Millions gather to view solar eclipse

0:00Hello, I'm Luke Jones. Thank you for downloading the BBC's World Tonight podcast from Wednesday 12th August. You might have heard there's been an eclipse, the most significant since 1999. Perhaps you remember the last one. There's been a total eclipse in Iceland and Spain. We'll hear from some of the people who've enjoyed it there. Also, why has the IDF been unable to move Israeli settlers who've been besieging the homes of two Palestinian families in the occupied West Bank since Sunday? A reporter who has been there today will brief us. And with the hot and dry weather continuing for the most part on these shores, should disposable barbecues be banned.

0:36The Prime Minister is pondering it. We will grill one of his MPs. Earlier this evening, a once-in-a-generation eclipse came and went. It was a total eclipse in Spain and Iceland and an almost total eclipse, a partial 90 % eclipse here in the UK. My microphone and I ventured out of the building a little bit earlier.

1:02In a shock twist, Radio 4 is concerning itself with North London. I'm on Primrose Hill, a short cycle away from BBC Broadcasting House. I would say there are multiple thousands of people crowded here, some with their solar glasses, some with little bits of paper with a hole pricked into it so they can see the eclipse shadow safely on the floor. and there are picnic blankets there are drinks there are picky bits a plenty most look like they were far too young to remember the last time in Eclipse was as good as this one's going to be and back in 1999 now try and make my way as far up the hill as I can here we go

1:47I'm loving it it's so beautiful and the best thing about it is like having everyone together I can't think of the last time everyone was like this maybe the Olympics. You can just see like a slither of the top of the sun. I'm very scared about burning my retinas, but I'm loving it. I'm 21, so I've never seen anything like this before. I can see the marvels of creation. It's just absolutely outstanding. It makes us realise how insignificant we actually are. Yeah. We were just saying that, you know, the sun, you're only getting like 10 % of it but you're still feeling the heat of it, you're still seeing the glaring light of it it makes us realise that this universe is immense.

2:32Is this your first eclipse? Actually no, 1999 I remember it well, yes Where were you? We were in Burton-on-Trent newly married, we'd been married two months. What do you make of the fact that so many people are here to watch it? Well that was a little bit bizarre actually, yeah that was kind of the whole of London came down yeah bit weird it's very cool what do you like of it? I think it's fucking amazing I saw it in 99 but this is amazing because we've got proper glasses it's actually really cool you're really prepared people have been queuing today to get glasses and how do you manage that? I went down to Greenwich Observatory at quarter to nine and then I went down to the Maritime Museum and waited there until it opened at 10 and so yeah It was one of the lucky ones.

3:19Yeah, but yesterday we drove all around South East London looking for glasses, couldn't find any. You were really keen. We were keen. Why so keen if you've already seen one? Do you know what it is? The kids haven't seen it as well. I'm going to say it was all for them, but maybe not. We're having too much fun. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But really, I don't care what it is. I wanted to see it. Can I ask them what they make of it? Yeah, go on. Go on, so what do you make of it? I think it's super cool, you know. It's like a once in a lifetime experience, so obviously I want to see it. Yeah. What about you?

3:48You look very young. This must be your first eclipse easily. Yes. It looks really cool. It's like a moon. It's the sun, but it's the moon. We spent all afternoon making our pinhole camera to watch this eclipse. So that is an old shoebox that you've put some holes in. Two of them. Three of them. And a colander. And a colander and a paper plate. It was hard to get the colander to focus, to be honest. we didn't realize that we have to actually keep them really far apart for it to focus but the shoebox worked really well. And why have you been so keen to come out and actually see it in person? I actually have a degree in astronomy sorry in astrophysics back in the 90s and I've actually never seen a solar eclipse I haven't even seen a lunar eclipse and I heard that the next one won't be for like decades So I thought, right, this is it.

4:44As a scientist, you must be very thrilled that this many people are interested. Yeah, I mean, it's really cool that people found this exciting and people, everybody, there are literally hundreds of people in Primrose Hill coming out to watch the solar eclipse. So I'm glad that science has finally made a breakthrough. Just a few of some of the thousands of people who gathered on Primrose Hill to see that, although slightly on the wrong side of it, because actually when the eclipse started to happen, it did disappear over the hill quite quickly. so they were somewhat disappointed someone. Of course the best view was not in the UK.

