20Sales: Five Lessons Scaling Snowflake to $1BN ARR, Why Customer Success is BS and Should Be Removed, Why All Sales Reps Should Do Eight Calls Per Week & Why You Should Hire a Head of Sales Sooner Than You Think with Chris Degnan, CRO @ Snowflake

24:38Here's what has to happen. In order for us to get it there, here's the following things that have to happen. We have to go through contracts. Our average time for contract to get signed is 30 months. We have some customers who are small customers, who will take 60 days. But we have customers that will take, like, in a large enterprise, their procurement departments they crush innovation by just their process. Large organizations have three or three new processes. Oh yes, even longer. We've been in procurement for six months. It's crazy. It's crazy. Like, large enterprises. We're the implementation on top of that.

25:12You're like nine or 12 months at least. Correct. Yes. And so if you educate customers as well, from day one to completion, you're like two to three years. Yeah, sometimes depend on the project. Like if you're selling to a digital native company that already has your date in the cloud and all so they're stuff. Yeah, easy. But if they're an on -premise legacy company, they have all these security loops. They have a procurement department that is wagging the dog. They can crush projects, careers, everything. If you think startups understand the complexities of selling to enterprise? No. Mm -hmm. Help me.

25:46What would you tell them? Because again, we have so many that listen. What should they know? So what I realized early on is that styling to a large financial institution is super interesting because you look and you can see stars, you can see dollars. And you say that's amazing. But those are our enterprises, especially in an early stage startup, they will suck the life out of that startup because they will say, I need these 100 features and the founders might say, well, I'm gonna build these 100 features. And then guess what? That person who said they were gonna bring in, they got fire or 18 months later they're off to a different project.

26:21They don't care about you anymore. But if you can find someone that is in your ideal customer profile that you can actually sell to in a relatively short period of time and get them using the product quickly, that's really what I focused on and that's important for any startup is what is your ICP who is going to be your fastest buyer, the large financial institution, they're going to send you off in a different direction and if it's a different direction that you don't want to go, don't waste your time. And by the way, that's not a sustainable model that you as the CEO of the company, you as the head of sales, you're going to get fired because what ends up happening is you get one quarter where you have this incredible revenue dump if you get that deal.

27:04And then guess what, you have to have how many more of those deals do you have in your pipeline? Not many. How do you plan? Like, you know, you have to do quarterly planning with those like procurement processes plus implementation first, but the different all the steps. How on earth do you effectively plan when procurement could just take a national month and then suddenly is Q2 not Q1? Well, it's a volume game. So go back to what I said earlier, eight sales calls a week, two to three net new business meetings a week. If you send the sales team towards the right ICP, all of a sudden you're getting customers who are using the product and you're finding them faster.

27:37And then you might then stumble across the large financial institution that is something that you can keep in the pipeline, but you're not going to thug that deal and think it's going to be the only deal you're going to close that quarter. And you can slowly build the large enterprise pipeline while you have the velocity pipeline keeping you afloat. You said about the person you're request will be features suddenly there, go on 18 months later, we always hear about the importance of building an internal champion. The thing is as we both know you need to have multiple champion, due to multi -threaded.

28:09Chris, how on earth do you do this authentically? I'm selling to you, Chris today. Chris, hi. Yeah, I just want to meet the rest of your team because I don't know if you're going to be here in six months time. How to do that authentically. Well, I think now, and in the size of stuff like is, I think a lot of our sellers, they can go build themselves the technical champion. So they identify the technical champion and a good way to test that champion and if they are real champion, is will they actually bring you to the economic buy? And they may not bring you hairy, if you're the sales rep, they might say like, hey dude, I'm not gonna introduce you to my boss's boss, right?

28:45But if Chris Dagnan, the chief revenue officer of Snowflake is in town, or I can get a Zoom call with Chris, or Frank Soutman, or Mike Skarpelli, or some senior person within Snowflake, then yeah, they use us and a good sales rep uses us as a pawn. I always say I'm an actor in the sales reps movie. They're the director. They can use me however they want if they make me the director Good luck. You're probably gonna fail But if you're the director and you're you're putting me in the the right position to say the right things That's a good director. How do you prevent yourself from being a bottleneck?

