Ultra-Processed Snacks, Sugar Cravings, The Gut-Brain Connection

0:26Race the rudders! The Jack Welch Management Institute at Strayer University helps you go from I know the way to I've arrived with our top 10 ranked online MBA. Gain skills you can learn today and apply tomorrow. Get ready to go from make it happen to made it happen and keep striving. Visit Strayer.edu slash Jack Welch MBA to learn more. Strayer University is certified to operate in Virginia by Shev and as many campuses, including at 2121 15th Street North in Arlington, Virginia. Welcome to The Wellness Scoop, your weekly dose of health and wellness inspiration. We are your hosts, I'm Ella Mills.

1:08And I'm Rhiannon Lambert. And after a decade in the wellness industry, we know how overwhelming and confusing health advice can be. So that's why we created this podcast, to cut through the noise and make healthier living simple, fun and personal. And we're full of big news today. It's a big news day. It's a big day for us. we're off to a really exciting shoot straight after we finish recording but tickets are live i don't even know what to say i just laugh because i can't believe it's happening i know the wellness scoop live it's coming 14th of june um at an amazing space the cadogan hall in super super central london so really easy to get to it is going to be absolutely unbelievable my mind is racing with so many ideas and Ella and I are having huge chats about how we're going to make this not only the episode that you want live but also with added extras to make it super special exactly loads of added extras one of which is going to be a full debunking of ultra processed food so obviously Ree's been working for the last couple of years on all the latest research data evidence about this conversation that is dominating so much conversation in the world of health and wellness and we are going to have a whole segment on 101 on ultra processed food what is it what does it mean where are the problems what do you need to know so that part is going to be particularly exciting exactly and we get asked so many questions after every show about this subject so you've got that to look forward to some surprises which we won't share until the day itself and of course we'll have some super headlines going for you then i still am very overwhelmed by this we are actually doing a live show we're going to meet so many of you i know we cannot wait i think it's going to be our only big event this year so 14th of june get it in your diary it's going to be so special tickets are live now the link will be in the show notes and we'll also both pop it on our socials um today and in newsletters so it should be easy to find also you could just google the wellness scoop live cadogan hall we just can't wait and then also in big news i've got present for you today um is this what's in this box she came in carrying around a big box It's very heavy.

3:19And I quite obsessively check our numbers. And I don't think you... I haven't looked in weeks because I don't like to look at them. Yeah. So, Bree's missed something. What? What have I missed? What have I missed? Dun, dun, dun. Ah! Oh, my God, Anna, this is beautiful. One million. We hit one million. One million downloads of the wellness scoop. So, it ordered us a pink cake. Oh, my God, I want to get a picture of our cake. I've got to restrain myself to laugh at the podcast. I want to whip my phone out. I know. We're just going to sit here with the most delicious cake between us for the next hour.

3:53But we hit a million downloads. Two months. One million downloads. That's insane. Everybody. Oh, I'm so happy we're cutting through. But also, what a shock. Ella knows me too well. You knew I don't look at the numbers. I just don't like. I didn't think you'd seen it. And I was like, I really want to surprise you with it. Because it's just such a mega milestone. One million. We've only just started. I know. But it does feel like we're only just getting started. We're only going into double digits of episodes. For sure. But it's all thanks to you guys. Honestly, it really is. So thank you for joining us.

4:24Thank you for tuning in. Thank you for supporting us. Thank you. And also, we've got some amazing listener messages. Ella's selected two here. And they're just heartwarming, aren't they? They really, really are. So the first one says, You have both inspired me to get back exercising and eating healthy, despite having a crazy house with three children under four. And I am prioritizing a small window of me time, and it has made everybody benefit. Thank you. I feel so much better in so many ways and I'm a better mum and wife because of it. My gosh, to say our podcast has just improved your life that much is just, you couldn't get higher feedback and this is similar to what Becca's said here and I wish we could give you all the cake, guys.

5:04And this message from Becca is just incredible as well. To say that the wellness scoop has changed my life would be an understatement. As a chronic overthinker, looking into wellness and improving myself and the environment around me can be well the most overwhelming thing ever but with you guys every Monday it feels like a chat with friends in brackets she's put who are actually qualified to give advice thank you Becca and it's the best start to the week and I'm so grateful I found you both and I'll be a long time listener for everything you do in the future I can't cope kind of turned into a puddle it's too much too much emotion today no guys honestly it does it means the world to both of us and we just are so grateful for this community we cannot wait to meet you in real life in june it's just going to be absolutely fantastic one million downloads a big cover shoot together and a live show it's all happening for the wellness school and what's even better is the more of you that listen the more of you that review the podcast so thank you it means we actually get to give you your answers and feedback every week so we record this weekly we've got obviously the easter holidays coming up so there might be just two weeks i think that We're not recording an Easter, isn't there?

