How Pochettino convinced USA they can win the World Cup

0:02This is a global production. Everybody needs to know about Mauricio Pochettino. He very much believes in the universe. This is the first ever Spanish-speaking South American immigrant that's taken over this team. It's not the strategy, it's not the tactics, it is the belief.

0:18Gabby:Kurt Russell could probably paint Pochettino as well, actually. Wouldn't kick him out of bed for eating crisps, but he is a handsome older man now. You know, for me, as a sport, it's bigger than the money, you know. The thing is with wild cards, no one deserves it, no one doesn't deserve it. And Serena, what she's done for the sport, has obviously been incredible. But that's another case of headlines, I think.

0:36Brad Friedel:The US player is a little bit more insecure than the settled Argentinian player and the settled Brazilian player. This is a United States men's national team. Truly believes we can go all the way.

0:55Hello, Mark.

0:56Gabby:Welcome to the Sports Agents, Gabby. Isn't it first? Yeah, I'm just excited to see you because you're actually at the World Cup. So I'm thrilled for you. I am. I am. I have a week in America at the moment. So I've been to one game. I went to the England game against Ghana, which is probably the worst game of the tournament so far. I'm going to Germany, Ecuador later, which is here in, well, New Jersey. and that life, which is huge for Scotland. Today's show, we are going to be focusing a little bit on underdogs, aren't we? Because I think we can probably add Scotland into this mix. We'll get into what they have got to hope everybody else does to stay in this World Cup.

1:38We're going to be talking to Marcus Willis, who had his moments on centre-court in 2016 with Roger Federer after he was a wildcard entry. But what it takes for those wildcards who are this week trying to qualify for Wimbledon at Roehampton and get into the main draw. and we're going to talk to him. We're also talking about Poch and the US men's team's belief that they can go all the way to the final, which would be a movie in years to come if they could get themselves there. And it is based actually, this belief or this narrative is based on what happened to the US men's Olympic ice hockey team back in 1980, which did become a movie with Kurt Russell because they were the underdogs, massive underdogs against the Soviet Union.

2:21Gabby:Kurt Russell could probably play Pochettino as well actually with the sort of maybe back then but have you seen him lately no no i haven't seen don't get me wrong i wouldn't kick him out of bed for eating crisps but he is he is a handsome older man now i feel whereas potch is still i think you know in his early 50s isn't he i think he wants maybe somebody more i don't know um who are we going to go for russell no not russell crow well actually maybe yes maybe russell crow because he's i'm loving his we did discuss this on there I know, Wayne's obsessed Yeah, his sartorial kind of presence in this World Cup has elevated him, I think, beyond other coaches Listen, we're not talking fashion It's the flowing locks though as well, isn't it?

3:03Gabby:Yeah We're used to that We're used to that He's done very well Wayne's getting quite a lot of attention, by the way for his kind of more what else we call it considered clothing appearance I mean, I don't know how to say it He's looking, I believe they say fresh I think he's looking fresh, isn't he? Of course, you were all over the Scotland-Brazil game last night, I imagine. My husband and son are there. Haven't heard from them since lunchtime yesterday. Have you not? No. The family WhatsApp group suddenly went quiet, which can only mean for me that they were having a great time, I hope.