5:17There was a total eclipse to be seen in Iceland and Spain first of all. This is Bella and Alfie who are on holiday there. They hiked all the way up a mountain in Burundia to get a good view. I'm very excited to see the sun totally blocked by the moon. We are in the line where just about it's 100 % totally covered. Very amazing. We've just seen totality. You could just see the corona around it and it was so dark. It was like sunset but really, really dark. And it's just coming back now. Oh, it's really bright. It looks like it's sunrise even though it's 8.30. Wow. So that's one part of Spain. Let's go live to another hill in Spain, this one near Valencia.

6:06Stuart Coulter is from the West of London Astronomical Society. Welcome to the world tonight, Stuart. How was it for you? Terrific, terrific. A very, very special day. I've seen eight eclipses, but they're all different. And this one, too, was unique in its own way. And it's quite thrilling to have seen the day through successfully. Eight is quite the collection. What makes this one different? What makes this one different is that I've brought instruments. So I photographed the sun close up and measured the color of light during eclipses. But this time I decided to take my family rather than groups, like astronomical groups, including my three-year-old grandchild, try explaining an eclipse to a three-year-old.

6:56I was enjoying hearing the children's reactions earlier just now. But for this one, I sort of returned to basics, just doing naked eye astronomy, seeing it as people see it for the first time. And what was special about this, what was quite extraordinary, was that it was a sunset eclipse. Pinsicola, where we are, is not a very good site really to see the eclipse. Northern Spain is preferred because the coast is backed by hills, which are in the direction of the sun. So if you're on the coast, there are hills in the way. So what do you do? You climb the hills to see the view from there. And I did that in advance using Google Earth, and I'd worked out a particular site where we would see the eclipse in its entirety and the sun would set just at the end of it.

7:41And boy, it was spot on. The Diamond Ringers, it's called when the sun reappears behind the moon, appeared just as it was beginning to set. But what was special about this one was it was naked eye, as I say. And if you want to look at the detail on the sun, you need to look through binoculars, protect it, of course. We all know that. But what surprised me was because this was an eclipse when the sun was on the horizon, there is what many listeners will know about the moon illusion, where the moon appears to be larger when it's on the horizon than when it's up in the sky. and looking at the totally eclipsed sun which was quite memorable jet black surrounded by the pink chromosphere and then the streamers prominences, the dark sky, the colour of the sky but what surprised me was that it was bigger than it should be because of this moon illusion and that's something which did surprise me and which sticks in my mind very strongly Beautifully explained and described Stuart Thank you very much and I hope you enjoy your 9th whenever that is, Stuart Coulter from the West of London Astronomical Society.

8:54He's seen plenty. One person has just enjoyed their first eclipse. That is Solvi Gummansson, who's the manager of Visit Westfjords in Iceland. Solvi, where were you and how was it? It was an amazing experience. Sorry, it was an amazing experience. I live in a small fishing town in northwest of Iceland, just south of the Arctic Circle. We decided to hike up towards this burr cliff to be close to nature, just a small group, my family and close friends. We sat there. It had been sunny the whole day. So we were quite excited to witness this without any cloud coverage. But of course, living in Iceland, the weather changes rapidly.

9:49And during the total eclipse, the sun went behind the clouds. It was a little bit disappointing, but it was still such an amazing experience because suddenly the light changed. Everything became a little bit mysterious. And then it became pitch black, just like night. My son even shouted, well, we haven't even had dinner yet. It's night. So that was quite cute. But it was such a surreal experience. A little bit emotional for me. I've been waiting for this day for roughly three years now. and it is a special, special moment when you can experience... Oh, sorry. Why emotional?

10:45Like I said, I've been waiting for this for three years. I've also been working with authorities, local authorities in Iceland, the government planning for this event in Iceland. So a lot of my time has been going into this. But then again, because then, and this was kind of the, you know, it was kind of the finale of the whole. So yes, emotionally because of that. But it was also just, I don't know, the birds stopped shouting in the bird cliff. The reason why we went up to the bird cliff was to listen to them. And they went completely quiet. and as soon as the sun came out again, it was one minute, 40 minutes of darkness for us.

