How to Run a Specialty Studio in 2026, with Searchlight President

20:56Is there a Searchlight film or television project that you have in development that you think can be a Disney theme park ride.

21:05Matt Belloni:Excluding Super Troopers, which would be amazing. No. We don't fulfill that part of the flywheel. But his point is, Josh obviously comes from that side of the business and would love that if that happened. And if it happened, it happens. We'd be thrilled for that too, but it's not the aim and it's not our place in the business. We operate on a smaller budget that has a whole lot of challenges for everybody to make movies on a smaller budget. The benefit for that is we don't have to aim for that, that we can have plenty of success commercially, culturally, in all the ways that matter without reaching a ride.

21:41If we ever made a movie that had that, it would be terrific and everybody would be thrilled. And there's no reason to say it can never happen. Who knows what, you know, we put out Fantastic Mr. Fox, like we make movies for everybody. Anything is possible.

21:57Matt Belloni:Your former co-president, David Greenbaum, now runs the live action studio at Disney. And he seems to want to do more original films. He wants the 20th, the 20th century studio to do more originals. How do you guys manage that? And what's the Searchlight movie and what's a big Disney and what's the 20th movie when you're talking about it? Because obviously you guys did the Bob Dylan movie. 20th did the Bruce Springsteen movie and it could have gotten, yours was a much bigger hit than the 20th version. It almost seems like those could have flopped or could have, not flopped, could have switched.

22:29Matt Belloni:So what's a Searchlight movie vis-a-vis 20th or Disney? I think for us, I think it's sometimes, I know it's sometimes unclear for people on the outside. For us, it tends to be really clear. And for David and I in particular, I think it's very clear. We worked together for a really long time. We have a really good sense of each other and also of our businesses. And I think in broad strokes, they're making movies at a budget that requires them to aim for everybody. That's the goal for those movies. It's more budgetary. And so they're making them at a... scale that that should that when they make a planet of the apes or when they make a predator or when they make that wears prada they're really aiming at the whole the goal is is the whole world they're trying to do more mid-budget type movies but they still are trying to reach a very very wide audience and for us we're making them at a budget that doesn't require us to reach a wide audience that requires us to reach a specific audience but in success we can reach everybody also.

23:24So in success, we can have a movie that's a hit of the same size, but our budgets don't require it. So we don't have that pressure to reach everybody. And we had already made, we were in post on the Bob Dylan movie when they looked into the, into the Springsteen movie, you know, for us doing a second rock biopic at the same time, one year after another didn't, you know, that was not, we're trying to do things that are slightly different from what we're doing. They were super excited by it. That was great. And David and I talk about these movies kind of constantly and we've never, for us, it's usually like a five minute conversation of like, this is for you or this is for us.

23:58How would you compare your taste to his? Like what are the, the, the differences in the overlaps? I would say there's, it's hard to, I would say it's very, there's a lot of overlap, but it's not the same. So we both, you know, there's, there's, it's, it's one of the reasons why I think it worked really well as partners and why it's great him doing that is we both, I think have the same sense of quality and the same taste, uh, in a general sense, But we each have different interests. We have different filmmakers who are a bit more passionate or a bit less passionate or stories that speak to us.

24:27And so it's more in the specifics that are different. His job requires what they're looking for is very different from what we're looking for. So what he makes and what I make are different. Part of that is taste, part of our businesses. Did you know that psoriatic arthritis may progress over time and could cause permanent joint damage if left untreated?

24:52Listen to what it sounds like to be a million miles away.

25:00Trimphaya gusocomab, taken by injection, is a prescription medicine for adults with active psoriatic arthritis. Serious allergic reactions, increased risk of infections or lower ability to fight them, and liver problems may occur. Before treatment, get checked for infections and tuberculosis. Tell your doctor if you have an infection, flu-like symptoms, or need a vaccine. Imagine being a million miles away. Explore the possibilities. Ask your doctor about Trimphaya. Tap this ad to see new joint data and learn more about Trimphaya, including important safety information. Gray roots entering the chat?

