposed then taking friendly fire and i was right phoned the uk they miraculously managed to speak to the uh well they spoke to the kenyan the high commission which is like the british embassy bizarrely the guy who was in the helicopter who was working to the helicopter or had communication with the helicopter knew a guy in that ops room one of the kenyans and usually these things would take hours or days to get through, but it happened in minutes.

2:09:03And we went, yeah, Friendly's on the roof. And the message got passed and they said, yeah, you can go on the roof now. And that was kind of spoken to the High Commission. I thought they called me and said, you can go on the roof. That's how I got this information. And then went onto the roof and then evacuated a load of people off the roof. And as we're going down the stairs, I'm shouting, Friendly's coming down, Friendly's coming down. always thinking about protection of the civilians. Once we got back to the bottom of the car park, there's like a gradient hill about 100, 150 yards to the, maybe a bit, roughly, I'm working on memory here, to the gatehouse.

2:09:43And I got thinking about friendly fire, take off my balaclava or pull it down, put my gun out the side like that, walking, going friendlies, friendlies, friendlies, just so I look like no risk. Daniel was escorting a young woman and that's the last time I saw him I didn't even get a chance to say goodbye I didn't see him again he then linked up with those three radicals and helped clear some more people out and he did an amazing job we became friends I kept in touch with him I only worked with him for it must have been like 15-20 minutes clearing that car park but he was a huge asset that day and I get to the as I get to the gay house I can see lots of people flooding in I'm trying to say to people get people get out it's not clear it's not clear there's some guys with suits with a walkie-talkie and pistol and got body armour and I'm like get out get out I'm quite aggressive about it and then I say to one of them who look quite old and senior I said hey are you in charge he's like no I goes who's in charge he's like come with me so then I follow him we go through the gay house and then there's an old man there and he's covered with a security detail.

2:10:54This man is a very senior figure in the Kenyan police force. And he looks at me and he goes, who are you? I'm like, UK Special Forces, SAS. Do you want to know what's going on? He's like, yes. So I then give him my assessment of the situation and say, we've had a suicide detonation and we've a suicide detonation and we have active gunmen estimated two to six people still hadn't seen them yet and i was asking people so i said two to six two to six terrorists are still active with automatic weapons and hand grenades casually and i said casually my estimate at the time i said at least 15 dead and uh multiple injuries he then says something that changes the outcome of the day, which was the assessment.

2:11:49He then says, can you lead my men? The reason that was assessed to be such a game changer was if he hadn't have asked me to do that, when eventual units turned up, it was likely that they would have went as far as the gatehouse and went into a planning cycle. and that would have then changed the whole situation into like a siege situation, which was similar to the Westgate Mall thing would happen in 2012 or 13. But by him asking me to lead the men, carried on the momentum. We had the initiative and carried on that momentum, which changed everything. And I said, yes, sir, of course. so then we had a bit of a talk and then turned on my heel and then I set off into the complex with

2:12:52basically a squadron of GSU these guys had armed with in some cases G3 assault rifles in some cases heckler and cock wearing the maroon berries very few had helmets on but they had their berries and so my helmet's on and um and i'm walking down the hill the reason why i go down the hill i have no idea where i'm going to go but when i turn around i can see buildings to my right and there's there's like uh kenyan red cross ambulances by the side and and gsu police officers so i'm looking those initial buildings i'm presuming are cleared so i'm just going to carry on walking down to would come to uncleared buildings.

2:13:33Two plainclothes police officers accompany me to escort to try and stop people from taking photographs and do that and lead me to where the next, where I need to be. And my band of merry men are behind me. And so I give a quick call to the UK and just say, I've been asked to help. I'm clearing through with Kenyan police. They acknowledge that and I carry on. As I'm walking down the hill, They've got a young guy comes up and he's holding a sledgehammer. Sorry, I don't see the sledgehammer, so he comes up, he's wearing a luminous dress. He's like, Mr. Mr. I'm like, well, he goes, can I come with you?

2:14:11I went, what? He said, can I come with you? I'm like, no. And then he holds up a sledgehammer and says, I can smash in doors. So I'm like, okay, come and join the party, you're the breacher. So now I've got a breacher and a young man called Julius, who I think is one of the bravest men of that day. He joins in, steps in behind me. As I get near the bottom, two guys who are kind of journalists. One had a pistol, but they were journalists. They said, we're going to come with you. I went, no, you're not. He goes, yeah, we are. He goes, no, you're not. And he goes, yes, you are. Yes, we are. There's nothing you can do about it.

2:14:49And I went, OK, well, just join in. Slot yourselves in. Just keep out of the way and try and make me look good, if you can. It's a joke, obviously, I said in their laugh. And then at the bottom of the hill that I met where there's a large group of police officers, and that's basically the forward line of where things are being cleared to. And there's the photograph of me looking at a piece of paper. So they hand me this piece of paper, which, again, my memory is kind of vague on this, but it was kind of saying that there's businessmen and people are still located in the building to my front, which was, when I'm looking at a paper, it's behind me, but as we're walking down the hill.

2:15:30So there's that cool picture. I've got the balaclava on. I'm hanging there, like, looking at the paper. And it's a cool photograph. But what it doesn't show is, or what it doesn't tell you is, I'm looking at a photograph. There's police sirens going off. There's people shouting. There's sporadic gunfire. there's fire alarms, there's helicopters, all of that ocean of noises going on, and I'm the man, I've got to make a plan. I've got a squadron of guys behind me, so that's 30 to 60 men who do not know CQB, close-court hostage rescue, and now the difference is, it's always on me, but if they kill someone, or if they shoot something they're not supposed to shoot, yeah they'll probably get in trouble but it all comes back to me so now I'm in charge and there's this rustling and I'm looking at this piece of paper thinking what the hell am I going to do so I've got to make a plan and I make a plan there and then and the plan is this I turn around to everyone and say right this this is what we're going to do we're going to go in floor by floor room by room I will make entry alone into every room no one is to come with me because I'm thinking about protection of the civilians.

2:16:59And I know this is where I'd rather me get killed by the terrorists than a Kenyan shoot a civilian and me get blamed for it. I'd rather that mission failure was unexpected. The only acceptable mission failure for me is my death. Everything else is unacceptable. And so I'm like, I'll go in. If I shout a number, that means that's a number of men I want. So if I shout one, I want one person to come in. If I shout five, I want five. And then we can just cover doors and help me out and search and evacuate people. They were brilliant. Like I said, the Kenyan police were brilliant. They were like, yeah, okay.

2:17:39No egos, no nothing. They were like, you're the man. We're going to follow your orders. And that's great. And I said, if I need doors, Julius, you're up with a hammer. Yeah, yes boss. Brilliant, let's go. So we then just clear room by room, floor before. And as we get civilians, we pull them out, search them, pass them to the Kenyan police, and they take them down the line. So we successfully evacuate this whole building, which is the Arlington building. We get to the last floor, so the top floor. There's this big reinforced door. Julius, the breacher, has a go. he can't get through, I have a goal, I am.

2:18:25So what I have to say at this point, this is kind of like two hours or so, over two hours into the incident, and I've been hard charging all the way through. So I am soaking wet with sweat. I'm breathing, like I'm sucking air in from China or somewhere. I'm like really like dying. Kenyan started laughing at me. I'm like, hey, you buggers, like I'm probably older than you think. And like, you have a go then. So they have a go. No, no, eventually, Julius is hitting it. Even the press have a go. The whole wall calls out, or the whole segment comes out. That falls down, go through, and then there's a barricade behind a glass door.

2:19:03But the keys are on the other side. So I'm like, barricade up. There's no movement. It's kind of a good sign for me, because what this says to me is, oh, there's a barricade. So I'm like, guys, there are civilians in here, because they made this barricade. There's civilians in here. No one shoots unless I tell you to. Throughout that clearance, there'd been times when they all opened up and I'd be like, stop firing. But that's another thing. We then, but then I say to Julius, all right, with your sledgehammer, smash the glass and I'll open the door. Okay, for some unbeknown reason, he had his sleeves rolled up like me.

2:19:43Instead of hitting the glass with a sledgehammer, like at the bottom of the sledgehammer, a dick creating distance he uses the sledgehammer like a battering ram so when he goes through the glass all the sheets of glass just fall straight down onto his arms and open up all his arteries on his arms and blood everywhere claret and he is a casket evacuated i never see him again i never saw him he did he survived but like i said he was from his actions of stepping up a very young or appear to be a young man from the Kenyan Red Cross, but willing to put himself right at the front of the stack to breach doors.

2:20:21What a brave individual. But he was evacuated. But he left the sledgehammer, so we've still got that. And now we break through into this, and in that last office was Japanese businessmen, so we evacuate all these Japanese businessmen out. So that's that building pretty much cleared. We then go down the main stairs. So we use the service stairs. And as I get to the bottom of the main stairs, we come down, we see guys dressed in black, Kenyans in black, obviously police. We've got all those police down here. And I think they're Kenyan Special Forces, but they're not. They're the recce squadron. So they're the GSU guys who I've been with.

2:21:03These are the elite of the GSU, trained by Americans, well-trained, well-equipped. So they're in black. someone green with m4s glocks ballistic helmets looked the part and part of the part really good good operators individuals but i said are you kenyan special forces like nowhere wreck your squadron okay he's like who are you i'm like i've just asked to um lead these guys okay you are no longer in command we've got we are real running things now we're evacuating everyone out so just way down here. He asked for my credentials. I had my ID. He showed him it. And they were using the armored vehicles to evacuate everyone who didn't have a part of the place.

2:21:45So all the free radicals, all of the press, paramedics, police officers, unassigned, all getting evacuated to take control of the situation, which is super good. And so I'm like, okay, that's cool. Because in my mind, I'm like, all right, I'll get evacuated to the main gate, and then I'll just resume role as a liaison officer. It's all cool. I see one of the three radicals, the Norwegian guy who I thought was a good guy of that original group. I talked to him. He told me some of the shenagans that went on, which I won't repeat on here, but again, and my suspicions were confirmed of some of them being absolute idiots.

2:22:31But it was good to see him and get the lowdown off him. He was evacuated. But this is the first time. So this is about two and a half hours into the incident. It's starting to get dark. And it's the first time where I'm not hard charging and thinking on my feet. And it's also the first time I think, damn. like I've acted a lot off my own bat here I might be in trouble so I then try and start calling people like hey what's going on with the I had the number of the um the director of national intelligence for Kenya on my phone and I'd been in communication with him at Christmas time and I just sent a message saying general I've been at the incidents pretty much from the get-go So if you need to know what's going on, give me a shout.

2:23:21Credit to him. As soon as the WhatsApp messages went blue, phone rang. Answered the phone. He's like, I was like, yes, General. He's like, Chris, my boy, thank you so much for being there. What's going on? So I gave him my interpretation of events, which is still the same as what happened before I had no reason to change it. There's a long pause, which to me said, in hindsight anyway, this is different to what I've been told on the ground. And what I should add as well, he said, I'm sat next to the president right now of Kenya. What's going on? So I should add that factor in. And there's a long pause, which, like I said, seems to me like it seems like this is different to what he's been told.

2:24:08He then changes my world once again and says, Chris, can you stay there and report directly to me and the president? Okay.

2:24:23Again, thinking on my feet, because that's what we do. I then say to the general, I said, could you please relay this request to the British government? And he's like, yes. And credit to him, he did it straight away, which again now made me kind of like legal. So now it was authorised military intervention, so to speak. He then followed through. He was absolutely, and is a brilliant man, and follows, he's super swept away and everything. I don't know what he does now, if he's still in position, but dialed in, keyed in. Soon as I asked him to do that, he did it. And then my phone comes to life, and now I'm reporting to lots of different people from this moment on.

2:25:05So now I'm sending updates to him, the British High Commission, to UK, and to other people about what's actually going on.

2:25:17The guys from the regular squadron who were there, they kind of worked out who I was speaking to. And I said, do you know who that was on the phone? They were like, yes, sir. And I went, what do you need? I said, I need to be where the command post is. And they got on the radio. And then an armored vehicle picked me up from this building and took me to the hotel, which is now we're into the D2 Hotel, where the terrorists have ended up running to, their four back positions, if you like. So I then get into the hotel, walk in the foyer, and they put position guys out, so the security's on the ball.

2:25:51Again, sending messages to me, these guys are swept up. In the bar area, when I say command post, it's police inspectors with a phone from the unit, from the Sareki Squadron Elite Unit. So I go there, make my introduction, they know who I am. and they were like and as soon as I get there I didn't know I was thirsty or fatigued but as soon as I got to the bar and I saw all the drink and liquor there and I was like all of a sudden my body's like you need to drink right now so I went one minute, I just went to the bar opened up a can of Red Bull knocked that back, then got loads of water cans of water, bottles of water just choked it down, because I'd been hard charging I was absolutely soaking wet and now like as soon as my body knew it could drink it was like have a drink as in water and stimulants or whatever um so knock that back and then so speak to the two uh guys in charge so to speak say right what's going on this is it and this is the message i get word for word is there's four terrorists on the seventh floor we have an assault team on the floor below and a small team on the floor above them.

2:27:07Okay. And so I send that message to everyone, hang around for only a few minutes, and then I'm like, and I should add in this, just to add the vibe, is the fire alarm is going off in this hotel, so there's a wailing fire alarm going off all the time, so the noise is immense. So it's, I'm like, okay. So I then say, hey, do you mind if I go up to the assault team? because in my mind I'm like, well, I'm not doing anything here and I need to be where the action is. One, to get a grip of the situation to see, one, for an information standpoint and two, where I can best help. So I say to the guys, do you mind if I go up with the assault team and they're like, no, please do.

2:27:53And again, it's funny because then they say, oh, can you send a message to the general letting them know that we're in charge here? and I knew it was like the this was the good relationship it was like yeah I'm going to send general your message that you're in charge because it makes you look good and everything but I'm reporting to him and they realised that they can't hide anymore so like I'm not saying they were going to but they're thinking if we make any bad decisions or do anything and it's not to my satisfaction the general and by proxy the president is going to find out. So it put me in a position of power as well.

2:28:32But I was like, yeah, yeah, I'm good. And as I go up to the stairs, the posted sentries on every floor, again, reinforcing that these guys know what they're doing. I get to the sixth floor and it's kind of this weird angle where you come up the service stairs and it's like a cups round and then the lead assault team is like a stack of about six guys stacked up. and as I turn up to the stack they are facing a staircase directly in front in an open area open area in the staircase and the terrorists are on the floor above as I turn up two hand grenades come down the stairs explode and then as soon as as the hand grenades come down we push back up just a little bit just a few feet so out of direct line of sight they detonate and then there's automatic gunfire rakes the area.

2:29:27The two terrorists or the terrorists on the floor above had positioned themselves where they could, it allowed them to be in a position where they could see and post hand grenades into the, and fire guns, into this killing zone in front of the elevators, but out of sight and therefore without a shot going on. So it was a well-recognited, I should add, that position, even though the official report says they got pushed there by Kenyan forces. I think that's pretty hard to believe. But anyway, so they're up there, and grenades go off, gunfire, and I look to the guys and say, do you think this other white dude turned up?

2:30:09And then smile, and then they... And then I add, welcome to the party, Mzungo. And Mzungo is a derogatory term which is used in eastern and some parts of southern Africa for people of European descent. In South Africa, it's mulungo, which is the Swahili word for the scum that you find floating on the water. So in essence, where the white scum that came from the sea. That's what you called yourself. And I said, do you think the miracle is welcome to the party, mulungo? And they started laughing and they all started repeating, going, yeah, welcome to the party, mulungo. And it's good because it's like, I don't, like I said in the book, I don't get upset.

