Food Guilt, IV Drips, Matcha Shortages & Healthy Ageing

0:00I am genuinely so excited about today's sponsor because it's the way. honestly if you have listened to me anytime over the last few months you know i have become a little bit evangelical about this app and i honestly recommend it to everyone my friends my family people on instagram everyone and she recommended it to me so it's true i've heard so much about it it's just because it has had such a big impact on me i've meditated on and off for 15 years or so now but using the way it's honestly the first time i've become so consistent with this daily practice. And I've just seen the most unbelievable results as a result of that.

0:38The app is just incredible. And what I love is every day you open it and there's a meditation waiting for you. So you don't scroll, that you don't have to choose between hundreds of options. There's no wondering what to do. It just takes you on a path. Well, I think that's why it works so well, because most of us just don't need more big decisions every day to make, Ella. No, exactly that. We've got decision fatigue, haven't we? So this is so nice because you just follow this path of meditation. which is led by Henry, the founder, who's just the most amazing teacher. And he makes it seem somehow just incredibly simple, but exceptionally profound at the same time, which is a very rare skill.

1:14And I've been using it too. Yes, I've now finally begun my meditation journey and I've been doing some of the shorter practices on busy days because I completely understand why you talk about it so much, Ella. It really is a nice intro in for me. Yeah, it is. And I'm so glad. anyway it's helped me feel so much calmer less reactive more present it all sounds like huge claims but i just say please please please try it if you're struggling with stress or overwhelm you just got to give it a go and the lovely thing is that everyone listening can definitely try it themselves exactly so you can get a 30-day free trial so just try it every day per month it'll change your life all you do is head to thewayapp.com forward slash wellness scoop yeah that's thewayapp.com forward slash wellness scoop.

2:04Welcome to the Wellness Scoop, your weekly dose of health and wellness inspiration. And we're both here today as your hosts. I'm Ella Mills. And I'm Rhiannon Lambert. And today we take the most pressing questions that you have and of course your recommendations in the world of health and wellness. So Ella, let's dive into it. We are going to talk about IVs today. Are IV vitamin drips worth the hype you probably guess what we think on that some vitamin d questions that you guys all need to have the answer to how to stop swinging between restriction and overeating does social media reflect real life and how does that impact you raising confident eaters some comparisons of different plant-based yogurts you've had lots of questions on peanut butter powder versus actual peanut butter some bits on matcha and all your recommendations so we have got so much to delve into and re has an update um for us on the plastic movement at the houses of parliament which is very very exciting but re first of all what are your recommendations anything that we all have to have in our lives i feel like it's just survival recommendations right now when around europe at the moment we have this unprecedented of course a global warming heat wave and it's happening in every major um city town uh in europe so lots of don't fear smoothies and fruit you know fruit juices I actually did a post on that today just get those sorts of items in it salads and not just leaves they can be we talk about this a lot but I did a nice rice salad the other day new potato salad I chuckle just chuck a can of beans in with some onion in a pan fried off then add it to your salad bowl lashings of olive oil a bit of salt I mean just go for it just try try try keep hydrated that is the honestly the only recommendation I really had I tried to sing the other day and honestly when all you're in pregnancy when everything's shifted up and your organs have moved you can't really feel I don't know how opera singers do I have friends that have been professional operatory and companies who have sung up until like week 30 in pregnancy and they have the most incredible ethos but for anyone doing deep breathing even in the heat when I'm pregnant I just found it so hard Ella it really just hit home to me how it's such a practice you have to really really think about the placement of your breath work when there's a heat wave and on top of that being pregnant that's a waffle from me how about you I always love your waffles how about me um I just finished a fantastic book actually called the names I've noticed it like top of the charts everywhere I think I've said this before I love to browse um Paddington WH Smiths for books when I've got time for my train I'm like such a loser I can't handle being late for things and so I'm like always at the train station 25 minutes early so that Paddington W.