29:19This is quite like venture where you have great associates and then they need the partner to use you to be the porn to close Those the challenges I find myself constantly being the bottleneck where I was like Connois be that. That's the beauty of what Frank Slutman brought to Snowflake is he said to me, Chris, you're a deal jockey. And he said that got Snowflake to where it needed to be, but that's not going to get Snowflake to where it needs to go. And so that stuck with me. And he said, you got to figure this out, dude, or I'll figure it out for you, which means I'm out. What did he mean by that?

29:52So every major deal I was involved with, every single major deal I was involved in, and what you just said, you're the bottleneck. If I'm the bottleneck, in my schedule, I can't get to Europe, I can't get to Asia, I can't be in Texas or whatever it is, guess what, I'm slowing down the deal. So now what I try to do is focus on finding sales leaders that work directly for me that have the same sense of urgency. So I have a guy who runs our largest customers working for me, he runs those transactions, I don't run those transactions anymore. And he tells me what he needs for me. And I trust that he's doing that job.

30:30Building that trust, giving the keys to your baby, if you will, is sometimes hard. But man, when you find those great leaders, you feel super lucky, and that's how you create scale. And that's what I've done with my organization today. I'm so pleased you said that about finding those great leaders. You've now brought in many great leaders underneath you. When you think about your biggest hiring lessons for sales teams, What are the biggest lessons you have from hiring the best sales teams? So you have to find people that kind of believe in the foundation that you believe in. Be a student of what you sell.

31:03If I have a sales leader who wants to sit in their office and manage a spreadsheet, that's not for me. I'm a lead from the type of sales leader. I want my sales leaders to be the same. And finding that out is hard. And so you can get faked out by people too. They can tell you that they're doing those things. And then what happens is when you go into the field and you go meet with the people that work for them All of a sudden you realize they're not doing that you're doing that and so all of a sudden that becomes a problem That has happened to me multiple times I've been faked out by sales leaders who say they're doing that, but they're not I wouldn't say it area It's an easy thing to figure out.

31:38It's something that I still struggle with to this day But you spend time effort and you figure it out. What's the biggest mistake using founders make when assembling sales teams? Well, I tell this to founders all the time. They actually, it's on the marketing side is where they make the mistake founders Love product marketers. They understand the product and they're gonna build this marketing literature and stuff like that That's a waste of time the marketing team needs to generate Iprin they need to generate leads meetings whatever it is that you have the metric that you want to come up with and founders They're like I don't want some pipeline generation machine I want a great marketing page on telling the sales team why the product is so good.

32:18Let the sales team and you, founder, figure that out together. Don't rely on the product marketer to do that because they're not in the field. The sales teams in the field, you're in the field. To me, the number one thing that I say to sales leaders, dude, go hire a world class pipeline generation marketer. That is what you need because then you'll learn from the sales calls, then you'll that'll help you develop the product. So I think that's the number one issue that I see in one start -ups. And we've heard about account policy. You said like pipeline generation master. Dude, I can fill your pipe, but I can do it with not great leads.

32:52And so I find like actually accountability then really hard on pipeline generation because like in game, I file all of the metrics if I wanted to. How do you think about creating that like what is success framework for pipeline generation given that so much can be gained? When we hired our CMO almost seven years ago Denise, I was arguing with the previous marketing team over what a You know an mql was when an sql was and also there's stuff and it was driving me crazy and she said great news We're never gonna talk about mqls or sqls anymore. We're just gonna talk about qualifying meetings That's that's all you should hold me accountable to and that's what she did So she would sit down with we had an sdr organization that that was initially under me and that I trained three years ago transfer that to her but we talked about just generating good quality meetings that converted to pipeline.