11:37The birds just started again like it was a new day. It just, I don't know, it's a surreal experience, I would say. Beautifully explained. Also, thanks very much for that. That's Solvi Gummansson, manager of Visit West Fjords in Iceland. You're listening to The World Tonight. Coming up, as Donald Trump's approval polling slides to an historic low of just 32%, we will take you to a Trump stronghold in Tennessee to ask whether it's the war in Iran that's done it. Trump said America first, and he's not put America first. He's put the war overseas first. If people aren't getting killed, I think people will tolerate it a little bit longer.

12:22But they're going to say, soon, you need to wrap this up. something needs to be done. It needs to be, something needs to be decided. Since Sunday in the occupied West Bank, Israeli settlers have been besieging the homes of two Palestinian families who say supplies are now low. The IDF, the military, were there today. The first soldiers to arrive were filmed praying with the settlers and it's reported they've now withdrawn, having failed to remove them. The Abu Ridi and Hassan families have been posting on social media appealing for help after their water and power supplies were cut off and their food stocks ran low.

13:00Kusey Aburida is a member of one of these families. He recorded a video from his rooftop with some men appearing to be Israeli settlers in the background. Have a listen.

13:14I am Kusey Aburida from the village of Kasra, south of Nablus. Four days ago, settlers came to the house and blocked us from leaving. They stopped anyone from coming to the house. We have been deprived of all necessities. They cut off the electricity and water and supply of health care. There is a family living in a nearby house. They have two children, age four and two. They have also been cut off from the outside world. We are unable to leave the house and our situation is tragic. The soldiers arrived at the house, but they did nothing. We appeal to the humanitarian organisations to help us and protect us and provide food and medicine to the families who are besieged by the settlers.

14:02So what is happening? Nosrit Yohanan was reporting there today for The Times of Israel. I spoke to her just before we came on the air. From time to time there were forces, IDF forces that came and then went and then blocking journalists, myself and others. But other than that, there wasn't any sort of like military action or big forces against the settlers. It was basically what's been happening in the last three days. Settlers are blocking two Palestinian houses in the outskirts of Kursa, the village Kursa. So the IDF arrived but tried to move the settlers surrounding the properties away or just failed to?

14:37Early in the morning, it looked like it was more a try. There were a lot of settlers there. There were dozens coming from all sides, and then there were forces trying to evacuate them. I understood from the Palestinians who are still inside their houses that there were tear gas that reached through them, tear gas that the soldiers threw at the settlers in order for them to flee. But other than that incident in the morning, there wasn't really much of a try, even I would say, to evacuate them because the forces we saw, they didn't really use any force. It looks like they just went there, talked to them, set aside for a few minutes, and then they left.

15:20So I say the full force of the IDF wasn't an operation at any time of the day. What about the people inside the houses, the Palestinians? Have you heard from them and how they are in all of this? Yeah, I've been in touch with them today as well as the last couple of days. They're basically in the same situation of them not being able to come and go. There was a slight, I would say, improved last night because an ambulance finally reached to one of the houses where a small little girl needed an evacuation, a medical evacuation, needed to see a doctor. And so she and her sister also, little girl, and their mother went.

15:58So now they're outside with this so-called siege. But other than that, the other family members who were left in both of those houses are still in the same condition. The settlers cut their electricity line. They used solar panels in the last couple of days. They don't have much water because they cut some of the water lines that they had. They did receive some food last night by the ambulance that came, but it's a day-to-day basis. They don't know if that siege will continue. So it's very dear and they're still talking about feelings of fear and, of course, concern from the future. The UN Security Council, at a briefing yesterday, heard from one of the UN's deputy special coordinators saying that settler violence was, quote, at unprecedented levels.

16:42But is this also a different tactic that we're seeing from settlers as well? In the last couple of months, we saw this kind of new tactic of trying to take over Palestinian stone houses at the outskirts of villages in order to expand outposts. In the past, it was more of getting land and maybe sometimes threatening communities, what we call bedouin communities, or people who live in tents in much more not-so-permanent houses. But now it seems like after they've done that, they sort of move on to the next level, if you can call it that, and they're trying to target Palestinians who live in villages.

