Novak Djokovic: magic potions and mafia car chases (with Josh Berry) | Part one

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0:32Prices, values, and available markets may differ from those mentioned. For more information, see calsheet.com slash regulatory. This episode is brought to you by Facebook. So you were scrolling on Marketplace, and there it was, the bike you'd been searching for. You sent a message, and it turned out the seller was super chatty, kind of funny, and an avid cyclist. The next thing you know, you're in a cycling crew. Well, a community cycling group. The thing about Facebook, you might find more than what you're looking for. From a browse to a bike ride, this summer, find more on Facebook. Every game day, you show up for your team.

1:12Now, it's your time. We go V! We go V! Ask your prescriber about WeGoV, semaglutide injection 2.4 milligrams, a GLP-1. Call 1-833-4-WEGOV or visit wegovi.com to view the medication guide and to learn more about WeGoV. Why wait? WeGoV! You don't win 24 Grand Slams without going a little crazy. Just ask Novak Djokovic. The Serbian sensation moves objects with his mind, sparks diplomatic feuds, and sets a place for his dogs at the dinner table. From mafia car chases to spats with Agassi, meet the Joker. Dobro docil, and welcome to the Upshot. My name is Jack. Zach is here as always. Hello, Jack. And fan favourite Josh Berry's in the house.

2:09Dobro docil to you. Oh, perfect pronunciation. Was that good? I think it was excellent. He shoots, he scores. Great to be back. I'm wearing a Wimbledon cap. The listeners can't hear this. Tis the season. Yes. Defrost me like Michael Buble. It's tennis season. You've been in your cocoon all winter. Yeah, I've been hiding away. Honestly, this is my... I was going to say this is my Wimbledon, but Wimbledon is my Wimbledon. I use that phrase a lot, but unfortunately it's come full circle back to its origin point. But I'm very, very happy, very pleased to be alive. You are on the Upshot Reddit, you are the most requested guest.

2:43Is that right? As a returning guest, always. Can we get Josh Berry? Love that. I didn't realise there's a Reddit. Oh, yeah. Careful, because our one's called The Upshot Podcast. If you just go to The Upshot, it follows a very niche sexual persuasion, a particular type of pervy photo. Yeah. Oh, okay. Yes, all right. I'm with you. You can probably guess what it looks like. An illegal type of pervy photo, I believe. No, no, legal. Okay. It's all above board. Post. Or underboard, as the case may be. Anyway, The Upshot Podcast is Reddit, and on their very demanding request for the return of Josh Berry.

3:17Oh, that's lovely. It's nice to be loved. Thank you. I appreciate that. So if you're not already a Josh Berry mega fan and you will be by the end of this podcast. Yeah, what the fuck, haven't you? Sorry. Sorry, I was too aggressive. I was too aggressive. The Novak Djokovic style. You can follow Josh at Josh Berry Comedy. That's the one. On all the... On all the platforms. All the darn platforms. Yeah. Wherever you get your comedy. Wherever you choose to pick your comedy up. And you got some live shows? yeah in london and the uk um in the autumn i'm doing my tour best man which which you guys very kindly we went to one of the first ones and it was a rip roarer it was excellent yeah can't recommend it highly enough yeah and so that that meandering journey through masculinity will be coming to london um but what about your show yeah well my show in my life there's not really that much of a distinction unfortunately i was actually having a conversation with a good friend today about that.

4:12He was like, maybe it would be good for you to have more distinction between your work and your life. And he was like, maybe it's not making you that happy. And I was like, you know, I think you could be right, actually. But anyway, I'm doing the show and hopefully it'll be funny. So where can people get tickets? Yeah, on the channels themselves. I put them right in the bio. Josh Barry Comedy.