33:41That's all that we talk about. And to this day, that's what we talk about. It's qualified meetings. And so that's the thing that I would say is, yeah, if you fill my funnel full of, this is where the friction with sales and marketing becomes is you start talking about what the definition is of an MQL and you have this definition and you're sitting down with the CEO and the CEO saying, oh, yeah, look at all this pipeline. I still see stuff following up on it. And I still see like, yeah, that's, so I think it's having integrity in the pipeline is important. You mentioned pipeline generation there.

34:13Dude, is old school our band dad? Can we get on those phones or get on those emails and you dial for dollars? So this week I met with some of our SDR leaders on they were in town and they were doing a quarterly review and some training. I stated I was snowflakes original SDR because I built my own lists. I script websites, I prospected. By the way, I still use that to this day. I still do my own recruiting. When I hire people, I pick up the phone and I call people. I send emails on LinkedIn. So prospecting should never die. Col calling should never die. You gotta find champions. The way you find champions is you're gonna say, hey, I heard you have this issue.

34:54Anyone who says that's dead is crazy. You know what I find funny is the people that I'm honest, the more powerful you become, the more outbound is effective and the more you should do it, not the less. Yeah, 100%. If you're waiting for marketing to hand you the golden leads, if you get two leads from marketing a quarter, you're welcome. Go pick up the phone and call call into your prospects. Go to go to conferences, show up, go to partners, ask them how they can introduce, but that's the hard work. And if you could actually do that in the hustle, you're going to be successful. You said there about earlier about reviewing kind of way you're out with cools and the green and the red, can you predict churn in potential customers, do you think?

35:34And actually, is it much harder to stay where suddenly budgets are turned off in macro uncertainty? So with snowflake being a consumption model, you could see the dial turn real time. I look at revenue on a daily basis. And if a customer goes up really fast or down really fast, it sets off alarm bells because I don't want them to overspend because all of a sudden they'll be really mad at me. And I know a lot, and if they're understanding, then I go right to the sales team and then why what's happening? And so I get real -time feedback on churn. When that customer is going to churn, we know. Now, they might be going out of business or maybe we lose a workload, but not the entirety of it.

36:12There are stuff like that that happens to, but we see that real -time, and that's a beauty of a consumption. Good or bad, that's a beauty of a consumption model. You know, a lot of founders are concerned, what are you here when you speak to CFOs? Is spending still going. Look, people have to do business. You're either going to keep moving or you're going to die. I call BS on that. And I think if you don't have a good value prop, yeah. If you have a nice to have like a sales tool, that's going to be hard. A nice to have forecasting tool. Like I got someone who would try to introduce me to some sales forecasting tool and I'm like, you're barking up the wrong tree here.

36:46I don't have that pain and I'm not doing that. The reality is, that's not a huge pain for me. I'm not going to go buy a nice to have something that would be additive, but find a pain and see if I was or spent it right now and I see that real time. I have said I suppose you know many about you as a leader beforehand and I suppose many underneath you actually and they said he's the best in the business for developing talent. My question to you is what do you think you do to develop sales talent so well? You know I'm humble enough to know that like I'm lucky to be selling the product that I'm selling, I take feedback and I act on that feedback.

37:22I feel like I learn a ton from my own sales leaders. Like people who work for me, they teach me something every single day. I was on a sales call at a customer recently with one of our long times, our, actually our very first sales rep, this guy Tom, and I was on a sales call with him and I learned from him. And so I think the thing that you learn about is if you're open to feedback and then And you can give those other people feedback onto how they're doing and what you're seeing others do. And jeez, it's awesome. And I think what I try to do is get others to talk to them. So like we just prone the guy to be the head of the UK.

37:57And one of the guys who runs a huge business for me in North America, Mark Fleming, he's spent time with Jimmy helping him out of the goodness of his heart. And Mark is a wonderful sales leader. And he's given Jimmy time and helping Jimmy develop. So I think it's about, it's like a family. It's like you're having a family raise people versus just like being a single parent and I think because I do it one way It doesn't mean it's the best way and I think that's the kind of the way that you kind of I view it as if I can get others to help me raise the family I think that's the way I look at it people don't say you should feel safe in your team.