2:30:52It's a really derogatory word, but ultimately it's only a word, so therefore I choose not to get upset by it. It's a media camaraderie build. Yeah, straight away it's like, and then they say, oh, are you an American? I was like, no, I'm British. And they're like, SES? I'm like, yes. They're like, oh, that's awesome. So they knew who the SES was. And straight away it was a good bonding session. nothing bonds group of blokes like a good grenade attack and grenade and all my gunfire attack really like anyway so now we're all brothers from different mothers and um as they say and uh and we're all getting on uh the um i lost my train of thought with my attempted comedy but um the yeah so i now turn to the team leader and i'm like saying to he's a big big guy and I said, hey, what's going on?

2:31:45So I want to get an update from him. Same, same, but different. He's like, there's four terrorists on the floor above, but this time he adds, two of them are injured. One's really badly injured and one's not so bad, and then the other two are active. Okay. I didn't know how he knew that, and I didn't ask. So I was like, okay. Then I ask a golden question. Are there any civilians up there? No. Why is that important? Because for me, that changes this mission from hostage rescue to search and destroy. And so I'm like, OK. So I report to people the situation. I say to the team now, what's your plan?

2:32:32He goes, well, when they come down the stairs, we're going to kill them. Is that it? Yeah. He's like, yeah, that's it. When the terrorists come down the stairs, we're going to kill them. Okay, yeah, that's a plan. And I smile, I'm like, okay, it's a plan. But in my mind, again, having a lot of experience, operating at the very highest level, it's not an acceptable plan because I do not know what the terrorists are doing. I don't know what's up. It was a gym, but I didn't know what was up there. I didn't know if they had explosive material, if there was parts of the hotel in that thing where if they damaged it, it could destroy or start a fire that would be catastrophic to everyone in the hotel.

2:33:18So my line is, we need to get this wrapped up. We need to push on. We need to solve this. We can't just wait. So then it's like thinking about how we can do this. And then so I'm working it and I ask about snipers. Have you got snipers? They said, yes. So I said, well, whereabouts? so they're not doing anything. Okay, well, let's get them up on the building, across, and see what they said. So they go through the radio, hey, he wants to put snipers up. Everything I said is well-received, put the snipers up. So everything takes a long time because it's a whole process of information, people in position.

2:33:56So it's going to be about an hour before the snipers get up into position. And in the meantime, there's trying to display this. the main in that sole team is split into three teams there's a group on the left who we have no interaction with because it's all of that open areas now a killing zone so they're in there and most of them are in the rooms there's only two of them holding the corridor so to speak then there's the corridor to our right and throughout the night we swap between the two positions the majority saw six to eight people it's always six to eight in this story six to eight or in the main, like, looking straight at the stairs.

2:34:38And sometimes we'd just be able to scurry across. It's just a very short distance, two yards or so, to the next corridor. And then because on the main bit, there's a little ledge, so you could sit at the back and take your leg, rest your legs for a second or two, a minute or two. But every now and again, when we tried to swap positions and I went into the one to look around, they could see us and they'd either throw a grenade or open fire into the area. So that would be going on. When I was in the other corridor, it's funny, and I think this is the first time I've said it. It's in the book, but it's good in case anyone, if they managed to retrieve any, I doubt it would have come out by an hour or so, but it's a funny thing for me was I was in the corridor.

2:35:29I was looking down the corridor. and I still had a guy on each end of his line looking down, but I was looking down the corridor, and for some reason, the guy at the front of the stack just decided to let loose a load of rounds at the stairs. He opens fire, so he's like... I jump about five foot into the air. I'm like...

2:35:54In my mind, I thought the terrace had snuck down and I opened up and that gunfire was like... And I jumped. There was nothing cool about it at all. I was just like... I'd hate to see what my face looked like. And as I jumped, I'd spin round. And they're just looking at me. They're just looking at me smiling. And everyone burst out laughing. So they all burst out laughing. And I said, next time you want to start World War fucking III, let me know about it, all right? And the big guy, one of the alphas of the group, he was on his horn. She's just laughing, crying with laughter at me. Because I was just like, ah!

2:36:33And so that was that. And then, anyway, snipers get up. How sure are you that these are the, I mean, are you guys thinking these are the last four terrorists? I'm just working on what we know. So they're just saying there's four terrorists. Like, I didn't question it very much that there's four terrorists on the top floor. Okay. And there's no discussion of any terrorists anywhere else? No discussion anywhere else. and no one, like that's all that's being said. And even when they said they're wounded, I'm like, I don't know how you know, I don't care. I'm like, don't know, don't care.

2:37:08Because, so the snipers get up, then it comes on the radio, oh, we can see the terrorists moving around. They can see two, which fits in. If two of them are wounded, they're not moving, so they can see two terrorists moving around. I'm like, okay. I said, and then it's like, what, we're going to do a sniper initiative, assault and they're like okay and they go happy and they say and then they reply back we're going to do a sniper initiative assault which is kind of like the sniper shoots the guys and then we run up the stairs and that's what i say so snipers get hit and then we're going to run up the stairs yeah okay so music to me is a report we're waiting and then all of a sudden like snipers have the shot and then you hear the gun gunshots go off almost simultaneously and the next thing we hear is oh sorry next thing you know is a grenade come down the stairs oh sorry sorry rewind that shots the next thing we hear is automatic gunfire coming from up the stairs not at us though but across where the snipers may have been but building the building across so they're raking the area firing at where the snipers could have been.

2:38:22I doubt they would have saw them, but they're just firing at the building across the street. Then we get a grenade down the stairs and automatic gunfire to tell us. Basically, that was their way of saying, you tried to take us out of the snipers, you failed, and we're still here. So that's that.

2:38:43The terrorists...

2:38:47So they're gone. So now what we're going to do? So every now and again, we're still getting grenade fire and then say, have you got explosive method of entry, which is using explosive to blow a hole through walls. So we say, yeah. I said, well, why don't we blow a hole through the ceiling and then use grenades to, once we've got a hole above them, we can throw grenades down there or something. You carry grenades? Yes. Brilliant. Let's do it. They pass that message on. They're happy to do that. So now we're going into that. So they've got to make the charges and get them to the team above. Now, the difference is that the team above, what I got told was it's the floor above.

2:39:30So I didn't question that. So I think it's a floor. But the team above is really the roof. And the difference between the roof and the floor can be several feet of concrete. So I didn't know this. But the charges go up. Again, this takes a while. Again, thinking ahead of things, I'm like, okay i need to make sure everyone knows what so i tell everyone who i'm informing to this is what we're going to do and it was very prudent and it'll come onto that once we once the detonations go off so tell everyone we're going to do an extra explosive uh breach we put the uh charges set detonation goes off failed breach so failed breach yeah we're going to make some more charges and get through grenade come down the stairs automatic gunfire but why it was prudent to let everyone know is because the people who needed to know and know we're doing explosive but as soon as that explosion went off all the world's media who were reporting on it was on the news that car bombs they were then reporters car bombs were going off inside the complex and it was a terrorist counter-attack so the information was wrong but the people who needed to know via me they knew that was just that was just like noise it's not car so they could then tell whether it be families friends other governments it's not car bombs it's actually our strike force using explosives so that's that um i then say what what do the what do the snipers see and they're like oh the snipers they're not there anymore and it's like what oh yeah they to try the shot and they failed.

2:41:08Yeah, but they should be back up there. And they're like, oh. And I went, okay, tell them to get back up there. And if they see the terrorists, shoot. And they can report on it. Holy shit. But this is the, so this is two ways of looking. You could look at it if, like, people could look at it from outside and go, armchair worrying, going, oh, that's outrageous, blah, blah, blah. And, you know, but these guys were pro. The reason why they were pros is they didn't know that. But when I told them, I'm like, of course. So there was no ego. There was no excuse. There was no lies. They were like learning from it.

2:41:41They just didn't know. And they were just like, of course, it makes sense now. And so the way I view it was, I was just coaching them. Because it's like this. Remember, this is the first time they've done this. And the American mentors weren't allowed to go into the complex. So the American mentors would be advising them normally, but they'd been restricted from going into the complex. So there was no resistance, and everything I was saying, and I wasn't going, oh, you idiots. It was like, oh, man, and they're like, why don't you do this? And like I say, it was an absolute pleasure working with them because they were just learning on the job, and they were receptive, and there was no egos, and they were like, brilliant.

2:42:25You don't know what you don't know. Yeah, and they were going, okay, so the snipers went back up, and then they're saying and as soon as got into position they were like the lights have turned off so the credit to al-shabab they turned the lights off but what this had done and i kind of i don't know how i knew this but it may be just common sense to a certain point of what this is doing though is restricting the so before we turn before i turn up they've got all movement of upstairs they can shoot down whatever other in between we shot out the glass that there was a mirror so i I shot the glass and some of the Kenyans chipped in.

2:42:59There's a big glass mirror and I worked out that that's how they could see us. So we shot the big, large glass mirror on our floor out. But now we've had snipers trying to shoot them through the glass bits. So now that's restricted the movement here. Now they can hear a charge above them. So now from having a lot of real estate to move around in, now they've been put into this really small area which will have an effect on your morale and your fighting ability eventually so it's all all of this is chipping away charges go up again fails then this time it's failed while they make a charge take sledgehammers so guys go up there with sledgehammers and start pounding boom boom boom boom boom just trying to to breach through so they're in between charges going off time's now pushing on um and my phone is about to die I've been operating with my mobile phone all day um luckily it was fully charged when I turned up because it's plugged into the vehicle and stuff so it's fully charged but my phone's about to die so then I have a thought I'm like okay we've got a guy on it on the end of every line looking down the corridors all right to the team like right let's clear these let's clear all the corridors let's clear all the rooms on the corridors he's like why i goes two reasons there was three but i didn't tell him the other one the first reason is it will free up a member of the stack so he doesn't have to look down the corridor second reason is i need i desperately need a iphone charger so there's got to be one of these rooms somewhere the third reason which i didn't tell it would give me a good look of how they would do their room clearances.

2:44:48So we set off and we start clearing the rooms. And two things. First thing is, on the first room we go to, there's a phone charger in there. So I'm like, yes, take my phone out, plug it in. And secondly is watching the guys clear the rooms. They're good. Yeah, they're not perfect, but they're more than workable. They're well-trained, well-versed at room combat, and they just need a little bit of direction here and there, but they're good so i'm like man my confidence in these guys is it's really high um so we clear all the rooms and the other thing i noticed in there is the mini bars and the fruit and snacks i then get to the um to the team leader and say right have you guys had anything to eat since he's been here no no nothing's happened all right tell the guys making sure we've got eyes on the threat to get into these rooms and help yourselves to the to the food and drink and he's like looks at me went oh well we can't really do that that's that would not be classed as stealing and i was like that's credit to them to the kenyan police because there's allegations from the west gate years before that the the kenyan army just looted everything and done but the kenyan police were like can we do that isn't that stealing i was like i'm telling you i said i have in effect overall command here go into the bars do not touch anything other than food and drink and if anything comes back to you tomorrow or the day after or whenever this ends then tell them are you i ordered you to you could do it and like that boom everyone just bomb burst and everyone's grabbing food because again for me i've been on the move since half past three this is now getting into the early hours of the morning so now i'm like going i didn't really want to eat anything but red bull was always the hot commodity and everyone went for the red bulls and then and then drinking drinking fluids and everything and like just thinking about sustaining the troops because we don't know how long this is going to go on for so we do that things are going on sledgehammers going uh then um we get the uh so when we get the um i'm having a mind dump i'm getting one event mixed up on the other side but let's go with it and if people read the book saying oh he was he said this the other way around in the book is right now i can't i can't i have a i'm having a bit of a mind dump on it but um but we'll just carry on with the breaching get the good breach they said good breach i'm like brilliant gonna attack with grenades yeah yeah yeah there's a pause goes on longer longer i'm like looking going then eventually we hear a grenade go off upstairs and i'm like is that it it's like yeah and then all of a sudden we get a grenade down our stairs and raking gunfire.

2:47:47And at this point, some of the failure I have to take, because I just said to them, blow a hole through and assault with grenades. Now, what I meant was blow a hole through immediately after you get a good breach, throw a whole load of grenades down there and deal with the threat. But they did exactly what I said. I didn't tell them when to do it. They blew a hole. They eventually threw a grenade down there and it was only one grenade. I didn't specify. So it's another lesson to everyone And if you, you know, whatever sort of role and leadership is, whatever you're thinking, make sure you articulate that well.

2:48:20Because people will follow the instructions to the letter. And if your instructions aren't exact, then you won't get exact actions. So there's that. So that's the end of that. At about 5.30 or so in the morning. So, yeah, the breach must happen. So now we're getting right. So the breach must happen. Field breach. Sorry, good breach. and then around about 5 30 we get a message saying oh there's terrorists two terrorists in the basement so i report that i'm not that worried about it because the terrorists if i'm finding out there's terrorists in the basement that means other members of the assault group have found them and are dealing with them my threat is up these stairs so pass it on and now i'm going to deal the threat it had so yeah so my thought is upstairs and i'm kind of i'm out of ideas now so now it's the well it's around about 5 30 there's not first not much time till first light so my thought is maybe at first light they're going to try and break out um and first light comes and it's fairly uneventful and then then it doesn't seem to be that long that and since hearing that there's terrorists in the basement we still get the occasional grenade and gunfire attack and but like say we're kind of i'm kind of out of ideas like say first light happens and then And then something significant happens.

2:49:53We then hear them praying. They're doing a loud call. You hear them praying? Praying. Loud call to pray. Now, this is significant because we haven't heard them at all all the way through the night. We haven't heard them talk. The only thing we've heard is the gunfire and the grenades going off. So now we can hear them. They're giving it what for with a call to pray, some sort of prayer. So I turn around to the Kenyans around me and go, guys get ready it's coming and the guy across on the corridor cross goes how do you know i might because they're getting ready to meet their god and and then it's like so i'm at that time number two in the stack and the guy in front he was okay okay boss let's change let's change i'm not bothered about this i'm number one in the stack i've got them i've got at this point i'm not even wearing my balaclava just round my neck.

2:50:47And I'm just waiting, and I'm like, am I scared? No. Am I apprehensive? Yes. Because I kind of know it's like now I'm pretty sure it's going to come. So this was like, oh. And then they stopped praying. It goes on for a while, I should add. And then they stopped, and something again comes over me, and I raise them a Hail Mary. so I just say Hail Mary and I'm saying about this level I'm like Hail Mary full of grace the Lord is with you so I'm rolling off the Hail Mary and there's no exaggeration this for entertainment purposes or whatever but now at the arrow for our death dink dink dink dink dink four hand grenades come down the stairs this is it it's the final battle starts right on the end of the Hail Mary so all four grenades come down the stairs all pushed back big explosions and stuff and then the

2:51:58then we surge forward terrorist number one fast on his feet he's already at the bottom of the stairs spraying with automatic gunfire so I take him immediately send three shots into his chest. But not only do I shoot, everyone's shot shooting. Kenyon's leaning over me. I'm sure left, right, over my ear, over my shoulder. Who knows? Huge weight of fire, but he's not going down. Remember, this is fractions of seconds. It doesn't go down. I immediately take aim up and whack him in the face, but it goes out the back of his ear. He drops. number two not so fast on his feet i've been thinking about this all through the night and he comes running down the stairs we just shoot his legs away and he falls and then sheer weight of gunfire it kills him um and then something really strange happens they're all firing i'm like ceasefire ceasefire ceasefire they all stop and as soon as like they stop firing all of the Kenyans run into the killing area and the big guy shouts, you don't fuck with Kenya!