3:41Gabby:Yes, they're drowning their sorrows, I would imagine, in Miami. me yeah it is it is obviously not uh where we want to be for scotland right now because they have left themselves with this horrible few days where they are in limbo waiting for results to come in from other teams and hoping that lots of countries around the world can do them a favor yeah and the uh virtually everything i read every uh website and uh stats based company that offers percentages has it somewhere between 45 and 55 really of them of them getting through so it's 50 50 isn't it so they're seventh out of eight teams currently right so they've only got a place to drop so they can only allow one permutation to kind of go wrong for them so um so in group d australia are playing paraguay and the loser will end on three points and a draw will leave both on for so what we want there if you're scotland is australia to smash paraguay yeah yeah can i can i come in at the start of this then now because because what you have just mentioned is the real is the real issue here which is which is to go back 40 odd years fifa had a massive problem with a game in 82 didn't they west germany and austria and they basically contrived to knock algeria out is is the theory because the games didn't kick off at the same time then now fifa have created this problem for themselves again because the third place issue obviously not everybody can kick off at the same time so australia and paraguay both know if they draw they both end up on four points they both go through and job done and look i appreciate that within that teams might be looking well actually we'd rather win this and not finish third so that we play argentina so we don't have to go to Mexico City but equally there is that element well look you know we both know we're through if we don't actually go full throttle and take a draw and there are an example of that and that's the example of that and there are a couple of those so it is it is a crap utterly crap way to sort out to have the only way you can make this better is to increase the tournament further or reduce it back to what it was they're not going back we know that I mean they're never going to rein anything in are they FIFA and that might include drinks breaks but they are definitely I think that the noise is growing around 64 teams well yeah Martin Samuel wrote a piece on it and I saw him in reception uh of the hotel in Boston a couple of days ago and I know I sort of mentioned his columns lock but they do make me think I don't always agree with them but they really do make me think and you read the headline FIFA have to go to 64 you think oh my god do they really do they're it and you then you read the thinking behind it and and would it would it the daft thing with it is would it make it bigger i mean it would make it bigger in the number of teams but actually you'd probably have more games on the same day it would make it more difficult to cover i think or or less you wouldn't have any more rounds because you wouldn't have any more round you've got the certainty of being in the top two basically is what no team no team would play more games than they're playing now and you would go back to the top two i i think it'll probably come not for the next one but i think it will come anyhow back to your permutations sorry oh we can take it a day at a time one one game one game and one day at a time because it bites by tomorrow evening it could all be over but but the the the yes and the but the interesting or not the interesting but the the difficult thing for scotland fans is i was sitting in a bar last night watching the last two games, the Mexico game and the South Korea-South Africa game.

7:33Gabby:And with 15 minutes to go, that was all looking fine. It was looking as though Czech Republic and South Africa wouldn't get into a third place. And then South Africa score a late goal, jump into second place in that group, bump South Korea down into third. South Korea have got a better goal difference than Scotland. So South Korea are now head of Scotland. It wasn't a good day for Scotland yesterday because not only did they lose, but the other two groups produce third place teams now with better records than scotland so the three completed groups they are third of the well they've dropped down haven't they after that result from second to seventh which is a mighty fall but there is a question going around really that actually does scotland deserve to scrape through if they've only scored one goal in this world cup and and as a scrappy-ish performance against i think i one of the players and there were a lot of interviews last night so i can't remember it may have been andy roberton but sort of alluded to something similar i think at the moment which is um which is that's one that's one win against haiti and and in terms of a of a tournament is that is that enough to get through to the the knockout rounds is that how is that how a tournament should work i don't think he said it quite like that and it may not have been him but somebody did bring it up last night and you know one win against Haiti, 1-0.

8:52Gabby:Is that what you want from a tournament? Nothing against Scotland. Is that what you want from a tournament? As brilliant as their fans have been and as amazing a presence kind of globally they've managed to land on social media, it ain't all about that, is it? So, yeah. But I have to say, swinging back the other way, of course, this household in particular, we'll be hoping that somehow miracles happen. If you ever hear from them. yeah they've gone missing on the family whatsapp group so the last picture posted was about seven hours before kickoff in their shirts looking really kind of pumped up and hopeful that was it never never to be heard from i mean we're talking now kind of the next day aren't we nearly i know they'll be asleep somewhere hopefully their hotel who knows traffic codes on the head met some nice brazilians decided to spend the night partying with them there was only one message actually that landed which Ruben obviously didn't realize he put on the group chat which was dad these Brazilians are getting really loud could you come back and I was like oh what's going on that was the only one so I don't know where these Brazilians were so I'm giving a lot away here behind the curtain well wait can't wait for the next episode of the sports agents to find we need we need the uh now there is a growing belief in the UN's men's national team camp that they could do something very special at this world cup so

10:17Brad Friedel:where does that belief come from 11 seconds you've got 10 seconds the countdown going on right now

10:32well that was the last few seconds of the miracle on ice one of sport's great underdog stories and And it's a piece of US sports history that Maurizio Pochettino has apparently fallen in love with and cried watching the movie of that, as we discussed Kurt Russell playing the lead in that. And this is what he's using to inspire the men's team, that they can go all the way.

