The Best TV Week of the Year, ‘Task’ Episode 3, and ‘The Mandalorian and Grogu’ Trailer Underwhelms

22 Sep 2025 · 57 min · 18 chapters

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In short

The Watch (Ringer) episode covers: (1) TV release chatter—Task (episode 3), Alien Earth finale, The Lowdown (FX, first two episodes), The English Teacher (season 2 starts Sept 25), Slow Horses (season 5 first two episodes), House of Guinness, and the Mandalorian and Grogu trailer; (2) a deep review of Task episode 3, “Nobody’s stronger than forgiveness,” written by Brad Inglesby and directed by Sally Richardson Whitfield.

Key claims

the trailer feels like a TV sizzle reel rather than “cinema,” and the Task mystery is less about “who did it” and more about character/architecture and tension payoff.

Notable examples

Lizzie and Grasso at the State Trooper Bar (with Mother Love Bone and Chloe Sevigny’s performance); Freddie’s monologue; Maeve teaching Sam to swim; the Richard Rohr “Falling Upward” reference about “container” vs “contents.”

Guests

Andy Greenwald (TV critic/Podcaster; known for “spamming mother love bone” jokes) and Chris Ryan (host; editor at The Ringer).

Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.

Chapters

Tap a time to open that second in VO

Eagles Game Recap

2:29 to 4:42

Chris and Andy discuss their experience watching the Eagles game, including emotions and reactions.

“talk to you about mainly so we did not previous week we did watch the eagles together yeah um and I thought it was good.”

The Excitement of TV Week

4:42 to 6:50

Discussion on the busy week of television, highlighting new releases and upcoming shows.

“So I really spent the rest of the day living that down.”

Highlights of Upcoming Shows

6:50 to 9:03

Andy and Chris talk about specific shows like The Lowdown and The English Teacher.

“Also on Tuesday night is the release of the first two episodes of The Lowdown on FX, which is Sterling Harjo's return to TV after the Reservation Dogs.”

The Lowdown Discussion

9:03 to 11:55

An in-depth look at The Lowdown and Ethan Hawke's role in it.

“I would say that's more of a Apple Plus screener site issue than a me issue.”

Mandalorian Trailer Reactions

11:55 to 14:00

Andy shares his thoughts on the Mandalorian and Grogu trailer, discussing audience expectations.

“Sterling, uh, leverage the success of reservation dogs into making a show that is at once a love letter to his hometown and honestly a love letter to the things that he loves.”

Analyzing the Trailer for 'The Mandalorian'

14:00 to 15:01

Discussion on the new trailer for 'The Mandalorian' and its implications.

“these are more modest, not barbed takes, because I do have other thoughts that maybe...”

Star Wars' Evolution and Viewer Expectations

15:01 to 17:07

Exploring the evolution of Star Wars and audience expectations after years of hiatus.

“It hasn't been around for a couple of years.”

The Impact of Popular Characters in TV Shows

17:07 to 21:53

Debate on the role of popular characters like Grogu and their impact on storytelling.

“not on Yom Kippur I agree with you look Look, there's also an interpretation of this where I'm like, this is actually the end of an art form in the sense that, look, here, Kaya, take this one.”

Anticipation for 'Heat 2' and Casting Rumors

21:53 to 24:12

Discussion about the potential of 'Heat 2' and the implications of casting choices.

“I think Mandalorian learned that it was not actually this monosyllabic samurai that people were tuning in for, but the cutest thing that ever lived.”

Hollywood Development Dynamics and Filmmaking Hopes

24:12 to 28:00

Insights into the complexities of Hollywood filmmaking and development processes.

“I just want to point out that there has also been another filmmaker that I love, Martin Scorsese, and it's been like, what's Martin Scorsese doing after Killers of the Flower Moon?”
Show all 18 chapters

Anticipation for Upcoming Projects

28:00 to 30:30

The hosts discuss various upcoming movie reboots and their potential.

“Or like Night of the Soldado and have like the Brolin character from Sicario.”

Anticipation for Upcoming Projects

30:33 to 30:55

The hosts discuss various upcoming movie reboots and their potential.

“What if we told you the taste of deep fried turkey is now available at your local deli?”

Reviewing 'Task' Episode Three

30:56 to 41:21

In-depth analysis of the third episode of 'Task', focusing on performances and direction.

“Written by Brad Inglesby, directed by Sally Richardson Whitfield, who has become, who's the guy who did Tim Van Patten, who was always like the HBO in-house, like nailed band of brothers and Deadwood.”

Exploring Themes and Ideas in 'Task'

41:22 to 42:00

Discussion on the deeper themes presented in 'Task', including character development.

“There's a note in the show that I thought you might want to get into.”

Exploring Richard Rohr's Framework

42:00 to 44:30

Delve into Richard Rohr's ideas on the tasks of human life and their relevance to the show.

“I know about him because my father-in-law got interested in Rohr's second half of life framework.”

The Depth of Task and Its Themes

44:30 to 48:24

Discuss how the show Task invites deeper contemplation and analysis of its themes.

“The truly great shows that engage us either as viewers or on the podcast have that secondary task, if you will, of probing deeper.”

Character Connections and Plot Development

48:24 to 51:20

Examine character dynamics and plot developments in the latest episode of Task.

“We got to meet Margarita LaVeva's character, Aaron, a little bit.”

Memories and Nostalgia: The Lanark Diner

51:20 to 55:49

Reflect on personal memories connected to the locations featured in the show, like the Lanark Diner.

“and the Ecuadorians might be playing just...”
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Transcript

Automatic transcript. May contain errors.

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1:22edition now only on netflix i need supports to have to clear the room stand up and walk now hello and welcome to the watch my name is chris ryan i am an editor at the ringer.com and joining me in the studio he's the guy who spams mother love bone at the state trooper bar it's andy Greenwald!

1:47Andy Greenwald:I can't decide. Chloe's just like me. Which part would I do worse at? I can't believe that Mother Love Phone showed up on task last night. You can't believe it? We're going to get into that. We're going to get into task. We're going to talk a little bit about the Mandalorian trailer. We have some chatter about what a huge week of television we have this week. It's almost overwhelming. Greenwald, it's great to see you. You can email the watch at the watch at spotify.com you can follow us on instagram the watch pod underscore you can watch us on youtube ringer dash tv or watch us on spotify where i hope you're listening and sunday sunday i imagine it was a roller coaster of emotions for the kid that's all i wanted to talk to you about mainly so we did not previous week we did watch the eagles together yeah um and I thought it was good.

