Matt Walsh Responds to Demands to Disavow His Allies, and How to Resolve the Right-Wing Civil War

31:39If someone does something wrong, we punish that person, we don't kill his kids. Why do we do that? Why is that our standard? Because we believe that God created every person as an individual, and every person will stand before God alone to account for his life. He's not responsible for what his children do, what his ancestors did, what his forebears might do. He's responsible for himself because we believe in the individual soul, not the collective soul. And that's what makes our civilization unique in the history of the world. And it derives from Christianity, from the Christian belief of the individual soul.

32:09And I see all these people who clearly don't believe that. So how are we on the same side well I think I mean so this is where we we can be friends on the same side and disagree because yeah I wouldn't agree with everything you've just laid out there I think that I think now last time we talked we talked a little bit about Israel and my take at the time was I really don't care right I just don't care I honestly don't care I want that take bad yeah I don't want to care i don't want anything to do that's and that that's still my take that's always been my take it upsets people on both this is one legitimately on both sides of the israel issue people get mad at me for that because they say that well if they're very pro-israel they say well you're being a coward and you need to stand up and support israel and talk about how israel's our greatest most important ally and all this stuff and but then another side very much it's well no israel's the great satan they're the most evil country in the world right they're responsible for everything bad that happens, which is something that I think some people legitimately really do believe at some level.

33:15A lot of people believe that. Right. And so then they say to me, well, you need to stand up and say that. And again, my response to that is, first of all, don't tell me what to say. I have my own mind. Amen. So don't tell me what to say. I will say what I want to say. And I can only speak for my own opinion. This is my view. And I think, and we'll get back to it, but not to get sidetracked. This is one thing, by the way, that's making political conversation in this country impossible is that all anyone ever does anymore is impugn the motives behind the argument that you're making. So you make an argument and then everyone goes, well, you're only saying that because, Because, and it's like, first of all, even if it's true that I'm making this argument for some dishonest reason, well, is the argument right or not?

34:09Because if the argument is right, the argument's still right, even if I'm the worst guy in the world saying it. It's also like arguing with a woman. They tell you what you think. And it's like, no, I'm actually telling you what I think. I mean, what? Right. Well, here's why you're really saying that. Well, for me, the only person who can speak to your motives is you. Exactly. And so if I ask you, well, why are you saying that? And you tell me. I have no choice but to just accept that because I'm not in your mind. You're the only authority. You are the only authority of what is in your mind. You're the only one on the planet.

34:36The only other authority, the only greater authority is God, and I can't really ask him, so I can only go to you on that. You're describing my life, but yes, I agree with you. So for me, on Israel, when I say I don't care and everyone on both sides goes, well, you're saying that because, no, I'm saying that because that's what I think. I'm saying and I always have which is why by the way you can go through my catalog I've been blabbering my opinions publicly for a while now and not as you know I haven't been in the business as long as you but I've I've been you know at least 10 years on the record and if you go through that before I worked at the daily wire uh and and while I was there when I was independent I was an independent blogger just like churning out content and you know um and you can go through all that And here's what you'll find.

35:26You'll find that I almost never, ever talked about Israel. And when I did talk about it on the rare, like once every five years, if it came up, my take was, I don't really care about this. I don't care about this country. It's not my country. You know, if you're if you're in America, if you're an American politician, you should care about America first. And that's it. That's always been my take. So that's always been my take. By the way, me too, believe it or not, up until the last year, I don't in 35 years, I don't think I've talked about Israel 10 times. December's already here. I felt like it was just summer the other day.

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37:08So here's the point. It's not actually about Israel. It's about the components of the American right. Right. Who are defending mass murder. and I mean that murder, killing people who didn't do anything wrong in Gaza. That's it. It's not Israel. It's what about the parts of this coalition that, as you noted, Charlie really did keep together that are now fracturing. But one of the reasons they're fracturing is because they have different views, different worldviews. And that is obvious when you hear how they respond to the murder of kids and women in Gaza. So it's Americans responding to that. Are you really conservative, how are you not the leftist that you just described if you're like, well, they're basically all Hamas, including the kids.

37:54That is collective punishment. That's blood guilt. That's the opposite of what you described. How can I be on the same side as someone with that attitude? Well, here's what I would say. I think that if somebody is making the argument

38:09that we or Israel can kill as many Palestinians as they want, can kill children because their lives have no value, because they're Palestinian. If you're making that argument, then that is a leftist argument. Exactly. It's a leftist argument. However, however, however, I think that there are plenty of people who would defend and have defended Israel's actions in Gaza and even our involvement, which I don't agree with us being involved at all, but people have had that view, but not on that basis. What they would say is, they would say, oh, well, it's not true that they're killing children, or it's really tragic, but there's no other way to fight the war.

38:57It's not intentional. We're actually targeting the terrorists, and these are casualties that happen like in any war it's very bad you try to minimize them but it we don't we don't want that to happen um they could say you know there's many arguments along those lines just also arguments that just kind of reject the premise like your premise is that they're doing mass murder of people in gaza i think that there are conservatives who would just reject that premise and say that's not actually happening okay but if you just the i think the undisputed fact there are tens of thousands 70 000 we can certainly say tens of thousands of women and children killed in gaza And so there are really two arguments you can make.

39:33One is that like that happens in war, collateral damage, which is true. It's 100 % true that that always happens in war. It hasn't happened at this scale in 80 years in the West, but it does happen. And the United States has done a lot of it. We dropped the atom bombs, okay. So like Israel is not the only country that's done this. But are you sad about it? Do you think it's bad? Would you be willing to say holy shit? I can't believe we killed 70 ,000 non combatants That's the acid test Can you admit that that's horrible? It's horrible. It's a moral crime. It was a moral crime We dropped the bomb on Hiroshima and I'm just not even a close call in my view It's not an endorsement of the Imperial Japanese government, but it's like that's just bad if you can't say that Then you are endorsing collective punishment.

40:25Aren't you well, I think I think it goes back to what argument are you making? So like using Hiroshima, for example. And I'll be honest, I've kind of been on both sides of that. I think there's interesting arguments on both sides. I think a morally untenable argument would be, well, yeah, just kill as many as you need to. They don't matter. They were Japanese. They were the enemy. Just kill them. Like that's morally untenable, obviously. And based on that argument, well, then we could just nuke. If you get into a war, just like nuke the entire country, kill everybody, and why not? And that obviously is rejecting the value of human life, which is an unconservative view.

41:13It's also just deeply immoral. But the other side of the argument for like the atom bomb, for example, would say, well, this was the best way to preserve human life, that these were legitimate military targets, and the way to preserve human life ultimately was this way. If we had not done it, then millions more people would have died. Millions more Japanese would have died. And that's the argument. Now, like I said, I can see the argument for that. Now, that runs into the charge of ends justify the means. Well, it doesn't run into the charge. It's an expression of ends justify the means. Well, there's all, yeah, there's ends justify the means.

41:47It's like the perfect articulation of it. It's like if I could save millions by shooting your children, it's okay to shoot your children. But I think there's a difference, like there's ends justify the means. Now we're getting into philosophical, I'm not a philosopher. There's ends justify the means, there's also kind of the principle of double effect, which is different, and double effect is, well, so I understand it, you can do something that you know will have a negative effect, but your intentions are good. And you're doing it in order to bring about a good result. This was the argument that Hitler and Stalin made.

42:19if you take a look at stalin's personal correspondence and diaries which by the way are available it was super interesting he was an idealist like he really believed he was ushering in a new era of man and like you had to kill a lot of ukrainians to do that and georgians and russians by the way a lot of christians you had to murder a lot of priests to get there but by the end you would have utopia hitler felt that way it's like if we only get the jews out everything will be great and so but we are against them because we don't share that view we believe in human life like it's not okay to kill an innocent person yeah I think yeah that that argument well it's not yeah it's not okay to intentionally and deliberately kill an innocent person I think that's you know in war innocent people do die I think that there can just there are a lot of wars that have been unjust there are there is such a thing as a just war for There's such a thing as a necessary war.

43:16And if we can agree on that, then we have to accept that in any war, innocent people will die. It's a terrible tragedy. So now, but the argument that I was just playing out for dropping the atom bomb, it's true. Like that can be terribly abused. My only point is, and I'm not even taking a position on that because my honest view is like, I kind of feel like I have an opinion of it and then I express it and someone comes and they, just eviscerate my argument on it, and then I think, well, you might be right. And then I hear, so that's kind of where I'm at. These are super tough. I mean, I should just say, I hope I don't sound self-righteous.

43:53My views have changed. If you went through my corpus of opinions, it would be a Jackson Pollock painting. It would just be splashes of everything. So my views are evolving in real time. But I've been forced to think about it because of what's happening in Gaza. It's like I don't feel like I have a choice. My point about that is, whatever is the correct view, let's just accept for the sake of argument like I'll take your view that dropping that bomb was morally wrong um I still think that somebody could be wrong about that but for the right reasons and so they're still kind of on my side because the the wrong if if you're correct in your argument then the the wrong for the right reasons position is yeah we we we cherish human life this was the best way ultimately to preserve human life.