6:14That's right. But we'll have extra scoops for you. We've got you all covered. So what's coming up in today's show, Ella? Okay, so first of all, we're going to look at why nostalgia is surprisingly good for your health and how loneliness can be as harmful as smoking. Sugar cravings. That was a lot of listener question requests. Re-use nutrition hacks, which I can't wait for. The toddler UPF scandal. What that means for long-term health of a generation. can white bread and bacon actually harm your eyesight more links with upfs and this time that's looking at vision your gut health versus your genetics why your microbiome may have more influence on your brain than your dna tongue scraping is everywhere does it actually work we've both been giving it a go plus my new favorite recipe and some beautiful wise words that i've taken from an interview that ottilanghi did this weekend on ditching diet culture

7:10so what have you been up to this week ella i'm off to new york in two days time thursday morning deliciousie ella launched in new york work across the whole of us um with whole foods a couple of months ago and this is my first time going to see all our products on shelf in real life we've got some cool events coming up and sampling some things like that so we're taking the kids and it's a kind of working holiday so that's the big that's the big news on my end and then in new york are there specific stores that are like target stores to get into is there like we've got a whole nationwide u.s whole foods listing which is just crazy so it's gonna be so surreal i haven't been to america since yeah way before sky was born probably six or seven years and i just can't wait bring it on you have to send me pictures the minute you see things i know because even i send ella pictures of an ella bar in like the local sainsbury's i know this feels so glam um so no and the kids are super excited.

8:07So yeah, that's the big news, my end. How about you? What have you been up to? I mean, I'm not going to New York, but that is incredible, Ella. Congratulations. That is the most amazing, amazing news. And I think I wanted to share this week with people, apart from the fact that behind the scenes, if anyone's doing this whole Easter bonnet crazy time, it's been a lot of late nights poking my fingers with needles trying to sew. I super glued my hands together doing a bonnet. There we go. So we're not pros at textiles, but I wanted to share a I guess a tip I had one of those weeks where I know that Ella and I always sound quite upbeat we're on the podcast because we love doing the podcast but we're human too and we have ups and downs and I had my first PTSD attack this week in a long time like a proper long time and I had to remind myself of grounding techniques that I haven't done in a very long time and I think it's really useful for our listeners to understand grounding techniques because I'd never heard of it before I had therapy for it.

9:04And it's almost like when you're going through something that is really difficult and you're trying to distract your mind or to take yourself away from the trigger of whatever it might be, you obviously focus on your breathing, but you have to think of a safe space. And weirdly for me, my safe space is the Royal Albert Hall. I worked there for 10 years in London. It was like my most consistent space. And I would visualize myself in this amazing building and you think of the sounds you think of your feet on the floor you think of all the things around you so if anyone is having I just thought to share on the podcast a moment just try and picture your safe space and take some breaths and I think that can really help but apart from that Ella I did a talk that I didn't discuss at Eton College a few weeks ago and it was an experience because you'd think that this amazing college in the UK would just be following credible sources for nutrition they've had some very controversial people who talks at Eton they've had Eddie Abood who talks at Eton they've had big carnival guys and it just reminded me that the whole world is in turmoil doesn't matter where you're from what your background is everyone is absorbing all this information online yeah we definitely had a lot of feedback didn't we last week on the kind of the crazy myth that floating around and water being bad for you now which by the way if you haven't listened to last week's episode it is not it was just a trending conversation so yeah it's fascinating lots of work for us to do to cut through stuff exactly so ella right give me any recommendations that you've got for us this week okay i've got two recommendations the first is you guys have probably seen online ria feel like i've seen you making it as well that viral date bark where you cut dates in half take the pip out squish them down put peanut butter or chocolate etc on it if you've seen it everywhere and you haven't tried it take this as your moment to try it reese like nodding along really intensely it's so good isn't it so delicious i'm honestly obsessed i've been doing it where you do dates first then you do peanut butter or you could use any nut butter then you do a layer of sliced bananas and then you do melted chocolate over the top sprinkle of sea salt pop it in the freezer it is the best snack in the world although I can't stop opening my freezer to get more out but it is just so delicious it's such a nice sweet tree but it's obviously full of nutrition at the same time.

11:27Oh my goodness there's no sugar spike with it in the same way as you would have in a chocolate bar because you've got all that fiber in the dates you've got all the fat in like the peanut butter or whatever nut butter and if it's dark chocolate it's just full of antioxidants. Yeah you've got loads of plant points in there so it's absolutely delicious I will write the whole instructions in the show notes just in case you haven't seen it but 10 out of 10 don't just think it's a trend online it is one of the most delicious things ever then my other recommendation obviously we've talked a lot about diet culture I've got a fun segment on next week's episode on a bit of history around diet culture which I think will really shock some of you guys some of the research I've come across but there was a piece that Ottolenghi wrote in the Guardian this weekend and it's so worth a read I really really recommend you guys look at reading it but I'm just going to pull out an excerpt from it because I thought it was such a sage advice and he said it seems to me that if we stopped for one second and allowed ourselves to ignore all this noise as in all the diet trends and instead follow the well-established routines we grew up with surrounding cooking and eating we wouldn't need such solutions as in 3 000 different diet solutions eating regimes foster self-doubt when there's no need for it they make us overthink our relationship with food instead of just living it the world of diets is a trap that locks you in by messing with your head as 21st century humans we are always on the lookout for simple ideas that would solve all our problems and eradicate the constant anxiety we suffer for the past few decades it seems the nutrition has been the fount of many such simple notions very profound and very true and i love it when you pull out things like this and i read it and i dissect it and my initial instinct is that's so true we are struggling from an evolutionary perspective of being humans with innate instincts with the fact we should enjoy the food we eat it should fuel us it should be okay but we are living in an environment that doesn't support it at all because you've got 24 hour access to food like you could order food at three in the morning we couldn't do that 60 odd years ago and I think um it's so difficult now to drown out all the noise of the diets because we live in what researchers call an obesogenic environment now in the UK well interestingly on all the conversations around a Zen pick etc etc and all those different weight loss drugs there's a lot of conversation around one of the things that then being helpful for people doing is stopping food noise which I had never heard as a term before prior to reading some of those conversations and I just thought food noise was a really helpful way of thinking as you said about the fact that like wherever you are there's food everywhere lots of which is marketing there could be drinks on a screen in front of you posters it you just don't realize how much you're exposed to it how noisy it is so I think I've just found that a helpful way of thinking about it and I love what he's saying as well is that it is a complicated world that we live in and most of us do feel overwhelmed or anxious or stressed probably too much of the time if we're honest and I think that thinking that we therefore need all these neat boxes and solutions is quite innate to human behavior but actually that's just not we don't need to put food into such a tight restrictive way of thinking we really don't and we really need to get this as mpick extra scoop going I think we've got it in the lineup haven't we because I know so many of you are confused or worried but you know it can be a lifeline for people so we'll get that going.