2:42Andy Greenwald:We had a kind of, you know, it was a little bit, it was a little bit like high holy days in an orthodox or conservative temple. Men and women were in separate rooms. The women had a sort of a crafting thing going on and the men were watching sports and it was okay. I wouldn't know, but go ahead. And we didn't do that again this week so we were in our respective domiciles for this game. It was a roller coaster. Can I ask you something just between you and me and Kaya and all our friends in the listening community. I seemed okay, right? I didn't seem to... Last week or this week? No, this week over text.

3:15Andy Greenwald:Was I like... You seemed fine. Thank you. Yeah, you seemed fine. Why? Were you fine? I was fine. Okay. It's real... Chris, it's really important for me for that you think... Don't print in the newspaper that I was mad. Exactly. I just want you to think that I was okay. I was pretty level-headed. You know, I was like, well, this will be an instructive loss. Then I was like, well, it'll be a moral victory. Then I was like, oh shit. We just won. So what did you do after the Eagles beat the Rams on a last-second field goal block return for a touchdown to cover? From those around me at the time, including, I imagine, the neighbors, I've been told that a sound emerged from my body that has never before emerged from my body.

3:55A per-bear job?

3:57Andy Greenwald:Here's the thing, though. I think that as a— which camera's on? Hashtag father of daughters. I think it's important not to continue the cycle of really like angry sports dads. Yeah. You know? Yeah, yeah. So I definitely try to keep it. I'm less crazy, hopefully, around them than I am with the fellas. But when that happened, I had the first like, I was ready to be like, oh, well, see, it's okay. And that noise seemed to begin in my sternum. And then Jordan Davis blocked it. And then Jordan Davis ran 18.59 miles per hour down the field for the touchdown. And the noise turned into something else.

4:39Andy Greenwald:It was kind of like one of those like Greek mythological creatures that's like part lion, part eagle, you know. And it was not cool. It was not a cool sound. So I really spent the rest of the day living that down. We were like, wasn't that weird when I made that sound? No, at first we were like, nobody heard that, right? That didn't come out of me. But it did. It did. Isn't it nice to learn things about ourselves at this age? I think it's what life's all about. It's just the constant journey of discovery. Let's discover some television. So no comments on your behavior? My behavior was fine. I got to be completely honest.

5:18I was working for the middle part of the game where I felt it falling out of reach. I was just like, I am not going to watch every play and criticize Matt Breyer. I have other stuff to get done today. And so I was trying to like, basically like get ready for rewatchables in the watch while that was happening. And then as soon as they let the, they uncuffed young Jalen and let him deal. I was like, okay, we're back. I was telling Kai that like, at one point, I think I started intimating that I'd be ready to go out for a lovely lunch with my wife. I was like, we could just turn our backs on this.

5:51Andy Greenwald:You can never say that. And he was like, okay, let me know. And then I was just like, I don't know why you're dressed. Like, you know, like we're never leaving this house. Because I've learned over time. I'm never leaving this couch because look what amazing things happen when I sit here. The spot on the couch. Yeah, exactly. I've learned later in life that it's important never to crack the window. Like, because when we say, you know what? It just might be an early day for me in the NFL. Yes. We say that for ourselves to make ourselves seem normal to ourselves. If someone takes us up on that, like that's a huge mistake.

6:24Yeah. It's a huge mistake. This week on television. Yeah. People are going to be busy. there is something for everyone and it's sneakily I think the best week of the year in the TV year. The best week of the year. So we've got obviously Task aired last night the beginning of the week. We have the Alien Earth finale we're all on the edge of our seat to find out what those crazy kids got up to this week. Also on Tuesday night is the release of the first two episodes of The Lowdown on FX, which is Sterling Harjo's return to TV after the Reservation Dogs. And they're dropping two episodes. And they're dropping two episodes.

7:04We're actually, I'm actually doing an event with Sterling and Ethan Hawke tonight. And we're going to use the audio from that event where we're screening an episode for Thursday's show. And video. And video.

7:15Andy Greenwald:I'm sorry I can't join you, but I think it's, we could probably say Ethan Hawke requested that I not be present. I don't know why you keep saying that. I thought we all had a great connection with him when he came on for Good Lord Bird. We did. We had a great time, but I felt the spark between you guys and like, I don't want to be the third wheel. We're just two guys who love Rihanna, you know? What do you want? I am sorry I can't celebrate Rosh Hashanah with you guys. It's a shame. Yeah. Those are good people and it's a great show. And also this week, we have the return of The English Teacher, which comes back with its full second season on the 25th.

7:50It's so good. It's so good. Not only that, I believe the first two episodes of Slow Horses Season 5 go up this week. Damn. It's the best season since the first one. Whoa. I'm serious. They're back. It's a fully, absolutely everything you would want from Slow Horses is this season.

8:10Andy Greenwald:This is great. And then House of Guinness, which comes out Thursday night, Friday morning. That's also this week? That's all this week. So there's two full seasons dropping. And I have to say, the fucking morning show is really good this season, and the second episode is awesome. Wait, like, awesome? Not awesome, like, oh my god, this is like Carrie and Brody in a cabin awesome, but like, that's like my only reference point is Homeland. Sterling, was Homeland in your mind when you were making Milano? Sterling, you cast Tracy Letts in the pilot of your show. Did you know he was on Homeland S3? Then walk away.

8:51So what a week. What would you say you're most excited for? I guess you've seen some of The Lowdown.

8:56Andy Greenwald:I've seen, I've watched The Lowdown. I've watched English Teacher. I've not yet watched Slow Horses. I would say that's more of a Apple Plus screener site issue than a me issue. I've tried. But of these shows, what am I most excited about? Well, I think I'm excited about The Lowdown because I have dreamed of having a show like this Tell people a little bit about it. Okay, well, no spoilers, obviously. But when Sterling was on this podcast, really, the scheme of things, not that long ago, he said that his next project would be, it had a different title at the time, but he was making a down-on-his-heels P.I.

9:36Andy Greenwald:show starring Ethan Hawke, set in his beloved hometown of Tulsa, and his number one North Star guiding light for the show was Robert Altman's The Long Goodbye. And he has done this. hang the banner he really did that mission accomplished in all of the best ways in all of the oh my god i can't believe they really let him get away with this ways he has gathered up i would say a hall of fame that guy cast two dozen of just those guys but also just i people that i have never met before or never seen before who come on and do two scenes and you're like well i'll follow you anywhere brother yes well or like you know macon blair was is a filmmaker He's really talented, friends of his.