25:43Uninvited? Garnier's got you. Garnier Color Sensation Roo Retouch covers up to 100 % of grays in just 10 minutes. No ammonia, no mess, and the color lasts up to four weeks. It's as easy to apply as shampoo. Plus, it's vegan and cruelty-free. 10 minutes. Sensational color. Sensational price. With those savings, your next girl's night is basically free. Find your perfect match at Walmart.com or at a store near you. This episode is brought to you by the Active Cash credit card from Wells Fargo. That's a mouthful, but that's because it packs a lot in. Earn unlimited 2 % cash rewards on purchases with it, big or small.

26:22So whether it's buying tickets to the game and grabbing a coffee, it earns unlimited 2 % cash rewards on purchases. Say it with me. The Active Cash credit card from Wells Fargo. Be a two percenter. Learn more at wellsfargo.com forward slash active cash. Terms apply.

26:39Matt Belloni:When I first started covering the business, when you go to festivals, the big two distributors that filmmakers wanted their movies to go to were Searchlight and probably Weinstein. I mean, Weinstein had its own issues and stuff, but then, yeah, we don't have to talk about that. But, but there was a pecking order and Searchlight was always at the top. Then we went through this phase during the late 2010s when the streamers basically went to these festivals and gobbled up everything. And there was a real switch and you guys felt, I think a lot of pressure. It feels now that for some of these big titles, the filmmakers want theatrical and they want the lighter touch or closer touch that a specialty division can bring them.

27:26Matt Belloni:They don't want to be sucked up by the algorithm unless the money is unbelievable or they have financial pressures on the movie or something like that. And we've seen it over and over at these festivals to where it seems like Searchlight, Focus, and A24 are now the dominant distributors. Tom Quinn is going to rush the stage. He will. But he's doing smaller, a lot of smaller movies. He's doing great work, too. No sleeping on that. Nothing is near. But my point is, for a big commercial movie at a film festival, something that you think can break out, who are your top competitors? And how do you position yourself against an A24 or Focus?

28:02I think there's always been a lot of competition in our area. So there was Paramount Classics, and there was Paramount Vantage, and there was, like, the focus has always been there. There have been many, and many companies have come and gone, but there's been intense competition always in our area for the kinds of films that we do. So that is not new. Who it is changes. And certainly, A24, Neon, Focus. But we, you know, for us, everybody is competition. we're always fighting with somebody for a movie, and that is good. I think that's a better thing. I think competition is important. I think having a lot of distributors is important.

28:39I think at the end of the day, there tends to be both a financial and a kind of personal perspective point of view fit between a movie and a filmmaker and a studio, and you need that, and I think that's really crucial. And I think when it's only left to the financial, there's a bit of a risk as to whether it's the right fit or not because the releasing of movies is a very involved and complicated and actually personal process in terms of the vision of how to release it, how to connect with the audience, how to work together with the filmmakers. And you need the right fit for the right movie. And there is no one size fits all.

29:11Matt Belloni:But A24 obviously is going for more commercial, bigger movies now. Do you try to use that against them in negotiations where they got 20 movies this year, we've got five? No, you can't use anybody's reputation against them. All we can do is try to express why we think we're the right fit. We can express our passion for it, our vision for it, but we think it's the right way to reach the audience, how we would do it and who they'd be working with and try to win the day on our own merits. We can't do that by knocking somebody else. Would you say that you are all sort of competing on a level playing field when it comes to what you can offer?

29:46Or is there one of them that will always come over the top in a way that you can't? No, I think it's different movie to movie, but I think each company is also really different. So not only obviously there's personality and there's taste, but also some of those companies are U.S. only distributors, some are worldwide. We're a worldwide distributor. We try to do that on all movies. Focus often does it. They don't have to. A24 does U.S. plus some territories. It's different for each company. And so I think that is a factor. That is a differentiation, which is the way we release movies is different slightly than the way other people release movies.

30:21That us, as a part of a bigger company, we have kind of Searchlight has its own marketing team, its own distribution team, its own core team, but we interface with the broader company. We do it with Disney now. We used to do it with Fox. We release ourselves in every country that Disney releases. In most of the world, we release directly. We don't sell it off. So we don't work with foreign companies for the most part. We pretty much try to reach the audience directly ourselves. That's different from most other companies. And so we can offer a comprehensive of worldwide plan, strategy, creative plan, marketing plan, dating strategy that's aimed at connecting with the audience as opposed to other companies.