44:44And again, you can say, well, that's wrong, but someone could have that view and the reason why they have it is because they truly believe in the sanctity of human life and they just honestly believe that that was the best way to preserve it. That was my opinion until recently as a lifelong adamant pro-lifer. So I mean, I want to give myself the benefit of the doubt. You know, I'm not for dead kids. I guess what has really brought this to the fore is a guy called Randy Fine, who's a congressman from Florida who I disagree with on a lot. I don't think I disagree with him on anything, actually. He spent his career in the gambling business, exploiting people, and now he got some kind of clever way to find a house seat in Florida.

45:25Everything about it I disapprove of, and of course, I don't like his foreign policy views, but there are a lot of people like that, and I'm not mad at them. What makes him unusual is that he said out loud what I think a lot of people think, which is like it's hilarious to see a picture of a dead child in gaza somebody tweeted him i know you're online you've seen this a picture of a dead baby in gaza and he laughed at it and said someone said how can you sleep at night you know getting self-righteous with him okay being high handed like the anti-war left is how can you sleep but okay so i get it they're annoying but like it is like his response was very well thank you thanks for the pick if that's your gut reaction to a picture of a dead baby we are not on the same side in any way on the deepest level we're not on the same side i'm a father like i'm not how can i laugh at that i can't and that to me revealed what i think a lot of people think who i know very well who call themselves conservatives which is just like these are not human beings well if you've got that attitude how can you how can you really care about me or my country or my children like I don't think you can.

46:31Yeah, I think that I certainly would agree with you on that. If you think that dead kids are funny, then we're not just on the same side, but this goes back to I don't think we're living in the same universe. You're the leftists that you described. Yeah, because you fundamentally cannot value human life if you could ever see it as funny that a child was dead. I think. So for sure. And I think that there are people that we would call neocons that are definitely not conservative by any stretch. My only point to you is that I think there are plenty of people who are on the other side of the argument who are conservative and they just don't agree with the premise that you're laying out.

47:11They don't – and they do want to preserve human life. They think this is the way to do it. They could be wrong, but people can be wrong about things. Or they haven't thought about it or the partisan system – I'll speak for myself. I didn't think about it at all, and all the people getting mad about Hiroshima hated America. It was just a fact, and they wanted to say that all American military expeditions were immoral, because America was fundamentally immoral. That's the point they were making. They wanted us to hate ourselves. They taught us a history that convinced our kids to hate themselves and to hate their own country.

47:44And that's all evil, and we're watching the results of it now. So I was like, man, there's no way I'm on their side. Like, they hate everything that I love, including my nation. So I just was like, if you're for it, I'm not for it. and because I'm a child that way, like I just react against things. But now I'm feeling like I got misled into supporting an awful lot of violence, like a lot of violence. And how is that good? Yeah, I think, well, so there's two things. First of all, maybe there's a whole other category we should be talking about because we're talking about, oh, left, right, conservative, liberal.

48:21Then you also have, though, politicians who often, not always, but often are neither, and they don't have an ideology. For sure. And their ideology is control and power, and that's what they care about. What percentage would you say fall into that category?

48:4395%. It feels that way, doesn't it? Well, I'll amend that. I think it used to be 95 % I want control and power. I think now it's more like, and this is even worse, now it's like 70 % want control and power and then you've got another 20 % who they're just there because they want attention like the Jasmine Crockett's right they're just there because they want to be influencers like Jasmine Crockett I'm so grateful for her she amuses me every day but if you were to go to Jasmine Crockett and say okay here's two buttons press one button and you're the president United States press the other button and you have 50 million Instagram followers and you're an Instagram, she is pressing the Instagram button in a second.

49:24Oh, Tom, 100%. But that's a different species of politician we've never really seen before. Yeah, no, it's so true. Because up to this point, every single politician, like, I can be president? I'll take that over. If it's like, I'll press this button, you can be president, but as a consequence, your whole family dies. They're pressing the button. Oh, yeah. A lot of these people. And now it's a little bit, there are people who, they're politicians, they're not even really hungry for power they just want attention which i think in some ways is somehow even worse but anyway the the the just want power category i think that does describe a lot of the people we would call like neocons lindsey graham yeah is for sure in this category you know i don't know where it was he gave a speech recently he was talking about uh i think it was him bragging about how we ran out of bombs or something like that i think i have the right person here yeah um and and so it's like okay well you obviously do not take human life seriously if you just think it's it's like you just want to run out of the bombs and um and and for someone like him this is not someone who's a conservative at all he does he doesn't but it's not for someone like him he doesn't i don't think that he's um passionately in favor of like abortion or no destroying the family he just doesn't care it doesn't matter right it doesn't doesn't matter to him so um so i think that's that's the other category that exists That's really smart.

50:46That's really smart. It's like post-ideological. It's even kind of post-power. It's just pure narcissism. Yeah. Although if I could, I'm actually glad you brought it up because I wanted to talk to you about this. In defense of violence, if I could, because I've heard you talk about this. And my views are, by the way, changing even during this conversation. Like this is all new to me, so I don't. Because I'm actually, I think in some ways we should have a lot more violence in society. I'm sort of pro-violence in a certain context. I think that violence can be a necessary tool for justice. I just believe that.

51:32Now, it can be really misused, and it very often is. And I think it very often is these days. but it is a necessary tool for justice and so what i'm really mostly talking about are evil people who've committed terrible crimes against the innocent and i think that through a legal means and i'm talking about you know i'm talking about extra judicial lynchings or anything i'm talking about legal means for those kinds of people we should be using violence a lot more because i think that it's just i just think that it's justice. What is justice? Justice is giving to someone what they're owed. Giving to anything.

52:15Putting things in their right place, basically, I would say is justice. So giving someone what they're owed is justice. So if you owe me$5, it's justice that you give me$5. That's a matter of justice. And if you give me$3 and you owe me$5, that's an injustice that has occurred. now if i slap your wife in front of you i'm owed something else i'm not owed five dollars but i am owed something now like there it is right that i receive something and that i would say is a slap right it's you slap my wife i'll punch you 10 times in the face instead like that's that is a just response that is justice and uh and i think what we have these days you got a lot of people walking around doing this assault like literally assaulting women you know and they don't receive what they're owed and what they're owed is is uh is harsh and i think sometimes violent but just punishment um and so that's that's my one kind of caveat you know it's hard to disagree with that um it's i mean of course viscerally i agree with you and all of this is just aimed at whites obviously because what you're talking about is a racial dynamic where non-whites who commit crimes just aren't punished as harshly as whites who commit crimes so it's a it's a racial double standard designed to like destroy the country which it's doing and and i feel that every person feels that like the need for justice and sometimes that is that expression is physical how do you balance that against like the sermon on the mount which i happen to have read this morning um where jesus is like well the law is eye for an eye tooth for a tooth but i tell you you know turn the other cheek and you know he takes your shirt give him your cloak i'll tell you because i've thought a lot about this i mean obviously hopefully all christians have thought i thought about the sermon on the mount a lot it's only the most important public address it's mind-blowing right but whenever people are like oh jesus was a great person great teacher you read that and you're like either he was god or this whole thing is insane because this is not it's not intuitive wisdom in the Sermon on the Mount.

54:19Yeah, that's the C.S. Lewis, the trilemma, lunatic liar or Lord. Those are the only options. But anyway, so yeah, of course, as all Christians should, I've thought a lot about this and how do you, because I also recognize in myself, I'm talking about how violence can be just, and I really believe that. But I also, I have a vengeful streak in me. I fully recognize that. Yeah, me too. And when I see evil people, I actually do sometimes hate them and hate means like i don't just want justice for you i want you to suffer yes and uh i want you to burn in hell and that and as christians we should never want that we should never we should never want anyone to be damned and sometimes i i find that feeling in myself i pray about it i just have to be honest that i do feel that way about really bad people um but how do you how do you square this i think that so turn the other cheek i think it's very important to notice that Jesus is saying, if someone slaps you, turn the other cheek.

55:21What he does not say is, if someone slaps your wife, or someone slaps your child, or someone slaps an innocent woman on the subway, turn the other cheek. Because turn the other cheek in that situation is not you being the bigger man, it's you being a coward. And so that's how I square it, and that's how I can also square Jesus having these kinds of, you know, the quote-unquote anti-violence statements that he made, with also, famously, he goes into the temple and fashions a whip. I mean, that's what scripture says. It's not even like he grabbed one. This was a premeditated. This was premeditated first degree.

56:05And so he fashions a whip, and he starts beating these people to get them out of the temple, and that is violent. I mean, think about, it's easy to read these stories and just read it as a story we've heard a million times. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Heard it in Sunday school as a child. It gets kind of sanitized. Well, imagine actually seeing this happen. I mean, imagine actually seeing it in real life that you're there and somebody has a whip and they are throwing down tables, beating people with whips. I mean, there's going to be blood. It's going to be a very brutal scene. In the temple of all places.

56:35Right, in the temple. And yet, this was Jesus Christ who did it. This was our Lord and Savior who did this act. And so it was and had to be a moral act. And so what that tells us is that violence is sometimes necessary. Now, the rejoinder to that is, well, that was God made flesh who used violence, and that doesn't mean that you could do it. Right. Well, there's also a theme that runs throughout the New Testament where Jesus and his disciple Paul draw a very clean distinction between you as a Christian and the state. So the state is held to a different, the state operates by a different code. Yeah.