10:17Andy Greenwald:Directs a couple episodes of Loading. Directs a couple episodes. He was on Reservation Dogs. And then he plays a character on the show that within minutes of introducing him in the pilot, I'm like, I cannot wait to spend the next six years with these guys. It's an absolute, for me, I mean, it's an absolute delight. Yeah. I loved it. It's no perfect. This is one of my favorite Hawk performances in recent memory. Because I think, you know, is he kind of flits between mainstream blockbuster movies, often genre movies where he's in action films and horror movies and then kind of really exploring the studio space when it comes to some of his more independent choices whether it's stuff that he's directing stuff that he's appearing in one thing I really really respect about him is that when one of his long time buddies makes a movie he's in the film like Rick Gomez makes a movie Ethan Hawke is in it you know what I mean like and he works with his family it's just a very impressive way of doing things.

11:16But this has some qualities where it's both the wild-eyed, idealist, romantic dreamer side of Ethan Hawke, but also the incredibly approachable, everyday guy that he is capable of being.

11:33Andy Greenwald:Who just loves to act, who loves to show up. I would also say, and we'll talk more about it later in the week and throughout the season, I hope, Uh, when we have talked about like dream projects from auteurs over the last few years, it tends to be people being like, I can't believe they let me play in the Star Wars sandbox or finally the keys to the xenomorph were handed over, you know, because that's the nature of the business. Sterling, uh, leverage the success of reservation dogs into making a show that is at once a love letter to his hometown and honestly a love letter to the things that he loves.

12:08Andy Greenwald:So there is a character who wears a hat a lot like Sterling wears, who owns a used bookshop that stays open despite itself on a street next to a lawyer who's his best friend in a diner that has great coffee all night. And I'm like, this is the dream of any writer and filmmaker to be like, I want to make a show about the things that I love in the space that I know and have it. But the trick is he makes it feel welcoming and not just someone telling you about a dream he had one time. Yeah, I think a lot of that comes from where it's shot and his familiarity and his love for his city. And there are moments, this is a very like ornate, like multi-layered mystery conspiracy show about one man up against an institution or force that is almost beyond his comprehension.

12:54but it takes time to have these beats like a guy walking into a used bookstore and being like I'm home or a guy getting food and like being like this is good food like these like real life beats that give the show like a ton of depth and heart and heart yeah you're right I can't wait to talk about it we'll hit that on Thursday along with Alien

13:17Andy Greenwald:I would also say having English Teacher back I watched too and I had to hold back from watching more because it's I just think that show is so fun to check it out. Speaking of the Star Wars sandbox, many, many, many people are asking, Andy, why is your silence so deafening on the Mandalorian and Grogu trailer? I mean, in the hour since it dropped? What did you think? You're so excited to talk about this. A little minute and a half taste of what Filoni and Favs have been cooking up? I would say, okay, I have two headline takes and then I'd like to cede the sandbox to you. One take, these are definitely like, these are more modest, not barbed takes, because I do have other thoughts that maybe...

14:05You don't want to get aggregated.

14:06Andy Greenwald:I want to get aggro. Yeah, Kaya's watching. She leaned in. Kaya the Hutt getting ready to cut up. Another viral take. Andy versus the Mouse House, round four. Go ahead. If Bob Iger thinks the release of this trailer is going to silence the... I think that on the one hand, like it's a kid's adventure movie. And that is actually what... I mean, that is what George Lucas said he wanted to do with Phantom Menace. That is, you know, even like the kind of Indiana Jones slash Flash Gordon font at the end speaks to the influences that George Lucas had originally for this trilogy before it became nerd rage bait for grown men.

14:47Andy Greenwald:And there's nothing wrong with that. There's an audience for that and it could be fun. um we'll see my main take though is that disney this is this is chickens coming home to roost in the sense that this looks like a fun sizzle reel for a new season of television on the disney plus service there was absolutely nothing in this that made it seem cinematic it's a teaser and they didn't have any dialogue not that this is a dialogue rich show in the first place but i I agree with you that it is strange that this is a show probably, I would imagine, I do not have the data in front of me, that has had, if not a declining viewership, a declining sort of Q rating.

15:31Andy Greenwald:Well, also, it just hasn't been around. It hasn't been around for a couple of years. And one of its seasons wasn't even it. Well, yeah, it was the Book of Boba Fett that turned into a Mandalorian season 2.5 or 3.5 or whatever. And so it's just a teaser. I'm not trying to like condemn it, but there is a feeling of, do you remember that scene in Armageddon when they first bring Bruce Willis into NASA? And they're like, you guys, we need you to drill on this asteroid to save the Earth. And he's like, this is the best you could come up with. Like all the guys at NASA, like this is the plan. Are you sure?

16:08And that's kind of how I felt watching that. I was like, oh, yeah, you guys got a hut and played by Jeremy Allen White and some giant snow bots. like uh it's like the same first of all like can we see like how hard is it to get insurance on

16:23Andy Greenwald:those giant walkers for the empire these days i see because are those at ats no those are the two those are the two footed ones and is that are they do you refer to them as at ats or at we've litigated this have we because i feel like i call them ats when i was a kid i did too and now i've been harshly corrected by the community yes the community was i got a community note but I can't remember what it was supposed to be that happened to both of us I think on the playgrounds of Philadelphia separate playgrounds because we didn't know each other we were both like just talking up at-ats and asking to go to the water fountain that's right I was running numbers you were observing the high holidays please not on Yom Kippur I agree with you look Look, there's also an interpretation of this where I'm like, this is actually the end of an art form in the sense that, look, here, Kaya, take this one.

17:22Andy Greenwald:I'm going to put it on the tee for you. Because this is a Star Wars, they took a couple years off. Kathy took a couple years off to really like kind of 4D chess it. And they came back with a movie that could be a TV show that was filmed entirely in front of a volume starring a random person in a suit and a puppet. Yeah. And a bunch of cartoon Muppets. Like, they're like, let's see. Do you know what I mean? Like, there is very, very little here that one could, Sean Fennessey voice, call cinema. Okay? Like, charitably. It doesn't mean that there is no place for this. I think that though in the conversation about Lucasfilm, about Disney, about Star Wars, that this is what they have when they're, it's impossible to distinguish what makes this different from a TV show.