38:28You should feel safe in your team Do you think the other apps should feel safe? What should they feel the pressure? I think they absolutely need pressure. Look, I never feel safe I'll be honest. I never feel safe to this day I don't feel safe. And I think when I see people like who are laid back don't have the sense of urgency that I have. It drives me crazy. The answer is no. Going back to the comment I made earlier about the new hire training that I went in. I said, if you do not go on eight sales calls away, if you do not become a student of what you sell, you will fail. You might be a really nice person.

39:00But if you don't do those two things, you're going to fail. And I say that to everyone. How fast do you know if someone's going to fail? Is it very obvious or does it take more time? Well, if you go out on a sales call and the person doesn't know what the hell they're talking about and they've been on the job for six months Yeah, you're gonna be in a world of hurt and you should just cut bait to quote Frank He has this thing when there's doubt there's no doubt and I think you in your gut you see it And I think a lot of times because you're a human you because you have empathy You want to help people along because and you want them to succeed But at some point they hit ceilings and you either have to say you're you're not scaling you're not doing this and in your gut you see it.

39:39And that's the hardest part is how fast can you make that decision? I think you see it pretty quickly. It's just, do you have the guts to go and make that tough decision quickly? Because it's not, it's not stretching. How do you do it with enterprise where it takes a long time for deals to close and those sales cycles are much longer? With the PLG motion, you're like, you know what? Chris hasn't signed anything in two months, clearly not working. When do you expect people to close their first enterprise deals? So we say you talk about productivity of sellers. So we have different productivity numbers per division that they're in.

40:10So corporate seller, so it was more of a junior seller, they're going to be come productive within three to six months, meaning they're going to, they should be closing deals because their sales cycle is 60 days. So if they can go and prospect, find a customer, they have a 60 day sales cycle, but in a smaller contract, you'll do that. And in a mid -size enterprise, it's six to nine months, and in the large enterprise, it's 12 months. That's what we see. but there are basic things. Like, I'll give you an example. I think you did some homework prior to us talking. You spoke to Kyle Rork. So, Kyle Rork was one of my first, he actually was the first guy I recruited to South Lake.

40:45He ran the West for me and at the time, I had all direct reports of sellers. And then when I had Kyle run the West, Kyle takes over basically for me and comes to me and says, hey, guess what, I'm gonna hire two people on that LA. I'm like, really? I'm like, we can't get arrested in LA. He's like, we're doing it. And sure enough, he was right. He had three people down there and two of the people became super productive and we're selling and that one person He couldn't get out of his own way and so I think that's when you realize is like he was waiting for the leads to come to him Versus the leads going and making things happen Would you always hiring too because then you know for sure whether you've got a head or not a head and you actually have reliability there?

41:23I 100 % like that's it That's a good lesson is like a single person should not be the litmus test because you don't know if they're doing the things that that you do, as the sales leader, you should be be a leading from the front sales leader. You should understand how to sell the product. You should understand what works. But then if you hire and choose and you put people in the field and you see one person successful, one person's not, it's not because of the territory. Guaranteed. It's because one person's doing something different. So find out what that person that succeeding is doing and then either make that person do that same thing or cut bait.

41:54I'm really like you Chris, but you're also quite direct. I can imagine in a deal review with me, I would also be a little bit on edge. My question to you is, and I did get this from Kyle. How do you give feedback that's empathetic where we know you're a good guy? But it's also direct, and maybe not always that nice and easy to hear. I mean, Kyle and I have had tough conversations before, and he's a good friend of mine. Look, you don't have to be an asshole. You don't have to be mean to people. Frank always says this to me. He says, do you think the board of directors are my friend? And the answer is no.

42:29He answered it for me and he said no. He said they fired me in a heartbeat if they didn't think I was doing a good job. I saw that firsthand when the board of directors fired Bob Muglia. Bob thought they were his friends and they weren't, right? And I saw that happen and I think you kind of have to know that in the corporate world, no one's really your friend. You have a job to do and you have an obligation to share holders. And if you operate that way and you understand that's the premise that you're operating on, that's how I operate. So do you find that sound? It's awful. When you build a stardom, you're building it from scratch.