4:30Josh Berry:You do the rest. You do the fucking rest. Should we get into the story? I'd love to hear about his whole life in excellent detail. That's exactly what we're going to do. some areas we'll cover in more detail than others but we'll go right back to the start he was born in 1987 in Belgrade in what was then Yugoslavia the family actually moved up to the mountains though when he was about two where his parents were working as ski instructors he also ran a pizzeria there as well and nobody in his family actually played tennis at all really but it just so happened that there were a few courts opposite their pizza restaurant And when he's five, Novak does a summer holiday camp there run by the Serbian tennis great Jelena Jancic.

5:18And Jelena had a bit of a track record of unearthing these tennis prodigies. So she also discovered Goran Ivanishvich, Monica Sells as well. And after spending a week coaching this five-year-old Novak Djokovic, she informs his parents that they have a golden child. Wow. So his parents had no ambitions for him to play tennis, but just because the courts were on the road. Yeah. So his dad was actually a champion ski skier. So he did a lot of skiing as well when he was a kid and maybe they would have pushed him in that direction. Do you think they've got that competitive? We've seen it a lot, right?

5:56With like, I can see that just like competitive dad. He strikes me as quite competitive. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I think that's definitely true. right yeah yeah isn't it always an interesting question like where that comes from like is it just the person because with Murray like I always feel like Murray is just an incredibly competitive guy right he is a competitor and people there was always this narrative oh his mum his mum's pushing I don't think that I just think he likes to win you know he wants to win I always assumed it was his mum but you know better than I do

6:27Josh Berry:yeah like he just loves he just fucking wants to win but like who's an example of someone who didn't have that parental pressure like his curiosity a bit like that. Yeah, I think Kyrgios is quite a good example. If anything, he could use a bit more of that. Yeah, he could, he could use on Dragas' dad, actually. You know, just for six months. Yeah, yeah, 100%. I guess, I don't know, yeah, maybe Federer's parents. I don't know. I don't know whether they were that pushy necessarily. I just remember the story about him, like he was a bit of a brat growing up and then, and then he, Federer, yeah, tantrum.

7:00You can't imagine that. Proper tantrum. There are videos, I think,

7:03Josh Berry:of his like teenage tantrums. Yeah, he's like kicking the racket. I always loved it. When you see clips of young Federer smashing up rackets, it's so good. It's lovely. But whether they were pushy or not to begin with, when Novak's parents discover that they've got this golden child, they really begin to push him in the tennis department. So he spends the next six years coaching really intensely with Jelena Jancic, traveling back and forth from Belgrade a lot, also traveling around the country and around Europe to tournaments and training camps. It goes to the US as well. And obviously this is very expensive and it's only so far that a pizza restaurant money can go.

7:47And Djokovic did an interview really recently actually where he revealed that his dad funded his early years of tennis by taking out these high interest loans from mafia loan sharks. Wow. And boy oh boy did that pay off. So if anyone is worried about taking a high interest loan let me just say now it does happen for you. Exactly. It can work. They do a good service those mafia loan sharks. Use code up shop. Yeah. It did pay off in the end but they're dealing with some pretty bad dudes. This is like the equivalent of being like, just buy lottery tickets. It might work. It's actually worse. Yeah.

8:36A lot won't break your legs if you don't get the bonus ball. Do they do that? It's not just in The Sopranos. These guys are bad dudes. Yeah, they do. What's the interest rate of interest? Is that too boring a question? He actually said in this interview, which weirdly was with Slavin Bilic, the former West Ham and Croatia manager, he was interviewing Novak and they did actually talk about the interest rates if you're interested. He was saying it was like 15 to 20%, but when Novak's dad went to them, he was like, look, I need the money now. And the guy was like, well, if you need it quickly, it's going to be 30%.

9:12Oh, that's such bastard. Is that per year? That's just like taking out a student loan, isn't it? Actually, I don't think that's any more immoral than the student financing fund. Is that 30 % a year? No, I don't think it's quite that much, but it is. And if you don't pay it back, Nick Clegg will. Nick Clegg will break your legs or he'll cancel all your meta accounts these days. That's what I'll do. Can't imagine Nick Clegg breaking someone's legs. I just thought I could imagine, is it like him with erectile dysfunction? That's all I can imagine. He just feels kind of impotent, you know? Is that because of how the coalition sort of went?

