How would PM-in-waiting Andy Burnham change Britain? - The Latest

0:00This is The Guardian.

0:11Number 10 North will be the nerve centre of a rewired gripping. There was a bit of a fear that it could just be this tokenistic symbol, but actually this seems to be the sort of crucible of power for redistributing power across the country. Imagine good growth in every postcode and hope in every heart. Burnham at the minute is sort of on the crest of this wave, showing people a bit of what he wants to achieve while not properly being held accountable. From the Guardians today on Focus, this is The Latest with Meet Lucy Hoth. Andy Burnham, our potential Prime Minister-in-waiting, has given his first major policy speech in Manchester.

0:56Josh Halliday, you're our North of England editor, meaning Andy Burnham is a man you know very well in his previous job as mayor of Manchester. Was this the Andy that you know, or was this a more prime ministerial performance in tone and vibe? I mean, Andy Burnham is basically walking on water at the minute, isn't he? In terms of Labour supporters, he practically got carried in on people's shoulders. They were that, you know, enthused to see him. The applause alone when he entered the room lasted about a minute. Burnham is just trying to ride this wave of momentum that saw him to victory in Makerfield, hitting the campaign buttons that he pressed all the way through that campaign.

1:36But this time to an audience of Labour supporters, it was interesting to see quite a few government figures there at the front of the hall, all wildly cheering and applauding. Who was there? Who was on the front row? So we had Johnny Reynolds, the chief whip, a Greater Manchester MP. We had Lucy Powell, Deputy Prime Minister. We had Ali McGovern as well, Housing Minister. And they were all wildly applauding as he dismantled the state of Whitehall and Westminster and talked about everything he's going to destroy and reform over the next, well, if he becomes Prime Minister, what he sees as his 10-year plan.

2:16Yeah, and I suppose the criticism in the last few years about Keir Starmer is he's someone that you can't really describe his politics or his political vision, or at least he campaigned on that very simple slogan, change. But as has been shown in the last couple of years, it has been hard to find real political substance within that. With Andy Burnham, we are blessed to have a very weighty tome that he published in 2024 called Head North. Have you been dusting off your copy of that book this morning, Josh. And I suppose what was in that book has informed a lot of what we heard today about a shifting of power away from the South.

2:59Absolutely. I mean, I'm ashamed perhaps to say that I've got both the audiobook version, which you can hear Andy and Steve Rotherham deliver it in their accents, which is, for me, the peak version of this book. And a print version I ordered from Amazon, which happened to be signed. This speech today was, you know, an expansion of this manifesto that he set out in Head North a few years ago, which, you know, this book didn't make the headlines at the time, but now is, you know, required reading for anyone who wants to understand Andy Burnham and what he might do in power. You know, this was, I mean, it's hard to overstate, actually, the contrast between an Andy Burnham as Prime Minister and a Keir Starmer.

3:42Obviously, Andy Burnham is at the peak of his powers right now. and so he's very much relishing this moment you know the place where he delivered this speech today it's the people's history museum in manchester is the museum that that you know displayed the famous jacket that he wore in in the covid speech that made him the king of the north right so like yeah this is his place these are his people you know he's got all these relics of revolutions from from down the years so like it was laden with symbolism and he very much enjoyed that um yeah you know he came in with jokes you know that is important for people uplifting people in the room and then yeah when he got to the the policy side of it it was all about giving people a bit of hope back and and talking about that you know this huge rebalancing of power across the country yeah he called it the biggest rebalancing of power our country has ever seen um as obviously someone that's been working in local government as mayor of Manchester that means really focusing in on local councils and that was at the core of the message wasn't it giving more power to local authorities to improve their local areas did he go into any more detail about that what did we learn there was a little bit of detail mainly it revolved around devolving power to you know a more local level away from Whitehall, there wasn't much on, you know, what power would trickle down to local authorities, because it seemed very much focused on combined authorities, like the one in Greater Manchester that he led.

5:14You know, to do this, he's going to establish what he called Number 10 North, which is, you know, splintering off part of 10 Downing Street to have in Manchester. Which got a massive cheer in the room. I mean, unsurprisingly, given he was in Manchester, but I mean, certainly there will be stalwarts of Whitehall and Westminster who that might prove something of a contentious issue for. I'm sure there's more, you know, there's a huge list of contentious issues down the line in terms of wrenching this power away from Whitehall. But, you know, I've been speaking to people before and after the speech and this number 10 North operation is much seems to be much more significant than many people thought it would be.