14:41Definitely and Rifa your recommendations you've got nutrition hacks right this week? Yeah I just thought you know what I don't have any recommendations this week that I've been doing personally so I thought let's just ask the nutrition clinic team and myself on what's something we just do without thinking about it you know every single week like I was in the kitchen yesterday with my youngest he's two and a half I had some tomatoes you know the ones that start going off and they go a bit wrinkly and I'm not going to throw them away because they're still edible. They're a bit soft. They're a bit soft and one of them was a bit dried out but it was still fine and the peppers that I'd sliced I forgot to put in the lunchbox so when you put things towards the back of the fridge you know they can ice over a bit and then they get a bit soft and watery so I got out all this old veg so anything that's going off and I just made some savoury muffins with it because I had flour in the cupboard.

15:29You can obviously use flax eggs if If you're vegan or if you've got eggs in your cupboard, just mix it all together with some cheese or some herbs, spices, whatever you want and chuck it in the oven. And in 20 minutes, you've got delicious, savory muffins that you can just cut in half and warm up and have a bit of butter or nut butter or whatever you want to put on them. And it's just a good way of getting some more veg in and something that lasts in lunchbox. So that was my little hack is don't forget you can cook up things into muffins and into different items. You could even do that in pancakes, for instance.

15:59then we've got some advice from the clinic so Kath who we've had on before Catherine Robert she's a gut health dietician she said go for pita breads over wraps and of course you can make your own wraps I've got a recipe for that in the new book the in-processed plate but if you buy pita breads you don't tend to get the palm oil in it you don't tend to get a lot of the additives and emulsifiers because to make a wrap bendable malleable the word to be able to shape it into a wrap or a burrito without it cracking because you know if you have a big loaf of bread you just pull it apart and with a wrap you want that plasticky texture you have to add things to it to create that which is why on the shop shelves along with shelf life you've got all these ingredients whereas a pita bread you just get a pita bread and you can make pita sandwiches so if you're looking to reduce ultra processed foods a pita also contains more fiber and that's a better option you can get a whole meal and then sarah our eating disorder dietitian sarah elder said cook once eat twice which I mean we all do right that's like the theme of my life I love who wants to just cook for one meal like let's have some lunchbox for the next day I think that's a lifesaver the next one from Lisa Waldron who's our eating disorder dietician as well she said just add lentils to everything she's like I do lentils every week I bulk up curries it's a good source of protein it ups my fiber intake and then the final one that I've got from me would be every week and I've probably given this to nearly every client I've ever seen it's just roast vegetables have them in a lunchbox for three or four days then you can add it to curries you can add it to salads you can add them to stir fries you're getting more veg you're getting your five a day and if you just spend you don't even have to cook you just chuck it on the tray go and do your own thing set a timer on Alexa and come back they're my little nutrition hacks this week guys and I hope it saves you some time it's such good advice as well because it's so actionable in busy lives So these are very, very simple wins, which obviously is so good for you.

17:55Very much how I cook at home as well. OK, so moving on to the health headlines that matter. So if you're new to the show, this is the section that we break down the biggest health stories making news. And Rhi, what have we got coming up this week? I thought this was really interesting, but we don't think about our eyesight. So the headline that we've got here is can ultra processed foods affect your eyesight? Now, we'll dissect this later, but we often associate, you know, UPF, so ultra processed foods with metabolic issues like weight gain, poor heart health. But new findings suggest that our eyesight could also be affected.

18:33Now, a recent analysis from eyewear prescription brand overnight glasses highlights how high sodium. So the amount of salt that you get in the foods, high glycemic foods. so that's again sugars impact in your bloodstream may increase the risk of age-related macular degeneration so that's the aging of your eyes at a more rapid rate and hypertensive retinopathy so two leading causes of vision loss and as someone myself I wear contacts you know I'm I've been short-sighted since I was probably about six I always had glasses at school but if I didn't eat well, I can imagine perhaps potentially, of course, my eyesight would be impacted.

19:14We just don't think about our eyes. And the issue lies in how certain foods can damage the blood vessels in the retina. So either by spiking blood sugar levels continuously, or raising blood pressure. Now, when I talk about blood sugar levels, guys, remember, it's not the B or end or we're talking about a chronic poor diet. So here are four foods that were called out in the report, Ellis, So we've got white bread, which had a glycemic index, so a GI of 70. Sodium, so salt levels were really high, 490 milligrams per 100 grams. And high GI diets, which are linked to a greater risk of this age-related macular degeneration.