9:48Yeah. That's just my vibe of him. Yeah, that's quite good. You know how there was that Guardian columnist at the time who always drew David Cameron as a condom? Oh, yeah, yeah. For some reason that rang really true.

9:57Josh Berry:He's just a bit of a fucking condom He is like a condom isn't he It's a good observation I think It's just the sort of greasy shape of his head But also there's his vibe You know that bit where he's in the House of Commons and he's like What would my mother say She'd say sit up straight put a tie on and sing the national anthem There's something very condomy about that You know Do you know what I mean I agree and I also see how Nick's legs a little bit flaccid Yeah not that having unprotected sex Is like you know not it's cooler it is cooler I'm not saying you should do it but Cameron he's very sort of like yeah maybe David Cameron is a mainstream brand and Nick Clegg is the ones you get for free from the sexual health clinic ah yeah that's a good yeah definitely that so we're 10 minutes in and the lesson is high interest loans don't wear a fucking condom oh that's the Josh Berry guarantee no wear a condom unless you'd like to have a child in which case we give you means if you can yeah Just do what the circumstances would require regarding contraception.

11:01Look, don't come to me for advice.

11:03Josh Berry:Just be careful. And don't come to Boris Becker either. He could use some condoms, actually. How much are they lending? They're lending, it's like big sums, like thousands of... Hundreds, hundreds, hundreds of big ones. I don't actually know. He doesn't exactly... And this is paying for what? For his tennis career, basically. For his tennis training. so he's training a lot he's going to these camps in the US going to different tournaments because you do just need a lot of money now yeah you do but I'm really interested in the sorry I don't want to get too sidetracked on the fascinating topic of investment structure but surely he could have found you know a business guy who'd want to get some selling back from Djokovic's career no?

11:45oh is that what they do

11:46Josh Berry:they sell yeah yeah that's often what players will do yeah they're like someone from like Morgan Stanley or whatever will be like here's X amount of money yeah This is Serbia in what year? 90s. Right, yeah. So there's wars on in the Balkans. Yeah, he's not going to go. Sorry, that's the most privileged thing I've ever done. Why is he just wandering to... Why is he just calling his network and just chat some of the chats on Morgan Stanley? Surely you know a VC. Yeah, everyone knows a VC, mate. What a stupid cunt I am. I hate myself. Anyway, let's carry on. Anyway, there weren't many. VC individuals floating around just network a bit more just go to a few more drinks events honestly yeah he goes to some drink events with mafia bad boys instead and he gets the money he does say actually in this interview do you want to do the quote yes sorry as his dad oh this is Djokovic they were very difficult times there are so many stories that cannot be told publicly car chases and other things while we were trying to get by.

12:56Josh Berry:Wow. Car chases. Car chases. That's terrifying. Pretty sinister. Apparently, some of these loan sharks caused a car accident for Djokovic's dad. Why was he behind on that payment? Yeah, so he doesn't really... Or just to get in his head. Yeah, just... Don't forget. You are ahead on your payments, but we will fuck you up if you... Maybe this must be, honestly, I know this sounds a bit glib, but this must be why Djokovic is so unbelievably good under pressure and is able to just, like, I've never, honestly, I don't think I've ever seen an athlete like it. He's able to turn negativity into focus and performance.

13:31If you grew up like this, it makes sense, right? Fascinating. And obviously, Mafia Lone Shark Society is a pretty volatile time to be living in the Balkans. Lots of wars going on in the 90s. Djokovic spent his 12th birthday hiding in a bunker while NATO was bombing Belgrade. So that's going to toughen you as well. Yeah, I think while living in Belgrade, this war was going on and he'd have to travel around the city to different courts, depending on where had been bombed the night before or where was in a fit state to play tennis. At some point, he's training in a disused swimming pool as well that they'd converted into a tennis court.