57:21Right? Run under God what's God's, run under Caesar what's Caesar's. I don't know. I'm the opposite of a theologian. I really don't know. Except what happens when the state, and we're experiencing this right now, because I think that is kind of the answer. The state has authority from God. Now, it's hard sometimes, especially for conservatives, to accept that, but that's scriptural. The state has authority from God. Now, it can reject its mandate. It can do things that are evil, obviously, and it can do things that we should reject and in some cases even rebel against in the most extreme cases.

58:01So we know all that is true. But the state as like an institution, generally speaking, has authority. This is God ordained. This is what God wants. He doesn't want us all to live as, he doesn't want anarchy, where there's no one in charge. But so the state has that authority. What happens when the state refuses to exercise that authority? Right. And what happens when it refuses to enact justice and it refuses to protect the innocent? What happens then? You overthrow the state. Yeah. At what point morally can the average citizen say, well, the state is not doing this, and so I have no choice but to do it?

58:48If I don't do it, then it won't be done. And I think we're getting perilously close to a point where people en masse start saying that. They start saying the state is not doing this. They're not defending my family. They are not defending my community. My community is unlivable. These violent psychopaths who've been arrested 40 times are running through the street, assaulting women, assaulting children. And I cannot live this way anymore. And I won't live this way. And I think we're getting perilously close to a point where in mass people start saying that. And when they start saying that. Perilously or blessedly close?

59:18Well, perilously because that's not, I would prefer, that's not the best option. The best option is the state does its job. When the other option is ultimately chaos, I mean, that's where it leads. And that's where we are. I think right now you have, like, the best version of that are people who have benevolent intentions and know what they're doing and are good, decent people. And they step up in an extreme situation because nobody else will. and they do the thing that the state won't do, but they don't go overboard and they don't become Batman. And so like Daniel Penny, for example. I mean, Daniel Penny is an example of someone who said, okay, I got to step in.

1:00:02I got to do the right thing. This guy should not be out here. He should not be allowed on this subway. There should be some kind of cop here to arrest him. No one is doing it. I'm going to step up. And I'm glad that he did. He was right to do it. And so that's the best version. The best version of people stepping in where the state has failed. Did he get a Presidential Medal of Freedom? What happened to Daniel Penney? Well, that's a very good question. Well, they tried to throw him in prison. No, I know. It was a rhetorical question, but it's like if you see heroism like that and it goes unrewarded, in fact, if it's punished, then you have a total inversion of justice.

1:00:42So how is the state legitimate at that point? Right, and by design, when people like that are punished, I mean, they tried to put him in prison. They, thank God, were not successful. but they you know they try to destroy his life everybody else looks at that and i think by design has this demoralizing effect because everybody else looks at that and they say well i don't want that to happen and now i think i mean i don't ride the subway because i value my my life but uh if i were on the subway and i saw something like that happening i'd be thinking to myself well i hope i would step in but i'd also be thinking well i got a family at home i got a wife and if I step in and I go to prison and so so now I can't be there for my wife and children and so is it right for me to step up and protect these strangers if the consequence is now I can't protect my own wife and children that's right I don't know and I don't even know what the right answer is I don't know I can't even say for sure if I'm if I'm looking at that happening and I'm in Daniel Penny's shoes and I got a wife and children at home I think the right thing is for me to step up and do what he did but I'm not even sure if it's the right thing because because I got a wife and kids and now I got to call them I got to call my wife and say hey by the way I might be going to prison forever good luck you know I don't know it's it's it puts it it creates a lose-lose unwinnable situation even now you feel that even after the last election and clearly there's a reaction against the kind of government that we had you still would feel like no one in authority would support you and uh yeah generally i think the rot well well first of all this is a this is a i mean when we talk about the state in general failing to do the basic things to preserve civilization this is a wide problem it goes to it's the state level it's the local level cities and um has all of that been fixed like definitely not i mean not even close well so that that was That was exactly the question I'm asking, and I don't even know if I have.

1:02:42You sent out an amazing tweet recently. Oh, it's right here, December 4th. I want to read it. It's an empirical fact that basically everything in our day-to-day lives has gotten worse over the years. The quality of everything, food, clothing, entertainment, air travel, roads, traffic, infrastructure, housing, et cetera, has declined in observable ways. You're a nice writer, by the way. Thank you. There's not enough good writing on Twitter. even newer inventions search engines social media smartphones have gone downhill drastically this isn't just a random old man yells at clouds complaint it's it's true it's happening the decline can be measured everyone sees it everyone feels it meanwhile political pundits and podcast hosts speaking of things that are getting worse focus on anything and everything except these practical real life problems that actually affect our quality of life so i have like eight questions there and i'm going to ask you about your core observation is it getting worse clearly it is why are podcast hosts and pundits ignoring this physical reality

1:03:45I don't know. I think that it's a wide group of people. I think they have different motivations. I think for, well, the most obvious answer is that for a lot of these people, pundits, podcast hosts, cable news hosts, all the media in general, a lot of them, I think, are insulated from a lot of this stuff. They don't live in this world. Yeah, that's right. And things like, so for example, we're talking about things that are getting worse. one thing and it seems small but it's not one thing that's really getting worse is restaurant food okay rest the food at most restaurants i'm talking about like chain restaurants you got a applebee's or chili's or whatever you order a pizza from one of these places especially one of these chain places and the food is worse and that's not just again it's not old man i am an old man yelling at clouds but it's not what this is it is act it's it is true it's a real thing that's happening and you can trace it you can look at okay uh starting in the early 2000s all these places started getting bought up by private equity companies yeah and so now they're they're run by people who don't care about the product or even know anything about it so that's happening um also uh it used to be that you go to these places and it's a bunch of like teenagers and college kids that are working there and uh and they're just working there to make some money to pay for college or whatever.

1:05:07And that's happening less now. And now you've got adults, you know, very, it's a, an increasing number of like people with substance abuse problems, people who, you know, they're in their late twenties and they're still, you know, they're, they're doing a job that a 16 year old used to do because their life isn't working out exactly as it should. That's it's, that's its own problems. Like, why is that happening? Right. But, but the effect of that is that even a lot of the people, not, not all of them at all, but But a lot of the people in the establishments that are working there on the ground don't really care that much about the product.

1:05:40And you can see why they don't care. They're getting paid crap wages. They've got a difficult life. They're working for people who don't care about it. So the guy who runs this, if I'm working at Applebee's and I'm a waiter and I'm looking at it like, okay, the guy who runs this place doesn't know anything about this. He doesn't care. I'm getting paid nothing. Why do I care? So I don't care. And so that's happening. And then the quality of the food. It used to be that most of these places made their food fresh. Now no place makes fresh food anymore. They all buy frozen food. There are a couple of food distributors.

1:06:14Cisco is one of them that the vast majority of the food that you eat at a Chili's or Applebee's or whatever is distributed. It comes off the same truck. It's the same frozen food that comes off of the same truck and that is served in all these places, which is why all the food sucks and it all tastes the same because it's literally the same. People don't know that even pizza places, again, everything's frozen. There's one, I forget the name of it. There's one cheese distributor that distributes most of the cheese at all these different places. And that's like the crucial element of a pizza. And it's literally the same.

1:06:51It's the same thing. And, but they're just pretending that it's not. So my point is that this is a small thing. By the way, it's not a small thing. Right. What people eat is important. Yes. It's quality of life. It's your diet. It's what you eat. And that stuff really matters. Now, podcast hosts and pundits, a lot of them, why don't they care? Well, there's two reasons. Number one, they're not eating at these places. And if you have money, then you don't have to worry about that because you can go to expensive places where the steak costs$85 and it's not going to hurt you much because you've got a lot of money.

1:07:24and if you have a lot of money then you don't notice any of this because at the really fancy restaurants where people spend a lot of money most of those places are still making fresh food and the service is a lot better because they're paying better wages to their to the to the waiters like now you've got older waiters and waitresses but they're older who have kind of climbed at the ladder they're really good at this they get paid better wages they care about it like you go into one of these fancy places and i like eating it i mean who doesn't like eating in these kind of restaurants the food is good but you go into it and one of the first things you notice before you even get to the quality of the food is that everyone at least in the good places everyone that you interact with starting at the hostess stand seems to be really happy that you're there and they care that you're having a good experience that is not how it works when you go to Chili's you know so anyway the these podcasts these people that I'm talking about they're in those places and so they're not in the places where the quality is falling off a cliff and then also i think that and this is something we all do and i do it too you get caught in this we're dealing with like national issues all the time we're dealing with politics and what's happening in washington and the president and geopolitics and what's happening we're dealing with these massive big things all the time if you're a pundit if you do commentary and so you can fall into this line of thinking that the things that actually impact someone's physical everyday life, those things are just too small to worry about.

1:09:02Well, politicians wind up at this exact place. And it's true that because I run into this, when I start talking about this stuff, I will hear this criticism from people. They'll say, why are you talking about this? I did a I did a whole video on my channel a few weeks ago. I did like a 30-minute monologue on why does restaurant food suck. And there are two interesting things that happened after I talked about this issue. One is that I did get a lot of criticism from people saying, everything's happening in the world, you're talking about Applebee's? Like, why are you talking about this? It's like, how out of touch are you?