18:15Andy Greenwald:And the only other thing we have going for the larger story now that Andor is done is one shot of Ryan Gosling hanging out on the ocean with a kid. Which is not in the stars. Which is not in the stars and they do not appear to be at war. I was kind of trying to figure out why this came out on a Monday morning do you feel like Disney needed to change the narrative I was wondering if perhaps you know Sarah McLachlan and the Lilith crew turning their backs on on Disney last night the weekend look I imagine that this was like we're going to put this out at some point but this is like a strange way to release the teaser to the movie that you're kind of banking your next summer on right if that's in fact what they're doing maybe they have some animated movie i don't know about i genuinely i genuinely don't understand what their internal um perceptions or anticipation for this movie what they are yeah like they could they could be underselling it intentionally knowing that there is a built-in ceiling because it is not uh it's not expanding the tent let's say um and then maybe that speaks to a future star wars cinematic release schedule where they spent a lot of money on Starfighter and then they released like smaller, could have been TV shows just to keep the...

19:32Andy Greenwald:Keep the subs? Keep the IP humming. Keep the subs. Well, but not the subs because this isn't even on the service. So I find it a little confusing. For sure. I was wondering whether or not... Have you seen the poster? I have. I thought it was... It's fun. Sure. Do you think this movie would do better if they called it Grogu Demon Slayer? Apparently. K-pop Mandalorian? Yes. keep keep pitching i keep getting every monday i get this email called the wake up it's from the ankler sean this guy sean mcnulty writes it and you know as the box office returns an analysis and every week it feels like the number one movie in the world is something called demon something yeah and it's like 500 million dollars this weekend i'm like i don't know what this is it's almost as if there's a groundswell of desire to slay monsters and demons maybe the zeitgeist i don't know do you uh do you have any look as someone who tried and sadly failed to have baby yoda on the podcast a few years ago somehow my emails went unanswered yeah do you have any concern whatsoever that we are perhaps going a little hard on oh that we're showing the baby too much is this a look i'll just speak my own truth a couple decades ago a show called family matters premiered and I was like, hey, it's Reginald Vel Johnson, the co-star of Die Hard.

20:58Andy Greenwald:He's just a working cop who has a family. And I'm like, what better way to wind down a tough week of third grade or whatever? I imagine you like sidling up to a grown man at a bat mitzvah, you know, and you're a kid. Yeah. And you're just doing the TV guide thing. You're like, have you seen Die Hard's Reginald Vel Johnson is making the leap to the small screen? Making the leap, yes, making the small step down. But my point is, I was like, this is an enjoyable family sitcom. Then Urkel shows up. And then it becomes the Urkel show. It's pandemonium. It succeeded. Did I feel like Family Matters lost its heart that day and lost its way?

21:34Andy Greenwald:I did. Perhaps my first hot take in the TV space. Is this an Urkel situation? Which, to be clear, would mean it would become very successful. Yeah, yeah. But I wouldn't like it. I don't know, really. I think at a certain point, you have to give the people what they want. You know what I mean? Samurai Turnpity learned that. I think Mandalorian learned that it was not actually this monosyllabic samurai that people were tuning in for, but the cutest thing that ever lived. Wow. That's just it, man. Speaking of giving people what they want, can I just bounce something off you here? This is what we're here for.

22:13Leonardo DiCaprio is apparently going to be in Heat 2.

22:16Andy Greenwald:Yeah, we talked about that, right? Did we really get into it? No, we can get into it more. So the timeline of this is Michael Mann writes or co-writes the book Heat 2. Yes. And then it becomes very clear through word and deed and gossip that making this into a film. It's almost like a proof of concept for a sequel, yeah. But he spent the last few years basically behind the scenes being like, this is my next work. This has to happen. There are all these rumors about potential casting, about collaborators. There was all this talk that like the bear season four shoot was like in the background. All of those actors were like weapons training to be in heat to.

22:51Andy Greenwald:There were rumors. And then there was a then the next rumor was Apple or whomever was balking at the price tag that Warner was right. You had the rights. There was 200 million dollars. No go. But that if Leonardo DiCaprio agreed to join. Yeah, I think that there was like a felony or something. somebody wrote a column where it was like it would need Leonardo DiCaprio to warrant this price tag. Which would also then maybe bring on Apple as a co-investor potentially. Something like that, yeah. Even though you would, you know this, I don't know this. Is DiCaprio older now than De Niro was when he played Neil in the original?

23:26Andy Greenwald:Not that that matters anymore. I think he is, but also maybe has taken better care of his skin than Robert De Niro did leading up to Heat. Sure. you can kind of stretch it a little bit okay but anyway now it's been announced it hasn't really been announced it's been like real was like this is a go and other places have reported a bit on it but it's okay uh man did an appearance in uh busan at the film festival over the weekend and was like i i am getting ready i am budgeting i am in pre-pro we would like to shoot next year um that being said yeah because and when i say this to people quote unquote i am saying it to me.

Read the full transcript

24:06I'm saying it to me to temper my expectations and to get ready for some bumps in the road. I just want to point out that there has also been another filmmaker that I love, Martin Scorsese, and it's been like, what's Martin Scorsese doing after Killers of the Flower Moon? When is this... He's going to make another movie. Is he going to make a Frank Sinatra movie? Is he going to make a Jesus movie? Is he going to make... There was a full-on, full-court press announcement that he was making a Hawaii gangster movie a month ago. With The Rock and Emily Blunt. And it was like, this is happening. This is Martin Scorsese's, it's like casino in Hawaii.

24:43Luau Casino. Yes. And it was like, go, go, go. And now Dwayne Johnson is probably going to get nominated for... Smashing Machine. Yeah, for an Oscar. And it was like, it's like, this is rolling downhill. This is happening. And then last week, kind of quiet is kept. It was like Martin Scorsese has found his next movie. It's a thriller with Jennifer Lawrence and Leonardo DiCaprio. Right. Right. Everybody was like Leonardo DiCaprio has this goatee and all this, all these one battle after another promo stuff. He's must be getting ready to play Neil like they're doing it.

25:13Andy Greenwald:Goatees notoriously take a long time to grow. For me, it's like all of COVID. I couldn't even get there. And no one cared. No one was like cool mustache. And it was your fault because cameras don't pick up nuance, but you could have seen it and you could have been like, dude, you look good and you didn't do it. You do look good, but I didn't know what you were doing. I didn't know what was going on. I just expected more from you, you know? Wow. I did not think that's where our conversation about Heat 2 would go, but it is a personal subject for you. So bring your own Heat. I'm trying to temper my expectations and protect myself from being hurt because lots of stuff happens in this crazy town called Hollywood.

