Why Are You Gay? Milo Yiannopoulos Explains.

28:15No. He wasn't just lame. He was awful. And in case you don't remember, here's his signature achievement as secretary of transportation, identifying racist roads. And the interstate system, the interstate system was built to keep certain groups in and certain groups out. So it was built on a racist system, correct? Yeah. Often this wasn't just an act of neglect. Often this was a conscious choice. There was racism physically built into some of our highways. There was racism built in to the highways. There was rebar and a concrete substrate, and of course gravel and then asphalt poured over the top.

28:50But mixed in there, probably in a drum at some point, was actual white racism. It was mixed into the roads, and that's why people to judge had to tear them up. That's a real clip. That's not AI, as you may remember. That's insane. That was his tenure as Secretary of Transportation, not being mean to him. And it's like not even worth dredging that up again, except to make the point that being gay isn't just this thing about Pete Buttigieg. It's the whole point of Pete Buttigieg. judge, it is the reason that he has the plurality of support from Democratic primary voters who are not black. His support among black voters, they're more in the, why are you gay camp?

29:43They're not impressed at all. In fact, I'm trying to do the math here. I think his support, Pete Buttigieg's current support among African-American Democratic primary voters is, let's see, around zero. So zero percent in that range, meaning nobody, like no black people. They're not going for it. Why are you gay? You can almost hear them saying that. But among white liberals, Pete Buttigieg's gayness, the fact he's married to a dude called Chasen and has somehow acquired babies somehow. How do you get babies? Just sort of buy them somewhere, whatever. He has these babies. And he is the model of whatever, a modern gay man.

30:29That's the whole point. He is a civil rights hero because of who he sleeps with. Pretty amazing. So two obvious points to make about that. First, do you remember when they used to tell us, we don't care what happens in your bedroom. Do you remember that? We want to keep politics out of the bedroom. We want to keep politicians out of your bedroom. This was a way to justify the Holocaust of abortion, of course. But the line sounded kind of appealing. Yeah, politicians probably stayed in my bedroom. That seems fair. Now your bedroom is the whole point. You've got politicians running on what they do in their bedroom and on the Democratic side, succeeding.

31:12So that leads very obviously to the second point, which is there are a lot of rewards in store for someone in the Democratic Party, an ambitious politician, someone who really only cares about the goal, which in Pete Buttigieg's case has always been becoming president. Is it bad to come out of the closet and announce that you're gay? No, no, no. That's like the only way you're going to get to the White House. That's the only way. That's your ticket being, quote, gay. Huh. So given that that's obviously true, and given that this guy dated girls as an adult, it's totally fair to ask the question, why are you gay?

31:56Like, what is this? Starting to think that maybe it's not genetic or entirely genetic, and if it is, show me the gene? We've decoded the human genome. We can tell you where the gene for eye color comes from. Where's the gay gene? Maybe there is a gay gene, by the way. Lots of things we haven't decoded yet. Maybe it's there. Are you looking for it? Are you trying to answer this question? No. The whole game is to make you be quiet, ashamed, because there's something to do with sex. And what are you, a creep? Focus on sex? You're obsessed with gay sex. Sort of a variety. You're obsessed with Israel.

32:36Actually not. But you're way up in my face about it. And so I think it's fair to ask you a couple of very simple, straightforward questions, foundational questions like, what is this? Where does it come from? Why is it good? Why is being gay better than not being gay? And if it's not 100 % genetic, clearly isn't. if you've had a 300 % increase in 10 years, probably not genetic, unless our genetics are changing at lightning speed, unless evolution is a much faster process than Darwin ever reckoned. If it's not entirely genetic, then what are the other factors? And since apart from moral concerns or the concerns of human happiness, does this actually make you happy?

33:22And what does it mean to live as a gay person in the United States? What exactly does that look like? Like, what's your life like? How many people do you have sex with? How are those unfair questions? Since you're the one throwing it in my face and telling me I'm not allowed to be against it, maybe I'm allowed to ask the questions I don't really want to ask, don't really want to know the answers to. But since you've made it the North Star of our moral system in the United States, since you're willing to starve an African country because they disagree with it, maybe it's time for me to ask those questions because you push me to.

33:55On this and a lot of other issues, If you just back off a little bit, if we could just return to the status quo of, say, 1985, where, yeah, they're gay people, they're great, they're off, you know, whatever. They're here, they're there, whatever, but they're not pushing gay sex on my kids in school. That's clearly not a good idea. Tell me why it is a good idea. And, of course, it's a crime to intentionally infect someone with an infectious disease. And of course, it's in fact the hallmark of civilization to make rape illegal, gay or straight. What? But since you blew up all those previous assumptions and now made them illegal, Uganda made this crime punishable by death.

34:41You made their law punishable by famine. So who's more serious about it? You are. since you did all of that how about we just slowly in a non-hysterical obviously non-hateful way ask what are we looking at why are you gay why is that a good thing what is it exactly and there are a lot of people we could ask about this but we thought believe it or not the most articulate person we know to answer these questions is milo yiannopoulos who was very famous 10 years ago as a, what was he called, conservative provocateur, running around the country making the case against liberals as an open, in fact, flamboyant gay man.

35:23And that was part of the shtick, right? It's like, we've got a gay guy too. What are you going to say now? You know, we've got black conservatives too. You can't call us racist. We've got a gay conservative. You can't call us homophobes. And so Milo was unleashed on the world. And then In literally one day, he was canceled, really destroyed as a person in a sort of non-scandal that, like so many of that period and of this period, took him right off the stage and never heard from him again. But during the period when he was flitting around America on his dangerous faggot tour, spreading whatever it was, libertarian economics or something to the kids, it became obvious that this guy was actually really smart.

36:06you know even for those of us who were never that interested in the dangerous faggot part of it um if you listen you thought well this guy's not dumb at all he's actually very thoughtful um very thoughtful high IQ high IQ guy who thinks about things uh so over the last couple of years during text conversations um I became aware that Milo had decided that he didn't want to be gay anymore I thought that's kind of interesting I didn't know you could decide you didn't want to be gay. And then you read about it and it turns out there's a whole industry movement and laws designed to prevent you from deciding not to be gay.

36:42Huh? The parts of the United States have banned conversion therapies. You're not allowed to talk to a psychiatrist about not having same sex attraction. Wow. What is that? It's like once you're in, you can't get out. It's like mandatory gayness. What the hell are we looking at? Well, it's the season to give gifts to those you love, and there is no greater gift than the first gift, the gift of life. With the abortion mafia doubling down, there's never been a more important time to fight back against them and for children, which is really all that matters, children. Our friends at Preborn are the ones to go to.

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38:33And so that conversation follows and we hope you enjoy it. This episode is brought to you by Fox One. Watch all 104 matches of the FIFA World Cup live in 4K for just$19.99 a month with three days free. Build your own multi-view, choose up to three streams, and follow player spotlights. Stay on top of every moment with live stats, highlights, and instant replays. The FIFA World Cup, streaming live on Fox 1, offers a subject to change. See fox.com for complete terms and conditions. You're really nice to do this. I'm glad you came. I want to begin with... You're the only person that has me on. I'm joking.

39:13No, I'm actually really interested. I'm interested in this topic. I've never been interested in it, but I want to begin by asking you... It's icky, isn't it? It's icky. Well, sort of impersonal, but it's occurred to me, particularly when I have interviewed Republican politicians, particularly neocons over the years. Sexuality comes to mind. I can't think why. I've always wanted to say, in a Ugandan accent, are you gay? Why are you gay? Let me ask, are you gay? Were you gay? What is gay? Nobody's gay. Nobody's gay. After that clip, which is the best thing on the internet, he changes the question, the interrogative to a declarative.

39:48He says, why are you gay? And she starts, you know, it starts talking. He says, you are gay. It becomes a statement. And this is where he goes, this is where he loses me because nobody is gay. We've been encouraged to think of this. It's an icky subject. Like, straight men don't want to think about that. No, no, it's okay. I mean, it's reached the... But you invited me. Well, I invited you because I have not, you know, not wanted to be engaged with the topic at all. I don't have strong, super strong personal feelings about it. But all of a sudden, it has become like a defining fact of the West that we have a huge gay population.

40:31Like, what does that mean? Exporting sodomy. But no one wants to talk about it. Giving aid with, you know, with strings attached. So I'm trying to look, what metaphor am I reaching for? Strings attached. Yes, you can, but only if you have a gay pride festival. Right. What is that? Exactly, what is that? Yes, it has been. And all of these things, and with the collapse in people identifying as trans, you're beginning to now see what some of us have always known about homosexuality, which is that this is a product. I mean, there are some people, obviously, who were probably always going to be gay.

41:06Tammy Bruce. but, you know, like maybe she might be the only real lesbian. She might be the only real lesbian. I believe when Tammy Bruce tells me that she was only ever into women, I believe her. You know, and I like her, by the way. I think she's great. But she's like the only real lesbian. With gay men, which is completely different, we see the numbers go up, the numbers go down. This is not, without some change in environmental factors, this doesn't make sense if we believe the old lie born this way. if we believe what was in fact invented in the 1980s as a public relations strategy born this way.

41:40So what happened back in the days, gays were in the 80s and with AIDS and the rest of it wanting to be out and proud and to wear their sins on their sleeves. And somebody came up with this idea which caught on and worked. It was twofold. One is, well, what if we say that being gay is like being black or being a woman. Yes. Then they're a bigot. We're not weird. And so it takes the religious, the moral majority's sinful lifestyle choice argument and it screws them because now they're saying like, you're wrong to be a girl or you're wrong to be black. It was invented. It was invented wholesale by the activists in the 1980s.

42:26And the second part of it was, and this is in a book called After the Ball, which is kind of defined how gay activists were going to, it was very influential because it was really the book that told gay activists how to get this revolting sin that most people don't even want to think about up front and center, family friendly, and ultimately to the state where we let them adopt children, which is a whole thing we'll get into. And that was, don't talk about bodily functions. Don't talk about effluvia. Just talk about love. Just talk about love. Talk about it in terms of love, like love is love, love wins.

43:06And we see this to the present day. Never talk about, you know, the stains on the sheets, the promiscuity, the drugs, the glory holes in Berlin nightclubs. Never talk about any of those things because those things will repel women. And you need moms with gay sons to affirm their homosexuality. And so what is that homosexuality? Long answer for a short question, I understand. in almost every case and in certainly in every male case it is a trauma response it is not a sexuality it is not part of what you are or who you are or or a component of your personality or a function of it is it is a set of behaviors that is that emerges in people with a number of very easily identifiable common etiologies.

43:55One of them is, well, so for instance, among gay, excuse me, among black and Jewish Americans, they report statistically significantly higher rates of homosexuality. Well, why could that be? Overbearing moms and absent dads, or in the Jewish case, nebbish fathers. And, you know, like Jewish, my Jewish friends, I always call their marriages are like lion taming, you know, where you have a sort of nebbish, scholarly, bookish dad and a larger-than-life mom who, you know, one day decides she's going to be a rabbi. You know, that or in the black community, of course, it's the fatherlessness. And so why, if we're born this way, if you don't have some other better explanation, could it be the case that there are more gays among black and Jewish populations where something's going on here?

44:44Why are we getting more trans and more gays and then less gays? Why? Because this is, in fact, a symptom. In fact, this is a product of something. It's the result of something. Well, this was Freud's position, which was kind of conventional wisdom for the better part of 100 years, that this was a response to the environment and particularly to the relationship with the mother that a young boy has and relationship with his father. I mean, this was like people just assumed that was true when I was a kid. They were not gay haters or homophobes. That was a state of knowledge on the subject. One of the only things Freud got right was that.