1:09:37When really, it's the opposite. It's like, no, this is the stuff that's happening in people's lives. but so that i got that criticism but then what i also noticed is that a lot of people watch that video it was like one of the more successful in terms of traffic videos that i've done in a while and uh and it was just about food at applebee's and why is that it's because again this is like this this is your life this is what's happening in your actual life and it matters it touches you and and it touches your family yes and this is one thing i notice about um a lot of people in the world that i have always lived in is they either spend time and this is true for me i'll admit it they either spend time in very rich places or in very rural like low-income places but there's no time spent in the middle which is where the overwhelming majority of Americans live.

1:10:38So it's like only rich people, only poor people, but no middle-class people. So they have a sense of like, you know, a lot of rich people have summer houses, so they sort of get the, you know, if you're on Nantucket, right, and you go there in the winter and everyone's on drugs, you're like, oh, wow. You know, fentanyl's a huge problem in our country. But there's no Applebee's. There's no Applebee's in Cambridge, Mass. There's no Applebee's in Nantucket. There's no, do you see what I'm saying? You just, you do get a very, I am so guilty of this in fact so guilty that I really go out of my way to like understand you know but there's no sense of like normalcy it's also in the same way that like the richest people Bill Gates for example are totally focused on curing Africa and Congo I mean curing malaria polio they're obsessed with the problems of the poorest while living the lives of the richest but like the the bulk of the population is invisible to them.

1:11:36Yeah, I think that's right. I was having a conversation with someone recently who's in the business and I don't know, I mentioned in passing, I don't remember why, I just mentioned in passing, I just had been to Walmart. I was buying something, whatever, I went to Walmart. And this person was shocked that I'd gone to Walmart and they said, I haven't been in a Walmart in 20 years. There's no whites in Walmart, that's the other thing. they're like they're you drive into like middle america there are nowhere i don't know what happened all the whites but are we allowed to say that i just notice it like we're all there's no whites like a rest area on the highway anymore yeah and in walmart i go to buy uh sporting clays it's my only my only shopping trip of the year usually and it's like where are the white people well that's that's part of the thing it's it's i mean it's a small it's a small thing but it's it's just it's uh emblematic of the problem it's like well there's just been total demographic change yeah but if as a commentator if you have never been in a walmart or you know it's like well then that's america i mean that's that's the that's middle america oh i totally agree so it's just there's there's a basic uh i'm not saying you got to go and walk around a walmart like a safari trip just to understand america i'm just saying that that's uh it's just like that's yeah that's what's going on in america is a place like that and if you're just never there at all to your point about either you're out in the sticks or you're in the really wealthy areas then you're you're not really in touch with what's actually happening in america and one of those things is yeah when you go you do notice this when you go to the places where everybody goes walmart is one of those places the dmv is one of those places like a place where everybody has to go yeah um unless they're very very very rich right um or very very very poor when you go to those places you do notice you start noticing things and one of those things is like yeah it's like it looks a lot different now it's it's um it's yeah not not nearly as many white people as there used to be you start noticing those kinds of like yeah like it you know i've never been a bigot it's prohibited by my religion but i also think there's overwhelming pressure not to notice obvious things and i try to keep myself, you know, alert just to notice what my eyes tell me.

1:13:54And that's the biggest change. That's an incredibly fast change, incredibly fast change. It was not an accidental change. It was an intentional change to reduce the white population in the United States. And I've kind of never seen anybody more passively accept it. And I wonder, like, are we getting to a point where we can say that and notice it? And why is that good exactly? Well, for every other, it's funny because certainly for every other race on the planet, if we were to look and see that in their native countries, they are dwindling and disappearing, everyone, it would be nothing controversial about saying, well, this is bad.

1:14:39No one would say, well, why is it bad? I'm not even saying it's bad. I'm just saying it's so profound and abrupt. Well, I will say, I think it's bad. Yeah. I think if you go to Nigeria, if I were to go to Nigeria and notice that like all the Nigerians are disappearing. Yeah. I would say, well, what's going on here? I mean, everyone's Chinese all of a sudden. Right. That's like, that's bad. And if I said that, no one, I don't think anyone would even ask, well, why is it bad? What do you mean? Why is it bad? It's Nigeria. Like there should be Nigerians in Nigeria. And it's bad if some other group comes in and takes it over.

1:15:10And I think for any other race or demographic on the planet, you can say that for white people were the one race, the one demographic where it's not even just that you can't notice that this replacement is happening. It's that, in fact, we're at the point now where you should notice it and celebrate it. It should be seen as a good thing. Isn't that evil? Isn't anyone who tells me that I'm not allowed to notice or scolds me for noticing, isn't that person my enemy? Isn't that, I mean, how could you justify that? What does that say about your motives? Yeah, I think so. And also, I said it's every other demographic on the planet.

1:15:43um any other species on the planet like if i yeah it's so true yeah if where are the condors right exactly if i if we look we get these panics all the time oh all the um amazonian horned owls are disappearing or whatever and they're going away we have to preserve them no one even stops and asks like why do we need amazonian more like we've got a million other owls well owls why do we need these owls and it's just seen as like well they're a species that existed they should continue to exist and so for every other demographic and species of living being we can all agree that if those people disappear that it's bad and white people only one that where we can't say that and part of the reason for that i think is well there's a lot of anti-white sentiment but also So I use the example of Nigeria.

1:16:37Everyone recognizes that Nigerians or black are the native inhabitants of Nigeria. And so if the native inhabitants go away, we see that as a bad thing. The Amazonian horned owl is a native inhabitant of the, I don't think that exists. I'm just, you know, whatever. But they're a native inhabitant of the Amazon. And so they should be there. with white people it's this really interesting thing where what we're told is that white people are not native anywhere we are not indigenous to anywhere which is why and i'm not like making this up there is nowhere in the world you can go where the people who are officially recognized as the indigenous habitants are white nowhere white people do how is that not genocidal intent Well, that's my point.

1:17:25So it's like, okay, so we're not indigenous anywhere, so where are we supposed to be? Because the other part is - We're supposed to be dead. Apparently. Yeah. Because we're told that, okay, here are the indigenous habitants, and what's implied every time we talk about indigenous people, or just outright said, is that, well, this land is really theirs, and so you shouldn't be here. And so what we're saying to white people everywhere is that you shouldn't be here. Well, where should we be? You want us to go to Mars? I mean, are we going to Jupiter? Where are we supposed to be? Or are we just going to throw us into the ocean?

1:17:59And I think the answer is that we really shouldn't be anywhere, which is why we should not be embarrassed or afraid to say that the Native Americans are white people of European descent. That is true. the people that we call Native Americans now are not Native Americans. And the reason they're not Native Americans is because they did not form a country called America. They are not Native. America is a country. It's not just a place. It's not just a plot of land. It is a country. And before America was formed as a nation, this place was not America because America didn't exist. America existed when it was formed.

1:18:48And so if someone can trace their lineage back to the Comanche on the Great Plains, well, that doesn't make you a, you weren't native to America. You're a native to Comancheria. You're native to this. You're not native to the country of America. The people who are native to the nation of America, the people who formed this nation, were by and large, almost exclusively, white people of European descent. They are the natives of this country. They're the ones who formed this country. That doesn't mean that other people aren't allowed to live here. It just means that they're the natives. And again, anywhere else in the world, there's nothing controversial about pointing that out.

1:19:33And we're the only place where we're not allowed to say that. But I've been on this, I've been preaching this for a while now. I think we should, we need to, and not just as a gimmick, Like, I really believe we should reclaim the title of Native American and not to denigrate the people that we call natives, who I think that they're, it's really interesting to read about their cultures and their history. Oh, they're amazing people, but not native to here. They're not native to America. And they also, by the way, they're also not native in the strictest sense to this hemisphere. Like, they didn't sprout out of the ground.

1:20:08They came here at some point in the past. From Asia. from asia they fought brutally with each other over the land all of the the so-called natives that were here and had claimed land when europeans first started showing up in the late 1400s early 1500s all of those people had were on that land because they brutally killed who had been on it before right and they raped their women and took their children as slaves one wave of conquest supplanted the next exactly and and and the law of conquest is what determined no it's it's of course it's factually true and by the way it's been suppressed for many decades by anthropologists and archaeologists by the official policy of the u.s government but cracking the human genome made it impossible to deny the origin of the of the american indians which was asia fine i mean i really like the native americans uh i do too personally yeah i'm not against them at all i feel so bad for them uh but you're absolutely 100 right i just find it so interesting the coordinated effort to to exterminate white people um which is in full flower now but it's so you know it's 1945 is when it started and but it was every part of our society i mean i remember at fox news in the most gentle way trying to say you know maybe all lives do matter or we shouldn't attack whites because they're white man that was like the worst argument i ever got in with it with a senior executive at the network.

1:21:37Like, that's racist. No, it's actually an argument against racism. It's like everybody on all sides was so brainwashed in just accepting this. And then, of course, it happened. And so I wonder, does it ever let up? It didn't let up in Zimbabwe or South Africa. You, like, take the power, kill a bunch of whites, suppress them, and then, like, 30 years later, you're still blaming them for everything? will that happen here when this becomes majority non-white i i all indications are that it will continue i mean so how do you respond to it what's the right way to respond you don't want some kind of race war i don't want to wake up every day thinking about my whiteness i'm not interested in my whiteness just being honest i don't like thinking in those terms sorry call me a boomer which i'm not but i'm i just don't want to i want to see people as people but how do you respond to that because you can't allow that you can't allow people to attack your kids because of their skin color what the fuck right exactly i i think you respond to it and i think there has been some progress actually in this regard probably significant amount you've been a big part of that by the way on the right so thank you well i mean i think a lot i think i think this is one of the things like i said before there are some victories that conservatives have had yeah uh i I know some of the more Doomer-minded conservatives say, what do we conserve?