4:50Smith is a big perusing place for me now they know they'll be on the lookout you'll see me there anyways the names and then lots of you guys recommended it it's a really interesting book it's not uplifting by any stretch of imagination and really important note that the kind of central premise in so many ways is about domestic violence I say central premise no it is based on a story which does heavily feature the impact of domestic violence the interesting thing that this book does is that it speaks to this idea that there are moments in people's lives and everybody's lives where one decision could have so many different impacts and one decision that you make can not all decisions we make but can completely alter the trajectory of your life and essentially what it does is it takes this moment in time about the naming of a child that's the whole premise of the book and the three different names that can be chosen and the impacts of that and then it tracks this person's life and this family and how they revolve around this person on the basis of these three different decisions and it's so interesting and then at the end in the epilogue it's like okay but now even imagine like what happens go back in time like if this decision was made and that decision was made and just these tiny little moments in life and actually when you you know it's the butterfly effect isn't it when you work backwards from it they can actually completely alter your trajectory I think we all have that in our lives don't we I mean I think about it like my husband met my dad in the gym and like if they had never met in the gym we would never have met and that's because they both went to the sauna at the same time that day I mean it's so random and my dad's very chatty So I got chatting to him, you know, if I'd never gotten ill and then I'd never read this really, really random book about healthy eating, like I wouldn't have changed my career.

6:40And then again, I wouldn't have met my husband. I wouldn't have had my kids. I wouldn't have met you and this whole life. And anyway, I like we all have those things in our life. But so it's a really interesting premise. It's not. But it is a really beautifully written book. It's actually a debut novel. Incredible success that that's having. So it's a very difficult topic, but it's a really interesting concept. It's incredibly well written. It's a weird thing to say you really enjoy, obviously, on that subject matter. But I did. I really enjoyed the book and the premise of the book and the framing of the book.

7:11And probably not for you right now, Ray. But I do. I really recommend it. I think it's having an appreciation for the path life can take you on. I think it sounds exactly like that. Like you said, it's something. It's almost like that sliding doors film, you know, different moments. Exactly that. And I've never read anything that captures it in such a good way. But we all have that in our lives. I think it's a really interesting thing to explore. And it's nice to look back and feel grateful for those moments, actually, that took you from A to B because we can so easily forget. That's a lovely recommendation.

7:40Thank you. I now have a quick voice note from Lisa Oxenham. And she is the ex-Beauty and Star Director from Marie Claire. where she is doing a lot of work at the moment trying to give us a voice for plastic-free, it's called Plastic Free Babies actually, the movement. She went to government and they had a big roundtable discussion and chat and she's going to give you a better overview than I can now because I know a lot of us on the Wellness Group have been very interested in the subject of plastics, microplastics, where we're at, but the fact we're actually in government discussing it now means there's obviously more to it than perhaps we're all privy to.

8:15So let's hear what Lisa has to say. I went to a parliamentary event for the Plastic Free Babies campaign this week and it focused on microplastics and plastic associated chemicals during the first 1000 days. So from conception to a child's second birthday. And I think what struck me most was the tone of the conversation. this wasn't about parent blaming. The room had scientists, doctors, campaigners, parents, people from policy and industry. And the message that I heard throughout was that parents are already overwhelmed and we shouldn't be left to navigate invisible chemical risks on our own.

9:06The first 1000 days really matters because that's when most of the development is happening. It's happening so fast. Brains, hormones, immune systems, reproductive systems, and it's really the foundations for lifelong health. And that's all being laid down at once during this time. So the concern isn't about visible plastic waste. It's the chemical reality of plastic itself. Phthalates, PFAS, flame retardants, plasticizers, microplastics. These can migrate or leach from everyday products, especially with heat and sterilizing and wear and tear, prolonged use, you know, being used in a dishwasher.