45:24And it's funny that, you know, the way that that's actually in line with Catholic church teaching. And now you see the terminology in the medical industry has begun to change as well. Because, you know, now gay people are sort of saturated everywhere. Yeah, you know, like when you get, it's kind of like America, you get a whole country full of people who are very similar, but all think they're really, really individual. That's deep, yes. I do know what that looks like. And, you know, sort of America is a very faggotized country in all kinds of ways. That's the technical term. If you want to know the truth about homosexuality, you've got to go to black YouTube and listen to the girls.

46:05How do you get to black YouTube, by the way? Well, you know, it's just sort of tumbling. It's a tumbling kind of thing. You find one good video by somebody who's like, Steph Curry, you've had a task. Sorry. And then, you know, you'll tumble through the algorithm. I'll send you some links. I'll post some links on my Twitter. I don't know if I dare, but you're saying that's the more honest YouTube. It's the only honest YouTube. It's the only honest anything because you go past the churches and you'll see, you know, the white homo demon stealing your man. You know? And it's not the pastor who comes up with this stuff.

46:42It's his wife. It's his wife who's got this, you know, who was trying to set her girlfriend up with somebody. And that was all great. But he went off with a dude, which is, you know, like even, which is sort of equi-distant for them from going off with a white girl or whatever. But no, the only honest place where, you know, people will just be like, did it, fagatas, you know, and then they'll go, Amazing LeBron, fag attacks And they'll go through it all I mean, for me, the neplus ultra of this genre Would be Blac Chyna's mum Do you know who that is? No Of course you don't You remind me of a line from Blackadder sometimes You know, because you have this sort of like lovely Kind of like ingenue kind of thing that you do And it's like, well, no, I don't know anything But do you remember that line from Blackadder?

47:35Like slumbering autogenarians who claim never to have heard of the Beatles No, but I get it. He's talking about high court judges. I've never actually heard of Blackadder before, so I... You're kidding. I'm actually not. What? I don't even know what you're talking about. But that's okay. It's not about me. I'm just trying to... That's how Stephen Fry and Rowan Atkinson got famous. How do you know about Blackadder? I don't know. There are huge gaps. I'm not a knowledgeable man. Jesus and the orphans. Well, you say this, yes. But anyway, so Tokyo Tony is her name. and she's, anyway, you can Google Tokyo Tony, that's your into black everything.

48:12Anyway, she's great. There's a whole, I mean, YouTube now, the only interesting bits of YouTube that still get views are like these black shows. They're like, these massively overproduced shows with these incredibly elaborate sets and they've got like, you know, 43 people live watching but the archives and the clips like go crazy. Anyway.

48:30Man, I've got a series of delights ahead of me. Well, you don't have many black people on the show so you've got me instead. I'll be your African-American contingent. I'll introduce you to these things. So, no, I'm kidding. So you're describing a world into which a lot of conventional propaganda has not yet filtered. Or they're resistant to it or something. It's interesting because, why are you gay? Are you gay? The origin of the born this way, I've just described, I've just explained. The reality is that these communities who experience this problem a lot, right? The black community, particularly because of fatherlessness, a lot of gay black kids, there's just a lot of them, have this very blunt and truthful...

49:20I mean, look, looking at me now, it's impossible to imagine that I used to be a homosexual. It hadn't entered my mind. No, but... I knew you during your flaming stage, so I had heard. Yeah, but there are so many like flaming young black men in America today, especially. And there's a problem this community is dealing with. And they don't, you know, black America is like commendably impervious to a lot of the woke PC language. You know, like very creditably skeptical of vaccines. They won't go along with a lot of this stuff like, you know, the proposition, whatever in California, gay marriage. Why?

50:01It's black women who are like holding on the floor. I love Candace Owens so much. The ungovernability of black women is the only thing that might possibly save America. As embodied in our friend Candace, who is just like, she's ungovernable in the best possible way. She's not going along with it. She isn't, to put it mildly. Yeah, fair, fair. She is not going along with it. And Candace is a very beautiful, polished, intelligent, sort of microcosm of a trend that you see everywhere in black America now, which is like, ain't doing that ain't doing that definitely ain't doing that wow and and and it's very interesting so so um they will be very resistant to this stuff they kind of intuit what white people i think have forgotten because you know we're just all so like bombos are weak and demoralized and like kind of overburdened with this nonsense the truth is that homosexuality and in particular conversion therapy is the first thing upon which the liberals tried what they later did to trump which is just this this wall of uh fake news misinformation propaganda it's the first time i mean there's other examples like around wars and things like that but when it comes to social issues it's the first time i think the press just says oh hell no except they didn't do that because they're white but uh you know that's new sometimes i lose the characters get confused I'm going to put Rwanda away.

51:26No, the first time that the media decides this is a social issue we care about enough because we don't lose our gay friends, that we're going to just lie and demonize and give the full fake news treatment that we later saw in its most sophisticated form leveraged, praise God unsuccessfully, against Trump again and again and again, right? So they start off with this, you know, you were born this way. Honey, you are born this way. Honey, you are beautiful. Whatever you are. No, you're like that because you got raped by a priest. Or you're like that because your mom was overbearing and your dad wasn't around.

52:03Or you're like that because you failed to form a platonic, stable attachment to other men as a child. For some reason, maybe you didn't have a good male role model or whatever. but there is a relatively small number of identifiable and repeated etiologies that mark somebody out as being, you know, vulnerable to this. And you look into the histories of gay people, they're all denying it. They're saying, no, that's just me. But it's not. And they know, they know, because I knew and they know. And I talk to them privately when there's no cameras, they could squeeze it out of them. Eventually that you get there.

52:37Yes, there's something about their sexual activity they know isn't right. And it's not just in the technical sense that the sex is sterile and therefore can never be part of the holy sacrament of marriage because it can't be co-procreation with God, right? Yes. Co-procreation with God, meaning you make a physical body with your wife, but then God puts a soul in. Right. And that's why it's the most precious sacrament because you do the others, you do your confirmation, the rest of it, but it's leading up to you getting to make something with God, right? Which is the real reason that Lucifer is so mad because the angels can't do that, right?

53:14The angels don't get to participate in creation with our Lord. Every single human being does. And you feel that too when you have kids. Even if you don't know what it is, you feel there's something supernatural going on here. This is going to sound completely pathetic, but I have some kind of pathetic simulacrum of it. Now I've become a cat dad. Just in the terms of caring for something helpless. Yes. And it's bringing out of me something that I know is going to lead to fatherhood because I'm responsible for this being that loves and laughs and they do, you know, and requires regular, not just maintenance, but affection and to be tended to and loved.

53:57Like I love dogs. I'm like, I used to be more of a dog guy, but I live in a house on the National Register of Historic Places, so I can't have dogs. And so I just, I got a cat one day, you know, just because somebody found it in an engine. and I was like, I'm so alone. So I said, sure, give it a damn kitten. And at that point, I wasn't sure I was going to drown it, wear it or nurture it. But I was just like, oh, okay. And being responsible for shaping the personality, which anybody who has animals, who loves animals knows that is 100 % real. Responsible for shaping the personality, nurturing that being into either being a parent itself or just into being a companion or to being the best that it can be, right?

54:45It's bringing something out in me, you know, that wasn't present when I was having a lot of what most people would regard as, well, what homosexuals would regard as very desirable kind of sex, you know, with a particular kind of person or whatever. So you get to the base of it and you get to the heart of it if you're sort of one-on-one with the gay person. They won't just talk about the emptiness of their life or the fact that the sex is sterile or whatever. They will know that there's something not quite right. And that its origin is there at something that was not quite right. Have you ever been addicted to anything?

55:20Oh, yeah. Okay. Big time. So you know there's that moment when your mind is flooded and it's all you can think about. Yes. And it's all that you can... You got to get it out because if you don't do a line or have a smoke or do something, if you don't, if you don't get it out, it's just going to be all you can think about for the rest of the day. It's just driving you crazy because it floods your mind. Yeah. I've been addicted to one or two little things. And I realized my sex works the same way. I believe that. Realized that when I was on a plane, I'm sitting down, hey, team 1A, I'm sitting on the plane.

56:02I'm like, yeah, I'll have a genotonic girl. And then, you know, like a basketball player, well, not basketball player, they're all gay nerds, but you know like a football player would sit next to me uh like it would take hold of me there were times i had to like go to the bathroom and like you know yeah because i because i had to get rid of it because it was it was taking hold of my mind it sounds like a demon yeah because it's what it is i joke i say gorgaroth the seaman demon you know he comes out the way he doesn't doesn't visit me very often anymore you know but it's totally real i mean that stuff is all it's all real but it I realized that so I don't do cocaine anymore but I you know it'll shock people to learn I used to be a bit of a cokehead you know when I was you know that rush of dopamine yep the rituals associated with it as well you know I was like oh my god that's how I feel about sex and that's that can't be right it can't be right no it's a it's literally I'm not just talking about gay sex but any that is literally a perversion yes and it is a demon and it's also other things too because these things go hand in hand.

57:07May I ask how in your own, with a Santu personal, how did you wind up? I think we're there now. Okay, I think we are. No, but... I just told you I wanked on UA1722. I cracked one out in the bathroom. People are never going to sit next to me on planes again. I think we're good. Anyone who's ever been... Well, I drank alcohol in the morning. I mean, you know, anyone who's ever been possessed... Please, I'm British. That doesn't count. No, I know. But I'm just saying... Give me a real one. Anyone who's ever been possessed by an obsession knows that it can totally destroy your behavior. But we spend so much time talking in our society about gay and it's all good, of course.

57:45Gay is good and gay rights are good. In fact, they're the marker of human rights. They're the only human right, really. This is the only human right people still care about. Your right to be sodomized. Your right to wake up in the morning and you're like, oh, okay, you're ready to go, are you? and hear that voice in your mind. And it's not a sultry voice. It's not a sexy voice. It's, go and get it. It's, you know, it's like, it's Gorgoroth. Anyway, sorry, I'm interrupting you. Wait, that's dark. I've thankfully never, because it's one of the few problems I don't have, but I get it. That's why Grindr's so dangerous, you know?

58:18It's just like within 20 minutes, they can be in the living room, you know? I want to ask you about that. But first, let me ask about your own life, because you never get to ask, you know, everyone's telling you how proud they are to be gay, and that's great, and all that. but it's a sin by the way pride is a sin well I agree with that but you never get to ask like how did this how did you start being gay like specifically describe with you know the way I remember in a PG way right if you insist no the way I remember we've done enough the way I remember it is I just did it to piss off my mother but that's not true I think that's that's self-mythologization you know like I did take a lot of drug dealers home when I was were you close your mom when i was in high school she married uh so so so i'll answer your question i'll skip back first let me let me do that first so my dad was in organized crime um funny charismatic brilliant uh there are things about like maybe alex jones that remind me of him a little bit just in that kind of like um just just in manner you know um like a bit of a bruiser but with the heart, you know, like, you know, like, you know, like he's a bad guy with a heart of gold.

59:30I've known a few. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I cleave to that kind of personality. It reminds me a little bit of the good bits of my dad, right? But there was another section, which Alex does not have, which was that, you know, he was a bad guy and I saw him do really bad things to people. I would come down, I've told this story before, but I've come down, sometimes the kitchen door would be closed and I would hear, you know, Nikki, Nikki, I'm giving up a life of crime. I'm turning over a new leaf. I'm not going to do anything that's going to give me any more than 18 months. You know, it's funny, but...

59:59It's all about goals, Milo. Yeah. But he was a bad guy and I saw him do things that really frightened me.