14:11When he's 12, though, so in the midst of the war, he moves to Germany and joins a tennis academy. and from that point on his progress is pretty meteoric so he's traveling around europe dominating these junior tennis tournaments it's actually him and andy murray who's a week older than him are dominating their age category wiping up at these tournaments and that is that why they're kind of matey aren't they yeah they go way back yeah yeah yeah um it must be quite an interesting relationship mustn't it when you've got someone who you're kind of you probably do have quite a lot of affinity and huge amounts in common with because you see them all the time but also like you wish they didn't exist yeah um anyway djokovic goes pro in 2003 and then makes his first grand slam appearance in 2005 which pricks up the pesky ears of the lawn tennis association who in 2006 make an audacious and frankly ridiculous bid to get djokovic to represent great britain was this after the success of Greg Rosensky is that the thing yeah yeah so this was it was it was a pretty dark period for British tennis Tim Henman was in decline Greg Rosensky I think was was number one but not making that much progress in in Grand Slams the Davis Cup team as well was nestled between Luxembourg and Chinese Taipei in the world rankings hang on a second sorry if only we had an amazing Scottish tennis player who was meteorically rising up the ranks at this point it's weird

15:46Josh Berry:what yeah yeah how offensive to Andy Murray we're going to swap him actually you're Serbian what that's outrageous also I mean I guess they didn't know Novak Djokovic that well but knowing him now as like an extremely patriotic Serb it's very funny I know our country just bombed your country that was mental but do you want to come and say here there's something so British about that isn't there it's like awfully sorry about that old chap don't suppose you fancy a game of tennis representing us do you it's so british yeah but yeah what is andy murray thinking that novak djokovic gets picked as this churchillian hero to lead the lta back to the top um um and yeah it's quite ridiculous i mean djokovic he'd never lived in the uk has no british ancestry at all because rosetsky's got a parent greg rosetsky yeah he was he was born in canada uh but i think he had his mum was British I think at least there was some connection whereas Djokovic is as Serbian as a Serbian thing get on I started oh gosh Serbian as a as a country in Eastern Europe Serbian as a former Yugoslavian state yeah yeah Serbian is a Serbian thing I can't believe we did that I feel embarrassed yeah should we look up a food something no no no sorry no not you I was just embarrassed no sorry no that would be how fucking patronising would that be oh my god you mangled that fucking hell I'm sorry no no I can't believe that happened yeah that's great it was dark days with British tennis wasn't it I mean I guess but Murray Murray won the US Open they would have known that and they won the US Open Juniors at that point they just completely ignored it because from the perspective of know nothing public like myself you're just like we haven't got anyone now so they were coming up through the youth rankings to get as like ranked doubles team number one and number two yeah yeah what's the point of poaching someone anyway what so you can just I guess it does it does get wider public interest yeah I mean it would have paid off because bums on seat yeah they were onto something he would actually be by miles the greatest British athlete of all time by miles yeah because who is it I think Murray's up there yeah Murray's 100 % I actually think Murray is the greatest British athlete.

18:12If you look at Achievement, it's like Ronnie O'Sullivan, which is that sport. Lewis Hamilton. Chris Hoy. Chris Hoy is up there. Steve Redgrove, I guess. Yeah, quite a lot. Getting a bit niche on the sports there with snooker. Yeah, they're the best Olympians, I guess. Gareth Bale? Did I say British? Gareth Bale. Yeah, yeah, Gareth Bale. Yeah, George Baird. Oh, yeah. It's a bit of a tetchy one, that. But you know what I mean? He would comfortably be the...