9:59And the concern is when plastic is in contact with heat, with food, with liquids and with babies' mouths and bodies, bottles, teats, dummies, teethers, formula prep equipment, and then plastic plates and cups going through the dishwasher. Then you've got food pouches. Then you've got synthetic bedding and cot mattresses. services one line somebody said in the briefing that no parent should need a chemistry degree to buy a baby bottle and that's exactly it if there's something that's being sold as normal and affordable parents assume it's safe so there are practical things that they were talking about that families can do where it's realistic so not heating milk or food in plastic avoiding repeated high heat sterilising where possible, choosing glass, choosing stainless steel, medical grade silicone or choosing natural fibres where we can.

11:06I'd say that the biggest point of the evening was that this cannot sit with parents. The campaign is asking the UK government for a fast track to cross government call for evidence, bringing existing science together with industry and healthcare expertise. So safer, plastic-free alternatives then become the norm, not premium products that only some families can access. And that's really the heart of it for me. Parents don't need more guilt. We need better information, clearer labelling and affordable choices. I just don't think a safe baby product shouldn't be a lifestyle upgrade. It should really be the baseline.

11:54I've been covering issues like this through my journalism and on my YouTube channel, because I think transparency around everyday products is becoming one of the biggest health conversations. So the call to action for this campaign is look at the Plastic Free Babies resources, follow the campaign, write to your MP and start asking better questions of brands and retailers safer baby products really should be the norm and not the luxury thank you so much lisa i did hound her on social media for a review i saw she attended and i said you know i really just want to know what's going on and i think it's nice to know that it's actually been taken seriously ella lots of things in our environment right now that can potentially change to make things more accessible for those that you know can't afford to go completely plastic free at the moment there's so many issues there aren't there there really are no it's it's amazing i've been following that campaign online actually fantastic okay and we have more recommendations from you so hannah has got in touch to recommend something for us she said in an attempt to get my five-year-old to eat some omega-3s when he doesn't eat oily fish i wanted to sneak some chia seeds into his diet he's a very slow eater oh my gosh my daughter is such a slow eater it's unbelievable and so we struggle with breakfast and getting out on time me too our savior on both fronts the mug cake I blitz in a little hand blender oats, banana, chia and flax seeds with a teaspoon of baking powder and some oat milk.

13:27Pour it into two mugs, one for me, one for him, microwave for two minutes. We serve it with raspberries, a little maple syrup or dark chocolate variety and not only are they delicious but you can eat them quickly, they fill us up and we've both had a good amount of nutrients to start the day. Love that, thank you so much. It's so nice when you give us all of your recommendations and the second one is the beauty on disney plus it starts out feeling like a thriller or murder mystery but it develops into a really powerful commentary on the rise of unattainable beauty standards so the pressure to look perfect in the growing popularity of miracle injections and treatments such as glp1s peptides etc i thought it was brilliant done and then finally a small win inspired by the podcast here so i used to binge quite a lot in the car on the drive home from work often stopping to buy something sugary when i was tired and hungry after hearing about the snack tins snack tins ella coming in i now make myself a little snack box every day to keep in the car with berries dates dark chocolate and it's been a game changer thank you both for creating such a thoughtful balanced and genuinely helpful podcast lots of love and that recommendation there is from izzy from durham northeast england isn't that lovely I know I thought that was so nice so nice to hear about the snack tits I so agree with you um Izzy on it like when you're like starving and you're knackered at the end of the day and like you're in a petrol station and there's loads of sweets and chocolate in front of you like who doesn't want it like it's so normal and then but if you've not hungry because you've got like lovely things that you're still really enjoying it's so effective so I love that I'm so happy for you and I really am excited to watch the beauty that's on my list um for this week and I really needed something to watch because I finished all my shows.

15:10Did you finish the campus one? No, I haven't watched that yet because Matt doesn't want to watch it. Have you watched it off campus? Well, I've got lots of opportunity doing lots of solo parenting recently, so perhaps, but I'm still so stuck in Desperate Housewives and there's so many of them. Right.