19:51I laugh at the second one because I think everyone knows that it's not great for you. But French fries, classic. Everyone loves some French fries. But frequent consumption is associated with corrodial, I can barely say this word, neovascularization, a severe form of degeneration. So basically degenerating your eyes. Then we've got processed cheese. So, you know, the American cheese that you put on that melts really nicely and bacon, which we seem to come up with every single episode at the moment. I know there's no agenda just to clarify on our side on this. It's just the headline. And I was already looking at the script for next week.

20:27ahead of flying off to New York and it slipped back in again. Oh, you have to tell us about the New York food when you go. Yeah, I can't wait. Oh, I really want all the feedback on what they're currently serving. Have they switched to beef tallow? I want to see what they're doing. Yes, it's beef tallow everywhere. I will let you know. Yeah. But it is interesting. I honestly had never, even with all the kind of interest that I have in ultra processed food and the conversation around it, when you sent this through, I had never even considered that that would have an impact on my eyesight. Yeah, me too.

20:56I just think we just don't think about our eyes because obviously they're just such a part of what we do every day. You just wake up, you see, you go to bed, you sleep. And, you know, it's foods that are marketed as healthy that could be problematic due to their glycemic index. So what we're talking about here is not just one area of a UPF diet. It's not just the nitrates in bacon. It's not just the sodium or the salt in the French fries or the sugar in the bread. we're talking about consuming all of these things high fat high salt sugar and additives chronically that are degenerating now our eyes and it makes sense i mean you get poor eyesight i think as well alongside diabetes sometimes and i think type 2 to distinguish but there's yeah we've got to look after our whole body every part of it i know and it deserves it but it is just interesting thinking about how yes often i think so often we've thought about food and weight you know maybe then we think about it with our heart health and we kind of keep going in steps but i think things like our eye health are quite far off the radar aren't they i mean i'd go as far as saying when it comes to eyes everyone's probably heard of carrots help you see in the dark and that's is that true well technically yes but not in the dark it just carrots contain vitamin a which helps support the retina the retinol in your eyes so it does help support your eyes you need vitamin a for good eyesight which you get in orange like beta carotene things and sweet potatoes trying to think orange carrots carrots and then i'm struggling better than a squash but yeah that's what everyone's heard of so there's an element of truth but we just don't think of our diet and our eyes so let's go i wonder how many of us were told as children um when you didn't want to eat your carrot you have to eat them they'll help you see in the dark i know i wonder if they still do that i don't know if i've done it with my kids you know i don't think they have anyway we move on to headline two which is about the fact that you know obviously one of the challenges when a lot of your diet comes from ultra processed food is that you're not packing your diet with fiber and these foods that are so good for your gut health and that moves on brilliantly to headline two which is that your gut health may matter more than your genes for brain function i mean blowing my mind even more here and it goes to show i mean we've always known in the nutrition field that your gut's really really important but now more than ever before ella yeah exactly as you said i think so many of us have heard that our gut and our brain are connected but in a new study that's just been published in nature structural and molecular biology there suggests that this link is actually even more powerful than previously thought and researchers found that gut bacteria can chemically modify brain proteins through glycosylation a process where sugars attach to proteins changing how they function so when we talk about glycation or glycosylation we're talking about the stiffening of proteins and kind of like sugar molecules or carb this is really basic science for you guys anyone listening to know science would be like that's not exactly how it is but just to explain it you're almost suffocating your molecules and your body you're stiffening them all up you're hardening them all and that's when we age glycation is involved with aging and what they're saying in the brain is that obviously the more good gut bacteria we've got we can really help the protein survive through this type of process where sugar is attached to protein so do you know what i find so interesting is again with this protein hype that's happened for the last two weeks as we're recording this podcast i'm seeing it everywhere it's probably just in my algorithm it frustrates me so much when i know from reading this that fiber helps fuel your gut yet we're still not taking it seriously because these changes that are huge it says that it can influence neuroplasticity which is you know helping your brain grow and develop new chains and threads in your brain inflammation how they communicate with each other gut microbes aren't just affecting the mood they're shaping our brain it's absolutely extraordinary and that can impact memory decision making stress response and even mental health conditions like anxiety and depression which is just absolutely massive and as you said it's like this desperate need to get people thinking fiber sexier if you didn't listen yet to the extra scoop episode that we just released on 30 plants with dr federico amati that came out on thursday it is so brilliant for this need to get fiber on the map i know fiber is not sexy but we've somehow collectively going to make get sexy share that episode with friends talk about it because our gut health is key what's so interesting as well is that i mean i did a post on this on instagram the other day is that okay if you care about protein just eat more plant-based proteins because they contain the fiber they are the beans the pulses the lentils the nuts the seeds they are the protein sources in a plant-based diet that are very rich in fiber so it's kind of like a win-win and then the other thing that i wanted to just remind you guys of because if you remember from a few weeks ago we were talking about another study in nature medicine that came from the UK's biobank and that was about how how your lifestyle has more impact on your health span and likelihood of developing various conditions than your genetics and I just think that's really interesting in the same conversation as we're having here where we're saying that again your diet because it's what you're feeding to create your gut health is more important than your genes for brain function and when you put those two things together it's super super powerful and if you haven't listened to that episode yet where we were talking about nature versus nurture in this new study as i said that showed your lifestyle was more impactful than your genetics the key thing was that lifestyle and environment accounted for 17 percent of premature death risk with genetics accounting for just two percent and early life factors like childhood weight maternal smoking during pregnancy for example not that they're things that we control but just to point out they were linked to disease risk up to 80 years later so we just think when you put the whole things together it's very very powerful in terms of how much is in our hands to influence our health it is and last week we had the study didn't we the data on gut bacteria and meat so if you do eat meat just try and make those switches what i'm trying to think do you remember i think it was 332 cases of bad bacteria or some developed from consuming processed meat versus a very low level it was like number 14 with white meat so and again it was a bit lower 12 or something with red meat so just try and remove those processed meats and it's like i say in the book you know you don't actually know what percentage of meat is in the burger you're buying and you don't know what impact that's having on your gut health whereas if you're trying to just have meat but enjoy the better quality cuts if you're able to this is what also just a little side note that i feel a little bit sad about is that in this country when there are these big divides socioeconomic divides on access to food on education the quality of foods does not up to scratch when you buy these cheaper fast food cuts you just don't know what you're getting in your food no i know it's so difficult and it's so easy to sit here and say well bulk buying dried lentils i know that's what i mean and like it is But, you know, we need to make sure people feel comfortable and confident to cook them, to have the equipment required, to have the kitchen.

