Are You Doing Skincare Wrong? What Actually Works (And What Doesn’t) | AD

0:00Welcome to the Show Likes podcast with me, Charlotte Collins. Today is the third in our very special series with Clarins talking all things beauty. And today we are talking about smart beauty, what works, what's efficient and what we all expect from our beauty routines now. I've got two of the best in the biz to talk about it with me today. I'm joined by broadcaster Sian Welby and beauty guru Alex Steiner. Welcome both.

0:30If you are a beauty fan and you've been enjoying this podcast series, why haven't you subscribed yet? Hit the subscribe button for more of our insights, advice and lots of lols. We always start our podcast from we're talking about what we're wearing. So Alex, can you just give us a run through of what you're wearing today?

0:44Sian Welby:That's going to be very bland because I'm literally black from head to toe. But with a little, I don't think we can properly see it, a little yellow T-shirt. Because I thought white, you know, let's just be a bit different. So yellow. But that's it. Black from head to toe. love it high street

1:00Charlotte:she's a high street queen because you know me I like my high street you do like your high street I'm exactly the same I'm a head to turn high street I've gone look fashion I have a scarf and then I've got jeans because comfortable and I was thinking my feet wouldn't be in shot so I've got trainers on so Sean you present Capital Breakfast Show so you are up I mean we've all been just so fascinated about the time of day that you wake up it's disgusting do you get dressed to go on the radio yeah because it's basically telly now there's cameras everywhere like being in Big Brother they're all set up and everything you say could be clipped up for socials so yeah i do think there's an extra layer of being a girl having to do your hair your makeup at like 4am gross and it is gross and so when it comes to makeup and stuff i literally want the simplest quickest option because i'm really i'm quite a lazy person in terms of like i need something that does my hair dead quick makeup like really like i'm talking 10 minutes for makeup tops um and then clothing wise like i do i try and make sure that like my top's quite nice and it could be the same jeans all week yeah because i'm just gonna be shot from there most of Do you pre-plan what you wear?

1:58Charlotte:Sometimes if I'm being organised. But luckily I've done like a proper sort of my wardrobe. So I know that tops are there, bottoms are there. I just grab. Easy. Yeah. Nice. That's similar. Do you pre-plan what you wear when you come to the office? Do you know what? The way I go to sleep at night is thinking about what I might wear the next day. So like the last thing I do before I go to bed is check the weather for the next day. Want to talk about that in a minute. Nice segue. And then I'll fall asleep just having a little think about what it is that I might want to wear. But not really. I always think like an oversized jacket like that is the go-to.

2:27Charlotte:Well, the reason we were joking about weather is because your roots are in Weather Girl. Yes. I mean, honestly, I didn't know what I was doing. It was my entry into presenting and you take the job that, you know, will get you to London. I was from the Midlands and I was like, oh my God, a full-time job in London. Yeah, what is it? They're like, Weather Girl's like, I didn't even do geography at GCSE. I stood in the wrong place for the first like three weeks. I'm not surprised. I was too far away. When I thought I was pointing at like London, I was pointing at Devon. like everything was off. The Isle of Man was missing from the map for three months.

2:58Charlotte:I didn't notice because I didn't know it was there. I wouldn't know. No, yeah. When you say that, I'm like, mm, the Isle of Man, mm, yeah, I'm there. Yeah, yeah, sure. Sorry, does one not need some sort of meteorology degree? Apparently not. You'd think so. They were a bit more loosey-goosey on Channel 5. And so I was hired almost just as a presenter, to be fair, and then I got briefed and learnt the job as I went along. I learnt a lot. It taught me how to memorise really well. And so I, yeah, definitely learnt a lot from that job. It's like backwards, isn't it? Yeah, like looking at yourself in a mirror.

3:26Like if you're pointing to the left of the map, it's actually the right of the map. Kind of.

3:30Charlotte:It's just like your mirror image is in, there's no autocue, so it's whatever the camera is, you're looking at yourself. There's no autocue, so you have to learn about all the different places. Oh, that's quite hard. What made my memory so good, though? Yeah, I was surprised.

3:40Sian Welby:I was like, okay. But isn't the weather always like the top most watched sort of segment on TV? Probably. It must be on TV. Yeah, well, it's got the eyeballs and it's clearly being watched by somebody because it got you a gig on Capitals.