1:22:59We haven't conserved anything. Well, I'm not saying it's been a, you know, I'm not saying it's been, we've been batting a thousand, but I think we have succeeded. I think they're referring, well, maybe this is what I think, but I do think they're mostly referring to conservative institutions. Yeah, which I would agree with. You know, the Republican Congress or some Republican think tank, like those clearly haven't achieved a lot. Yeah, I would agree with that. But so one success that I think that you're starting to see recently is that the left used to get a lot of mileage out of obviously not engaging with arguments, but just labeling them.

1:23:35They would just label the argument. And so they would say their way of engaging with the argument is say, well, argument's not wrong or right. I don't care about that. The argument is an ist or ism. The argument is racist. The argument is, you know, whatever. Bigoted, Islamophobic, whatever. Anti-Semitic. so that they used to they used to get a lot of mileage out of that i think what's happening now is that people are people are saying well i don't care about the labels like you can say whatever label you want it just doesn't it doesn't mean anything to me and the reason it doesn't mean anything to me is it's not my fault it's your fault when you when you decided that everything fits under that label the label doesn't mean anything anymore exactly uh and i think that's made people more more fearless there was a time i mean look you go back let go back to 2000 not 2000 well certainly 2000 but even going back to 2020 um in the the throes of the floyd hysteria and for a lot of people being called racist was it's like the worst thing in the world they were terrified of it oh yeah being called racist was it for a lot of people that was worse than being called like a child molester i mean they they they would rather be called anything but racist and there's all this fear and i think the the race hustlers got a lot of mileage out of that fear I think that fear is starting to dissipate and yet I still haven't seen many people Especially people who spend a lot of time claiming bias against them Coming out and making unequivocal statements against anti-white hate like that's the one category I haven't seen a lot of people say that like no Hating whites is every bit as hating blacks or hating Jews or hating Asians or whatever hating a group is immoral I have seen very few people say that.

1:25:15Barry Weiss is not big on that. Why? Like, why can't we just say that? It's all the same. It's all species of the same evil. Like, that's my opinion. I think that's the Christian view. Someone correct me if I'm wrong. But it's certainly my opinion, and it's a coherent argument. But I never see anybody say that. Well, I think a lot of that is programming that's been going on for a long time. to the way a lot of people programmed is that to speak specifically in defense of white people as a group, to say anything positive about white people as a group is just automatically racist. And I think that this, and it's obviously bonkers.

1:26:00Right, it's absurd, but it's ingrained deeply. I mean, this goes back to, I can remember this kind of conditioning in public school in the nineties. I went to public school. I can, I can, you know, we talk about wokeness, like it just started in 2015. It didn't. And maybe it was worse in 2015 than it was in 1993. I can remember it in 1993 and I can remember being in school. And the only time that if we ever talked about like our ancestors or the people who founded this country or anything like that it was it was either in an expressly negative way let's talk about all the terrible terrible things they did or if we are going to acknowledge anything good they did we have to couch it by first saying well here's a lot of bad things they did they also did this but also the bad and so that's been going on for such a long time these were in retrospect these were the first moves these were the shock troops of a total takeover and change in the country like this was preparation for what we got under biden where it's just like let's just totally transform the demographics of the country in four years and then no one will feel free to say anything about it because racism right i mean it feels that way to me i don't know if it was a strategy or intentional but it was certainly a coordinated effort maybe unconsciously but like it wasn't an accident and it happened in every white majority country and that's why there won't be any white majority countries really soon and so like what was that i i kind of wish i wasn't white in saying this because it's like it's not self it's first of all it's curiosity like what the hell you almost never see anything happen globally that's that similar in countries that aren't that similar like the united states is not that similar to the uk or canada or new zealand to Australia, but exactly the same thing happened in all of those places.

1:27:56Much worse in a lot of those places. Yeah. Oh, if you visit those places, it'll just break your heart because the people are broken. But in Canada, they are. Canada is not even a country. It's not even a country. And they are overwhelmed with guilt. They are so. They're murdering. The government is murdering tens of thousands of its citizens every year. They're almost all white. And now they're going to be doing it to kids. And by the way, under the MAIDS program, they're harvesting the organs. They're harvesting the organs from the Canadians they kill. So it's like the darkest thing. That's like I would feel much freer and safer living in China than Canada.

1:28:36I can't believe I'm saying that. I actually love Canada. But that's happening. And no one's saying a word about it. Yeah. Well, that in particular is one of those things that it's so dark and so depraved that when you talk about it i think a lot of people especially in america they think you're making it up or you're exaggerating i almost don't talk about it very often because i don't think anyone believes it but i live right near canada and i know and i i'm like the only american who really sincerely loves canada because it's just so beautiful not the only but not many people care about canada i do so i know a lot of canadians and that's absolutely you'll look it up on the inner tubes it's there it's it's becoming one of the leading causes of death and it is one of the cause of death.

1:29:18Is assisted suicide. The government killing you, and not because you have ALS, but because you can't pay your rent, and then extending it to children, and then harvesting the organs and the blood. I mean, I feel like they're a way bigger threat to the United States than Venezuela. I would be open to an argument in favor of invading and occupying Canada on human rights grounds. I'm not joking even a tiny bit. I think it's one of the darkest countries in the world. and it's such a great country with such great people. I don't know how we can allow this to happen without at least saying something about it.

1:29:51I'm not actually arguing for military action, but like maybe threatening it. They're way worse than Maduro, way worse than Maduro, way worse. So like, but I'm sure I'll be scolded for, how can you say that? Because it's true. Yeah, well, the MAID program alone is one of the most evil things happening in the world, period. Murdering your citizens and harvesting their organs on a greater scale than China does? Really? And it's right there? I think one of the things that's happening, why are people ignoring this in America? Well, one thing, it's like not your country, so you think it doesn't affect you.

1:30:27I think it does affect us. Also, when you look at Canada and Europe, we're on the same kind of crazy train. They're just a few train cars up. And so that's why you got to pay attention to where they are because we're going to be there. So that's one thing. Yes, thank you. But I think that also for some conservatives in this country, there's some embarrassment about this because they, I think there are plenty of conservatives who've been at least indifferent to the issue of euthanasia and have even kind of, I've had many arguments with so-called conservatives. Actually? Over the years. Not as much now because you see what's happening with MAID.

1:31:03But over the years with saying that, well, you know, because they get hung up on this, well, it's a personal choice. and they just think as conservatives you cannot oppose a personal choice. You can't do it.

1:31:18And it's kind of the libertarian instinct gone way haywire in my mind. And so there... But now you can see... Now, those of us who have always been against... So a desperate person has free will? Is that what they're saying? And that's the problem. These are children. They don't know what they're talking about. And also... So those of us who were opposed to it, we have been saying for years, like, this is where it's going to go. Okay, yeah, right now, and the other argument for euthanasia was, well, these are people who are in terrible pain, and they're a death store. They've only got days or at most weeks to live anyway.

1:31:56They're in horrible pain. You have no idea what it's like. And so they should be able to have a way out. and from an emotional level, I get what you're saying. I totally disagree with it. I get what you're saying. Our argument was, well, there's a few arguments, but the big one was, okay, that's what we're doing. It's already evil to do that even with someone who's terminally ill. They're doing that now though. It will not stop there because it never stops there. And once you give the state and the medical establishment the authority to kill, they will not stop. It always starts with the most justifiable version of it that they can muster, which is still totally unjustifiable in my view.

1:32:39But it always starts with the most justifiable version. And then next it's like, okay, yeah, but we should include people who maybe they're not terminally ill, but they're chronically ill and they're a lot of pain. And okay, now we've included them. Well, what about mental illnesses? Well, what about this person over there? He's homeless. Yeah, he's not terminally ill, but his life has no meaning and he's terrible. He lives on the street. and then step, step, step, step and eventually you're killing kids too. But we've seen this. We've seen this and by the way, I'm older than you and so they were still teaching this in schools when I was a kid but the Nazi experiment began with euthanasia famously and it wasn't just on a small scale.

1:33:16It was like hundreds of thousands of people killed and it began with Down syndrome. Like how could your life be worth living and then it wound up with Dietrich Bonhoeffer in the Warsaw Ghetto. like this was a very clear much written about continuum that began with murdering the weakest and then again you know uh it ended where it famously ended which was with mass murder but hitler was famous for his euthanasia program he was also famous for like rounding people up and moving them to new places like is now openly being discussed in gaza it's like the whole thing is so bonkers and it just tells you that human evil is not specific to any group or time or place it resides in every person every person is capable of this kind of behavior justifying this kind of behavior and we should all be on guard against it but like hitler was very famous for euthanasia did you even learn that in school no certainly not so funny things change i was in first grade in 1975 and that was like a feature of it you know he was bad because he killed people on the basis of like their dna that's not allowed and he killed the weakest not allowed and i guess they stopped teaching that and and the other thing is when you give when you give the medical establishment When you accept the idea that death is a treatment, you have opened the darkest door imaginable.