28:12And also the mental load, you know, we're living with generations of people so overwhelmed, so stressed, so kind of bogged down in the various different responsibilities of life. And so it's a complicated world. And it's not to say, yeah, it's so simple. Your lifestyle means more than your genetics and DNA. Don't worry about it. Just finish this episode. Hot girl walk and eat some lentils. I know, that's not what we're saying. It's so reductive in a way. But if you can be inspired to do that, and then I think it's how we collectively work together to create more meaningful societal change that allows us to.

28:45Yeah. And find your balance, guys. Find your balance. Find your balance. We've got this amazing cake in front of us and we will enjoy it. And it doesn't mean items are off limit. But you've got a good quote. Who is the guy with the dice? The guy with the dice. This is just one of my favorite quotes. We pulled up a few weeks ago again from this study of almost half a million people in the UK Biobank that showed that lifestyle was more influential than genetics on your health. And it was Dr. Stephen Burgess, University of Cambridge. And he just said, genetics can load the dice, but it's up to us how we play our hand.

29:18And to what we were just saying, it's not completely up to us because so many different socioeconomic factors play in there. But for lots of us and for, you know, a big swathe of the population, there's more in our control than I think sometimes we like to think. to some degree and it's worth making those small changes like making those muffins you mentioned like roasting up your veg those little efforts you like the recommendation just tip a tin of lentils into what you're cooking you could even chuck them in the muffins do you know what there's nothing better than like warm bread with butter and if you've got a bit of veg in there then it's just win-win ella how do people sign up for biobank i think that should be a recommendation that i should have put at the beginning because the biobank seems to provide so much incredible data Yeah, it does.

29:58It really does. I don't actually know. I know my mum's part of it, but I think she became part of it 20 years ago or something. Anyone listening, if anyone knows, can you just drop us... We always love reviews, by the way, anyway, but just drop us a comment if you're a member of the Biobank. Yeah, we want to hear from you because you're providing the world with a lot of research.

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32:06Sierra also has yoga gear. It might be a good place to find your zen. Discover top brands at unexpectedly low prices. Sierra, let's get moving. Okay, tell us about headline number three. I loved it when I saw this one because I feel like I live my life as an adult. You do just look back on your childhood and think it shapes you. You almost refer to your childhood every day, don't we? We refer to it in a child on a psychological level. And then we refer to Disney, for instance, as a child and what joy that brings you. So this headline, why feeling nostalgic is good for your health. Well, thank goodness, because I feel I do it a lot.

32:43Nostalgia might seem like a soft emotion, but a new study shows it may be one of the most protective behaviors we have. And that's when it comes to health and happiness. So researchers from the university at Buffalo and Kyoto University followed more than 1 ,500 participants across US and Europe. And they found that people who regularly reflect on fond memories are significantly better at maintaining close, meaningful relationships. So the study was actually published, if anyone wants to go look it up, in Cognition and Emotion. And those had a high score. So I think I might be on a high score, you know, with this study.

33:20I'm excited. They were more likely to preserve strong social ties over a seven year period. and those with low levels of nostalgia had 18 fewer close relationships by the end of that time so nostalgia made people more motivated to nurture existing connections you know keep those friends on facebook from your childhood or at your school you know that crop up every time and you look you look on it you see them but you don't actually talk to them anymore but you're like oh i remember being at school and you know that sort of thing rather than just focusing on expanding their social circle it is absolutely interesting and i think the thing that's fascinating about this and just a reminder again I feel like I keep saying just remind it don't mean in a condescending way I mean everything we talk about fits together it's like a giant jigsaw puzzle so I say that just to keep bringing back other things we've all been talking about reading about because when you start to put it together you get this really helpful kind of jigsaw puddle puddle jigsaw puzzle or map essentially of health and wellness and what you really need and what you really need is a 360 approach you don't just need your lentils even though you don't just need food yeah you don't just need food lentils or cake aside you need all of these things and i think one of the reasons as rey was saying that this is so significant is there's just the most extraordinary body of evidence about how important your relationships are as a predictor of happiness and that one conversation a day like we said that week you know because that's why we enjoy the podcast you get interaction and you just feel like a better human yeah it provides a lot of meaning doesn't it and you guys probably have heard of this um before but there was this absolutely massive study done the harvard study of adult development and it was a real landmark because it was 75 years long so it was a 75 year longitudinal study and it tracked 724 men from both inner city boston and harvard's kind of elite most academic students and they after tracking them for 75 years there was one conclusion which was the biggest predictor of long-term health and happiness for both groups they're obviously very much taking into account here socioeconomic factors was good relationships.