15:28Our first question of today is from Nina. And this was brought over from last week because it was her 60th birthday and she had a question for us at Ella on vitamin D. So should I look forward to Mondays and Thursdays? And my question is, I take a vitamin D supplement, which contains D3 and K2. It contains 10 ,000 micrograms of vitamin D. Is that too much? Also, I take a vitamin B12 spray. I'm probably one of your older listeners, as I've had my 60th birthday. But I love everything and anything about food and nutrition, which can make me age better. Well, what a lovely framing of thinking about these things.

16:04um really tell us about how much vitamin d we probably want and also obviously it's boiling hot and the sun is shining do we need it in the summer well that's the question if you have darker skin naturally and the different amounts of melanin that we all can have and if you're wearing a lot of sunscreen some people might still actually need it all year round even in this insane heat wave because not all of us will be sitting in it actually it can be too hot to go outside this is what happens in the middle east of course in areas where it's very very hot you You spend a lot of your time indoors.

16:36But I would say that dose is considered extremely high, well above what I would suggest as a maintenance dose. Unless you've had guidance from your GP that says you are actively deficient, you can get measured for this. They will test it for you, your blood. So you can always push for that when you go to a general practice. Or of course, you can pay for a private blood test for that sort of thing. We generally recommend safe levels because, let me explain, vitamin D is fat soluble so the danger is the high doses you're taking can build up over a long period of time in your body that can create toxicity so we suggest 400 to a thousand micrograms daily for maintenance periods and there's a lot of those sprays out there then there's the addition of K2 which I looked at a lot because obviously I developed a vitamin D range that before I fell pregnant I was hoping to release this September you might have to backtrack on that now it's only so much one woman can do.

17:32But K2 was marketed alongside vitamin D because of its role in calcium metabolism. We don't actually have the gold standard research to suggest that is the case to combine it in the supplement yet, which might sound shocking to some of you. Well, how is it out there everywhere? Why are people talking about it? This is a classic example of nutrition science not catching up yet. The media reporting and people jumping on bandwagons because it's so unregulated that before we've got bodies of robust, reliable research, we're pumping things into supplements. So just be careful. And then should I go on to B12 quickly, Ella?

18:09Yes, please. B12 sprays can be useful when we get older, of course, because that absorption can decline. But again, it depends on your diet. And I would say, generically speaking, I don't know on a one-to-one level, but unless you're on a vegan diet or predominantly plant-based, you probably don't want to be taking additional sprays like this because it can put extra stress on your digestive system and certain medications as we age they can start to interact so my major concern there is just to air with caution before taking so many different supplements and to always just get a base level at your GP because if you've got your B12 measured and it is water soluble then I would suspect it probably is okay if you eat animal produce as well throughout the week but what you need to focus on more protein weight-bearing exercise just walking more each day get more calcium in your diet that does increase as we age it is very important vitamin d supplements 400 to 1000 micrograms maintaining muscle mass we talked about a lot about weight bearing didn't we on monday ella that's key absolutely love that okay our next question is from Kathy who said she loves listening on her morning dog walk love that Kathy's a biomedical scientist and she really appreciates the research that we put in and she's got two questions for us first of all she has quite a small family it's herself her husband and their 10 month old daughter and because of our portion sizes she only uses part of the veg when she's cooking for example she said I might make a curry using half an onion a pepper and a sweet potato then need to find another meal later in the week that uses up the rest I sometimes feel this limits my ability to reached the goal of 30 different plants a week as of course she's trying to avoid food waste and use what they already have have we got any tips for her for storing the ingredients but also making it easier to increase variety she does batch cook but terrible remembering to take the meals back out the freezer and use them i definitely know that feeling i know i do that you find one don't you at the back and then she said secondly our daughter joined um their family through adoption so congratulations to you unfortunately um she didn't have the best start both in utero and during the first seven months of her life.