2:53:09And they all start cheering and dancing. And I was like, it's the wrong vocab for me, but I sprint past them and I'm like, infill, infill, infill. And I'm like, because I think in my mind, there's two more upstairs we need to get up there. So they're like, oh shit. They all like tag on and then jump over the bodies and run up the stairs and then peel into the gym where there was no one else. It turns out when we come back downstairs, the recce squadron boys were already prepping their bodies and doing stuff. I'm like, I thought there were two wounded people up there and they're like, no. Like, no.

2:53:49I thought there was two more. Oh, no, no. And again, I remember it's English, not the first language, So I'm just putting it down to maybe a bit lost in translation. But it turns out there was only two terrorists up there. Now there's a two terrorists in the basement. But again, thinking on my feet, I take mug shots of the, so I take photographs of the dead bodies, the faces, send that to my link to people saying, hey, who wants these, who wants pictures of the dead? A lot of people say yes. So I send them straight away. They can start building up intelligence. take the photographs of the dead.

2:54:25I then turned to the team leader and said, okay, what's the score with the people in their basement? He's like, yeah, we've got to go down there. Sorry, yeah, we've got to go down there and get them. All right. And then he says, and first, we've got to clear all the hotel as well. So I'm like, okay. It seems like this assault group has now grew. Now that threat's been neutralised, there's a lot more people. but now we've got to clear 102 rooms to the basement. So we now start going to work on, we've done the top floor, so now we're just going room to room. At the same time, I get a message and they're saying, you need to go to room 316.

2:55:04There's an American citizen there and secure her. So I then peel off, say, I'm going to 316. She'll make a beeline for that. And I start heading down towards room 316 where the American melee chipping was located. Who's here today?

2:55:28Shit, man.

2:55:33There's elements of the story that when you read the book, there's some things I've said that aren't in the book, and there's some things I haven't said that are in the book as well. So there's a mix of, so when you buy the book, everyone, you're going to get some, there's going to be some other information and things. And also, this complements the book very well, this interview. but we'll talk about more, we'll talk more about that later. They're gonna buy the book, I guarantee you that. This is one of the most descriptive accounts I've ever heard. And it's...

2:56:07Wow. Wow. Those grenades come out right, as you said, at the hour of our death in the Hail Mary. Yeah. Just... Think, think, before that was it. Shit. Want to take a break? Yeah.

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2:58:28May Lee Chapin, welcome to the show. Thank you. I'm really honored to be here. I'm honored to have you and I really appreciate you making the trip. It's already a very special interview, and to have somebody else who was there that day who was rescued and another perspective is... It's just... It's... It's always funny when people want to talk to me, because I didn't do anything special that day, right? People say, like, oh, we want to hear your perspective, and my perspective is about just sort of surviving. But... the reason I like to answer these questions when I get them or to talk to people if I can is because I wasn't the only person he saved.

2:59:19Do you know what I mean? Like, he... It's hard for me to even say I'm in my first sentence, but he saved 700 people that day, right? And so if I can come and show I'm just one of those 700, but I'm a real person with a real life and a real family, and he gave those things back to me, and then you multiply that by 700. I just, I want to do justice to being a tiny symbol of what he saved that day, to make that real for people. Do you know what I mean? It's... indescribable. I mean, not only was it 700-plus people that day, It's the kids that they're gonna have. It's the kids that their kids are gonna have.

3:00:03I mean, there's a entire lineage of people that will experience life because he was there to leave that mission that day. People that will never even know him will experience life on Earth because he was there thousands of years from now. I can't put into words what it's like. to wake up, I got married, for example, after he saved my life. And to get to walk down the aisle and marry my now husband, because Christian gave that to me. Like, that's a gift that he gave me. I would not be here. I would not be alive. I would not have married my husband. And as you're saying, that continues generationally.

3:00:47And again, multiply by 700 and then multiply that outward. That ripple effect is... It's hard to even fathom. It's so powerful, what he did. And he's just one man. He's just one man. It's, yeah, indescribable was a good way to put it. So can you kind of... Can you tell me what it was like in the building when it hit? When the first bomb went off? Yeah, I can try. I use a lot of words, and I still don't know that I can ever do this justice. I think that the first thing I would tell you is I didn't have any experience with anything like this. I had never been in a dangerous situation. I had never been near an explosion or even gunfire, really.

3:01:32And so I was actually getting into bed in my hotel room. I was really jet lagged. And I had been up since 3.30 that morning. And so I just figured I'd take a quick nap before the research team got back and we could debrief. And I crawled into bed. And the sound of this explosion, which I now know was the suicide bomber in the courtyard detonating his vest right outside my window, it was so loud. My ears were ringing, and I didn't even know that I was screaming. That's how loud it was. Like, it was so loud. It shook the building. It literally shook the bed. And I sort of leapt from the bed and just moved instinctively toward the noise.

3:02:16but I knew already. I mean, I knew, I think, in that moment that I was dead. It was the scariest. I can't explain to you. I can't explain to you the way it shook the building and how dangerous that feels in that moment to have that happen so close by. And so I ran to the window, and my hands were shaking so much I couldn't wrench the curtains open to look down into the courtyard. And I finally got them. And it looked like a dystopian movie, like a scene from it. I remember, like, blinking my eyes over and over because I couldn't get my brain to acknowledge what I was seeing. I just kept thinking, like, I'm hallucinating.

3:02:59That can't be real. There's just smoke rolling through this courtyard. And blood spatter, just this spray of blood spatter. And I'm blinking and I'm looking at this object. lying on the pavement in this blood splatter. And my brain won't admit what it is. And I'm staring at it, and I'm staring at it, and finally I see there's still a boot on the end of this leg. And it's a chunk of a human leg. And I just started sobbing. I knew in that moment. I didn't know that that was the suicide bomber's leg, but I knew a bomb had gone off, and I knew it was on purpose. and I knew that they, I knew they were coming to kill us.

3:03:45It was so, I knew it with every fiber of my being. I had just been talking to my driver that morning about the history of terrorist attacks in Nairobi and the motivation behind them and how they like for them to be these very large events, often lasting many days. And so I knew immediately, oh, this is, he said, you know, we all go through our lives wondering when the next one will be. And I looked down in the courtyard and said, this is the next one. And so I was still standing there when the two gunmen, I heard cars start to explode and car alarms are going off. And so, you know, I know now so much information, but standing there, I didn't know if they had surrounded the building.

3:04:30I didn't know if they were inside. I knew some sort of bomb had gone off. You don't know how many? I didn't know, exactly, I didn't know how many. I knew some sort of bomb had gone off, Then I knew cars were exploding and car alarms are screaming and the fire alarm starts in the building. And then I see these two gunmen walking through. And I'm probably almost trying to convince myself, like... Maybe those aren't terrorists. Maybe they're here to help. But they were so... I don't know. Maybe the word would be resolute. They were just walking, right? They weren't running. They weren't trying to help anyone.

3:05:08they were walking through this blood splatter, like it was nothing, and coming toward the building. Yeah. And I thought... What I thought was, I hope I have enough time to say goodbye to my family. That was it. Sheesh. Yeah. So you were, what, two floors above exactly where the bomb went off? Yeah, I was on the third floor, so it was like, just high enough that I could look sort of down, I mean, right at the initial site of the explosion through my window. And you can see when you see the CCTV footage online, you can see the people run through in the immediate aftermath and then the gunmen come through.

3:05:49Yeah. And you could hear them shooting. Yeah. Could you hear the screaming? Actually, at that point, I couldn't hear screaming. But throughout the ordeal, I heard screaming at different points, some of which actually, I think, was the terrorists when they came in the building and started working their way up the stairs. How long were you in there? 17 hours. 17 hours. Yeah, and it's a tough thing, right? Because it's certainly the longest 17 hours of my life.

3:06:24But 17 hours was a grace that was given to us. Like, that would have lasted days. That would have lasted days. That would have been just like them all. It would have lasted for so, so much longer. It only lasted 17 hours, which was a gruesome amount of time for anyone who was in there, because someone came and did something about it. So it was long, but not nearly as long as it would have been.

3:06:55So you didn't move rooms? You didn't... I mean, what was your... Did the initial shock ever go away? No, that's an interesting question. In a way, it didn't. And there are interesting things that happen in retrospect, where, you know, I was discussing with my now husband, and he'd say, oh, you know, sometimes you'd go silent for an hour, and that was really hard. I wouldn't have said that was possible, but if you look at the timestamps on my text, it is. And I literally, I would go silent because I was literally on the floor shaking and just sobbing. And, like, I didn't, you don't register the passage of time in the way that you do when you're living your real life.

3:07:35I had no idea how much time was passing. I literally was just, I mean, I was lying on the ground just waiting, just saying like, let them kill me quickly, let them kill me quickly, let them kill me quickly. And, you know, you don't realize that you've done that for an hour. But that level of fear and adrenaline and terror in a way that redefined the word for me. Like, I didn't know what terror meant until I was standing there in that room shaking, trying to dial my phone to just, like, send one last text to my parents. It... it's... it's like nothing I've ever felt before. And that level of terror and fear was with me the whole time.

3:08:16I mean, there were... there were really brief moments where I thought, maybe someone was coming to save us, and then you'd hear more grenades, more explosions, more gunfire, and you'd think, maybe not. Hope felt... hope felt really dangerous. You almost don't want to believe you're going to be saved because then the gunshots start back up again, and it feels even more crushing to have to reckon with your own death again and again and again and again than to just accept it and wait. Who was your first text? My first, I had been texting with my dad right before the explosion, right before I was gonna take this nap.

3:08:52And so he was the most recent text, so he was my first text. And I said, terrorist attack on the hotel, I love you. That was it, right? I wasn't dead yet. I figured I was gonna be dead imminently. And I thought, I want you to know what's happening and that I love you. And I remember thinking, I hope when I'm dead, they take a little bit of comfort in the fact that that was my last thought. Like, I love you. That's my last... the last thing I said to them. And I truly believed in that moment, Sean, that those were the last texts I would ever send for the rest of my life. And then I texted my mom separately the same thing.

3:09:34And then I texted my now husband the exact same words, Cheris, to talk on the hotel, I love you. And I'll never forget that moment. I just stared at the screen for a minute and I thought, gosh, that sounds so empty. Like, I really, he's a really good man. He's a really good man. and I love him more than I can put into words for you." And I looked at that text and I thought, that's it. That's all I'll be able to say to him. And so I just typed out a couple more words. I said, more than anything. And I sent that off. I remember thinking, I hope he knows. Like, I hope when he gets that, he understands all of the gravity that I was trying to put into that.

3:10:26I hope he knows how much I wanted to marry him. And just, like, how much he meant to me. I don't know, you don't think about trying to tell someone in a really fast text what they mean to you until you're standing there, hands shaking, waiting to die, and thinking, like, man, I hope that gets it across. So that was what I sent. I thought about texting my little brother. He was 18 at the time, and I thought, I don't know. I just thought, I don't want him. I had just visited him for the holidays, and I just thought, let that be his last memory. You know, we were sitting around and playing games and laughing together, and I just thought that was a better last memory than some traumatizing, sad text from his sister right before she was murdered on the other side of the planet.

3:11:16So those were the three texts. I am. Yeah. And then, um... You can't call 911, right? But I had been given a work sort of security number, so that was the next thing I did was called this work security line and basically asked them what I was supposed to do. What did they say? So I got put on the phone with this woman named Melissa, who I think this was probably the most unusual day in her career as well. But she was amazing. I don't know how she had these answers or what exactly the process was like for her, but she very quickly started giving me instructions, which was, it was the best thing you could have done for me in that moment.

3:12:03Because I was literally, I mean, not literally, but I was frozen to the, I was standing in front of that window, phone in hands, shaking. I sent the three texts and that, I mean, that was it. I don't know, I couldn't come up with anything to do. I had no training. I had no experience with anything like this. I hadn't the faintest idea. You could have asked me right now, like, what's the best next thing to do? I still would tell you. There are really different approaches to this. But she said, let's make it look like no one's in the room. So we're going to close your curtains. We're going to turn off your lights.

3:12:36I want you to lock your door with the physical, you know, the, what's that called? The door lock as well. And then I want you to barricade it with the heaviest things in your room that you can physically move, barricade your door. So I said, okay. And suddenly it was this, there was a very slight comfort in someone else has some good ideas. Someone else can help me maybe live. I don't know, right, but I'm at least going to try it. So I moved like some nightstands and some chairs and anything else, my bags, anything I could move to put in front of the door. And then she said, can you find a good hiding place?

3:13:15And so I'm sort of taking stock of this hotel room, and I look in the bathroom, and I see sort of, you know, like there's your vanity, your sink, your mirror, and then there are these open shelves underneath. And I thought, it doesn't really look like a person could fit in that very bottom shelf, but I bet if I crushed my body in there, I bet I could fit. And I thought, hey, maybe that's a good hiding space because it doesn't look like someone would be there. So I went in the bathroom, locked the door lock. You know those that you just push with a single finger, and they're like, dink. And I remember, I froze for another moment thinking, that's not going to keep out someone who has an AK-47.

3:13:57I just remember being like, that's the lock? And then actually, I did melt down for a moment. I sort of slid down the door, back to the door, and I remember my whole body going ice cold. And I thought, as nice as it is that she has these ideas, and I think it was that door lock moment that really made me think, this isn't going to work. A few suitcases and a door lock are never going to keep them out. They have explosives. Like, I just saw this in the courtyard. And I just sank down against the door, and I was shivering. And I thought, one bullet between the eyes. Just one, like, please, please, please, please, just one bullet between the eyes.

3:14:43Because, I'm sorry. Wow. Because if they take me, if they film me, if they assault me, my family's gonna have to watch that. And I'm still gonna die, right? Like, I'm gonna die one way or the other. but if they draw this out my family will be tortured by that for the rest of their lives and so I'll never forget that moment of just like back against the door sinking down onto the floor and thinking like please please please just one bullet one bullet between the eyes I just it's okay just let it be done and let it be quick. And then the woman on the phone, I think had to kind of shout my name finally and say, like, go to that hiding place, go to that hiding place.

3:15:44It's not over. Go to that hiding place. And so I pulled all the towels out from that shelf and I like crushed my body. And I actually ended up with a huge bruise on my hip for many, many days afterward. But I don't remember, like, I don't remember hitting my hip hard enough to, to cause a bruise that large, but crushed myself into these shelves and I pulled the towels back in and there was this moment where I thought, I mean, I don't, if you're in a hurry and you're trying to kill as many people as you can, I guess, and you're just blowing these doors down and spraying gunfire at anyone you see, maybe, maybe I'll live.

3:16:24Like, maybe they really won't see me. And then a few minutes later thinking, I barricaded the door. So they know. They know someone's in here. And they're gonna look until they find me and, like, this is not a foolproof hiding place. And so then I just started telling myself, don't scream. Don't scream when they walk in here. Don't scream, don't scream, don't scream, because you're gonna be so scared. But if you scream, they'll know exactly where you are. So just don't scream. and that more that was one of those times where like so much more time passed than I realized almost an hour passed I think before I even gave any more updates to my family and so then I was I was sitting out there listening to Christian tell it from his perspective and I was crying because

3:17:21Oh, geez. Because he was literally the difference between what I pictured happening and what actually happened. They would have come into my room and they would have killed me. There is no question about that. You can't argue that. That's what they came to do. They came to systematically execute everyone in that complex. and that's what they were gonna do. And then he gets in his car and, like, uses all of this training. He has this training about how to drive tactically and live through that and get to the destination, you know, quickly and effectively. And he does that, and then he even says what he has to say to make sure he gets all the way to the hotel complex so that he can come save all of us.