17:19And of course, Israelis will be going to the polls not before long later this autumn. Do we have any sense about what the population at large feel about not just these incidents of settler violence, but also the expansion of some of these outposts that we're seeing in more and more parts of the West Bank? I would say it's a very complicated issue inside the Israeli society. From one hand, we've got the right-wing government. Some parts of it are supporting the outpost and funding them and definitely support them verbally and so on. But I would say the last couple of incidents, especially the incident in Kusra, really made a lot of Israeli question what's happening in the West Bank.

17:56How come the IDF don't have control on the ground, for example, is something that bothers a lot of Israelis on the last couple of days. So if it will continue to be a sort of ongoing topic in the news, it will definitely, I think, will make Israelis think again about all those kind of beliefs about whether they're supporting whatever is happening in the West Bank lately. Nurit Yohanan from the Times of Israel. The BBC has requested an interview with the Israeli Defence Forces. So far we've had no luck. The head of its Central Command, Major General Avi Bluth, and other senior officers arrived at the scene earlier on Wednesday.

18:30They are said to have met residents and voiced their, quote, grave concern. Is Donald Trump the election winner he once was? Results from some Republican primaries on Tuesday suggest that his endorsement still carries significant weight. in some places, but not everywhere. Public enthusiasm for the president more widely has certainly waned. Recent polling placed his approval rating at an historic low of just 32%. Is the war in Iran and the gas and fuel prices it's pushed up at home to blame? The BBC's Sheila Flynn has spent the last week speaking to Trump supporters in the Tennessee town of Kingsport to see if the war has eroded support for the president in one of his strongholds.

19:14It's a Thursday morning in early August here in Kingsport, Tennessee, where we're surrounded by the Appalachian Mountains. The mist has just burned off as the sun has come out. Residents are walking their dogs, and some are gathering for coffee and bagels on the main streets of Kingsport, which has a historical southern downtown, full of old-school furniture shops and clothing stores, as well as newer boutique operations. Then again, there's also a shop selling guns and ammo at the end of the street. Support for President Trump's Make America Great Again platform is overwhelming in this mountain town, which voted for Trump by comfortable margins in all three of his elections.

19:55No one I speak to here is happy about inflation, but few lay the blame at the president's feet. I think they're doing a great job, I mean, with, you know, what he can control. Parked on his Harley-Davidson outside a local cafe, I meet 53-year-old Daniel Overstreet. Whether it was the Iran War or anything else, we're not going to control those gas prices. And people can complain and fuss and everything else they want to about it. It's not going to change that. It's still going to be what it's going to be. Also stopping for his breakfast is David Carter, a bearded veteran who plays Santa Claus at Christmastime.

20:32He backs the president's involvement in the Middle East. You've seen it in history that the reason we go over there and we keep everything under control there is we don't have it on our front doorstep. Veterans account for around 10 percent of the region's population. The town is also home to the Holston Army Ammunition Plant, which churns out explosives used in Patriot missiles and other heavy weaponry for U.S. military stockpiles. David says that while he and many others in the town still back the president's goals overall, the war has certainly caused some frustration amongst the supporters.

21:08Trump said America first, and he's not put America first. He's put the war overseas first. Not all conservatives here caveated their support. Oh, Pinky, I want to bring you home with me. Outside one of Kingsport's discount stores, I meet veteran James Camper, who served eight years in the Navy, and his dog, Benke. I think attacks need to be up a bit more than what's being done. Honestly, I think we should turn them into a parking lot and don't worry about it anymore. In addition to the munitions plant, the city is home to a number of major factories. Employers Trump came to office promising to defend.

21:4765-year-old Pam Robinson spent 20 years working at the local chemical plant. While she also fears the prospect of a nuclear Iran, she does think patience for the war, even here in Kingsport, has its limits. If people aren't getting killed, I think people will tolerate it a little bit longer. But they're going to say, soon you need to wrap this up. Something needs to be done. It needs to be, something needs to be decided. Despite a few misgivings, none of the Trump voters I spoke to brought up the war unprompted. This is deep Bible Belt America, a moniker that many here embrace proudly. Christianity is often the primary driver of their voting intention.