25:51And, you know, the way that things get announced is often not actually in sync with where they are in development or where they are in shooting. Often you'll see, like, Rosemary DeWitt has joined this cast and it's like Rosemary DeWitt shot her part

26:05Andy Greenwald:oh that's like nobody wants this season to add Seth Rogen to cast that wrapped months ago so I think that really what we're talking about here is just like fingers crossed I note with interest that he has the goatee I note with interest that they have now pretty much if it's Driver somehow as Pacino are they going to do the thing where they like film him in the reverse Hagrid, where he's just half the size he actually is. It's literally like, honey, I shrunk Adam Driver. Instead of an Apple box, they dig a small Apple box level of inches below. And then I don't know what's going on with the possibility of the Chris sequel element of Heat 2.

26:54So there's two timelines.

26:55Andy Greenwald:For the normies, the book picks up two storylines. There's a prequel part about Neil, In Chicago. In Chicago. With Vincent. With Vincent. Not like with him, like in a cohabitation. Circling each other like birds, you know? Absolutely. Birds. Classic birds. Classic bird thing. Remember the scene where birds go to a diner together? And everyone's like, finally these birds are sharing a table. Do you want to put it in my mouth? Yeah. That's exactly what they say. And then there's a sequel element that is Chris after the events of Heat. That's Vel Kilmer. Yeah. Going, I believe, to the triple frontier area and working security for a triad.

27:30Andy Greenwald:Two questions. One, this is, I mean, Austin Butler was born to do that part, right? Like just that that's. Yes. Two, at this point, when you go to quote the triple frontier area, is it like going to the four corners in the U.S. where there's just like little shops advertising your chance? Welcome to the triple frontier. Do you do a little narco terrorism while you're here? Or do you want to like, everyone's going there these days. Oh God. When are they going to make the triple frontier shared universe? When are they going to make triple frontier two, Six Frontiers or something. Fourth Frontier.

28:02Or like Night of the Soldado and have like the Brolin character from Sicario. Oh, it's all one thing? Like all the guys together. I will say for true man men, we are also tracking with interest Joseph Kaczynski and Dan Gilroy's Miami Vice reboot. We are all interested in this. And the dream casting of that being Austin Butler and Aaron Pierre. And... Do we want that? I don't know. I don't know either. I don't... Joseph Kaczynski... frankly, doesn't really miss. It may not be Hamlet, but it's going to look fucking cool.

28:36Andy Greenwald:And you get a Gilroy on the script at this point. I'm Gilroy agnostic. All respect to Tony. Could be John, could be Rose. I don't care. Get me a Gilroy on it. I'm very excited about that. Do you have anything in your life that you feel like is your heat too? The thing you can't wait for? For it to happen? When you grow a beard again? I have been tracking trades. Like, I think one day it could happen, but you never know when it's going to pop off or pop out. What if I did, like, the turkey hair transplant, but it was just for a mustache?

29:14That's it. That's it. The Wayne Rooney, but it's just for a cool mustache. I just have, like, Tom Selleck, Magnum PI mustache.

29:24Andy Greenwald:I think it would be amazing. We would all support you. I think that just from the one thing I will say for sure from having worked in and around this town is that movies are absolute chaos and no movies are happening until the second they hit roll. Yeah. Hit roll. It's classic movie talk. Hit roll, guys. We got the actor. No, but like the deals coming together, like everything is seat of your pants until you're suddenly there and things have fallen apart at the 11th hour and things have come together at the 11th and a half hour. So I wouldn't worry so much about Scorsese saying he's doing this, that it's somehow going to preclude DiCaprio doing something else.

30:02Andy Greenwald:I'm sure you're right. He could shave. He could go quick trip to Istanbul, have a new face, beard put on. The only thing with Marty and Michael, both men getting up there in years. Oh, you're worried about the clock. Time is of the essence. This is, you know what though? There's one thing we've learned recently. This absolutely is a country for old men. It's true. It's good news for us. That title was not. We got a long runway still to play with. It's going to be great. All right. Let's take a quick break. We'll come back. We'll talk about task. This episode is brought to you by Boris Head. What if we told you the taste of deep fried turkey is now available at your local deli?

30:37Well, Boris Head just did that. Bursting with flavor, perfectly seasoned with that indulgent taste that usually means planning your whole day around it. Presenting the Fryer's Turkey Breast only from Boris Head. A backyard tradition now available behind the counter. Visit your local deli today. Discover the craftsmanship behind every bite. Boris had committed to craft since 1905. All right. We are back. Task episode three. Nobody's stronger than forgiveness. Written by Brad Inglesby, directed by Sally Richardson Whitfield, who has become, who's the guy who did Tim Van Patten, who was always like the HBO in-house, like nailed band of brothers and Deadwood.

31:19Andy Greenwald:And Mylod was like that a little bit too. Yeah, Mylod. She's worked on Winning Time, Gilded Age, EPs on both those shows, I believe and it does a great job with this episode first major major set piece I think it's fair to say uh well I guess the robbery in the first episode um but she did there were some beautiful touches that really split the difference between like aesthetic show-offy director stuff and storytelling like there was a moment when we meet what's his name Freddy for the first time yep um and we meet him going through like the war in the kitchen and then we follow him in a The EDU thing, yeah.

31:53Andy Greenwald:It's a beautiful shot that was not calling attention to itself, but really, really drew us further into the story. It's these little details that add up. I loved it. I want to start by saying, well, first of all, I thought this was a great episode. This was a great episode. I want to highlight two scenes to start with. First, we kind of skipped over her when we first were talking about the show, but Tussauds and Bedou's performance in the interrogation of Shelley and her anecdote, her monologue about her own experience with domestic violence and even watching this show, you're just kind of like, oh, it's interesting because, you know, Brandis tells her, go in there and get close to her.