3:18:12And it's like, it's almost incomprehensible to me. Who does that?

3:18:20But that's what he did. That's what he changed. He took the reality I was so sure was going to happen. And he saved us instead. It's pretty incredible. Yeah. You know, even just, I don't know, the intuition to go. Exactly. Like, before we got into the incident, I was like, Like, we've been... I've been in lots of places. I'm sure he's been in lots of places, much more than mine, than I have, where hotels, hospitals, schools, I mean, things get hit. It can be a daily occurrence. And it's so often, I mean, you couldn't even begin to respond to them. And you don't respond to them all. And you don't respond to really much of any of them, because they're not your people you know and i hate to say it like that but um you know it's not your mission it's not your people for but for him to you know and i mean i get what he says oh well this is a semi-permissive environment that still is is well i mean you heard the coincidences that led up to this and, you know, I think it's...

3:19:44pretty obvious, you know, there was a lead up. I always joke with him so he knows this well, but he joined the military in September of 1992, and I was born in September of 1992. And so I always think of it like, in a way, like, though we didn't know it yet, our lives had already intersected all the way back then. and then 26 years later, he shows up in this hotel and saves me because he had spent 26 years training and building up all of this experience that he put to use that day, that he says he feels like his whole life led up to that day. And I know you had said it to him and you just said now that they weren't his people, they weren't his comrades, they weren't his colleagues, they weren't even his countrymen, largely.

3:20:30And to me, it's part of what makes the story so... meaningful. So meaningful, right? Like, he didn't save us because we were British or this or that. Anything. He saved us because... In my words, he couldn't bear to let evil win that day. That was it. He just... We were human beings. We were innocent human beings who were being systematically executed to make a point by this organization. And he... I think he couldn't bear... for that to happen. Yeah. 17 hours. You are thinking you're gonna die in any minute. Yeah. Lots of things can go through people's heads. Life reviews. Regrets. Yeah. All the stuff you just described.

3:21:34How was gonna happen. Yeah, I thought that would happen to me. That mostly, I would replay... There was this sort of almost like vision in my head over and over and over of what it would look like when I died. What it would sound like, what it would feel like. You know, okay, will I still have consciousness for a few minutes after they shoot me? Two minutes, will I feel myself bleeding out? You know, what will that be like? Um, but it was two things. It was funny. I, I remember thinking, I thought I'd be braver. I remember thinking, I thought I'd be braver. I, I don't know why, but I thought I would have said, oh, you know, if I have to face death, I'll, I'll face it staunchly with a brave face.

3:22:17I don't know why I thought that about myself. And I can't tell you how not brave I felt in there shaking and sobbing on the floor and how helpless. That was part of what was so frustrating, was feeling like there was nothing I could do. I didn't have any training. I didn't have a weapon. I didn't have a plan. I didn't have anyone to call, like nothing. And so I just remember feeling so, so helpless. And then thinking, I would have thought I'd review my life for like the happiest moments, or maybe I'd look back at old photos and cry. Did you have any regrets? No, and I didn't, it didn't feel that way either.

3:22:55The regret was, I'm so sad that I don't get to finish my life. Like, I'm only 26, and I love the man I'm engaged to, and I love my family, and I love my job, and I'm so, I have led such an amazing life, and I've loved every minute of it. Like, I truly didn't feel like I had taken my life for granted or my relationships, but I was so sad, like, devastated that I wouldn't get to go back to them. I remember sobbing, thinking, I really wanted to marry Paul. Like, I really, really wanted to marry him. And so it wasn't about, like, past regrets. It was about the future that I was gonna miss. And I was so sad to miss it.

3:23:38Did you think about what happens after death? I don't think so. I don't remember having a thought like that. I think it was, as much as I felt like I had accepted dying, I was so sad. I was really caught up in being sad. Sad to die, sad to miss out on this future that I had been looking forward to living. And so I didn't, it was really, I was really caught up in sort of grieving the things I was gonna miss. And you never hit acceptance. I don't think I... You never really hit, this is just... I felt that it was inarguable. Like, it was... there was nothing I could do. I was going to die. Mm-hmm.

3:24:23But that didn't bring a calmness over you. No, no, definitely not. I wanted it to be quick. I was certain I was going to die, and I was certain there was nothing I could do about it. But it's a hard thing to accept, you know? Death. And that's the human condition, right? Like, we want to fight. We want to live. We want to survive to see another day." And I wanted to see another day.

3:24:52Did you hear gunfire, grenades? I mean, was it all 17 hours? Yeah. Yeah, I mean, there would be short respites, especially toward the end. And you've heard it a bit from Christian's perspective. I didn't know what was happening. But toward the end, there would be these bursts of like explosions and gunfire, and then it'd go quiet for a minute or two. And then more, what I know now are grenades and gunfire. But in the beginning, it was such an assault on the senses. It was like the cars exploding, the fire alarms, or the car alarms, the fire alarm inside the building, including inside my room, right?

3:25:29So just wailing right above your head. The explosion that had been in the courtyard, the gunfire from the two terrorists who had split off around the back, it was... Yeah, it's hard to put into words how much that overwhelms your senses. And it felt like it was coming from everywhere, from everywhere. I remember saying to my parents, like, there have to be dozens of these guys because it is, this gunfire is all around me and it never stops. Like, it never stops. So the beginning was just, it was just constant. And what I know now, too, that I didn't know then, was I thought people had arrived at the scene and were engaging the terrorists.

3:26:11So I thought the police were there or the Kenyan Special Forces were there long before anyone was actually engaging the terrorists because I could hear, like, gunfire and then gunfire from a different location. And so I thought maybe that was them trading gunfire, but actually it was this group of two terrorists gunning people down and this group of two terrorists gunning people down and they had split off. And so... I got a lot of different stories throughout the 17 hours, but at one point there was a report that it wasn't terrorists, it was a bank robbery. Yeah, this is a big story. Where are you getting these reports from?

3:26:47At the time, well, that actually went all the way through Google Security. They were like, it's confirmed, this is a bank robbery, you're actually not in any danger. And so that was the first time I came out of my hiding place. And I was trying to tell myself, Okay, okay, okay, okay. This is really good news, right? These aren't terrorists. They don't want anything to do with me. I mean, I understand I could die accidentally in the crossfire, but these are not people hunting, you know, down all of the people in the hotel. And I was trying so hard to ignore the voice in the back of my head that was saying, why would a suicide bomber detonate as part of a bank robbery?

3:27:21Like, what, how, what was the plan there? Um, and then, you know, later, these tweets went out that the property had been secured. And so my parents texted me, oh my gosh, okay, we've heard, it's official, right? The property's been secured. And I could still hear gunfire from multiple directions. And I was like, I can't imagine the property has been secured. I can still hear quite a lot of gunfire. And then there were more explosions after that. And so I remember saying, I remember saying to the woman on the phone, I was crying and I was saying, Melissa, isn't anyone coming? Like, doesn't anyone care that this is happening to us?

3:28:04And it was such a... It was such a naive thing to say, right? I was in another country. Nobody owed me anything, but it was hard for me to believe. And I think especially as an American, it was hard for me to believe that, like, no one was coming. And that was the case at that time. No one was coming. And I always think if you could watch our lives unfolding side by side, you'd see Christian getting this call and getting in his car and probably getting to the complex right as I'm sobbing, saying, isn't anyone gonna come? And he did. Like, someone did. And that literally made all of the difference.

3:28:45That made all the difference. How did they approach your door? I mean, when it was... Yeah, I... And how did you answer? I mean, I would think that other than the bomb and probably the initial gunfire, to hear a knock at your door. Yeah. Who's not an American. Yeah, yeah, actually. So it was an interesting thing because the whole time, right, you're hearing all these sounds and your brain is working so hard to try to understand where are these people and how much danger am I in? And is it changing, right? Like, oh, are they getting closer? Am I in more danger? And then I got all of these different reports through the security team, and I talked to Marine Post One at one point.

3:29:27And so I had been told all kinds of things. Fill the bathtub with water because we're worried the whole building is going to catch fire, and that might buy you a couple of minutes. I had been told, Kenyan Special Forces is at your door. Literally right now, go answer the door. They're here to save you. And there was no one, no one in the hallway, no one at the door, nothing. I had been told, obviously, like the bank robbery. I had been told the property's been secured. And so you just start to, you start to unravel, kind of. It's a hard thing to explain, but you don't know what to believe, right?

3:30:03What's true? How safe am I? But the one thing that had been reiterated to me over and over was you don't leave your room, and you don't open your door for any, I don't care if they have an American accent, I don't care, you do not open your door unless they tell you who they are and who sent them, like, you know, what group they're with. And so actually, a few hours in, I could hear the card reader on my door. A card, a hotel key card went into the card reader, so you can hear it, you know, and they opened it and slammed into that lock and, like, shook the door a few times, never said anything, closed it again, and went and I could hear them do it at the next door.

3:30:42And I still, to this day, Sean, I don't know who that was. I think about that still. I don't know who that was. That was, like, one of the first questions I asked Christian. I was like, did you have a hotel key card? Who was coming through? And it could have been a good Samaritan. I don't know. I don't know who that was. But I remember thinking... I remember thinking that I was going to die of a heart attack and how ironic that was going to be, because my heart was pounding so hard. I remember thinking, there's no way your heart can pound like this for very long before you die, I think. It felt like my heart was exploding out of my chest.

3:31:15And when I heard that, the card in the card reader and then the door against the deadbolt, I remember thinking that the fear was going to kill me, that I was going to die. I was so scared. And then a little bit after that, Christian talked about how the terrorists fell back to that position in the gym. Well, they went up the stairs in the building and they were screaming, like, in a language I don't understand. And so I could hear their voices. My room was very close to the stairs and the elevators. And so I could hear their voices get louder and louder as they came up the stairs. And then there was this explosion, huge explosion of glass.

3:31:54So the whole stairwell in that hotel was made of glass. Just natural light could shine in onto the stairs all day long. And it was so loud. There was so much glass shattering. I remember thinking that was the windows. The windows in that stairwell just got shot out. and they cascaded into tiny shards. And I started sobbing and I texted my family and said, they're on my floor. Like, I can hear them. They're here. They're on my floor. Oh, my gosh. And so, I mean, I knew. And I knew beyond the shadow of a doubt. And that was, again, it was one of those moments where, like, it had been, you know, I'm definitely going to die.

3:32:32Oh, no, the Kenyan Special Forces are at your door. Oh, no, it's a bank robbery. Oh, wait, no, you're going to die. Like, so many times I had already believed I was gonna die and believed I was gonna be rescued and believed I was gonna die and believed I was gonna be rescued. And that was another one of those moments where it just... You think, I remember thinking to myself, how naive. I can't believe there was a little part of me that thought I might make it out of this alive. Because they are right there. They're in the stairwell. They're here. And it makes sense because they're gonna do what they came to do.

3:33:03They're gonna murder as many people as they can get to, even if there is some sort of response force here, because I have no idea who's on the ground. They're gonna murder as many of us as they can, and unfortunately, I'm on the third floor, so it looks like they made it here. Wow. And then... and then they kept going. They kept going up the stairs. I know now they were trying to make it to those fallback positions, that fallback position in the gym, up on the very top floor. But they kept going and screaming, and glass was shattering, and... I don't know. All I knew was they were getting closer, and now their voices are receding again above me, but they're in this building.

3:33:49Like, I could hear them upstairs. Shit. Yeah. Yeah. But then I did get a message. A message got to me that said... This is hard to say.

3:34:10A message got to me that said, US and UK special forces are on the ground. And for me, through the ebbs and flows of everything, emotionally, I had been through up to that point, that was the turning point for me. That was the first moment that I thought, I don't know, you don't hear a lot of stories of US and UK special forces showing up and just like turning around and going home, you know? That was the first moment I thought. Those people might save us. If they're here, if they came, we have a chance. We have like a real chance. and I'll never forget. I'll never forget till the day that I die.

3:34:59I'll never forget seeing that text. And it's hard to explain what it's like to be on the far side of the world and to think like...

3:35:17Sorry. To think like they came for me.

3:35:25They came for me anyway. I'm not on American soil. And they don't know me.

3:35:35But they came for me. They're here to like... to risk their lives for mine.

3:35:46It's... I'll never be able to put into words what that feels like, that kind of gratitude. when you think you're on your own, when you think you're being left in a building to be murdered by terrorists, and you get a text that says, I know you're in Nairobi, but U.S. and U.K. special forces are here.

3:36:12That was the turning point. I'll never, never be able to put into words the gratitude I felt. and he was there and that was the turning point. I'm gonna need a second tissue.

3:36:31Okay, sorry. You're doing great. It's tough. It's hard. You feel like you can't really put words to that kind of feeling, you know? I have tried and tried, but I'll never do that justice. I'll never do that justice. I think you just did. Trying. I think I had lived my whole life taking my safety for granted because I could, because I had always been safe. And so it was almost unfathomable to be caught in this attack. And then it was even harder to believe that no one was coming. And then... And then they did. Someone came, and it just... I think if I had to try to explain it, I'd say... I stood between...

3:37:37I physically stood between the two extremes of, like, what humanity can be. There were literal strangers who wanted to murder me in cold blood, who I didn't know, and who would have done it without hesitating. And who were, like, quite literally willing to give their lives to do that, to kill me and a bunch of other strangers. And then there was this man and the people who were helping him who was also a complete stranger to me, who was willing to give his life.

3:38:14to stop them. And so in the same day, I think I saw the absolute worst of what humanity can do and be, and the best. And that changes everything. It changes everything. Sorry. So good. I'm just gonna cruise through these.

3:38:43But yeah, eventually, there was a, what actually started happening, he discussed meeting with some people in the lobby. And so what that was like for me was that my, you never think about the physical phones that are still in hotel rooms, right? But most hotel rooms have a phone both beside the bed and on the wall in the bathroom, almost always. the the phone i was in the bathroom so which was where i was told to sort of hide out and so i was in the bathroom for basically all 17 hours the only time i would leave the bathroom was when i would have to swap my phones i had a work phone and a personal phone both of which i was just you know using uh the whole time but when i would have to charge one the only outlet that would take my kind of plug was in the main bedroom so i'd have to army crawl out there to try to stay below the which was almost the whole far wall.

3:39:40Army crawl out there and take one off the charger, put the next one on, and then army crawl back, because they said to stay below the level of the glass. But I spent almost the whole time in the bathroom. And so I was in the bathroom, and the physical phone started to ring, which was actually really startling to me and very distressing, because I had spent... They tell you constantly, right? Don't make any noise, don't make any noise, don't draw any attention to yourself. And so when this phone started ringing, my initial desire was to make it stop. Like, I almost picked it up and hung it right up because I didn't want it to be making all of this noise to draw any attention to the room.