31:02And for some movies, that's a strength to have only U.S. So it just depends on movie to movie. But for us, we believe that being involved in the world and being able to have one plan and one group of people that are working kind of hand-in-hand for the entire world is better than trying to coordinate a whole bunch of different people who have different points of view and different things that they're working on.

31:23Matt Belloni:By the way, Poor Things would be the best Disney ride.

31:29Matt Belloni:Sorry, how do you get that? It's a movie I love. And made a lot of money. Has Josh Tomorrow seen Poor Things? I assume so, but I've not had that conversation with him. Because we've talked a lot about directors and people you affiliate. Who is your white whale director, someone you haven't worked with that you most want to? I mean, for me, I'm very bad with this, but I also feel like it's constantly changing and there are people like... There's a name, come on. I mean, I would love to work with Jane Campion. I'd love to work with Alfonso Cuaron. I'd love to continue working with Martin McDonough and Georgis Lanthimos, but I also love working with new filmmakers and we released Mona Fastfield's movie and we're working with Alice Birch, who's a first-time filmmaker.

32:12For me, I have a passion for filmmakers and artists and I love the ones who are established and who have really had incredible long careers. We're working with Alexander Payne for the third time right now. And I also love working with new filmmakers and discovering people and being a part of that journey, too. So for me, it is there isn't like a must have. There's like I want to make great movies with great filmmakers. And I want that in all the varieties of it.

32:35Matt Belloni:And imagine you have a relationship with certain filmmakers where you almost expect them to bring their next project to you. I think it's dangerous to expect anything of anybody. But I certainly hope there are people that I love. Our agents certainly don't agree with that. Yeah, and I think they're artists and they're going to find the right home for each movie. And so there are definitely people that I have a relationship with that I hope to work with again and I want to work with again. And we're making this our third movie with Martin McDonough. We're making our third movie with Alexander Payne.

33:04We've made three movies with Jorgos Lanthimos. There's lots and lots of filmmakers that we've done that. I want to keep working with all of them. And if some of them make movies with other competitors for whatever reason, sometimes it's because that company has a script that appeals to them. Sometimes it's the nature of the market whatever it is, I'm happy to work with them again. Alexander Payne made two great movies with us, Sideways and The Descendants, and then he made a couple movies with other people, and now he's back working with us, and we're thrilled for that. So we were talking about this a little bit backstage, but like Jesse Eisenberg, you made his last movie, huge success for him, successful for you.

33:36Why does the next movie not go to you? It's just the nature, sometimes it's the nature of the market.

33:41Matt Belloni:Agents is the answer. But that's okay. His first movie was A24, his second was us, his third is with A24, maybe his fourth will be last. Okay, that's a good answer. The market for these films, theatrical versus streaming, you've had a couple movies go direct to streaming, and how is the decision made on that? Is it simply, this movie is not commercial? Is it simply, we don't have the bandwidth to release this movie in the way that it should? No, we've never had a movie that we made with a plan for theatrical that we've released streaming. Even during COVID? No, during COVID, I mean, Nomadland was released at a time when theaters weren't open.

34:25Right. So that was a different time. We put it in some theaters. Weirdly, Nomadland was in IMAX briefly when that was the only theaters open. But that was the time when theaters weren't open. So that's a whole special case. But in general, we've never made a movie that was for streaming. I mean, that was for theatrical that was streaming. we did have a period of time where we were making movies directly and intentionally for streaming.

34:47Matt Belloni:That was the Bob Chapek, everything goes to streaming. Yes, and so we did that, and we made a bunch of movies that I love. But I think, and we had success with Fresh, with Daisy Edgar-Jones and Sebastian Stan, and Flame and Hot, and Andrew Allen's movie with Bowen Yang and Joel Kim Booster called Fire Island. but we but i think we really felt like we're we're committed to theaters and we believe that having a movie in theaters having a theatrical marketing uh campaign bringing people together to see movies in theaters as a first step is by far the most powerful it's it's it helps bring the audience in it helps make the audience excited and then there's always a life and there has always been for decades people watching movies at home and we love that too but that is a more satisfying experience for us, and we think for the filmmakers, if we can start in theaters and then come to streaming after.