32:30And has no idea, you know, I imagine that this is what she's going to do, that she's going to open up to make herself vulnerable. But I thought her performance was really powerful in that. And I got to talk to you about what is my favorite scene of the year. Yes, sure. Which is Lizzie and Grosso at the State Trooper Bar. Bruce Springsteen into mother love bone please drop a pin in this fucking bar for me djcr on the decks so i can go and i would like to just you you i'm gonna give you a statement you say whether you agree or disagree all right allison oliver yes here we go is to drunk philly girl acting what daniel day

33:08Andy Greenwald:lewis is to abraham and lincoln i think that's i think that's setting the bar too low it's an understatement i think she is to philly drunk girl acting what daniel day lewis is to acting like there is a moment there are plenty of moments in this episode that I want to call out that I want to celebrate including the beautiful filming of my high school hangout the Lanark Diner but there is a moment when what's the dialogue when Lizzie says she says like DJ not getting any ass in Nova or whatever and he's just like well it's kind of true these days and he looks away and her face lights up yeah and i was like just this is an emmy moment this is like everything in that smile in her eyes that is an actor who is vibrating with on the frequency of art and yingling in a way that speaks to my soul there's also the second the point at the conversation when he i think when he kind of what she thinks is that he noticed that she is an outcast among her fellow fellow trooper and he's like yeah i forgot i have to do something after like three yinglings and shots he's he's hiding it well he's doing well he's handling his booze well and her reaction is but i just bought a new pack did you i was like was that like sing to me in your voice america that is the point on love is blind when i kneel that is the point where it's just like what do you want from me and i'll give it um i can't tell you what happened when chloe dancer came on in the bar i just i i seriously don't know if i have ever been in a bar where chloe dancer came on but it's so it's so beautiful to have like the piano part as like she's going through this like experience of trying to keep up her sort of exterior even though her life is spinning out of control and she's just had this giant fuck up at work just an awesome scene um and it's really what i think inglesby does best is it's not necessarily the crime i've seen some people comment like this mystery is kind of unraveled already like it's it's about like the people who are caught up in it i i want to talk about one of brad can we call him we can call him brad one of his superpowers as a writer if you want to keep it mr inglesby if you want to write for the new york times i i think he has particular set of skills as a writer that are that are very impressive and one of them i think we'll spend more time on which is just his sense of scaffolding and architecture and and how he builds a season and how he pays off tension while moving the story forward in ways that are very very subtle and very very artful But you mentioned it already, so I think we should focus first on something that he does that is particularly exceptional, which is something that in the wrong hands is one of the worst and least rewarding crutches of a mid-writer.

36:04Andy Greenwald:The hero ball ISO play where a character introduces him or herself with a self-definitional monologue that has to at once completely draw the attention of everyone actually in the room. Freddie or Aaliyah. Freddie or Aaliyah. There's two of them in this episode, and there's been a series of them. He is God-tier at this, at writing these monologues and casting them so that they actually feel lived in and less like a ball stopper being like, thank you for visiting me. I'm here to say something that I would have said anyway into my mirror, but it's convenient that you happen to be here. Elvis Nolasco is the actor who plays Freddie, and that also is just a master class in...

36:49Andy Greenwald:controlling heat while cooking. We got a lot of emails about whether or not he pronounced Lancaster right. He did not. Do you want to go into how it is properly enunciated? No, because here's the thing. We are so deep in the weeds now that if we get it slightly wrong, or if we say it in a way that it's not said in Newtown Square or Upper Darby, no, we're doomed. You know what I mean? Forget about how they say it in Broomall. Do you feel like we're throwing a no-hitter and we can't possibly afford? We cannot. Two guys who often need to Google what day it is. Or how many episodes there are in the season.

37:21Andy Greenwald:In the middle of the show. Yeah, okay. But I thought that the words that Brad Inglesby gives him in this scene are compelling. They're captivating. They're a little bit fucked. They're funny. But it's communicating something. It's giving a full life to someone who I imagine will see this character again. But we might not. Like in the same way that Ray, who, do you have the actor who plays Ray? Yes, it is Peter Patrikos, who is also a junkie on Dope Thief, but has done, is like a working, lifelong character actor. And I don't know. He's astonishing. Like. He's so good. just the fact that they were like he refs men's rec league basketball and have him in his like his stripes and his footlocker outfit is just so perfect and like just you know everything about him and his wife Shelly that he's a piece of shit that she's scared of him that he's supposed to be on the straight and narrow that his two kids are drugged out on video games and that he has been waiting for somebody to come to his door and be like do you want to get in on some action from the second he got home from prison and that he is desperate.

38:35Andy Greenwald:So let's, I mean, let's talk about the art that's happening like in the subtle ways of this show. I feel like, and I feel like this has been recently with Alien 2, I'm turning into like Paul Goldberger, architecture critic when we talk about TV, but we are, there's so many shows right now and we're so many new shows starting off. And so I'm starting to pay more attention and I think appreciate more the scaffolding of the blueprint that's clearly done ahead of time as to where this is going. And with a show like this, he's doing a very, very impressive job not moving the ball forward every episode.

39:09Andy Greenwald:So Cliff is now blown. The Dark Hearts path towards Robbie, as well as the task force path towards Robbie, is very, very clear and likely short. Like, I don't think we can keep those plates in the air for all of the four episodes remaining in the show. And I don't think they're afraid of that. what's impressive to me is that in addition to moving things forward at a relatively healthy clip so we do not feel like we're being stalled in order to, you know, show off or indulge things, he's doing something that in lesser hands can feel like the red herring of the week. So usually in murder mystery shows, ones that we love and ones that we nitpick, the way that they become eight episode series instead of movies is each week introduces a new likely suspect and it clears that suspect.

39:58Andy Greenwald:so that there's something to investigate, some stakes for the next episode before finally revealing the ultimate person. This is a crime show without any mystery, really, about who did the crimes. Yeah, and now we have to wonder who's the rat on the task force, but it's kind of, you could do some process of elimination. And we should get to that. What this episode did is introduce Ray and Shelley, give them, like you said, a full illustration of inner lives, of conflict, of past, of history, and that's the story of the episode. That gives us the action sequence. Their story doesn't really matter past this episode.

40:32Andy Greenwald:But that does the job of the red herring of the week in a way that feels so distracting and engaging that you don't notice any kind of water being treaded. You touched on something really interesting, which is that the conception that we had of this show, that it was a cat and mouse thriller of a cop and a criminal driven by some of the same things, could very well be over next week. like if the pace continues at this clip, like there is a, what is the second half of this show about? And I wanted to bring up an email that we got a couple of weeks ago from someone named Tom. And I thought this was fascinating.