3:40:15But I called Marine Post One back and asked them, like, this phone is ringing. Do you want me to do something about that? Am I supposed to answer it? And I heard them have a discussion, and he came back on the phone and he said, yeah, if it rings again, answer it. And write that, I mean, literally, the sentence came out of his mouth and the phone started ringing again. And I said, okay, I'm gonna answer it, hang on. And I should clarify that I never spoke to my family members. I only texted with my family members. I spoke to the security line from work and to Marine Post One, and then when I answered this phone.

3:40:51But I didn't... I felt like if I talked to them, if I heard their voices, I was gonna break down and there would be no... I wouldn't be able to do anything else. So I was only texting them, and then I was talking to these different people who had information. So I said, okay, I'm going to answer it. And I picked the physical phone up off the wall. And probably in a barely audible voice, you know, I was like, hello? And dead calm, dead calm American accent, you know, man comes across the line. He says, oh, hey, Maylee, how you doing? You know, I'm down here in the front lobby and we're checking in with everybody.

3:41:24Are you injured? Do you need anything? And I think I just went silent. It was so strange to get this call on this physical phone. This man, I don't know, says he's in the lobby. As far as I'm concerned, the lobby is imploding. I'm not really sure, does the lobby still exist? And like, yes, I would really like to leave. You know, what am I supposed to say? I remember being really startled. He said he was my security liaison. And I said, I don't know what that is, but okay. And he said, you're doing a great job, which I remember thinking, I don't know how one does a good or bad job I'm just sitting here in my room, you know, crossing my fingers and crying." And he said, I wanted to let you know that your floor has been secured, but it is of the absolute, you know, utmost importance that you stay where you are.

3:42:18The building has not been secured, but, like, your floor is secure. And I probably continued to cry. I remember asking him to repeat himself, can you say that again, can you say that again? And he said, yeah, your floor has been secured. And he said he would call back with more updates. And so I hung it up. I texted my parents and my then-fiancé, now-husband, and they said, my floor has been secured. My husband responded immediately and was like, that's great news. You know, it probably means that the battle is not taking place there, and they know there are no terrorists on your floor, so let's take that as a win for now.

3:42:56Um, and then when I got, I think there were two more calls in between, but the next big piece of information was, he said, we're gonna start the final assault. It's going to be loud and it's going to be long. And I just wanted to give you that heads up. But try to remember, it's a good thing. Like, we're gonna neutralize the terrorists. And I hung up and there were a couple moments of that, like, near quiet again. And then that was when the grenades just started going off so much above me. There had been like a pounding sound coming down from above me, just like repetitive, that I finally, when I met Christian, learned was them sledgehammering the ceiling, trying to get in to throw the grenades into the gym.

3:43:41But yeah, the grenades and the gunfire, and that's when it started just being exchanged over and over and over and over. And every time I thought it was done, it would start again. And by then, he was saying this too, but the sun was coming up? And I can't explain to you how strange it is. I mean, they had started the attack in broad daylight. And we had gone all through the night, so it had gone, you know, pitch black in the room. I remember the lights of the helicopter shining in at one point, but mostly pitch black all through the night. And then the sun starts to come up the next morning, and the birds come back, and they're tweeting in the trees outside my window.

3:44:24and then they all scatter as these grenades start to explode again. And it was like... It was unreal in so many ways. It didn't feel real. There was something so violent going on. And I still didn't know if I was going to live or die. And I remember them saying to me, at this point, the biggest fear is that the whole building is going to come down on you guys, that the building will collapse onto you. So that's what we're most afraid of at this point. And, of course, what I didn't know was there were still two terrorists in the basement. So, yeah, it was, even as I was living it, it was hard to process that it was really happening.

3:45:08Who came and got you out of there? Yeah. I was just, it was the most casual knock. I don't know what kind of knock I expected. Maybe, like, maybe it was a similar thought to Christians, right? We don't want to freak out the victims inside these rooms. But it was just this really casual, like almost light knock. I almost felt like I had imagined it. And I remember leaping off the floor. I was on the phone with the security line still from work. And it was the third person because they change shift every eight hours. And so I was on the phone with a third person at that point. And I said, they're at my door, they're at my door.

3:45:41And I started running for the door, like throwing the door open to the bathroom. and, like, I was so... I wanted nothing, nothing, nothing more than to get out of that hotel. And he was very adamant on the phone. He was, you know, urgently saying, hang on, hang on, you can't just open the door for anyone. Like, we can't verify who that is until they disclose, you know, who they are. So, like, don't throw the door open. So I'm sobbing and I'm saying, like, okay, I'll try to ask them. And I'm ripping all the furniture away from the door that I pushed in there, and I'm shaking. And he, you know, reiterates yet again, you can't just open the door, Maylee.

3:46:22Do you understand what I'm saying? And I was like, okay, okay, okay. Hey, can I... I said something to them about, you know, is it safe to open the door? Can I open the door? And they said, yes, Maylee, we're here to get you. We're here to take you out. Again, these calm American voices, we're here to get you out. It would be great if you could open the door. and he said one more time, they have to say who they're with. And I was like, okay, can you just, can you say who you're with? I don't even know how to ask that question, right? But that's what he said. He's like, can you say who you're with?

3:46:51And I started to reach for the door handle to just throw it open. And as I got my hand almost there, I was like, can you tell me who you're with? And this gruff American voice came back from the other side of the door and he said, don't worry about it. And I remember my hand just freezing in midair. And then, honestly, I was like, seems fine. And I hung up and threw the door open. I know. It was not a good response. I think I was... I think I was so desperate to leave. So desperate that I would have... Yeah, it truly could have been a disastrous mistake. It was not a great moment of judgment. But luckily, they were two American guys, button-down shirts, very calm.

3:47:39They asked if I was, like, physically injured. I said no. And they asked me a couple more times just to make sure. They got, they asked if I had, like, sort of a little bag packed, which the security line had told me to do at one point, so I did have, like, a small bag with my passport. And they got that. And then they asked if I could walk. And I said, yeah, I could walk. and I tried to start stepping out into the hallway with them, and there was so much broken glass on the floor that I was literally slipping. Like, I mean, my feet were... I had sneakers on, and my feet were going out from under me.

3:48:15I remember one of them having to, like, prop me up under his arm as they made it down the stairs, and I looked up at the window, and I thought, yeah. They brought down all, like, the windows in the staircase. There was so much blown-out glass. It's hard to even put it into words. I was talking to Christian about it last night, I was like, do you remember wading through broken glass? And he said, yeah, it was literally slippery because there was so much broken glass everywhere. And they had told me, the very first person I had spoken with on the security line, the very first time they thought I was getting out, which was about an hour in, she had said, when they take you out, don't look around.

3:48:53She was like, it's horrific. Don't look around. And so that's how I remember, just like training my eyes on all of this broken glass on the stairs, and that was all I saw with this arm under me as they, like, half carried me down the steps and into the lobby. And they announced themselves to the force downstairs. I think they said blue, blue, blue or something like that. I remember jumping because he shouted, and I thought it meant something bad. But he was announcing himself, and then we came down into the lobby. And they sat me on a couch and said they had to go get the other American. And I remember saying to them, are you sure it's safe?

3:49:31Are you sure it's safe? I can just sit here in the middle of the lobby on this couch. And they, another guy from the group, whatever group that was, stayed with me. And they said, yeah, we're sure it's safe. We're gonna go get the other American, and then we're gonna get you out of here. And I... As someone who often chooses the wrong words, I took out my phone. I wanted to let my family know, like, I think I'm gonna live. I think I'm being rescued. And I texted on the group chat, they got me, which was probably the worst words that I could possibly choose. So I said, they got me, put my phone away.

3:50:15And then a few minutes later, I sort of gasped and turned to the man next to me and was like, am I allowed to get out my phone? Because, you know, you're not supposed to reach in your bags or, like, do any sudden movements. And I was like, can I get my phone out one more time? And he said yes, and so I got it out. And I was like, I'm so sorry. The good guys, the good guys got me. And I think that was the moment that it hit me too as I was typing that out. Like, I'm out of there. I'm out of the room where I literally thought I would die, where I imagined bleeding out thousands of times. I'm out.

3:50:49I got out of there.

3:50:53and I think I'm going to live. Like, the good guys got me. They're here. Like, it's like living inside of a superhero movie where they really do, like, they show up and they save you and they take you out of what literally felt like hell, like the worst thing I had ever been in. And they took me and the other American out to an armored vehicle and drove us off the property. And it must have been, I don't know what you'd have to ask him, but not an hour later, maybe a little more than that, that Christian walked into my room and it was empty. Man. Yeah. Watching that video, he showed me the video of you and your mom.

3:51:39Oh, yeah. At the airport when you got home. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, you can see, like... I think that video is really powerful to me because again when you think about 700 people getting home to their families 700 mothers sobbing as they get to hold their child again who they truly believe they would never see again um and and just as much you think about the 22 mothers who lost their child that day you know before he could get there before the good guys came to save us.

3:52:17It's, yeah, it really demonstrates that that was life or death. Like, that was every second, that was life or death. He talks about, like, getting there as fast as he could. And every second that he saved on that drive and clearing the buildings saved someone's life.

3:52:39When did you meet him for the first time? I met him almost exactly a year later. So he saved me in January of 2019. I got married about halfway through that year. And then my husband and I met up with him at a hotel in Washington, D.C. And it was to have had the worst experience of your life in a hotel. And then later that same year, to be, like, sitting in a hotel room, shaking, crying, tears of, like, gratitude and joy because you get to meet the man who saved you is, like, I don't know, reality is stranger than fiction sometimes, I think. We knew of him, right? Obviously, I finally got out and I finally get back to the US and there are these stories on the internet where everyone's saying there's this guy, Obi-Wan Nairobi, you know, he was our only hope.

3:53:36He came through in this, like, button down and saved everyone. And there are these videos of him literally carrying wounded people out of the complex. And we didn't know... And he's wearing a balaclava, right? We didn't know anything about who this was. There are all these theories circulating online. And I... I remember seeing the blackbeard patch that he had on that day. And I ordered everything I could find with a blackbeard patch on it. I had, like, a water bottle and a thermos and a patch and just anything I could find that had the blackbeard patch. Um, and I, I just, I was, it's, I think to me at that time he was like this myth, right?

3:54:16He was this mythical person. I'm sorry, I'm still like tearing up. He was this mythical person who had come and saved us and in a way he almost wasn't real, right? Like, I don't know, there are these photos and these videos of this man doing this like superhuman thing and saving everyone. And it didn't... I knew he was a real person, obviously. But to me, he was so much larger than... It was like Superman came and saved us, right? And now the whole internet is saying, like, oh, Superman saved you. And I'm like, well, that makes sense, because he saved so many of us. And so he still was this, like, mythical figure in our lives.

3:54:56And I had these patches, and they felt like these little... I don't know, talismans. I was obsessed with them. I would take this thermos everywhere and say, like, I don't know. It was odd. It just, like, it felt like these little charms I could take around with me. Like, if I had one, I was safer because it made me feel almost connected to this mythical person. And so when we got the opportunity to meet him in real life, it was humbling to put my arms around him and think, like, somehow I never thought about the fact until that day, until I was hugging him in that room, I never thought about the fact that he was a real person, like, who also may have never made it home to his family that day, who also, like, everything in his life was on the line, except he did it voluntarily.

3:55:53Like, I would have given anything, anything, anything to get out of that hotel, anything. And he chose to walk in. And so it wasn't until I put my arms around him and, like, gave him this hug that I think that really hit home for me, that I thought, you're a person. You're a man, and you could have chosen not to save us. You could have never joined the military, right? And then I'd be dead if you never joined the military. I'd be dead if you drove slower that day. I'd be dead if you didn't, you know, risk still going in alone. And so I can't explain how humbling it was to put my arms around him that day and, like, thank him.

3:56:44What's the first thing you said to him? The first thing I said was thank you. I was sobbing. And then I handed him a letter. I had written him a letter. And in the letter, I said, I hope that you never forget that you didn't save me. You gave my parents back their daughter, my brother back his sister, my husband back his wife. And you did that 700 times. I just, like, I wanted him to know every day

3:57:20that there were real people, like, that I'm just one real person, but I have a real life. I wake up every morning, and I go live it, and there are people that I love that love me.

3:57:33And he gave us that gift. Like, he literally gave me the gift of my life. So, yeah, there I was, again, trying to put words to something that... I don't know that you can put words to that. Mad. Yeah. And you guys are still close today. Yeah, yeah, very. I try to... I don't know. It's a hard... It's a... You think about your life very differently when it's been given back to you, right, for a second chance, a second time. And so I try to do what I can in a very different life from his to honor that gift that he gave me, to put good back out in the world or try to help other people where I can.

3:58:29Because I wouldn't have had any of these days. And I feel like that's how I try to pay tribute to his legacy, to what he gave me. And you wrote a book, Terrorist Attack Girl. Yeah. And you came up with an app for PTSD. Yeah. Yeah. Both are. What's the name of the app? The app's called Trauma Brace. And they're both just efforts to give a lifeline to people who are suffering from PTSD. I didn't know what it really felt like until I went through it. I didn't know that civilians could have PTSD. But it's really dark. It's really lonely and ugly. And it's filled with so much guilt and shame. And I thought, I don't know that I've ever heard people describe it that way.

3:59:24So I wanted to say what that really looked like. And how not proud of myself I was. Like, I was, I had these bouts of rage for the first time in my life. I was not being very kind to the people in my life, and I wasn't sleeping, and I wanted to write about that so that people knew they weren't alone and that they could get better. And that's what the app is about. Like, if you don't have another option, now you do. You have something that you can try. Because I think... The worst feeling that I felt in all 17 hours was hopelessness. When that ice cold feeling hits you and you think, there's nothing I can do, there is no hope left.

4:00:15That is the worst feeling. And I think that can hit you afterward too. In those deep, dark moments of PTSD, you think, like, what's the point? I remember thinking, what's the point? And I think if instead you can remind yourself that there's a light at the end of the tunnel, that no matter how dark it feels today, there's hope, that can change your life. And it can get you back to a point where it's not so dark. Like, you can crawl, climb, fight your way back to a place that doesn't feel so dark. And I just, I want everyone to know that's possible. Good for you. Well, Maylee, we're wrapping up your end here.

4:01:14But, you know, you had said something at breakfast that I'd like you to reiterate here. Sure. You know, the event's been... massively politicized. Yeah. The UK government is going after him. You heard what happened on the break. Yeah. They're trying to serve him. Yeah. They're trying to keep him from telling his story. They've treated him like shit. Yeah. You know, and... You said something at breakfast that I'd just like you to reiterate. I was trying to say, I don't know that I do it justice when I express it this way, but I was trying to say that if you're politicizing this story, if you're trying to use it for some agenda, then you missed the whole point.

4:02:09you missed the whole point of what he did.

4:02:16Because Christian didn't go through that hotel opening doors and saying, are you this? Are you from this nation? Are you this religion? Do you look like that? He went through every door and saved every person because they were innocent. That was it. because it was the humane thing to do, because it was good against evil. And that's what he did. He went through that hotel and he saved every person in the whole complex, all 700. And if you hear that story and you twist it to be about some agenda or some story he was or wasn't trying to carry on, or you're mad about what he did, that's a personal insult to every single person he saved.

4:03:10And it hits me really hard when I hear people doing that because this is the most pure, kind, beautiful, human story there is. He didn't know us. He didn't have to save us. But he did, and he didn't do it because of any political belief or agenda. he did it because it was the right thing to do. And that's the end of the story. Period. So, I hope people let that story be what it is. Thank you.