35:25Yeah, because interaction counts. It's almost like if you've ever watched the old Charlie and the Chocolate Factory film, and you know, you see the four grandparents in the bed at the beginning. Oh, my goodness, that film. And I just, anyway, that's nostalgic for me. But you know, when you look at it, and you think they rally together, and it's the interactions they have that get them through that period. And why does this matter, guys? It's because loneliness is one of the most serious health risks of modern life. And that's according to harvard health so chronic loneliness is associated with a 26 increased risk of early death i mean we see that in care homes as well we see loneliness a 29 a higher risk of heart disease a 32 increased risk of stroke these health effects are basically comparable to the data we've got of smoking 15 cigarettes a day yeah so when you're putting thinking about your health map put your friends put connections put meaningful conversations on there just as much is your hot girl walk and your lentils one thing i do need to stop though is and i've noticed it because when we chat in our whatsapp group and when i do it with the clinic i just put kisses at the end of my messages and it dates back to being a teenager and i can't seem to shift it you know sometimes i'm writing a message and i notice with my friends from school we go kiss kiss kiss kiss at the end and then i don't do it now with my newer connections the last 10 years but it's something i don't know why i still do it no i'm actually with you on whatsapp i find it easy because it's like a conversation as opposed to you know it's like three words yeah yeah but if even when I'm writing an email to like I know too much a stranger I like want to put kisses I know and then yeah stop really bring myself back like be a little bit professional I know um right headline four is actually a bit more serious yes and a lot of you sent us this a lot of friends and family sent us this this has been a big conversation and again we're very conscious we both have children but this is not a show about family life or children i think the reason we sometimes want to include these things that focus on children is because it's representative indicative of a whole conversation to me the interesting bits of this article don't just speak to children i think it speaks to an adult population and lots of the problems that we collectively have and this came out in the guardian last week and it was a thought-provoking piece even the image Jella, the child with the crisps coming out on our mouth.

37:41Exactly. And it was called the toddler snack food scandal. So the Guardian described this scandal as one of the great food scandals of our time. And that's the dominance of ultra processed food, UPFs in toddler diets and babies, and the developmental consequences that we're now seeing emerge. And I think what's interesting about this is this whole UPF conversation is just, it is obviously emerging in real time because the speed of which our diets have changed over the last couple of decades is so fast we didn't grow up eating these sorts of things they just weren't available we all had snacks but not in the way that it's available today yeah and it's just very very very interesting and the thing that i wanted to pick up from this article is this fussy eating phase that they're kind of really pinning back to it's called as neophobia i want to pull that up just very quickly because a neophobia is a fear of food rather than a rejection of food yeah it's a fear of new food and i think in that is a lot about texture and the thing that's so interesting is because now there's basically the whole article is focusing on the fact that a lot of babies and toddlers and we know that you know it's almost 70 percent or so of their calories are coming from ultra processed food so they're not getting this early exposure to a variety of different textures and tastes necessarily of course that's not always the case and it's creating this as you said fear of new foods and to me what's so interesting about that is yes there's some terrifying data for example there's showing the shift in diet appears to be having these immediate consequences and noticeable increase for example in toddlers having tooth decay a growing concern over the number of children reaching three who are more or less non-verbal outside of medical conditions and one contributing factor of that potentially being that the muscles needed for chewing are also that involved in speech and they're just not being developed because they're just having kind of pouches and things because they're mostly eating soft ultra processed foods so that can delay speech oral coordination for example and they're basically raising a very serious question have children born from 20 to 20 onwards become scared of real food the thing that i thought was so interesting about this obviously that in itself is absolutely terrifying and needs a huge amount of focus i think for our conversation on the wellness scoop the interesting thing to me is I don't think that's just reserved to children though where do I start my head when you're reading that out is going in back to my uni training with it but then back to practical advice and then I'm thinking of the issues in society so like you said when you wean a child ideally you want to be weaning them on produce rather than packeted items and what is happening and don't get me wrong I used pouches like pouches are very convenient But the problem is the pouches that sell, and I know this because I used to work with a baby food company.