35:42Matt Belloni:And you get the sense that Dana Walden shares that view. She's a TV person, she's now over film, and so that is settled. You think that, you know, you hear all the time about how theatrical is settled as the place where if you want to launch a movie, you go there. I can't speak for the industry, and I can't speak for every division. I can say that for us, theatrical is the way to go, and we believe that that doesn't preclude that streaming is an important home for it. A lot of people watch movies at home. When I was a kid, a lot of people watch movies on cable and they watch them on VHS. It's always been an important part of moviegoing is to watch movies at home, and I think that remains.

36:16But I think for us, for Searchlight, it's really key to have movies in theaters first and then to bring them to other avenues out. How have you found building up a TV division as someone who has been such a movie person for your whole career? I mean, it's been interesting. It's like a learning experience. Um, and it's a, uh, but, you know, we approach it with the same, uh, with the same way we approach the film, which is we're trying to work with great storytellers and great creators. We keep our film and TV divisions very close together. So they work very closely together. And there's a lot of overlap between the talent we work with in one place or another.

36:53And it really started from conversations that we had with filmmakers that we were making movies with who knew were really making their living in TV at the time. or doing just great work in TV. And we thought we have a relationship with this person. They want to work with us. We want to work with them. Why not keep that going in television as well? It's obviously a different medium. They're different storytellers, a different way of telling stories. That's a part that I've learned, but I'm learning, but there's great storytelling in both mediums. And great artists and many going back and forth between the two, which is exciting.

37:24Matt Belloni:Do you feel slate pressure? Like when you look at your year, do you go to a festival saying, man, we really need something for the fourth quarter. We really need, because I'm looking at your - Well, last year was for you as a relatively light year, right? Sure. You'd had a really big 2024, a couple of huge movies. And then last year, you weren't really competing at the Oscars in the same way. Did you feel like you clearly decided you didn't need to go out and get something, but was there a point in time at which you wanted to or? No, we worked really hard. I mean, we balanced our slate with both productions and acquisitions.

37:57We work really hard to be in a place where we make every movie we want to make and we buy every movie that we both want to buy and are able to. But we try not to be in a position where we have to buy anything or we have to make anything. For us, that tends to be worse than better. The problems it causes are worse than better.

38:14Matt Belloni:But that causes the P &L to swing. Yeah, and that's a challenge. And that's why we keep our company relatively small and we keep ourselves nimble. And we try to keep a pipeline really active. and we try to keep the development pipeline super active because we can control that more than we can. The acquisition market is an opportunistic market. You don't know what's going to be available. You don't know what rights are going to be available. You don't know what's going to be good or not good, and you don't know what the competition is going to be like. So we can't control that. So we also try really actively to make as many as we can because they're in our control.

38:43But we keep ourselves very flexible so that the number of movies can vary depending on what we have, and we try really hard to only buy or make or release movies that we love and believe in and we try to avoid things, you know, being in a position where we have to do something.

38:58Matt Belloni:I was looking at the slate this year. So five movies this year. You have one direct to Hulu, which is called In the Blink. No, In the Blink of an Eye. Yeah. One sequel. No, two sequels. Ready or Not 2, Super Troopers 3, Wild Horse 9, which is your awards movie, Behemoth, which is another awards movie from Tony Gilroy. is that a normal searchlight year five releases two awards movies two sequels one direct to hulu yeah i mean it's a well the the blink of an eye is a wonderful movie that was the kind of tail end of the direct streaming movie so that was something we've been working on for a long time uh and that that we're no longer doing those actively we we can do it if we found the right thing but but for us what that right thing is is unclear so we're not really doing that actively.

39:47I would say two sequels, you know, there's probably only been four or five sequels in the history of Searchlight. So that is an unusual thing for both of them to land in that moment. But it's just the nature of the creative process. They come when they come. And that's the process. We've been talking about both of them actually for quite a long time. So for us, that number is, you know, we love having five movies, six movies. Sometimes we have three, sometimes we of eight, we try to keep very flexible so that we can do the widest range of that. And we keep flexible so that we can have staff and the team ready to be able to take on movies.

40:25We don't take on movies if we feel like in any given two or three month period, we have too much. But over the course of the year, we can always find room for movies. And we try not to let any opportunities past the movies that would feel like are right for us.