1:00:09And, you know, he was in pubs and nightclubs in a, you know, running the clubs and the security and sort of like, you know, he's gone now, so I can say it, laundering millions. Yeah. between those two, you know, like the security, these security guards are on$120 an hour, huh? Yeah, yes, yes, officer. Oh yeah, oh yeah, aren't you? Tell him, tell him what you're on. It's like 110, 120, 120 an hour. So he used to let me sit in the booth and like do the stamps and I would watch people go in and I'd watch the behaviors of like low socioeconomic, white, working class, like in their 20s, just you know just drinking and effing you know and and and then i saw some of the things my dad did and they would start with that joke they'd start with that very charming joke they'd start with that alluring joke and my dad had like a degree in my dad had a master's in fine art he was a great sculptor and painter but that but that was the charming bit of him the dark bit was you know like he would say to people um can i use bad language on the show yes yes you may because you and bleep it, but my dad would say like, listen, just because you're in a wheelchair, don't give you the right to be a cunt.

1:01:23And he would grab the wheelchair, spin it around and like walk people up to, you know, like to parking lot edges and stuff like that. And I'm sitting in the car like, you know, or he'd go collecting, which means protection rackets. And he would, you know, I would overhear like, Julian, can you take your glasses off, please? I don't want to get glass in my finger when I poke your fucking eye out it's very charming very funny like very Tony Soprano kind of like that kind of ilk you know but I saw some of it and I think maybe somewhere in my head I was like yeah if that's being a man I think I'm out because I was a child I was frightened and then my mother left him and married a new guy and he was very like he's sort of a nice guy now but but he would go through all my stuff.

1:02:15Like if I had papers, you know, if I was reading something for school or whatever, he would like, when I was out, go through every page and just sort of leave it like this. It's just that I knew that he'd been in there, you know? And that kind of like invasive, like, just horrifying, like, it was just for a very sensitive artistic child, like me, you know, already on my way then, you know, having had a much larger than life grandmother who was like, you know, egging this stuff on. and by this time I had had some interactions, sexual interactions with a Roman Catholic priest who's dead now, has been dead for a long time, but that had obviously, you know, that fed into it as well.

1:02:47Wait, wait, stop, stop. That obviously fed into it. Right. Well, if you're being molested. Yeah. Well, yeah, also the molestation. No, but really for me, this is why it's important to do the other stuff first before you get, oh, and I was raped by a priest.

1:03:05But this sort of psychological torture as I experienced it was, you know, sort of like I had no private space anywhere. And I knew that all the men in my life were just not things I wanted to become. Yes. And then I cast my, see if you let me get to it. Then I cast my mind back to a lovely old rich man in a frock, Father Michael. And I, who had not been like that with me.

1:03:32And one of the things that got me into trouble 10 years ago was when I said I felt like the kind of the aggressor in that situation. I didn't know what bad stuff it had done to me. And at that time I didn't. You know, I made a couple of jokes that got GOP Inc. hot and bothered because they're all faggots. They weren't happy about some of the truths that we're talking about today kind of toppling out, you know. and so these things combined the having what I perceived to be at that time I perceived as a child to be consensual sexual experiences with an older man who was a kindly yes kindly sweetheart you know he was I think of him now as a harmless old queen you know of course what he was doing was not harmless well you have a right to any opinion you want about the experiences that happened to you apparently not well I've been retired for some time as a result.

1:04:27Well, I continue to believe that people are allowed to formulate their own opinions about their own lives. I think you should be able to talk about your rape however you like. I kind of agree with that. And not necessarily have to go on live international television and apologize for it like I did, but I'm not bitter.

1:04:44Fortunately, I carved out a much... I have a new kind of career and a new life now that I much prefer. more satisfying, lucrative, blah, blah, blah. We'll do it later. So I haven't gone crazy like so many of my friends. And it's funny watching them because I see some of the, in the way that their personalities have become kind of empty and sharded and become filled with wickedness. I see some of the things that I have been working over the last 10 years to get away from that created this sexual behavior. They've become faggotized. Well, there does seem to be a connection, but it does, you know, the incidence of closeted homosexuality on the right is like overwhelming.

1:05:29It's like way above what you would imagine is statistically probable. Three straight guys on the right. It's like Alex, you, and I have a floating wild card just in case I forgot anybody. Who else is there? Who else is there? I mean, maybe the Tates, but who else is there? What is that? I don't understand that. There's such a long relationship a long, happy marriage between conservative politics and homosexuality. And it's easy to joke about it and say, oh, it's all of the bells and smells and frocks of the religious dimension to it all, or it's the pomp and circumstance of power. The New Testament is really tough on homosexuality.

1:06:09So I don't see it as a, that's certainly not a Christian thing. It's not a Christian thing. But of course, it's easy to understand with the sort of obscene, obese heresies of the type that obtain in this country. I mean, in a country where prosperity gospel can thrive, who would be surprised, right? It's not an authentic faith as we would know. I sometimes tease you about your denomination, but Episcopalian churches is as close to us as it's possible to get. And it was designed to be a mirror to high Anglicanism, which was indistinguishable from Catholicism. And at its best, it's a very similar creed.

1:06:46you know, and with a very similar style and similar beliefs, you know. Yeah. But as soon as you wander away from that in America, it's just like mental. So, but what is, and I'm not attacking anybody and I never want to out people because I don't, you know, it's not my business, right? I've never done it. And I mean, maybe. I live to out people. I live to out people. On which subject? Cory Booker. Did you say? But what is that? Why is it so common on the right? Well, of course, on the left too, but on the right with closeted gaze. Like, I don't get that. It's an interesting question I've never heard a really good answer to.

1:07:28I'll be honest with you. I suppose I should have a good answer to that, but I don't. But I think if it's about anything, it's about the exercise of power over others. Yes, I feel that. I have no idea exactly why that's true, but I feel that that's true. What's the worst thing about magic? It's not that you can turn a person into a frog or you can make yourself look more beautiful or you can whatever. What's the worst thing about magic? Is that it robs others of agency, that you can make them do things they don't want to do. The worst and most sinister bit of magic is that you can trick someone or compel someone against their will to fall in love with you or to throw themselves off a cliff.

1:08:07It's a kind of slavery, yeah. Exactly. The most frightening thing about magic is its ability to compel the wills of others. Yes. And that's what I think homosexuals are seeking because they feel so powerless in their own lives and have this understanding that they are broken people without agency over their own sex lives, over their bodies, over that down there. Like, I don't even have control over me, but I'm damn well gonna have control over you. That's, I think, a lot of it. And so if you dovetail that in with the - I know you're telling the truth here. I don't fully understand what you're saying, but it comports with a lot of what I've seen.

1:08:43I feel as though if you are a person who intuits that you have a lack of control, of power, of agency over your own drives, your own desires, your own urges, and even your biological, anatomical, your physical responses, like I can't stop getting aroused by men. What is that? you're going to want to exercise power elsewhere over others. Oh, that's so interesting. And being sucked into the nexus of intersectional blah, blah, blah, blah, you're going to be tempted by explicit magic as well as the implicit magic of whatever. And so, you know, dovetail that with right-wing authoritarianism and I have to say, I'm sorry to say it, I must say it, some dimensions in some respects, I can see that that might be something that attracts homosexuals to the Catholic Church, for instance.

1:09:44Just the illusion of being a bishop. Or National Review magazine, you know, which is... You don't just say, man, it's all right. I'm happy to talk about the Catholic element of it. I mean, the bishops are all faggots. I mean, they're all whoopsies. Whoopsies? Gays. I like that one. It contains within it a kernel of the sort of slapstick that I think we have to, one of the ways I got myself off it was imagining myself in that situation as ridiculous. Like, I can't even perceive that I would do something so ridiculous. Like laughing at it became, because you know, I laughed as the death of arousal, right?

1:10:22I totally agree. So I read this, or something like that. Anyone who's ever been laughed at naked can tell you that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, never have. I haven't either. I tell you. No, but I mean, you know, I think it's a famous British, particularly a British injunction, you know, that laughter is the death of arousal or whatever. And I just thought, okay, well, how about if I start thinking about it as ridiculous? Because it is ridiculous. I mean, you and the football team, it is ridiculous. And so that's one of the ways I was talking about it. But no, this... That is so true.

1:10:59Seeing themselves as powerless, even to control their own bodies and knowing on some level, I think homosexuals seek out those places. And, you know, you see on the left as well. So this is why you might want to bomb Iran in Venezuela. Yeah, bomb, bomb, bomb, bomb, bomb Iran. What's gayer? What's gayer? I'm not saying he was a practicing homosexual physically, but is there anything gayer than John McCain's like bloodlust? I agree. Or his protégés. Seen through this prism. I mean, he's even got the fat friend. It's his daughter. You know, he even bred the fat best friend, You know, like, is there a more ostentatious, like, fag hag in America than Meghan McCain?

1:11:36You know, she hates herself. She's fat. She's crazy. She's every gay man's dream. You know, she can't dress. You know, she's... Why is that every gay man's dream? Because they want to visit upon their female friends the cruelty they wish that they could perform on their mothers. Whoa. Whoa. they want to make her feel fat and ugly and ridiculous because that's what their mother did to them. And there was no dad around to protect them and their mother was just this overbearing, terrible, you know, sort of the Jungian devouring mother. All of this has been banned in the United States. So I don't even think people are familiar with these concepts anymore.

1:12:18Right, so I'll try to keep it simple. Imagine like a female, like Lutheran pastor or a female Jewish rabbi. And that is like, you know, hey, it's great to grieve. That's for a TV show. But you know, one of those, right? This is horrible, overbearing monstrousness that on some level the homosexual knows is what's made him like this. Because dad wasn't around, so mom did it, right? By the way, this is why trans was so popular because it got parents off the hook. If you've got a gay kid, you know you did something, but if your kid has a disease and was born into the wrong body, well, that's not your fault, is it?

1:12:58And you get all the sympathy and all your friends are like, oh, do you got a trans kid? How tough are you? No, you got a faggot because you raised a faggot because you're a terrible parent. You know, that's what's really going on. They want to avoid that. So instead, no, I'm going to chop its ding dong off and say it's got a disease. That's why it was so popular with single moms. Amazing. That's why trans were so popular with single moms because it got them off the hook. It means they didn't turn their son gay when they know they did. They know they did. They know they did. And the sons know they did.

1:13:25And the sons grow up being cruel to women because of what mom did to them. So they're hostile toward their moms, even though many gay men I've known have had very close relationships. But it's a toxicity. It's a codependent relationship that they know is... So sometimes they can't visit this cruelty on their mom because they have this close relationship with their mom, but they do it on other women. It's redirected, right? It's transferred onto other women because they love a mommy. Like, what would I do without my mom? but on some level they know that she did that. She did that. So they force women into ever more uncomfortable and ever uglier outfits and throw them down runways in 10-inch heels.

1:14:13Or they... What? So you think the fashion industry is acting this out? Of course it is. I mean, what other explanation could there be for the intolerable ugliness of the catwalk? Look, you are blowing my mind on so many levels. I can't even. I mean, sure, we used to have, when society was working properly, you would go, have you ever seen Mrs. Aris Goes to Paris? No. It's a lovely movie about a char lady. Housekeeper too? Yes, housekeeper, yes, to Americans. See, I didn't know a char woman, and you've never seen Mrs. Aris Goes to Paris, who dreams of one day owning a couture d 'or dress, like the person she works for.