40:27We developed the most insanely amazing like lentil, butternut squash, delicious protein fiber rich pouches. They didn't sell. No one wanted them. They just wanted the fruit pouches and the fruit and yogurt pouches because the sweeter palate sells. So straight away, if you're weaning your baby this way, they're getting a preference. This is debated, by the way. Everything I'm talking about is debated by scientists. and then we don't just eat with our mouth we eat with our eyes our hands all the senses what we hear and babies are opening packets of like a crunchy biscuit or often it's that ultra processed food is food that melts in the mouth that doesn't take very much time to break down all the fiber has been removed and it's very easy to eat a lot of it and they're just being weaned on these snack items where they're touching these kind of crisp items don't get me wrong I gave my kids a few of these as well they're lifesavers sometimes they're really nice they melt in their mouth they really like the taste and then once they've got a preference for that why would they want to then hold some broccoli or hold a really soft bit of carrot or pureed avocado if it hasn't got fruit mixed in with it i think there's a approach to childhood nutrition and the first a thousand days really matters that's from nought too we discussed that with brain development and taste and preferences but to reduce your risk of fussy eating if you start with veg and bitter foods that has been shown to help and later in life with a preference for veg and I think you're right with adults what we're doing just to flip the conversation I know there's so many reasons parents wean in this way by the way it's convenience it's time it's not knowing what to do it's not being confident in the kitchen it's being thinking that the packeted foods are safe because they're in a packet so you think that can't go wrong this isn't going to harm my child I can see those conversations but for adults we are just consuming these hyper palatable melty foods and not chewing it's fascinating and it tastes completely different the sweetness of sweets is totally unrecognizable from the sweetness of a strawberry and i remember watching it was when there was a kind of whole series of documentaries that were going viral netflix this is probably almost 10 years ago like what the health and things like that i remember that do you remember that moment very controversial and there was one on sugar in the u.s and i gosh name is i know who it is with robert ludwig and yeah but they were going through some of these children in the u.s and they were really struggling with their weight and really struggling with their diet and they you know would then try say a carrot and they got no flavor from the carrot because your simple foods like keep talking about lentils today but take a lentil if you eat lots of hyper palatable ultra processed foods with these sweeteners with these artificial flavors those are so much stronger than the flavor of real food oftentimes and the flavor of real food is also inconsistent and that's something that we're kind of acutely aware of in our industry which is that that's why people often do use emulsifiers they do use flavorings because you create this uniformity that's totally impossible to create with real food essentially and so i'm just very interested in this conversation because I think it is fascinating with kids but to me I see it with adults too where they then try things and they're like what I really like it because it doesn't have the same sweetness or satisfaction or intensity that a lot of the ultra processed food has and therefore it becomes unsatisfying.

43:45You're right and you know this starts from conception like we said there's studies that show if mothers during pregnancy have a lot of carrots or drink the study was on carrot juice so they made the mothers ethically by the way obviously done ethically small sample size though drink carrot juice and then the babies had a preference for carrots when they were born and then when mothers are breastfeeding even eating a lot of bitter foods in their diet can give their babies more of a preference towards these foods so there's support i think kate middleton is working with the early years foundations at the moment and there's a lot of talk as we speak right now there's lobbying there's campaigning for more focus on let's start off young getting supporting mothers and helping them make better decisions but the cost of living's just gone up food has gone up and as a reminder you know we touched on this research that in the first a thousand days of life you know eating less sugar is linked to a 35 lower risk of type 2 diabetes in adulthood it's just crazy where we're going it is but as i said it feels representative to me of like all ages and the urgency of this conversation on ultra processed food which you will learn all about when you come to the wellness scoop live yeah maybe maybe i should save it all and obviously if you pre-order my book you will learn you'll learn a lot about it but this conversation is huge and the headline i found it was quite fear-mongering the way it was really fear-mongering and as you said i think there's a time and a place but all of this stuff and it can be incredibly helpful yes but it's about it comes back to the same old word doesn't it balance which is that we need to reverse what we currently seeing we need the inverse of it in the sense of 60 70 80 percent of calories coming from ultra processed food it needs to be that that proportion of calories is coming from deeply nutritious food then you add on i could not agree more could not agree more and anyone listening we do eat these items too every now and again but yeah majority of the time so i think it moves us nicely on to the trends in wellness we've got a nice short trend this week because we did a chunky old trend section last week this week lots of you asked us to talk about tongue scraping i think it might be because there's been this kind of virality in morning routine videos on socials and we obviously talked about morning shed right at the beginning i'll never forget that our first episode yeah when you wake up was it go to bed ugly to wake up beautiful and you've got and then i thought you'd said shred not shed i was like really the morning shed i remember it so clearly anyway the whole shebang if you haven't seen it look it up online because the videos are quite something but as part of that a lot of people do a tongue scrape and so we've been looking at it this week and basically yes as i said latest addition to the viral morning routine trend is the tongue um scraper and they're essentially like they're quite sleek looking normally copper metal tools and they're part of wellness rituals that are kind of in the spotlight at the moment it's actually nothing new the habit dates back thousands of years in ayurvedic medicine even though it's having a modern moment with tiktok tutorials everywhere etc etc and basically what you do is you just gently drag a curved metal plastic tool from the back to the front of your tongue to remove up the build-up that naturally accumulates overnight so that build-up's a mix of debris bacteria dead cells it can contribute to bad breath adult stunts of taste etc etc anyway normally paired with brushing flossing etc it's not something you do on its own but it is a quite an interesting one we both got tongue scraper last week have you been finding it thanks to ella who bought me a tongue scraper last week i was gonna say because you beat me to it i was very dubious i'm always dubious but i really wanted to try it because i'd seen some research they're very small studies but if you floss and if you tongue scrape you reduce your risk of dementia and I saw that and I'm going to dig out the facts on that because it's really interesting but I did send a message to my dentist and I've got a voice note just to confirm so I love Ree's voice I know because I just thought look if I'm going to do this every day because it makes sense to me it makes perfect sense why would I not scrape my tongue it felt really clean yeah I really like the feel of it every morning oh my god my first scrape yeah the white stuff I said oh my god I promise I'm like a hygienic person but it really was fat yeah how have we not done this our whole lives yeah it's really interesting it's almost like western society's forgotten some of the basic parts of hygiene let me play this to you now this is from dr rona at the chelsea dental clinic oh sorry it's on full speed i do this all the time there you go ayurvedic tongue scraping is something that i have been telling my patients to do for many years you cover a lot of bacteria on your tongue and by scraping it first thing in the morning, usually by using something made out of a metal, for example, copper, you can actually remove the bacteria.