3:52Charlotte:Well, yeah, and you're right, though, it's weirdly quite personal because you are talking like this down the camera. People think you're talking to them. That's where some of my more interesting followers have come from, shall we say. Do you have some diehard weather fans? Interesting. They were. They were an odd bunch, a unique bunch. Some of the nice people have stayed along and some of the slightly more kooky ones hopefully have gone along the way. I learned stock phrases. I don't know how to describe the weather. I just go, it's raining or it's wet. so you have to learn about weather fronts and this coming in from the Atlantic and high pressure and all of this but I learnt the stock things you have to say is could be, looks like, chance off right so incredibly vague basically you get yourself out of everything every complaint if you say could be looks like chance off because you've never promised anything could be sunny tomorrow, chance off, rain because then it's almost like talking about beauty products disclaimer disclaimer otherwise people would hold you accountable if I got the weather wrong and I was really precise you'd hear about it the next day especially if it's someone's wedding day or something exactly okay high pressure there she is again you're welcome we're obviously here to talk about high performing beauty and smart beauty Alex what does smart beauty mean to you?

5:05Sian Welby:I just think we're now in such a place where for many years I've been a beauty editor for 25 years since you were like 4?

5:14Charlotte:I've just turned 51 I know you did. You're ridiculous. I'm turning 51.

5:17Sian Welby:Sorry, it's on March 22nd. You're ridiculous. Next Sunday is my birthday. And I think one of the things, definitely from my perspective, what I've learned throughout my entire career is that when I started, serums barely existed. And I'm not that, I mean, I am old. But like, you know, the way everything has sort of accelerated now and we just expect more from our products, but also we see more results now. And I think that's the big shift. There was a point where like, does this really work? and the thing is yeah we are at a point now where products do work does every product work no because of course marketing has a lot to do with it as well but definitely we can expect more from our products and there are definitely ingredients and certain products and brands that promise and deliver and I think that's that's really where we're at now one of my favorite things about talking to you about beauty is your take on trends and and the the longevity of your career means that you really you can you can smell a rat with a trend right like you're you're pretty you're not one who's just going to get carried away with beauty trend are you I don't love a trend and I believe specifically in beauty of course makeup that can be a trend but in terms of skincare specifically I just think one has to be aware of trends and I think definitely when it comes to like especially your skin and looking after your skin long term that's where you need to focus it's the long term it's not the miracle that gives you something now and I think that's sometimes the thing where I struggle a little bit um because I find sometimes the quick results means it's a bit harsh on the skin and and so it's having patience that's what you gotta do that's what you gotta do except with makeup like makeup obviously that's where the instant results come and that's why we love you know a good foundation a good concealer those kind of things you know I mean you don't look like you only slept a few hours because you're wearing you know because there's quite a lot of makeup because you're wearing the right products that work for you that make you look fresh you know and i'm sure when you do your makeup i mean i'm fascinated like do you do your makeup in in like the cab in the morning in the dark like how well i'm doing i'm doing it in like

7:14Charlotte:tiptoeing out of my bedroom trying not to wake a baby shoving it on i mean you'd be horrified by

7:20Sian Welby:my methods i'm just like i think you must have it down like you must have the right you need those products that perform i agree i do have it down to about four or five key things i'm just putting

7:30Charlotte:on in a bit of a rhythm and sometimes I just shake it up a little bit because I used to be very much like a slave to the old black eyeliner flick which I still go back to um but sometimes I'm just like yeah I've really made it quite a basic look what about skincare do you squeeze that in as well I am the worst I'm so bad I go through phases of being good and then terrible without wishing to um to go straight into the product of presumably skincare makeup hybrids or where is that for you? A hundred percent because then it does the job and you're not having to overthink. I am a big one for wanting nice.

8:03Charlotte:I love that glowy look. I love like a nice moisturized, healthy glow of a face. And that's my key thing that I always try and achieve. But other than that, you know, I'll go through phases of using masks or scrubs or a three-step skincare and cleanse. And then I'll go through weeks of behaving like a teenage boy. And I'm sort of splashing water at my face and going to bed and hoping for the best.