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4:06:06What was it like watching that? I wasn't watching it. You didn't watch it? No, no. I went in and out and I was just like making phone calls and pacing as I do. A lot on my mind right now. I can imagine. I'm telling you, you're in great hands. Don't worry about it. Yes. but um well she crushed it yeah she's just she's a natural so man yeah man she loves you man very thankful very thankful lots of gratitude but yeah she's good she's a good one so

4:06:49So let's talk about where we left off. You head down to room 316. So just to put, just to do the recap, so we've neutralized the terrace on the sixth floor. And now we're on our way down to the lobby and then the basement, but we have to clear all the rooms. I get the message, hey, can you check out 316? I can't remember the other room number, but was it where the other American was? and get her out. There's a kind of mess up in communication because what had happened was somewhere along the line where we've said we've neutralised a terrorist to the security liaison who had, through the night, who positioned themselves outside the foyer in their armoured vehicle, the security liaison team got told that the building was clear and not...

4:07:39So they didn't, as far as I'm aware, didn't know that the basement, there's still terrorists in the basement so they thought the whole building was clear not the real information was we just neutralized the terrorists on the top floor on the sixth floor so we move around and it was only minutes we we like when they when merely the the guys were knocked on the door escorted merely out it was just a gap of like minutes before we got there um and when we got down to the um so we clearly she wasn't there we searched the room and then we went to the other room, wasn't there and then cleared the rest of the floor, got to the foyer.

4:08:20I saw the American security liaison guys were outside in the armored vehicles because at that point I think they'd been informed that the building's not cleared, there's stuff in the basement so they're following their rules. Like, okay, building not secure, to get back into the armored vehicles, and that's all good. But then we've got the issue with the basement now. You know, just, I'm sorry, before we move on, I just want to, I'm still processing everything that she said, and, you know, I have never heard, I don't think I've ever heard somebody with an innocent

4:09:08civilian mindset that had been through something like that. You know, everybody I've ever talked to, you know, that has been through an event like that is a mindset like you or like myself or somebody that's been through training to get them out of that or the thought process on, that was really interesting to hear, somebody as innocent and stuck in that kind of a situation who doesn't have an instinct or a mindset like an operator. And it's scary, man. Yeah. I mean, it's bad enough for people when, you know, there's people training, go on the range and say, I'm going to respond and that's good for them.

4:10:08And it's one thing for them, when they hear like real gunfire at them and explosives in an enclosed place without hearing protection, without all this, it's an ordeal. But in some ways they're prepared for it or they're preparing for it, so it doesn't hit as hard. But you imagine that with people who've got no interest in the military, not into guns, not into things, and the sheer calamity of this terrorist attack, or any terrorist attack, or traumatic event for that matter, when it hits, man, that's when you see real, you know when we talk about post-traumatic stress disorder and effects, that's when we need to go, people don't take that into consideration, like violent attack, whatever, it's like, it's combat times a hundred because you're not prepared for it at all and don't anticipate any, like, physical violence, especially whenever it involves carnage, bombs and bullets and things like that.

4:11:09Man, that hits people. That's devastating. Yeah, I never, I mean, it just instantaneously gave me a perspective that I just never thought about it

4:11:25from that angle. You know, I never thought about it from that angle. And I'm not saying I've been in situations like what you were just in by any means, but, I mean, I don't know. It just gave me a different perspective. Shit, man. I mean, she was terrified. She couldn't think. She couldn't move. She couldn't. Yeah. But she did a great job. She did an amazing job. Because what a common factor is in what happened on this is people get freaked out when they're on their own, and they will sacrifice. And this is something for everyone to listen to if, God forbid, you're in this whole situation, and you're not armed and you're just hiding is people will sacrifice a safe hiding position for human company.

4:12:23And that's when they run into terrorists or bad guys. So if you're in a relatively what you think is a secure place or do, so she was, she plays it down and whatever. She did an amazing job because she didn't scream, shout demand rescue like not follow orders and like get out and run out the hole no I'm just gonna leave I'm just gonna leave or whatever she's she did exactly what she was told to do and that is calmness under pressure so she plays it down I was terrified I was out of that that's typical her playing it all down but she did an amazing job because she did what she was supposed to do she followed followed followed the like the instructions and remain cool and she did She'd remain cool.

4:13:09Yeah, in her mind, she thinks she's going to die. She's processing it, whatever. But she's still cool. She's not crying or whatever, being weak. Not saying crying as being weak. But what I'm saying is just like, just like, I know what she's saying. Yeah, she was solid. Yeah. And I think, like I said, she deserves a lot of credit for that because. It's a really good perspective. I mean, it really painted the picture of what, you know, for lack of a better term, an everyday person experiences when that happens.

4:13:50And then to have the, you know, the complete opposite you sitting right in the same, like from one conversation to the very next, and like it's just a total perspective change. And like, yeah, I just wanted to acknowledge that. So to the basement we go. Yeah. So we're in the foyer. I meet up with the chief inspectors who are, like, in charge of the recce squadron. Tell them, I said, hey, do you want photographs of the dead? I'd already passed them on to other people. But they went, oh, yes, please. Give them to them. Passed the two mug shots over. And then I'm like, hey, we need to get down in the basement.

4:14:31We need to go. I said, we're going to need at least six people to get down there. So they start giving the call, hey, we need six guys. I'm doing, hey, six guys, let's go. Like, start stacking. And this is into where the, so it's like the dining area that leads into the kitchen. The kitchen leads to, we call it the basement. Technically, it's not a basement. It's like the service area, service corridors from where you would deliver, where all supplies and laundry and things come and go. But it kind of looks like a basement. but we just for ease of description i call it the basement and um and and credit to the to the the four guys the four guys who always put themselves who were always like rotating in the in the stack upstairs the four guys who are who are always in burning my memory they were the four first four to stack up i'm looking around and there's a lot of guys milling around i jump in on number five i said come on guys we need six at least six we need one more But as soon as I, it was kind of, I really like, like, made me feel good was when I stepped in, then everyone felt like a load of others fell in behind me.

4:15:41And they're like, okay, I'm involved, let's go. And it's a good example of stepping up to be a leader. And sometimes you don't, I'm kind of playing things down or very humble. And I didn't realize that at that moment then how much effect I was having on the troops of like being there, making the decisions and pushing. and so when they all fell in behind me, I was like, well, that's good. So I went, right, let's go. So we move off into the dining area. There's like the bathrooms. First two guys peel off to clear them. Then there's like an office or storeroom or something, two guys. So I'm number one again.

4:16:16And as we're heading to the kitchen, and I'm like, okay, here we go. Just short of the kitchen, there's like an elevated, there's like dead ground behind a counter. and I'd already done it in that day and all the CQB experts would be like, oh, I don't know about this, but I call it the, in the book, I call it the Patrick Swayze maneuver, Patrick Swayze maneuver, and it could be, on the edit, I removed the Neil Macaulay because I didn't want to confuse it, but it was a Patrick Swayze or Neil Macaulay from Heat, that maneuver, and it's where I just jump up on the high ground and walk along scanning into the dead ground because it was just fast, and if anyone's there to shoot, I'm going to try and beat them to it, But it was just a way of, instead of moving, slowing down the momentum, I did it.

4:17:01So I was just, and they looked at me like I was a lunatic. But I was like, and then jumped down, went to the door to the kitchen, said one of the guys, OK, open. And when I opened the door, that was the shock. Because I cleared it from what I could from the outside, then made entry. this was different because what they say when there's a terrorist attack run hide tell and that's what most people do run hide tell if you're a chef in a five-star hotel and a terrorist that happens you run hide tell what you do not do is turn off all the hobs turn off all the other ovens and run hide tell so all of this food what's been going on in the kitchen has been cooking off for 15 hours so first factor is when they open the door the heat pit was like wow it was like hot like really like intense insanely hot then there was everything had been so there was low i'm five foot ten so it was just at the top of my head so there was low lying um smoke and then this pungent smell of all this food added to that with all like kitchen white chrome black it was just an intensive place to start clearing through and and and potentially meet meet the terrorists but we cleared through the kitchen and there was no one there that's led in down into the basement area so the basement was like a rat run like a rat so there's open there's like an open courtyard and then connected to it was like a rat run and then one of the runs ran all the way down so i was number one i punched into the uh down the corridor straight out and i went took a left with one other and as and then there was like a delivery office and i went and cleared into the delivery office with another guy at the same time so when as we're moving sorry as we're moving and then three others within the corridor as we're moving down the corridor to a terrorist stepped out around the corner and like fired a long burst of automatic fire miraculously didn't hit any of the three operators they spun around the terrorist went behind cover fired a quick volley and then ran back to the uh to the entry point i was i was in the um office was one of the uh there was a bit of a exchange of like loose exchange guys firing and then I could hear the terrorist firing because it was on automatic.

4:19:41And I leaned out of the office, saw the muzzle flash and just like sent five rounds just to the left of the muzzle flash and then went in. Didn't know at that time that I'd hit him or not, but it seemed to me like, okay, that makes sense. At that point, after the shot, then guys come out of the entry point, which was the indication because they'd seen what happened. So they'd seen me hit him. so I'm just like I'm not sure if I did so they run past me and they're like oh so so then me and the other guy tag on behind we go into the courtyard and then to go look right down to the other into the other the court like parallel corridor and it's like a rat run as we run into the other corridor so there's about there's four plus like me plus three so that's as we run into the corridor we move a bit further down and all of a sudden a grenade comes, lands at our feet, detonates.

4:20:38Shit. And when I say at our feet, it's about the distance between me to you away. Detonates. None of us pick anything up from it. And then there's a burst of automatic fire in this little funnel and none of us get hit. Nothing? No shrapnel? Nothing. It's like nothing, no shrapnel. He's firing a burst of automatic fire. And we're kind of, not massed together, but there's not much room. The width, incidentally, is about the width of this platform. So what's that about? Five yards. Five, six feet. Five yards or something, yeah. The width? Yeah. About five yards. Six, seven feet, maybe? About, yeah, seven feet.

4:21:18About three yards. So it's that sort of basement type feel to it. None of us pick anything up. So we quickly push. When we say push to the outside back in the courtyard, this is only, again, two or three feet. So we push out, and then there's an exchange of fire. The terrorist had positioned himself behind these glass doors and he'd left the gap. And his MO was he could send a grenade through it and fire through the gap. But this glass could stop five, five, six bullets. And he knew it. And the reason why I know that he knew that I know it could stop the bullets is because when we'd fire, it hit the glass and he was behind it going like that.

4:21:57Are you serious? Bearing in mind, it's a two-way range, so we weren't hanging around there looking and firing it was just quick fire and it went and it went on for for a while when i say a while it went pretty like but it's going we're trying to in hindsight now i know that sheer weight of fire would have compromised that glass but like i said wasn't too sure and it was a two-way range so again every time we're exposing we're putting ourselves out so it was just a quick shot shot and falling um recce squad guys were firing i was firing now and again, pushing back, trying to get information about what's going on.

4:22:33And then at some point, they bring down a shotgun and fire some CS rounds down the corridor. I didn't know they did that. I said, what are you doing firing the shotgun? And they went, oh, I'm trying to breach it. And I was like, I don't understand that. And then my eyes were streaming. And I thought, oh, I need to add a bit of information that I've missed out. When we breach into the corridor, it's another unusual operating environment because in the corridor, all the lights had been compromised by grenade detonation. So all the lights were out and the only ambient light was from the courtyard.

4:23:09And all the pipes overhead had been compromised. So hot water was pouring from the ceiling. So when I breached into the corridor, and because it was hot water, there was steam coming off from the floor. so this ankle deep water of hot water slip me coming on burning the top of my head as it was coming down they all had helmets on still and that was by burning my head as i was into the corridor so again it's an unusual operating area but back down to we're having this volley but i i didn't know that they were firing cs rounds and my eyes started screaming streaming and i just thought oh maybe it's chlorinated water so i just thought that was chlorine but it was css and i i kind of because the fact that they didn't put anything over their mouth i think maybe he didn't know it was the cs rounds but it was fine but then we're like hey we've got to get through that and then then it came up in conversation that they had a uh an m72 law up in the vehicles and i said and i was joking saying go and get the bazooka and that because i was like laughing and i was and I went you know the law go and get a bazooka and uh and they went because I was like yeah let's get this down and just fire that down in the down the corridor not sure distance would it would have been armed or it could have detonated gas or whatever but I was like hey just bring it my point of them was bring it down if we need it we'll use it so they went to get it as as the bazooka turned up um there's a bit of one of the Kenyan shot and he went he's hit he's hit so he'd compromised the glass terrorists went but the same thing again I was right on the edge and I went to step out but everyone just ran out and just fired as it was the terrorists had fallen behind a lot of covers so everyone they were firing pretty much into nothing as in there was they couldn't see but everyone was firing so I was like I couldn't step out because I was like but the same thing happened I was like okay stop firing and they all started singing and dancing and I was like come on let's go so I went down the corridor again couldn't see where the terrace because he's done by cover credit to him next thing grenade comes up gets flown over some boxes lands not far from us he fires a burst of automatic fire but none of it is into the roof that detonates we don't get hit but i go right let's come on so we go back out i said two men stay here cover it even though they can't see him and then we move back round as I moved past the guys who were holding the entry point, I was number five in the stack.

4:25:45Not about, I was number five. And as we come round, we see the blood on the wall where I'd hit the guy, like when I aimed left of the, as I'm looking at it, left of the muzzle flash. Shut up to the wall. So I'm like shot, bub, bub, and there was blood and splatter away, hit the wall, like pushed back or fell against the wall and slid down it. And then as we got round, again, there was a, everyone's on torchlight now on weapon lights. and I'm moving and then it was like

4:26:16and all I got then I had the magic words they're dead they're dead and the two guys like bled out like they both like bled out or died the one and then I was just saying make sure they're dead just hey don't assume it make sure they're dead because it might be risk or whatever so just a Kenyan Wreck-East squad I just made sure they were dead, as in checked that they were still alive. Sorry, checked that they weren't still alive. So they made sure. I said, oh, just walk away from them. Are they dead? And I said, but bear in mind risk of suicide, detonations. And they just got, yeah. And then so that's that.

4:26:56I went, all right, came over, clear and secure. So I get my phone out to take mug shots, and the guys are literally pulling me away. And that goes, hey, I need to get mug shots for everyone. so I'm taking the mug shots of these two guys who've been taken down and they're like pulling me and then that's clear and secure by the time we get to the foyer which being conservative three minutes by the time we get back there the whole of the command element entourage of the Kenyan police is already there and we'll just wait and turn to us and say, OK, they say something in Swahili, and then they say in English, we just want to thank Mr.

4:27:40Chris, who's from the British SAS. We want to thank him for everything that he did for us tonight, or everything that he did that night and led us. And without him, it wouldn't have been possible. All they had given me a chuck up, which I was surprised. It would happen, but they were like, thank you. And they said, oh, do you want... And then the boss man was like, do you want to say anything? I turned to all the guys and went, it's been an absolute honour working with you guys throughout the night, but don't ever forget what we all did for Kenya today. And with that, they all cheered, and then they got in their vehicles and drove off.

4:28:20Meanwhile, the manager of the hotel had a list of papers, and all these people are still unaccounted for, can you go and find them? so I took the list and then I back cleared the hotel so I went up to the top floor just went in every corridor I didn't go in every room I was trying the corridors going security forces the building is secure if you're hiding come out no one came out but I was just like going going through and the problem with that what what happens there in these incidences someone terrorist attack happens or incident happens they phone their wife or husband say oh there's a And then they escape.