1:14:54right and she saves up and she saves up and there's calamities with her money and you know some some boyfriend loses whatever and eventually she manages to go to paris and she manages to get the dress right and when society was properly ordered there were these aspirational um beauty standards and these aspirational lifestyle goals included gorgeous tailoring and beautiful um uh um silhouettes for women that accentuated their uh you know their gorgeous because she goes, it's not like that now, is it? It's not like that now? No, and it's funny. I don't know much, I don't know really anything about fashion, but I love female beauty, of course.

1:15:30But you don't see any of it on the catwalk now. Exactly. In fact, you see the opposite. You see the opposite. You see manufactured ugliness. Gay men turning women into the demons they see themselves as. You see gay men. Look at the most celebrated woman on the stage at the moment is the Gorgon opposite Ariana Grande, whose name I forget now. You know, this Nosferatu, like black Nosferatu, who seems to be sucking the life force out of poor Ariana, who's I think going to die within the next few weeks. If you've seen that singer's physique lately, she sort of, but this appalling apparition, um cynthia or something i think uh of course she's called cynthia um you know with these with these claws you know and you look at the silhouette and you're like that's literally nosferatu it's literally nosferatu and i know a gay man did that and of course the gay man then put her on stage in jesus christ superstar as our lord did you know that no if you've seen you've seen the person i'm talking about right no okay well you'll google it later but um it's this spindly, just straight up goblin looking black woman.

1:16:46Like, and I, you know, I'm not trying to have like a Roseanne moment, although she was right. You know, whatever. But this woman is like, you know, like ugly by any racial stage, just monstrous looking, right? Just what our mothers might've called deeply unfortunate, right? Yeah. And practically circus level. and of course she's the heroine of of the billion dollar franchise now wicked and she's um and she's on stage as jesus which which so it's an act of hostility is what you're saying exactly exactly and and and so the these gay men who feel the will of gorger off inside them you know and and and turn these women into the demons they see inside themselves.

1:17:37You know, the demons they see acting on. This is a lot deeper than I expected. I texted you to have this conversation. It's more than you would imagine from a guy wearing this t-shirt. No, it's not actually. And by the way, can I say one thing that's bothered me for years? When I was a child, there was a lot of creativity coming from gay men in the United States. It's all gone now. I know. And it's Dave Rubin is responsible. Not him personally, but I mean like. But do you know what I'm talking about? I mean, of course. And why? Because a lot of free thinking. And I was related to one of them. And I spent a lot of time in my house, lived in my house when I was a kid and gay died of AIDS, you know, but and had a lot of problems.

1:18:16But I will say creative, free thinking, like truly free thinking. Gore Vidal was like the archetype. This is Burkean. There are no Gore Vidal's in gay world that I'm aware of. They're all like conformists and supporting the man. Like what? The only ones these days are ex-gay. But do you know what I'm talking about? Yes, and it's Burkean. It's because creativity arises out of order. There has to be limits. And if homosexuality is not prescribed as wretched and kept at the fringes where it belongs, creativity dies. And what do you get? Because you don't have those people playing with the limits.

1:18:52You don't have the taboo breakers. You don't have the artists, the creatives living at the limits of society. They're brought instead. I have to say - I think the gay community such as this is one of the least creative, most conformist elements of our society. I never thought I would say that. They become the enforcers just like - They're the enforcers. They're the Praetorian guard for Apple and Microsoft. What the hell? Just like the white women of folklore who are responsible for all evil. But they become like turbocharged Karens. And it's the white women who welcome in And the white single moms typically, but single moms generally, I think, who bring in a drag queen story hour.

1:19:34Because there's no gay people like banging down the door. No, that's right. There's no gay people like, excuse me, can I come read your kids? Do you mind? Can I come read stories to your kids? Like, no, they're not. They're not. But there are demons out there who will come do it if you invite them. Because what do you have to do with demons? Open a portal, open a doorway, you know? Yes, I do. These women open the doorway and in comes, you know, three little pigs.

1:20:04But the gays now have taken this role. They've taken the mantle over from, you know, what we used to, I mean, we used to say, didn't we? We used to say white single moms are root of all evil, like, you know, kind of half joking because of all this crazy stuff they support. But now it's homosexuals. I have to be honest with you. I bear some responsibility for this because it was me 10 years ago mainstreaming homosexuality into the Republican Party. It's the great regret of my life, more so than anything I've done to my own soul, which is a lot. It's the great regret of my life because it has given rise to horrors I never imagined.

1:20:43Let me say Lenin said, all revolutionaries come to hate their children. Well, the gay horrors that I've given birth to, Lady Marga, Nick Fuentes, I mean, they keep me up at night. They keep me up at night. I mean, you know. Why did you mention Dave Rubin? What's his role? Well, because he is at the vanguard, along with another of other gays in public life, of introducing children into the equation. Because when you do what I did, which is like, gays just like everyone else, you'd be a normal gay. I remember, and this is the thing I regret more than anything else in the world, there's a video of Ross Matthews in 2017 on Twitter saying, so I came home and landscapers have been in.

1:21:22We're getting more citrus. You can never have too much citrus. And people were asking me, Ross, what do you think about this Milo guy? And I'm like, Milo, Milo, how low can you go? I don't know who this person is, but I read it. And he says, I'm getting letters. This is Milo guy. He's resigning from Breitbart or something. And he says, I'm getting letters from people who say, you make it okay that I have a gay son because if he grows up, he doesn't have to be like Ross Matthews. And I was like, no, they should be like Ross Matthews. They should be like Ross Matthews. They shouldn't be like Dave Rubin.

1:21:52like you might not even know unless you've watched him for a little bit because this domesticity of homosexuals has killed all the things that were good about gays that made them like tolerable and instead has given them this grotesque parody, this simulacrum of domesticity which has of course in their never-ending hunger expanded to include babies. And now we have the Buttigieg couple buying black children. I thought you weren't allowed to buy people. I thought - Oh, no, you can if you're homosexual. But I thought that was - It's called adoption or surrogacy or whatever, but you can buy them.

1:22:31I thought it was called slavery. In fact, you have to buy them because it's really, and it's quite expensive. Is it some online slave market? It doesn't cover, no, no, no, it's the government. And as you know, but Dave Rubin has like frankensperm babies. Like he mixed his effluvia with that of his husband. I mean, this is real. This is physical. Gave it a stir and hoped for the best. And whichever one we get, we get. And planted it in some highly paid woman we'll never know the name of, the real mother of those children. And, you know, he and his catamite are on the internet, you know, with these signs like, it's coming with these two dates and i'm like yeah your damnation that's the date you're counting down to the the the date you're how is that conservative oh because it's family you see because it's uh it's the the the the sleight of hand like that's going on is they're like well gay is just like everybody else so we should behave like everybody else which means we should have kids and if we don't physically have kids because our sex is this like demonic sterile horror show, then we'll buy them and then we'll look like we've got it.

1:23:51I mean, that's how bad it is. That's how bad it is. And so you have the, I love, I don't know if it says anything about Republicans versus Democrats, but you have like Dave Rubin, for whom buying a child is not good enough. It must be his own, you know, like the conceit of that. So on the right, you've got this sort of techno conceit Frankenbaby. And on the left, they adopt blacks. You know, you've got these two wispy, wiry faggots who adopted two black babies. I mean, isn't Buttigieg just the most interesting character of our age? Like, I mean, he doesn't look like he. He looks like an intensely boring homosexual.

1:24:35Like, it's everything gay people shouldn't be. But it's so interesting the fact that, I mean, clearly he wasn't gay, like at the beginning. Well, he had girlfriends. Right. So he wasn't gay, but he made himself gay. I made that point because actually I had gay men who worked for me who were more in tune with this than me. I'm not in tune at all. I just didn't. I thought Peter put his judge into the joke, but they said, well, he's not really gay. And I was like, no. So what does that mean? Well, his sexuality, like all homosexuality, is a function, a product, a symptom. What is his homosexuality a symptom of?

1:25:12It's of his vaulting ambition. Buttigieg timed it perfectly so that post-Obama, the gay guy with the black kids, perfect presidential candidate. So I think to the heterosexual brain, it's like, are you really saying a guy would switch his, quote, sexuality in order to get a better job? Yeah. Yeah. Women do it all the time. lesbianism has got nothing to do with male homosexuality. Just look, everybody knows they got a college girlfriend who was a, they got a girlfriend who was a lesbian in college. Yeah. Everybody. Like you could barely find a woman who hasn't played around with a woman. Queen Victoria didn't believe that this was sex or that two women would do that with one another.

1:25:56And she refused to accept that women even did that very wisely, realizing that lesbianism wasn't real. And so lesbianism wasn't illegal in Britain for a long time when male homosexuality was. But female sexuality is known in the studies to be far more malleable. Women go backwards and forwards between men all the time. And, you know, lesbianism is a social and political decisions, a series of social and political decisions. I mean, women want companionship, they want stability, they want safety. They can find that in a woman, you know, like you can find that in a butch dyke just as easily as you can find it in an American man these days.

1:26:34I'm sorry you know at least she can cash in her Harley Davidson what have you got you know but sorry I love the jackets go for something you know that warehouse full of eyeliner you've got no I joke but only slightly we've seen women do it seen women do it they do all the time they choose to be lesbians all the time so so so you don't find it you don't find the i realize it sounds extreme and implausible well to i to me anyway it's like really but we're dealing with a sociopath here we're dealing with somebody who's who's entirely divorced from his own emotional from his own feelings right we're dealing from somebody we're dealing with somebody who will do anything go anywhere be anything.

1:27:24I mean, are you telling me like, is it so crazy that he would get, that he would have a boyfriend and adopt these kids? Is it so much more insane than a gay man living in the closet and having a wife and having sex with her and producing children with her? Is that so nuts? Like, okay, so there's probably more sex involved. Fair, fair. Is it, like, isn't it just like that on steroids? Like, is it so bonkers? And that's where gay people should be, by the way, in the closet, praying to get better. But is it so wild? It's not wild. No, you're right. I just hadn't thought of that. And gay men have been doing that for centuries.

1:28:01Well, I know a bunch of them. Of course. Well, you work in, and I used to work in, conservative media. It's all of them. It's everybody. It's everybody. They're all faggots. They're all gay. All of them are gay. All of them are gay. Like, everyone is gay. I haven't said anything about it for like 30 years because of my just general... Anglo commitment to not get involved in other people's business. But it's so noticeable. I just don't know what... Clearly, there's something going on here. Yeah, I think it's the exercise of power over others as we talked about. I think it's really smart. But in this case, the Buttigieg, I find him fascinating because he's misjudged, but only slightly, what would be required to be the perfect presidential candidate like in 2028, 2024, right?

1:28:54And he starts off and he's got girlfriends. He's in the military.

1:29:00He's living a normal like American life. And then, chasten. I mean, like if you want to, they say that ex-gays often go for like Near Eastern women because they're not sexually demanding they look like boys from behind you know like some malaysian girls um you know when they come to have wives uh but isn't chasing kind of like the closest thing you can get to a girl um closest you know sort of if you need a similar cream of a woman you know flip him over could be a girl you know um i don't think i know what chasing looks like his well you're blessed um his husband is is if you don't know that then you might know the expression aged out twink or uh but but um he's about as the most the most effeminate man that you could you could oh is that true yeah um not in the kind of like so so there's whereas pete has that kind of fake radio voice like yeah yeah yeah yeah so you know yeah yeah yeah so so you know um and it is a fake voice because you can get you can find recordings of him earlier and he's got more into it the more gay his life has become really yeah like the the the base the diaphragm it's like talk from your stomach Pete talk from your stomach you can imagine chasing him before he goes on stage remember babes from your stomach he's like yeah from down here you can just imagine remember what Lindsay said you know the speech coach who taught him how to sound heterosexual you know but no no it's going down it's like sinking it's like there's something in there working its way through this like achingly slow form of peristalsis gradually finding its way down eventually he's going to sound like Gorgoroth you know when he realizes his full potential no he

1:30:53he's fake he's not gay he's not gay there's a doubt in my mind he's not gay but he's performing homosexuality because and including having the sex you know but probably not a lot of it I mean you don't imagine them you know well I don't want you to imagine anything because I don't wish to to leave an unpleasant taste in your mouth like that. But I'll suggest to your viewers that it's not a particularly sexually active couple, which might also explain how it's possible for somebody to do that, right? In the same way that a DL gay guy wouldn't be a particularly sexual husband, right? Are gay marriages monogamous?