41:11Tom Brandis. Got it. No, but I didn't know where to fit it in and I wasn't really sure what he was getting into. I'll just read the email from Tom. I enjoyed watching the first episode of Task and listening to your podcast about it. There's a note in the show that I thought you might want to get into. In the scene where Brandis' old friend visits him, the priest friend who visits him, the friend mentions having sent Brandis an article by Richard Rohr. Brandis, who is drunk, responds by mocking Rohr's theology of the universal Christ, pounding the table, asking, is Christ in this table? And then standing up, rattling off the name of other Catholic theologians who he doesn't want to hear about anymore because he has all the info he needs on his Phillies cup, which is full of booze.

41:53I was surprised to hear Richard Rohr mentioned he is known among, he's well known among people, but not very famous. I know about him because my father-in-law got interested in Rohr's second half of life framework. And we talked about it for a while. I suspect that the person who made this show has a deep interest in this topic of second half of life and perhaps other ideas in the Franciscan contemplative practice. Kyle, you're going to clip this part, right? Yeah, this is the good stuff. So I looked into this a little bit.

42:22Andy Greenwald:I mean, clip it for Instagram. I think Chris reading emails should be on all of our socials. I looked into this a little bit. Richard Rohr is probably best known for a book called Falling Upward. And this is an excerpt from Falling Upward. There is much evidence on several levels that there are at least two major tasks to human life. The first task is to build a strong container or identity. The second is to find the contents that the container was meant to hold. What? Are you talking about Philly's cups? The first task we take for granted is the very purpose of life, which does not mean we do it well.

43:00The second task, I'm told, is more encountered than sought. Few arrive at it with much pre-planning purpose or passion. We all try to do what seems like the task that life first hands us, establishing an identity, a home, relationships, friends, community, security, and building a proper platform for our only life. but it takes us much longer to discuss, to discover the task within the task. As I like to call it, what are we really doing when we are doing what we are doing?

43:28Andy Greenwald:And to be clear, you said what are, not woulder. Woulder. It's not about woulder eyes. I wonder what the second half this season is going to be about. First of all, that's fascinating. Yeah, I feel like Pablo Torre right now. I'm like, let's get Richard Rohr in here. I love what it does to the title of the show I love what it says about look, all of the really, really kind of exciting and provocative ideas in that email, also in the theology makes sense to me in the sense that this is a deep show we are responding to it because it is very entertaining and there's peach rings with tahin on them, sprinkled throughout in ways that are delicious and surprising and broadly speaking, this week is the episode where I completely stopped clock watching.

44:19Andy Greenwald:Not just that the episodes are long, but like where are we going with the storyline? This is the week, in the parlance of our time, this is the week Task became a TV show to me in the best possible way. All of that is true. The truly great shows that engage us either as viewers or on the podcast have that secondary task, if you will, of probing deeper. Yeah. and being worthy of that level of conversation or insight. And so that you can watch it on the first pass and be like, that was really wild or Tom sure seems to be suffering. I hope they get the kid back. Second time, you could, whether people still write or read essays anymore, write an essay about the Phillies Cup and filling it up and what that means for this man who has been so emptied out by the choices he made in life.

45:04And I think you have to take a second when you see something as honestly gorgeous as Maeve showing Sam how to swim. Very beautiful. Which looks like a baptism. which is obviously this moment in nature away from the chaos of, you know, lefties tap room and drug dens and everything else. And wonder why a moment like that is in there and why it's shot where it's shot and shot so beautifully and so tenderly. And, you know, start to consider like some of the obvious religious overtones when look at the title of the episode, you know, like, so what are we going with this? This is something that I think will start to get revealed over the next episode or two.

45:44Andy Greenwald:We'll get a chance to talk to him about this, but Brad went to Villanova. He did. You know, in a way, we started our partnership at Villanova. Within spitting distance. Not on the basketball team, but we went to the diner. Yeah. Not the Lanark diner that night. I think the idea... Did you see that Temple played Oklahoma the other week? And they got destroyed. But... In football? Yeah. Oklahoma's band couldn't come for some reason I think weather and so St. Joe's just let we're like you can use our band that's nice I thought that was uncalled for on St. Joe's part you think they shouldn't have done it yeah it's big five rules you know well they did it also because it's big five and they were like we are on the team we are on the team of the team playing temple yeah it's like enemy of my enemy you know so you don't I don't I don't condone it I think that's first of all you're playing all the sides against each other because you're like I love temple I went to temple but then also like you're a Phil Martelli disciple.

46:38I went to St. Joe's basketball camp.

46:40Andy Greenwald:So where does your allegiance lie? Okay, pick a side. Is there no way to just be a center? There's no nuance anymore in this country. The idea of looking at things as vessels that exist as one concept or one space and how they're filled, I think is relevant to in both Brad's understanding of the region that he is documenting and the way that it is shot. Because one thing, we talked about this briefly when we talked about the pilot. I think the one thing that might be surprising to people who have not spent time in the suburbs of Philadelphia and its surrounding counties is how rural it can be, how beautiful, how green.

47:22Andy Greenwald:And I was thinking about that observation again last night when Cliff and Robbie go to visit Ray. And the establishing shot, it looks like Mayberry. it is absolutely beautiful the houses with stately porches and wood columns and beams and the mountain just behind it this is a vision of America you know in the best way possible and even when you walk into the house when he lets them in or Shelley steps aside and lets them in like house has good bones you know what I mean like I'm not trying to do I'm not trying to do a hundred thousand dollar listing here but I'm like you know it's similar to where Robbie and Maeve live and they have chickens and there's a different way into this world where you're like, this is a place that people would retire to.

48:11Andy Greenwald:Like, this is fine. Owning a home, having outdoors, like, isn't that what it's supposed to be? But what is the content of this beautiful green vessel these days? It's fentanyl and rage and impotence and sadness, which is not really a good recipe. We got to meet Margarita LaVeva's character, Aaron, a little bit. You called it. Well, I mean. You don't call the bat phone for Margarita unless you're going to do something with her, you know? Yeah, but look, you just read this text. I think that they were just fainting too much with Shane, you know? Yes, although again, that ties into the observation I want to make about how some of the more practical structural stuff is just done artfully.

48:54Andy Greenwald:Where last week when we were talking about episode two, I was like, maybe Shane is the mole because he's acting sketchy. Yeah. he's not but him acting sketchy is intentional and put in front of us so we have that reaction and then that perry and the dark hearts have that reaction so it's not wasted space it's not a red herring that is going to be the next thing that gets dealt with and probably probably not well for shame well and then on the flip side of that you've got what will probably be a i've not watched episode four but will probably be a mole on right like on yeah on uh on brandis's part it doesn't look great for Grasinova just because he came out so strong in the first episode with a lot of Wikipedia intel about the Dark Hearts I do not think it is Aaliyah so the zag would be Lizzie right but are they leaning too hard on the Lizzie's a mess kind of thing I think that I don't know how to do odds and I don't understand what FanDuel does but I would say that Grasso would be the...