10:54Gabby:So let's talk to Luis Miguel Echegare, journalist at CBS, ESPN and Fox, and Brad Friedel, former US and Aston Villa goalkeeper, amongst others. Luis Miguel, tell us what the Miracle on Ice was and why it should be so inspiring. Well, Chapras, the Miracle on Ice story is one that lives in eternity here in the United States. It's during the 1980 Winter Olympics in Lake Placid in New York, and it was played between the hosting nation, the United States, and the Soviet Union back then, back in 1980. and it was during the medal round. So it wasn't the final gold medal win. It was during the medal round of the men's ice hockey tournament.

11:39And this was about an American side that was essentially an amateurish side made up of university college players going up against the giant, the Godzilla that was the Soviet unit at that time. So very much, you know, imagine the mighty ducks in real life, right? And this was basically what it was. And it was a tremendous, heroic performance where the U.S. won that game. That took them, obviously, to the gold medal game. And I believe that was against defeating Finland 4-2 in their final. Well, the Soviet Union, even though claimed the silver medal, it was really about the fact that the U.S. defeated a giant just like the Soviet Union.

12:23And at that time, when the US won Al Michaels for ABC at that time, as the game finished, he screamed, do you believe in miracles? Yes. And that basically concluded the victory. It was a remarkable David against Goliath victory for the US. And this unsurprisingly maybe wasn't a film that Maurizio Pochettino knew about, was it? He was directed towards this story by a US soccer sponsor, Scott Godwin, who said, you've got to see this film. Yes, he was just inspired by it, obviously. And, you know, we also, you know, for those who don't know, there was a movie by Disney called Miracle that, you know, that essentially tells the whole story.

13:10And Pochettino, Mauricio Pochettino watched it. And look, there's a thing, Gabby and Chappers and Brad, that everybody needs to know about Mauricio Pochettino. He very much believes in the universe and how the energy of the universe can help you become an optimist, a positive human being, somebody that really can just do anything. And so when he watches Miracle on Eyes and he watches this story, to him, that's speaking to everything that he speaks about. That's why his ethos throughout this entire whole process has been belief, work, compete. Belief, work, compete. And he has established this ethos, this mentality, this philosophical and strategical, you know, way of thinking to the American side.

13:55And obviously, Miracle on Eyes is the perfect example of doing this.

13:59Gabby:He also, Brad, used the line from the coach in the film, Herb Brooks, I'm not looking for the best players, I'm looking for the right players. And I'm wondering, as a former US international, whether as the sport sort of took off over here and grew over here, the pressure on the men's national team every time they went to a tournament was just pick our best players because maybe we don't have a wider pool and maybe because that's what we need to do to establish ourselves at international level. So does that line on Pochettino's philosophy show the progress of the number of players and the types of players that are available now.

14:41Brad Friedel:It's not just that the U.S., not just the best U.S. players or perceived best U.S. players. It was also U.S. players could pick and choose their games. I mean, that goes back to in 94 when I came into the fold in 92. But back then, the big players playing in Europe could pretty much pick and choose their games they wanted to play. the marketed players could pretty much pick and choose their games. It wasn't like in other countries when the best they have to play, they want to play, they take pride in it. Mauricio is someone I know very well, as you guys do. I also, Luis Miguel, Mike Arruzzioni, Jim Craig, I was right there.

15:19Brad Friedel:I played a lot of ice hockey growing up, so I know the story very well. There you go. There you go. What Mauricio had to do, and I think I'm probably one of one pundit in the U.S. I mean, Luis Miguel, you probably saw a lot of the pundits really sticking it to Mauricio the last 18 months or so. And Choppers, I think we spoke earlier. He's going to get a team together that's going to compete. That's how he works. And he is about the universe, and he has his own nuances, of course. But he knows who will work in his system. He manages some of the biggest clubs, but he also manages some of the smaller clubs in big leagues.