1:31:35That's funny. Oh, you mean it? Well, I sense that they're not having known some. But are any, I guess is what I would ask. I mean, I think you get that sort of elderly antiques dealer in Kentucky. You know, you get that. That's so good. You know, we have a senator like that who, you know, I think if he found a husband who was prepared to put up with them. I really shouldn't. I really shouldn't. But look up the ladybugs. Look up his ladybugs. It's on the internet. We have so many senators like that. It's crazy. Well, I think people know the one I mean. Oh, the actual one from Kentucky. No, no, no.

1:32:17A little bit over. You know, you can imagine he sort of invites his friend, Jasper, in for a mint julep. You know, and it's like, do you want to just sit there while I'm going to get myself dusted up? You know, like, yes, of course, there are loads, loads. But I'm thinking of the one in particular, everybody kind of, you said you don't out people. so I feel like - No, sorry, sorry, sorry. I'm not going to use Mitch McConnell's name. It was Lindsey Graham. Oh, okay. But no, it's a shame, isn't it? The falling over, how long are you going to stagger on? They're determined to turn themselves into the goblins that dictate their behavior.

1:32:55Well, that's the thing about, and I'm not, yeah, it's that there's a bloodthirstiness that's just really distressing and offensive to me, actually. But think about it like this. the sassy, vindictive, catty cruelty of the homosexual. Imagine what he'd be like if you gave him a nuclear button, right? It sounds stupid, but it's a continuum. It's a spectrum, right? And so those gays that have the will to power, they go get some and they use it to bomb people or to bully. I mean, how much must they all get off on the fact that they are all having sex and nobody would dare touch it. Nobody outs them.

1:33:41Nobody says a thing. And they're all living lies to their consent. I mean, we were joking earlier about outing people, but that's why I have a thirst for it because it's hypocrisy. It's public hypocrisy. I'm not interested in outing Joe Simpson who has a corner store. I'm interested in outing people who are misrepresenting themselves to the public. and somebody just got married with wedding pictures and with engagement pictures that are so absurd. I know. I figured him out, by the way. I figured him out. I could never work out this guy. I was like, what is it that's off with you? And I realized he always wants a bigger laugh than the joke he tells commands.

1:34:19And it's because he's actually obese, but in the body of a merely fat person. Like if you think of him as like 400 pounds, he suddenly makes sense. Because he's always doing this, you know? and you're like oh you're a fat person you're a giant fat person so he's like a really fat gay in the body of like a a merely slightly overweight gay and suddenly his personality begins to make sense he does all these like fat you know he's got these like fat tics that fat people do to like get a bigger laugh than their wit would normally allow for you know you know what I mean and everybody laughs long anyway because they're fat you know the fat people are just funny because they're fat you know and he's like he's he's like he acts like he's funny because he's fat but he's not fat you're talking about cory booker yeah yeah so just back to the question though is so is monogamy an expectation in a gay marriage no i think well i think it's an aspiration i think it's a i think it's a stated ambition uh but you know like all ambitions you know we we state something we know we can never reach because in grasping for it, we, you know, we achieve greatness.

1:35:30And so maybe they only have sex with 20 people a year instead of 200, you know, and that's gay, that would be gay fidelity. That would be gay. Really? Oh, yeah. I'm not even going to tell you. I mean, maybe I'll tell you, but like, because there's no woman there to enforce it. So I've always... And normally no kids to the blah, blah, blah. How could you use your children? This is why living on the DL in marriage with a woman is the optimum environment for a homosexual. Because all of the social cues are pushing them to do what they know that they should be doing anyway, which is working on eradicating these disordered urges, as the religious ex-gays would put it, or unwanted same-sex attraction as the reparative therapists would have it.

1:36:28Whatever it is, all of the cues and the pressure is moving them in the right way. And so, you know, I mean, it's good. Alan Turing, for God's sake, you know, was living like that. Who was? Alan Turing, you know, he was living like that. And they castrated him anyway, which seems a bit mean to me after the war, after he'd won the war for them. It's like, okay, that's all brilliant, but we're going to chemically castrate, you know, It's in a vicarious system. It's like, come on, come on. Oh, God. I let him crack one out after he won the bloody war for you. Oh, my God. All right, all right. So Brits can be savage like that, you know.

1:37:02So do you know, like, the happiness level of people who are involved in, like, promiscuous gay sex? Like, what's it? When you...

1:37:16When you live that kind of life, you're living deep in profound denial. And it comes from, I read something in, maybe it's the Atlantic or Mother Jones, of all places, you know, some left-wing gay guy who just wrote about this really beautifully. I'll try to find it in Twitter after this. But he said, when homosexuals are young, they realize they have to put on different faces for different people. I guess the racial equivalent would be code switching, right? Yeah. And the effect of this on a person who has disordered urges, unlike someone who just happens to be black, is that it begins to like create cracks and ultimately that turn into like shards in the personality, like bits of the personality, like burst, ping off like a chandelier that fell to the floor.

1:38:03And it's so sad. Yeah. And it produces the space for profound denial of the type that most homosexual men find themselves in, where that flooding of addictive urge is mistaken for healthy and normal sexual um uh attraction and so i kind of stumbled when i when i looked into i just woke up one day and i was like and i was married to a dude to my shame and i who's now like the ex-wife from hell my god um you know look if there's no other reason to like not be gay just imagine like how bad a black homosexual ex-wife is oh like I'm not even going to go there you don't even want to know it's like oh sorry with two sports cars a year wasn't enough okay all right okay all right um don't even but um

1:39:02when I woke up one day and I I woke up one day and I looked over and I was like oh no I don't want to do this anymore like hell is real I don't want to go there and it just hit me like all after it was growing you know while I was just like no no I really don't want to go there and I, no, what am I doing? And the way that I started to address this, I kind of stumbled upon a crude version of what the enlightened, like they don't call it conversion therapy anymore, they call it reintegrative therapy because it's reintegrating those shards and those broken bits of like memory that lead to the wrong output.

1:39:41We can talk in detail if you want to, but I stumbled upon kind of like a crude version of that. So when I was trying to stop myself from doing this stuff, I was using like hot oil on my thighs. I was like doing things, you know, like that hurt. And I was trying to rewire my brain. Because I read a lot of, you know, psychology and anthropology books and stuff like that. So I thought I didn't know. Sex urge is such a basic and powerful urge. It's got to be hard. I thought I knew what I was doing. So I was like, every time I get aroused, I'm going to go and do something that hurts. You know, and so I took the, I took the, you know, like paying my taxes.

1:40:19No, you know, like having sex with black people. No, no, no. I did something immediately to try to redo that. And there's a much better way to do it, which I can talk to you about. But I was, I think I was recognizing in that, that I had this, something had jumped the tracks in my brain right and i was having a an incorrect response to a particular stimulus as a result of damage trauma whatever and that um and that it's a little bit like being a ptsd victim or or some other kinds of sexual deviance right um and that i i knew i knew that i could train my way out of it because at the same time i had been returning to the catholic faith of my childhood and i had been speaking to a dear friend she's a very brilliant professor in chicago she's a world's leading expert on marian devotion in the middle ages and she's you know she was she was she was kind of like feeding me this rich material about you know training the soul in virtue and and and i was i was like okay well if i can do it about that because i'm getting pretty good at that like what about this and so i did this stuff and and i And I got myself as far as celibacy, which is where I'm coming.

1:41:43In January, it'll be five years. Oh, celibacy. Yeah. And the good thing about the male libido is the less you have, the less you want, which married men can tell you is the only reason they're still married. You know. It's like sugar, though. The more you eat, the more you want. It is exactly like that. Why? Because it's an appetite, not a sexual orientation. It's an appetite. It's an addiction. and the more that you have cocaine or adderall the more that you are likely on a given tuesday afternoon to be like oh lime would be nice or oh why don't i have a little little um little instant release 30 milligrams that'll get me through the day you know um it works the same it functions the same it is the same i remember reading during the aids uh period about you know like the number of sexual partners a year which is like crazy high i think it's all banned i don't a lot to talk about it anymore.

1:42:35But, and thinking, you know, if those were all like hot girls, what I want to sleep with, 75, probably wouldn't be able to get through it. Honestly, I don't think most trade men would. It'd be like, yeah, you know, I mean, men are obviously pigs and like variety and all that stuff. No, but you've hit on something real, which is that. Well, I'm trying to be as honest as I can. I'm sure I'll be mocked for this, but I did wonder like if it's, there's something wrong with the act itself if you're doing with that many people, right? Yes. Now there's a component of it Where it's like the women are setting up the friction there.

1:43:08They're the ones with the precious jewel. They're setting up barriers too, right? Men will put out. Like if a man wants to have sex, they're normally the person asking for the sex, right? They're normally the ones who are seeking the sex. Women, normally the ones who are, I wouldn't say withholding it, but regulating the access to it, let's say, as the enforcers. For sure. Take that away. and of course, and put two men on there and you're like, well, if they both want it, they're both going to do it all the time. Of course. But that doesn't really explain. Exactly. Doesn't explain. That was my thought.

1:43:42It's like if there was no limit. Grotesque extent. If good looking women wanted, this is my younger self thinking this, if they wanted to sleep with me as much as I wanted to sleep with them, I still don't think I'd sleep with 75 of them in a year because that sounds kind of gross. Well, I mean, by gay standards, that's a practically celibate. I mean maybe not these days with the boring gays that adopt the children who don't have sex with each other and just molest the kids but um but by by the old-fashioned gay standards of the taboo-breaking promiscuous drug I mean I grew up in London taking a lot of fucking drugs going to a lot of clubs going to Ibiza and then of course you know like in London you had a circuit of clubs trade and beyond and DTPM, whatever.

1:44:29It was like a circuit every weekend. It was four continuous days, right? Which you could only really do with drugs. And during that time, stop soft for sex. I mean, 75 is like, takes you up to February. Actually, I mean, I probably was a lot worse than usual. And I, group scenarios and whatever, but yeah. I mean, it doesn't fully explain the grotesque extent. And by the way, it's always the gay couples that are basically lesbians that live these sexless lives who are incensed when you dare to talk about gay promiscuity. It's not because gay promiscuity doesn't exist. It's because they don't have access to it.

1:45:08But most gays do. And what we are thinking about in our hypothetical example of two men doesn't explain the full grotesque extent of it. and it's because there is something unsatisfying about gay sex. Well, that was my assumption. And you're correct. And it's...

1:45:33So Catholic natural law and the way that law therapies work, they start with this presumption that things are working properly when they are performing the function for which they were designed. Yes. Right? Clearly, an erect member going into the wrong orifice is not performing the function for which it was designed, right? So sex that ends that way too cannot possibly be satisfying. It's not permissible spiritually. It's not satisfying physically. So if you take Catholic church teaching, for instance. No, I think that's real. And that's true for eating. And it's true for beauty. It's sterile.