5:57There was a bit of a fear that it could just be this kind of tokenistic symbol, you know, splintering off, you know, five people into a room in Manchester and calling it number 10 north. But actually, this seems to be real, like the sort of crucible of power for, you know, everything that he wants to do in terms of redistributing power across the country. Right. He gave a bit of detail about its three key aims. They were reforming essential utilities, water, energy, housing. It would be re-industrialisation and the third one would be regeneration. Right. So that's a bit more flesh on the bone and it sounds like much more of a significant operation than I think many people had expected.

6:40Yeah, he used this quote, good growth in every postcode and hope in every heart twice during the speech, sort of bookending that message. There has been lots of speculation since his absolute triumph in Makerfield about who Burnham would choose as Chancellor. He actually called out the back row, which was the row of press, for speculation over who will be Chancellor. But I think Josh does speculate anyway, if we're allowed to, because it is crucial, isn't it, who he decides. And it will tell us so much about what Burnham will be like as a Prime Minister and what his cabinet will look like. The front runner has been Ed Miliband, but there has been some jitters about that from the right of the party.

7:21There's been some union jitters as well. Is Burnham, given how well you know him, how long you've been reporting on him, someone that is likely to be concerned by that? Or what do you think will be factoring into his decision making at the moment? Well, I think, as you say, it's an incredibly important thing to announce. And I don't think Burnham supporters or him, you know, Burnham himself can get away for very long with saying, you know, this is tittle tattle. It's none of your business, essentially, until they come to form that government. It shows what direction the country is going to take.

7:56And the chancellor is often as powerful as the prime minister, aren't they? You know, they decide who gets the public finances. And, you know, they will, if Burnham is going to oversee this major redistribution of power, you'll certainly need a chancellor that's backing you 100 percent of the way. he didn't touch that today. But, you know, he did say that it would be a cabinet that kind of unites the party that seeks to, you know, be, reflect everyone in the countries, not just everyone in the Labour Party, but, you know, people across the board. So I think that was a hint that you will get people, you know, from the left of the Labour Party as well as those towards the right.

8:36Yeah. And interestingly, and he's faced a bit of criticism for this today, he didn't take any questions from the press, presumably because he wanted these, you know, key catchphrases, phrases to cut through and for those to be the headlines, rather than any grilling on what his cabinet might look like. Yeah, I think that's really disappointing, actually. I don't think it's a good look for, you know, a prime minister in waiting who's, you know, coming off such huge momentum to be effectively dodging questions. And yeah, there would have been a lot of questions about who the chancellor is. Those are legitimate questions.

9:09But I think every journalist in that room would have had about 30 other questions they would have liked to ask him about what actually his his mandate would be you know what he's you know because a lot of it is this quite high level talk about the biggest rebalancing of power in decades but what does that actually mean and when are you going to do it you know yeah so Burnham at the minute is is sort of on the crest of this wave and he's you know getting away with you know showing people a bit of what he wants you know what he wants to achieve, while not properly being held accountable for how he would do that or when he would do that.

9:44And yeah, so I think that's a tricky position for him to be in. Well, he is a bit rushed off his feet, isn't it? Because he was hoping, as per reporting for a September Labour Party conference transfer of power to give himself more time to prepare. But instead, he could be Prime Minister as early as next month. So a lot for him to be thinking about. And Josh, you're going to be very busy. Thank you so much for your time. It's a pleasure. Thank you very much. That's it for today. My huge thanks again to Josh Halliday, our North of England editor. You can keep up with his reporting and our live coverage of this story over at theguardian.com.

10:16And do listen to our sister podcast, Politics Weekly, where Pippa Crearer and Kieran Stacey will be boring into the details of what we've heard from Andy Burnham in Manchester today. Thanks for listening to this episode of The Latest. Today on Focus will be back in your feeds as usual tomorrow morning. The Latest will be back tomorrow night. This episode was presented by me, Lucy Hoff. It was produced by Bryony Moore. The senior producer was Ryan Ramgobin. The executive producer was Zoe Hitch.

11:05daily episodes across the tournament, breaking down all the action, the results, and of course, the drama. Can the US make it out of the group stage and into the spotlight on the biggest stage? World Cup daily, listen wherever you get your podcasts or watch full episodes on YouTube. This is The Guardian.