15:57Brad Friedel:Espanol, Southampton did very well there. um Tottenham did made Tottenham you know just about one of the uh Giants so he knows how to bring players in that'll fit his system I think if there were I I sort of equated a little bit to Bora Milutinovic going back to 1994 because Bora Milutinovic played a player and started him in every game named Mike Sorber Mike Sorber was nowhere in anybody's probably top 50 and here he was in the team and starting every game and he did brilliant in Bora's system and he had a really strong World Cup I don't think many coaches would have brought in a Sebastian Berhalter and a Christian Roldan and and players like that I don't think there's many coaches that would have stood up and said Matt Fries is my number one um so Mauricio knows exactly what he what he wants and he will never make a decision based on what a pundit says what a media outlet says what a fan says that's not how he works he's gonna he's gonna look on the pitch see who's working hard on the pitch and then he's gonna see who acts accordingly off the pitch and those are my guys hard work determination putting together being this team with belief and and all wanting to go in the same direction only gets you so far brad though doesn't it absolutely gabby like um and we spoke we spoke earlier like we'll have a ceiling that that's who we are as the u.s and And I also said that there's no shame in that.

17:23Brad Friedel:You know, we're not a football culture over here. We don't have the best of the best in the inner city waking up and saying, I want to be a soccer player. Like, that's not how it works over here. But we have arguably the best left back in the tournament, or one of. We have a very good center back in Richards. We have very good Tyler Adams, Weston McKinney, if Christian Pulisic's fit, Baligans on form. we could cause an upset but i think it would be difficult for our team to let's just say beat a belgium then back that up by beating spain back that up by beating argentina back that up by brazil i don't think that or in france you know or england you know i don't think that's who we are but round the 16 what bosnia or algeria looks like right now as the permutations go i think we can win that we could also lose by the way but i think with with the way we're playing right now with the character in the camp, with how things look.

18:22Brad Friedel:It looks really, really positive in that game. And then we'll see who we're drawing in the round of 16.

18:26Gabby:You can only beat what's in front of you, can't you? Because there is a danger of getting carried away because two wins add to two, but it has only been Paraguay and Australia. But then at the same time, some of the football, Luis Miguel, particularly in that Paraguay game, was some of the best football at the tournament still now. I'm going to say right now, it's the best I've seen the U.S. play at the World Cup. It's that good. And yes, we can talk about, like you said, what we're seeing in front of us. We can only judge it by that. But just like Brad said, Mauricio Pochettino focuses so much on what he wants out of the players that he thinks are going to help.

19:04That the number one, the number one priority is not the strategy. It's not the tactics. It is the belief. And I know that that sounds very poetic, but it really is. Because he comes from the school of Marcelo Vielsa. He comes from the school that you should represent the culture of the town or the city that you live in. Like we saw it with Leeds United. Pochettino does exactly the same thing. He enters an environment and he says, I want this team to represent what we can be. And the United States is a country massive, full of immigrants and hard workers and people that are just searching for that American dream.

19:42And when I look at this team, that's exactly what it is. You know, as a South American myself, it doesn't leave me, by the way, to think that this is the first ever Spanish-speaking South American immigrant that's taken over this team, right? And is doing so many amazing things with this kind of squad. The other thing I want to say, by the way, is that when he entered U.S. soccer, he has said it himself. he was very naive about what he was entering because he thought that he was entering an environment where players were fighting to be part of the squad you know they were trying to work hard towards a certain mentality that is going to make them victors that wasn't the case Pochettino essentially had to break everything down in order to have what he has and just like Brad is saying look you know Matt Freeze, Berhalter, Freeman who is just wonderful like I don't think that any other manager would select those kinds of players in this situation.

20:39And it's because it begins with the ethos of believing in yourself and creating a mentality that why not us? Why not us? And that's exactly what you're seeing right now. And some of the things that Luis Miguel touches on there, Brad, the way this team looks, behaves, you know, has this support, certainly in the stadiums, this incredible support behind it. I don't know, it flies in the face of what certainly here in Europe and in the UK, we've been feeling about the US over the last few years. I don't want to start kind of going down a Trump road because we haven't seen the guy, have we? I mean, Trump's, he's really kept a low profile at this World Cup so far.

21:17Brad Friedel:Let's not go there. Let's keep him out of it. Yeah. But this, I certainly, you know, talking to people, they're just feeling a bit more positive about the US because of this team. what Luis Miguel said, the first half, there's only one in the history of the United States. I mean, I obviously didn't watch the 30s and the 50s, but in the modern history of the United States, there's only one half of football that compared to the half of football, the first half against Paraguay, and that was possibly us in 2002 against Portugal. But I still think that the Paraguay game was better because we were the aggressors and we were on the front foot and we had the possession against Portugal, we were hitting them on the counterattack, and Luis Figo and Rui Costa were keeping the ball.