43:02You know these people's families. You've traveled the world with them. You become friends with them. But then at some point, there becomes a point where it doesn't work anymore. And I think that's the awful part of the corporate world. But this is what I just can't get my head around with Eucharist, which is like you all this unicorn. Again, I've entered you had 200 of the best operates in the world because product growth sales, everything. Everyone agrees that people having stages of company, you transcend that and all kind of stage agnostic. Do you think people should be bound to specific stages, or can they be plastic to many?

43:37I think CEOs, founders like to blame other people for failures. Sales is probably the first person to get the finger pointed at. For me, what was incredibly helpful is having a job -mic man on the board of Snowflake because when Mike's Pfizer came into Bob and said, hey, you're going to go higher and someone over Chris. Bob was like, no. And why? Like, what am I going to get the Chris isn't giving? And John was helpful because John gave me feedback. Like, if you don't do these things, you're going to get replaced. And by the way, well, I said earlier, I took his feedback real and John was very directly, you're either going to keep this job or not.

44:16And here's what you have to do. So I think the founder that you can have a sales leader that has done this before on your board or as an advisor whatever It's incredibly helpful because they'll help you identify can this person scale and sometimes they will sometimes they won't But the number one thing is you have to give them feedback if they are doing that and do they act on that feedback? I found this too quick to find that had a sales because I would say that too slow. I've seen both I've seen that you know the board of directors is saying this person stinks and and they don't. It's more that the founders aren't listening to customers, they're not building the right products.

44:52I've seen everything. Like, Franco, he says, there's no playbook. It's situational. It's like, what is the situation you're in? Do you have product market fit? Are you convinced of that? Do you have the right marketing leader? Are they generating the right amount of leads? You have to investigate that stuff. Does your sales leader actually communicate with product? Like, there's a bunch of questions you should ask yourself. When you hit a quarter, do you say to your team, well done and do you celebrate hitting courses? or do you just go on to the next, trap map, trap map. I'm on to the next. I'm like, okay, that was a good quarter because sometimes you're gonna have back quarters and you have to diagnose and be honest with yourself on what happens.

45:27Why did we have a back quarter? And there's things like COVID. There's things like inflation and you have to decipher between is inflation having an impact or is it your sales team? If you don't celebrate the good times, you are gonna have people leave. So how do you think about celebrating the good times? Every quarter, I do a quarterly review with the entire sales team. I celebrate the top performers. We have spifts, we have a president's club, you know, where we bring the top performers every year. So the answer is, yeah, I do celebrate that 100%. And I celebrate them. And I say, great job.

46:01On the black downside, you have a course which doesn't go to plan. How do you prevent morale getting shot in the head then? I think you're honest. You're saying like, here's what we're seeing in the market. We really have to think through what was happening in the market. Was it sales? Was it products? And as we looked at it, we started as you said earlier, CFOs were cutting back and the behavior was changing. So you have to be measured in how you look at these things, not emotional, and you have to really look at the metrics and understand what's happening. Final one for you to a quick part. Add Henry Schuck on the show from Zoom info.

46:33Yeah. Yeah. And he said to me that actually we have to change our whole org structure in this new macro climate because all of our customers they used to just renew and upsell. Now they're going flat, they're not buying more. And they're going and we want data, we want to see ROI, we want to see usage, we want to see the dollars we're spending are being spent efficiently. Are you seeing that same transition? And are you seeing a restructuring of a more CS heavy ROI presentation style needed? Well, when you say CS, that's a naughty word. So I don't believe in customer success. Jolp the mic. Why not?

47:13Yeah, because what does customer success do in most companies? They're basically either renewal people or they're guiding the customer around to how to use the product. But if you ask the tough question of customer success, could they sell the product? No. Are they technical enough to be a sales engineer? No. What are they doing? So, me and I'd rather take that money that you're spending on customer success and invest in either professional services people that are paid for, that you can use as free resources but they're technical sales engineers or sales reps. So, you're getting something as opposed to this weird thing that you can't really quantify.