1:46:12The sex is sterile. No, but every pleasure that's like a righteous pleasure satisfies you. Yeah. I don't need 15 of them, right? But like justice feels good. You know, when you see somebody wicked get the comeuppance and you're like, yeah. And that feels like a lot of, that feels, it feels a little like, as you say, righteous pleasures. All of which tend toward the kind of satisfaction that you, that a lot of people describe getting in Holy Communion. It's filling. Right? It is filling. It is filling. That little wafer is very filling, right? The further you get away from that, the less satisfying things are by volume, if you like.

1:46:51That tiny little wafer, which is complete, you feel like you don't need to feel, eat, drink, think, pray, anything else the rest of your whole life, you just feel like perfect in that moment. Like you have, because you are just in that brief moment in dialogue with our Lord in some fashion. and you're like, that's my Sunday vibes, you know? Like, whatever it is. And it's not until Monday morning that life kind of comes back at you. The further you get away from that, the more stuff you need to approach the same level of satisfaction. Think about like the fake sugar you have, right? Over here. The cornstarch, whatever it's called.

1:47:35How much Hershey's chocolate you have to eat to feel the same as two squares of Capri's, right? Or how many Reese's peanut butter cups equals a steak. Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. Well, I really noticed that. I mean, by the way, you know, Halloween candy, you can, I don't know, I don't know much about calories, but you could eat like millions of calories, but you can't eat six pounds of steak. It's just not possible. But the point is that not that sugar is bad necessarily, but that this fake sugar that has that waxy taste that's not really bad, you need so much more of it to feel satisfied, to get your sugar hit.

1:48:08That is totally right. And in so doing, you have so many more calories. right and you start to get fat and uh and and and then then then you need not just six cokes but eight cokes a day instead of one like so so homosexual sex is sterile it's not capable of leading to production excuse me of procreation right you cannot make a baby with gay sex it is spiritually unsatisfying in addition to being and of course these two things are connected physically unsatisfying too. And when you start to think about everything working, performing the function for which it was designed, doing that for which it was intended, you start to realize why gay sex is not hitting.

1:48:56And this is the basis. This is the start. This is where the therapy begins. It begins... Can I just ask you one last question before you describe how your life has changed? I don't mean to rush onto that. No, no, no. I'm fascinated by it. I just find it so interesting. So you spent like an hour and 20 minutes describing the hell that you lived. You thought it was hellish. You left. And it sounds like you feel better and certainly resolved. But you're not encouraged to feel that way. Like there's something about the life that you live that's treated like a gang initiation or something. Like you can check in, but you can never leave.

1:49:32Like you're not welcome to leave. Well, just look at the comments. You get like, forgive the language, but under every post that I will make online or every, you know, on the rare occasion, I might say something about this in an interview. One phrase keeps popping up over and over again in the comments. You can't unsuck a dick. Meaning there's no salvation for you. Once you're gay, you're gay. You're gay. You're homosexual. But who's pushing that? The stain that that leaves, right? which is profoundly unchristian. I mean, we think about Isaiah, right? You know, your sins may be scarlet, but they'll be washed white as snow.

1:50:09But Saul became Paul. Right. Doesn't exist for these people. And it's often leftist, but not always, insisting on the permanence of this stain. And there's more to it than merely just, I hate you and I want you to hurt or you're doing something stupid or whatever. There's something more going on. And it's, people are terrified by the idea that this might not be an intrinsic part of a person's personality or nature. Why? Why are they afraid of that? I thought we were for personal choice. Well, we're all a bit afraid of that, aren't we? Because we're all kind of like, you know, we see other people who are doing well in life or who have got themselves out of a sticky situation.

1:51:00or who left their phone on the table when they went for the bathroom in the break or whatever and who lash out against others who do seem to be achieving something redemptive. And isn't it true that one of those characterizations of the demons is that in the presence of the light and the presence of good, of the word of God, they hiss and spit, right? And it's not necessarily these people are gay themselves, but to confront the horror that a gay person might be able to un-gay means that whatever you've got going in your life, you could fix easy. But you don't want to, do you? You don't want to get better.

1:51:47You don't want to stop. Because if he can stop having sex with men, knowing what a powerful compulsion urge that is for most men, you know that might mean i have to stop drinking that might mean i have to stop taking drugs that might mean i have to stop being a fat ass that might mean i have to stop being cruel being vindictive abusive malicious uh and i think that part of it is certainly that we have become a society that encourages vice over virtue that aggressively pushes sin yes why because dumb dependent people are easier to control because dumb dependent people living paycheck to paycheck enslaved not only to and we and we live in a particularly evil

1:52:39environment now where we're not just enslaved to things we're enslaved to the mechanisms by which we get them compound interest you know uh you know our our car payments all this kind of 50 year mortgages. Yeah, thanks Trump. How many years of that are we just paying down the interest before we own a brick in the house? We're now enslaved to these like meta addictions or these additional layers of problem, which mean that we can't even do anything about our lives because one missed paycheck. We can't do anything. Totally true. We can't do anything about it because we're locked in from every single angle into our addictions, into our compulsions, into the bad food that we eat in the supermarket because it's cheap.

1:53:20And the TV we watch, we know we shouldn't. And the video games that are fine by themselves, but which, you know, 20 hours over the weekend, like that's a lot, bro. You know, just all this stuff. And it's packaged and it's pushed and it's encouraged. And just look at the sponsors. I looked at the sponsors of Jimmy Kimmel's show when he was taken off the air. And it's donuts and banks. Look at the sponsors of Jimmy Kimmel's show and you're like, oh my God. Like, these are evil, wretched, terrible people who just want you fat, stupid, and quiet. There's no question in my mind you're telling the truth.

1:53:59It's too obvious. They want you dumb and dependent. And do you think the relentless promotion of homosexuality is part of that? Because it is relentlessly, tirelessly promoted, period. Anyone says it's not, it's a liar. What is more incapacitating? What is more incapacitating? Having no control over your own sexual desires. and just look at how comfy capitalism has made itself with homosexuals. Like, oh, you've got no kids? Well, perhaps you'd like these designer clothes. You know, oh, you don't have any dependents? Well, maybe you'd like to spend way more than you should on this cruise. You know, or whatever, I mean, boat cruise.

1:54:35You know, oh, all your disposable income is yours to spend? Well, perhaps you'd like to try. We do have a special this evening, sir. like our pan roasted blah blah blah blah blah blah you know they used to call it the pink pound in England this disproportionate ability of gays to spend which has a reinforcing effect it's like a I don't know the economic term but you probably do it has like a magnifying or a fortifying effect because of course gays spend more so you market more to gays so you get more of them and then other people begin to acquire gay taste which has happened to women and is now happening to men because it's seen as a prestige or a luxury or a desirable kind of lifestyle so you see men as the charming ladies of YouTube would tell us who are acquiring gay habits and I mean like soul cycle I mean please what are these people doing it's like you're in a lycra and you want me to see your ass got it because this is doing nothing what other gay habits are men acquiring uh definitely um a food which i mean like if you're if you're a chap as i was in a hotel last night um as i was thinking about this show and i looked at the menu and i was like there's nothing on here for men it was all these like seafood um uh a bit but but hand whatever and the guy was serving me had a huge ginger beard um god bless him and and i said you don't eat here and he said well and i said you don't eat here where do you eat and he said okay fine and i said is there anything on here that you would eat aside from this uh and he didn't say how big the filet was but i was like what is it six ounces but you need four of those and he was like, yeah.

1:56:32You know, and I was like, I was like, you work here and you're just like, you wouldn't eat anything because there's nothing for men on the menu because it's all this like airy-fairy, unsatisfying, calorie-rich, full of like, you know, flavor but no protein food for girls. All food for girls. Look at the menu in your favorite restaurant. Look at the menu in every restaurant. There's no food for men on it. I mean, like, where is it? Even like a heroic meat like lamb. it's like 78 dollars to this little this little like thanks thanks so much what is that that's not man food so food for sure i mean clothing let's not even um uh uh sexual habits women uh have become thagatized by by the promiscuity culture that their gay best friends um you know like to to sort of have a nudge and a wink kind of relationship with like oh I don't do it but who's this oh just Jamal you know

1:57:34who's this that's not the guy that you were with like three days ago quiet girl sorry about her you know like just all that kind of stuff and men just the way in which the self-destructive

1:57:50self-sacrifice the relinquishment of the will to the most addictive version of everything is very gay. Very gay. The most addictive version of everything. So like if gay sex is like addiction where it just floods your mind with like the chemicals where you can't get it out of your head, like we were talking about right at the beginning. Well, the food has become like that and the clothes have become like that. And, you know, like men buying designer clothes has always been a bit sus to me. Oh, I totally agree. I mean, I do it because I'm like, I've got about another three years where I can still get away with this and then I'm going to have to just be straight.

1:58:30Well, I can still do it, you know, and then I'm going to have to find like some, some like, I'm going to have to find my own nudge and a wink thing. Like, oh no, they're not Dr. Gimano, they're Arellano. Oh, that's the, it's the, it's the late Pope Benedict XVI's favorite shoemaker from, you faggot ass, you know, stop it. You know, I'm going to have to give all this up. But, but somebody's been heterosexual all their life. Like, what are you doing in Dior? Well, I mean, they only make shoes, I think. No, no, no, there's male Dior now. What are you doing? It's Chanel that doesn't do men's clothes.

1:59:00What are you doing in Dolce & Gabbana? What are you doing in Versace? Why are you spending$1 ,000 on a pair of shoes that is not like a tactical or a... And even that stuff. Oh my God. Like the faggotization of like the... You know, now you can go to Cryptek and you can get the Versace of camo. it's like which which their sales people will even call it that not on the website because men don't like that but but you know like there's now like designer camo uh where it's like i mean i know i have it but uh but you know uh faggotize faggotize everything is look at the consumer who's making these decisions women and we and we have this women women in the marketing departments women in the in the advertising women on social media everything's going gay and and and and it's It's justified.

1:59:51And just the same way the pink pound is self-reinforcing. This thing we always say, oh, women make most of the purchasing decisions in most houses. Shut up. Like, it doesn't mean every man has to go out looking like he wants to drop on his knees in a public park or in a toilet just because his wife chooses what washing powder they use. Like, stop it. Everything has gone gay. Everything's gone gay. I mean, just every bit of life. I mean, music. I mean, now we force heterosexuals to listen to Lil Nas X, you know, and this sort of, you know, endless turnover of preening homosexual crooners that we call pop stars.

2:00:31There aren't any anymore because, you know, pop stars require a kind of like heroic manly virtue, I think, that is just gone now. It's just not there anymore. So if you wanted to weaken a society to the point of collapse... Faggotize it. It's not feminization. That's a mistake to believe that. It's not... Society is not becoming feminized. It's becoming faggotized. It's become... It has been gayed. You know? And it's... And it's like the difference between effeminacy and femininity, right? You look carefully at the behaviors. It's like it might have started off feminized. Like you said, oh, the HR departments have kind of like feminized language in the corporate sphere.

2:01:14And blah, blah. It might have started that way. But the gays took over very soon afterwards. And so now we don't have a feminized public square. We have a faggotized public square. And it's hardly surprising given that everybody in Congress and everybody in the Senate and everybody in the party and everybody on TV and everybody else that you've ever heard of on television and everybody on all the TV shows are gay. It's not a shocker. This would be the result. because even if they might be living

2:01:43DL lives, they still like what they like and they're still going to do it. Oh, yeah, let's have that little cocktail. You know, like they still do it. You see it in DC, like these men in DC, like drinking their little champagnes and things. So when you are, I mean, a lot of this, it's like walking into a room full of women and there's all this stuff going on, but you have no idea what it is. A daily occurrence for me. but you know something's going on but you don't quite get the right or the wrong frequency. You're not recognizing it because it's not feminine because you'd recognize it if it was feminine.