48:41This has a lot of benefits such as reducing bad breath. It can also improve your taste buds because you're getting rid of that film. And it's incredibly important to ensure that you're removing harmful bacteria from the mouth. It is something that I tell my patients to do. And usually first thing in the morning, when you get that build up on your tongue? I mean, it sold it to me, Ella. I was like, bring it on. I can't wait. You got me a tongue scraper. Off I go. I got you a cake. I got you a tongue scraper. Got a cake and a tongue scraper. It's a really diverse range of gifts. I'm so happy right now.

49:14I feel like my life is complete. With your tongue scraper. But you know what? As we said, there's a lot of mad wellness trends, but there's some really nice ones that are getting spotlighted thanks to socials because I don't think tongue scrapers would be without this morning routine phase. But what I loved about this, The reason I was dubious before I got that voice note to try is because I've heard so much about the oral microbiome. So almost like the natural organisms that we talk about in our gut that live within our mouth and that area and how that's also linked to dementia or skin health or heart health.

49:44There's so much we don't know that we're still discussing and learning about. And I was thinking it's almost, oh, you know, is tongue scraping similar to things you don't want to do with your gut, like colonics, which is something we should get into another time. because I'm sure lots of you listening may actually have tried those. But from what I understand of it, from my background, you don't want to take laxatives or clonics if you can help it because it just flushes out all the good stuff. So I was thinking, oh, no, I don't want to do that in my mouth. And actually, a 2005 study has found that scraping twice a day reduced levels of, I'm going to read this correctly, it's the Latin word, the mutants strepococci and lactobacilli bacteria that's linked to bad breath and tooth decay.

50:26and then you've got a 2004 study that found tongue scraping to be more effective than brushing alone at removing odor causing bacteria and i'm sure there's more recent data if i do some digging but i was just absolutely fascinated that i've never done this before i know i'm a convert me too total convert yeah one of my favorite um highly suggest getting it we should be selling tongue scrapers yeah start seeing affiliate wellness group tongue scrapers kind of rank though yeah but definitely 10 out of 10 recommend okay this moves us on to our listener question and i loved this listener question really feel like you're going to give us a very insightful answer to it they said love the podcast so thank you the information you guys are giving is so beneficial it's completely changing my mindset towards well-being i would love if you could speak about sugar cravings it's something I really struggle with and feel I can never get enough sugar thank you share your experience first Ella before I go into that because I think everybody on the planet is impacted by that at some point oh my gosh yeah I think I have quite a sweet tooth probably naturally and I love sugar as in I like sweet stuff like I was telling about the date bark at the beginning like I love sweet stuff and definitely I have found times in my life where for example and there's been a lot of demonization of sugar and I'm thinking oh we shouldn't eat so much sugar and I find myself kind of sitting there being like but I want something sweet and I would say just my experience is that having something sweet every day like I eat chocolate every single day are you chocolate or crisps girl I'm a chocolate girl me too yeah I I like salty snacks but not kind of I wouldn't buy them like take it or leave it but there is always a stack of chocolate bars in my house always I need and I like I'm a wellness gal so I go dark chocolate mostly I'm not to be too cliched but like I really crave sweet things like that um hence having a freezer full of date bark for example and I find it is it's just about as I said and we always talk about it is about balance and I think when you try and demonize it or restrict it that's when you want more and I you know I'd love to hear your take on it but I feel like it feels like it prompts a bit more of a kind of binge and restrict cycle whereas ultimately i think if you allow yourself to have these treats and these sweet things if you like sweet things like i like to have something sweet after lunch and dinner yeah and like a few squares of chocolate or something like that or some the date bark etc just hits the spot and i feel so much happier for it see i'm nodding because you're so right the research is if you allow yourself enjoyed items you're less likely to overeat on them and if we go back to why we crave sugar let's start there yeah you know from an evolutionary visionary perspective, and I remember doing this in anthropology modules at uni, you know, we would climb a tree, bat off all the bumblebees at a beehive to get a lick of that honey, because the energy in that tiny amount of honey would power you through your next hunt or whatever you've got to get to.

53:25You know, as human beings, we seek out sugar, we have a preference for sweet things, because it's instant energy for the brain, it's instant energy for your body, your body's preferred source of fuel is glucose. A sugar molecule is made up of 50 % glucose and 50 % fructose. So you've got that beautiful combination of lovely sugars for your liver and your brain, and we love it. So it's totally okay to enjoy sugar. The problem with sugar, obviously a side note in ultra processed foods is that it comes in items you don't expect like the pasta sauces or in the bread. But if you're craving sugar, now there's two sides to go down this.

54:02My clinic side is saying let's have a look at the psychology of this how hard has your day been how much have you eaten on that day is it a feeling or a fact stop and have a think have a pause within yourself and say like right now am I angry am I upset am I okay is what I'm about to do by going to eat this whole bag of Cadbury's buttons because gosh have I been there going to actually solve the problem or am I really tired do I just need to lie down for a minute and then I'll go back and have the buttons but I've actually given myself a minute. And then there's stop delay tactics that we use in clinic.