47:51We have a business value engineering group which they actually are more of an enabling will make group for the sales team to help actually what we do is build business value plans for the customer. Hey, you were doing X before you're doing Y with snowflake. Here's the benefit, but it's an enablement. It's the sales team should be you're teaching the sales team how to fish. It's not like they're going to do this for every single sales rep across the company. The sales rep should end up doing that for themselves. What was your advice found as then who are going, well, I've been trained for years on customer success.

48:23Should I get rid? Yes, get rid of them. Build up, build up professional service organization, hire more SEs who can do it. Customer success, look, people think that's last of me, I get it. I don't believe in it. I inherited our customer success when Frank came in and he gave it to me. I got rid of it. It was an expense that I didn't see the value in. Yeah. How do you think about the losing renewals? Customances, that can be quite good for account monitoring and then managing up sell, no? No, because the sales rep can do that. You give the sales rep a renewal quota. I mean, it's a basic thing. It's a lot to ask.

48:56No. No. Because if you, if you're, I guess why you have a renewal quota and you have a growth quota, that's easy. Here it goes south. And if you're too busy to do the renewal, great. I'll just take away, you know, half your accounts. I could have asked this. Are there any other conventional things in sats and sales that you were like, nah, wouldn't do that? Well, on the current market side, it really is about, I think, professional services is is incredibly helpful. But we don't need a professional services. We can kind of be helpful because we're also trying that it's not, and it's just consulting.

49:27You don't want to be a consultant, you're a worse and you're multiple. So our, our professional services organization is a single digit profit, margin, business. And is it not something Wall Street cares about in terms of our services revenue? It's an enablement function. It remains profitable, but at a, at a low margin. So we're not losing money on this organization. And they're getting customers to use the product and consume the product. Also, what's coming out of that organization is the training for our customers and our partners. So all of the content at Stuff Like for Training and enabling comes from our professional services organization.

50:02That content is then distributed out to our partners and customers to make them successful. So I'm a huge fan of our services or for sure. I mean, geez, that was a mic drop moment for the Amazon. Chris, save a good nugget and wisdom there. Final, final one and then promise to a great fire. I have from Kyle that I had to ask this before the IPO you had to reseggin the whole sales team and Everyone had a new role in a new geo shit. That's a lot to do late stage in the company. How did you do that Chris? You ripped the bandaid off and just do it and by the way That's something that's just constant at so -fake is changed if you're not changing your dying and I think I'm always Evaluating how we can become more efficient.

50:43So even at our skill I am constantly saying, what do we need to change for next year? It's always a lot more than I thought. So do it now and it's painful and people don't like change. But man, you got to do the right thing for the business. And so that's how we always operate. Well Chris, I've enjoyed this discussion. I could tell you all day, I want to move into a quick fire answer. I say a short statement, you give me your immediate thoughts. Does that sound okay? Yeah. Tell me about a deal that you close where you have to do something creative to get it over the line. Well, especially early days, prior to us being public, there are product commitments that we had to make to get stuff like out there.

51:19There were new deployment models, so Capital One was an early customer of ours that we had to invent a new deployment model to handle that some of their security requirements. You have to do that. At our stage, I can't do that as much. There isn't that because that would be called a side letter or some other thing, so you really have to stay within the bounds of as a public company, you can't do that stuff. In all honesty, what size of deal does it make sense for you to come in on? Is that a 10 million dollar deal? The pants, I mean, like I said, I was in New York last week. I went on an 80k first logo deal.

51:51I love that because I love opening up new customers. I love developing the sales team, leading from the front. So yet again, it just depends on, you know, how this, as I said, I'll go on a large deal if the sales are up, wants me to play a certain role. That is what I love the most about my job of going on sales calls. So I'll go on whatever the sales team wants me to do. Was sales tactic has not changed over the last five years. Going on eight sales goals, we can be coming a student to what you sell. I mean, what I've said over and over and over and over again. Was sales tactics died a death?