40:39Matt Belloni:The horror question, because for all of the prestige and awards-oriented movies that get released by the specialty divisions, what keeps the lights on typically are the genre movies and horror. And you've done less of that than Focus or Neon or A24. What's your thinking on horror? What is a searchlight horror movie? And are you going to be moving more into that arena as we've seen these big, low-budget movies break out? I mean, we love it. We don't do many, and we've not traditionally done many, but we're interested in them. And for us, it's about finding ones that feel like any other movie we make.

41:20For us, it's the same judgment, which is, does it feel exciting? Does it feel original? Does it feel different? Do the filmmakers that we believe have something to say and can connect with an audience? And when we've done that in the past with Ready or Not or Hills of Eyes years ago or 28 Days Later, we have a movie called Monitor that will come out next year. They're all that in one form or another. So we're eager to do it just as we're eager to do other genres. And we know that the audience is there for those movies. But we have to find ones that feel right for us. Auteur horror. I mean, you know, yes, but that makes it sound like it has to be fancy.

41:55Like I think, you know, Jared Hess is an auteur who made Napoleon Dynamite. Like you can, the definition of auteur is very wide ranging. He also made the Minecraft movie. And to great success. I took a beat to let you jump in on that. To great success. He's a wonderful filmmaker. And so I think it's, I think, yes, auteur in that they're filmmakers with a vision. But that doesn't mean that it has to be kind of quote unquote fancy or it has to be highfalutin or anything like that. It can be the widest range of what that means. You know, you use the word theatricality. I think of it more as kind of an event.

42:26Your movie has to be an event if you're going to get people to leave. You have to create urgency. People have to feel urgency to go. Who are the directors that you work with that you feel like just their name being attached to it creates that urgency, and it is something people need to go to see? At the top end of the industry, we know it's Nolan and Kugler, and there's a few of those people. Do you feel like there's a deep bench of auteurs where you know you can hit a certain threshold of ticket sales if they're involved? I think there's a deep bench of auteurs that you know you're going to make something great with.

42:56where they used to have... You'd have an audience. You'd ask about the audience that's there. Well, I would say the thing is that the audience is there if you make a great movie, and if you don't make a great movie, the audience will not be there. And that's true for almost every filmmaker. There's some filmmakers who, because of their track record, you have much more confidence that regardless of the script, they're likely to make a great movie, and even if it's a very untraditional movie or a very unusual movie. And so I think there are filmmakers whose track record can give you more confidence to that.

43:25there are no safety.

43:27Matt Belloni:Wes Anderson, perfect example. You do some of his movies, focus to some of his movies. It seems like there's a model around the Wes Anderson movie where he gets his financing and then he comes and takes it to the market. And you have a certain degree of, of certainty about what you can do with those. Yeah. And those movies are super proud of, but I don't think that there's, I don't think that's a, that's based on those, on the movies. Wes Anderson, as a filmmaker making a movie, that altogether is the thing. He's an incredible filmmaker who has a really loyal following. Love his movies. Some of our greatest movies are Wes Anderson movies.

44:03I think that is an important thing. I think that's true in the industry as a whole. But I don't think it's not a mechanical calculation.

44:12Matt Belloni:It's a creative process. Your guy is a perfect example. Big hits and very small. Yeah, and I love all those movies that we've made with him and all the movies that he's made that we haven't made and some reach big audiences and some don't reach big audiences. Some are kind of aimed for big audiences. Some are aimed for smaller audiences. Ideally, the budgets are in line with that so that nobody gets hurt too bad. But that's the creative process and that's the nature of it. And no one filmmaker is, I don't think, is like, it's about, there are artists making movies and trying to connect with audiences and tell stories.

44:44And that is the process that connects with an audience. What about actors? I think that having the right actor in the right role with the right filmmaker. That's the magic. That's what we're all looking for. I don't think it's about, I think for any artist, for writers, for directors, for actors, for studios, you need the right fit. Not every movie is right for us. Not every movie do we see. That's true for all parts of this business. And so I think it's having the right fit that excites the audience as opposed to solely. Obviously, some people are more well-known. Some people automatically draw.