1:34:47Yes. And this is what's so frustrating is that what are often decried as slippery slope arguments, people talk about, oh, it's a fallacy, slippery slope. First of all, slippery slope is not a fallacy. It's not a fallacious way of making an argument. all we're trying to show you is that okay here's a door you've opened okay you've made an argument to justify something and what i'm trying to tell you is that i can take that argument intact and use it to justify this thing over here that we both agree is horrific and so if i can do that what that tells me is that what it should tell you is that either your argument is bad or the thing you're arguing for is bad or both and so that's what the slippery slope thing is and and and that was the point with euthanasia once you allow the the medical establishment to to use death murder as a form of medical treatment you've completely flipped it on its head because the whole point of medicine is to heal and treat and so so to avoid death and pain like that's the point of it and now you've flipped it upside down and you've said that death is the treatment and so now you've just destroyed the whole thing you've destroyed it and uh but this has happened i think that almost all obstetricians are required to commit abortion during their training yeah well that's right so then you wind up with an entire medical corps that's evil yeah yeah like there a lot of evil doctors not just a few but a lot evil and or i mean this is the same thing but they they have to be very indifferent to human life which is evil uh so but did you realize i did i certainly didn't realize it really was the covid vax and the lack of covid treat the intentional lack of covid letting people die rather than treating their symptoms which happened extensively across the United States.

1:36:48That sounds like these people aren't just wrong. They're like the worst people. The physicians are the worst people in the country. And for all the nurses, sweet nurses, I love nurses, sorry, who like stood up and like, this is wrong. Almost no doctors did. A few, a few, Mary Talley Bowden and people like that, but like not a lot. And I was just like, our doctors are evil. Not just mistaken, they're bad. do you do you feel that i i think a lot of them are i mean certainly obviously not all of them but not all of them right yeah but but like not five percent right exactly we're like 70 percent well and how about also there's abortion euthanasia covid you've gone to but then also something that i don't think we should just drop and move on from because speaking of justice there has not been justice for this, which is that for years, we had the entire medical establishment unanimously almost telling us that the best thing to do with a young boy who's a little bit confused about his identity is to castrate him.

1:37:57And they were doing that. They were doing that to thousands of kids. They were chopping the breasts. They're still doing it in some places, but it was certainly happening at scale for a long time. They're chopping the breasts off of 15 year old girls. And to your point, it was not just like a few doctors. There's a lot of doctors that were involved in it. A lot more doctors supported it. And a lot of other doctors who maybe didn't like it, but they didn't say a word. They did not speak up against it. This is some of the most insane, barbaric, Frankenstein bullshit that the world has ever seen.

1:38:33Completely unjustifiable no one can argue in defense of it it's the one of the craziest things that's ever happened in the history of the planet it's hard to hear this even because you're because you're right right and and it was it just went on and the the way that the the advocates for this the way that they argued in favor of it because obviously they couldn't make any substantive argument for castrating kids what they would always say is well look at all these medical establishments every single one of them is in favor of it and they were right they all were all of what's so crazy is that um you know female genital mutilation which is you know universal in a few countries i think somalia is one of them but um was very frowned upon by by feminists and also by me as a lover of women and it was a feature of debate on cable news shows like my most of my life as a cable news debater fgm you know we do a segment on fgm or whatever can you believe they're doing this and like nobody would defend it you know we'd look far and wide who will defend female genital a clinterectomy like who would defend that and you know our bookers tried really hard but there weren't many all of a sudden no one mentioned it again and that's because they started doing it and it's just a reminder that you don't have to be somali or a nazi or any specific group to participate in evil.

1:39:57Like this is a human problem. And the second they stop talking about how what other people did is bad, it's probably a tip that they're going to start doing it themselves, right? And it's also a lesson that it's very easy. I mean, look, nobody wants to admit it now, but at the height of the trans madness, and I don't mean to talk about it totally in the past tense, like it's over, it's not. But we are past the height of it. It feels that. Thank God. But at the height of it, no one wants to admit it now, but almost everyone on the left supported it, vocally so. And most people on the right told themselves or insisted that it's not worth saying anything about, it's not that big of a deal.

1:40:44It's totally right. That's exactly true. This is a cultural war sideshow. and so what that tells us is that it's actually very easy for people to convince themselves to go along with the worst evils that are even conceivable no that's totally right people it's very easy to convince yourself and partisanship is not a good guide to that i can as you just said yourself a lot of people that are on our side like i don't want to deal with that yeah it's it's it's well because what you have are i mean usually this is not how it always works out but um you've got the really evil thing being promoted facilitated by the left whether it's abortion or euthanasia whatever else and then you've got cowardice on the right um refusing to speak up against it uh until it's very safe to do so you know and then and then everybody does and that's why it's also been on the trans issue it's been interesting over the last like year year and a half to have uh like people coming out of the woodwork like very very boldly saying you know men uh men shouldn't be in women's sports like yeah thanks for that like i could have we could have used that six years ago well because this was one of those issues was you and a few other people just changed it it wasn't congress it was you made your movie and you wouldn't stop talking about it.

1:42:11And there were a few others, but they were all in the commentariat. They were all like in the pundit class. It was not, it was no like US senator who led the charge against this. Some followed in the end, but it came from outside the system, I guess is what I'm saying. Right. So that kind of shows, among other things, that the commentariat, which is insufferable, even as I say this part of it, does matter matters actually the opinions you see on all these podcasts like they over time do change things clearly so to circle back to where we began how is this current conflict the intra-right conflict resolved

1:43:01i don't i don't know i i if i knew how to do it i would do it um if i if i knew how to solve it if i knew how to bridge the divide and get everyone on the same side again i would do it i've tried in my own way i know i have not been successful i have tried you're like the last person with a foot in each world it's interesting and i and i i value that like this this isn't for me this is what people have to understand i try not to take it personally the insults i mean when you're in this world you get insulted all the time and you do do it uh you have to you have to have thick skin there are certain attacks against me that i should not admit this but i will that do bother me like they do like what okay you opened it you opened the door so well charges of well when people say things that just aren't true like and it happens all the time and it's it's the one thing i should be the most used to i guess i am but it just pisses me off really it it does because i i'm the opposite it's only the true attacks that upset me i don't know yeah it it shouldn't but when people are i see someone you know make a claim especially if it's someone it doesn't have to be but especially if it's someone who i kind of know and yeah it's not but saying something that's like it's not true you're ascribing motives to me that it's just it's so it's just the exact opposite of what is actually true and you're not even asking me you're not reaching out you're not giving me a chance to speak for myself who did that to you and i here's the thing i talked about loyalty before i'm i'm so uh devoted to it that i i have people i consider friends who have been attacking me publicly and i still don't want to attack welcome to my world i still don't want to do you feel like there's a connection between the degree to which you've helped someone and the vehemence of the attack i've noticed that in just in my life I'm not whining and I agree with you it's I hate being attacked I'm being threatened someone shot at my house like I'm never gonna say that okay though it's true but I have noticed that a lot of people I've helped are like on the front lines of attacking me or calling me names they know aren't true Nazi and I feel like there's a connection it's not random it's like if you've helped someone maybe they resent you for it deep down yeah there there might be some of that I mean there's there's a there's a lot of things first of all everybody's very emotional like yeah and I try to keep that in mind to people I try not to do the thing that pisses me off so much people to do to me which is ascribing motives and say yeah you're really doing this because of this and and I think sometimes people do a lot of people do have ulterior motives clearly and people are scheming and they're playing games and also by the way we live in a space like this is a business and and people do this for a living and so there's also just competitiveness no it's right and that happens but then at the same time people also get just pissed off and they get emotional well that's definitely true and there's and that's happening on all so i recognize that like some of the so that's why some of the the some of the people that go after me publicly even be like consider friends and i'm like you have my phone number you call me and you're not and i try to understand like i do my maybe it's for my own sanity i i try to be as charitable as possible and think like well they're just they're wrong but they're really angry and they've got this whole story about me that's not correct but that that's what's happening they're just pissed off and i've been pissed off before and said things i regret so i i think i think a lot of that's happened to go back to the question of what to do about it well i guess i guess i don't know why i'm going back to it because i don't have the answer but uh i think the only thing that can be done is for all of us, if you're on the right, to go back to some of the basics that we talked about at the beginning of the conversation.

1:46:59Like, what is it that we want? What is it that we actually want? What's the real catechism here? What does it mean to be on the right? Exactly. What are we, it's the classic question about conservatives. What are you trying to conserve? It's a good question. You should be able to answer that. You should be able to answer that. What are you trying to conserve? And everybody needs to ask themselves that and come up with an answer. Write your list, write it out if you have to, whatever. come up with your list i'm gonna do this this is my this is my calling right here and and everyone should have their list and then we should compare notes and if our lists match up like we want the same things we're trying to conserve and preserve the same things then the only way forward is is with that is for us to realize that like let's let's reorient towards that make make that the goal and and remember that even when we disagree we're gonna have disagreements but we're only disagreeing about how to do this thing that we both want done.