2:02:14You'd know what you were looking at. But when you go to Washington when you were flitting around Washington what was your dangerous faggot tour? Is that what it was called? Yes, I think the verb would be flit. Or perhaps flounce. There was some flouncing. I saw it. There was a bit of flouncing. Do you know the funny story? Sorry to cut you off. No, no, no. Again, I've been doing it the whole day, but a perfect illustration of the faggotization of society. My bus, my giant dangerous faggot to a bus is in a parking lot just outside Washington, D.C. And Mike Pence's advance team are planning to put him in the same hotel.

2:02:52And they have to change hotels. No, stop. But they have to change. I mean, he's like spiritually gay for sure. But he has to change hotels and divert his... I mean, this is the incoming vice president of the United States, right? to make way for the faggot. Just saying. It wasn't like... Not the first time. They could have come to me and said, would you mind, because we have the vice president elect, like whatever, or coming in. Well, I mean, this is 2017, so he is the vice president by then. We have the vice president coming through. And we would have said, yeah, sure, we'll go to the residence inn.

2:03:31But no, they just changed all of his plans, not mine, to make way, to make space for the faggot. Perfect analogy, isn't it? Perfect. But you picked up that vibe a lot when you were in Washington. Oh my God. The number of people who, sorry, you told me you don't help people. No, I think allegations have been roundly disproven, haven't they? No, but the number of people who were just, I mean, they didn't quite say hop on my lap, but. So you, I mean, because you're on that wavelength. Well, 10 years ago, I was very beautiful. and I didn't notice no of course you didn't notice I've been upset about it ever since

2:04:14Tucker never said I was no no I was I was very good looking you know I was in shape and all the rest of it and and and now I mean it was it was it was like a daily avalanche really never needed to visit Niagara Falls I just just like I've got a I've got I've got a giant torrent coming out. I won't finish that metaphor, but... No, it's just... No, it's like a torrent. So how has your life changed day to day now that you're celibate and getting away from trying to overcome your gay sexual impulses? I don't really have them anymore. Not often.

2:04:56My life is... So I've learned... Well, the first thing to say is that dogs have stopped barking at me. What? I mean, I used to set dogs off, like really set dogs off. Like they would go crazy around me. And when I stopped - Yeah. With hostility or affection? Yeah, I mean, they can sense evil, you know. My spiritual director. I can only tell this joke because it's my spiritual director that said it. I said, do you think it's because they can sense evil? He said, no, it's because you don't smell like blacks anymore.

2:05:32Look, the priest said it. Let the record reflect. I'm not laughing. You know, dogs have a famous complex relationship with certain people. I'm sure that's not what it was. But maybe. No, but you know the biggest thing that happened to me? Wait, can I stop? Did dogs lure you? Are you being serious about dogs? I'm 100 % serious. I mean, there's two photos of me like snuggling with puppies. like, okay, you got me. But other than that, almost every other dog, like would just go nuts anywhere around me. I set up a loving firm last year with a friend and her dogs just went apes anytime I was even in the vicinity until I started making these changes.

2:06:18And then it was like, and now they're like, it's bizarre. I mean, I'm a cat person now because I kind of have to be, but I'm a great lover of dogs. Like I think you are too. Yes. A great lover of dogs. And what they lack in intellectual sophistication versus their feline compatriots, they make up for in like intuition. Yes, they do. They're like babies. They got a little Holy Spirit in them or something. They're just like, they know good guys from bad guys. Dogs just couldn't be around me. That's amazing. I mean, I'm sure not all gay people have that thing, but it's just a sign of something that changed.

2:06:57the biggest thing that changed me though which is not like a big the biggest thing to me because I live quite an internal life you know like most of my most of my life is up here right the biggest thing that happened to me is I started caring what happened in stories like spoilers started to bother me and I couldn't figure out what that was about like 10 years ago when a Star Wars movie came out just before Christmas when no one had had the chance to see it I tweeted Han Solo dies you know like a thousand people unfollowed me How could you? You know, the worst person. I was like, what are you talking about?

2:07:30It's like a stupid space movie. Like, get a grip. But I started to care, maybe because I started to care what happens to me. I've started to care what happens in stories. Like the plot matters. I'm no longer just looking at the surface, at the, well, at the surfaces. I'm not looking at the dresses on the women or the accents, or at least not just looking at those things anymore. Like I want to know that the story has a happy ending. Because I think, you know, cleaving to my faith more closely, I've become more aware that the universe has a happy ending and I want a happy ending. And that's the biggest thing that's happened to me like in my head, in my soul, you know?

2:08:13Did you not care about yourself as much? No, of course not. Of course not. But I've gone from, I went from somebody who liked Oscar Wilde because I liked the witty lines and the sparkling surface of it to somebody appreciates instead now or at least reads it differently now for the subversion, for the little eddies in language he uses which are meant to show this kind of disintegrating way of life. And I read it historically now. I never read history books because nothing mattered before or after. It's just like today, because I'm in a grip of an addiction. But now I read biographies. I never did that before.

2:08:58Well, because a narcissist doesn't care about other people's lives. Right, but I knew stuff, but I didn't want to know details. And now I feel... I mean, Myers-Briggs is a lot of old shit, but my personality type, such as it is, it's completely changed. And I don't know exactly... Really? Yeah. I mean, I know I look and sound pretty similar, but the way that I because I have the same sense of humor like I have some bits of personality that I have but the way that I acquire information has changed like I I forget the distinctions because it is a lot of shit but you know like the intuitive to the sensory or whatever it feels now like I can I feel more in tune now like before there was kind of like a sheet of glass like some critical ironic distance between me and the world yes didn't really want to engage with it you know and now i'm like i want to grab the wood sorry i'll rephrase that um i want you know i want to like i'm now going to grab a different kind of no i want to i want to like know what it's made of and where it's from and and and look at it and think about it and and like so this is how you ended up huh uh you know you know like like that that didn't used to occur to me at all i'd just be like yeah it's cool i love the aesthetic it's really nice i love what you're going on today What is this, shabby chic?

2:10:16You know, like, and I just wouldn't know. And now I'm just like, this is alive. This is like, now I get, I didn't get when you first started, I was like, like this about the set. And now I'm like, no, no, no, no, no. So you were a prisoner of ironic detachment. Yeah, yeah. Like this kind of like, everything's got to be matter, everything's got to be whatever, because I was afraid of engaging with the material critically. Yes. And authentically, you know. I was afraid of engaging with the material. And now I'm not. Can I just say, can I just brag indirectly? Even when you were, I first met you in the green room at some Fox show years ago, many years ago.

2:10:54And you were in full. Full fag, yeah. Yeah. Oh, ridiculous. It was a lot. Parody of a gay man. I thought you were deep anyway. I could see that in you. Sorry, not bragging. I always thought that. I mean, it was a compliment to both of us. No, but I perceive that. Now when I do gay things, I do it like a Margaret Thatcher accent because now it's not really me anymore. No, I saw that though. I saw that instantly. Like first day, I remember we were, yeah, exactly where we were standing. But when you see somebody that way, I mean, there are gay people who are not deep, you know, Dave Rubin, you know, people who just - There's no one shallower.

2:11:32There's no there there. There's nobody behind there. Oh, I know. It's just that. And you read his book and it's like, Candace made me read his book. Really? She made me. I mean, his book, Don't Burn This Book. I'm like, I'd have to buy it first. I'd have to know. I'd have to have heard of it. I'd have to acknowledge it really as a book. No, please, the spacing, the margins. Oh, my God. I mean, you know, from having so many successful books, all the publishing tricks, if your manuscript comes in short, you're like, blah, blah, blah. We probably both had that happen to us from time to time. There was this rumor that I...

2:12:13there was this rumor that I didn't write my books. It was this team, a fleet of assistants. And so the first interview I gave about my book about the last Pope, the book had been out two months. And I said, sounds brilliant. I can't wait to read it. But I was like, well, you know, when you actually have like stuff going on, you're too busy to write it. And then you write other people's books when in the fallow periods. Anyway, so... I actually have a famous friend who never read any of his books. No, of course not. And he had a million of them. Come on. Probably, probably. That's very much a TV thing.

2:12:43Yeah, it is. It is. It is. And I was on tour and stuff. But I did actually write mine, as it happens. I had a research assistant. Actually, a very great guy, Alan Bukhari, who's now writing a book about Gamergate, the great untold story about how Trump happened, which is a completely topic for another day. But what was the question? Well, the question was how you've changed as a person. I still go off on tangents. but you were saying that you have an appreciation for the future and for things beyond yourself whereas you didn't before I'm back in the room

2:13:21now I will I care what happens at the end of stories like I used to read it for the wit and try to remember the sparkling dialogue to semi-plagiarize it in conversation or whatever you know and you know I see a little of this change in another friend of mine in George Santos. What a good guy he is. I can't help but like him. I always liked him. You can't help but like him. I totally agree. I always liked him. I was just like, oh, he's so likable. And he's likable. He would be likable if he was thin, which is how likable he is. I never thought of that. He'd be likable, even if he was skinny. That's how likable he is.

2:14:04He's especially lovely as being jolly. But... I've noticed in him some little changes, some adjustments along these lines since he's had his reckoning and his, you know. Yes. I mean, he had to confront something. I make a prediction. Guarantee you the guy doesn't die gay. Guarantee you George doesn't die gay because he's going to see his behavior, the Walter Mitty stuff, as being in dialogue with, dependent on, congruent with the other damage. Guarantee it. Guarantee it. I'm still so uncomfortable with this topic that I'm not going to broach that with him, but I think you're qualified to do that.

2:14:49Well, I'm on Tim Paul with him soon, so maybe I will. So how do you change? Like, what's the process? This thing that we're not allowed to talk about, which is, and I can't, gay conversion therapy. We don't call it conversion therapy anymore. But that's what it was called, right? They were trying to ban it. So like, you were required to be gay. I remember thinking like, and by the way, I've never been anti. What are you converting from and to? No, but also the idea that you're not allowed to change. Like what? That's when I realized. It's the biggest thing. Why are you keeping people gay against their will?

2:15:22You keep it. Well, that's when my mind, as someone who's always been, I guess, pro-gay or whatever, I'd never really been that involved in it. It's one of the least attractive things about you. I agree. I agree. But I started, my brain started to change a little bit when they were like, we're going to ban gay conversion therapy. And I was like, I thought the whole point was you can be whatever you want to be, which I was kind of for. But now you're gay. You must stay that way. It's respectable for you to be pro-gay if the basis of your pro-gayness is that they're trying to force people to stay gay.

2:15:51Well, no, no. That's when I started to change. I was like, what are we talking about here? You're not allowed. So you're going the wrong way. Yeah, no, you're just off on this. That just blew my mind when they tried to ban that. I was like, this is not what they told me it was. They're trying to force people to stay gay against their will. Yes. I mean, it's bizarre. There's a Supreme Court case right now. The ruling will come next year about whether or not bans on gay conversion therapy are constitutional, whether it's legal to do it. So we'll find out. It's the craziest thing I've ever heard.

2:16:23Well, the Supreme Court's kind of like, it always struck me, at least until recently, I guess, with the injection of the DEI, like lunatic. Isn't that the greatest chart you've ever seen? the greatest graph of my life, how much Ketanji Brown Jackson talks. It's the greatest chart I've ever seen. Self-esteem is in inverse proportion to ability. Yeah, we're aware of that. Yeah, it's the greatest chart I've ever seen. And then you got old Clarence in your life. Right, yeah, one word. It is the greatest chart. I just saw it and my reaction was, that tracks. And we had in the Supreme Court, and probably maybe, I mean, it's sort of down the line, isn't it, Democrat?