49:58He's the betting favorite, yes. What else in the episode did you want to hit?

50:03Andy Greenwald:Don't you think he's also the favorite because of A, how likable he is being? Sure. I feel like it's an intentional misdirect. But B, he walked into lefties like you walking into lefties, you know what I mean? Like you're like... The two of them walking into lefties was kind of... It was kind of like Norm. It was kind of like us walking in there. Or like one of the two is a little bit like, okay, okay. We all know I don't belong here and I don't want to be here. And Grasso's like talking shit. Yeah. It's a meeting that Big Balls Society at Lefty's or something. Grasanova. He's going to break your heart?

50:38I mean, I'm sure there's nuance to it. I don't think it's just going to be like, you big rat. I'm sure he'll be like.

50:46Andy Greenwald:Look, Robbie's brother fell into the arms of the Dark Hearts. I mean, hearts is in their name. The arms of Margarita LaVeva. It didn't fall, you know. So she's worth it for you. That's your, that's your, you're like, generally, you abhor drug running. If you want me to push uncut fentanyl across county lines. You gotta make it worth your while. No, I just mean, I think that the connections between the group of the people that we have met probably go much deeper than we know. Did you have any, as someone who spent time there and went to college there, did you have any insight into the role Boston and the Ecuadorians might be playing just...

51:24Andy Greenwald:Can't comment. Oh, really? Still sealed. Yeah. Statute of Limitations hasn't run out? No. What was the name of the place that we used to get breakfast in Back Bay? Charlie's? Yeah, it's still there. A lot of Ecuadorian. I took Sean there when we were in Boston for a show, yeah. Did you? Was there still the framed photo of Tim Dog? You know what? I didn't see it. I wonder if he's been cancelled. I think about it all the time. Cancel culture came from Tim Dog. It said, fuck Compton, right? That was his song. I don't know if he said it on the paint and the picture. He did. Way to go to for Charlie's for keeping it blue.

51:57I don't have anything else really other than... Yeah, we get it all.

52:04Andy Greenwald:I don't think... I feel like Cliff... I mean, if we were going to do numbers on the McBain Live Forever speech, I feel like Cliff's not... Yeah, I know. Cliff's not doing great. Yeah. Cliff's a little worried, he's a little upset. And too many people know his name now. And his home. Yes.

52:24Andy Greenwald:I thought that like again just understanding the nuance of the story there's so many moving pieces there's so many characters but there's also just you know the balancing act between between the larger the bigger shoes dropping in terms of who's doing what to whom and how it's going to play out and then why you preload an episode like this with a little bit more of Robbie and Maeve which was touched on at the end of last episode. And not only are both Amelia Jones and Tom Pelfrey amazing in the scene and I, the two of them in their real accents talking to each other which I saw on the HBO Max Instagram account is really wild.

53:07Andy Greenwald:Yeah. Pelfrey was at the Eagles game. Must have been agony for him. But Ruffalo was wearing birds. He's wearing like a Dawkins jersey. He was like fully, can we welcome him? I think so. He seems like a great guy. I feel like he's, he knows, he's rolling with the winners right now. No, just in the Robbie scene, what he says in that scene about, you know, Jason shook my hand with the same hand he used to beat your father's brains out. And like, there's got to be a reason for all of this. And he needs to make, you know, it's a religious almost purpose out of this. It can't just be that this is something that happened to us.

53:44Andy Greenwald:It's a showcase scene for the actor. It's a breakout scene for the emotional inner life of the character. but it also is just a smartly placed hedge against the kind of nitpicking conversation that can spring up in a show like this. Like he knows they're on borrowed time and yet he is still very much living under his name in his house with his children. Yeah, I also like the fact that he's hanging on to this. Like I need a million dollars for like my family and to get out of, it's like, this isn't a Bruce Springsteen song, man. Like you're not going in. It's a mother love bone song. Exactly. And those end up a lot different.

54:17We can wrap there.

54:18Andy Greenwald:did you recognize the Lanark Diner in that scene? so I was thrilled I have to say for a moment I thought I have been pretty nerdy about the locations so the first two the first episode I think I spent too much time trying to like create and then found out the Enquirer was just making a map of the locations so I don't need to be like how far would it be to get from like from this place in Chester to this place but were you trying to treat it like collateral? As people come out of stuff, I try to see if they're a sign, and then I saw it was Lanark. So that diner, it's like four minutes from the house I grew up in.

54:56Andy Greenwald:That was where we went after high school, like all the time. Not to roll with dicks and black coffee. The world's strangest. Breakfast of champions. That is, of all the things that I've said out loud on this show that everyone was like, that's not normal, bro. That is the one I will stand by. Okay. That is a classic teenage order. I inherited that order. I wasn't like, let me look at this whole menu. no snapper soup for me today. I want that and that. That's what the older kids got. And I was like, I want to be like them. I'm not going to be smoking those cigarettes and running numbers like CR downtown.

55:26Andy Greenwald:I just give me some fried cheese and I'm good. I briefly thought that they had only done the exteriors there and shot the interior somewhere else because they dressed the shit out of it. They put in like very moody window shades and stuff. So it did not look the way it looked in my time in the interior or in Silver Linings Playbook, which I also filmed there. That's right. let's wrap there that was exciting I was thrilled for you thanks to Kaya thanks to Kaya thanks to John thanks to our listeners thanks to our email writers and thanks to our incredibly intelligent theologians my theologian email writer saving our show we'll be back on Thursday for the finale of Alien Earth yeah and the first two episodes of The Lowdown and say hi to Ethan and Sterling for me I will brother

56:16Thank you.

From the publisher

Chris and Andy talk about why this might be the best TV week of the year with the upcoming ‘Alien: Earth’ season finale, the premiere of Sterlin Harjo’s ‘The Lowdown,’ and the return of ‘Slow Horses’ for Season 5 (5:00). Along the way, they react to the trailer for ‘The Mandalorian and Grogu’ (12:00) and the rumored casting of Leonardo DiCaprio in Michael Mann’s highly anticipated follow-up to ‘Heat’ (20:44). Later, they break down the third episode of ‘Task’ (29:05).

Subscribe to the Ringer TV YouTube channel here for full episodes of ‘The Watch’ and so much more!

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