45:18Emma Stone. She's a Searchlight star. We love her. And when you have her in a great role, it is like nothing else. It's tremendous. Timothee Chalamet. Tremendous. How do you tell if... Those are great actors doing great work. How can you judge if there's an actor that you work with that you think can cross over and become a good director? I mean, it's not so much for us that we have a vision of we work with this actor and believe in them as a director. I would say it's more in those conversations. First of all, you get a sense when you're working with people of what's their creative point of view.

45:56And then it tends to be a conversation when they have a project that they want to make. It's not necessarily us saying you should be a director. It's more them saying. You don't think if you see someone on set or the way they're talking about it, you go. Because in sports, for example, I think you can often tell based on how someone behaves, thinks about the game, that they'd be a good manager. Yeah, sure. Sure. I have my own point of view of that. I'm encouraging of people to explore it if they're interested in exploring it. Same with writers who want to be directors, same with directors who want to be producers, same with, you know, for sure.

46:26And in those conversations, you know, ideally you're having creative conversations with people about the things that they want to do and what they dream and the stories you want to tell. And there's some people who do one thing and they have a specific vision for a movie that they want to direct. That's the one movie that's going to be the perfect thing for the director. There's other people who can do the widest range of things and, and, and both are great things. And so it's, it's, it's, it's less my vision for it. Although I definitely like meet people who I'm like, wow, that person has a big wide ranging vision and they know how to tell stories more their desires.

46:59I've also met people who I thought I met actors who I thought could be astounding directors who have just no interest in it at all. And, and so I think part of that is, and writers too. And so part of that is what do they want to do and how can we help them do it?

47:11Matt Belloni:What impresses you in a pitch? I think it's, it's storytelling, you know, on its basic level, it's storytelling. But that storytelling is, is the story itself. It's a cinematic vision. It's the collaboration with actors. It's all the pieces of it of like, you need, you know, film is a collaborative art. You need all the pieces together. So you have to have a vision for who's the right person in it. What's that going to mean? How's that going to work with that actor? what's the story, what's the way you're going to tell the story. It's not so much necessarily the plot. It tends to be all the other pieces around it.

47:45Matt Belloni:All right, we have to wrap up. I have one question. Do you want to go first and your last question? Sure, you can. I'll go first and you go second. What's the one movie that one of your competitors has this year that you're most jealous of? The Odyssey. No, for real, though. That's for real. That's for real? You're jealous of that? you were going to put me up$300 million for that movie? I'll tell you, I went to see that movie. It took me a really long time to see the movie because I could not get tickets because it was very hard to get tickets. I ended up seeing that movie at the Alex Theater in Glendale, which is a great theater.

48:17It's a theater that has not shown a movie since 1996, I think. It shows plays and musicals and concerts and all sorts of stuff. They put in 70 millimeter projection. It was a great experience. And as I came out of the theater, I saw it on a Sunday night in that theater. As I came out of the theater, the crowd around, like there was a window in the back of the projection booth, and the crowd was like six deep of people just staring at the 70mm film sitting there. It wasn't even being projected. It was just sitting there on platters. So eager to see it. And I think that's a great cinematic experience.

48:50We're going to have Wild Horse 9 at the Alex for a couple days for a special engagement in 35. I think that's a special cinematic experience. I think there's theaters all around the country that are doing that. I think that's what we want to do with audiences in theaters. All right.

49:04Matt Belloni:Scale of one to 10, 10 being most scared, one being not scared at all. I'm very scared right now. How scared are you that Josh tomorrow will wake up one day, look at his budgets, look at some of the challenge that Disney is facing, and we'll do a Thanos snap and searchlight is gone? I'm not scared at all. You're not scared at all? No. Okay. All right. Well, that's good. I think everyone here is excited, but I'm excited that you're not scared. Thank you very much. Thank you very much. Thank you all of you.

50:02to make sure there's nothing to mess with the flavors you want. Shop Whole Foods Market in store or online. Fall has never looked or tasted this good. Sweet Greens Fall Harvest Menu is back with seasonal favorites dressed to impress and made to be devoured. Warm roasted sweet potatoes, crisp apples, maple glazed Brussels, and crave worthy flavors in the Autumn Harvest Bowl, maple glazed salmon plate, and roasted bacon Brussels side. the season's most desirable menu has returned to Sweetgreen, featuring fall's best dressed. Make your move. Order on the Sweetgreen app.