18:35Josh Berry:I think Murray... The geographers would comfortably be... Yeah, yeah, yeah. I might start referring to him as that. Yeah. by Djokovic from the UK British number one Novak Djokovic amazing yeah so just to explain why they even tried that trick there was a rule with the world tennis body at the time and possibly now I'm not sure that if you lived somewhere for two years then you were allowed to represent that place so I guess they were hoping that Novak could just move to Kent yeah Klaten you've been to Putnik Klaten yeah that's such a strange I'd like worlds colliding like Djokovic in a sort of three bed in Clapham just cracks me up as an idea like having to do with all the chaps go to the falcon mates mates unbelievable tennis mate bring me the the green juices I don't like this here that was we're before green juice and all that yeah he got into the green juice later I think I sort of assumed he was always quite holistic well he was still eating gluten at this stage?

19:41Josh Berry:Yeah, he was big. He loved his pizzas. He loved his gluten. Of course, he grew up in a pizza restaurant. Because he like, sorry, I don't know, I hope you're not raising your hands, but when he like, the change, and actually, even though he was a professional athlete, and even though he's ripped to shreds, you could see the change from when he was eating gluten, and then when he stopped eating gluten, he lost about three kilos. I'm such a dork. He lost about, he lost about probably 3.2, 3.3 kilos. And he, yeah, he looked different. his body looks kind of different as a result he looks less inflamed what type of gluten was it?

20:15just the regular just the regular type yeah just the gluten gluten but we can get into the

20:23Josh Berry:we'll get into the manuka honey and the algae good anyway so unsurprisingly being a very proud Serb Novak turns down the LTA and sticks with Serbia Do you know how he turned that? Did he say like anything? Is there any more information? It's actually been something that the Djokovic camp have tried to sort of hush up a little bit. Even the idea that they entertained it. Yeah, because they did have talks with the LTA about it. I think part of it as well was that, you know, Serbia was coming out of a war and maybe didn't have like the funding. Although isn't this like the early noughties? Yeah, I guess it was mid noughties.

21:05I think it was pretty. Anyway, they thought they had a shot and they shot it. Presumably there was some money on the table. There was, yeah. It's a personal sponsorship.

21:14Josh Berry:Yeah. Robinsons are interested, Novak. I don't know if you're... You're familiar with Fruit Cordial, yes?

21:22Just like all this shit is proud. I love Robinsons. Sorry, I don't want to slap. I'm not slacking Robinsons. Other Cordials are available. Yeah, but I don't want to... But, you know, just like all the sort... It does actually amaze me every year that Robinsons still have such... Sorry, it's really going to the boring parts, but they still have such a domination on Wimbledon sponsorship. The iron grip. It's like how... I love it. Like surely... Big squad. Big cord. I have like... I'm surprised that like Prime or Huel or something hasn't swooped in. Oh, thank God it hasn't. Robinson's that much of a...

21:53It feels like quite a good fit in terms of... It does, but like... Outlook on the world. Huel. Yeah, yeah. No, no, Robinson's. Oh, okay, okay, yeah. People who drink Robinson's will give it to their kids. They're all drinking Huel at the change of ends. Yeah, it doesn't feel right. It makes me feel so angry. Yeah, yeah. No, I'm very happy. Stephen Bartlett's there at the change event is just doing a fucking advert. He will be in the crowd this year, I bet. Anyway, by this point, Novak is making waves at the top end of tennis and he really catches everyone's eyes at the 2007 Canadian Open where he knocks out the world number three, Andy Roddick, number two, Nadal, and world number one, Roger Federer, to claim the title.

22:31so that's really people sitting up and taking notice it's the first time since Boris Becker in 1994 that someone's knocked out all the three top seeds at a single tournament and then in 2008 at the tender age of 20 Novak wins his first major title at the Australian Open and at this point Federer and Nadal were really dominant they'd won 11 consecutive majors and he's sort of the great pretender now, breaking into that monopoly. It's actually another three years, though, before he wins another Grand Slam. The following year, he has to pull out of his Australian Open title defence in the quarterfinals after getting heatstroke.