20:13We also missed her initial weaning journey and understand that she was weamed primarily on very sweet fruit purees and rusks dissolved in milk. Following your discussions about how pregnancy, nutrition and early food exposure can influence later food preferences, is there anything that they can be doing now to support a positive relationship with food and encourage a broad range of tastes and textures as she grows? Cathy, what amazing questions and huge congratulations on your daughter joining your family. Rhi um shall we just quickly talk about the um using up of ingredients maybe um and variety and then we can go on to the second part of the question yeah definitely you lead with that Ella and then I can obviously tackle the nature nurture debate with a food exposure so Kathy first of all obviously goes out saying amazing even to be thinking about getting 30 different plants a week I mean I totally know what you mean in forgetting to use up batch cooking but I do find it an easier way for me personally to use like the other half of the onion for example but what I tend to do is I actually I don't put that if it was just going to have two portions of it I wouldn't actually pop it in the freezer I would just personally be using that other half for like work lunches you know taking them to the office or something or having them if you're working at home one day because it just means you don't have to think about lunch during a busy day which I personally really really appreciate and I think in terms of otherwise using them up I would then be focusing on like a soup for example you know that was an easy way to put your half of an onion in another bag the rest of your sweet potato bag for example but if you then want to be adding in extra plant power on top of that to get your 30 plants I would be thinking about for example like you know if you've used a tin of chickpeas in the curry could you use some of the other sweet potatoes and roast them for a salad and you could roast a tin of lentils and so they're nice and crispy with it so you can be using some of the same base ingredients like a big bag of sweet potatoes but layering in other things a tin of lentils here a tin of white beans there for example that's something I personally find really really helpful and then just little things like I don't know I've been making recently like seed mixes it's literally just pumpkin seeds sunflower seeds and I had some leftover pine nuts so I put them on and I roasted them with a little bit of soy sauce and sometimes I do chili sometimes not a little bit of olive oil just roast them for like 15 minutes let them cool completely so they're crispy and I pop them in a tupperware and then I'll sprinkle that on different things and again that's just three different plant points which is an easy way to just gently nudge it all up.

22:47I love that Ella it's it's so nice to have inspiration that we can definitely lean towards. And to reassure you as well, Cathy, there is a huge, huge amount that can be done when you're raising children with their food environment. The start that you quite rightly said was tricky and working on that will be a small challenge, I expect. And we've got to be kind on ourselves as well because you can do so much. And just being a positive role model around food in itself is humongous. and children can be very adaptable. It's just repeated exposure. And it's a very frustrating message for parents to hear.

23:27Oh, just keep going 10 to 15 times. I keep rejecting the food. Eventually, if you keep continuing to offer wide varieties of flavors, colors and textures, you will, even if they only have one spoon as you're working off when you're weaning and all the way up, it's still impacting your child's microbiome, which is building from exposure to the food environment just as much as what the child may have been born with or without. So there's so much you can do. I would say try and get bitter foods in now as soon as possible, alongside those perhaps that are already accepted, things that are listed as allergens, get them in as early as possible as well and test them very safely.

24:07You can read up on all of that, of course, on the NHS website too. Eating together as a family, like I said, you are the best role model. Don't label foods as good or bad. I think you just sound like the most fantastic woman wholeheartedly for this fantastic question anyway. And texture needs to be encouraged as well. And it's very tricky when the children are weaned a certain way. And 10 months is still such an unpredictable time. I think until children are older anyway, it's always an unpredictable journey with food. Don't be fooled by what you see on the Internet. No one's got it nailed down.

24:43Ella shared her experiences and here I've shared mine. no child is perfect at all that doesn't exist but the more textures so not just offering smooth foods that you can introduce like a breaded side of fish or something you know something that's got a bit of substance to it as well and something's a bit rougher lentils alongside mashed up avocado oats things that have a lot of texture will help but ultimately you have the most beautiful opportunity to have a lovely relationship with food and positive food environments it's never too late and in fact 10 months is very early I think you've got this.