8:25Sian Welby:Except that teenage boys nowadays will have a routine. Oh, they will. You would literally, I mean, like my nephews, I'm like, what is going on here? Like boys, when I was younger, was not that. So it's really interesting because I do think this whole idea of, you know, I need a 10-step routine. That's kind of gone out of the window a little bit in my view. Like you want those few products, but that really, really deliver. And I think that's where we're at. I wanted to ask you what's a beauty trend that you're really happy is over. Is it that multi-step routine? I think definitely like multi-step regimes also because to me that brings up the danger of mixing too many actives that maybe might not work for one.

9:04Sian Welby:Like too much. For me, my thing is always over-treating the skin and using too many strong products, I think, is what really creates long-term issues in skin. So I think when you have less products but that are really calibrated and right for you, that minimizes the chance of irritation, which I think long-term is detrimental. Can I ask you a question? Yes, you can. Yeah, I'm here to host a podcast and ask questions. So by default, if you're not somebody who's prone to like breakouts or skin irritation, what are the warning signs that something isn't working for you? Because if your skin just sort of, you know, bumbles along and it's kind of fine, how do you know if you're using too much product?

9:39Sian Welby:The one way to see if it's too much is easy. If you're a makeup wearer and makeup slips off, you know that's too much. Like that's just in terms of quantity. If you're someone who has really resistant skin, because that's something we sometimes don't talk about. Some people have more sensitized skin. Some people have more resistant skin and you can chuck anything on it and nothing will, you know, irritate it. But in that case, if you don't feel any redness, if you don't feel any like skin peeling, I mean, then you're fine. OK. You know, I mean, I would say the thing is what you don't see. And I mean, I can just see people rolling their eyes when I say this.

10:14Sian Welby:But the sun damage, honestly, is something that only comes up over time. So you might get a sunburn and go. but the real damage of it like the sun spots that's not instant that's cumulative so that's where i would say you know a sunscreen is something that it's just even if you can't see the instant result of it that's what you should be can you actually debunk something for me i have to put your spf on after all your other skincare yeah of course you mean but you don't mean first thing uh like you cleanse and you do your yeah yeah but as in i do it before my moisturizer this is the easy way spf is your last step in skincare and your first step of makeup so let's say you're doing a simple routine which is your cleansing maybe you're toning or using an exfoliating toner or a milky toner serum moisturizer spf foundation but it's for the last

11:02Charlotte:year i've been doing it the other way around which way around like spf serum foundation no not that i'm not that stupid before serum yeah well i don't understand why this has been so no one told me

11:14Sian Welby:Charlotte you have an entire beauty team including me working for you I will do a personal session but SPF goes after skincare before makeup well now I know I'm embarrassed as someone who should be doing that content for you we'll do a deep dive and I'll never do it again let's talk about confidence and the confidence that makeup and skincare and good beauty brings that's been a kind of a running team in this podcast series how much is your beauty routine

11:52Charlotte:tied into the confidence you feel day to day yeah a hundred percent it's it's all connected and you only realize that by going through years of getting it wrong or making mistakes or maybe just not appreciating how hard getting the right makeup for your look and your face is and because for years I've used different makeup artists and that didn't know me and didn't know my face and you learn what doesn't work and you were sadly for me I've only found out when I've then seen the footage and gone oh I think that's the case for so many of us yeah like I know that I can't do a really dark eye I used to have the you know the big smoky eye right up to my eyebrows my eyebrows are very dark so I just I'd look like Uncle Fester from the Addams Family or like um there's certain shades of lipstick or even lip gloss I don't that really don't suit me it's so interesting how much I've learned but when it's wrong I find it hard to even just present and be me because I'm already now thinking I look like an idiot or I feel self-conscious and I've had skin problems because of you know product irritating me and then when you're on camera and I had like contact dermatitis all over my face I was so self-conscious and it made me appreciate how good skin is taken for granted because when you've got it bad you know when you've got bad skin you just you do feel so self-conscious about it and all you do is pray for it just to look nice again and clear and you think you've done something wrong when you haven't

13:13Sian Welby:but it also it's important that people who are in the public eye speak about it and speak about their own you know because that also upsets me that when you know you talk about there's so much more transparency out there more information but it's also more misinformation and people are giving bad advice, wrong advice. And then, you know, and then I just feel so sad when people go like, oh, well, what am I doing wrong? And it's not like it's just sometimes there's just really uncontrolled advice out there. And then people get skin issues as well. And then they feel like it's their fault. And it's not.