22:05Brad Friedel:So it was a completely different feel. But that's the only game, Luis Miguel, that I can see that compares. And one other thing that hasn't been touched on, where Mauricio is able to get the best of his players, so whether it's Son or whether it's Kane or whether you're talking about Freeman, what he does is once you're into his inner circle, is you know that you have an ally, a friend in a compassionate way. So if you have anything that you need off the field that has nothing to do with football, you can go to him. That doesn't mean that just because he helps you with it, you're going to start.

22:42Brad Friedel:But you know that you have a real human being sitting in front of you. You don't have a dictator. You don't have someone that is going to throw you to the curb just with one bad performance. Once he creates his group, you know you have a father figure in there as well. And the young U.S. players, I think, really take to that. Because the U.S. players are a little bit more insecure than the settled Argentinian player and the settled Brazilian player. They're constantly looking for satisfaction, gratification, and stuff like that. And the other thing why this team's come together, I think, because for the last two years, and I said it earlier on this, almost every single pundit at some stage has questioned, not just tactics, they've questioned a desire to wear the shirt.

23:33Brad Friedel:They've questioned their work rate. So now I think there's a lot of players, and I coach Tyler Adams. I know Tyler really well. I know inside that will have killed him. I mean, so this team, I think all that got this team together as well.

23:48Gabby:But the final thing I would say as well, Luis Miguel, is that this is all why Pochettino was brought in, why they went for a superstar international coach with the experience to shut the noise out. Because Jesse Marsh thought he was getting the job, didn't he?

24:07Brad Friedel:That's a different can of worms, Gabby. but but to to that point though gabby jesse marsh is that kind of manager that in many you know facets and i know jesse marsh was as well obviously as brad does i i love the man i think he he i respect him hugely but what the u.s needed was a complete turnover and it's funny because in many ways the u.s uh knew what they didn't know and so when they brought in mauricio pochettino he kind of introduce them to something different. And again, it all begins with an identity of culture. And I think the U.S. was searching for that. So when Pochettino arrived, he created this.

24:47And again, I don't want to, you know, repeat myself, but it's because Pochettino comes from the school of Marcelo Yelza of coming somewhere and just shaking it like a snow globe and just saying, we're going to make this happen. And then I'll just say one more thing about this relationship right now and we don't know what's going to happen like brad said at the beginning like the u.s could lose it could win it could do whatever but what's happening right now is something that i'm seeing that again i haven't seen in a very long time and brad brings obviously the portugal game i agree you know this is a united states men's national team that truly truly believes we can go all the way now you know things can happen obviously we haven't seen them play against giants and and there are bigger obstacles coming their way.

25:33But to have that mentality now, to truly believe it and work as a cohesive unit and do the things that they're doing is truly remarkable. And it's like you said, Gabby, it's inspiring an entire nation.

25:45Brad Friedel:They're getting a little bit lucky right now as well with something else that they're already first in the group. You don't often get the opportunity to play and make a lot of changes in the game that can bring the team together as well. Just a little anecdote to it is that, you know, he's already come out and said the players that have bookings aren't going to be playing. I would assume he's going to give Turner a rolling goal. I would assume there's probably going to be seven, eight, nine changes in this game. And that's going to really help the group because it's not fun sitting there on the bench through all these games.

26:20Brad Friedel:And when everyone gets to put their foot on the field, it's going to bring the group together even more. But Brad, the mentality will stay the same. Exactly the same. they will not take their foot of the pedal. That's what I love about Poche. You saw it with Tottenham and Southampton in Espanol. He's just like, look, whoever's out there, you better kill yourself for this. And that's what I like to see. And you know what's interesting, Luis Miguel? If a player doesn't get on the field tonight, take away the third goalkeeper. But then you probably know that player's not doing everything in trainings.

26:52Brad Friedel:That's another situation that Mauricio deals with quite well.

26:57Gabby:Tough life being the third goalkeeper, isn't it, Brad? That's why I took out of that, actually. Chappers, I don't know. Yay! Hey, listen, as a lifelong Aston Villa fan, I can attest to this, by the way.