25:19Rhi you're fantastic I love that okay our next question comes to us from Inez who says that she feels stuck in an all or nothing cycle with food she said I try to eat perfectly than ovary and feel guilt and frustration how can I build a more balanced intuitive relationship with food I think you first of all Inez thank you so much for sharing and second of all I don't think you're alone in that in any shape or form I think one thing that's so important and Ree's got an amazing voice note from us from a fantastic psychotherapist to dive so much more into this but just one small thought for me I think I feel quite strongly on this for all of us for everybody I think we've got to kind of remove the word perfect when it comes to any habit that we have in our life because it's impossible first of all there's no such thing as perfect you know some people will tell you you know to follow the Nordic diet, someone will follow the Mediterranean diet, someone will do the green Mediterranean diet, as you know we talk about this all the time, there's lots of variation on these things, some people are going to be a big advocate of a little bit more animal produce, some people are going to be of less, like there's no such thing as perfect, we're all different, we have different lifestyles, we have different needs, we have different days, we have different emotional weights or lack thereof at different chapters in our lives and I think if you're trying to do it perfectly quote unquote you're probably putting in a kind of totally insurmountable amount of pressure on yourself and no one can do anything perfectly in any aspect of their life for more than about 20 seconds and also perfect so subjective anyway i mean so i think it's so important obviously the foundations are the whole food diet are key we know that we know we need our fiber and our plants and all the rest of it but it doesn't you don't have to be no one has to be perfect.

27:02Exactly. I love that, Ella. It's so true. Perfect doesn't exist. And we've all got a different thought process. We're all built differently and we frame things in different ways. So I have a wonderful voice note from the psychotherapist, the founder of the Pathway Clinic, Helen Burke, who can go through this in more depth from a different perspective that actually I probably haven't thought of sometimes before. Hi, Ella. Hi, Rhi. Thanks so much for having me on and asking me to help answer Innes' very vulnerable and beautiful question. Hi Innes, I want to start, if it's okay with you, at the very beginning of life, which might sound quite random, so bear with me, but I do think that's where the answer to your question lives.

27:43So in the very first hour of life, a newborn baby, if they're left alone and just placed on the mother's stomach post-birth. They do what's called a breast crawl. And it's in this very act of a baby latching onto the breast and the very first act of feeding that something profound happens. It's not just about nutrition. It's the first experience of love. So being held, being seen and being responded to equates to being fed. For that baby, food and love are the very same thing. They are inextricably and intrinsically linked. They're woven together from the very moments of any human being's life.

28:24So holding that in mind, that wiring doesn't leave us, it stays with us for life. So when we find ourselves in a complicated relationship with food, this all or nothing cycle you're describing, I always want to gently ask, what is this really about? Because it's not about the food. It's about our relationship with ourselves, ultimately. if we think about food equating to love and that we've learned that before we even had words so when we restrict food on some level we're restricting love from ourselves we're withholding it and then the pendulum swings and we overindulge and that's often not hunger either that's us trying to fill something fill the void in our stomach because there's potentially a void in our heart or trying to push feelings down to numb them or suppress them because we don't quite know how to sit with them.

29:13So this cycle of restrict, overindulge, guilt, restrict again, it really is a cycle of punishment and reward, a cycle of self-deprivation and then self-soothing. And underneath it all, a deeper question that I want to ask gently, which is what are you actually hungry for? So how do we begin to break this cycle in answer to your question? The answer isn't another food rule. It isn't more discipline or more willpower because that's just more restriction or more withholding of love from yourself. The shift begins with curiosity instead of judgment. So when you reach for food and you're not physically hungry, pause just for a moment and ask yourself, what am I really feeling right now?

29:54What do I actually need? Not to stop yourself, just to know yourself a little better in that moment. Begin to separate the feeling from the food, not perfectly, but gently over time and start to find other ways to meet those emotional needs, to comfort yourself, to soothe yourself, to fill yourself up that aren't food. Whether that's connection, rest, movement, creativity, or simply sitting with the feeling long enough to let it pass. And perhaps most importantly, Ines, start to practice giving yourself love directly, not as a reward for eating well, not withheld as punishment, just as something you are worthy of unconditionally.