22:27Dave and Pam again. This country strayed away from God compared to what it used to be. The first question I ask, do you believe in abortion? And usually if I get that answer, I know pretty well where I need to go on the rest of it. Even if his national support is slipping, there's little to indicate that the Republican core conservative base here looks likely to break faith with President Trump. Sheila Flynn reporting from Tennessee. You're listening to The World Tonight on BBC Radio 4. I'm Luke Jones. Good evening. Our main headline so far, millions of people in the UK and Europe have witnessed a once-in-a-generation solar eclipse.

23:04And immigration enforcement officers in the United States could soon be able to wear gloves that deliver electric shocks. As the hot and dry weather continues for many here, so too does the risk of fires, leading many to ask, should disposable barbecues be banned? After the COBRA meeting held today to discuss the heat, Prime Minister Andy Burnham said, maybe. There is advice to the public here not to use disposable barbecues. We have today confirmed through the National Fire Chiefs Council that the framework restricting the retail sale of those disposable barbecues is being extended. And now I would ask all retailers, big and small, to adhere to that framework.

23:55Longer term, we will look at whether a temporary ban in the summer months is justified. John Pearce is the Labour MP for High Peak in the Peak District. He's been campaigning for a while on this issue. I asked him earlier what he made of the Prime Minister's comments. It's massively welcome. I mean, I've been campaigning on this, well, for a long time now, but I've obviously done lots of campaigning this summer to ask retailers to suspend the sale of disposable barbecues while the risk of wildfires are so high. So to hear the Prime Minister speak so clearly and passionately about it is such welcome news.

24:31Should there be some kind of ban in place? Councils do have the ability to issue these public space protection orders. Some of them have already done that. Would you like to see more of those? Yeah, I mean, so in my area, my council, my Labour Council, High Peak, have got a public safety protection order in place. And so disposable barbecues are banned in my area. The Peak District itself bans disposable barbecues. The big issue with it being done in a sort of patchwork way is that some national parks don't ban them. Some local authorities don't ban them. And so the public often don't know that there's a ban.

25:05and also it makes enforcement really difficult. So what I would like to see is a national ban. Now, whether that's a national ban during the summer months when the risks of wildfires are particularly high, or actually it's a ban on their use in public spaces full stop, which I think there's a really strong argument for, because it's not just rural areas that suffer with this. It's, you know, city and town parks. You know, there's lots of fires, particularly bin fires, are caused by disposable barbecues, but also on beaches, because they heat up either the stones or the sand, they cause horrific burns.

25:42So I think there's a wider debate about the use of disposable barbecues in public spaces. It sounds like you're dancing around the idea of just banning them outright. If you're going to stop people using them in public spaces during the summer when one might want a barbecue, why not just ban them altogether? Well, I mean, I think There's a petition online that is calling for exactly that. I think it's a debate very much worth having. Where do you fall on it? But if people want to use them in the privacy of their own garden, as a cheap way of a one-off having a barbecue without the need to buy a full barbecue kit and so forth, I'm fairly relaxed about that.

26:20But John, I thought we lived in this new era where local decisions were made by local decision makers and not by central government in a blanket way. hey, your area needs this ban, you said, and your local council has put in these public space protection orders. Why can't we trust those making decisions in local areas to do the right thing? Well, I think we can, but when it's very difficult to communicate. So what happens, so let's take my area, for example, people travel from all around the country, indeed all around the world, to come to the Peak District. It's very difficult to communicate to those people that they can't use disposable barbecues if they've also been to other national parks within the country that do allow them.

27:00So that consistency of message, I think, actually is one of the things that we need to have. And so doing it on a local basis is fine. If you go into my area and you go to the residents of my constituents, they all know the risks of disposal of barbecues because we live with it because we've had the fires. What we have is a national problem with wildfires. And so it needs a national response. Just finally, obviously the problem is wider than just disposable barbecues. There's people smoking cigarettes, there's people letting off fireworks even, doing campfires. Australian states have the ability to issue these sort of total fire bans when there's an increased fire risk.