2:17:03up until recently. It was, you know, it was really just like Catholics be Jews on the Supreme Court. I don't think there are any Protestants on the Supreme Court. I don't think there are now. There is one. Neil Gorsuch is an Episcopalian. Yeah, but you're just over the fence. No, but I mean, there was a while where... You got a little toe in the Tiber. This country was founded and created by Protestant men and there's not a single one on the Supreme Court. Yeah, but there's a fifth of them a Catholic. The smart ones. only in Rhode Island but whatever another day when when you see that kind of civilizational clash as it seems to me that it is one I can't help but hope if they're not going to do Obergefell that they at least let people get away from being gay like at least let people leave at least let people leave um because i had to fumble my way with hot oil on a stove and like hurting myself to eventually get to a point where i was not seeing a particular stimulus and automatically having a particular arousal response is that what you want is that what is Is that what they want?

2:18:24Is that what they want everybody to have to do? To sit at home and abuse themselves? To sit at home and like hurt themselves? To get rid of these unwanted, disordered urges that are making them miserable, that are hurting other people, that are hurting them, that are the product of trauma, that are a trauma response? Is that what you want? You want people to sit at home and do it to themselves? I don't think so. I think it's what they want. I think destroying people is what they want. But I don't think it's what we want, you know? I agree. so how how do people change and what is the process well um the father of this stuff the most i mean there are some quacks oh i bet we're all gonna lie about it but the father of the stuff that most respectable stuff with the highest success rate um uh the guy's name was joseph nicolosi and uh you can't find most of his books on amazon um but actually yeah why Because they're suppressed?

2:19:25So that just tells you that right there, if they're banning books. Well, I'm not such an anti-book ban guy. You're a bit more of a free speech fund. What were the Nazis burning? What were they burning? Ask them. I know, I'm very aware of that. I guess what I'm just saying... You're more of a free speech fund. I am. I am a free speech. I have evolved into more of an authoritarian over the last 10 years. Well, I'm not even having that debate. I'm just saying that you know what's important to people. You know what they're lying about by what they try and hide. Sure. We can agree that's right. And we can also agree that all of the Jewish trans doctors need to have their books burned.

2:20:07But when he wrote about this stuff over decades, had a very tempestuous relationship with the bodies in psychology and all the rest of it and psychiatry. But he's the person to read if you want to understand how people become gay and how many of them have got out of it. So for me, the most important book is Shame and Attachment Loss. It's kind of got a yellowy green cover. And the good news is that although Dr. Nicolosi has left us, his son, Joe Jr., is still in the practice and is still training therapists today. He's based in California, obviously. And so he's still working today. And today, the way that the therapy that Joe Jr.

2:21:03does presents itself is, okay, it looks weird. it looks really weird it's peculiar looking it's almost funny looking when you see when you know because sometimes they'll film a session as a demonstration you know but it and it almost looks sort of like a like something you might see from Ali McBeal like smile therapy or something right but for a lot of patients it's showing enormous progress and progress we measure as the amount of arousal, unwanted same-sex feelings are just like, I didn't, wait a minute, did I? I don't think I got the hots for anyone this week. Yeah. So people have gay sex urges for a variety of reasons.

2:21:55So without getting too specific, the passive partner in a gay encounter is looking to take on some of the masculinity he feels he lacks. And that's in a literal physical way and in an emotional way too, right? He's seeking to absorb in some fashion the manliness he feels he doesn't have. Really? Yes. And it makes sense, don't it? Like when you think about it. I've always wondered what that was. but yeah if you're if you're if it's a way of of interacting with the kind of men you've never been able to interact with or who have never like taken you seriously or that you've always kind of like admired from afar or whatever because you have had this like jump tracks in your brain from from neglect or abuse or whatever it is and so you seek you want to be you want to you feel like it's it's like getting charged up and this is the way the magic comes in again as you know like this is how magic works you know like magic artifacts got like charged up with evil power like that's what you know grace doesn't work like that you know god doesn't work that way uh the infinite limitless uh generosity and charity and grace of god doesn't work like that you don't have to like recharge your your reserves another reason gay sex is unfulfilling because it's refilling a battery that's always depleting it's like a slow puncture you know and you just top it up you can never fill it up you can top it up for a moment with with an encounter like this um those urges in the first place come from a memory or a thought or something that's leading to this arousal, this disordered urge.

2:23:40And the way to get rid of it feels a little like some people will have heard of maybe CBT, although it's different in some important ways. The therapy is three-step. The first thing that you do is you you produce that state so you think about or you look at something that will take you to the place that would have produced arousal previously and then you introduce something unexpected into the brain and the idea is that you rewire the brain in its plasticity to expect a different outcome when it has that stimulus in future right so um the way i did it was to hurt myself. So if I saw a basketball player, not basketball because we're all gay nerds, like I said, but a football player, like I said, sitting down next to me on a flight or something, I wouldn't get aroused.

2:24:37Like the blood wouldn't stop flowing. I would get like, you know, like that. Or something, right? Vaguely. Or at least wouldn't get that arousal response. The way that the therapists do it, which is better, is a sort of like, just a completely unrelated feelings neutral kind of a thing, right? And the way it looks, it's just remarkable. And the third step is just repeat it because there's only two ways you can persuade the brain of things, which is emotional connection and repetition. Nothing else works. Those are the only two means of persuasion that work. Emotional connection and repetition.

2:25:13So this is why all the late night comedians who aren't funny anymore, their job is not to be funny. Their job is to associate certain things with certain emotional reactions and then to do that every night of the week forever. So Trump, ew. And then the next night, Trump, ew. And this eventually persuades people that Trump bad, right? Because they're associating an emotional reaction to a certain thing. Repeat, repeat, repeat, repeat. It's just programming. It's programming. It's programming. They don't have to be funny. That's not their job. It is not Jimmy Kimmel's job to be funny. It's Jimmy Kimmel's job to repeat and repeat.

2:25:49It's why it's so boring and repetitive, right? Yes. They repeat and repeat and repeat and repeat. Positive, happy, like Kamala's so brave. Trump's hideous. Oh, God, disgusting. Isn't he gross? Isn't he? Oh, that fat ginger, orange retard, whatever, you know? They're not talking about him in terms of policy. They're talking about in terms of disgust. Yeah, because that's an emotional thing. And again, again, again, again, eventually people are like, Trump, ew, you know? Of course. That's what's happening. It's just programming. It's why the comedians aren't funny. You're welcome. this is that for virtuous ends because it's what works in the brain and it very often uses so people find this strange but so Aquinas talks about how grace builds on nature right Thomas Aquinas and so there are ways in which our bodies are machines they They function according to mechanisms and respond to stimulus.

2:26:51And although there's a spiritual dimension to all of this, the way our brains work, it's trainable. It's trainable like a dog is trainable. It's trainable like anything is trainable. And so the way this therapy looks, and I provided you with a couple of little examples in video so that you can see it yourself afterwards. The way this therapy looks

2:27:16is, first of all, that the original stimulus will be produced. And then there may be a pattern of like following a pen around or a particular kind of tapping on the knee or something. It's just intended to be like a neutral, different outcome from that initial response. So that no longer does the brain go to arousal, but it goes to something else. And that, it's very common. If you see in PTSD survivors, if you've ever been to the VA, you'll see a lot of like this going on in like the treatment rooms and you're like, what the hell is that? Yes. That's what it is. They're produced, they ask them to remember something traumatic from their service and then something, it's just kind of a little thing.

2:27:54And what's going on is, the best way I can kind of describe it is, it's like when you press control, alt, delete, and then a couple of other things and the computer reboots without the virus now. Yes. You know, like that's not quite how computers work, but you know, it reboots and you're no longer in that situation again. You can do that with the brain, but it takes not just one reboot, but it takes repeated raising, if they call it the schema or the target, the thing that produced that unwanted response. And then immediately the introduction of an unexpected outcome. So your brain's like, hang on a second, this happened.

2:28:33So I was expecting that, but then this happened. and then over time your brain learns to just do that instead and that instead could just be like something you know completely anodyne or it could be like i did which is you know a kind of clunking amateur version of it which was you know something something painful or unpleasant and in the third step just do it over and over again and eventually you see people just have less of those desires it's the most peculiar thing but it is being born out in the studies and so joe jr i brought this with me i'll leave it with you if you're interested but um 144 people uh in a randomized placebo blind trial it works it works and it works because this these homosexual urges are not so totally unlike other forms of trauma other forms of damage, other forms of deviance.

2:29:35This same thing, it works on people who are obsessed with rape. Like a guy who can't get off unless he's thinking about raping a girl. Now, rape is something that women love to fantasize about, but perhaps don't necessarily enjoy the reality of, even the reality of play of it, right? It's something women love to think about, but you act that one out without warning, you're sleeping on the couch. at minimum. It can help men to enjoy sex lives that don't involve coercion, you know, because they have that sort of thing. And much of the same technique is used with people who have other kinds of trauma, who have other kinds of trauma responses as a product of bad things that happen to them or as a product of just something going a bit wrong where that track has jumped, you know?

2:30:25And so this... though it looks very odd, it's based on decades of research and builds on other therapies for other kinds of trauma and it looks like it's working. Now, I didn't have this kind of therapy. I will say that. Like I said, I kind of bumbled through on my own because I'm stubborn and a loner. But this has started to work for people. When you look back on the life that you led 10 years ago, how do you feel? I feel ashamed. I feel embarrassed and disgusted by the things I did, but I feel ashamed, particularly about 10 years ago, about how many people... You know, I thought I was like laying it on thick with a sort of like day-made and average kind of, you know, a high-synth bouquet performance on stage.

2:31:18And I realized people weren't picking up the layers, maybe. And every talk I ever gave in the Q &A, I said, if I could not be gay, I would push that button, you know? And nobody ever, like, that never registered with people or that they why? I don't know all they got was being gay is okay now being gay and right wing is okay now and I know that I pushed that button with the left to annoy them and because it was absurd at that time but people never got the message when I said if I could possibly I never gave a speech in my life where I told people go be gay I said my first ever appearance on television was with Boy George like 20 years ago and I said I feel that something is wrong inside me and I didn't have the vocabulary to articulate this.

2:32:00And he's like, no, honey, you're perfect just the way you are. I can't do what you're just, but, you know, I was like, no, no, I feel that something is wrong in there. And everybody around the table just left, you know, like thinking like, oh, this is self-hating homosexual. Well, I'm not, I wasn't hating myself. I was hating the things that I was doing because I knew they were hurting me. And I knew even then, I never gave a speech in my whole life where I say, have you ever talked to other gay men who have the same feeling? Yeah. Yeah. I think because I mean not many of them will articulate it like I do because I am a little bit cuckoo and I don't mind kind of living in public and talking about my feelings like my Twitter is just like this well aside from the eight years missing it's just this like insane stream of consciousness where I'll just say the most like ridiculous absurd outrageous things but it's because people are getting like a tap straight in you know it's just what's going on in there today so I'm comfortable living that way and i'm comfortable expressing myself and talking about myself and i think now i have a duty now i have a responsibility to others because of because the message didn't land like i was i i was i was not intending to give birth to this huge generation of gay republicans who now just i think it's openly like openly fine to to to traffic in babies and to be a gay Republican and I feel a great deal of responsibility for that.

2:33:27I hate myself for that a little bit. Milo Yiannopoulos, thank you for everything you said. Thank you. For your honesty. I appreciate it. Thanks. And your insight, which is amazing.

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