13:44Sian Welby:It's not your fault. So, you know, I mean, you can sort it out, but it's not your fault. And that's, I think, sometimes the issue. It's so important that you raise things like that. And I think maybe with the contact dermatitis could have been also people, all these people doing makeup on you. I think it was a mixture of different brushes.

13:59Charlotte:I had to learn to wash brushes. You're not even taught that really, are you? To keep your brushes clean and be hygienic. I used to do a lot of things, touch with my face and my hands would be touching my face. They're all little things I've learned from makeup artists along the way or experts or just chatting to people about their routine. It's changed how I do everything. Not to change the subject or to take it away from beauty, but what you're saying about beauty, Alex, is exactly how I feel about fashion. because you know these things that are deemed to be superficial by so many people or on so many levels like actually have the biggest impact on how we feel how we present how you show up in the world how you how you evolve and you know get do better and all of those things and i and the the sort of dismissal of them can be so is so kind of reductive where actually they are so important i'd love to know from both of you what how your expectation of beauty products has changed over the years what is it that you used to want from products that now is different sean That's a good question.

14:54Charlotte:I suppose I want it to look less like I've got makeup on in a way. I think that my aim really is to look as sun-kissed and healthy as I possibly can, where I look like I've got minimal makeup. There was a phase where it really was all about contouring and it was all extreme. It was very much piled on layers and layers. And that look has actually never really suited me. Especially in TV as well, you get a lot of powder and everything was dry and matte. and I've always liked that that dewy glowy look um and so I always want that from a product I want I want like a nice warm tone on my eyes that isn't so obvious it's eyeliner and isn't so obvious it's eyeshadow and a blusher that blends in and I think maybe that's what I'd look for I think that's a

15:39Sian Welby:really good answer I relate to that Alex yeah and I mean I agree with you and I think you know products are just of of that level now that they do give you what you want so if you want more of dewy finish you can get products that do that if you want more of a matte finish you'll get like the also techniques now i mean again it's all been demystified like you can learn all the good techniques of how to use products properly that's also the other thing but definitely we are in a place now where products generally do absolutely deliver what they promise um and so they are that good like the advance i mean constantly when you know there's so many new product launch i mean more than ever like sometimes even i'm like i can't keep on top of the amount i mean that's sometimes a bit batshit crazy i'm sorry but there's a lot you know out there but the reality is that the products really development goes so fast research goes so fast so much money goes into research that every time i see a new something a new foundation i'm like oh i want to try that one and see if that's better than the one before and you know now you're like damn like there really are so much better and the the textures are better the finishes are better so yeah products do work but you just have to find ones that work for you okay we've obviously got to talk about the foundation you've led us beautifully on to the double serum foundation from clarins so i know you're a massive fan i know you're wearing it today so can you just tell us a bit about why you like it so much first of all i think you know when it comes to clarins there are just some brands out there that you know you can trust because they've got proven track record you know like there are so many new things launching constantly that you're like well but when you have a brand that consistently delivers on a skincare front first and then now into makeup like they've had a few years of good good makeup like the lip oils were so massive like you know and definitely a new generation found them what's great about this is that this is not just a tint was a bit of skincare like this is proper skincare also you can really this is a proper foundation so you can make it sheer which is the finish you like you know i'm looking at your skin and i can see your skin i'm not like oh she's wearing that's a nice foundation yeah looking at you thinking got your skin you know and i can't believe you've had it on since four o 'clock in the morning it probably doesn't look the best right now it does but that's the thing so this is the thing as well you can expect your product to deliver you don't have to compromise and i think with this one specifically like i i have to say like i've been blown away by it i like coverage like i like my skin to look like skin but I like coverage it's one of those things you know like and um I feel definitely that this is the most skincare rich foundation I found but that still acts like a proper foundation is it because you've got like you've literally got the double pump did you know that you can you can get more out of it like you can change the balance you know I know but it's the best and you can literally put more skincare into it or you can put less so depending and I have to say like and also I love using the brush yeah I was going to ask for your your number one foundation application tip because we're loving this brush and its shape I'm normally a thing I like to use my fingers yeah that's quite old school because I learned that way from from doing backstage reporting because all the makeup artists backstage but then I realized duh because that's just for a fashion show yeah that's not for all day I kept going like oh yeah because all the big makeup artists you know they all use their fingers yeah that's how I but it's for a show on an 18 year old model

19:00Charlotte:for 10 minutes of exposure.