1:47:53And, and, uh, and I think that's the way forward. Now, on the other hand, maybe you start looking at your list and you, and you realize that I actually don't even want the same things as these, as these people. Okay. Well, then we're not on the same side. And that's very clarifying too. I think that there are people. That's happening in my mind. I'm like, I, we don't have anything in common. Actually, I thought we did, but we don't. Is that happening to you?

1:48:20There are certainly some of that. I think that there are definitely people who just don't want the same things at all. They don't have the same fundamental goals. I think that's certainly happening. And that's part of the clarifying. That's part of the... Is that bad or good? Well, clarity is good. Yeah. I think we need clarity. but for me like I said the only person and I believe this wholly I try to live by it the only person who can speak to your intentions is you the only person who can tell anyone what's in your mind is you and so if someone says to me that's why I try to interview people right so exactly you're allowed to speak for yourself and so I've given my list of what it is that I want to conserve and preserve can you just can you in an abbreviated form just run through it really quick one more time because i think i agreed with it abbreviated is always a trouble for me well no you don't have to abbreviate it we just say it again like what are the thing you're saying there's left right what even i don't even know what that means anymore but like people who share your values believe what they believe in objective truth yeah okay they they believe in truth uh number one that there that there is a truth.

1:49:35Okay, I'm going to write this down. Hold on, hold on now. Okay, objective truth. Yeah, objective truth. Whether or not there... Can I just add one caveat? I'm not always convinced I know what the objective truth is. I've certainly been wrong, but I know it exists. Right, exactly. And that's exactly the point. We can disagree about what the truth is. We're going to have those disagreements. Right. But we have to be able to agree that there is a truth to begin with. And when you're talking to someone who's a moral relativist, they're on the left, you can't even agree on that. So there's no conversation to be had.

1:50:07We cannot even have a conversation. And that's the problem. That's our problem in our culture. And even above the truth, the reason why there's an objective truth is that there is God, that God, that there is a God, there is God. and um and he has designed the universe and everything and everybody in it um and that's the the source that's the wellspring of truth you know that that's why there is a truth because god designed it a certain way and so it is like that's the the fundamental bare bones truth is that god has designed it this way that this is that this is god's universe and that is the truth So I think that's number one.

1:50:54Yeah, that's number one. And then what are we trying? I think probably everything flows from that. Everything flows from that. What are we trying? But in America, as American conservatives, what are we trying to conserve? We're trying to conserve American identity, our national identity. We're trying to conserve the institution of the family, which is the foundation of the country and of civilization. We're trying to conserve the institution of the marriage, which is the foundation of the family. So this is the foundation of the foundation. Which is the foundation of American identity. Right. And we're trying to conserve all those things.

1:51:40and then and then at a broader level we're trying to conserve western civilization itself which grows from so if if you were to sum it up you could say objective truth derived from a belief that this is all created we are not the creators exactly and the the family the family unit husband and wife children, which is the basis of all human civilization. So objective truth family? Yeah. I think that's - If I were writing this on my hand for the test, okay, probably in here so the teacher couldn't see it, it would just be objective truth family. Yeah. And I would also put national identity for, we're talking about American conservatives, which is what we're talking about.

1:52:26But then the question goes, like, what's that? Yeah. Well, that's also a debate in a sense. I think there are some basic things, but again, that's like, okay, as long as we agree - That we need one? That we need, that we, yeah, we cannot. So we have a culture, right? We need to have a culture, and multiculturalism cannot be the culture. That's not a culture. That's - a unifying set of beliefs or customs that keep the country from breaking apart. Otherwise, it will break apart. And that's the point. So the things there, if someone looks at that, I'm speaking for myself, and not just myself, I think a lot, but that's my North Star.

1:53:12And if you look at that and you say, well, I want the same things, so I'm fighting for it, then you are on my side, period. Like we are on the same side and we'll have a lot of arguments again about how to do that, how to achieve that. We'll have a lot of arguments about it. And those could be like fruitful arguments. Those don't have to be angry, nasty, personal arguments. They could just be discussions, you know, as adults. And we'll do that, but we're on the same side. However, if you look at that and you say, you know, well, I don't believe in any of that. I don't believe in God. I don't like truth.

1:53:52We all have our own truth. The family, I think the family is like, marriage doesn't matter. We don't need the family. And a lot of people feel that way. So fine, you're allowed to feel that way. We're not on the same side at all, no matter what else you believe. And then I might agree with you. Then you might go on from there and say, yeah, but I really think that gun rights are important. And I think we need to restrict immigration. and I want to abolish the income tax or whatever. I'd agree with you on those points, but we're not fundamentally on the same side. It's so smart. I don't want to blow anyone's mind, but I travel a lot, talk to people for a living.

1:54:28You would be amazed by the people I know who agree with you vehemently and sincerely on those two points, and they're not all on the right at all, which is kind of interesting. So it does feel like there's a true realignment happening now. I just know in my own life that people who reach out to me in some cases are people you would expect. In some cases, they're not at all people you would expect. And they're just, they're hearing the same music and they're motivated by the same impulses. And that is one, a belief that we are living in a world we didn't create. These rules aren't ours. It's basically the nature argument.

1:55:09Like you can't ignore nature because you're not in charge of it you cannot ignore natural law because you didn't make it because god made it a and b in the end your only true protection is your family and your deepest connection is to your family and that needs to be protected above all which i think is a variety of what you were just saying the people who've reached out to me who who believe that man it's it would blow your mind so I guess what I would say is it feels like a lot of our politics is artificial it's inorganic it was these divisions in some cases are you know are real in some cases they were created in order to get us to not see that we have a lot in common with other people does that make sense I think so look and if someone the words left and right are labels that we put on on things well people have always said that but i never really believed it i was like that's bullshit but it's just it's a way of categorizing and organizing things so we can speak about them coherently um but sometimes the labels that we use you know we have to we have to uh shift it over there might be people who so but like anyone who you've talked to who we would say is on the left who agrees with all that well then i would say they're not on the left well i agree you know they might they might they might even think they still are but they're not um and so they're uh they're they're over on this side and uh you can kind of call it whatever you want i'm saying right conservative we could come up with any team team name we want i guess what i'm saying is then your side is bigger than you think it is yeah maybe for the during the when we're talking about the trans issue and i've sort of talked about the teams what i've come to what i've come to call the side that's against all the trans madness is team sanity you know yeah um it's just we're for sanity like on this issue we're sane people and fully acknowledging that on that issue there were people who uh i don't agree with on like anything else but are sane on this i can think of some of the i used to have this woman on oh i really liked her i don't think she ever liked me at all i can't remember her name she was a radical lesbian feminist and every she would always come into the studio on the trans issue years ago and she was like i could i could hear her thinking I can't believe I'm in the same room as this monster but we were so aligned on it and I always wondered like why did she care so I mean she we must have been more aligned than either of us realized if she cared that much about it right uh you must have dealt with a million people like this yeah yeah and this is a conversation I would have sometimes with the because I it's very strange bedfellows I would find myself aligned on that issue with some feminists like left far left feminists but the the radical ones yeah um but the point i would try to make to them i think mostly unsuccessfully is that okay if you if we agree on this that i i think like if you can see the truth on this then i think we should agree on a lot more you know well that's my instinct too right um what would they say well for me i i'm not the guy to make an argument to feminists they're not gonna listen to me there might be someone who can um be kind of the i think you could convert a few matt walsh i i i don't know it's my my track record would say otherwise but uh but the point is that like the argument i would make to them is that actually i know you call yourself a feminist the reason why we have this problem is because of feminism uh feminism is the actually the root of this problem worse and so if you agree with me on this then I think really you are critiquing feminism so you're not a feminist get it together come over here and I they didn't find that that was that was mansplaining you know they weren't that was definitely they weren't like ready to run to the patriarchy after that no no that's a shame so here's my last question and again it begins where we began which is the fact that you're like at the center of all of this I really do think you're the last person on the right you the official, well-known official podcaster, right, who has a foot in two camps.

1:59:41And so it's just the pressure on you. I've just noticed it has been almost unbelievable. And you've bore up under it so impressively. But how do you keep yourself from becoming a hater when you're under just relentless assault and not just your views, but your motives, your character, when people you really like or your friends are denouncing you and most people live an entire lifetime without that experience it's an unusual experience and it can drive some like totally crazy like they become foaming at the mouth haters how have you avoided that uh maybe the honest answer is i have not avoided it well but i but i but i but i think that uh i mean look the the real the correct answer is prayer.

2:00:29You have to have a rich prayer life. Yes. And do you? I do have a prayer life. I don't think it's as rich as it should be. And I think that I think like a lot of people you kind of go through waves. I go through waves and then I go through and here's what happens with me and I think it's probably relatable is that right here. When you're really frustrated and stressed out and things are not really working out how you want them to, your kind of prayer life can dry up too. Because that starts feeling, everything just starts feeling kind of dry. Everything starts feeling like nothing's working, no one's listening, you feel frustrated.

2:01:07No one in your life is hearing what you're saying and you start to feel like God is not hearing you either. And it's just this kind of frustration. And then it snowballs. you know and then it becomes a it's a self-fulfilling prophecy because now you're everything's feeling everything's feels kind of dried up and frustrated and so that's what happens with your prayer life and then everything gets worse because of that um and so those are the the moments where you have to be very intentional and say i'm really annoyed and frustrated i don't feel like praying i don't even know if god's listening he's always listening but in a frustrated moment you feel like he's not.