4:28:59So the wife husband next of kin tells the authorities they're in the hotel. They escape, then tell the husband, oh, I've got out. But then said family then forgets to tell the authorities that they're out. So that was why they thought there was a lot more people still in the hotel. And there were some people still hiding that were discovered, in some cases, days later. But I did the back clear and I was like, And then when the Kenyan police turned up and the US FBI turned up to help with the investigation, I then went round as a scene of crimes officer saying, OK, this is, went through each, put the terrorists at the top.

4:29:41OK, he died here. He was coming down here. He got shot from over here by this. This is why we shot him. So I went through all the legal stuff with them about how and where they were all shot. and then in the basement. They kind of didn't want to get their feet wet, so I just gave them an outline of what happened and they were happy with that. And then I went home. And then I hung around for a bit. That came out really joddy. Hung around for a bit. I hung around for a bit. And I met the owners of the hotel and their staff and they were very helpful. Some friendly faces turned up, talked to them.

4:30:21And then eventually, so it's coming up over past lunchtime now, on the 16th, I then say, right, there's nothing more I can do here. No one, and check with FBI and other people, don't need me anymore. No, okay. And I just walked up back to the way I'd parked my car, my truck, and hoped it would still be there. And miraculously, it still was. That was on my mind end. But one of the, another touching moment was as I was walking out, Now, incidentally, just before this moment, I was thinking, may God bless you many times this day. I was thinking of those words. You already thought about that. And as I was coming to the gatehouse, there was a young Kenyan police officer.

4:31:03And he came up and he grabbed my arm and he went, sir, I just want to thank you. And I was like, yeah. And he was like, I saw that you were here yesterday. And you were here till the very end. You were here for Kenya. most people they come most white most white he said most white men they turn up rescue their family rescue their friends and then go home and leave us to deal with it but you were here from the start you were here to the finish you were here for Kenya thank you and I was like thanks man I'll probably have a beer tonight and then but it was good that I wasn't why that hit hard was this was no it wasn't a diplomat it wasn't an officer This was a grunt who still was like, thank you for what you did for Kenya.

4:31:52And I got in my truck, drove home and had a cup of tea. Had a cup of tea. Yeah. Yeah. It was interesting when I got home. It was just, got home, took off my clothes and stuff, had a shower. And then I wore a kakoi, which is like a Kenyan, East African, like basically a sarong and made a cup of tea sat on the sofa and then put music on and the song that came on was searching by in excess and again it's it's a song that i'm big in excess fan but i'd never really heard that song but it was the first song that came on and I was like, and then at the same time, I had the TV on and it was images of me on Sky News pulling people out of the hotel and it kind of hit hard then.

4:32:51It was kind of emotional at that moment and then, yeah, and that's the end of that. 33 hours. 22. 33 hours awake, right? Oh, yeah, yeah. And I didn't sleep, that night I didn't sleep I went to bed a few hours later to try and sleep, and my mind was just like... And of course, by the time I woke up, or like not woke up, I maybe dozed, but I didn't really sleep. And I looked at my phone, and it was still like, this is now like 5 o 'clock in the afternoon, and there's like 100 messages, where everyone's just like messaging. and then went for dinner with some friends that night. You went to dinner?

4:33:41Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, some nice pasta, nice Italian restaurant. And then, uh... Who'd you go to dinner with? Just some friends. Some. You just went to dinner? Yeah. After 22 hours, saving 700 plus people, killed four terrorists. Yeah. Two died in a suicide bombing. Yeah. Blood an entire... I mean, what am I supposed to do? I'm just like, well, so I went to... I don't know. I don't know anybody that's been through that. Beef carpaccio, for starters, and then some puttanesca for my men. And then... What was the dinner conversation like? I was just talking about that stuff. At that conversation, I did get a phone call from the military liaison officer to the defence secretary, Minister of Defence in the UK.

4:34:38He said, can you take a call? And the Minister of Defence in the UK called and just said, just well done for what you did, blah, blah, blah. But he got his knuckles wrapped apparently for that. He got it. He was just flying by wire sort of thing. But he just said, oh, well done for what you did. Thanks for saving 700 people. And that was the first and last time anyone from the British government ever said anything to me. That's it. Other than like now saying, we're going to, we're going to, now they just want to ruin my life, but we'll get onto this in a moment. Did these people at dinner know what you just did?

4:35:15Yes. Yeah. They did. Yeah. Yeah. They were friends of mine, so. Gotcha. So they just arrived in country in response, so. Yeah. So we talked about that and talked about some stuff.

4:35:32and then uh yeah and uh how do you process that well this is so then a few days later so this was on so this is the wednesday and then on the friday i get a phone phone call from the doctor saying is he hearing all right and i said yeah i think so and he's going well actually how would you know if it's all right because you need to get back we need to do an emergency treatment we need to check your ears and then maybe do an emergency treatment because you've just had sustained gunfire and the grenade explosions going off without hair protection in close quarters. So I then got on a flight to the UK and then on the Sunday, I got there on the Sunday, so that was a Friday, I flew on the Saturday, got into London on the Monday and then went straight to Birmingham where the hospital is and the the consultant there checked my ears and was like yeah you've you one ears took a huge kicking but luckily they've got it's developed quite a lot now I don't know where it is but there's a treatment where if the if you have any hearing damage if they if they catch it within a certain time they can inject it with steroids and it's Your hearing is repaired, but it's got a very short timeline to do this.

4:36:50And it was still relatively expert. So she then took a spinal needle through my eardrum and injected my ear with steroids, which was not pleasant. But part of the thing with that was, so that was on the Sunday evening. I laid down on the, and the whole room spins because it's knocked all your balance off. and I was like, no dignity, I just laid on the floor, trying to stop the room from spinning. And then that's when it all hit me. I hadn't really slept until that moment. And then I just fell straight asleep in this deep sleep. And the consultant, she said she was looking at me sleeping on the floor, and she said it was really haunting because I was whimpering and jerking.

4:37:37I just looked like a dog sleeping and dreaming. and um uh so there's that and the other thing i said to the doctor i said doctor this is kind of embarrassing but i keep bursting into tears and i said i'm not i'm not even thinking about anything i'm not i could be listening to music or driving and nothing's happening i'm not thinking about the incident i'm not thinking about anything traumatic and all of a sudden i just can't help i just burst into tears and he he said oh that's something to do with like adrenaline dumping and He goes, you were just running, your body just must have been pushing all that out.

4:38:11It stopped now, but it went on for quite a while after the incident. How long? I would say about three months. Three months. But I wasn't all right after the incident, and I was really, like, suffering. But, you know, I needed, you get paid extra for being overseas, and I needed the money, so I didn't say anything to anyone. so I just knuckled on and and one of the and this is no criticism to my friend so my friend who was like my sergeant major at the time it was like one of my peers he was back in UK and he and he called me one day and this is like a few few months into it and he goes look look Chris I've known you for I've known you for years so I know you're all right but I've got to do these checks or you're like, are you all right?

4:39:01Are you suffering? Are you doing all right? And I was like, yeah, mate, I'm good. Just plodding along. The reality of it is I was like thinking to myself, I wanted to say I need help. I'm dying here. I need help. And I think the moral of this is, like I say, this is no, my friend who called, there's nothing against him at all because I would have done the same if it was the other way around. but from that what I've learned from that is if you are whether it be whether it be as a parent or as a friend when you ask if someone's all right make sure you can see their face because I I wager that if he'd saw my face especially if he'd been in person he would have went you're not all right you need to come home but I was just like yeah I'll just I just soldier on.

4:39:54So, yeah. But that's what a lot of people do. Shit, man.

4:40:08From a stranger on the side of the road saying, God bless you many times today, to... I mean, from that... A full-on terrorist attack by al-Shabaab. I always consider myself unlucky. 700 people. unexplainable how that grenade and those shots didn't kill you or anybody or even injure anybody around you. No shrapnel wounds, nothing. No.

4:40:36So.

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4:42:05what's it like seeing that footage now yeah i mean it was there was a lot more of it I captured some of it people were sending me like days after but we're very not long after the incident it was getting removed and removed and removed people do not want it this incident is quite a hot potato and we'll get into this why you know some of the theories why they've got such a such hatred of it and why they do not want this story to come out it's out I mean I say it as if it's a secret and they treat it like it's a secret the British government think it's a super secret operation that no one ever heard of and it was on all the front pages of all the newspapers and everything.

4:42:45It was everywhere. Everywhere. But they just don't want this. And it's not, they just don't want the story. The story's out. This is just my version of the story. That's what's crazy about it. All the information is kind of out there. Just not the real information. The detail, the real information, the true story is in this book. And it's my story. on an unsanctioned mission. It was me chipping in. It wasn't a military operation. It wasn't. And let me get this point, and we'll address this in a bit. I have never been on any podcast or any interview and talked about my service in the SAS. Never have, and I have no intention to.

4:43:36I only talk, and the only reason, and if Kenya had not happened, I wouldn't be on social media trying to put posting pictures or whatever trying to make a name for myself Because that's not me The reason why I'm on social media is because this kind of forced me into that This pushed me into the public So I don't talk about SAS operations I don't talk about anything and never will talk about At this point never will talk about any SAS operations I haven't even talked about selection Which is fine because I think it's not my story to tell. But this is my story to tell, and the whole world saw it.

4:44:16But it doesn't sit well with certain people and you could say the establishment. Why? Why doesn't it sit well? I mean, they had one of their own, saved 700 people. Right. So here's the thing. Take the Kenyan Special Forces under their wing. Yeah. To help them save the day. There's a lot of strands to this. Kenya's saying thank you. Yeah. Or at least the people that you worked with. Yeah. And the police chief. I met someone from the DRC. Secretary of Defense or whatever the equivalent in the UK is thanking you. And then I met someone from the DRC a few months back, the Democratic Republic of the Congo.

4:45:06and he met me, obviously he's of a senior position. When he met me in Washington, D.C., he started crying and was like, you are the most famous white man in Africa. And I was like, and he FaceTimed his mother and she was on the, he goes, can I talk to my mother and he put it there and she started crying. Because it's like that guy said to me, He goes, you stepped, you didn't see colour. You didn't see anything. I just helped the innocent. And I didn't go, I'm just here for my white friends and family and then everyone else can go fuck themselves. Didn't matter. I'm not here for the, I'm here for everyone, Christian, Muslim, everyone.

4:45:55I'm just here to save people. If you're innocent, I'm here to help. If you're not, you better watch out. but and and that's why they a lot of like people in africa like they they they love me some don't because this is the problem that i mean we're going to go through different strands but look at it from this point of view so i heard a term in when was it 2020 the end of 2020 or like october september october 2020 i got called a white savior i never heard that so So in all the time I lived in Kenya after the incident, no one ever called me a white saviour. But ironically, it was a university-educated white woman who called me that.

4:46:40What does that mean? It means because I'm saving black people. So they couldn't do it themselves, so it took a white man to do it. That's kind of the vibe. So they're saying, oh, but it's a bit of a white saviour story. And I was like, it hit me hard because I never heard that. Never heard it from an African. Never heard a black person call me that. but that's the first time i heard it was about september october 2020 of what the oh it's a bit of a white savior story where's this person from uk but um so so look at it like this so there's all these elements there's one there's the element of there's maybe people in the military of a senior of a senior position well maybe there are i mean some of them are retired now who obviously didn't like what I did the classic line of Christian Craighead is a bad example to young soldiers his mutineer attitude promotes lawlessness in the military that's what someone said so there's that element of me not having orders going in doing it oh it could be bad so there's there's that element which is a tiny little element but that the those people are invigorated by the other stuff to then try and stop stop me stop the book but if you think about it there's this element as well there's if you think of modern hollywood tv commercials hey there's this guy did this thing oh that's a cool story what does he look like oh he's middle-aged white guy with blonde hair blue eyes and promotes christian value and supports trump it's like it's probably the worst i can hear all these blue-haired liberals kept like vomiting right now um because it doesn't that it doesn't it's a bad image and so when you when so when we're speaking like peers and people like you and people with the common sense we go this would be a great story this would be great for pr yeah for us it would be but if you think about all the people who are dictating and pushing where advertising movies and everything goes kind of not a good PR story because it's like, well, that's not what we're pushing right now.

4:48:58We need white guys to look weak and effeminate or the bad guys. We can't have them to be the heroes. That's so 1980s, 1990s. Holy shit. This is why the UK is coming after. I mean, these are theories. This is not... This is theories. But this is not me. I don't know this, but I think what I'm going through now is like maybe some of all of its parts, there may be elements of this there's the jealousy there's just it's not a good look not to mention that i'm working class didn't graduate high school so it's like so when when they're bottle feeding officers and stuff going you you lead without you soldiers can't do anything and then you say well that guy has got no education but he ended up being a sergeant major in the sas and a warrant officer for anyone who's going to pick holes, but it's a warrant officer, so it's like...

4:49:58And people in Russia love this story. People in Ukraine love this story. People in China love it. Brazil, France. Africa. Yeah, Africa. And so everyone in the world loved this story, but remember, he's just a scumbag. not a good look because it goes against everything that everyone's being fed so so there's that element could be it doesn't help there's also um the the other way of looking at it is the destruction of the ses so it's not conspiracy theory we can see that the uk is being destroyed It's being destroyed. You can't dress up. They are destroying that country. So why stop at our premier fighting force, the SAS?

4:50:48Because all they seem to promote now, they don't have any stories out. They don't want to speak highly of it, but they'll allow negative stories about these wild claims of war crimes in Afghanistan or whatever, complete bullshit, all that kind of stuff. But they want to suppress this, completely suppress it. why i'll tell you another theory because when you want to destroy something which they will it's easier when no one knows anything good that they've done so like oh we can't like and i think and we're seeing it in australia we're seeing the same the same thing same woke crazy government destroying australia from the inside allegations against the australian sas and yeah there's the footage that people saw but there's left and right of it and it's just like oh because remember if you're seeing this it means you the one you that's what they want you to see you don't see the whole story you don't see everything else um and um ben robert smith we just talked they see again trying what why they're trying to break him down because again he's a he's um he's a hero it's an element of strength so it's this feminization of the of our premier fighting forces again it's all it's all kind of woven into each other when i say about oh yeah well we don't you're not he's not he's kind of the most undiverse person we could ever ask for because of everything these things it's breaking down the strength of these units so when they just when they when they come when they want to destroy it which i'm sure they will in the future and left unless left unchecked it's easier for the public to swallow because all you've heard is bad things about them you haven't heard good things and then the the the other thing is that the picture of me running into the hotel that famous picture which is that's taken from that picture that image of me going into the the hair salon what is it what's that picture well you could look at it at the first level is it's a SES commando running into a building to clear it.

4:53:03Pretty cool picture. Everyone loves it. Okay, that's one way of looking at it. But what else is it? Well, it's also a white working-class male who seemed to have no opportunity in life, but he joined the army,

4:53:23thrived in the army, joined the Premier Fighting Force, and then saved the day. That's just such a powerful thing that one, it could be used for recruitment, but also what else is it? So let's have another. It's also a white working class male who saw evil and tyranny and decided to act when no one else will or when no one else would. So a few times that by 10, 100, 1 ,000, 1 ,000, 1 ,000, then you've got problems because then you've got revolution and I think that photograph is kind of an image of revolution and what's the worst thing that could happen or the best thing depending on how you look at it well I'll tell you what would happen we're sitting in it and through young men standing up to evil and tyranny and acting when no one else would, the greatest country on this planet was created, the United States of America.