30:31Because that's when this cycle is really stopped. If this feels like something that runs deep, I'd also really encourage you working with a therapist who specializes in relationship with food and the emotions that lie beneath it because you deserve real support with this and not just strategies. The food is just the messenger and it's been trying to tell you something important. Sending you loads of love. Thank you so much, Helen. It's so insightful. I think it just reminds us that food is never black and white. There's so much nuance when it comes to food and um so thank i cannot thank you enough for sharing your insights with us today and also just to mention that's why i'm building these food freedom courses on the retrition plus community that i've developed because i feel we've all we've all got things to tackle and we'll be working with of course our psychologists and dieticians there as well starting or growing your own business can be intimidating and lonely at times.

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32:48That's shopify.com slash realm. Plan B is a backup birth control option that's there for you when things don't go according to plan. It specifically works after unprotected sex and before pregnancy occurs by temporarily delaying ovulation. Plan B is available nationwide at all major retailers and through delivery apps like DoorDash. No ID, prescription or age requirement. It's the number one OBGYN recommended brand of emergency contraception and it won't impact your future fertility. that's freedom to be use as directed the next question ella is sheree wheeler from the states usa she has a question that we've been waiting to come on to ella about iv drips marketed for health longevity and even beauty benefits i'm curious to hear your thoughts do you think these treatments are actually safe and is there any real benefit that justifies the cost of them too okay this is such a great question they have been such a trend for a little while now they have been literally yeah everywhere somehow I've ended up on a mailing list for one and they I keep getting emails from them and it's like it's so insane they kind of you know this will change your life and being completely honest I remember having like a real struggle just you know I've talked about this with with burnout and it was a few years ago and I was just like so low in energy and I remember being like oh my god I can't go on like this like I'm just so burnt out I'm so tired I'm trying to juggle so much I've been like what's my magic answer what will help me and I remember being like well people keep talking about IV drips maybe this will help me I did so much research and at the end of it I was like I actually don't think I've ever come across a trend that has literally no evidence like actually there are so many things like I'm not advocating really don't worry a cortisol cocktail at least you're getting some hydration like at least you know coconut water like with this I was like this is these are so expensive obviously you're putting you know something into your bloodstream you've got to be super careful you know any contamination issues blah blah blah blah but also you are spending a huge amount of money on like just really really expensive pee I mean there is literally there is no data for this whatsoever that was where I got to and I did a lot of research because then I became very interested in it well no of course you are because every celebrity seems to be doing it or posting videos of themselves doing it so ingrained in their world that was it i was seeing this everywhere and i was like well i need some help like maybe this will help me in after like a while i was like what the hell like how can something with literally not a strand of evidence allow this industry to exist even on tv shows like medic tv shows i can't remember if it was gray's anatomy or another one but there was one clip that was criticized heavily because you've got the junior doctors going off shift, being filmed, hooking themselves up to the medicinal IV drips that they use, of course, because IV nutrition does play a key role.

35:50If you are dehydrated, you go to hospital, you've got hyperemesis in pregnancy, malabsorption conditions, you know, GI, chemo, all of it, it can save lives for that purpose. But when you're already at an optimum status and you have, I mean, who is measuring first of all, these concentrations of vitamins in this sort of drip? Who even suggested that these water-soluble vitamins should be inserted in this way? Who is inserting this to begin with? There's risks of infection at the site, vein irritation, inflammation. People have had allergic reactions to the ingredients. Then it causes electrolyte imbalances if the formulations, like I've said, are inappropriate, which I expect for the ones that are on the lower price range that are more accessible or to the general public probably have the highest risks because I don't think, I'd like to think celebrities probably have a doctor they use or someone on call.