19:02Sian Welby:But all the makeup artists now, especially when they do glam and I'm sure with you when they do your glam, you'll use a brush. I sometimes struggle finding a good one. This is like, they say a gua sha shape. Like it really is nice because it does grab your little contours and it's nice. Like look how it goes into the bristle and you can really like stamp it in, put less, put more on. I just, I really love it. I'm obsessed with how well you've just blended that into your hands. well it is my match that i it's your match what color is that so this is l6n which i think will be like it's a bit so charlotte and i listen you're with you're you're with the two biggest fake tan girlies great in the world i don't know what color my skin is none of my business not interested fake tan shade yeah exactly whatever matches my tan is perfect l6n is l6n what have

19:52Charlotte:you got what are you wearing so i'm m3w we're talking about different shades can you talk us through the shade matcher because they have an amazing tool on the website because it's one of

20:01Sian Welby:the most difficult things when you buy foundation online and i don't know about you but i'm i'm an online oh me too and i'm guessing medium yeah what i love about the finder specifically here so you go on the double serum product specifically and then it will you can put in your existing so an existing brand and shade of foundation you're already wearing yeah amazing no is your matte now whether that's your exact match it's just the one you like yes because i'm not one who's like you have to match like what's the shade you enjoy wearing i agree because if i went so pale i'd be like a victorian goat oh yeah if you actually match me no interest in no one wants to know my actual skin no interest it's great and but you have to go with what you like so on there you go you put in whatever the brand is whatever the shade and it brings and it it was accurate because i got l6n so it was absolutely accurate and i have to tell you the amount of times i've bought foundation online and went that's not right and that's annoying it's a waste of money because you

20:58Charlotte:can't send it back and they are expensive and you're right i've never seen a system that does that where you just go oh here's the thing i wear now what's because i'm like you i like to try new ones especially if i think it's going to give me a different look or more of a glow or whatever the thing is oh it's new and it's this is exciting i've not seen anything like that yeah it's really

21:15Sian Welby:i mean it is a real innovation in the sense that we've had found that most brands will bring out a foundation with some skincare benefit because you can't anymore not you know but this is like the amount of skincare in there is really impressive like it's actually a skincare product you still need to do you know if you're doing your your cleansing and your you know serums maybe you can if you're someone who likes to mix serums maybe you can use one less but I would say I still do my full-on skincare but then you know but it's you for me it's joy it's like some people like cooking i like doing my skincare it's like my therapy it always has been love that we all need

21:53Charlotte:your skincare i know it's ridiculous afterwards i am gonna literally like handcuff you to me yeah pen and paper yeah and then take all the notes and i will only release you when i know all

22:00Sian Welby:i love it you know and then when i'm when i'm in the office and people like what alex would someone ask my opinion on beauty i'm literally like like i love it so much i really because it's brought me a lot in my life that's personally as well you know because when you're talking about confidence as well i haven't always been the most confident person but i've always had confidence in looking after myself and looking after my skin and you know being in my 50s i i can see that it's paid off for myself because i'm happy in my skin and with my skin and i think that's also but anyway let's not get too philadelphia please go by me that in my 50s i'm my skin is like yours let's start using spf in the right step one um i want to know well you know we're here to talk about smart beauty so in terms of those really the things that you couldn't live without the really effective things that you always have on you sean what are they if you could put three

22:54Charlotte:products well again it goes back to i think if my skin feels even and i agree with what you're saying alex i don't necessarily want it to be so covered that it looks like foundation but i want coverage in terms of it looking even and feeling confident so i've always got a good foundation if all I can put on in the morning is a good foundation and then one of these little quick tips that I've just started doing is someone once told me to use a bronzer as an eyeshadow and I think that's what I do stop it well there we go and that changed my life actually because then that's quick so I just I get the thing I put a bit of bronzer on because it's the right kind of browns that I like and then I can use it as a blusher or a bit of bronzer on and then it just I do think you have to have a fairly decent mascara but it's about the brush for me and I always look for a nice brush and because then I don't ever have to curl my eyelashes or really have fake eyelashes.

23:44Charlotte:I don't do that. I can't be bothered with that. They're not using those contraptions still. People swear by them. I'm so scared of them. No, like you know what you're talking about. I just don't. I just find it very scary. I like catching my eye in it.