23:17His serve was a mess at this point as well. The biomechanics of his serve. He was basically, for anyone who's interested, it may not be very many people, and we may need to cut this out, but I'm going to go into it anyway. He was basically bowling his serve in. You're supposed to bend your arm. and he was his serve was just totally fucked and then yeah 20 the next time he wins a slam it's a 2011 Australian Open he'd sorted that out and then it made a humongous difference but he was just like he was all over the shop for that period of time so it was a rough diamond yeah so this Australian Open defence he drops out with heat stroke it's 37 degrees the air temperature that day and then apparently another 10 degrees hotter on court what per se well you know what obviously not you might have been chatting to Andy Roddick his opponent because he doesn't have much sympathy either uh and he actually already just clarify i do have sympathy for that it's about 22 degrees in the uk and i've been a pissing sweat walking i went i walked around the park with my friend this morning and i was i was dripping so i i i'm very very acutely conscious of being that type of bloke in the armchair you know being like i would have missed that drop shot like i think it's amazing what he's done yeah andy roddick doesn't agree andy roddick doesn't agree so so he already uh thought that jokovic was a bit of a moaner always complaining about injuries so the previous year the us open jokovic had been suffering during the tournament with this ankle injury and roddick in a pre-match press conference was asked about jokovic's injury and and which ankle it was and he replied um isn't it both of them and a back and a hip and a cramp bird flu anthrax SARS common cough and cold I've done the pacing there because that's exactly how he delivers it in the conference and I do know the exact clip we're referring to you're an encyclopedia I'm a loser that's what I am I lost my virginity very late as I'm sure you can imagine you spent a lot of time on YouTube watching tennis clubs oh my god women were just not I found a forum where people are well I'm sort of impressed by my immense knowledge of tennis trivia.

25:25I'm impressed anyway. So if I'd been around in those days, Josh, swooning. If my sexuality could have changed, I might have lost. Still time, guys. So does Roddick, Roddick hates him and is calling him a pussy. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think Roddick and some of his other opponents at this point see Djokovic as a bit of a wet wipe with all these injuries. Yes. Have you seen the Federer clip about that? I know, I haven't. That's amazing. There's a bit where jokovic retires in a match and federer it's like he's like look you know it's not the story of the guy who never retired let's just put it that way you know it's like every match you know he's whatever i just don't want to do it and he leaves so you know look uh i've never done that i've never done it's fucking amazing it's such a dick that clip yeah are you searching for the clip because it's it's 2009 australian open i'm sorry i'm sorry the url yeah i believe it's qxy after um jokovic 2009 post-match interview on youtube it'll be for me the next one i'm so great look at me uh so handsome yeah i'm sure you'll be diplomatic but we're kind of surprised also with the heat getting into him like that and seeing him stop

26:40Josh Berry:Well, I mean, it's happened before. So, I mean, it's not the guy who's never given up in his career, you know. So that's kind of disappointing to see, you know, when you've got two top guys playing each other and you give up. I mean, he gave up against me. Give up, give up. Heave stroke. So his throat. I mean, those are kind of things, you know, you wonder about. I've only given up basically once in my career. That came just now in Paris against Blake when I couldn't move because of my back, you know. But I think Andy pushing there. and Andy probably would have run away anyway. Tell us what you really think, Rog.

27:13Well, you're playing great tennis. It's going to be a great swimming farm between you and Andy. All the best. I hope so. Thanks a lot. So did Djokovic have a bit of a rep back then? It's weird to think from now of being someone who physically or mentally didn't have the resilience. That was a big joke. I remember as a tennis fan at the time, people just being like, oh, Djokovic just gives up. He just retires. Yeah, like 2007 Wimbledon as well. I think he had blisters and he has to retire and stuff. Yeah, so that was a big thing. Whereas now, he's probably got the reputation more than anyone of just like, he won't die.