52:21The taking people golfing and whiting and dining to get a deal. Again, if you're like relying on the relationship sale, then you're in trouble. Was it been your biggest lesson from working with Frank? Do it now. A high sense of urgency now. We're nervous when he took over. Yeah, for sure thought I was gonna get fired and there was probably nine months of me wondering and then I get an email From him at Christmas. He says Merry Christmas and it gave me a bunch of stock and I'm like, wait what I'm not getting fired You want me to stay? It was a shock. So yes, the answer was nine months of a lot of anxiety What would you most like to change about the world of sales?

52:55I don't know I think people look at salespeople as the dumb sales guy I actually joke is saying I'm the dumb sales guy and I think a lot of times the relationship that I built with the engineering team is incredible and I think that's what's part of what's the magic that has made shoepake is it's not the dumb sales guy it's the sales guy that actually is or saleswoman was bringing you customers if you create a great product and it's not selling you got a problem and so I think the marriage is super important when there's a huge value in sales and some some founders kind of look down upon salespeople.

53:28Final one what one company sales strategy have even most impressed by recently. I'd say Amazon Amazon. They invented the cloud. They invented how to work with companies like us. We were hard for them because we competed with a product of theirs or multiple products of theirs. But yet they make us successful. So it's a hard thing to do. But for them to be this over successful platform, they have to have companies like us succeed. And so even though we compete with certain products, they not only let us be successful. They like invested our success and I think they're the best. Listen, I can't tell you how much I love this Chris.

54:05Pantle, maybe a fantastic one, but this really has been one of those where I I realize why I love what I do so much. So thank you so much for joining me and you've been amazing. Xerios is great to meet you and thanks for having me on your show. Appreciate it. I mean, I just thought that was one of the most exceptional shows. For me, the best shows are when you have slightly out there more controversial opinions and my word Chris there with customer success did not hold back if you want to see more from us of course you can on YouTube by searching for 20 VC but before we leave you today static financial models with manually updated numbers they just won't cut it anymore.

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55:19actuals report, automatically consolidate multiple entities, forecast cash in real time, and empower department heads to manage their budgets effectively. And here's the kicker, we're deep into the 2024 budgeting season, your board or seasweet is probably expecting fresh financial models at every turn. So let Liveflow shoulder that burden for you, tap into their library of 100 plus expertly crafted templates, such as 13 week cash flow forecast, which you can access and customise for free. Don't wait, head over to liveflow .io forward slash 20 sales and elevate your financial game today. The first 10 people who sign up via the link will get 20 % off for three months.

56:01And speak of incredible products like Liveflow there that change how we work. Outreach is the only AI -powered sales execution platform that unlocks seller productivity to help sales teams efficiently create and close more pipeline from prospecting to deal management to forecasting their platform leverages automation and artificial intelligence to help revenue leaders increase efficiency and effectiveness of all go -to -market activities and personnel across the revenue cycle. An outreach is the only company to offer sales engagement, revenue intelligence and revenue operations functionalities in one unified platform.

56:38But don't just take my word for it, there are 6000 companies, including Zoom, Seamons, Octodoccusign and many more who depend on our reach to power their revenue Organizations to learn more check them out at our reach .io and then speaking of incredible products I have to discuss zoom info I had Henry shot the founder and CEO on 20vc recently and zoom info helps companies supercharged their revenue potential Landing your next customer. It's really freaking hard, but it doesn't have to be you can be more efficient So get more efficient, close more deals with Zoom Infos all in one tech stack and the world's best beta -be data.

57:14Their quality data delivers the insights you need to identify the right prospects at the right time. Don't just tame my word for it, check them out and see why 30 ,000 customers and growing, including the likes of Snowflake, PayPal, Dropbox, and thousands of startup and growth companies, love and use them, head over to zoominfo .com for the slash 2 -0 VC to see for yourself and sign up for a free trial of the Zoom info platform. As always, I so appreciate all your support, really it does mean so much to me, I cannot wait to bring you another exceptional episode this coming Friday.