36:44I'm not condoning it at all, but I'm sure they're using a trained healthcare professional, you'd like to think, to insert these things to begin with. But yeah, evidence, there is none. Like Ella said, if you're concerned about a deficiency, you get tested first. I know people want to try things and it's completely your prerogative like we're not saying you can or can't do something but we're just saying in terms of it being something that everybody feels they should be doing there's definitely no reason to be doing it if that makes sense and I don't like those flashy Instagram posts I think they're irresponsible and I don't think the influencers sometimes that take the paid jobs and realize the knock-on impact because they're not trained health professionals they don't realize they don't know um they might think it's utterly harmless because in their world they're thinking oh i'm just helping people by saying this has helped me and i don't think they realize the bigger impact well and they always need new content and you know it's important to always remember that like you know that's that's their job is to have something new to say yeah um and it's good content but it really it really really really like i would go so far than really like i think that there's all sorts of trends we talk about that it's like look there's not a huge amount evidence here but like if you you know oats and pick it was disgusting it's not like loads of there's no evidence behind it but like if you want to try blending oats to keep you full like be our guest like you know it's not it's not delicious it's not actually gonna have a huge impact but like it's not dangerous it's just a bit gross whereas with this it's like this is so expensive and takes time and you you know it looks flashy and fancy but it to me this is where i'm Like, please, please don't do it.

38:23Because if what it is, is you're just absolutely exhausted, like an IV drip won't fix that. But we want it to fix it. And it's the ultimate culture of quick fixes. And I find these really, really, really frustrating. I completely agree, Ella. So our next question is from Juliette from Sydney, Australia. She said, I wondered, and this links on nicely, actually, I wondered if what we see in social media posts is actually representative of real life. do you think people are more influenced through conversations with people and friends about what food to eat and the supplements or sadly are they affected by social media let's hope social media isn't at all representative of social of real life she said to end it so it's almost like a kind of what is our thought process ella because we're very for the ban that we've just had in the uk because we don't think it's all that great do we no i mean look i would say and there are always exceptions to this so you know be aware of that but I would say as a general rule of thumb no social media isn't real life in any shape or form and I think what's so important to remember and I'm not criticizing anybody for this because I think it's actually an amazing way that a lot of people and lots of you know stay-at-home mums have been able to create income streams so I'm not kind of inherently against the economy I've benefited from it as well we both have but you have to remember we all have to remember that like the way that social media works you have to have something new to say if you don't have something new to say or something that's kind of quote unquote interesting different catches people's attention your account will not perform so you have to remember like even if it's just a new lip balm influencers people on social media always have to have something new to tell you or to talk about which means that essentially it's an inherent thing to like dramatize something or make a mountain out of a molehill or to sell you something because they can't just be like I've eaten the same thing every single day for the last week I haven't done anything new this week I'm wearing the same clothes I've worn for 10 years like I'm watching the same series four times in a row like I'm not reading a new book like all of these things like I've eaten the same breakfast every day for four years they can't do that like they have to be like I bought a new top I have a new lip balm like this is my new makeup routine here's my new workout routine I'm going to change your life this has changed mine yeah but if they don't have something new to say so they always have to have something new and as a result it's not real because that's not what real life looks like and real health is so much about repetition you know and just doing the same things that work for you again and again but that's not very good content So not criticizing anyone for doing it, but I think it's a really, personally, I think that like inherent search for newness is a really important like frame and lens to have when you look at socials because that is how they make money.

41:16Yeah, social media is almost like a vessel now in most fields for trends. Like, you know, we discuss on the Wilderness Group, the trend for longevity optimization. It is a selling platform, essentially, I think. There's two aspects of it. But Ella and I have been on, who were like the first people online. So it was very different back then. It was about building a community. But that has shifted. That's not so much the case anymore. I feel it's become this massive marketing vessel, of course, for people to get what product they want out there. And influencers are a massive part of that. There are exceptions where wonderful conversations can be evoked and causes can have awareness raised.

41:57Like we discussed the Kick Out Big Soda campaign on Monday and hopefully you get some nice voices behind nice campaigns every now and again. You'll get people like Ella and myself on there. But a lot of the time, people want to have a career from this world and it has to be extreme, like Ella says, to gain any traction. So I agree with Ella. I don't think it does reflect reality in most of the areas online and use it of a pinch of salt. And there are obviously some gems, but between us, Yes, we, that's why we love podcasts, because we have long, long format to discuss things. No, I completely agree with that.