2:01:41And that's when you have to realize that and then reorient yourself and become, you know, and for me, when I have those moments, I've found that just being more structured, like sometimes you have to, like anything in life that is good, you have to kind of force yourself to do it. Sometimes you have to get into a habit. What's your structure, if you don't mind? Well, I think there's, you set up a time for prayer in the morning, like you set up just times this is my this is my time when i'm going to pray you know yes and hopefully it's multiple times a day um but and when you have a really rich prayer life and you're you're in a good flow it's like you're you're a constant prayer it's like a it's a constant it's a constant state of going to god even if you're not on your knees rejoice in everything never stop praying yeah And I think that things like your physical posture when you're praying, that can matter.

2:02:36And especially if you're going through a dry spell in your prayer life, I think actually kneeling, being on your knees, does matter. And you can pray without being on your knees, but it can kind of help to orient you in the right way. And it's kind of your body telling your mind something, which is that you are submitting yourself. like you're on your knees you are submitting yourself to a power that is greater than you that's why you're doing this and so you're reminding yourself that there's someone greater than you who you are appealing to um and so i think stuff like that can can help also how much time do you spend on x too much meaning like way too much i don't know what effect does that have uh not not good I mean it's also hard for me because it's my job and not like my job requires you know it's like a not like there's a I have to punch in the clock and go on x but part of the job is to be clued in and I'm also creating content every day I do a show five days a week four days a week now um and so this is where the conversation is happening this is where all the content all the sort of content is all the things I want to talk about yeah I also use it as kind of a you know it's it's like i'll start a conversation on x and and then i'll talk about it on the show and it's just kind of this feeds off of each other thing um but the problem and all that is good and i'm glad that it's there for that reason but the problem is this stuff sucks you in like it just sucks you in and um because i bet i'm just guessing you're not into say pornography or cocaine or I don't know right zero I knew that zero percent so like for a man like you you're not you know you don't you're not ruled by your addictions but do you feel like x well it's weird here's the weird thing for me it the the amount of time I spend on it sometimes would seem like an addict however when I go on vacation and I say I'm I'm leaving I'm not going to be doing a show i'm i'm i'm out of the i'm gonna be out i'm not paying attention to anything then i go on vacation i put the phone down i have zero desire to pick it up i i don't even find myself like i gotta find out what's happening i put it down i'm on vacation i have no desire in fact it's the opposite when i come back i have to force myself i know to like get into this again and almost it's almost it's ridiculous i'm like forcing myself to tweet because i got to get in the flow to do the job and um so that tells me it's not really an addiction it's something even worse i guess because when i have the chance to walk away from it i so eagerly do it's like my soul telling me like you got this this is what i actually long for is not this i think that's a really good sign i think it's a good sign um do you feel like when you i'll tell you i feel when i go on it because i know so many of the people who are tweeting their opinions it's like seeing all of your acquaintances naked i feel like people reveal so much about themselves and it's like wow you don't look great naked i mean i never really thought about you naked but now that i can see it you should put some clothes back on that's the feeling i have every time i go on there that is a that's that's an interesting way of putting it and i think that's true i mean that's it used to be right if you were like a prominent person in some field uh if you ever gave your opinions publicly depending on the field you might never give your opinion publicly but if you ever did it was like in a structured it was a very intentional kind of way and i try and stick to that and now and now we have it used to be like it's hard for people for kids these days to realize this but it used to be that we would have all these like famous people and celebrities and most of them we never knew what they thought about anything we had no clue what they thought we didn't even know what their personalities were we only saw them because they were throwing a football or because they were acting in a thing or whatever and now yeah we just know everyone's opinion up to date on every whoever thought that i mean if you told me 10 years ago that like all the people in charge were thoroughly banal and conventional at best.

2:07:00They had nothing interesting to say. They never thought about anything ever. Like Hillary Clinton had not a single thought in her head. And that some guy called Oren McIntyre, whoever that is, would turn out to be, you know, or you, or like all these people who 10 years ago were not, they're very far from what we might think of as a public intellectual. All of a sudden, they're purely through the force of their ideas and the clarity of their expression. we're kind of defining the terms that is a huge change it's totally disempowered the poobah class and it's given rise to this like genuinely interesting bubbling conversation like at best do you feel that yeah i do which is why i mean we talk about social media they talk about X and I don't want to talk as though I think it's a, it's a overall like nothing but a negative because I do think it allows.

2:07:56Oh, total. No, no, it's a mixed blessing for sure. So, and that is true. Like it allows, and it obviously has created a situation where the institutions that used to control the conversation completely now, now don't control it at all. And they're like, They've shown that they're just not impressive, that in the true and fabled marketplace of ideas, they're like a rummage sale, actually. Yeah, they have nothing to say. But who would buy that crap? It's just not... Once we see it in its entirety, once the mystique has been stripped away, they have nothing to offer. They're just totally pedestrian.

2:08:38And then these... I mean, do you ever see random Twitter accounts? You have no idea who this is. It's not someone who's anyone's ever heard of. Making a point that's so profound that you can't get it out of your head. Does that ever happen to you? Oh, definitely. I was just thinking, I saw, I don't remember who the guy was. But yeah, I read a tweet a couple days ago, and it was this lengthy, really well-written analysis of something I can't even remember. But it was like a random Twitter guy. I don't know who that guy is. Like what? And in a way, it's kind of sad, because I read that, I'm like, well, I don't know.

2:09:08This guy's a philosopher. He should be in a different age. No, but affirmative action has kept them all out. So this is where they went. So you're like, well, we don't have a meritocracy anymore, and the smartest, most impressive people literally can't get jobs or grants or into college, so what are they doing? And they're sitting at home tweeting. Yeah, tweeting these morsels of incredible wisdom in some cases. No, truly. Yeah. But this is, as I said, mixed blessing. The problem is that in between the morsels of great wisdom, you've got nothing but just slop and all this. And so the best thing we can do is things like keep your prayer life alive and control.

2:09:52You have to have self-control in how you interact with this. One of the worst things, and everyone does this, I do it, I think it's the worst habit that almost everyone has now. I'm sure I do it too then if it's a bad habit. the first thing you do when you wake up in the morning is check your phone. I don't do that. Well, then you're in better shape than I am and a lot of people. Never. That is like the worst. That's like having blueberry pancakes for breakfast, which was a habit that was very hard for me to break. But once I did it, I realized that framed my whole day in the wrong way. Have you ever started the day with blueberry pancakes?

2:10:35I have. You can't get past it. Everything in your day is defined by blueberry pancakes. Why? Because you're longing for the... Yeah, you're hungry all day. You feel shitty. You're lethargic. Just don't eat till noon and everything is better. But I grew up in a blueberry pancake world, like 100%. Blueberry pancakes and a cigarette. And that's not a good way to start the day. And I feel like social media are even worse than that. Just do the cigarette. Don't do the pancakes. That is... I can't say this. that is still a great way to start the day i don't care what anybody says it's just a fact yeah but whatever sorry just totally kidding the the uh yeah starting the day by looking at your phone is so horrifically bad i do it all the time actually i do i shouldn't that's like the one thing you can't just don't do that that's easy just like because you use it as your alarm right Yeah, my phone.

2:11:33Of course. Everybody does. I do too. We don't allow phone usage in the bedroom except for the alarm. That's like ironclad rule. Just get up, get a cup of coffee, get your face in a Bible, or just stare out the window, kiss your dogs, anything but that. I totally agree. In fact, just this morning, I woke up. First thing I did is I checked my phone, and I went on X. It was just in my feed. It just happened. Like the first thing I read, I just opened my eyes 30 seconds ago. The first thing I read was like in my feed, something popped up and it was like, Matt Walsh is a coward. I'm starting my day with that.

2:12:13Like the first thing that enters my eyeballs. What are you doing? I don't know. And then I put my phone down. I'm like, why did I do that? Why did I do that? You're in a hotel room though, right? In a hotel room, yeah. Because there's no chick there. That's why it's so important to be married. That is, yeah, that's true also. Right? And there's no kids. Totally. Matt Walsh, some of us, probably not a huge group, but some of us, just kidding, really appreciate what you're doing and your clear thinking and your self-control and especially your summation of what actually matters. So thank you very much.

2:12:52Appreciate it. Thank you.

2:12:57You don't need to be an economist to see what's happening. the dollar is in trouble it's getting weaker it's sad but we're not in charge of it so we have to respond appropriately in ways to protect our families when paper money dies it's going to be replaced by programmable digital currency or gold gold survives the same americans who think they're protecting themselves with gold are the ones getting ripped off by big gold dealers after we left corporate media we got offered tens of millions of dollars to promote gold companies how do they get the money to spend that much on marketing because they're scamming their customers We didn't want anything to do with that.

2:13:27So we sought an honest broker, and together we formed a precious metals company that you can actually trust. It's called Battalion Metals. At battalionmetals.com, we publish actual spot prices. We're totally transparent about the VIG, what we take, and we treat everyone with honesty. So if you've been watching what's happening, you know it's not just about money. It's about sovereignty and holding something that endures and cannot be manipulated or taken from you. So if you've been waiting for the right time to act, this is it. Visit battalionmetals.com. Thank you.