4:54:34That's power. And people do not like that. It is very interesting to see how much of an effort they're putting into coming after you. when you when you take it into perspective i haven't talked about anything to do with sas operations this so there was a checklist when i said right i'm just going to publish it in the united states anyway firstly this book this version of this book was written in the united states of america two doesn't break the official secrets act it's got less in it than the other version of the book which was in the judicial review but even that version did not break the official secrets act so i'm a kind of a team player if it broke the official secrets act i wouldn't have released it but it but it doesn't so and all it breaks is this disclosure agreement where i said where they i could write a book saying the grass is green and the sky is blue and they could look and go we're not letting you publish that we don't have to tell you why we just don't want you to publish it so that i but it doesn't break the official secrets act and it's story about what a whole world saw which was no SAS operation is only me so it doesn't even give any any tactics because none of it was based on all the squadron doing this or or I'm doing this so it's not nothing about the SAS in there other than that I'm in it and I did selection it doesn't talk about selection I just failed it and then passed it uh but they they push it and every and And there's like, but they're trying their damnness to stop it.

4:56:12This might make some people uncomfortable, but it's the truth. There's a cherry on the top of it all. And that cherry is President Trump. Because I am a, since meeting him, I am a big supporter of President Trump. And I think that, especially for people in the UK government, is just too much. and dare I say it, I think it might have been, they might have tolerated this had I not met President Trump in 2019, no support of him later and there's a chapter in the book about me. If that wasn't in, I think they might have just let me publish it but there's that and I should, sorry, I forgot to mention the Christian element.

4:56:57It's making, this is going to, which we'll go back can't do but the president trump is i'm a supporter and i think that is just too much for some people in the uk from up top it's like no and remember this is the same government there's two things like three things now this the same government whilst i spoke for i had the privilege to speak for president trump to 120 000 people in his campaign for president for the presidency at that same time the same government who wanted to destroy my life illegally sent over a hundred i think it was 120 members of parliament to the united states to canvas for harris and you're telling me there's no bad blood i doubt it so tds runs runs runs thick runs deep and thick um but the other thing as well when when the when the shutters came down on this all those years ago in 2021 a very close friend of mine said you know i have you ever considered that forces of evil might be trying to stop this book and i hadn't given it a thought then i was still kind of reeling but now i look back and go absolutely that's what i was getting at the beginning of this.

4:58:16Forces of evil are trying to stop this book. Why? Because this is the story, like I say, of... It's a story of good versus evil. It's a story of standing up to tyranny, when no one else will. And this will... I think a lot of people, young men and women, will read this book, and it will make them look in a Bible, or make them consider their faith as well. and I think that is just something that evil cannot tolerate. Bear in mind, whilst there's an injunction going to get launched against me next week maybe in the UK, at the same time the Council of Birmingham are doing another injunction. If you put the national flag up on a lamppost, you could also get two years in prison for doing it.

4:59:03If you put a Palestinian flag or a Pakistani flag up, that's fine. But if you put the flag up of the country you're in. So sometimes when I think... I mean, they're allowing... They are turning a blind eye to...

4:59:24Islamists raping women over there. And totally ignoring it. When you hear about everything that's going on... But they'll put effort into coming after you. When I get the legal notice saying, oh, you're going to get served in America for this injunction, which kind of expected it hurts it still hurts like hell even though i'm expecting it hurts but then i look at the news and look what's going on in the uk and think what why am i even surprised they're willing to invest time on putting people putting flags up saying things on instagram um or me telling a story everyone's heard but if you if you gang rape a girl film it on your on your phone you're probably gonna get less time in prison than i would get if I went back to the UK the country's fallen another reason why they don't like it is like this is a modern story make no make no doubt about this this is Christian warriors fighting against Muslim cowards that is this book so and if anyone thinks anything else that's not true I'm getting angry but that's what this is and in the UK like everything we know it's fallen we know that we know that they they dance and skip to islam that's what they do it's a the country has fallen so having me looking as i look as i am even though i help i help other muslims i help everyone i help blacks out anyone japanese everyone the the fact that i killed islamic terrorists, it's just too much for them to bear as well.

5:00:57They will never stop. I think the whole thing comes down to good versus evil. Yeah. Same stuff we were talking about at the very beginning. Yeah. Same stuff we talk about offline. Yeah.

5:01:18I think it comes back to what's your purpose?

5:01:25You know, hopefully soon I'll be a US citizen. As a permanent resident, I mean, by the time this comes out, I could be a US citizen, who knows. But as a permanent resident, I'm protected by the Constitution, obviously I can't vote. Maybe if I vote a Democrat, I could. I think that works. but I can't vote but I'm protected by the US Constitution. This is a book that was written by me in America and it's only being published in America by an American company. So I think any attempt to stop it is one, foreign overreach and two, a breach of my First Amendment.

5:02:12but that's a job for Tim

5:02:17you know

5:02:23you know what's weird is

5:02:33this is just by coincidence All the people around me that are protecting me, for some reason, wound up being Catholic. Tim Parlatori's Catholic. Rob Luna, who does all my business and financial work, Catholic.

5:03:01Hendo, the guy that protects my family, who you know now. Catholic.

5:03:12Laura, who knows everything about me and my family. Everything. Catholic. And I didn't even know. I didn't even know any of this. Yeah. Until fairly recently.

5:03:29So I was a convert, so I became a Catholic in 2013, I believe. I became a Catholic then, which is fine, but I'm saying this to young people watching and thinking, oh, I want to explore my faith. Any Christian faith is better than no faith, find and feel. and then but the the catholic church is the is the source point is is this is the church is the church and you'd be you you you go when people are looking going where do i go just find it find a vicar find a priest explore it and then ultimately you'll find your way home whatever that looks like bible sorry find a bible yeah and then and then just let it take its course and so I'm not saying everyone, oh, you know, you should be, you know, you'll find it all out and do what works for you.

5:04:33But it's real. This is real. And if you've sat through however many hours this has been so far, and you're doubting, going, they're all just talking shit, there is no God or whatever, then maybe consider what you just watched. You know, the people that are coming after you now are even more cowardice than the ones you've fought in Kenya. Yeah. They don't even have a face. Yeah. Yeah. They just look at it. And that's what I said. A good friend of mine is very senior in the British Army. And I was hoping you could help or make them see sense. Said, this is still, you can still retrieve this. This is a good story.

5:05:10It's good PR and everything. I said, but let's look at it this way. What is success for you now? What is success for the, whether you frame it as the British government, it's really the government or Ministry of Defense. What is success? is basically just destroying my life. That's it. Buck's out. That's it. You just want to destroy my life. And I haven't broke the Official Secrets Act. I've just broken a civil disclosure agreement. But you want to destroy my life. People will be talking about this story long after I'm dusting the ground. And everyone now, and they have the opportunity to stop this because they'll say, oh, have you read the book One Man In?

5:05:55Or have you heard about the story? But hopefully everyone's bought the book, reads it, it's a bestseller. Have you read One Man In? And that story, oh, brilliant. The next words out of everyone's mouth, probably for as long as the story exists, will be, yeah, but it's a shame what the British government did to him or tried to do to him. What a great American. Yeah, he is. and they had the opportunity. And the other thing, which is kind of frustrating, is 2019, sorry, 2020, not 2019, 2020, that's when I kind of make the decision I may get out. And there's a whole lot of checklists of me getting out and coming to America and then retiring and going to America.

5:06:46And just for full disclosure, from about 2013, 14, that was when I decided to come to America. I thought, right, when I retire, I'm going to move to America. And I didn't leave the UK because of this or because of what they're doing. Even if UK was some tax haven utopia, I would still be in America. It's just coincidental timing. But I had two years left in the army and I knew that I wasn't going to do another, I knew that they would force me out after that. And maybe they could have extended, but at the time I was like, they're not. So there's a checklist. I asked very senior people, when I see me senior, senior officers, can I write the story about this book?

5:07:35Yes, just work with disclosure, which I did. If they'd said, no, you can't, whatever you do, you can't write this story, I wouldn't have went. Just like on that day, if they'd phoned me up before I'd got there and said, you cannot go in under no circumstances go in, there's a good chance I would have followed the orders and not went in. With this book, if they'd said, you cannot go in, you cannot go into the, sorry, you cannot publish a story about this under no circumstances, I would have went noted. And I would not have went down it. But they said, you can write the story. And the sad thing is, in the judicial review, which was that head job, some of these officers lied and said oh we told him he could write a book but we didn't know it was about kenya what do you so what you were happy about me writing about my life or whatever that and that and and they approved the even they approved the for the image which is not it was different to that but it was very similar um oh we didn't know it was about kenya and and and so they just backtracked but if they told me that if they'd said from the get-go you know you can't you can't tell the story i wouldn't but then you set me on this motion and the genie can't get put back in the bottle and it's like what the the the the pension if they they probably stop that soon but it's it's pins i can't even live off it so it's this thing about what am i what am i supposed to do and then so they see you can i can so i i invest all this time effort writing the book trying to do it and then and then i have to then they throw down all this legal and all you can challenge the legal it's all bully tactics you can challenge no one's ever done it so i challenge it absolute head job government and it's a cautionary tale because it's happened in the uk now of this is what happens when you get rid of jury service when you have a government no no uh no no jury and a government appointed judge and you're challenging the government so even when your legal team's going we've got this there's no way we've lost this and then they declare no no we win in favor of the government that's what happens in this Orwellian society that is the UK in Australia um and I and like and then it comes down to the whole thing of I sold I had to sell my medals I sold my medals in um what year would have been 2022 I had to because like we had the two weeks to flatten the curve and couldn't really do much in there.

5:10:04And then I've got legal fees. I've got an afterplanning thing. I don't know if I'm going to have to. I've got to pay a mortgage and things like that. And I'm like, I've got to think to the future about these legal battles. So I sold my medals to pay for my legal fees. So when you talk about a pound of flesh that the British government's got, this book has cost me personally over$130 ,000 to publish so far and that's my own money that I paid on that it's also because if I can't ever go back to the UK I'll be arrested and as it stands I'm not making money from again it's if they want to take the money off me and everything It's just like, that's what I'm saying.

5:10:55Their mission is just to destroy, not to like work or whatever we could do a regain. Yeah, it's cost me a lot. But I'm thankful because I think it's part of the plan. And it's a lesson forever. It's like the Streisand effect. If they just let the original book come out in 2021 when it was supposed to, this book is far better. It's much more streamlined. It's a fast read. It's entertaining. But if they'd let that book come out, yeah, it would have done well. It would have sold. And then it just would have been a thing. But I'll tell you something now. There's a lot more people going to buy this on the 15th than probably 10 times as many people are going to buy this on the 15th that would have if it had been sold in July 21 when it was supposed to be sold.

5:11:44And that's all because of you're trying to stop it. Everyone wants to know about this. It's going to work out, man. And when you all buy this book and read it, and you'll read it fast. Most people smash this in 24, 48 hours. It's a fast read. It's a real page-turner. When you read this book, you will finish it and go, why the hell did the British government try and stop this book? Because it's a good story. There's no... I don't talk about... There's very little negative in there at all. There's no negative at all to the British government or the military, it's like that's... People will go close it and go, why are they trying to stop this?

5:12:29And obviously, the theories and reasons I've given you already, and that's it. I think you're dead on. I think you're dead on. You're doing a good thing, man.

5:12:46You're doing a good thing, and you're a good man.

5:12:56Well, we'll see what happens. You want to end this with a prayer? Sorry? You want to end this with a prayer?

5:13:07You want me to say it? I'll say it. Oh, I can say whatever, but...

5:13:17St. Michael the Archangel, defend us in battle. be our protection against the wickedness and snares of the devil. May God rebuke him, we humbly pray. And do thou, O Prince of the heavenly hosts, by the power of God cast into hell Satan and all evil spirits who prowl about the world seeking the ruin of souls. Amen. Amen. Amen. I was going to say the same. I thought, oh, that's why I was just like, oh, if he'd said, St. Michael, I would have said it. Do you say, do you say, I notice that people do say, Prince Michael the Archangelist, defend us in the day of battle. I say defend us in battle. I say, I was taught defend us in the day of battle.

5:14:05Be our safeguard against the wickedness and snares of the devil. May God be with whom we humbly pray and do the whole Prince of the Heavenly Host by the power of God cast into hell, Satan and all evil spirits that wander the earth seeking the ruin of souls. Amen I think that's a pretty fitting prayer Especially for right now And for what we just discussed Christian It was an honor man Such an honor just to be your friend And to know you And to be able to do what we did today With you and Maylee Thank you God bless

5:14:54but so the interesting thing about well it's interesting to me about the incident is most people in the military will know that and you you've probably seen this if you do something great or good you get shit for it by from your colleagues and your peers they're like they give you oh man I can't believe you did that or you should have done this or whatever and it's all It's all with love. It's banter. But with this incident was different and it caught me off guard. And when I was back to the UK, my peers, even people who I didn't see eye to eye with in the past, they treated this incident and my actions with total reverence.

5:15:33It wasn't bad mouth. It was all just like, thanks for what you're doing. in december of 2019 i briefed not just uh my unit but support staff civilians who worked on camp everyone about the incident into my new detail far more than i ever went into detail in any of the any any any podcast i have done or will do and or in the book but i went into every detail and finished it and everyone loved it. So what is unusual is to get praise. So not only afterwards did my peers come up and praise, they actually sent me messages of praise, which is, for me, that's like totally unusual. And so unusual, I took note of all these messages because it did hit me off guard.

5:16:25Like, hit me off guard. I was like, man, this is unusual. And it wasn't disrespect to them. it meant so much to me that's why I kept the message I didn't think oh in whatever how many years, seven years time I'll go on a podcast and bring these up it was more of like man that that moved me but I saved them in my notes and forgot about them and it's only in the past few months that I came across them I was like damn because as humans we forget and what I'm trying to get to where this is leading to is the discontent of how the establishment, the senior leadership did not like what I did that day.

5:17:04So I'll get my phone out here. And I'll read some of them. I won't read all of them because some of them are just praise. But it just highlights the feeling, what guys in 2019 knew. So here we go. Well briefed, mate. It goes against the clean image and worries them that you have so much influence and reach that they can't control or manipulate for their own means. So someone from my unit messaged me that in 2019. Mate, I just want to say how proud I am to know you. Every time I hear you speak, I remember why we do what we do. You're a true iconic legend within the geezers. Geezers is like a high compliment in the SES.

5:17:51If you're a geezer, it means you're a dude. It's not like an American. so you're a true iconic legend within the geezers never change and always keep doing what you're doing

5:18:06great presentation mate you did the regiment proud fuck all those negative cunts so why that's important is it's saying that they knew that there was a whole load of negativity surrounding this and then on point so um last night a friend of mine uh within the within the sas messaged me saying how's it going and i just said to him dude the the mod uk government are trying to destroy me because that's what they're trying to do they're not trying to stop the book they're trying to destroy me and what i represent and he previously hadn't he's not in any of these messages but how on point is this? So this is less than 24 hours old.

5:18:52History tells us that people fear what they can't control. Oh sorry, history tells us that people fear who they can't control. So it's well sort of indicated within the regiment that a lot of the senior people don't like what I did or what it represents. So I just want to say, same as the previous Sean Ryan Show interview, I just want to thank everyone who's just taken the time to go through this interview and listen. And hopefully from hearing this interview and buying the book One Man In, then all I ask is your support because the establishment, so to speak, Certainly from a European point of view, do not like what I stand for and what I represent.

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